>-The D&D spread for abilities may not be what you want here. Charisma, in particular, doesn’t fit the genre; I think that you want for all characters to be vibrant, and for the ability to lead to be based more on things like personal convictions, acquired skills, and relationships with other characters. I AM BORN TO LEAD AND MY VOICE COMPELS YOU is more a feature of western fiction (without getting into how accurate/inaccurate it is). However, even strength, dex and con are often more based on skill, physical training, or energy/ki/chi/chakra in manga (i.e, prodigal children punching adult warriors’ lights out, by “giving it all they’ve got”).
Well, the Intellect, Wits, Strength, Agility, Tenacity, Charisma owes more to White Wolf than Gygax. Intellect, Strength, and Tenacity are about pushing things you way. They're the Power attributes. Wits, Agility, and Charisma are all about pulling things where you want. Finesse attributes. In a fight, Strength would be punching someone, while Agility would be throwing them with their own force.
The concept of Pushing and Pulling is taken from Mistborn, which is completely unrelated to the conversation at hand. Each power (emotion control, buffing, and throwing metal around) is divided into a pushing and pulling category. Pushing on someone's emotions makes them weaker, pulling on them makes them stronger. Pushing on yourself makes you stronger, pulling on yourself gives you better senses. Pushing on metal... well, throws it. Pulling it makes it come towards you. I could be mixing that all up, but you get the point. Still unrelated.

>Your basic fight mechanic (attack penalized by defense, then toughness or evasion penalized by damage) is actually pretty smooth and has a nice back-and-forth feel to it.
It should, I mostly stole that from MnM with a few tweaks. In MnM you're just trying to beat the Toughness and Defense, though, not subtracting it.

>Re- your shared token pool and “only three abilities at a time” and shit. I.. hum.
I honestly don’t know what the hell you’re trying to do here. Seriously, I have no idea what this is supposed to simulate or how it is supposed to be fun in play. Why are you doing this?
>In a meta-narrative sense, it sort of models the whole “you can’t do your move until I’ve tried something myself” thing, becoming a sort of regulator for the dramatic flow of the fight. It COULD actually serve as a replacement for a rounds mechanic (allowing someone to save their tokens up in order to do several moves in rapid succession), but you seem to be implying that they take turns anyway. Have I missed or misunderstood something?

It's the concept of the flow of Chi. Your enemy's move strengthens your move by adding to the flow of Chi in the area.
The metaphysical essence of the area increases as you start throwing around magic, and by focusing you, or your opponent, can draw in that essence and use it to power your abilities.

Ever played Final Fantasy Dissidia? It's kind of like Brave. There are likely to be attacks that can steal Focus from enemies instead of drawing it from the area.
Which of course, could be an interesting alternate use of the tokens. Two types of moves, one that steals energy from your foe, and one that uses that energy to strengthen attacks and increase damage. Of course, that gets even more complicated.

It could indeed be a replacement for a rounds mechanic, I suppose. But it would require more tweaking. As is, it's just meant to simulate the flow of energy through the battle. Think of it like a fighting game, where when you hit the enemy, little motes come flying out, and if you charge up, the motes come towards you. The more motes get launched all around the area, the more either one of you can draw in with their charging.

This concept is relevant to my interest.
How cinematic do you intend to make the battles?
And how are you going to handle injuries, battle fatigue etc?
I'm sorry if this was handled in your previous shitstormed thread.

Sorry for the troll-baiting. Not actually bi, either. It's just fun to agree with an insult sometimes and roll with it.
I promise to be good in this thread.

>>6979046
I'd prefer it be both gritty and cinematic. Players aren't likely to die, because that would be the easy way out.

Stunts are possible, wound penalties are likely. However, players will be able to shrug off injuries temporarily at the cost of injuring themselves further later down the line. One of the big themes is cost, specifically the cost you have to pay down the line for something that you do immediately.

This applies both to ignoring injuries for a scene to have them double in severity down the line, as well as taking the easy way out by using forbidden magic and heading down the Dark Path.

>>6979085
Hey you're a faggot - you can't just back out now.


Also, you Naruto faggots should all die in a fire.

