Posting mode: Reply
Password(Password used for file deletion)
  • Supported file types are: GIF, JPG, PNG
  • Maximum file size allowed is 3072 KB.
  • Images greater than 250x250 pixels will be thumbnailed.
  • Read the rules and FAQ before posting.
  • ????????? - ??

  • File : 1250805372.jpg-(218 KB, 1240x792, TheahPolitical.jpg)
    218 KB ITT "I love this RPG except..." Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)17:56 No.5528043  
    7th Sea fulfills my historical, 17th century, ships of wood and men of iron desire. The perfect RPG for me to find as I draw to the close of my Empire: Total War binge. Except...

    This map. This fucking map. I don't care if a professor of cartography, geography, and continental drift came to me and told me this is absolutely, perfectly reasonable, it still looks fucking retarded to me. But God damn if I can resist playing a Dutch viking.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)18:13 No.5528209
    Ah, 7th Sea...
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)18:17 No.5528247
    I'm reading the books on my computer and just squalling "FUCK YEAH" over and over again! Except for the Brotherhood of the Coast who just irritate me. And some of the secret societies. But other than that (And the map, and some of the drama dice rules), I'm really getting psyked for this game.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)18:23 No.5528300

    Yeah, some of the secret societies ended up COMPLETELY different from what the corebook pitched them as(I'm looking at YOU, Sophia's Daughters).
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)18:25 No.5528330
    Wouldn't continental drift be a sub-category of geography? Meh. Either way, I agree with you, the thing looks terrible, and I can't even put my finger on why. Maybe it's the JPEG compression, I hate that shit.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)18:29 No.5528373
    And I thought Alderac did it bad with the l5r map...

    (at least here they TRIED copying Europe, there... It doesn't even seem CHINA, let alone Japan, and this makes me rages)
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)18:31 No.5528402
    I think you are failing to see the obviously wrong things b/c of the borders obscuring the impossibly placed rivers.

    So: The River separating the 3 southern countries from everything else is impossible, or is a strait instead of a river, in which case it's absurdly long and narrow. The lake in the northeast must be a salt sea (no outlet to ocean), but is damn close to an actual ocean with no apparent reason why erosion wouldn't have connected the two. Cathy is separated from everyone else by a river connecting two oceans (NOT OK). Um ... oh, another salt sea in Eisen (like the other salt sea, it doesn't have to be a contradiction, but I see little reason for its existence). The river by numa in Vodacce appears to CROSS MOUNTAINS to get to the Empire of the Crescent Moon ...

    And that's just why the rivers are wrong.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)18:34 No.5528425
    It probably would be, but I got this thing where I have to things in threes, and I couldn't think of anything aside from continental drift for some reason. Professor of Tectonics? Whatever.

    My problem is is that few of the nations are really very separated by seas, which kind of stunts the swashbuckling theme they have got going, the mountains, deserts, and forests are thrown on seemingly at random, there's a whole bunch of peninsulas hanging off the underside of the thing like teats on a dog, and I don't see much to provoke the formation of maritime powers... Maybe it's a reference to how shitty early cartography is? Maybe Theah actually looks like a real continent, and the goofy ass artist is messing up the details?

    ...Or maybe I should stop treating geography as SERIOUS BUSINESS, considering I don't study it and for that matter, it's for a fictional universe?
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)18:34 No.5528427

    Oh, actually, as I look closer, I see there are two "salt seas" in Ussura, which means the river is flowing OUT of them (rivers don't split except at deltas) which then forces the questions: "Where did the water come from?" and "Why is the river flowing out of a pair of ginormous lakes going into a mountain range and then just ENDING?"
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)18:37 No.5528472
    Man, and here I thought one of the advantages of making your fantasy world just a parallel of real places was so you couldn't fuck up the geography too badly.

    That is a truly awful map. Just use a blank outline of Europe and write in the names yourself.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)18:37 No.5528473
    Rivers cannot flow from ocean to ocean. Tree's rarely grow on both sides of large mountains. Rivers do not just end in lakes.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)18:40 No.5528506
    Nations don't have to be separated by seas for the sea to be the main avenue of travel and commerce between them. Ships are like faster, tireless horses and you don't need to worry about maintaining the roads.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)18:43 No.5528545
         File1250808201.jpg-(206 KB, 759x907, sm0007-GibsonOldWorld1758.jpg)
    206 KB

    The fucking random ass RIVERS.

    I'd like more old maps though.
    >> Lazy DM V !vONhvIg88o 08/20/09(Thu)18:44 No.5528553
    You realize rivers don't flow south, right? They tend to flow downwards - usually from heights where alot of rain falls due to clouds becoming chilled when climbing those heights.

    I see one of those rivers you're talking about, and obviously (to me) it's flowing FROM the mountain into the large lakes at the end. Speaking of Ussura.

