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  • File : 1271447149.jpg-(110 KB, 650x1000, priest.jpg)
    110 KB Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)15:45 No.9232905  
    What Should i play as in Dark heresy? My last character was a 7 foot black voodo shamen (feral psyker) am looking for something different but playable.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)15:46 No.9232917
    What else is in your group?
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)15:46 No.9232923
    Play a 4' tall midget Adeptus Mechanicus.

    Name him Goliath.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)15:48 No.9232943
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)15:48 No.9232947
    A power player who said hes gunna player a void born psyker and anothe rpower who i dont know what he will play.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)15:49 No.9232964
    Heard it in the voice and everything. I don't even like Starcraft. Damn
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)15:50 No.9232995

    Clearly you know what you want to play already. Cleric, Fellowship the FUCK out of everything. Smile wryly as you recruit angry mobs as cannon fodder and sway opinions with a silver tongue. Best of all you'll be decent at personal combat as well.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)15:51 No.9233012
    TechPriest with multiple personalities and a servo arm named Bob who he converses with. Not a good character for avoiding insanity points though
    >> Toledo Steel 04/16/10(Fri)15:52 No.9233024
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    Play a cleric with a flamer.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)15:54 No.9233067
    Only first rank, playing tattered fates.
    >> OP 04/16/10(Fri)15:56 No.9233099
    Whats the point in Adepts?
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)15:56 No.9233115
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    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:01 No.9233218
    They know all kinds of shit. Also they can hold a gun.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:02 No.9233225
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    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:02 No.9233235
    >what should I play
    Roll random. Go.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:03 No.9233254
    I love this picture.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:06 No.9233302
    Best pilots, best investigators, can do everything.
    >> Toledo Steel 04/16/10(Fri)16:06 No.9233310
    So? You can afford a flamer and the skill in it isn't that important and you could take the back ground which give access to it if you got the inquistors handbook.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:08 No.9233338
    Always roll random.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:09 No.9233361
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    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:13 No.9233460
    What I liked about that story is that the poster is thoroughly convinced that the other player is being an asshole and a complete douche, while everyone READING the story is marveling at how fucking awesome the whole thing turned out.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:19 No.9233565
    This is why I play Dark Heresy
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:22 No.9233615

    >Best pilots, best investigators, can do everything.

    Except fight. But yeah, by endgame most adepts are like a super investigator/surgeon/linguist/diplomat/historian........who's best combat moves mostly consist of dodging and sprinting for cover and finding something to huddle under.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:24 No.9233643
    Yeah, that's the worst part about an Adept.

    But it doesn't keep you from being AWESOME. Just think out the box and keep an oversized pistol with recoil gauntlet handy.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:27 No.9233693
    Bullshit they can't fight.

    This. Our loremaster-type adept has a nice, high powered laspistol and did well in combat. He wasn't as effective as, say, the noble born guardsman with ridiculously good gear or the Moritat Assassin/Axe-Murderer, but he did his part.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:28 No.9233728
    Or lay down suppressing fire from cover. Build a bomb with your other hand.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:32 No.9233789
    Haven't tried this yet:

    + "Thy Name I Keep" Background
    + Nascent Psyker Elite Package
    Go for the Adept branch with Psychic powers
    Go for Malefic Scholar
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:33 No.9233800
    >get purged immediately
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:35 No.9233844
    Has anyone tried playing a Navigator in DH? Warp Eye powers could be interesting.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:36 No.9233853
    >Adepts can't fight

    Unless they have a knife....
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:36 No.9233860

    Navigators are even less subtle investigators than tech-priests and angry feral guardsmen.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:37 No.9233874
    apparently you can abuse the shit out of the Lidless Stare
    >> Inquisitor Smathers 04/16/10(Fri)16:39 No.9233905
    Go with an assassin.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:41 No.9233951
    Considering all u have to do is point it at someone for it to work...yeah.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:41 No.9233964
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:44 No.9234024
    I wanted to justify an interesting Guardsman on the Officer track and came up with
    Voidborn Battlefleet Calixis Naval Officer

    Not sure how to make it not suck at the higher ranks.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:44 No.9234025

    Trouble is that Lidless Stare does not distinguish between friend and foe. Warning your pals gives them a bonus of +30 to resist the effect, but an exposed warp eye has a way of undermining the will and drawing the attention of people. It's also roughly equivalent to using a psychic power in public. Powerful, yes. Advisable? Fuck no.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:47 No.9234076

