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>>30394338
It is morning now and you watch rain drizzle against the tall glass window of the Hawkins spire. A mist hangs over the city far below you and you think it an odd reflection of the uncertainty ahead for the city. And yourself for that matter. Sipping at your coffee as you stand inside Sarah’s study, you can’t help but wonder if you truly know what you’ve gotten into.

Vitria is yours now, yet you do not know if you can call yourself an Emperor despite that. You ostensibly rule an entire nation, plus much of another, so it seems reasonable to do so, yet, you falter before making the final step. Sarah and Aaron will rule the city atop whatever structure you elect to place there, your doubts about the Tabeth whelp notwithstanding. You will stand over them governing the entire nation plus your own territory – really, Vitria is part of that and you make a mental note to cease making such a distinction. It is the perceptions of Vitria you worry about. Do they see you as a mere adventuring hero of sorts, who freed them from tyranny, or some such nonsense, but do not want you to rule? Will the other provinces want to be ruled by the city rather than Harrowmont?

You sigh and gulp down the last of your coffee, setting the mug aside. Your men are in control of the city now. Grandmaster Lucas informs you that the soldiers abroad have declared their allegiance to the city and whatever new ruler it may have – they see an end to the civil war no matter who won it. Aaron made contact this morning to let you know that the small Taour raiding force that crossed into Vale has been repelled – and you’ve confirmed with Count Argyle the existence of such a force. Given how small it was, you’re not certain Aaron needed to direct his whole force there, however.

>continued

>>30394368
The most troubling piece of news is that many of the nobles are massing in the Certam spire which serves as a great hall of sorts and is the traditional meeting place of the ruling council. It seems they wish to hear from whoever is now to rule. Whether to declare yourself an emperor here and now, or merely the ‘overseer’ of sorts for Vitria’s own rulers, is the question that has been hounding you since.

You’ll need to leave shortly if you wish to be there in a timely manner, but you still have time to seek the counsel of one or more of your companions. Most of them, barring your officers, are lurking nearby. Who do you wish to talk to?

>1. Undine
>2. Salamander
>3. Gnome
>4. Sarah
>5. Maloric
>6. Lynn

If you choose multiple, realise they’ll all be in the room with you and may not speak their full mind as a result.

>>30394382
>5. Maloric
I need some buddy-time, all this flirting has made me a bitch

>>30394382
At the risk of them not speaking their minds I'm going to have to go with:
>Sarah - who knows these people and is a solid social advisor
And
>Undine - who is our champion and a rather competent administrator.

I figure between them we should be able to game out all our options fairly well.

>>30394382
>4. Sarah
She's probably the most important given her local knowledge. I want her imput on the plan presented last thread:

Archduchy of Vitria organization:
Territories: Vitria, Vale, Temby, Craol
Population: 1,940,000
Ruling House: Hawkins (Archduchess Sarah Hawkens)
Great Houses: Tabeth, Argyle, Rorek
Ruling Cabinet: Sarah (archduchess), Aaron (chancellor), Argyle and Rorek, additional members appointed by the legislature, but assigned portfolios by Aaron and Sarah (and yes, there is a post or two specifically for people they don’t want)
Legislative branch: Unicameral legislature drawn from multiple sources with varying representation. House Hawkens has the most delegates, followed closely by Tabeth (Aaron has speakership of the legislature incidentally) with Argyle and Rorek in distant third. Other members of parliament include: Mages and Knightly orders, the two most powerful groups outside the four, the merchant guilds and other prominent “commoners”, a few for the more common commoners and the lesser houses.
Basically, the seats are proportioned to give pretty much everyone at least some buy in to the current system, while ensuring that as long as Sarah and Aaron get along they really shouldn’t have trouble getting their way 90% of the time (especially when you consider their alliance with Argyle and Blackstone).

>>30394382
Sarah

>>30394410
soon friend, but he doesn't seem the best choice for this situation.

>>30394441
this works, with their opinion on this plan >>30394453
Also, thank you for the most excellent birthday present.

>>30394382
>Sarah

>>30394453
Just a quick note on this plan - rather than voting wholesale on it, I'll be breaking it down a little bit, though I'll still gather Sarah's opinion on the most important parts of it.

>looks like Sarah is the advisor

>>30394540
On a side note, how are you doing OP? Sounded like things were a little hectic for you?