    The weirdest thing for me is the strait you point out first. The other stuff seems sort of reasonable.

    Hate the font (and its colour) and border colours though.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)18:44 No.5528561
    Yeah, but, would you imagine Spain building a vast armada if it didn't have holdings in South America to secure?
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)18:45 No.5528574

    See how it's flowing "into" TWO lakes? Rivers Do Not Split (except at deltas or really weird conditions), so it MUST be flowing out of them. And into the mountains. Which as you correctly point out makes no fucking sense.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)18:46 No.5528582
    And above all, failing on geography on a sail age-inspired game.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)18:46 No.5528590
         File1250808407.jpg-(113 KB, 448x600, Barbarossa_Hayreddin_Pasha.jpg)
    113 KB
    Yeah, who can imagine pirates growing up on the Mediterranean- oh wait...
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)18:48 No.5528615
         File1250808512.jpg-(485 KB, 2284x2218, Dinotopia Map.jpg)
    485 KB
    dinotopia is the only decent map
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)18:50 No.5528645
    I'm no master of geography but I can only weep at that map. The most ridiculous thing is the river that splits the continent east to west (RIVERS DO NOT WORK THAT WAY) and pierces a mountain range with what must complete lack of respect to gravity.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)18:50 No.5528647
    I think that's what I'm going to end up doing...

    And I should restate, I'm passionately in love with 7th Sea (Post 30 Years War Germany, Netherlands/Vikings hybrid, a view of 1600s/1700s France that isn't ENTIRELY 'oh ho what pompous fools!'), but...This fucking MAP.

    I wouldn't like to do it as just plain Europe, but I don't know nearly enough about geography to actually make a realistic map that wouldn't drive me nuts. And obviously I can't draw.
    >> Lazy DM V !vONhvIg88o 08/20/09(Thu)18:51 No.5528657
    >Rivers cannot flow from ocean to ocean.
    We don't know of any in our current world which aren't manmade. But there are a few shorter straits. It doesn't strike me as impossible from a plate tectonic moving apart point of view, but in that case some of those effin' mountains are placed kind of odd, I feel.

    >Tree's rarely grow on both sides of large mountains.
    True. You mean "large mountain ranges", I think, but that doesn't change anything for this map.

    >Rivers do not just end in lakes.
    Eh, it's not impossible, I think. Should depend on the ground.

    Actually, there's an awfully small amount of forests here. Feels to me like there should be more. Unless this is a large steppe or something.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)18:51 No.5528661


    Sorry, automatical response.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)18:53 No.5528680

    Rivers definitely can end in lakes, only in that case the lakes are usually called "salt seas." Think Dead Sea or Caspian Sea. Such things are not particularly common -- definitely much less common than normal lakes with exits. Generally in the bottom of a really low basin, surrounded by mountains, or some such.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)18:54 No.5528686
         File1250808883.jpg-(162 KB, 792x860, mapa_de_rokugan_01.jpg)
    162 KB
    Am I bad too?
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)18:54 No.5528687
    I think there are some map making programs out there, if you don't just want to say, "Okay guys, we're playing 7th Sea. Except it's going to be set in Europe."
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)18:55 No.5528698
    You don't bug me for some reason.

    But perhaps Geography-man can put out some stuff I'm missing?
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)18:57 No.5528710
    Any names?
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)18:59 No.5528733
    >>5528680 here

    Also, that straight really is not ok. If it were even as wide as the Red Sea (which was formed and is continuing to widen by the process you're describing). At some point Africa will split of there and then yes, there will be a strait.

    But in this map, the "straight instead meanders like a river, with both shores staying the same distance and very close through a number of meanders. That's not ok.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:00 No.5528741

    You'd be better if you seemed more like Japan. This could mean some remastering of the clans, for sure.
    >> Lazy DM V !vONhvIg88o 08/20/09(Thu)19:00 No.5528750
    Ah, but the problem is that the map is not detailed enough to show such "very weird conditions". There could be height differences, hills, rocky obstructions for the river which haven't been worn down yet... But we can't see those because we only see the really really big stuff. So I feel inclined to go for the explanation which makes more sense: Either the river flows into the mountains from two lakes in the middle of fucking nowhere, or they flow from the mountain and run into obstructions not detailed on the map. I'm going with the latter.