>It's the concept of the flow of Chi. Your enemy's move strengthens your move by adding to the flow of Chi in the area.
>The metaphysical essence of the area increases as you start throwing around magic, and by focusing you, or your opponent, can draw in that essence and use it to power your abilities.

Okay, that's interesting and I'll buy it. I just found it inscrutable without the flavor text to back it up. I'm not sure how it serves the mood or genre though; as with the negative-dice-positive-dice thing, it sounds like you're just trying to write something "different" (even if in trivial ways), rather than trying to write a really good kid-ninja RPG.

>>6979118

Second though, "stealing chakra from enemies" actually does serve the mood I think. It's ruthless and resourceful.

Sorry, I shouldn't post before I've had time to digest a new idea.

One thing I don't like about it is that you know exactly how many cards your foe is holding, which is pretty antithetical to the whole "ninja duel" genre. I'll get to that in a sec.

>>6978943
You could do the Dorfquest stats.

CONGRADULATIONS

YOU'VE MADE EXALTED:DRAGONBRUDS

Not taking the bait this time.
>>6979091
So, I understang it like this: You get hit in the leg with a kunai. You could lie there or not use your leg, but basically be fine in time for the next major battle, or you could keep using the leg and take a penalty to speed and dodging ability for a reasonable amount of time?
Very good. Fits with the Naruto style, and there are several instances in canon where it happens.
Unless you're a regenerating douche like the Jinchuuriki.

>>6979118
Well, the flow of essence is an integral part of the ninja myth, and something that I think makes for a good mechanic. Control the chi of the battlefield, and you control the battle. Lose the essence and you lose the battle. Some areas that players fight in might actually have it's own natural essence floating about for players to grab. Either way, at the end of the scene, all the Focus pools go back to normal, barring any sort of spiritual illness or lasting technique.
Admittedly, the positive and negative dice is strange, but I think it might work pretty well. It's not really any different than roll over versus roll under, to be honest. Otherwise, I'll playtest it, and throw it out. In fact, I might do just that on Friday.

But, since you wanted it, we can work on the fluff again. What I have so far is that thirty or forty years ago, the Daimyo's son was disgraced, and the title went to the Daimyo's star pupil instead. The son gathered up his loyalists, and started a war--an open, Great War--with the new Daimyo. After about five years, this ended with the son of the old Daimyo leaving the Land of Light and creating his own country in the Land of Shadow. Now the Light and Shadow are in a Cold War with each other, using Ninja as the primary weapon, much like the Russia/America Cold War of the last century, only instead of gadgets there's magic.

Meanwhile, inside of the Land of Light, the countries are all on more or less speaking terms, and not much else. They work together against the Land of Shadow, but are nearly as likely to make war with each other.

I just want to say that I completely support this idea I wish that were some way for me to help/contribute. If this is followed through and finished then I will have my group play it.

>>6979148

Me again- to clarify, ARE ninja-duels (sneaking and ploys and reversals) the feel that you're going for? Or is it more 'grim-and-gar martial arts battles, but in trees and with shiruken'?

>>6979194
>>regenerating douche like Cell.

What about magical beings and the like? (demon foxes come to mind) Will they be sources of power lurking down the Dark Path, willing to trade secret powers as long as their subjects act as portals for their malicious wills?

so... you're turning naruto into weeaboo l5r?

>>6979241
Too many regenerating douches to count. Never a regenerating Savior of Man or Hot Sidekick.

>>6979228

And if the supply of energy is basically limited, then dark powers which grant "free chakra" become all the more appealing.

Except that if you don't win then and there it bites you in the ass, because then there's just more chakra for the enemy to use against you.

>>6979148
How do you know how many cars they have on the table? You only know how many cards are in the deck, not in their hand.

They could very well be charging to keep you from getting control of the energy. A person with a huge Focus pool still has reason to steal the essence on the table. A very ruthless tactic, even, since no matter how much Focus you start with, you can carry as much as there is in the area.

>>6979194
Actually, it's more like you could lay there and weight for a medic to get you, or limp away slowly, OR, you can press on with minor to no mechanical penalties to your actions, only to drop in terrible pain once the scene is over, your wounds doubling in severity. A cut that puts you in the red that you ignore means that instead of being in the red for a day or two, you're now in the red for a week, and should probably stay off that leg for at least a month.