    Guardsmen are decent combatants, no worries. You'll want a high starting Fellowship score, though, since it's expensive to raise. When you get to high ranks you'll ideally be using your commander skills to, you know, command people. Bring mooks.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:47 No.9234085
    Ive never known navigators give a fuck bout anyone but themselves. Almost to mutiny level...
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:49 No.9234105
    Agree, I suggested the Navigator because of his ability to sense corruption with Gaze into the Abyss. Held in my Gaze just rapes daemons. Tides of Time and Space gives free actions. The Course Untravelled is a short teleport.
    All very very useful to the Inquisition.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)16:55 No.9234226
    I agree with this choice. In my experience it goes like this.

    The psyker is most likely to fucking kill everyone or have to be executed by the party. The Guardsman is expected to be a tank most of the time because he has armor. The scum is less combat heavy than the assassin. The Cleric is expected to go all Lawful Stupid and get himself killed + orders people around. Adept is useless in combat. Arbitrator is a more social guardsman. Tech-Priest is a skill-whore (making it my second choice. The assassin can survive in combat, has stealth capbilities, is long ranged so expected to hang back in combat, ambidexterity unremarkable etc.

    There's no real best class since everyone has near the same chance of survival but I find that no one questions the Assassin for hanging back or hiding. It doesn't make you look like a coward for running away it makes you "efficient"
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)17:14 No.9234583
    Can Navigators be Inquisitors?
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)17:18 No.9234654
    Assasin long ranged? it can be with some effot but id say assasins were better suited to hacking and slashin.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)17:18 No.9234664

    So, your reasoning is that if you want to "win" at DH and not rely on anyone else you play the assassin?
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)17:25 No.9234808
    No. The Idea was to survive without looking like a complete pussy. No class can "solo" DH but if you build yourself one way and pull your own weight form a safer distance, you should be able to survive long enough to gain enough XP to have a chance.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)17:27 No.9234846
    For a solo investigator, the Arbitrator is probably the best. inquiry, tracking as well as contacts with the Arbites. The Divisio Immoralis from IqH gives you an excuse to be an X-file-sque Arbite with legit jurisdiction just about anywhere.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)17:29 No.9234885
    > survive
    Guardsman or Arbitrator.
    Buy cheap Toughness and Sound Constitution
    Get best Flak armour.
    Take cover.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)17:41 No.9235101

    Every career is capable of surviving just fine by being smart. Besides, hanging back is just asking for enemy melee assassins to sneak up on you and remove your intestines.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)17:45 No.9235157
    "Dude! Thanks!"
    "I had appendicitis! You saved my life!"
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)17:45 No.9235158
    And standing in the front isn't asking for it?
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)17:47 No.9235187
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    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)17:48 No.9235202

    You'll generally see what's coming at you from the front. Standing with your allies also means you can help each other more easily. Unless there are explosives. Really though, if you're going into DH purely to make the most combat-able and survivable character then you're doing it wrong.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)17:48 No.9235203
    You are a combatant class hiding behind your non-combatant teammates.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)17:50 No.9235248
    Brave =/= Stays Alive
    Even if you look at it from a purely RP standpoint, don't you want your character alive long enough for you to be able to develop them?
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)17:53 No.9235298
    >Brave =/= Stays Alive
    Try running away and leaving your team to die. That works too.

    See >>9234885
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)17:54 No.9235313

    Sure do, but playing it safe every damn second of the game is boring. Sometimes you need to take a risk. It may kill you, sure, but you'll be remembered if you succeed. My DH group has survived (mostly) to rank 4 and none of them have been particularly combat twinked. Except the sniper-assassin. Who is currently looking at mind-scrubbing once the mission is over because he's a sociopathic loot-whore who places his survival above all else. Not that he doesn't have bigger problems elsewhere.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)17:55 No.9235334
    I said before that you don't have to be a complete puss the whole game but it would be nice to survive long enough to get enough XP to be stand a chance.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)17:59 No.9235390
    DH isn't that lethal
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:00 No.9235423
    >DH isn't that lethal
    Your GM is doing it wrong.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:01 No.9235446
    I am kind o new to DH, what I don't get is the Armour. Can some classes not wear some armor while others can? Cause it seems to me if you have and adept wearing flak like the rest of his buddies in combat at least his survivability should not be so disparate from his comrades.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:02 No.9235465
    Shoot yourself with a lasgun in head. Do it again. You are probably still alive. DH isn't that lathal.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:03 No.9235469
    From what I understand anyone can wear any armor but in the beginning only the Guardsman starts with any kind of viable armor.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:04 No.9235480
    Everybody can wear armour, and should! But not everybody starts with it or can afford it.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:05 No.9235499
    I think that might be taking to to far. I've have my guy get shot by a laspistol and get dropped. Fuck 10-again or whatever the fuck they call it in DH. Emprah's Wrath or whatever.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:06 No.9235532