    One thing which struck me is that Vodacce is pretty much fucked up. It's struck in the middle between two mountain ranges (nevermind how the hell that happened), which should effectively shield it from most any rain and turn it into a goddamn desert. And yet, it has a forest on one side of a mountain range, a goddamn river and a second forest on it. (I'm referring to the coriolis effect which would have most clouds moving in a spirally movement, which would make them unload most rain from either one side or the other). Though some might come from the bay next to Vodacce. Eh, I don't know. Eisen has a similar issue. The big problem is all these goddamn mountain ranges. Seriously, what the hell?
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:03 No.5528774
         File1250809415.jpg-(698 KB, 1275x887, Theah_seen_by_Theus.jpg)
    698 KB
    Hay guiz, am i mor reelistic nao?
    >> Geography Man 08/20/09(Thu)19:04 No.5528781

    Looks pretty much fine to me. It doesn't have rivers (which is fine if you're choosing not to show them) which eliminates the most common and easily spotted mistakes.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:04 No.5528787
    Protip: Coastlines can be replicated with fractal geometry. There are laws behind the shapes you see.
    >> Geography Man 08/20/09(Thu)19:06 No.5528802

    Agreed, way too many mountain ranges. I think the map maker decided where the countries were, then put a mountain range or a river on every border. Seriously, the only border that is not mountains or water is about 1/3 of the Vodacce, Castille border.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:07 No.5528810

    It's not Japan. And if you bring up the unicorn thing I will reach through the internets and choke you.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:07 No.5528811
    All I see when I look at that is a giant ant.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:08 No.5528816
    Looks better, but that continent-splitting... thing... needs to go. And am I seeing it branching a second time, a tributary flowing through Castille and into the southern sea? As said by someone earlier, rivers do not split like that.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:08 No.5528821
         File1250809708.jpg-(93 KB, 1024x614, creation.jpg)
    93 KB
    I guess this thread has become "Post your RPG's map and start bitching" then?

    But no, seriously, 7th Sea, awesome, deserves lots of love. Though I'd revise all the Drama Dice rules. And also, because of this thread, I'll never be able to look at the map and not be bothered again.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:09 No.5528825

    ... did you just combine the 7th sea map and L5R?

    ... thats kinda cool.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:09 No.5528826

    Looks like some sort of donkey.
    >> Geography Man 08/20/09(Thu)19:09 No.5528828

    Also, I don't want to push this too heavily b/c I'm leaving stuff I actually know about, but the "really weird conditions" are not simple things like obstructions -- it would just go one way or the other, not both. My impression is that such conditions are either transient such as a temporary split that quickly becomes an oxbow lake, or a small island before the river quickly rejoins itself. But I'm not entirely certain about that.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:11 No.5528848
    Hooray, even more impossible rivers. There clearly weren't enough of those before and so a new one was added to split Cathay.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:11 No.5528851

    Looks like it's just the 7th Sea map done realistically.
    >> Geography Man 08/20/09(Thu)19:12 No.5528864

    Except for a river-strait in the north (why does everyone make that mistake?), that's fine. But I can't get my eyes off the river-strait.

    Also, whoever drew that understood that rivers flow perpendicular to lines of constant elevation. How'd they get that right, but not fix the river-strait?
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:14 No.5528895
    Looking at Rainy Basin, I don't get how the water flows North, then does a 180, and starts flowing South down a major river.
    The major river has to be downslope of the basin, and I don't see any ridge that would prevent water from just flowing straight down into it rather than having the water chuck a 180.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:14 No.5528896
         File1250810089.jpg-(404 KB, 1393x1890, Suvorov_crossing_the_alps.jpg)
    404 KB
    No. Just Theah done realistically. But...

    I'm planning, after my L5R game comes to a close, to have a 500 year time skip, then have the players start a 7th Sea game, in a race to find a route to Rokugan.

    The only fly in my soup would be the updated map that Legend of the Burning Sands has... I'd have to explain a MASSIVE area. Which I can't find a map of online. So, uh, here's a picture of Suvorov crossing the Alps?
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:17 No.5528919
    I fucking love this thread.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:18 No.5528935
         File1250810323.jpg-(106 KB, 900x595, 900px-Faerun_political.jpg)
    106 KB


    >> LogicNinja !AZlS3./ex. 08/20/09(Thu)19:20 No.5528959
    More like Mary Suephia's Daughters.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:23 No.5528980


    I can't argue with that at all. I mean, JESUS CHRIST.

    I'm just making them a Secret Society of Feminist blackmailers and manipulators that are working to bring the Great Game of Voddace to an end favorable to them instead of...Fucking THAT. Though I'm sure there are those that would call my interpretation mary sue anyway.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:23 No.5528981
         File1250810602.jpg-(603 KB, 1128x1600, rokuganKarte.jpg)
    603 KB

    But it should be more like it. Because, I have problems imaginating many aspects of the material culture of Rokugan (which is japanese: eat fish, use wood in mass) in those great prairies.

    Anyhooooow Rokugan with rivers, in pic.