This is actually based on a Combat Hack from WoD Armoury Reloaded called Valiant Surge. You spend a point of Willpower to heal yourself, but at the end of the scene you're basically fucked.

>>6979273

Jotaro got stabbed in the face by a pen
the next day he was fine

>>6979273

Deadpool.

>>6979241
Tsunade is like Cell with huge tits.
Same attitude, really.

>>6979290

>BROtaro

>>6979284
What is the extent of "fucked"? Severe penalties, incapable of movement, or does the DM just decide it case-by-case?
Case-by-case works best for me, since a crippled limb and a caltrop in the foot should be different

>>6979246
Some might. The Land of Shadows is certainly full of people who are more than willing to summon a gale of kamaitachi on a village, or let demons share their body for power. These things are things that lead down the Dark Path, but not every mystical creature is evil. A Kirin might wait in the darkest part of the forest to cure one of your squadmates of a necromantic virus, or a trickster kitsune might chase the kamaitachi and eat them.
I assume foxes eat weasels, I don't really know, but it seems plausible.

A Red Oni might crush anyone who trespasses on his territory, but a Blue Oni might be willing to give the team valuable information if they can solve his riddle in a week.

The long and short of it is yes and no. There will be mystical creatures, but they aren't so clear-cut evil. Some might be, some might not. A pure hearted monk might have a group of kamaitachi of his own, or a villainous Blue Oni might offer to give valuable information, but threaten to eat one of the team for every riddle they fail.

If this game is to actually be made and played, I think something that should be central in the character creation process as well as in-game is that every PC is unique. They're stylish, they're vibrant, they've got something that nobody else has, not even other PC's. Hell, even Hinata is exceptional in some way. Exceptionally shy.
Is there currently some mechanic that illustrates this aspect of the shounen genre?

>>6979356
If you were stabbed in the leg and pushed on, then you'd end up crippled. If you ignored a punctured lung with your uncanny will, you might have trouble breathing.

In a way, yeah, it would be at the ST's discretion, but for the most part, you can expect the damage to double in some way. Bashing become lethal, bruises become wounds. That kind of thing, to mix WoD and MnM terms.

Of course, characters would likely be using these abilities to persevere to save downed teammates, or a wounded ally who can't press on any longer.

>>6979403
so it's like when Rock Lee kept on fighting, despite crushed limbs

>>6979403

Basically, what I see this as is that you're providing a great incentive for giving up and sitting out, so that it seems more heroic when they DO choose to keep fighting 'til they drop.

>>6979381
Well, there was that Merit and Flaw system he mentioned.

>>6979436
This keeps seeming more and more well thought out.
I think I like you, OP.

>>6979381
Many of them--or at least, that's their purpose.
No two character sheets are likely to be alike. There are no less than four reasons for this at the moment.
While everyone has the same attributes (Intellect, Strength, Tenacity, Wits, Agility, Charisma), the Specialties are unique. Players choose the areas that they want to be good at, instead of using a set list of skills.
Then there's the concept. This is a simple thing, a sentence or phrase that sums up what they want to do with their character's personality, as well as their abilities. "Shy girl with a secret crush" for instance, or "guy who fights using BEEEES" (I actually did stat The Pain the first time I did this, but I lost all that in a computer crash). Concept is also what fluffs your abilities, and what acts as a guideline for creating them (when I figure out how to do ability creation)

The last is the Merits and Flaws. Players pick two archetypes (again, that they make up, though in a pdf there'd still be some examples) that fit their character. One positive (the Merit), one negative (the Flaw). Players gain Merit Points by acting towards their Flaws, reinforcing the negative traits of their characters. These are then spent to "force" the Merit, giving the player a bonus, or even letting them break the rules a bit. In the example I used earlier, a character had "Won't Betray His Friends", and spent a Merit Point to basically shut down and completely resist the torture he was under. Had he not had that, he would have had to rely on the dice.

>>6979436
Well, by sitting out as you put it, you could be letting your team mates die, or even be a sitting duck yourself. There are less noble uses of the "Valiant" Surge.

Primarily, saving your own ass and leaving your friends.

But yeah, the intention of it IS to give players the chance at a Big Damned Heroes moment.

