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  • File : 1258389583.jpg-(122 KB, 250x326, 40krp-dark-heresy.jpg)
    122 KB Tau Heresy part 2 Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)11:39 No.6730953  
    Hello again, /tg/. This is a continuation of:

    I've been doing some thinking, and I have a name for the game now: Ethereal Dawn. I've also named the program that the players are part of: Outreach. I have one more idea, but I need to know if astropaths have to be loyal to the Imperium (as opposed to faithful to the Emperor, they don't have to be the same thing) for their powers to function.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)11:48 No.6731033
    Bit tricky. On the one hand, no, as pyskers the powers are innate to them. On the other hand, the only way a human can become psychically strong enough to be an Astropath is to be soul bound to the Emperor, even more so than normal sanctioned psykers. They are so unlikely to work willingly for the Tau it is untrue.

    Faith in the Emperor means following his commandments: beware the mutant, the alien, the heretic. Astropaths have all been to Terra, been exposed to the Emperor's psychic magnificence and had God knows how many horrible training excercises and purity tests. Psycho-indoctrination is almost certainly a part of this. It is quite possible that it would never occur to most to rebel against the Imperium. Besides, Imperial psykers are constantly probed for heretical tendencies and eliminated if they don't match up. Some fall to demonic influence, but these are very rare.

    Astropaths tend to be locked up in choirs together and rarely see visitors. It would be highly unlikely that they would ever willingly leave the choir.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)11:51 No.6731058
    All right. The reason I came up with this idea is that I thought that exploring the area of space around the Tau Empire might not be all that interesting or meaningful, and so introduce a rogue astropath to give them one means of traveling longer distances. Specifically one piloting a supercarrier of some sort that would allow the Tau of Outreach to theoretically set up shop anywhere in the Imperium.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)11:51 No.6731063
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    >I need to know if astropaths have to be loyal to the Imperium (as opposed to faithful to the Emperor, they don't have to be the same thing)

    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)11:53 No.6731075
    Look at the Space Marines. Especially when they come into conflict with the IG.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)11:53 No.6731076
    Yeah. You're not going to get that. The penalty of the Tau is they are really small and really insignificant. On the plus side you get to be kind of good in comparison to everyone else.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)11:54 No.6731089
    ...I wouldn't think you'd want Tau operatives to die horribly and often in insignificant ways, Exalted.

    Because that's how most of Dark Heresy works.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)11:56 No.6731098
    Not going to get what, exactly?

    Other possibilities are somehow discovering the Webway, or using the Nicassar to navigate.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)11:56 No.6731102
    I'm just using the ruleset. The tone of Ethereal Dawn is completely (well, partially) different.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)11:57 No.6731103

    What you need is a rogue Navigator. Maybe a whole rogue Navigator House, disgraced due to some transgression, that wants to make contact with the Tau and become their warp travel providers. That or a Kroot with Wierdboy genes, they use those to navigate their Warpspheres.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)11:57 No.6731107
    Asrtopaths only really concern themselves wiith communication, its the navigators that plot the courses and guide the ship, since they can see into the warp.
    There are rogue/renegade navigators, as explained in rogue trader. But for them to be actively anti-imperial.. bit strechy
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)11:58 No.6731115
    The Webway? Hell no the Eldar hold onto that shit like nothing.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)11:59 No.6731119
    Ooh, the Kroot Weirdboy idea sounds quite interesting. But a rogue Navigator could work too.

    I really only need one, unless you need more than one person to navigate a sufficiently large ship.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)11:59 No.6731120
    I don't think Dark Heresy is good for a Tau game.

    Tau are the least grimdark race in the game, they might fair better in Rogue Trader.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)12:00 No.6731131
    That's more about trade and exploration. The Tau Outreach more closely resembles the Inquisition, except with an emphasis on infiltration and undermining enemy structures instead of rooting out heresy.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:01 No.6731139
    There are outcast houses of Navigators. The Tau obtaining the services of such an organisation isn't infeasible, though there are plenty of other problems with warp travel beyond the usual ~5 light year hop that the Tau are used to. Can their ships withstand a longer journey through the warp? How do they deal with the strange and occasionally terrible things that occur during a routine warp voyage?
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:02 No.6731146
    What about a brand new technology that allows them to observe currents in the warp? Your guys are the first to test it out.
    Thats its made for a half-dead navigator whos body is in constant agony is not for the normal castes to know, it is for the greater good.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:02 No.6731148
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:02 No.6731149
    Eh. Just doesn't seem to be the Tau's style. Exploration and diplomacy seems more their thing. And they don't seem as expendable as the Inquisition uses their Acoltyes because they are so small.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:03 No.6731152

    I'm thinking the rogue House could be a nice plot hook. The Outreach gets their first mission, to establish negotiations with the House and get a demonstration of their star charts or the routes they know. The PC's will enter the rogue House's vessel, an ancient Imperial cruiser, and if they snoop a bit they'll discover the inbreeding, mutations and rampant Chaos or Xeno worship that goes on in the House. Of course, being Tau they'll shrug it off as "degenerate Gue'La behavior" but that's when you introduce some sinister plot or whatever.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)12:04 No.6731158
    There's also the issue that Dark Heresy is the only thing I have right now. I don't have the money to get anything from Rogue Trader and I can't find anything current online.

    That has potential... hopefully slightly less painful potential, but potential all the same.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:08 No.6731184

    To be honest a Tau secret police might be a better bet. There will be crime on the Tau worlds, there will be secret invasions - it is all very well having your little team gallivanting around the universe, but what happens when a Lictor or a genestealer lands on Au'taal,? What happens if a Vindicare is going to assassinate an important ethereal? What happens if a space hulk teleports in? Or a chaos corrupted Kroot gets into the sewage systems of a capital city? Your guys will be the one to deal with it.

    The Tau empire is tiny compared to the Imperium, but seems about the same size as a small Imperial sector. There will be plenty for a team of operatives to do just in Tau space. Besides, as soon as you get outside Tau space, you are going to run into the other races in big numbers. And they will murder your lot.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)12:08 No.6731185
    Mmm, yes...

    If anyone wants to know, Outreach's headquarters is on Kronus. Specifically, it grew out of the research facility on the Thur'abis Plateau that the Tau originally built for studying captured Necron weaponry.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)12:10 No.6731198
    I think that crime is one of those things the Greater Good has done away with, but the other ideas are certainly plausible. On the other hand, I'm not sure why the Tau police force would need to be secret; Fire Teams would probably be enough to take care of most of it except maybe genestealer cults. Of course, one could still easily make a campaign out of it.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:10 No.6731199
    Its a plot hook, and what I would do, nice and evil but nessecary. But you could just use the Navigators eye.
    I'd put as little friendly contact with humans in it as possible.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:10 No.6731202

    Studying Necron technology never ends well. Never.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:11 No.6731212
    Oh yeah! There's those genestealers the Imperium put into Tau space.

    Man, they are probably trying their best to hide that from the rest of the Empire. If they even know about it at all. Better hope they do.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:12 No.6731226
    Nah, I think the Tau like to shout out that their Empire's near perfect but I think it's pretty much propaganda, they still have problems. Unless that pheromone thing is true and it's mind control.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)12:13 No.6731228
    Does Necron technology have bad effects on other people? It's completely material, so it wouldn't involve Warp-induced insanity...
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:14 No.6731232


    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)12:14 No.6731233
    I think it's less mind control and more of a calming effect. The Ethereals don't dictate the thoughts in other people's minds, but they do keep everything basically peaceful.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:17 No.6731252
    Well yes on a lot of levels but they can't do it to nearly everyone, right? I'm not buying that they have built a society without crime. Not going to happen in 40K, even if the Tau are one of the least grimdark.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:18 No.6731257
    It has the potential to call in some more 'crons. It could also activate or re-activate those already on planet.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:19 No.6731266
    Meddling with Necron tech will bring the Necrons around. The tombs of Kronus are buried, not destroyed. Also account for the fact that Necron tech is insanely, *insanely* advanced and you've got a recipe for disaster. Necron technology far, far outstrips anything the Eldar have or humanity had during the Dark Age of Technology. The Tau would have an easier time trying to replicate wraithbone that understand it.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)12:20 No.6731278
    I suppose that's a difference of opinion, then.