    Inb4 L5r fouth ed incoming.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:24 No.5528996

    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:25 No.5529011
    Montaigne en haut dans cela baiser fourte de mere
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:27 No.5529025
    Ah, the Realms... mountain ranges that make no sense, forests strewn around without reason, climate bands... what climate bands? And Anauroch takes the cake, I think they first slapped it there and only much later came up with an explanation as to why it manages to exist.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:29 No.5529048
    So I says to myself, I says, "Hey, if /tg/ is unhappy with 7th Sea's map, why not just go ahead and make a remade map that makes some more sense, cribbed off of Europe, and get advice from /tg/ until we make something good?"

    Then I saw that Campaign Cartographer is in twelve parts on /rs/.

    Bugger that.
    >> LogicNinja !AZlS3./ex. 08/20/09(Thu)19:29 No.5529060
    Besides a few mechanical issues, what really bugs me about 7th Sea is the metaplot/NPCs. SUDDENLY, TINY CTHULHUS CRAWLING ALL OVER EVERYTHING! Every secret society is really about SEKRIT ALIENS!
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:31 No.5529081
    No, geography IS serious business and retarded ass maps infuriate me too.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:32 No.5529099
    Mi Castillian madre duerme con usted que usa una correa encendido.

    ...Well, I haven't gotten that far in the metaplot yet, so I can pretend that never happens.

    Seriously? Aliens? When I heard complaints that the reveal had the magic system had Lovecraftian origins, I thought they would be, y'know, not amateurish.

    Well that's very disappointing. CCG METAPLOOOTTTTTT.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:35 No.5529125
    So, drop some spoilers... what IS the metaplot?
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:36 No.5529146
    Saw what you will about Legend of the Five Rings metaplot fuckings that the card game threw on to it: It may have killed your favorite character, screwed over the time line, had your clan act stupidly out of character... But at least it hasn't killed the game line yet.

    Poor 7th Sea...
    >> Lazy DM V !vONhvIg88o 08/20/09(Thu)19:36 No.5529149
         File1250811384.jpg-(28 KB, 400x514, sweden-river-map.jpg)
    28 KB
    Throwing in a couple of real maps for comparison.
    >> Lazy DM V !vONhvIg88o 08/20/09(Thu)19:38 No.5529178
         File1250811502.gif-(41 KB, 522x462, euriv.gif)
    41 KB
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:39 No.5529198
         File1250811593.jpg-(412 KB, 655x907, 1242197220865.jpg)
    412 KB

    Don't worry, 3.5 ED lasting an year probably will kill it.

    In 2010, ALL HAIL YOUR 4TH ED
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:40 No.5529208
    ...they have a new edition of L5R? Already?
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:42 No.5529223
    >a few mechanical issues

    I did some math on roll-and-keep for some homebrew, and it essentially became impossible to fail on far less dice than I thought. Is this said issue, or does it actually work out ok and I'm missing something else?
    >> Lazy DM V !vONhvIg88o 08/20/09(Thu)19:42 No.5529225
         File1250811741.jpg-(287 KB, 1498x1216, europe_15th_colbeck.jpg)
    287 KB
    And a bit of an older one.

    It's not as accurate, of course.

    Also, though it might not be relevant here, maps aren't made in a vacuum. They're frequently used for political ends. As such, they're not unbiased. Also, accurate maps used to be closely guarded secrets back in the day.

    Anyway, 7th Sea... No, you don't need a fucking natural barrier for each country border. Mountain ranges don't just pop up all over the place and leave the climate unaffected. And that long strait is just inviting critique, and makes people notice other flaws.

    Should've just cribbed a European map or something and shaved off/reorganized edges a bit, adjusting rivers and climate a bit. Er, or something.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:44 No.5529259
    Okay, I'll bite.

    What do I need to do to make a realistic map of 7th Sea?

    This thread's gotten me interested.
    >> Lazy DM V !vONhvIg88o 08/20/09(Thu)19:46 No.5529295
         File1250812002.jpg-(80 KB, 568x402, ereb altor karta.jpg)
    80 KB
    Speaking of Fantasy maps, I'll throw in Sweden's most popular RPG setting - before Eon or the Trudvang version that is (couldn't find a map of the current version).

    Here ya go, Ereb Altor. Made sometime during the late 80ies/early 90ies.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:47 No.5529302
    THe problem with retooling the map is, some game components and adventures likely rely on certain things being in certain places - like the fact that you CAN sail through the continent along that ridiculous river - which will inevitably break things. Or need you retooling more than just the map.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:48 No.5529315

    Don't worry man, I'm raging as hard as you are.

    That said to be fair AT THE VERY LEAST it seems 4th would be story-neutral, you choose the period you like, metaplot seems it will be developed in other parts. Which, considering how much l5r lolcards/OH NOES IT'S THE END OF THE WORLD EVIL AT THE GATES metaplot sucks, is good.