If I make a write up of what I have from tonight, could someone rewrite it? I suck at this kind of technical writing thing.

>>6979506
I had an idea for stat generation.
Stats can range from 5 to -5. At creation, you get 3 points.Everything starts at 0. You can decrease stats to get a maximum of 3 more points. No stat can be higher than 3 to start with.
Sound good?

>>6979689
Not that great at technical writing either, but my writing in general ain't so bad. I can give it a shot if you make a .pdf or something.

>>6979714
I'm thinking that saying they went to -5 might be a bad idea. I think instead I'm going to cap the negative at -3.

>>6979775
Well, that's why I put the limit on stat reduction.
-5 is the lowest you can go and still break even on a roll, since the highest 1d6-1d6 can go is 5, while the lowest is -5.
The only way to get lower than -3 is to get injured or cursed.

If you want to make a good fight system for a given genre, you need to figure out how fights in that genre go and then write your system to encourage the same sorts of tactics and thinking. Here are a few tidbits about shounen-esque ninja duels as I see it.

-You never win with the first move unless you are completely cock-fucking-awesome and they suck. Everyone has at least a few aces up their sleeve or contingencies to fall back on.
-Everyone utilizes widely different techniques. EVERY fight with a new opponent is going to contain a few surprises that you must adapt creatively to.
-Secret ploys. The substitution jutsu. The feigned-punch that plants an insect on your shoulder. The defeated Naruto-clone that you thought was Naruto (and then SHOOO-RYUKEN). Etcetera. These are the meat and potatoes of the ninja duel.
-You don’t dump everything you have into an attack unless you think that the enemies is out of tricks or caught off-guard, because you never know when an attack is going to go horribly, horribly wrong (either because these ‘ploys’ negate your attack or because they spring on you when your guard is down).
-Fights are nerve-wracking and dramatic. Underestimating your foe or get cocky and you will lose. Even if someone seems harmless, the only safe thing to do is to whip their ass ruthlessly and then move on.
-The fight can turn against you at any time
-Assume nothing
-Take the time to feel your enemy out. Once you have them figured out you’ve basically won.

Other things are very important (the roll of perseverance and personality traits, for instance, as we’ve been discussing), but the core of it I think is here. When people are just fighting, you know that the fight is only warming up. Once you have ploys countering ploys countering ploys, THAT’S when shit has gotten real.

>>6979867
Now, what mechanics would enable this style of fighting?

One is that you should be ABLE to dump huge resources on a haymaker attack, but should choose not to at first because starting a fight like that is foolish. The “finishing move” is a staple. So is the “failed finishing move that leaves you vulnerable to a finishing counter-attack”. The “feinted finishing move done to provoke a finishing counter-attack which you double-counter for the win” is less of a staple but it IS awesome.

Another is that you should be able to invest resources in a tactic –without your enemy knowing about it-. Or, knowing that you’re probably ‘planning something’ but not knowing exactly what. Which is a bit trickier.

Yu-gi-oh (and now, apparently, M:TG) does this remarkably well with “trap cards”. They are a mechanic which can easily foil and punish some brilliant offensive of yours. You, in turn, will probably react by prodding or feinting at them to get them to reveal that defense, but you won’t commit to a REAL attack just yet. Except that sometimes they’re just bluffing, laying out two or three traps that don’t do shit. And sometimes they’re actually using those to set up a terrible offensive chain-reaction, and they’re counting on your caution to prolong the fight, because right now they’ve got nothing and if you attacked you would win.

It encourages layered, cautious sorts of battles, rather than everything-all-out-right-now sorts of battles. Fights that tense and cerebral, about nervous guesswork and about figuring out your opponent.
(Not that I’m saying YGO is “tense and cerebral”, but you see where this kind of mechanic can go).

>>6979867
So, basically, god-mod a bit back and forth, but keep it in context of the character. Watch for an opening (predictable jutsu, weak abilities, has to charge every so often, etc.) and push yourself through the chink in their armor (charge to absorb all avaliable chi, take out their legs, jump in the water to reduce fire damage).
Sounds like every fight in Naruto, Ever.