    Thankfully, the complex isn't as Necron-focused as it once was, but perhaps that could be a rather nasty adventure idea...
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:21 No.6731279

    Number One: if the Tau have free will, then there will be bad eggs who will commit crimes. They may well be hushed up, but crime will happen. See Cmdr. Farsight, for instance. If they *don't* have free will then the Tau Empire is everything the critics say it is.

    Number Two: Secret police in the same sense as the Inquisition, Section 9 from Ghost in the Shell, the Psi Corps from Babylon 5, the MIB. They police secret crimes that they don't want the population at large to know about, either because the knowledge would cause panic or because they need to keep the regime protected from all potential enemies, within and without.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:21 No.6731281
    What's up with Farsight going completely rogue, then?
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)12:26 No.6731332
    I see your point on 1, and the Tau do have free will... I can't see them committing any kind of major crimes, though. Committing theft for a Tau would likely be as psychologically difficult as committing murder for an ordinary human.
    However, the secret police thing is still interesting. I just liked the idea of traveling around the Imperium and undermining it a bit more, but staying in the Empire and fighting any hidden demons that show up would be interesting.

    The long-term effects from not having an Ethereal around. Tau don't take their deaths very well, and those who are away from one for a really long time might start going genuinely insane, especially members of the Fire Caste.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:27 No.6731340
    No, there is absolutely no mention of crime on Tau worlds. Tau are raised with the Greater Good beaten into their heads in the same way that the Emperor is beaten into Imperium citizens. Crime would be extremely rare and would primarily be the result of a bad childhood or something similar.

    No one knows why Farsight went rogue, but it's probably because he accidentally got all his Ethereals killed. Regardless of what happened, he still fights for the Tau despite severing his connection with the main Empire.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:28 No.6731354
    Not known if he actually has. but I am cetain GW will tell us.
    Ofcourse there are bad apples in the tau empire, not all see the greater good the same way. Though a severe caste system and indoctrination does go some way to stop this.
    And ofcource the Tau have a secret police equivalent, exept I doubt they are really secret, I would cnsider them a more thought police idea, but less tortury and shooty.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:30 No.6731376
    And yet Heresy still creeps up in the Imperium, even on the most devout worlds. Tau have free will, there will be bad eggs. The Empire wouldn't broadcast this, everything in 40K is propaganda from one side or another.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:31 No.6731386
    >Tau are raised with the Greater Good beaten into their heads in the same way that the Emperor is beaten into Imperium citizens.

    What, and the Imperial Creed advocates anything besides blind obedience and lawfulness? If it was "exactly the same" then crime on Tau worlds would be about as frequent as it is on Imperial ones.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:33 No.6731408

    I knew you were going to bring this up, but my analogy is imperfect. The one thing the Tau fear more than anything else is divergence from the Greater Good; it might be as bad as how the Imperium fears the enemy within. The primary difference between the two however is that turning from the Greater Good is a personal choice, whereas turning to the Dark Powers is very often the result of external influences. The Tau are probably less susceptible to turning into bad eggs because they don't have Chaos Gods prodding them around.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)12:34 No.6731410
    That's why it's not beaten into their heads, really. The calming presence of the Ethereals substitutes.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:36 No.6731428

    This isn't a perfect analogy though because the Tau are still alien despite their similarities to human. Remember that they have been selectively bred over many generations abhor The Terror. Although they have free will, the overwhelming majority of the Tau are incapable of turning from the Greater Good through a combination of genetics, societal pressure, and whatever it is that the Ethereals do.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:36 No.6731431
    What kinds of weapons would be available? Just pulse rifles/carbines/pistols? Or would you allow things like rail rifles or man-portable flamers/plasma rifles/burst cannons? And what would the stats for those weapons be?
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:36 No.6731435

    >no mention of crime on Tau worlds.

    They probably aren't going to be advertising it though, are they?

    When I read the words "There are no criminals in the tau Empire" it sounds in my head very much like "There are no homosexuals in Iran". Reality and what the government wants to be reality are rarely the same thing.

    there are hints that it is only the Ethereals preventing a meltdown in Tau society. Fire caste Tau are naturally violent, for instance. When the railgun snipers first came out, there was a short piece of fiction detailing the testing phase. When one of the fire warriors using the new gun was killed by feedback from it, the Fire Warrior commander was ready to kill the earth caste engineer/lead scientist. It was only when he was chastised by an ethereal that he backed down.

    There cannot be enough ethereals to completely control every Tau across every world. It might be psychologically difficult for some Tau, but for others it would be less so. There are sociopathic human murderers in the real world, for instance, to say nothing of the Imperium. Most castes probably end up having a few types of criminals - fire warriors have violent types, Earth has kleptomaniacs, theives and so on, Air caste have joy riders, organised crime and smuggling from the water caste...
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:37 No.6731444
    Again, people in the Imperium also fall to the enemy within. There are those who do it voluntarily, often justifying their actions making up lies to convince themselves they haven't corrupted.

    I could see a Tau do it just as easily. Oh I must steal this, for if I prosper I will get more influence and my influence will cause more good for the Greater Good. I must kill this man, for he is impeding my progress and by doing so impeding the Greater Good.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)12:38 No.6731455
    Tau aren't human, though.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:39 No.6731472
    I think the problem here is that we are treating Tau too similar to humans. They are same in a lot of ways, yet different too. Let's look at the difference between Humans and Dwarves for instance. I would say that crime in a Dwarven city is far less likely than a Human city.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:40 No.6731477

    I'd imagine they would get the experimental weaponry to act as testbeds for new equipment. Possibly some new stealth suits.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:41 No.6731485
    Like most of 40K fluff, this is subjective, You could interpret it as Tau propaganda or the truth.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:41 No.6731486
    They're not perfect, selfless being either, though. Everyone getting along perfectly, all the time, without exception is impossible and, well, boring.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)12:41 No.6731489
    Moving somewhat away from the discussion of Tau criminals, I came up with a little introduction piece that can probably apply to any Tau-centered bit of 40K media. It's the Tau equivalent of the "In the 41st millennium..." intro.

    "Six thousand years have passed since the great warp storm enveloped the world of T’au, shielding it from the murderous eyes of the mighty Imperium of Man. Four thousand have passed since the Ethereals arrived to save the Tau people from their senseless internecine wars, and show them the light of the Greater Good. Now, the Tau Empire reaches for the stars… and finds nothing but war and darkness beyond its own borders. The iron fist of Man clamps down on the galaxy while barbaric marauders run rampant throughout the stars, extragalactic monstrosities seek to devour all life, and daemonic entities from beyond reality itself gaze upon it all with anticipation and joy.

    But to accept defeat here is not the way of the Tau. The warriors of the Fire Caste make themselves ready for war, while the pilots of the Air Caste ply new routes and take the fight to Man’s war fleets. The diplomats of the Water Caste form connections beyond the Empire, running between the myriad wars and brokering what peace they can, and the Earth Caste’s labor and ingenuity both supports it all. All four unite and prosper under the benevolent hand of the Ethereal Caste, and here, the 41st millennium finds its hope.

    Now is the time for heroes. Now is the time to silence the laughter of the thirsting gods. To drive back the billion horrors of this galaxy and beyond, or to die trying, knowing that your service was not in vain. To confront the tyrants and blood-soaked fanatics of Man… and show their oppressed servants the Ethereals’ light.