    But I really think this will kill Alderac child, or anyway cripple it seriously. What kinda period is this for throwing out new editions with idiotically short terms for the old, goddamn?
    >> Lazy DM V !vONhvIg88o 08/20/09(Thu)19:49 No.5529318
    I'd consider the mountain ranges - plate tectonics and such. Then there's those enormous rivers running through the place at a couple of places. And the rivers flowing oddly.

    Consider what consequences the mountain ranges have on the surrounding fauna.

    I think that's some of the most annoying ones?
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:51 No.5529340
    Actually if you go by the attitude on AEG's forums most people are glad a new edition is coming out. 3ER was horribly rushed out and was a terrible book. 4E is looking like they learned from that mistake, it has had a year and a half at writing and playtesting. I hope they keep it on the drawing board until it is done and do not rush it out for Gen Con next year.
    >> LogicNinja !AZlS3./ex. 08/20/09(Thu)19:52 No.5529357
    Okay, so, basically in the past the senators of TOTALLY NOT ROME GUYS, WE SWEAR, SERIOUSLY made a pact with some creepy things from Beyond the Whatever and got SORCERY FOR THEIR BLOODLINES.

    Then it turns out that, oh yeah, every time you use sorcery you weaken the fabric between our world and theirs. (This was revealed AFTER the first book, so people already had reasonable, nice, non-evil sorcerer characters.)


    And oh yeah the Sidhe are aliens but they're totally nice aliens for reals.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:52 No.5529359
    I'm thinking of splitting the continent in two along the strait/river divide, so there's actually a sea in between the two, with a Gibraltar situation over on the Ussura/Crescent Empire side- Cathay is rare and exotic anyway, so it should be damn hazardous to get through that end of the straight.

    Though, I think turning Castille/Voddace over might also be called for then, to prevent total isolation on their part- maybe some island hopping between the two? Would make it look like a big mouth then. I dunno. I'M BAD AT THIS.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:55 No.5529386
    ...Alright, I wasn't really minding that stuff about Totally Not Rome breaking some kind of demonic pact until it got into "LOL MAGIC BONES WORLD" and that secret society shit. 7th Sea is about more fun and swashbuckling, so that clashes with the magic eating reality thing, and then the secret societies... Just...

    Also, fuck the Fair Folk. Just do 'em like the Changeling kind of Fair Folk, then it'll be good.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:56 No.5529400

    The fuck? Gencon? 4th is gonna be there in first quarter of 2010. So much for your hopes of taking it slowly, it seems.

    Also, I don' mind much another core (well, they're cocksuckers if they did 3ED badly, but at least I didn't buy that), but what I mind is having all the other books redone.
    And yes I know I could just use the old ones, you got my point.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:58 No.5529424
    I kind of shuffle off the Shadowlands to their own corner anyway... It's kind of annoying having the incarnation of darkness popping up around you constantly going "HAY GUYS HOWS IT GOIN' LOL" every two years.

    I don't like that 4th is coming out so soon leaving 3rd revised hanging in the breeze, but I'll remain optimistic. Also sounds good they're the RPG from being tugged around so damn much by the metaplot as well.

    I dunno. The big thing I'm worried about is the line's survival.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)19:59 No.5529433
    What can you tell me about this mysterious Swedish RPG?
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)20:03 No.5529466
    7th Sea is dead, isn't it?

    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)20:03 No.5529470

    Not that the Shadowlands were anywhere something very good IMHO.

    Goddamn, I'm raging.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)20:04 No.5529480
    The CCG is going strong and that is what finances the RPG. As long we have the first we will probably have the second.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)20:05 No.5529493
    I don't like them either... But, well, I kind of feel compelled to have them hanging around, otherwise... Well. I'm actually trying to summon up a reason other than "It's in the book" and I can't find it. Hrm.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)20:08 No.5529523

    I know, I know. Well, not so sure the CCRPG is as strong now with this economy.

    The fact that I'm somewhat expecting the fukken books is what make me rage most. I'm weak, but... I liked so much skipping through EE...

    It's your fault not putting them into /rs/, /tg/!
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)20:09 No.5529531
    Never gonna happen. /tg/ only loves itself, DnD, and 40k, and only the porn of 40k and stats for rape in DnD at that.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)20:11 No.5529561

    Collectible Card Role Playing Game?

    I have a love hate relationship with the CCG. On the one hand, it makes fucking stupid things happen in the metaplot. On the other hand, it actually keeps the RPG going.

    I actually should try picking up the card game sometime, huh?
    >> Lazy DM V !vONhvIg88o 08/20/09(Thu)20:14 No.5529593
         File1250813694.jpg-(446 KB, 1970x1386, 01_erebresize.jpg)
    446 KB
    Eh, it's the official setting for Drakar och Demoner (Eng: Dragons and Demons, commonly shortened DoD, also known as Dragonsfire internationally I think). Up until 5th edition of the RPG. Pretty much generic fantasy setting-wise. There was a thread about Target Games(the name of the company which released the RPG once they went international) a bit back where I gave a rundown on the Swedish history of RPGs. Check suptg, think you can still find it in the displays. Lazy DM V is in the descript (the archiver screwed up the tags a bit).