>>6979883
Now, suppose a core move in this game is writing down an ability that you have used on a note, then laying it face-down on the table, and flipping it over once it becomes relevant? Basically, a tabletop RPG with trap cards.
It’s not quite like that, because the other player should have ways of getting SOME information, or at the very least will know how much energy their enemy has spent (maybe). In fact, ultimately, the DM should see all and should be able to just reveal something if he deems that the other player would know (for instance, if Neji had had some sort of tremmorsense to locate Naruto underground, he would have seen that coming).

Or maybe there are no notes at all. Ultimately, just having fully-reactive powers within the system (something awesome that you can trigger when an enemy takes some unfortunate action; that is, assuming you have the energy) would produce a similar sense of paranoia in players. You could even use both; that way, even if you don’t see a note/trap/ploy/whatever active, you still can’t be completely confident.

Or maybe how much the other guy knows is completely dependant on his own perceptive powers and abilities. That’s basically what I’m finally getting at here. Information control should be KEY.

>>6979883
Well, how well do you think that the mechanics so far represent those traits of Shounen anime?

Though do remember that it's a deconstruction. Pumping all your Focus into one attack at the beginning of the battle is just asking to get maimed.


Also, I think I'm going to write up the basic mechanics, maybe a bit of plot, and then go to bed. I don't want to end up staying awake until the sun comes up again.

Just keep typing, I'm copying all this into a text document for revision. About a quarter of the way through the first thread and we're at 4 pages.

>>6979940
>the other player should have ways of getting SOME information
Remember, while there will likely be player conflict, that the main point isn't that it's player versus player. Though I do like the idea of "Trap Card" style triggered abilities.

I'm going to bed right now. I'll see if this thread exists in the morning. If the last one was archived, do the same here. I'm really interested in this. The system is simple, yet it works. I want to see it's finished form.

>>6979980
You're totally right. I just write like that because I assume that NPCs follow the same rules as PCs (i.e, the DM plays by the same rules as the players, and even though he sees all it should be easy for him to keep in mind what information his badguys do or don't have).

This could be a faulty assumption of mine; you CAN write asymmetrical combat engines and still get a great game (see: 4e. Badguys and goodguys using totally different rules). I just don't like it personally.

>>6979946Though do remember that it's a deconstruction. Pumping all your Focus into one attack at the beginning of the battle is just asking to get maimed.

...like when Sasuke fought Killer Bee

dude, you aren't deconstructing anything, you're just adding more gore.

This is all I could think of to contribute...

>>6979946

You haven't really touched on ploys and deception at all yet (which is fine).

Though the token mechanic so far has a nice back-and-fourth feel, and it really supports the 'failed haymaker'. The core attack mechanic also jives well by divesting hit-chance from damage (you could conceivably gamble all of your resources on an attack that would deal multiple 'boxes" worth of wounds, but that doesn't make you more likely to hit, or even more likely to hurt- it's wasted if your enemy's defense turns out to be higher than you thought).

>>6980030

yeah, needs more tits and angst to be deconstruction

Riddle of Steel pretty has the mechanics of what you're looking for.

Heck, Riddle of Steel is basically the game you're trying to make.

>>6980030
Actually I'm not. Gore isn't really a factor here. I'm not even saying that some of this hasn't happened before. I'm saying that while generally these tropes are played straight, here I'm showing them in an ostensibly more cynical light.

That said, despite the cynicism inherent in a deconstruction, one of the themes is pushing ahead for a brighter tomorrow, and the cost it will have on today. It's an Earn Your Happy Ending thing.

>>6980025
They probably will be the same. It's just that hiding things from the ST becomes an exercise in futility. At least, mechanically. Most people want to know what it is their players are doing, and will proceed fairly. An enemy that doesn't know what a player did will still attack like he was going to, even though the ST knows the PC is preparing for that.

>>6980030
>>6980078

Honestly, I think that people (understandably) under-estimate how sophisticated Naruto really is. Most of the attempts at a "naruto RPG' that I've seen are kinda candy-assed or simplistic.

Maybe if he aims high-brow he'll get it about right in the end.

>>6980110

Yes, I meant to see that the DM sees everything. "Ploys" will be a surprise only to other players not in on the ploy.

