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/tg/ - Traditional Games

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Happy New Year /tg/. In honor of this special time, I'd like to offer a special session of our playthrough of King of Dragon Pass. Rather than play through a year or two, I'll introduce the game's background and history screens, which go sadly underused in this game about both.

I'll also field questions. If you want to know about gameplay, the critical path, event outcomes and the like I'll answer to the best of my ability. Please mark spoilers and use spoiler tags out of consideration for those who prefer to not be casually spoiled.
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The second main button from the right is the background screen. It contains setting information useful in playing King of Dragon Pass. In addition to the heroquests, it has other myths, cultural material and an explanation of the events leading to your clan coming to Dragon Pass.

We'll start with the cultural information, move to the myths, and then history.
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We'll start with time keeping. A Gloranthan year is 42 weeks long, and in the Sacred Time magic rituals and the Lightbringer's heroquest are performed to keep the world running. Since Glorantha is a place where stories come true, the failure to do this probably would destroy the universe.
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This is Chaos, the enemy of all good Orlanthi. From the union of the Goddess of Rape and the God of Evil (and violence and force) and with the Goddess of Disease as the midwife, Wakboth the Devil who killed many gods and destroyed the perfect world.
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Glorantha has many gods, and we only talk about a few of them. For a who's who of the gods, check the Deities screen.
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Foreigners introduces the various non-Orlanthi factions you might interact with in KoDP. The Northern empire mentioned here is not Tarsh, so if someone knows what the game is referring to I would appreciate finding out.
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Some terminology. The only one that isn't immediately obvious is wyter.
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Heortland refers to the living customs of the Orlanthi people descended from Heort and his followers.
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Knowing the law is a good way to keep warm bodies around to use against Chaos or other people we hate, like the Greydogs.
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I hesitate to call this the world map, but this is a map of the region of Glorantha King of Dragon Pass is set in. The actual pass is the red line in the middle of the map, our clan and the other Heortling newcomers to Dragon Pass are settled somewhat East of the marsh you can see.

For reference purposes, Wintertop is Kero Fin.
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The Runes, and one in particular, are more important to the game than might be first assumed. Either way, it's interesting to find out that the symbols in the character portraits have more meaning than indicating a ring member's faith.
It is referring to the Lunar Empire, which eventually sweeps through Tarsh into Dragon Pass, and destroys the Kingdom of Dragon Pass. The Lunar Empire is based around a culthood worshipping the Red Moon, which Orlanthi have been foretold as an ill omen. It is, because the Lunars bring suffering to the Orlanthi they have not seen in ages.
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Ah, it was the Lunars? I wasn't sure and didn't want to say.

The next bit is taking some time, so while I put some images together have a look at the kings of Dragon Pass surrendering to the Lunars and the Feathered Horse Queen the traitor.
That's not the Horse Queen. Those two are the Celestial Twins of the Lunar Empire. They're the ones who brought upon the defeat of the Kingdom of Dragon Pass.
From the deviantart page:
"Two rebelling kings, Hofstaring Treeleaper and Kallyr Starbrow, are surrendering to the victorious Lunar - Fazzur Wideread and his ally, Feathered Horse Queen. Lunar soldiers, mages and standard bearers are gloating in the background. Mount Kero Fin looms in the distance."
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We'll start myths with the very first one: How Things Began. This is how the world was made and how the gods came to be worshiped.
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The Sword Story is the story that Humakt the Champion comes out of. It tells the story of the Death weapon and how it came to be in many hands.
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Next up is The Contests, the story of how Orlanth came to take control of the world from Yelm.
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The Storm Age is the myth of how the world was while ruled by Orlanth.
I'm a Glorantha fan, sadly never played in the setting. I bought the game after seeing the KoDP threads on /tg/, so basically: thank you for introducing me to the fame.

On the other hand, I suck at the game. Even with FAQs and walkthroughs for the Heroquests. I never have enough cows or know what I should be doing when.

Teach me, oh master?
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You're familiar with The Making of the Storm Tribe, but here is the full version, with all the bits that the priests don't want you to know. That bit at the end gets me every time.
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Here's Humakt the Champion. No extra content but we're going in order. Next up is Issaries.