    Standard fantasy setting though it was, there was this epic campaign called the Fifth Conflux(translated name) or somesuch, starting with an adventure called Sulphur winter(also transl). Sort of wanted to play that. Supposedly it's pretty damn good.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)20:18 No.5529623
    Here I think we have some good local-made RPGs, but oddly enough very few have proper new maps: you have to use real world maps, slightly alterated, for an alternate history Rome or zombies against the nazis.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)20:30 No.5529739

    That abominable river could perhaps be explained as a channel dating back to Numan times. Not sure how to determine where the natural river should flow, though. One west, one east, I should think, with the split somewhere between the two lakes.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)20:32 No.5529760
    Do you mean a natural channel, or a man made channel? I'm fond of having "A Wizard Did It" but that massive of a man made channel would be seriously pushing it to me, especially in a low magic setting like 7th Sea.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)20:33 No.5529770
    >That abominable river

    I don't care how, but in my upcoming 7th Sea game I'm going to refer to this delightful river rage through out it.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)20:34 No.5529782


    Because Roman Empire Equivalent + Slaves + Magic = Think Big.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)20:38 No.5529808

    That might be alright, actually, if we put a Robert E. Howard spin to it. Something like Serpent People in an age past yadda yadda actually I don't know where I'm going with this.

    But that idea could work. It's just I'd have to tailor it to my personal idea of what could mesh well in 7th Sea's swashbuckling setting.

    Maybe have a whole bunch of ancient I Can't Believe It's Not Roman work sites from the ancient era that the big bad wants to control to mess up the strait's flow?
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)20:38 No.5529814
    Your LOTR map just got more real.

    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)20:40 No.5529826
    Bookmarked. Thanks mate.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)20:41 No.5529834

    Well, a pretty standard excuse for "We have no idea how it works!" in 7S is "Syrneth Did It". Even when you ignore the later meanderings of the metaplot (like, everything after that island rose.)

    I fare well with a campaign set in the Eisen Unification Wars of the early 1700s, myself.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)20:54 No.5529998
    I look at the 7S map, and what I see is a poorly executed attempt to make logic work in their world.

    I think they made the map first, without stupid rivers and mountains. Later, someone pointed out that there's no reason for most of the countries on the landmass to develop significant naval force. So they said fuck it, and threw some mountains and rivers on there to make travel impossible except by sea.

    I've never played, but it looks like they did alright making Vendel out to be Viking territories, as they don't seem like they'd have much in the way of arable land.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)20:55 No.5530006
    You know what I'd really like to be on /rs/ on the subject of maps?

    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)20:57 No.5530030
    I freaking love the Vendel/Vesten. It's the perfect combination of the United Provinces and the Vikings. And it actually kind of makes sense!

    It's just the rest of the continent. There has to be a way to make it work, without ruining the setting...
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)20:59 No.5530053
    Wow. That actually looks really badass.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)21:02 No.5530066
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)21:02 No.5530072
    Rifts is a chaotic mish-mash of so many things fantasy and scifi that it should fall on it's ass and explode, but somehow manages to be a believable and fun setting. Palladium has some great writers working on Rifts.

    It's a dirty rotten shame that they're not so fantastic at making a good rule system.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)21:03 No.5530088

    Frustrating think is that I can't see how my city is supposed to be called! And no, they don't sell in my country.

    Anyway names seem pretty more logical than I would have thought. Seine is kinda gentle.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)21:10 No.5530162
    Sweden apparently ate Denmark though.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)21:14 No.5530196
    It's possible that one is flowing into the lake and that the other is a tributary flowing out of one.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)21:27 No.5530345
    Does anyone know of any site or so somewhere which lists "21 common mistakes on fantasy world maps" or so? Currently poking around a bit with trying t design a bit of a world, and it would be nice if I could avoid the worst sins.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)21:28 No.5530361
    Not really, but you can just look up the rules about rivers, and mountains. Those are the most common mistakes- although you'll need to remember climate bands. And the effects of y'know what fuck it, you're going to need to take a college course for this.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)21:30 No.5530383
    Feared as much.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)21:36 No.5530463
    Yeah, it is soooo believable that Vampires that can be killed with squirt guns manage to hold an empire in Mexico...Rifts is one of the most incoherent settings out there. I have never understood why it gets such high marks by anyone older than 16. There are nuggets of good amongst the mountains of shit but even the good is not that good.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)21:37 No.5530470
    Sorry dude. I don't know enough about the subject, but if I did, I would totally hook you up with some info if I could.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)22:13 No.5530822
    Bump for cartography! I fucking love this shit!
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)22:27 No.5530943
    This is a video game map.