    Righteous Fury which, by default, only PCs and primary NPCs can trigger. The lethality of DH really comes down to who is running it. If it's a combat heavy meatgrinder then of course everyone's going to end up dead.
    >> Inquisitor Smathers 04/16/10(Fri)18:09 No.9235574
    This. Play style changes form GM to GM. I know that I'm particularly forgiving with my acolytes and don't try my best to fuck them. Find out what your GM does and play accordingly.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:09 No.9235585
    Impossible unless u rolled like 3 hp.
    Armour plus toughness?
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:10 No.9235607
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:11 No.9235624
    No headgear. Voidborn with like 9 hp and like I said Righteous fury that allows one hit basically count as two.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:11 No.9235627

    No, the PCs are doing it right.

    DH can be lethal, sure, if you just kick in doors screaming CLEANSE AND BURN, CLEANSE AND BURN. But that's stupid, and stupid Acolytes don't last long.

    The key point to remember is that a lot of the time, if you're in a firefight then that means you fucked up somewhere along the line. Acolytes aren't soldiers, they're investigators. Their role is to look into vaguely suspicious stuff on which the Inquisitor can't spare proper Throne Agents and determine whether or not it warrants more serious =][= involvement. If they want extra credit they can be more proactive in stamping on the heretics, but that raises the risk of lethal encounters significantly.

    Ideally the Acolytes go in, make their investigation, report to their Inquisitor, and the Inquisitor makes arrangements to bring an appropriate level of horrible violence to bear on the targets.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:12 No.9235639
    Who shot you? cos only PC's get that.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:12 No.9235643

    See his comment about the 10. NPCs were capable of inflicting Righteous Fury.

    If you want lethal then look at Rogue Trader. The amount of high-grade weaponry kicking about results in horrific amounts of damage being dealt.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:12 No.9235646
    2D10+4 damage? Actually, that averages about 15 damage between two shots.

    The baseline starting DH character has about 10-11 wounds and toughness bonus 3. Crappy (AP2) head gear is not too difficult to find, but for the sake of this discussion we'll leave it out. Subtract 6 damage via toughness bonus and now your "average" DH character is severely wounded, but still has 1-2 normal wounds and about 7-8 critical damage wounds before dying outright. In fact, he would probably survive a third laspistol shot to the head but suffer some permament damage in the process.

    This is an average rank 1 dude without armor and with average toughness. Then again, it's also just a laspistol...

    If mooks are getting righteous fury and critical wounds, then the GM is probably doing it wrong.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:13 No.9235666
    My GM has an house rule involving if someone/or yourself has enough time to point a gun at you up close and to your head excluding you are in actual combat. The damage by the gun still has to be greater than the AP if you have any, but you T bonus doesn't apply.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:14 No.9235673
    Stupid Evil psychotic guardsman. Cliche, yes, but it works.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:14 No.9235687
    Our Gm was a dick.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:14 No.9235688
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    >6 damage via toughness
    >3 toughness bonus
    >what the fuck am I reading.jpg
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:15 No.9235704
    Lets not forget fate points. burn one and live.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:16 No.9235711

    Violence is, to a degree, inevitable. A perfect investigation is a rare thing and so a smart cell prepares for when things go wrong. An acolyte or two who specialises in las-ing holes in heretics are an asset to a cell. There will be times when there isn't time to call in support. The trouble comes from when the cell begins to fall back on martial acts to accomplish their task instead of playing it cool.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:16 No.9235712
    I was calculating for the guy who said "shoot yourself in the head, then do it again" but misread laspistol instead of lasgun

    so two shots, each deadling 1D10+2 = 2D10+4. With TB3 applying to each shot, that's a reduction of 3x2=6.
    >> Inquisitor Smathers 04/16/10(Fri)18:16 No.9235724
    Yeah why the fuck is everyone whining about dying easy. You have at least 1 get out of jail free card before you're in any real danger. Even if you spent the point you can still burn it.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:17 No.9235736