The best advice I have is to think like a barbarian. Don't raid when you should be farming and worship the gods appropriately. Enshrine Truesword and Fyrdwomen, and ally with your neighbors. Learn the Healing ritual fast, and use it when you've got more than 20-odd injured. Try to have a 3/4 split on the ring, all of different gods, and make sure your chief is a worshiper of your main deity.

Any specific questions?
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Lhankor Mhy Finds the Truth happens alongside Issaries. I don't believe I've posted this one before.
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Orlanth and Aroka is even cooler in long form. The heroquest performance doesn't do it justice.
Trading and farming. And exploring I suppose.

What should I be doing about trade routes?

Do I need to regulalry futz with the balance of the three crops?

How often should I be sending my Ginger people out exploring, and how far? (I already know to explore my own lands)
Generally you don't want to mess with your crops.

If you do plan on doing it, do it at sea season, only during years when you've got a divination for poor wheat or good wheat (when you plant less or more respectively).

Never grow less than 15% of any crop, or you'll piss off Esrola.
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You're unlikely to be familiar with the next few myths. Here's Orlanth the Justice Bringer.

Trade routes are great passive sources of goods. You'll need to have a good number of crafters (30+) to maximize your profit from trade, so do both at about the same time.

Exploration can be done at your leisure. You can get through the entire game without doing it once, but there are some treasures and events that will not trigger without it. For easy ones, try exploring named areas like the mountains, and areas just to the north of the Marsh.

>Never grow less than 15% of any crop, or you'll piss off Esrola.
Ernalda outside Esrolia. Correct about the planting schedule, though I heard it was 20%.
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We haven't yet performed Chalana Arroy Heals the Scars. She's pretty badass for a pacifist goddess of healing.

I'm working on grabbing the Lightbringer's Quest right now. This will take some time.
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Esrola is still important elsewhere. She's the mother of the grain goddesses like Esra the Barley mother.

She's often portrayed as Ernalda's sister, or as an aspect of the goddess.

Having your Ernalda Temple set to the Bless Crops blessing can be seen as having it contain a shrine to Esrola, just as having the Rain blessing in Orlanth's temple indicates a shrine to Heler.
>Rather than play through a year or two, I'll introduce the game's background and history screens, which go sadly underused in this game about both.

Well that... that sounds pretty awful, yeah.
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As in it's awful for the thread to be about that, or awful that it's not used?

Because if it's the later... well, um, there's a lot of material. They can't use it all.

I mean, King of Dragon Pass doesn't even mention Arkat Humaktson as far as I recall.
I would break so many oaths for an Arkat/Godlearners game.
But yeah, if OP doesn't mind, I'm happy to offer my services to answer any Gloranthan questions people have.

I know enough that if I don't know the answer to your question, I at least know if and where I could find it.
I had forgotten that they were separate goddesses. That's a very good explanation for why some temples have wildly different domains.

What I mean is a lot of players don't check the lore screens. Of course the developers don't touch the rest of the Gloranthan canon, you could fill a library with books about Glorantha. But a lot of KoDP players don't look at the myths that aren't associated with a heroquest, and they're not aware that the game keeps a log of their actions and events.

By all means, go ahead. I have a question of my own actually: Who is Pharaoh? Where did he come from, and what is he doing in Heortland?
I'd be damn interested to hear more about how other culture's perspectives on something (i.e. a red moon) compare to the Orlanthi views.
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The Great Darkness is the time when good times became bad and then got better. Chaos overran the world and only after a much suffering was it driven out.
Ah, yes, Belintar.

Belintar the Pharaoh (more properly known as the God King), is of unknown origin. He walked out of the sea one day on the islands southwest of Heortland.

He then went around the lands surrounding the sea there to take them over. In Caladraland they sacrificed him to their Volcano God Veskarthan/Lodril. He survived, and ruled them.

In Esrolia they appointed him the year king, and then killed him. He came back.

In Heortland he slew their rightful king, and forbade anyone from recovering the body. The body reawoke, the king was now the king again, just resurrected, and loyal to Belintar.