And hell, it's not a big deal if you want to just ignore all that and have them plan collaboratively. What you lose in excitement (HOLY SHIT BOB WAS DOING SOMETHING AWESOME ALL ALONG) you gain in tactical fun as they scheme together OoC.

But you still need good rules for information-control to determine what the PCs are and aren't in the dark about.

>>6980068
Well, I'm thinking about that trap card aspect of writing things and then pulling them face up when they get 'activated'.

For instance, a character that uses Focus to pump up his defense before the enemy attacks him. He doesn't know what the character has done, just that he's messing with his Focus (it would get pushed to the side until it's actually spent. Otherwise it's considered 'committed'). When the attacker charges him with a power punch, only to be rebuffed by a Focus enhanced defense.

>>6980150

I think that in practice some defenses like that would be secret and some would be obvious, to various degrees, which is a good way to add mechanical variety. But that you worry about once you get to actual, character-specific powers and techniques.

But yea, that's basically what I had in mind.

>>6980110
I just love your sounding like a tvtropes addict.

>>6980143
>What you lose in excitement (HOLY SHIT BOB WAS DOING SOMETHING AWESOME ALL ALONG) you gain in tactical fun as they scheme together OoC.
Personally, I like a little bit of both. "Hey, set me up for an attack next round." "Why? What have you got planned?" "You'll see :3c "
And then you pull out some beam sword that cleaves mountains in half behind your target.

>>6980180
Well I sound like one because I am.
Spent two months there when I found out about it.

>>6980184

I admit, I've been mostly thinking in terms of one-on-one until now.

Teamwork makes everything cooler.

Did someone archive first thread? It's mostly shit and spam and sidetrack but I kind of like where this is going and might want to look it up in the future.

>>6980209
Teamwork will be one of the main themes, so it's best not to forget about it.

I'm actually sort of back of the brain thinking about how to deal with team attacks and combos.
Perhaps even the ability to donate Focus to a teammate, or use Focus to supplant their defenses.

Also, fluffy teamwork at that. One character knocking the enemy in the air, the second holding them telekinetically, and the third leaping into the air and wailing on them.

>>6980226
http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/archive/6974168/
For the first thread. I also saved this one so that I could go back and see what happens after I go to sleep.

>>6980255

This is just my experience with other systems, but I think "combo moves" are most awesome when they aren't chosen from any sort of list; instead, you wait for them to say "Wouldn't it be awesome if you used your X and then I did Y..."

The first time they do it it could just be a creative representation of some existing rule (aid another, lending focus, whatever), but could gain its own stats and become a distinct 'move' as they get better at it.

>>6980110here I'm showing them in an ostensibly more cynical light.

Orochimaru was the hero of the village and raised by the Hokage with the hopes that he would one day take his place. Orochimaru grows up to betray his friends, and kill the man who loved him most in the world. He dies crawling on his belly, black flames burning him to nothing.

Jiraiya rescued a little boy and taught him to be a fine ninja. The boy grows up to lead a terrorist organization. Jiraiya dies when his arm is cut off, his throat crushed, and finally he is skewered.

Tsunade has seen every important person in her life die violently. What does this celebrated War Hero do when the war is over? Gamble and fall in debt. Under her care, Konoha is completely destroyed. She will probably die soon.

Itachi found out his father was planning a rebellion to overthrow the government. He sided with duty over his own blood and murdered his entire clan. He spared his precious little brother, but decided it was best he not learn the truth but grow to hate him. His master plan was to die a heinous villain at the vengeful hands of his little brother, so he could be a hero of the village and free of the suspicion Itachi grew up in.

Madara fought longer and harder than anyone for his clan, but in the end they gave up and abandoned him, etc. etc. etc.

Naruto is already full of grimdarkery, intrigue, politics, and all the other stuff faggurts champion.

Yea, I think I'm out for now too, but thanks for the brainfood. Keep saving threads so I can see where this goes.

>>6980303
Exactly. It will likely be aid another, only in combat. Perhaps for each additional person attacking, the damage threshold increases, or automatic damage is added so long as the attack succeeds.

Also, how do people feel about a tick based combat system? I don't like that about Exalted, but I do see how useful it can be from playing a bit. It also adds a bit of cinematic flair to things, were you've got two people who are basically cross countering each other on the same tick.