    Now is the hour of the Greater Good."
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:42 No.6731491

    No, I really doubt that would happen. It doesn't match up with the fluff at all. I'm not saying crime is impossible; I'm saying that it's exceedingly rare. The Tau wouldn't have to rely on secret police forces, prisons, or courts at all.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)12:42 No.6731498
    Possibly. I'm saving item crunch for last; right now, I'm trying to work out all the fluff.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:42 No.6731499
    Yeah, as a Tau fan I don't like the idea that there's no crime.

    There's Relatively Good in a Grimdark Universe and then there's TOO Good in a Grimdark Universe which gets boring.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:43 No.6731501

    or maybe human crimes are less common, but dwarven crimes happen about the same amount.

    "Urist Axebeard, you stand accused of supping another Dwarfs ale / engraving without a permit / consorting with elves / disliking chainmail - how do you plead?"
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:43 No.6731502

    Yeah, this is fitting for the Tau.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:43 No.6731510
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    Must-post to every tau thread

    you can print this and put to your wall, think its gue´vesa propaganda poster
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:44 No.6731511

    You make it sound like it's going to be a campaign of Tau Gear Solid, Splinter Tau, or Call of Tau: Modern Firewarfare, where the players are a crack team of special ops units sent to eliminate terrorist threats to the Empire and use experimental weapons in their fight against secret and terrifying foes that are unknown to the general public...

    Actually, that WOULD be awesome. OP, do that.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:45 No.6731523

    I can just see the grainy propaganda film reel, and hear the dramatic music. Nice.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:45 No.6731525
    I'm with you, which is why this thread irks me so much. Too much "Tau are brilliant, defy grimdark, ray of shining hope" which is divorced from the reality of the race to a worrying degree.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:45 No.6731526
    Hard to do it in Dark Heresy. Not really made for it.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)12:46 No.6731530
    That's certainly an option if everyone wants to be a part of the Fire Caste. But I do want to keep roles open for other castes.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:47 No.6731537
    Would this be awesome: human resistance in Tau manned human city, tired of endless Tau propaganda and discrimination, liberate the city with help of one single, yet unnamed, legendary space marine, sole survivor of tau attack
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)12:47 No.6731539
    Generally I'm referring to the tone of the setting. The Tau Empire may well seem creepy and uninviting to humans, but to Tau it's exceedingly awesome, and this is from their perspective. It may seem jarring because almost everything in 40K is through Imperial eyes.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:47 No.6731540
    "no crime" makes me think more of brainwashing than goodness
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:47 No.6731543
    Yeah, I mean the Tau are quite good, in comparison to the rest of the galaxy, but let's not make them out to be a Utopia. That's boring and not 40K style. It just plain doesn't fit.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)12:49 No.6731554
    Possibly, but that's something that you can do in any of the other Imperium-centered systems. It doesn't fit all that well in this game, although they'd make for interesting antagonists.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:49 No.6731557
    What are you going to use for Earth castes? Thats the biggest problem I can see. The other castes have their uses.

    Fire = Shooty
    Water = Fellowship
    Air = transport/spaceship
    Kroot = close combaty
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:50 No.6731558
    think half-life 2: rest is history

    Propaganda, people, guards, everything fitting DC-tau

    and yeah, its awesome
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:50 No.6731560
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    >City 17
    >think it's gue'vesa propaganda

    You sure? I think it's from someplace else...
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)12:51 No.6731572
    Technicians and scientists. Sort of the non-social skillmonkeys of the party.

    How exactly would this work if the players are playing as the Tau? Unless the human rebels are antagonists.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:51 No.6731575
    Earth Castes would be techies and engineers.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:51 No.6731576
    I don't know. We don't yet know how the Tau actually treat human citizens, but it doesn't seem as bleak and dystopic as you're making it out to be.

    Well yeah, in the same way humans are "brainwashed" to worship the Emperor. All Tau are raised with one guiding principle, to achieve the Greater Good.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:52 No.6731578
    People tearing down Propaganda Screen which endlessly replays Ethereal speech, and yell the Emperors name!
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)12:52 No.6731586
    The Emperor doesn't have a name.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:53 No.6731590
    >humans are brainwashed to worship the Emperor

    Yeah, that doesn't always work out so well. Chaos Cults.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:53 No.6731593
    Its Bill Cosby
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:53 No.6731595
    Yes, he does. Everyone just calls him the Emperor. Because that's kind of what he is.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:55 No.6731605
    We already had this discussion before:
    1. Tau are not Humans.
    2. Chaos is an external influence.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:56 No.6731614

    Funny, everyone keeps saying "In the Emperor's name", and yet I've never heard anyone actually say it.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:57 No.6731624
    That's not what I'm saying. I'm saying that human "brainwashing" isn't as effective as the Imperial higher-ups like to think it is. The Tau don't fall to Chaos because they have no reason to; they have little Warp presence and as such, the daemons of the Warp largely ignore them in favor of the humans and Eldar.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:58 No.6731632
    thats like saying "Jesus´ jew" to fundie
    it doesnt really matter
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:58 No.6731637

    Even without Chaos Cults there are people who don't worship him. In the real world during the middle ages there were people who did not follow the Catholic church, despite the social pressures to do so. Same deal here. I mean, come on, any human who joins the Tau has turned their back on the Emperor
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)12:59 No.6731646

    Probably unwillingly though, they'd rather live another day then not join the Tau and die.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)12:59 No.6731650
    All right, fa/tg/uys and ca/tg/irls, I'm now curious. What do people like the idea of more: the Tau Outreach, infiltrating the Imperium and investigating other forces? Or peacekeeping in the Tau Empire itself?
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:00 No.6731656
    Unless they're working undercover. Or had no choice in the matter.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:00 No.6731657

    Peacekeeping Secret Police Special Forces
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:01 No.6731664

    Peacekeeping in the Tau sector, simply because adventuring in the Imperium would leave you with very little social interaction. Aliens are shot on sight...
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:01 No.6731666

    Why don't you combine them? The Outreach could start out investigating some internal problem among the non-Tau (kroot or human) elements of the Empire, and then the investigation would turn outward as links to outside influence are discovered.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:02 No.6731671
    Peacekeeping. More opportunities to encounter horrible things from beyond the known galaxy (in the Tau's eyes) without them being a TPK on a time delay.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)13:04 No.6731698
    Perhaps Outreach could recruit from those in the Tau peacekeeping forces who've had experience with outside influences? Although that sounds a bit more like character backstory than the beginning of a campaign.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:04 No.6731701
    or what if they have so burning hatred towards Xenos that they turn into Chaos worship in order to get free of Tau..?
    Not hard to imagine idyllic wapanise tau city, when khorne cultist jumps in, cuts his writs. Everybodys waiting, and then he suddenly turns into fuckhuge Bloodthirster who fucks the shit up
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:06 No.6731715
    like sorta terrorist? Super!
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:07 No.6731731

    That seems like a good scenario for the peacekeeping force. On some of their recently captured worlds, the human citizens are resentful of Tau rule. They could be inheriting a fanatical sect of the Ecclesiarchy or some hidden Chaos Cult
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:07 No.6731733

    It would be like Mulder and Scully investigating a terrorist atrocity. One would be all rational about it, saying it was probably an explosive mixed with halucinogens and the other would be all over the "crazy monsters from another dimension" theory.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:07 No.6731735
    like Gestapo? Combine-Tau, here we come..
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)13:07 No.6731736
    I don't think the Tau would just let discontent simmer in those who actually belong to their empire. They'd send in Ethereal counselors to soothe everyone.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:09 No.6731751

    Chaos suicide bombers. Sleeper cells of Necron-worshipping Pariahs. Genestealer cults in the sleezy underground of the Kroot ghettos. Checkpoints into Tau "green zones" where the Greater Good has control, soldiers inspecting and scanning anyone entering for mutations or illegal technology.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:09 No.6731752

    Ethereals can only soothe other Tau with pheremones.