No one is sure where he's from. Some people theorize he's a heroquester from the future who dropped out in the past.
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Elmal Guards the Stead gets some explanation of why Elmal was left behind during the Lightbringer's quest.

The Lunar Empire worships the Red Moon as the body of their chief goddess. That's a big difference from the Orlanthi who hate it with every fiber of their being, and avoid looking in its direction entirely.

So he's a mystery immortal with many powers, one of which is the ability to inspire or implant loyalty?
The Red Moon is often seen as an omen of evil and disaster.

The exceptions are the Lunar Empire (Naturally), and quite curiously, the Dwarves.

The Dwarves claim they prophesied the rise of the moon millenia ago, and that its rise indicates the schedule is going according as planned, and that the World Machine (who humans call the god Mostal) is being repaired and things are going well. This helped stop the dwarven wars over heresies like Openhandism (which believes humans are useful as more than raw materials)
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His immortality is interesting, given that it works more by getting a new body.

Over the years he's been human, merman, and an elf. Both male and female.

The Lunars later disrupt this reincarnation. Leaving Belintar dead.
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Uralda's Blessing is going to be a pain.
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Ernalda Feeds the Tribe also has its secrets, and they're interesting.
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The Lightbringer's Quest is the Orlanthi equivalent of Christmas, Easter and All Saint's Eve, all in one. It's so big that even the game splits it into six parts.
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Here's the first part, The Journey West, in which Orlanth gathers his fellowship.
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The Sea Journey is short, and describes the Lightbringers ride across the ocean on a giant sea turtle.
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The Luathela were more enemies of Orlanth, and after the Lightbringers beat them up some more, their queen let Orlanth pass into the Underworld.
Cool. What about other world phenomena where other cultures have different perspectives?
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The Underworld describes the trials and tribulations the Lightbringers faced, and their failures.
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Well, not quite a phenomena, but: >>29196062

The Luatha are known to other cultures. The Seshnegi know them as the Purple Giants who shattered their land at the end of the second age. They now roam the area in their giant boat, killing any human they encounter.
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Another different approach?

Well, okay, let's say the great darkness.

Everyone knows that Orlanth slew the Bright Emperor, sending him down to hell.

What about those already there?

The trolls, who had never seen light, or fire.
They see the sun as a monstrous entity of hate, who invaded their paradise and exiled them to this painful surface world.

So Orlanth is responsible for the Trolls being on the surface.
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Orlanth found Yelm in the underworld, and the two of them made a pact to fix the world.

>They now roam the area in their giant boat, killing any human they encounter.
Which, the Seshnegi or the Luatha?

So then Yelm is indirectly responsible for Cragspider roasting our noble explorers? What do you know, you really can blame everything on Yelm.
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The Luathans.

The Seshnegi can't fight an army of demigods (even if it's just 40 of them. They can unmake things with a song)

The Seshnegi are Malkioni, worshippers of Malkion "the god of sorcery". They believe that Orlanth is nothing more than simply a giant air elemental.
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The Cosmic Compromise spawned a goddess who was key to defeating the Devil, as told in The Ritual of the Net.
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We Are All Us, silly Heortlings. Bend the knee to the Seven Mothers , and we'll give you some of that beautiful red dye for your wife's dresses!
Otherwise, you get the Bat.
Orlanth is basically a big dumb jock , who relies heavily on advisors and women to think for him.
The whole greater Darkness is a consequence of his poor impulse control , lust, and ambition.
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The Lightbringer's Quest has a Disney movie ending, in The Return.

>They believe that Orlanth is nothing more than simply a giant air elemental.
Holy shit, they must have balls made of titanium.

Didn't I read somewhere that Axe Trance and Great Parry could let a Babeester Gor initiate beat the bat?

Phrased differently, those are all Orlanthi virtues.
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We now leave the mythic age and come to History, although it's still exaggerated and mythologized. But this is Glorantha, so I'd not claim it never happened exactly like the stories say it did.
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I, Zzabur shall reveal that my errant brother Worlat was not the slayer of Ehilm, the true being of the Sun.