    Depends on the style of the game. I personally use two-shot mooks who don't get Righteous Fury, but another GM might use full critical tables for every combatant and apply RF to all attacks.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:18 No.9235754
    average TB = 3
    flak armour AP = 4

    = soaking 7 points of damage off every hit

    average Wounds= 11

    + Critical tables. need around a 8+ to finally kill you.

    but but don't forget your Fate Points! Average FP= ~2x Get out of Jail free cards

    Conclusion: DH isn't that Lethal.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:20 No.9235785
    There's a feral guardsman in our game. He started at rank 1 with TB4, Guard Flak and 18 wounds. He's up to 22 now. He doesn't let small arms fire concern him, and this was before our psyker made his talents known to everyone else along with the Healer power.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:21 No.9235807
    >Have Healer power
    >pretend to be a cleric
    >Be healed in the name of the emperor!
    >Punch the wound out
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:25 No.9235856
    >Ascend to Hierophant
    >Take Mercy of the Emperor trait
    >Lay on hands to literally mend flesh with your faith
    >A living saint is you
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:26 No.9235876
    You mean Divine Ministration?
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:28 No.9235896

    Check out Ascension. There's a second method of faith healing now, one that doesn't involve the spending of Faith Points.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:28 No.9235903
    High enough fellowship and abit of bending with imperial law and u can talk/walk outta everything.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:28 No.9235908
    will check it, thx
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:29 No.9235914
    Faith points?
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:29 No.9235920

    Sorry, meant Fate Points. Easy to get confused, especially when they're used to fuel Faith talents.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:30 No.9235940

    That's true, yeah.

    I tend to approach DH in the same way that I play Call of Cthulhu - be cautious, be wary, avoid direct confrontation where possible. If you can't avoid it, be sure to pour vastly excessive firepower into it just to be on the safe side.
    >> Inquisitor Smathers 04/16/10(Fri)18:33 No.9235983
    >Call of Cthulhu
    Fucking Mi-Go!!!
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:35 No.9236013

    That's the smart way to play it. Of course, you might eventually screw up a mission because you were too cautious and didn't take decisive action. And then there are times when you're dropped in the shit from the get go. Like if your GM decides to run Tattered Fates.
    >> OP 04/16/10(Fri)18:51 No.9236254
    So, wait...what am i playing?
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:53 No.9236285

    Chances are your chums are going to be combat focused. Roll a social or investigative character (arbitrator, cleric, scum) unless your GM really likes combat heavy games.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)18:55 No.9236305
    I aways play a tech priest. I fucking love them. My currently living one is a Magos; in which the organic half of his brain is starting to develop emotions after decades of having only two logic halves.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)19:05 No.9236458
    Whats so good about a tech priest?
    >> MR. RAGE !D9l9S8Lio6 04/16/10(Fri)19:08 No.9236488


    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)20:31 No.9237915
    >> Captain AdMech guy 04/16/10(Fri)20:59 No.9238389
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    Not to mention you get to be a dick to the Imperial Cult. The Omnissiah's your Jesus, not your God.

    Realize that being a Techpriest is as close as a Xeno as you can get to play right now from the fluff standpoint, and you open up all sorts of opportunities.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)21:50 No.9239253
    >being a Techpriest is as close as a Xeno as you can get to play right now

    Fuck ya!
    I completely hated 40K humans until I learned about Admech. Their awesome!! To me at least, they show promise for humanity's future within this grim-dark galaxy.
    >> Captain AdMech guy 04/16/10(Fri)22:02 No.9239438
    >show promise for the future
    >show promise

    Hahahahahahha the AdMech is just as fucked up as everyone else.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)22:14 No.9239620
    Still better than the shitty organics.
    >> Captain AdMech guy 04/16/10(Fri)22:17 No.9239663
    Not really.

    When some asshat is promoted over you because he happens to be a half of a percent more machine than you? When you CAN'T present your original research for fear of HERETEK and BLAMMING?