    Plus, most successful chaos cults are really, really good at keeping below the radar. If the Imperium can't get them all when they know exactly what to look for and how dangerous they are, how the hell are Tau going to find them all?
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:11 No.6731764
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    "Dont listen to Khornes followers. They are cheaters and liars who want nothing but anarchy and destruction. To destruct our peaceful society..."
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:11 No.6731768

    Well no, the scenario is that the recently captured world had a hidden Chaos Cult on it that they didn't detect. The other human citizens don't care much either way being simple farmers, but the Chaos Cult blooms and begins hurting both the Tau and the other human citizens. Throw in some moral choice somewhere between saving Tau or Humans or something like that.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)13:13 No.6731787
    This could be a new responsibility for the Tau peacekeepers, certainly, where the Tau could learn the risks of bringing such huge psychic beacons into the Empire...
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)13:14 No.6731792
    Ah, right. That sounds quite interesting indeed.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:14 No.6731797
    Another similar scenario might be the Tau trying to fold another minor alien race into their Empire. Some of the aliens are resistant and the peacekeeping force is sent in to eliminate the leaders of the dissenters.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:15 No.6731801
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    Now I'm imagining some kind of Tau NCIS.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:15 No.6731805
    shitty stupid cop shows are shitty and stupid
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:16 No.6731812
    and Undivided cult could easily lure some young men in their cult with power of slaanesh...tau of child welfare would first be worried, but for long...
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:17 No.6731826

    Precisely. You might even get the occasional operative who thinks "maybe the humans were onto something with the whole 'abhor the mutant' thing..."

    The nice thing is that the PCs start off as happy, shiny, naive and optimistic, but very quickly end up losing their ideals as they run into the horrors of the universe adn try to protect the rest from things they cannot know.

    A microcosm of the Tau Empire in general.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:18 No.6731829
    You could easily create new alien races since the Tau Empire isn't only made up of Tau, Kroot, Vespids, and Humans. They have numerous other minor alien races within the Empire.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:18 No.6731833

    and simple firewarriors would vomit seeing such twisted acts of faith...

    Slaanesh live long
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:21 No.6731862
    if all human were loyal citizen of the Imperium of Man, it would be night impossible to make human join the greater good.

    We all know what true devotion might make people do
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:21 No.6731863
    "They certainly do fight for freedom. And their 'freedom' is little more than wanton bloodshed and suffering. Only with Order can we truly prosper and see happiness. Join the Auxiliaries! It's Your Empire Too!"
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)13:22 No.6731866
    One thing. They don't HAVE to lose their ideals. They can instead develop into more of a knight in sour armor thing; "The galaxy may be unfair and crappy, but we will never give up our devotion, and we will never stop fighting for the Greater Good."

    I always like to make triumph a possibility.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:23 No.6731878
    A question, Exalted: where do you see the recruits for this organisation coming from?
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:24 No.6731891
    Well, if Tau tried to attack Shrine world, its confessors would likely make people blow themselves with xeno scums and mercilessly slaughter their new "peaceful" neighbors

    they would leave pritty quickly
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:26 No.6731905

    From a mechanical perspective you could make the loss of hope associated with gaining Insanity or Corruption points - they might not mutate, but the more horrors they are exposed to the more likely they are to completely lose hope. So long as they can keep below 100 they still believe in the Greater Good a little bit, but once they cross that threshold...
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:26 No.6731909
    like combine: totally re-educated collaborators who wished for better live, i presume
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:26 No.6731911

    Wouldn't that sort of be like what Farsight did?
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)13:27 No.6731916
    Recruits from other castes who've proven themselves to be good at operating independently.

    On that note, there's one possible problem with this peacekeeping forces thing; the characters will probably never be more than arm's reach away from aid or backup. Does that bother anyone?
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:27 No.6731919
    What? What are you talking about?
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)13:28 No.6731932
    Not corruption points; Tau are pretty much immune to the Warp. Insanity points are things that I will include, but I'm modifying it so that it's possible to get rid of your disorders and reduce your level of madness.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)13:29 No.6731942
    I don't really know, but I think he and his enclave are going steadily more insane the longer they're away from the Ethereals. They might even end up as antagonists.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:29 No.6731943

    If you go with the whole "planet only partially controlled" thing the PC's will be like American operatives in Iraq: sure, it's technically under control but there are these no-go zones (into which they will be forced to go because of the investigation)...
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:30 No.6731960
    would at least be epic ending
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:30 No.6731961

    You can use the corruption points to simulate "loss of connection to the Greater Good".
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:31 No.6731970
    Insanity points should still be in the setting. Corruption not so much, but definitely Insanity.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)13:31 No.6731972
    That wouldn't result in mutations. It'd be pretty much the same thing as insanity.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:32 No.6731987
    Throw a bunch of Greater Good morality problems at the PCs. in the beginning they know that they must serve the Greater Good and make the most good of any situation, but as their adventures go on they know that it is not always that simple.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:33 No.6731994

    Well... technically Inquisitorial forces are surrounded by potential sources of backup. They don't use them because of the whole "need to keep the organisation a secret" thing, as well as the fact the missions they have to go on mean that they cannot trust anyone. You could have one of the first missions the PCs go on be to investigate a rogue Tau - when they see that even there own people can be falliable, they will probably be more circumspect about calling for backup.

    Also, I would make the potential candidates be Tau/Kroot/whatevers that have stood out for some reason, and probaly have some idea that there is more to the universe than the Propaganda - (sole?) survivors of demon battles, Engineers who dug to greedily and too deep into Tomb Complexes, guys who have fought alongside radical Inquisitors or rogue traders, physically and mentally scarred water Caste diplomats who tried to make contact with chaos corrupted forces...
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:33 No.6732001
    I also remember discussion about humans live in Tau Empire.
    While humans considered Tau little more than barbaric beasts and inhumane conquerors, they tolerated them. They already attacked their culture and life style, but direct rebelling would only make it worse.
    However, if Tau insulted their Emperor, they would not feel any moral problems if they did anything to her.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:35 No.6732025
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    Also, here's a Tau propaganda poster.

    Are Kroot/Vespid/Gue'vesa going to be playable? They'd probably have access to different equipment; Tau can't use Kroot guns, Only Vespid can use their Neutron Blasters, etc.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)13:36 No.6732037
    See, I don't think Tau society works that way. A rogue Tau would be truly alone, and probably not even living in the Empire. The Ethereals make sure that sort of thing doesn't really happen. Renegade Kroot and humans are more likely, but the greater Tau society is almost certainly trustworthy, unless there are problems that the greater Empire really, really can't know about; since Chaos has no real interest in them, I don't think they'd be one of those. Necron uprisings and genestealer cults, perhaps.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)13:37 No.6732041
    Gue'vesa are definitely playable, I hope to have Kroot and Vespid be too.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:37 No.6732044
    >tau police in human territory
    white police in nigger ghetto
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)13:38 No.6732050
    Unless having gue'vesa would endanger their security; I mostly included them for the purposes of infiltrating the Imperium, but that seems to be losing popularity fast.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:40 No.6732068
    OP, you might be interested in this Water Caste diplomat background and stats made for an Inquisitor sample character:

    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:41 No.6732077
    but sure, there are different humans:
    *not so willing, just joined the Empire
    *willing humans, lived in Empire for decades or have born to it
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:42 No.6732085
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    human police in a vespid ghetto
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:43 No.6732092
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    Not technically true! See the 3rd edition Daemonhunters codex. These rules were implemented to allow other forces to fight demonhunters by taking greater demon possessed HQ units and generic demons.