For I, Zzabur confronted Ehilm with his claim of purity and showed his make up to be gross matter, like all the Elementals. Ehilm was humbled and I, Zzabur commanded his deluded followers to Separate him into his constituent elemental parts.

When I, Zzabur ended the Age of Ice, I, Zzabur commanded all the elemental forces to humble themselves before the Law. When Ehilm did this, I, Zzabur rebuilt him. Ehilm was less than he was, but was able to light the world for you lesser mortals.
The Bat is crawling with giant ticks, as well as a cult of it's own worshippers. so unless that mere Initiate can survive a wave of disrupts and Firearrows, i doubt it.
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The Empire of Wyrm's Friends (EWF) was a mighty empire, but was destroyed by the dragonkin they claimed as friends. It serves as a warning to Orlanthi about what liking or trusting any dragon leads to.

If one of the people with setting knowledge is still around, what are the reasons given for the destruction of the EWF?

If you're still around, >>29196528 is the perfect example of the same event from a different cultural perspective. Gloranthan cultures all acknowledge the existence of the Great/Cosmic[adjective meaning great] Web, but they ascribe its creation to different entities. The Orlanthi version is described here >>29196364.

It's a reference to a much older version of Hero Quest, where those two abilities were grossly overpowered. I learned about it while researching information about Ernalda Feeds the Tribe.
Well, it's for the same reason that the Orlanthi believe Yelm is an evil emperor.

Similar figures in their mythologies. The Malkioni have a monotheistic view of the world and work their magic via understanding, rather than devotion.

Think about a society run by Lhankor Mhy or the dwarves.
I am, and thanks for pointing it out!
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We now come to times in recent memory. Kethaela and Heortland came under Pharaoh's sway, and our clan left for Dragon Pass.

So because the locals don't believe in Orlanth and haven't for long enough that it's become ingrained, Orlanth can't touch them?
From what i remember, Arkat dismantled the EWF after they gave birth to Nysalor/Gbaji.
The Dark Trolls helped him in revenge for Nysalor inflicting the Trollkin Curse on their women. Arkat had to commit ritual suicide, have his corpse mutilated to look trollish, and then be resurrected, just to gain their trust.
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For those who haven't had the pleasure of encountering Zzabur, he's a figure from western mythology and history who has his fingers in a lot of events over the course of the world. And claims to have been behind others.

Zzabur is the prototype for all wizards. Even his name means Wizard. He wrote several books of magic which taught people how to manipulate the world.

In Orlanthi terms he would be a god, but he views himself as merely a powerful being, albeit one who represents and controls a major part of the universe.

He is also an Atheist, who turned against his father, teacher and creator, a being known as Malkion the Lawgiver. Because Malkion claimed that the Laws were not everything, and that one needed to worship the Invisible God, creator of All.

Zzabur thought he was insane and betrayed, condemned, exiled and murdered him. (Or as he'd put it "Commanded the True Being of Death to Separate Malkion")

He is understandably not a popular figure amongst the followers of Malkion.
No, because the locals "understand that Orlanth is nothing more than a powerful elemental", they have many spells to turn away Orlanthi magics.

Just as the Orlanthi know that sorcerers are blaspheming soulless monsters who drain people's souls and have magic to turn away their sorcerous wizardry.
So I got an event about a kingdom in the far northwest. I sent people to explore and they found a dragonewt statue, but I decided to use it to bring doom upon a tribe I was feuding with.

Then the year ended and I was told that I had missed my chance. Did I fuck up?
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At the end, we have the story of the Early Settlements of Dragon Pass, Colymar and his clan in particular. This is the last bit of lore on the myth screen.

High class comedy. Thanks for the clarification.
You didn't go northwest enough. I'm pretty sure you just get a bonus if you make it, you don't get penalized for not going
Ah, okay.
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Bit of confusion there.

You tried to explore the part labeled here as "The Dragonnewt wilds".

You wanted to explore the far far northwest. More like the edge of the map area.
Well, each culture has their own point of view, and all of them can be seen as right.

And then the God Learners tried to explain everything and screwed things up.
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There's a morale penalty for not making it. Nothing permanently damaging though.