    AdMech is JUST AS FUCKED as the Imperium. But with machine boners instead of EMPRAHHH boners.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)22:18 No.9239674
    actually since they're maintaining control on everything and preventing actual scientific advancement so they can maintain their standing LITERALLY EVERYTHING IS THEIR FAULT YOU DUMB FUCK
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)22:21 No.9239723
    Protip: "Actual scientific advancement" is fucking dangerous in a universe where building something the wrong way can lead to it becoming spontaniously possessed. Imperial Technology does advance, just very slowly and very cautiously, because barging ahead with random experiments causes more trouble than it solves.
    >> Captain AdMech guy 04/16/10(Fri)22:22 No.9239739
    I agree with this, actually.

    But when it means the last 'new' thing you made was nigh-literally pre-Heresy, there might be something a bit fucked with the process, in the minds of a few factions.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)22:25 No.9239787
    They are even more stuck in the past than anyone else...
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)22:26 No.9239821
    I concur. omnissiah be praised. We do advance our tech. We just like to have a fucking template first, so we don't have to literally reinvent the wheel! I have seen one of my peers lose his forge to warp demons once. The idiot tried to use an experimental warp-drive-reactor...
    >> Captain AdMech guy 04/16/10(Fri)22:29 No.9239870
    This is part of the problem.

    EVERYTHING has already been done. It's quicker and easier to just go out and find the shattered remains of an impossibly wonderful era than it is to retread the path.

    Because if you do, you'll have to go through the pitfalls, and the pitfalls are on fire and full of HELLACIOUS AGONY OF ASSORTING KINDS.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)22:30 No.9239883
    Imperium of man = Medieval Catholics in space

    Admech = Alchemist in space.
    >> Captain AdMech guy 04/16/10(Fri)22:31 No.9239896
    They're much more religious than Alchemists.

    They're like Russian Orthodox In Space.
    >> Dr. Baron von Evilsatan 04/16/10(Fri)22:36 No.9239995

    The Mechanicus does NOT have the technology. They haven't been living on some fancy paradise planet since pre-fall. Mars is an anarchic nightmare shithole the moment you leave the safe zones into the kilometres of labyrinthine corridors beneath it full of rogue machinery, self-aware and malevolent AI from before the Fall, and the daemon programs of the Heresy. EVERYTHING in the databases is fucked. The databases are fragmented over the entire surface to the extent that it would be impossible to see one tenth of the total files in the ludicrously extended life of a Magos even assuming that they are completely safe to visit. And they are not.

    The files have been corrupted into madness by the Fall, and the unleashing of the most potent informational warfare systems ever to exist to defeat the Iron Men. Nearly all of Mars was rendered uninhabitable, what they live in now is built on the top of the ruins. They send archeotech expeditions in to find shit, nearly all of them never come back. The sheer number of rogue war machine running around in there is sufficient to rape the mind. Then came the Heresy, which was not earth-exclusive. Mars as the second most critical planet in the Imperium was the site of fighting nearly as ferocious as on Terra, with Mechanicus loyalists and Hereteks fighting tooth, nail, and mechadendrite everywhere. Ancient machines were unleashed, viruses both normal and daemonic unleashed into all the computer systems. Nearly every single stored record on Mars was rendered unusable, and those that survived are half the time self-aware and don't like you, or daemonic and actively try to kill you.
    >> Dr. Baron von Evilsatan 04/16/10(Fri)22:37 No.9240002
    If you come back with a schematic, it is almost certainly gibberish, and if it isn't, it's probably corrupted into uselessness. If it does come back whole it was probably malevolently fucked with so that instead of a Lasgun power cell it's a fucking grenade set to detonate the second you finish building it. Why do you think they want off-world STCs so damned much if they had them all here? The fucking Heresy is why. Off-world they only have to contend with the Fall's war and its effects on the machinery plus twenty thousand years of degradation with no maintenance. But at least off-world it'll probably just not work instead of actively seek to kill you.