    It would actually be a really good suprise to spring on the PCs. So you think you're all immune to demons, eh? Say hello to Mr. Lord of Change possessed Ethereal! If you somehow survive that, it might lead them to question where all the chaos gubbins that they have collected in their missions have gone. the last person to have them was their own mission control Ethereal.... oh crap.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:44 No.6732099
    okay, but kroot have been members of the Empire for looooong and do not likely see anything unusual in it

    but thats good, gives ideas
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:44 No.6732103

    There's also some more Tau stats, fluff and abilities taken from the now-defunct Specialist Games website:


    And Kroot stuff:

    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:45 No.6732111
    but different races within the Empire might not like each other, maybe because of stereotypes or exprience

    Tau commoner might not likely like humans: rapists and fanatics (officially tau love everybody :P)
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:45 No.6732113

    You know, I imagine the Tau perspective on humans is pretty similar to how humans view the prawns of District 9: Filthy, unpredictable drones to be managed.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:45 No.6732117
    NO NO NO!

    Nowhere does it say Tau are immune. They aren't even more resilient, but their small minds don't attract the attentions of daemons as much as others.

    They can be corrupted just as easily as anything else, and have no pariah powers.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)13:46 No.6732118
    What? There's nothing in the codex that states anything about Tau being possessed, and it contradicts a lot of other Tau fluff. I'm still not including corruption points for Tau.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:47 No.6732127

    >Blunt: All Tau have virtually no psychic presence in the Warp. To the daemon, they appear as a shifting will-o-the-wisp rather than the burning fire that represents a human's soul. As such, Tau can never have psychic powers. All daemons, daemonhosts and other denizens of the Warp attempting to detect a Tau have -50% to their Awareness rolls and must roll even when the Tau is in plain sight. If they fail this detection roll, they must act as if they had no knowledge of the Tau's presence.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:47 No.6732138

    It all depends. The Tau is a meritocracy in some ways, if you prove yourself worthy of respect, then you will earn it.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:49 No.6732145

    the orks are entirely a meritocracy
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)13:50 No.6732161
    All right, but the rules would still need to be modified, and corruption would come much more slowly to a Tau than to a human.
    >> Nephanim 11/16/09(Mon)13:50 No.6732162
    Holy fuck why doesn't the Inquisition recruit a few of these guys ASAP?

    Especially for the DH team I'm in? Pleeease?
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:50 No.6732163

    Do you save the human farming community? Or the nearby Earth Caste factory?

    It seems simple, right? Except that farming community produces a good third of the food supply for your settlement, meaning if you don't redirect that Bloodthirster a lot of people, human and Tau, are going to go hungry (not to mention all the humans that would die.) On the other hand, that factory, when completed, would double the planet's output of new weapons to the rest of the empire.

    So which do you save? Which will better help the Greater Good?
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:52 No.6732180

    Chaos can corrupt non-sentient things like swords, vehicles, spaceships, buildings, icons, planets... it can. the only thing it cannot corrupt is the necrontyr stuff because it is anti-warp. Tau may be blunts, but they aren't roaring psychic voids like Culexus assassins. they have twisty little souls, but they can be seen and corrupted by demons who care to do it.

    There was a big article in an old white dwarf about adversaries, I'll try and dig it out. It actually recommended Ethereals as possessed commanders. It was in WD 281, May 2003 in an article called "Downward Spiral: Daemonhunters Adversaries"
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:52 No.6732194
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    Tau are less easy to detect by Daemons.

    But there's no such thing as immunity for a non blank (Tau aren't blanks) so they can still get corrupted. Consider that inanimate objects can get corrupted; Tau have no magic way of stopping it, so they can get corrupted in the same way, albeit slightly easier since they are living beings but harder than humans.

    Not making Tau corruptible is a really bad idea.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:53 No.6732197

    Abhor the xeno, etc. Would be pretty sweet though. Maybe a Kroot that's eaten enough Tau corpses could pick up the Blunt talent and become a daemonhunter mercenary for hire... That's a pretty neat Rogue Trader character idea, actually.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)13:53 No.6732208
    Were that me, I'd go for the farm. It seems more Greater Good-ish to keep as many lives going as possible, plus it would make us look better with the humans.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:54 No.6732212
    Tau are not immune, they just make REALLY SHITTY HOSTS

    Tau are just a bad tasting fish in a sea of delicious, easily caught fish (humans)
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)13:54 No.6732220
    Why is it actively a bad idea?
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:55 No.6732229
    Tau have little to no knowledge of demons and psykers. They keep humans in their empire. Humans have psychic potential and are easily corrupted.

    Shouldn't Tau Empire human settlements be ripe for daemonic possession? There is no Inquisition to keep them safe.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:56 No.6732233
    (kroot are already blunt)
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:56 No.6732234
    because it's instead of "my cat doesn't like this food" it's "MY CAT IS INCAPABLE OF EATING THIS!!"
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:56 No.6732238
    Not that guy, but corruption is great fun in DH. Makes some hilarious moments.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:57 No.6732247
    Which probably means that a Daemon that tries to possess one is looking for a challenge.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:57 No.6732251
    Basically this.

    Basically, if your PCs are immune, they WILL abuse it. The slightest hint of being corruptible, and they'll behave properly once they know the implications.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:58 No.6732255

    I imagine the first instance something like that happened caused a drastic reevaluation of Tau policy towards Gue'Vesa.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:58 No.6732260
    yes I'm sure they will abuse it by running out and mooning demons with their blue butts

    because without the threat of corruption, chaos demons are completely harmless.
    >> Commissar-kun !WjzSLG3MPo 11/16/09(Mon)13:59 No.6732266

    Tau are very very hard to corrupt.
    They don't have much contact with the warp nor any psykers.

    They're also generally not of much interest to the denizens of the warp.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)13:59 No.6732268
    Hm, true.

    What do you think about having more lenient insanity rules (being able to remove madness levels and such)?
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)13:59 No.6732274
    Since when? They have warp travel, ergo they have some sort of psychic potential (usually thought to be part of the Ork WAAAGH, or a kroot-adapted version of it).
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)14:01 No.6732289
    You don't need a bloodletter in the room for that though.

    Just an artifact here, a tome there.

    Something or someone that promises to make their quest to bring the Greater Good to the galaxy just a little easier.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)14:03 No.6732306
    How? It's not like they can use it.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)14:03 No.6732314

    That's correct, Kroot aren's blunt, and those that consume Chaos-tainted flesh go on to develop Chaos traits, which is why Tau-aligned Kroot are prohibited from eating Chaos dead.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)14:04 No.6732322
    It won't help against madness, but make it harder for the daemons to 'notice'.

    If there are non Tau around as PCs, the Tau receive less or no 'whispers' or just aren't shown something tempting.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)14:05 No.6732341
    The madness was a separate issue. I figured that the calming effects of the Ethereals would make it easier for Tau to heal mental wounds.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)14:06 No.6732351
    Why can't he use it? there's no need to be a psyker. I mean, it's not so bad, all it does is tell him where there's danger near. Or has written down the thoughts of those around him, on it's text.

    Nothing big or flashy.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)14:07 No.6732369

    So the Tau is Bilbo, and the Chaos Artifact is the One Ring? That kinda makes sense. Hobbits were supposed to be extraordinarily resistant to corruption in the same way Tau are.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)14:08 No.6732377
    They have Orky Tech, which is probably what serves as a Gellar Field and Warp Drive, but their method of navigation is completely Kroot. Its some sort of innate migration sense, probably done by the shamans.

    They can "feel" vibrant biospheres, and can only travel to planets that have a functioning ecology. It probably allows them to find other things as well, using each point of life as a mini-astronomican.

    Point is, Kroot do have Psykers. they're shamans, and they use gay-ass hippie/druid magic.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)14:09 No.6732385
    It could happen, but it doesn't seem that likely. I think the Tau know enough about Chaos to have a policy of "Don't even think about it" when it comes to using anything touched by it. They certainly don't let Kroot eat Chaos-tainted flesh. And the things wouldn't be able to tempt them directly, as they can't communicate.