    The designer clearly knew nothing about geography, but they did know that chokepoints help direct player actions.

    PCs start in Montaigne, which has low-level monsters. Travel south to Castille as part of a quest. They want to go to Eisen, the bridge has monsters. When they finally do get to Eisen, they find out it's at war with Vodacce, which becomes the bad guy for awhile. Then they discover the LOL SECRET PATH through the mountains to the Empire of the Crescent Moon, who are struggling to keep the real threat at bay, Ussura.

    And yet... it's a game about boats. Go figure.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)22:38 No.5531050

    If you're still there, this is not what you requested but in the same vein. Try
    for rivers (and that forum generally for mapmaking) and
    for climate.
    >> Anonymous 08/20/09(Thu)23:01 No.5531311
         File1250823705.jpg-(62 KB, 460x460, 460_678679.jpg)
    62 KB
    "I have never understood why it gets such high marks by anyone older than 16."
    16 = the Age of Rifts. Rifts players chronologically older than 16 = arrested development retards.
    >> Anonymous 08/21/09(Fri)00:13 No.5532117
    >> Anonymous 08/21/09(Fri)00:15 No.5532130
    Take a good look at that map.
    Realize that it's a game about swashbuckling and piracy.
    Notice it takes place on ONE CONTINENT, with NO reason to sail between locations.

    >> Anonymous 08/21/09(Fri)00:16 No.5532148
    Well yeah, but otherwise they'd have to trip up on the mine field of slavery, and aboriginal genocide. So, commence pussing out!
    >> Manyfist !!TggEaf+C4RP 08/21/09(Fri)00:21 No.5532188
    Is it me or does the map look like Antarctica, but without the ice?
    >> Anonymous 08/21/09(Fri)00:28 No.5532257
    >>"I love this RPG except..."
    DnD has armor written as damage avoidance rather than damage absorbtion, which it really is. Plus they still use anachronisms like "chainmaile" when it was just called "maille". Studded leather never existed other than mis-identified brigantine or coats of plate by the writers of the original rules.

    The katana is NOT a superior weapon. Only a glorified cavalry sword. That shit can't penetrate 20 guage steel. For those not in the know, european plate armor was around 18 guage hardened steel by modern estimates.

    Bows do about the right amount of damage. Bows did not penetrate plate armor beyond 50 feet on a direct shot. However, the power of the bow shall always be in the sheer numbers that they were used in hopes that a knight's horse was killed in a mass volley.
    >> Manyfist !!TggEaf+C4RP 08/21/09(Fri)00:30 No.5532273
    Ya except you know... a wizard did it.
    >> Anonymous 08/21/09(Fri)00:37 No.5532354
    Swashbuckling, sure; piracy, optional. 7th Sea is as much inspired by Robin Hood or the Three Musketeers as it is Treasure Island.

    But still, there's plenty of scope for a full-on nautical campaign. Two major nations are on islands and even if you live on the continent only Porté is quicker than sailing for travelling long distances. And boats are by far the most efficient way to transport goods in bulk, so there's plenty of scope for piracy. The designers just wanted to build a bigger, more coherent world than just some swashbucklers on the high seas.
    >> Anonymous 08/21/09(Fri)00:39 No.5532384
    I LOVE 7th Sea. It's just that...Everything looks like it's glommed together, so I have to wonder if naval battles would be possible. I mean, 7th Sea even off boat is awesome, it's just, well, I dunno how often I can justify going on boat, y'know?
    >> Anonymous 08/21/09(Fri)00:42 No.5532426
         File1250829755.jpg-(704 KB, 2262x1560, 1247267794441.jpg)
    704 KB
    worst. map. ever.
    >> LogicNinja !AZlS3./ex. 08/21/09(Fri)00:43 No.5532433
    Man, this reminds me. I had an awesome Zorro-style character that I never really got a chance to play. Lots of fun attitude/background-wise, and she had a thing where she'd use Corps-a-Corps or Pommel Strike to lower someone's TN to 5, then quickdraw a pistol (pirate trick) and shoot them for MAJOR DRAMATIC WOUNDS and everybody going "oh fuck shit just got serious".
    >> Anonymous 08/21/09(Fri)00:43 No.5532441
    >piracy, optional.
    It's called 7th SEA, and the only book cover I've seen that I can recall has someone standing by the rigging of a sailing ship.
    I think one is hard-pressed to claim there isn't a strong nautical element presented by the game.
    >> Anonymous 08/21/09(Fri)00:45 No.5532475
    See, I want to revise 7th Sea now. Revise the map, and shake off the metaplot, and maybe do some reconfiguring of magic rules and drama dice. There is an EXCELLENT game and setting under that, and it's not even buried deep like RIFTs.
    >> LogicNinja !AZlS3./ex. 08/21/09(Fri)00:46 No.5532482
    Also she had like six names because she was Castillian (read: Spanish). Shit was fun.
    >> LogicNinja !AZlS3./ex. 08/21/09(Fri)00:46 No.5532494
         File1250830017.jpg-(100 KB, 600x474, YouHeardMe.jpg)
    100 KB
    Don't forget to throw out the ridiculous NPCs that do everything important.
    >> Anonymous 08/21/09(Fri)00:47 No.5532499
    Too many people are using this bullshit excuse to try to get away with being lazy, stupid, or both.
    >> Anonymous 08/21/09(Fri)00:48 No.5532519
    Really? What's so bad about it?