>>6980308
I don't know why everyone seems to assume the point of things is for everything to be grimdark...

OR why people seem to think I've actually watched the show...

>>6980255

I would say let people discern what the combo actions are themselves, but have them go in a certain order. IE: [Setup -> Attack -> Finisher]. If you're utilizing some sort of initiative order than they all delay to the slowest person and act in the same turn. The setup attack is not damaging but lowers the targets defense, or something. Any attacks that follow behave normally, the finisher could just be a typical power for accuracy tradeoff, but with the lowered defense of the setup would still likely hit.

Or possibly give the target a defense penalty for each proceeding attack, with the setup causing a decent amount to begin with?

>>6980110That said, despite the cynicism inherent in a deconstruction, one of the themes is pushing ahead for a brighter tomorrow, and the cost it will have on today. It's an Earn Your Happy Ending thing.


and with the protagonist, Naruto, one thing to consider is that he is not single handedly changing the world, but rather a part of something greater than just himself. He is the son of Yondaime and the student of Jiraiya. Naruto has been granted his role through the actions of those that came before him.

If you look at him solely as an individual you might think "omggenericsmarysuelol" and nothing more of it, but you have to stop thinking in terms of Individuals as something stand alone, Naruto puts a huge emphasis on bonds (parents, siblings, friends, teachers) and how the individual is inseparable from them.

Naruto is Earning that Happy Ending, because Jiraiya was Earning that Happy Ending, Yondaime, Sarutobi, all of them, that's what Will of Fire is, the bonds that bind people's destiny together.

Hate is also passed on. Orochimaru, Danzo, Madara, their actions have created the mega-douche Sasuke.

>>6980378I don't know why
>>Naruto RPG thread
>>Naruto pictures with every post
>>Naruto thread

>>6980378I don't know why everyone seems to assume the point of things is for everything to be grimdark...

your OP was "HOT CHICK YEAH YOU SEE HER TITS BUT OOOH SHIT GUTS SHES DEAD FUCKIN HARDCORE MAN U GONNA DIE!!!"

seriosly, you're trying to make Riddle of Steel

just go buy(lol i mean download) it, it has everything you're looking for (to an even greater level of detail, but you can simplify things if you have a brain), and the magic system is open ended for making your own effects.

>>6980394
Each successive attack would probably lower a target's defenses.

>>6980412
Yes, I get it, alright, give it up, I don't actually care. My point is that this isn't meant to be lolgrimdark, it's supposed to be a deconstruction of a genre where a ten year old is sent around the world with a dangerous rat creature that generates enough electricity to kill the average human being.

It's not grimness for the sake of grimness, it's grimness that serves a purpose. It's less 40k and more World of Darkness with ninja.

>>6980421
I also haven't mentioned the show or anything related to it other than using the images, have I now?

>>6980482

If you don't know anything about this show, then maybe you should stop claiming that you're "deconstructing" it?

Pay no mind to the trolls, this is good stuff so far.

>>6980482

>>6980482I also haven't mentioned the show or anything related to it other than using the images, have I now?

>>hay guis I am deconstructing Naruto

>>6980457
I don't want Riddle of Steel. Why do people seem to assume what I want when clearly they don't know?
Riddle of Steel is gritty and overcomplicated and full of nutshots. I want a fluff heavy narrative system. If anything I'm trying to make Exalted more.

>>6980433
Actually, no, it wasn't anything about hardcore. It was about desperation and fighting a losing battle, seeing your friends die, knowing you might die. Grim, yeah, but not the same GRIMDARK that you're trying to associate with it. It's the same kind of 'grimdarkness' that a war movie might have.

It's certainly no more grim than World of Darkness. And only slightly more grim than Exalted.
Actually, reverse that. Exalted is shiny, but everyone is going to fail, the Gods are dicks, Creation is breaking apart, and no one can work together ever.

>>6980482it's supposed to be a deconstruction of a genre
>>I don't actually care

interesting.

>>6980541
>>6980502
I know OF it. I have seen some episodes, but I wouldn't consider myself a fan. This is just as related to Pokemon--something I was trying to get across.