    Why do you think they seek to placate the Machine Spirit? It's because it exists. The fragments of trillions of self-aware programs, flourishing during the Dark Age of Technology and shattered by Man in his war with the Iron men, imprisoning the few who had not set themselves irrevocably into the machinery, a prison smashed wide open by the Heresy. Everything that can hold programming in the Imperium has a shard of a program in it. EVERYTHING. And you'd better fucking please it or it will do everything in its power to make your day shit. Sure, if it's a Lasgun it'll just not work or start shooting off rounds by itself, but if you piss off a Lard Raider you can say bye-bye to half a continent. They apply these principles to things without spirits by habit, since they're so used to dealing with tanks that if not talked to just right might go rogue and annihilate the manufactorum before they can be killed.
    >> Dr. Baron von Evilsatan 04/16/10(Fri)22:37 No.9240018
    This is why they do not like ANYONE fucking with technology, because it is so rare to find anything that just works it is critical it not be compromised. That, and they do not have the actual knowledge to fuck with it intelligently, just through experimentation, which inevitably leads to slaughter. Pressing buttons to see what works is fine in a 21st century computer, but it is a very stupid thing to do at the helm of a 410th century starship with the destructive power to end solar systems. The entire knowledge base of humanity was lost. Not forgotten, but outright lost. Everything at all, poof. Nobody knows anything because the Fall fucked everything up and the Heresy double-fucked it. To rebuild the theoretical framework needed to design new technologies that don't kill everyone near them would require starting from the ground up. They don't have the time, and they never have.

    This gets on to the point of war and what it does to technology. Someone will parrot that it makes it go much faster. Yes, it makes practical applications of technology go much faster. It also utterly stops all research on the scientific theories behind those technologies. This means that when war chugs along for a decade or two things get done. It means when it goes on too long you run out of theories to turn into technologies, and then you run out of technologies to apply. You stagnate. When you have been fighting in a war for survival in a drastically overextended empire, this is what happens. You are desperate for any extra materiel that can possibly be produced. Half your entire fucking military might went rogue, smashed the half that stayed, leaving you with the tattered shreds of a war machine to keep hold of an empire that was reaching straining point with an army far larger. There is no time for the sort of applied research programs that took Man twenty five thousand years to develop, in a time of unprecedented growth and prosperity.
    >> Dr. Baron von Evilsatan 04/16/10(Fri)22:38 No.9240031
    This is also why the Adeptus Mechanicus insists on cargo cultism. It's because when you are dealing with things you barely understand because everything you knew about them was destroyed it is the safest and most reliable option. The rituals do not exists for mysticism, they exist because they are the most practical means of building, repairing and maintaining the equipment they have with the knowledge surviving. You don't understand why pressing that button makes it go, because the manual tried to take over your brain and the copies are all unreadable and the research base that would let you reverse-engineer it does not exist and cannot be built.

    Why are the Tau doing so well with their technology? Because they had peace. Eight thousand years unmolested by any enemy and they were helped the entire time by the most advanced biological race in the galaxy. Give the Imperium eight thousand years of peace and I can guarantee you it will be harder than it was during the Great Crusade.
    >> Dr. Baron von Evilsatan 04/16/10(Fri)22:38 No.9240043
    Since some some still don't get the idea, try this.

    Build a library, fill it with all human knowledge. You take it elsewhere when you need a book from it, but the book is only a simplified copy. You don't understand the real book, and you don't need to. Nobody takes the rea lbooks anywhere because why would you, when there's a whole library there?

    Now that library goes rogue and the maintenance machinery starts killing everyone any-fucking-where near it. Where the fuck did they all come from, you swear to god there weren't this many, and there weren't because they're using the library's information to fight their war. The government fights a battle that destroys the planet against these robots and tears apart the library to stop them using it, only to be destroyed in the process. The library is leveled, cast into flames, every book burned and every computer virus-laden.

    Then comes a man who worked there. He talks to the few surviving library workers, assembles their information, and starts rebuilding a city around the library and expanding it as the librarians find little scraps of paper and fragmented bits of files that stuck together just right read something. They rebuild a library from scrap on the ashes of the old. It isn't a shadow on the glory of the old, but it is all they have.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)22:39 No.9240046
    I know this isn't rally the thread but can someone expand on the rules and limitations of first aid. Cause I am kind of confused as to how you can only heal one type of wound during combat once deal not matter where it may have hit.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)22:39 No.9240051
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    Imagine this. You've been charged with designing a new circuitboard. Just as you're putting on the finishing touches and are about to send it off to pre-production, your eyes start to bleed. When you bring your hands up to wipe them, you horribly mutilate your face since your hands have inexplicably become claws. Just as you begin to scream out a keening wail of incomprehensible anguish, your ribcage bursts out of your chest. Your last few minutes alive involve you hearing it laugh at you.

    All because that fucking circuitboard had a random pattern etched on it that sort of resembled a portion of the true name of a greater Daemon. Oops.