    The mountain ranges look plausible enough, the rivers run down to the sea. It's a hell of a lot better than the 7th Sea one anyway.
    >> Anonymous 08/21/09(Fri)00:48 No.5532527
    I'd keep Kheired Din though, he makes a good antagonist.

    But the mary-sues've gotta go. Top of the list? Allende and his fucking stupid lawful good Brotherhood of Pirates.
    >> Manyfist !!TggEaf+C4RP 08/21/09(Fri)00:49 No.5532541
    That's one the best maps, it's just a distorted real earth map.
    >> Anonymous 08/21/09(Fri)00:53 No.5532602
    Well yeah, that's pretty much what they sell it as because it's a familiar and appealing concept for a game.

    But it'd be selling the game short to pigeonhole it as nautical adventure fantasy when they've gone and redrawn all of Renaissance Europe as a D&D setting.
    >> Salamanders Fanbro !!IkBm+qsTaW7 08/21/09(Fri)00:58 No.5532666
    What I hate about is that the entire empire is basically forest. YOU CAN'T RUN AN EMPIRE ON FOREST FFFFFFFFF. One of the main things I hate about Warhams and almost all other settings is that they have no idea how logistics and economics work. Sure you have a huge army of a million men, but you have like 5 peasants. Who feeds them? Who equips them? Where did they get their horses, and who feeds the horses? Where does your saddle come from? Who drives the wagon carrying your tents? Where are all the camp followers? Who supports the camp followers? Where are the merchants, and how do they ship things to you? How much does it take to feed your army per day, and how do the supplies get there? and on, and on, and on.
    >> Anonymous 08/21/09(Fri)01:11 No.5532838
    This, OH GOD this.
    >> Anonymous 08/21/09(Fri)01:18 No.5532926
    I gotta say, you're a bit smarter than I thought you were. I've never even thought about that kind of thing before.
    >> Anonymous 08/21/09(Fri)01:23 No.5532983
    This was covered in more depth in WFRP 1st edition which got into settlement patterns and the likelihood of finding a village in any given area, but the gist of it is that the Empire is covered in varying degrees of forest with the routes between cities being particularly well-settled and intensively farmed.

    Somewhere like the Reik valley is obviously going to have a lot of farms about, it just fades into the wilderness quicker than you might expect since in Warhammer the woods are actively hostile and filled with monsters.
    >> Anonymous 08/21/09(Fri)01:26 No.5533008
    And hey, Camp Follower is a playable career in WFRP 2e. Looting the baggage train was a valid tactic in WFB 3. They do think about this sort of shit from time to time.
    >> Anonymous 08/21/09(Fri)01:31 No.5533069
    highly relevant to this conversation:

    >> Anonymous 08/21/09(Fri)01:37 No.5533147
    My only gripe with 7th sea is their insistence to have every fucking thing from 16 to early 19 century crammed into a couple decades of the default timeline. Reformation and Napoleon at once do not fucking blend.
    Otherwise, setting is fine and the rules... well, good for a change.
    >> Salamanders Fanbro !!IkBm+qsTaW7 08/21/09(Fri)02:01 No.5533420
    I know all that, but they don't show it on the map and that's what I bitch about. I just kind of went off on a semi-related tangent.
    >> Anonymous 08/21/09(Fri)04:52 No.5534817

    Ah, Svordsman Schools...
    So many way to humiliate and kill a foe, so little time and xp to learn them.
    >> Anonymous 08/21/09(Fri)05:07 No.5534928

    Villanova School fencing or bust, motherfuckers!
    >> Anonymous 08/21/09(Fri)05:15 No.5534999
    my friends 7th Sea campaign died after only 3 sessions because of everyone's conflicting schedules. i lol'd
    >> Anonymous 08/21/09(Fri)05:40 No.5535185
    bump for map-haitng awesomeness
    >> Anonymous 08/21/09(Fri)06:45 No.5535660

    Eisenfurst is superior, Vodacce cur.
    >> Anonymous 08/21/09(Fri)08:59 No.5536470

    Delete Post [File Only]
    Style [Yotsuba | Yotsuba B | Futaba | Burichan]