Also, again, I've implied a connection to the show, but I haven't mentioned it explicitly. I said I was trying to deconstruct the shounen genre, not the show itself. There are plenty of shows where children are left unaccompanied and meant to sort the problems of adults, but don't suffer emotionally

>>6980528
I once got a friend with that. It was awesome. He also fell for the Fight Club=Calvin and Hobbes one.

>>6980567
Naruto defines the shounen genre at this point in the game.

What you're doing is a reconstruction.

One of things about this kind of a setting is it's really going to depend on the storyteller to get the mood across. I once ran a Naruto freeform RP online for my friends, and this was more or less my goal. I put them on team's with NPC's. Spent months building up the characters and getting my players attached to them, then had every last one of them gutted or maimed horribly in the climactic battle. It was a TON of work and I wound up needing a lot of help to develop so many different characters properly, but in the end it really drove the point home. A couple players even admitted openly in the OOC chat that they cried a little when their teammate was heartlessly stabbed in the eye by a grown man and then punted at them like a projectile/human shield. It affected the way they played their characters for the rest of the story.

>>6980593
Reconstruction, deconstruction, it doesn't really matter at this point, does it?

Also, fuck you, Dragonball Z defined and will continue to define the shounen genre.

>>6980699Also, fuck you, Dragonball Z defined and will continue to define the shounen genre.

as it stands right now, I figure...

One Piece= Dragon Ball (adventure)
Bleach= DBZ+Yu Yu Hakusho (power levels)
Naruto= Fist of the North Star (shitty dads)

>>6980729
Actually, for that last one, it and Bleach and One Piece are all inspired by Dragonball Z. Dragonball Z is pretty much the Ur example of a shounen series, and the one that all others aspire to.

>>6980797

How are those nostalgia goggles working out for ya?

DBZ was terrible. Revolutionary, sure, but its derivative works are better than it in every way.

>>6980819
BITCHES DON'T KNOW ABOUT MAH DRAGONBALL KAI

Jesus christ i just read through the first thread.

Your perserverance among this level of trolling is impressive.

>>6980819
I never said it was GOOD, just that it was THE shounen anime.

>>6980819
Well, DBZ inspires a majority of the new shounen series, so it would still be considered to define the genre.

>>6980844slurp slurp slurp

oh god, an e-cock sucker

>>6980867 implying implying implying
Oh god, another fucking troll.

Define's the wrong word to use on Naruto. It's popular, yeah, but the genre was defined by the shows that came before it.

>>6980853
Dragon Ball was great
Dragon Ball Z was also fun to read, there's no need to deny liking them.

>>6980874omg troll I shuld respond to him!!

hurry, save the thread by replying to the troll!!

>>6980882

>>6980879
DBZ scarred my imagination for sound effects.
I can't read a manga or comic that has "super fast dodging" without hearing the ZWEEE noise in my head each time.

>>6980699

Heh, you're a weasely motherfucker, you know that? No offense, I kinda respect that (though watching you try to squirm out of admitting that you misjudged Naruto isn't *quite* as entertaining as watching you develop your game was).

But for the record, no, you may not claim to be "deconstructing a genre" then back up your claim by toting the oldest and least-sophisticated example of that genre as gospel. Worthy effort, thank you for trying, but no.

>>6980895

om nom nom I am getting so well fed

>>6980902
I wasn't toting Dragonball Z as gospel, just the template.
I still think that it's deconstructing the genre. From what I've seen, and heard in both threads, the characters never acknowledge the things that have happened to them, and those that do are few and far between, and mostly only the villains.
The characters don't even seem to have been effected all that much by their first kill.
And let's not get started on Ash not having any psychological problems after all the shit he's gone through.

Here's what I have so far. I switched it to rolling 2 red and 2 green die in the end, because it does give more swing. Attributes will be doubled up, though you'd still only be able to use one Specialty at a time. Attacking with a physical attack might be Strength+Agility, or Agility+Tenacity, while a ranged attack might be Wits+Agility.

http://privatepaste.com/a05d3ee6d4

But, I'm going to bed now. I'll think about it tomorrow before I have to run my game, and I'll try to get some kind of playtest going Friday.

>>6980844
There was only one troll, at the end. There were none in this thread until you said something...
Most of it has been people not seeing where I'm coming from, and assuming I'm trying some stereotypical lolgrimdark thing.