    Morale of the story? Keep using what already works.
    >> Dr. Baron von Evilsatan 04/16/10(Fri)22:39 No.9240052
    Then the city turns on itself, kills its master, and the librarians turn to rage. Half of them kill the other half and destroy the remnants of the library because where they're going they won't need science. Everything burns, and the city is left to a scattered few survivors, walls open to the world, with the hungry predators circling.

    The Adpetus Mechanicus is the sole surviving librarian, desperately scrabbling through the ashes of paper and splinters of hard drives for anything to help him and the city he needs to survive just a second longer.

    The Imperium isn't grim because things suck by choice and could be fine if a sensible person came along. That sensible person wouldn't survive fifty seconds of the reality. The Imperium is grim because every single shit decision, every single sacrifice, every single death, every single man woman and child suffering a shit life in the worst conditions imaginable, is the absolute best that can be done. It is a study of the worst happening to everyone and what part of your humanity must be sacrificed today just to stand a chance of survival, and all it asks is whether or not it would have perhaps been better to die.
    >> Captain AdMech guy 04/16/10(Fri)22:41 No.9240074
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    I think I love you.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)22:45 No.9240129

    You've been refining that, haven't you. It reads better than the old version.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)22:50 No.9240223
    Fucking saved. More people should read this, so there would be less "HURRDURR ENTIRE IMPERIUM FIXED IF YOU APPLY THIS 21ST CENTURY IDEAL" idiocy cluttering the place it.
    >> Dr. Baron von Evilsatan 04/16/10(Fri)22:51 No.9240231

    I get an annoying amount of practise. I shouldn't be able to get away with having a folder full of pre-made responses to the same old lines, but there's never any real progress in discussion on /tg/. No matter how far one thread gets about one thing and how long it is until the next thread, that next thread will always start from the exact same place the last did.

    At least with these I can try and get the topic onto a more progressive level and save some repetition.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)22:52 No.9240244
    Actually, my Tech Priest went and became a Secutor or whatever they're called... it's like a prestige class, and it's in one of the first expansion books they put out. Anyway, it pretty much made me into a hulking colossus, a defender of the AdMech... but I couldn't swim. Still pretty badass.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)22:54 No.9240269
    Baron, I recall you saying you GMed. How do your game of Dark Heresy typically go? Really fucking well I'd imagine?
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)22:55 No.9240277
    well no shit retard, but acting like the Mechanicus is the SOLE HOPE OF HUMANITY isn't doing anyone any favors either, which was the point in question

    they're all equally contributing both to the misery and survival of everyone else. going "oh yeah well the ecclesiarchy and space marines are dumb but the ADEPTUS MECHANICUS IS COOL AS HELL" is stupid because faith and witch-hunts are just as important to the survival of the Imperium as technology is
    >> Captain AdMech guy 04/16/10(Fri)22:56 No.9240295
    I freely admit I lighten the fluff up because holy fucking SHIT look at how MISERABLE everything is. This is as good as it can be and not DIE FOREVER, and it is basically a shithole hell awful place.

    I just like AdMech BECAUSE they're that little fucked up librarian trying to fix something, /anything/. The odd combination of faith and science fighting tooth and nail is neat (Even if the science is fucked to hell and back).

    Also, I'm going to be 12 for a moment: FUCKING TITANS. YES.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)22:58 No.9240308
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    >reedun comprehenshun
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)22:59 No.9240325
    im talkin bout
    >> Captain AdMech guy 04/16/10(Fri)23:01 No.9240353


    And then it busts out chainswords and Titans because fuck going into that long night gently. Or something. Desperation to survive.
    >> Dr. Baron von Evilsatan 04/16/10(Fri)23:01 No.9240356

    I'm not saying that at all. The zealous fury of the Ministorum is critical to the Imperium's defens,e because the only ways to combat Chaos are relentless war or simply. Seeing as the latter is what got the Emperor pseudo-killed and the Imperium nearly destroyed, it's not much of an option any more.