A warning against attempting a unified field theory, or just a precaution against building giant robots in a fantasy setting?
Can you ally with Dwarves?
Can you run KoDP in windowed mode?
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The rightmost button on the ring is the Saga button, and it bring up the roll of years. Every action you took, every omen or prophecy and every event is written out here. Here's where we'll be starting in the next full session, and on the right you can see a list of years that goes back to 1329 and clan Lore. The saga can also be found in a text file created alongside your save file.

We're actually ahead of schedule, Sartar wouldn't show up for another 100 years in the main timeline.

This is all I have planned for today, but feel free to keep asking questions.

Tragically, no, they aren't an Orlanthi clan. There are some few events involving them, but they keep to themselves mostly.

Yeah. Create a new shortcut, right click the shortcut, go to Properties, under the Shortcut tab add -w to the target box outside the quotes.
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In game? Well, you can get them reasonably friendly and trade with them.

In general? Depends on the Dwarf in question. The ones near Dragon Pass are reasonably friendly, if you don't steal their stuff. Further west? They're a bit less nice.
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Fuck is with the dwarf all the way on the left? Is that fucking radioactive lightning or something coming off him?
What's the western dwarves' deal?
That would be a dwarf of the Copper caste.

They're responsible for making simple tools like containers, pipes, and weapons. They made the first coins as a way to pass the time.
They are also responsible for ensuring the flow of magical energy from one conduit to another.

So yeah, magical electric radiation.
What are the different seasons supposed to be used for again?
Well, the center of conservative dwarves is there, one of the largest dwarven cities in Glorantha. They view Openhandism as a mistake, and think that teaching humans how to be helpful will lead to ruin. They were in a war with the communities of Greatway and Dwarf Run near Dragon Pass (naturally few humans noticed, as it took place underground), until the rise of the Red Moon convinced them that the openhandists weren't going to destroy the world.
They still don't agree with them though.

Sea - Planting
Fire - Raiding
Earth - Harvesting
Dark - Sitting close by the fire.
Storm - Blood and Thunder!
Sacred Time - Time to stop the world falling to bits.
In KoDP it's usually advised to use Sea season for trading and alliance making, Fire season is for raiding, Earth season for exploring and more trading, Dark season for sacrificing and heroquesting, and Storm season to wrap up unfinished business.

In Glorantha, >>29198367 has it right.
Now I see why KoDP programmers say that "translating will be problematic because of text volumes". And that's not even half of myths and texts, just main Orlanthian.
Also, where is that myths webpage with some of Eurmal stories? I liked the one about invisible and unstrikable by weapon monster in particular.
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Broos are nasty.
>Immune to disease because they worship a god of disease
>most carry one, including weird Gloranthan magical shit like the Creeping Crudd and the Shakes
>piss and shit on their weapons to make sure you get it if you get wounded
>Main goddess is goddess of rape
>broo only reproduce by rape
>either gender, any species with a butthole
>most have goat heads because goats are their favorite targets
Which means some badass broo held down a rhinoceros and buttfucked it.Thanks Dad.
That could be baby rhinoceros as well.
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askin for it
In other words, Orlanth barges into the council that rules the world rationally, and murders their leader to show off.

What an asshole. No wonder chaos tainted the world.
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What the actual fuck.
He's a barbarian storm god, you were expecting anything else?
So I missed the boat on the Guide to Glorantha kickstarter, anyone know when that thing will be available to buy?
Orlanth is almost entirely responsible for creating the Devil. If he hadn't offered Thed any boon for her rape, she wouldn't have chosen to become the goddess of rape. If he weren't so convinced that change was good, Malia would never create disease. If he weren't so in love with sex and violence, Ragnaglar would not have been allowed to become the Father of Chaos.

The Orlanthi faith, viewed from the outside, can be said to be all about dealing with the fallout of Orlanth's sins.

They just recently announced a delay. If you're really interested (and you should be), I recommend emailing and asking if they're taking pre-orders.
Bump for Gloranthan awesome
Ragnaglar being left alive was more about wanting to avoid kinstrife.

Still, part of the point of Orlanthi mythology is that Orlanth makes mistakes. And then fixes them.

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