    Also: How often would you prefer to have the Tau in this setting go up against the Imperium?
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)14:09 No.6732389
    no. theyre about eugenics

    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)14:10 No.6732394

    >gay-ass hippie/druid magic.

    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)14:11 No.6732402
    Nah. Tau should go insane just as easily as a human can. They're only mortal.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)14:11 No.6732410

    Millions of Tau spend every day of their lives in the service of the Greater Good. It is the center of their lives, no, their universe; a constant reminder of what your race has accomplished in such a short time and of the promise the future holds for all.

    But you, you're special. You've seen first hand just how small your little Empire is, how many threats there are out there, how little they care for you and your kind. You've seen just how fragile your Greater Good is when placed against the horrors of Chaos, the unstoppable hordes of Orks or Tyranids or Necrons, or the xenocidal Humans of the Imperium.

    But throughout all that, you kept your faith, and for that you have been rewarded. You still serve the Greater Good, now, but with a different purpose.

    Because the Greater Good must not just be followed: it must be protected, whatever the cost. And the next time it comes up against one of those threats, you'll be the one standing in between.

    Good Luck.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)14:12 No.6732411
    Yeah, this is basically it.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)14:14 No.6732434
    Oh, they can GO insane just as easily. They just recover from it more quickly.

    I quite like this. It makes an excellent specific introductory peace, as opposed to my general one.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)14:15 No.6732441

    Oh, i like!
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)14:19 No.6732482

    Relevant quote from that pdf:

    >Shortly after the Ria’tan Convocation, Por’la uncovered information relating to a nascent Tyrannic cult within the families of Tash’va. The cult had perverted the Tau life-ritual of the Ta’lissera, a sacred bonding ceremony, into something far worse that culminated in the genestealer’s kiss. Enraged, and confident that he could take the initiative and tackle the problem on his own, Por’la called upon a pack of Savage Blade Kroot still planetside and ‘acquired’ enough pulse carbines and photon grenades from his quartermaster friend’s property to ensure every member of the carnivore squad was armed to the teeth. Unleashed upon the cult’s underground headquarters, the Kroot reaped a massive toll of blood from the corrupted Tau, putting the place to flame and feasting on the few Tau that had merely been hypnotised instead of contaminated by the insidious genestealer cult. The action was a bloody and a swift success, but the Tau Fire Caste was enraged at having been bypassed in favour of a group of unpredictable mercenaries, and the relatives of the Tau needlessly killed in the operation would not be content with Por’la’s half-hearted apologies. After all, Por’la knew what he had done was for the Greater Good, and felt no need to repent. To add insult to injury, getting the high-tech weaponry back from the Kroot proved rather more difficult than securing it in the first place, and was eventually written off rather than endanger the volatile Kroot warband’s renewed oaths of loyalty.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)14:23 No.6732512
    awesome. pure awesome
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)14:25 No.6732522
    Why would they recover from it faster?
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)14:27 No.6732536
    They're helped by the Ethereals.

    And I reiterate my question about the Imperium: >>6732385
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)14:28 No.6732541
    Their society is partly a hivemind what with all the pheromones and shit. Why wouldn't they recover from individual trauma more easily?
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)14:29 No.6732553
    Imperium are spread pretty thin at the moment, but certainly quite a few clashes.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)14:30 No.6732562
    Hmmm. Would the Imperium be sending in any forces to Tau space, or would our PCs need to go looking for them actively?
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)14:31 No.6732581

    Another relevant quote:

    >Por’la has inhereted his bloodline’s natural flair for relating to the other castes of Tau society, so much so that his mentors suspect he prefers the company of the other castes to that of his peers. He has always aspired to the honorific Vash’ya, literally ‘between spheres’, a suffix bestowed on those who have forged strong bonds with castes other than that of their birth. As a nascent envoy, Por’la had strong connections to both the Earth and Fire Caste, and had many friends within the ranks of the Tau army.

    The Outreach leader should be a Vash'ya, going against tradition in order to combat threats to the Greater Good in an unorthodox fashion. In general Tau society, fraternization between castes is somewhat frowned upon so the characters that join need to keep it in mind.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)14:34 No.6732622
    Well, Outreach is certainly unorthodox and does involve a lot of cross-caste fraternizing, except possibly in the case of the Air Caste.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)14:46 No.6732731
    I reiterate this question.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)14:49 No.6732771

    The Damocles Crusade ended with a truce, so I suppose the official Imperial line is "we'll leave the blasted xenos alone for now until we round up another crusade's worth of forces" but I imagine wolfpacks of Rogue Trader privateer fleets are active and threatening Tau shipping lanes.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)14:51 No.6732795
    And it wouldn't do to be provoking the Imperium...

    I might need a different name for this organization if it's mostly going to be dealing with Tau space, but I suppose it does make sense, since they can't really afford to antagonize many other people.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)14:52 No.6732803

    The Imperium also has a "no touchy" policy for Chaos and xeno artefacts, but a good few radicals still use them. They can be very useful. Plus, the Outreach group will have a lot more independance - they can't always have an ethereal following them around, because they are too valuable to risk. If they come across a highly useful object, are they really going to give it up? Especially if it could be the only thing to make the mission a success.

    Be creative with moral threats. Books, paintings, jewelry... all potential sources of corruption. It doesn't have to have a thousand eyes and big screaming face to be evil. Most of the really horrible books look quite normal. That's why the Imperium has such a hard time finding them. Water Caste's will especially have trouble here. "It's a book, what harm can come from reading it?"

    Similarly, what happens if an Earth Caste engineer finds a chaos corrupted vehicle. It doesn't have any of the standard markings, hell it may not be from any known species, but it responds very well to commands. The only thing odd about it is that the engine block has been sealed very tightly and has all sorts of microscopic engravings on it. A captured Imperial savant says it is possessed, but what do these primitives know? Clearly it is simply a highly advanced AI. We just need to crack open the outer shell...

    Fire warriors + possessed weapons = a Firesight situation. Farsight got the weapon BEFORE the Ethereal died, remember.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)14:55 No.6732836
    Some of that sounds a bit more like DM dickery. "Oops, you looked at a Chaos-infested tome for a bit too long and now you're corrupted without knowing it."
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)14:59 No.6732888

    They can still be Outreach. The Intercaste ("between spheres" or whatever that term was) Outreach and Cooperation Unit.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)15:01 No.6732908
    Clever. All right, I can keep that for forces dedicated specifically to defending the Empire/studying its enemies.

    They might end up going beyond the Empire for missions of investigation, though.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)15:02 No.6732924
    My dear sir, this is Dark Heresy.

    If being fucked very hard in the ass is not 90% likely, you are doing it wrong.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)15:04 No.6732937
    It's not Dark Heresy, it's Ethereal Dawn. The themes and mood are rather different.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)15:05 No.6732953

    This happens in Dark Heresy all the time.

    If the PCs encounter them, it should be reasonably clear beforehand that all is not well with these artefacts. Most of the GM suggestions say that anything more than a cursory look gives Corruption points. A grey psalter, for instance, might look the ramblings of a madman, but a glimpse at it does seem to show that it has some information on a particular cult. If the PC decides to look more deeply, they get +10 on the next INT test involving the cult, but also gain a corruption point as the evil burrows into their sub-concious. Corrupt swords and things of that nature will almost certainly look wierd, or be in the hands of "very bad people" tm. If the PCs decide to use it even then, that's when they get corruption.

    Always give a willpower test to allow PCs to resist corruption, but some environments are going to be more taxing than others. A warpspace/realspace overlap (like the Murder Room) is going to send almost anybody around the bend.