    I don't have a problem with the Space Marines either. They make a kidn of sense if used right. They're not a conventional or covert military force, but a hard-and-fast unit comprised of terrifyingly deadly men. Their doctrine is more along the lines of Delta than, say, the Rangers. They don't need camouflage or tactical advance, because they exploit shock and awe and their own momentum. They show up and blaze a path to their objective so fats that by the time a meaningful response can be raised, the situation has changed to the point where that response is now irrelevant. It doesn't matter how easy it is for a thousand men to kill one Space Marine if those thousand men are paralysed into inaction by the sheer intensity of the situation.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)23:03 No.9240387
    There's also possibly inertia. The Imperium has a bit of a problem with it- and when part of it involves Space Marines possibly getting tetchy about their Chapters getting shut down, I can see why.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)23:05 No.9240406
    There was that one forgeworld where the original titan's STC deliberately sent the whole planet partially into the warp for thousands of years and didn't get stopped till some Grey Knight convinced him that "No evil sentient program you are the demons, and then evil sentient program was smite-able."
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)23:07 No.9240429
    >>9240356 Or simply.
    Or simply. What?
    >> Captain AdMech guy 04/16/10(Fri)23:08 No.9240447
    Man, imagine how fucked that would be. Popping out of the Warp and-

    >> Dr. Baron von Evilsatan 04/16/10(Fri)23:10 No.9240493

    Chaos been stealin' mah paragraphs.

    Simple starvation. That was the Emperor's original plan; to starve the Chaos gods through rationalising humanity's thoughts until they were weak enough to be pacified and contained. The problem with that was the incredible vulnerability it leaves humanity in. The choices for fighting Chaos are basically mutual opposition and strength to each, or deliberate pacification at the cost of personal weakness.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)23:16 No.9240572
    They forgot that humans need so much more in food than they make in flesh and had the tech heretics worshiping the STC/GIANT-TITAN breed meat-tech hybrids as a renewable resource. Giant tower warped in muscle fiber and sinew that can lash out at shit GET!
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)23:41 No.9240985
    *click* I'd like to know more.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)23:49 No.9241095
    *I plug a wire into the ancient machine near me.
    "Yes! This is amaz---
    *Grasp hands to sparking head.* Must delete it, oh god I have to... before I... Lose my brain."
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)23:52 No.9241133
    Wow, the Emperor was sure naive to think that humans would stop being hateful, ambitious, and despairing simply because he would be in charge. Being a shitty dad didn't help either.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)23:56 No.9241189
    One of the grey knight novels "Dark mechanicus" or something.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)23:57 No.9241191
    Great, now I have to re-read that book.
    >> Anonymous 04/16/10(Fri)23:59 No.9241218
    Dark Adeptus
    >> Anonymous 04/17/10(Sat)00:08 No.9241382
    What is the main difference between dark and normal admech (beside hurr hurr we be chaos)?
    >> Captain AdMech guy 04/17/10(Sat)00:09 No.9241404
    Disregard for everything Baron posted, basically.
    >> Anonymous 04/17/10(Sat)00:11 No.9241444
    Well, the whole "we be chaos" thing sort of counts for a LOT. Basically, they use Chaos with technology. As you can imagine, this fucks up everything that they work with or do.
    >> Anonymous 04/17/10(Sat)00:12 No.9241455
    So Dark Admech will use the corrupted tech even if it fucks them over? Wtf...
    >> Anonymous 04/17/10(Sat)00:13 No.9241476
    I meant more that the stuff they come up with is just fucked up.
    >> Captain AdMech guy 04/17/10(Sat)00:13 No.9241481
    Yes, because they're under the sway/blessings of the chaos gods.

    You really think a Tzeenchian Techpriest cares if his hands SUDDENLY, BLADES, EVERYWHERE or a Slaaneshi one if his head opens up like a flower, feeding on sunlight and baking what's left of his useless fleshly brain?
    >> Anonymous 04/17/10(Sat)00:13 No.9241482
    >> Captain AdMech guy 04/17/10(Sat)00:15 No.9241510
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    >> Anonymous 04/17/10(Sat)00:30 No.9241818
    How do Tau fit into the grim-darkness? They feel too mar sue right now...
    >> Captain AdMech guy 04/17/10(Sat)00:32 No.9241854
    That's kinda their point. They JUST walked onto the galactic scene, and they just so happen to be highly resistant to WARP BULLSHIT.

    They're still going to get it up the ass- their thing is that the other shoe hasn't dropped in the form of the Imperium finding enough time and men to CRUSH THE FILTHY XENOS.

    Also they're fascist space commie cow things.
    >> Anonymous 04/17/10(Sat)00:35 No.9241892
    OP: Noble Born Guardsman.

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