    The other ideas might be better suited to NPC plot hooks - a research station has gone quiet, an experimental warpship was lost but has now returned, a highly successful commander is acting up... stuff like that.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)15:08 No.6732975
    I suppose this can fall under the "blasphemous knowledge" clause.

    Is there any way of removing corruption points?
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)15:09 No.6732988

    Of course, since we're talking about Tau, they should get the corruption chance reduced by 50% due to Blunt trait.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)15:13 No.6733021

    Not really. It's mentioned a couple of times as being possible, but no rules are given. I suspect 250+ xp points plus IC reasoning for each point loss.

    You are supposed to be more sparing about handing them out as a consequence. You can be more liberal with Insanity points.

    If you kill an innocent, you might get IP. If you kill an innocent by ripping out their throat and taking joy in it, you might get CP.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)15:14 No.6733036
    Are you all right with my idea of making insanity points easier to remove?
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)15:15 No.6733060

    I was thinking something like all corruption points gained are halved rounding down (if a human would gain 5, a tau gets 2) or Tau never have a penalty lower than -10 or 20 difficulty on their willpower test to resist chaos (like the schola progenium background)
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)15:18 No.6733097

    From Ethereal counselling and such? That's fine. Unlike the Inquisition Acolytes there are only a finite number of Tau to recruit from, so each one becomes more valuable as a consequence.

    I would however make it so that there is a tangible cost for scrubbing away insanity. Perhaps the cost gets steeper the more times it has to be done, or the more insanity points you have removed the more likely you are to be removed from the team (clearly you have deep seated psychological problems,you'd be better off somewhere else)
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)15:20 No.6733115
    Why is that a necessity? The second idea does make sense, perhaps, but I'm still curious.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)15:21 No.6733125
    Maybe make insanity easier to gain, but also easier to remove? The Tau aren't inured to the horrors of the galaxy as much as the other races, but they do seem to have a better social support network to soothe the afflicted.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)15:23 No.6733146

    Tau and a human against a chaos cult

    "Yeah, heh, they're ugly suckers aren't they."
    "*concerned* did it?"
    "Only a scratch."
    "Aww crap."
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)15:32 No.6733207

    OOC - Gaining insanity points should be a threat. You don't want players to abuse the fact that they can get away with stupid stuff because they can get all cleaned up later. If they are less likely to get corrupted from chaos stuff, and the insanity points can be got rid of relatively easily, there is a strong possibility that someone will start going all Farsight with evil artefacts with impunity.

    IC - this a dangerous, secretive project. It wants the best of the best. Yes, all of the teams involved will need counselling as they come to terms with the terrible things they have seen and done, but they still need strong and stable personalities to begin with. Someone who keeps coming back for psychological restructuring clearly isn't strong enough to be doing field work. You don't want them to have a breakdown during an op, so you retire them for the Greater Good of the mission.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)15:33 No.6733218
    Hmm, fair enough. Possibly that happens once their total number of insanity points ever gained reaches 100.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)15:37 No.6733255

    You mean they keep track of every insanity point they have ever gained, so that even if they appear to have only 10 they have had 70 over the course of their career? Could work.

    You could also dangle the possibilty that madder characters suffer some problems but gain immunity to fear, as in Dark Heresy. Perhaps only characters with a certain amount of current insanity points can take Forbidden Lores?
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)15:40 No.6733278
    That'd probably be the case, but I think that every one of the Outreach staff has mandatory Ethereal counseling sessions to make sure that they aren't going mad, whether they enjoy being mad or not.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)15:48 No.6733355

    It's not necessarily enjoyment, it's a case of sacrificing the individual's sanity for the good of all Tau. Put bluntly, mad people better understand the madness of the warp. A lot of the forbidden Lores deal with things that make no damn sense whatsoever - entities made from energised lust are attracted by the colour purple and the number six? Human engineers worship machines and fix things by hitting them with hammers? The Eldar have a magical library guarded by horrifying jesters in the centre of an extra-galactic labyrinth with entrances on almost every world in the galaxy? WHAT?

    If someone appears to have even the slightest grasp of these mad concepts, and can actually use that information for the Greater Good, I would assume that the Ethereals would monitor them closely but otherwise leave them be.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)15:50 No.6733365
    If knowledge is gained through madness, would it not stay after the madness was healed?
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)15:54 No.6733405
    hohohoho, your creative use of a commisar image and a suggestion that a post would not be appropriate inside the setting of warhammer 40k has made me laugh heartily. I am glad some wise neckbeard does this EVERY SINGLE TIME it is possible.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)15:58 No.6733427
    You conquer planets in Rogue Trader. Regardless they are the same game mechanically (and this is where the Navigators are)? It's just the profit factor and ship rules are also worth incorporating.

    Also you seem to have a loose grasp of 40k lore and are new to /tg/. Here:
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)15:58 No.6733429

    It's more like the madness allows them to think in distinctly Un-tau like ways. A Tau who is healthy in mind and body wouldn't understand why silver dipped in virgin's tears is important to ward off Ch'gazar the Bloodied, but one who has already dropped off the deep end might.

    As for keeping the knowledge after counselling... once it gets to the point that you are writing on the walls in blood to keep the demons out, I suspect something like brainwashing or mind-cleansing is in order. Merely talking about it won't do the job, as the knowledge is itself a memetic hazard that may have permeated the Tau in question's subconcious mind. Even talking to them about it might be enough to drive you mad!

    We're not talking a full lobotomy, but something similar to completely eradicate the taint. Unfortunetly that removes the esoteric knowledge.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)16:00 No.6733442
    That's why counseling sessions are mandatory and frequent in my conception, so it never goes that far. I don't think the Tau will see much gain to be had from madness.

    My grasp of the lore isn't the tightest, so I thank everyone here for their patience.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)16:02 No.6733461
    Why do you always stretch for something incredibly whacky and out of canon? Ex-Space Marine Librarians? Non-Imperial Astropaths?

    There's no reason a bunch of Tau couldn't just cruise around with a slightly radical Rogue Trader or some Demiurg miners. Hell, it makes it even more plausible if you're using human auxillary troops who signed-up with a passing rogue trader and are now "under cover" sending messages back to base via non-Imperial quantum state technology the AdMech can't detect or fathom.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)16:04 No.6733482
    >Other possibilities are somehow discovering the Webway

    My inner Eldar just motherfucking raged.

    No one except the motherfucking Emperor and Inquisitor Czevak are allowed access to the Webway.

    Ahriman, the mightiest 'human' sorceror can't even get in the Webway, and Tau fucking worthless psykers just find an entrance?


    Are you on crack or are you mentally retarded?
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)16:05 No.6733489
    Because that's not as interesting to me right now as a purely Tau campaign, and because that's the sort of thing likely to happen with existing systems. This one is meant to be rather new.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)16:05 No.6733495

    Are U MAD? Chill out man.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)16:05 No.6733497
    We're long, long past that. It was only a passing thought.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)16:05 No.6733498
    Just fucking stop trying to shoehorn your own fucking ideas in 40k.

    Stick to the base-material or get the fuck out to a livejournal/fanfiction community.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)16:07 No.6733509
    The majority of people have been stable enough to just correct me when I come up with something bad, and I think that I've been reasonable in listening to them. I'd appreciate it if you read the entire thread before attacking me.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)16:08 No.6733519
    So Exalted have you talked to your group about this?
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)16:09 No.6733525
    I'm nowhere close to having a group. I'm just coming up with this for fun, but if I get far enough, I might try to find one.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)16:13 No.6733558

    > I don't think the Tau will see much gain to be had from madness.

    They don't yet, but they generally haven't had to deal with a full blown chaos incursion yet. Remember, the Ethereal caste is quite happy to sacrifice the odd Tau for the Greater Good - see the railgun snipers and their unfortunate tendency to die from feedback. Those who created the Outreach program know (or at least have an inkling) that there are hazards out there which cannot be combated in normal ways. They need Tau who can understand these hazards. Unfortunately, in trying to understand these hazards, many go potty. A lot of things in Warhammer 40,000 simply don't make much sense, especially if you try and approach them from a rational, scientific point of view. The ethereals may have realised that they need to approach the problem from a different point of view. Look at the Imperium - from the outside it appears to be a cult made up of violent lunatics, but time and time again they hold back terrible chaos threats. The Ethereals know about chaos, even if they don't really tell the rest of the Tau. Given that the Outreach program is taking a slightly different approach to normal Tau philosophy they may be more willing to allow "deviant" philosophies in their, for want of a better word, acolytes. If it works, it works. The important thing is that the threat gets neutralised. They can always have a sane member of staff go over the data later to look for more rational explainations.

    Remember also Tau madness might not take the same shape as human madness. It could appear as obsessive devotion to a cause, for instance. It may not appear to be a problem until too late, especially if the Tau in question is away on operations a lot of the time.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)16:17 No.6733594
    That's where there can be temporary dips into madness to gain insight, then when the knowledge is gained, to have the mental damage cleared away. Madness so profound it requires brainwashing to cure probably isn't worth going into for the Ethereals, who I think are very leery about Tau having thoughts that deviant.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)16:17 No.6733597
    You've never read the Sister of Battle career, have you.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)16:18 No.6733605
    No, why?

    Also, we'll be autosaging soon.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)16:24 No.6733663

    Also, remember that your characters are going to be Tau with a bit more knowledge of the universe than most to begin with. They likely already understand that the Greater Good isn't the totally utopian and universal ideal that the Ethereals make it out to be, which makes them more apt at grasping alternative philosophies even as they still remain loyal to the Greater Good.

    As >>6732410 said: an ordinary Tau lives the Greater Good as if it's true. Outreach fights for it to BE true.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)16:25 No.6733672

    SoB = tremendous faith in the Imperial Creed = Purge the Alien = cleansing with fire. Lots and lots of fire.


    Eh. Your game. I would restrict all access to Forbidden Lore though. Plus, again, I personally think you are being a bit blasé about how easy it is to recover sanity. Having nightmares because you've seen a genestealer eat your friend - yeah, that could probably be cured relatively easily. Seen a man morph into a fifteen foot tall cancerous abomination dripping pus that burns the ground like acid and seems to have small creatures clinging to his distended abdomen? That is going to leave some mental scars.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)16:27 No.6733696
    That was to those two guys; As *novice* Sisters of Battle are immune to Daemonic Presence and can spend a fate point to ignore any daemonic attack, possession attempt, or corruption gain.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)16:27 No.6733699
    The Greater Good is more of a result than a neverending journey. I think that most actions that promote it, even if they're not orthodox, would be deemed acceptable in Outreach. Alternate philosophies can be used, but only if they lead to the Greater Good in the end.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)16:30 No.6733735
    How heavily should I restrict it?
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)16:31 No.6733740
    This is a setting where memories can be erased, minds can be reprogrammed, and peoples brains can be inscribed with hexagramatic wards to prevent posession.

    I really think curing insanity should be easy providing the character is willing to have some memories altered.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)16:32 No.6733754

    Exactly. Most Tau would never conceive of the sort of things that Outreach members have to deal with all the time. But they're allowed that because in the end it's still necessary for the Greater Good. I'm just trying to point out that the Greater Good=/=everyone are slaves to a rigid ideology. Some people have to think outside the box, even if it's generally discouraged by the Ethereals.

    On a side note, I would have Outreach itself headed by a sort of "radical Ethereal"—not in the sense that he's potentially tainted, but in that he's a bit more liberal than most in what he considers allowable for the Greater Good.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)16:36 No.6733799
    Good, then we're on the same page.

    And I think that the head of Outreach will be Aun'el Shior'es. It seems in character for him, especially since he directed the creation of the Necron research facility.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)16:36 No.6733805
    A sister has a lot more access to protection than any Tau though.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)16:40 No.6733849
    Right. But that was a response to someone whining about wanting a Tau in their DH group and how non-blanks can't be immune (they can.).
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)16:44 No.6733890

    I would say not to allow it as a standard part of any career at all. How and where are the PCs supposed to learn this stuff? They don't have a millennia old organisation to teach them, they don't generally have access to the resources to learn in a safe environment. The Outreach program is a new invention. Assuming you are setting it in modern day WH universe, the Tau only started to make headway with warp research during the Medusa V campaign (where the final result of that research was "let's not do that again, ok?"). the only way to gain that kind of dangerous, esoteric knowledge is in the field, as an elite advance, with all of the insanity and corruption point hazards that that entails.

    One of the reasons I suggested the "only allow it for mad characters" was a way to sidestep the fact that if the PCs get Forbidden Lore from doing stuff "in the wild" they will go mad and/or corrupt. If they were mad to begin with it won't have as much effect.

    The other reason was to allow a bit more flexibility for players to create interesting characters. I'd think a shell shocked Fire Warrior who has seen too much would be more interesting than a bright-eyed and bushy tailed guy, simply because you don't see many of them. I realise that this is a personal taste thing.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)16:48 No.6733941
    That makes sense, I suppose. I hadn't thought about the Forbidden Lore thing for starting characters; does that only cover things of Chaos, though? Because I can see characters starting out knowing some few things about the Necrons from the Thur'abis labs, or the Eldar from the Tau's discussions with their Kronus prisoners.

    I do hope I'm not putting too much emphasis on Kronus, but it's the setting I'm most familiar with, and since it was a nexus of so many different factions, I think it'd make an excellent founding point for Outreach.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)16:49 No.6733947

    Like that character in Fire Warrior? I seem to remember that the novel ends with the main character in some Tau mental asylum, traumatized for life but an invaluable source of information.

    Op, I'd be very interested in taking part in this campaign if you were to run it online. Over IRC, preferably.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)16:51 No.6733972
    I'd be willing to, although I'm really not very familiar with 40K lore at all, so I don't know how well I'd do.

    Also, one reason that I do have something of a bias for the bright-eyed bushy-tailed ones is because, while they may be common among the Tau, they're practically nonexistent everywhere else. Except maybe with the Orks.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)16:53 No.6734001
    Forbidden Lore covers whatever you want to put in the parentheses after it.

    I am pretty sure the knowledge of an ancient star-eating race that can move through space-time to forever put themselves back together, that doesn't HAVE to travel to new worlds because there is a good chance that they are already buried there, and that wears the dead flesh of their enemies as clothing for their metal hides would be equally as maddening.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)16:54 No.6734012

    Do you have the DH rulebook with you? The main ones are listed in the skills section. Off the top of my head it's "Warp, daemonology, Black Library, Inquisition, Adeptus Mechanicus, psykers, xenos, archeotech", but with more specific ones as per GM discretion or in other books (like Forbidden Lore: Dark Eldar for knowledge specifically about Dark Eldar rather than aliens in general)

    Don't allow any starting PCs access to forbidden lore. Common Lore and Scholastic Lore is fine, but as raw recruits they can't know darker secrets until they can be trusted to keep them. They tend to only turn up in careers around rank 3-5, and even then only the most academic careers like Adept, psykers or techpriests.
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)16:57 No.6734049

    I imagine some kind of Outreach career advance, one for each caste (Outreach Firewarrior, Outreach Water Diplomat, Outreach Earth Machinist, etc). Depending on the campaign, the advance would give access to Forbidden Lore (whatever), weapon and tech access, and related skills.
    >> Exalted !OOirDpvrkA 11/16/09(Mon)16:57 No.6734056
    New thread: >>6734050
    >> Anonymous 11/16/09(Mon)16:59 No.6734079

    You can start them in the labs, during some experiment. Obviously, something will go horribly wrong and they'll have to defend the lab or escape from it. Take it from there with the characters being recruited to Outreach for having survived that incident.

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