>>30394540
Yeah, its a broad strokes kinda plan anyway. I certainly didn't bother to count delegates or anything silly like that.

>>30394666
Just spent a fair bit of last weekend going over financials, investments etc. Left me a bit high-strung. Plus, I'm still doing 11-12 hour days at work.

>4. Sarah

You step out into the common room where everybody is in order to collect Sarah. Maloric is reading a large tome and making notes – a spellbook he’s picked up, you presume. Gnome’s playing a game of chess against Lynn and winning handily, though that might be because Lynn’s attention is on Sarah for the most part. Sarah’s currently finishing up with a rather extravagant dress and Undine and Sala are helping with some of the fiddly bits. While you wait for them to finish you lean over the back of Mal’s chair and knock him on the head. He gives you a glare.

“How long have they been at this for?” you ask your friend, tilting your head towards the trio of girls.

“Ever since you got the news about the nobles,” he replies testily. An hour then. You consider whether you should institute a rule in any court you’ll rule limiting the complexity of dresses anyone can wear – you can foresee meetings having to be delayed for rather silly reasons otherwise.

Finally, Sarah finishes up and flushes slightly with embarrassment as she spots you waiting. You indicate for her to follow you into the study, garnering a few odd looks from the others. Still, nobody questions you and the petite girl follows you obediently, if somewhat wobbly. Why she’s wearing such a complex dress when she’s having difficulty walking in a straight line is beyond you. Once inside you briefly explain your thoughts and ask her to go over an organisational structure you’ve been mulling (>>30394453).

>continued

>>30394915
She spends a fair bit of time thinking things over before responding very hesitantly, “I don’t think it will truly matter, Talon. The nobles might get a bit upset if you declare open rule over the city, but they don’t have the ability to oppose you. The populace at large likely won’t care what you call yourself – they look at the nobles with disdain for the most part.”

You snort. “So, if I keep the civilians happy I could call myself the God-Emperor of Mankind and they probably wouldn’t care.”

Sarah frowns a bit. “That’s a bit ostentatious as a title, but the point is there. As for the plan itself, I don’t see too much trouble there. It might be a good idea to have two chancellors, however. I’m not sure that leaving Aaron in charge would be a good idea.”

“Why would Aaron be ruling Vitria? That’s your role,” you say.

“Well, when I’m helping you with the empire-at-large it may be a bit hard to rule Vitria at the same time. I’ll try to be here as often as I can, but it would still make sense to have somebody loyal to the two of us with more reliability to temper Aaron.”

“You could just appoint a vassal in your stead,” you say.

She shakes her head. “They would need their own authority if they were to truly hold power. Perhaps a mage or military appointment? Or a council of three? I think Maloric needed to speak to you about something like that.”

You cock an eyebrow over that piece of news. Maloric’s never really cared about the ruling side of things.

>Anything to ask or say to Sarah?

>>30394453
This sounds pretty good, it establishes a political system which is broad enough to have legitimacy, yet narrow enough that we can rule these people without too much trouble.

Sarah will probably need to use our troops as her own for a while though, as she will need to rebuild her House militia.

Side note: I'm of the opinion that we can't simply declare ourselves Emperor, someone else with power needs to do it for us - otherwise we simply seem like a lucky warlord giving himself a royal pedigree. Is there a religious head who we can appeal to - similar to Charlemagne being crowned by the Pope?

>>30394933
Preemptively vetoing Neir getting a vote on the ruling board. Too many conflicts of interest.

>>30394992
Not much in the way of organised religion in Vitria, though there is a lot of general beliefs etc. Most of the general beliefs are usually something along the lines of the archangels being the messengers of God. Otherwise you could try to get approval from another religion or get the RSK to back you - they claim a form of divine right to rule via their magical blood, as thin as it tends to be.

>>30395026
I'll second this, smart move.

I like Sarah's suggestion of a broader ruling council.

>>30394992
Not really. Religions aren't as powerful in this setting IIRC.
>>30395026
Oh, agreed.
>>30394933
Maybe ask her a bit about the minor houses. We haven't had much interaction with them.

>>30395070
Hmm, right. Is there a single popular religion across the continent?

Also, was there a strong religious organisation in the former Darlesian kingdom?

>>30394933
>Anything else to ask or say to Sarah
Casually mention that as lovely as she looks, we might start helping with her selections again if only to give her an excuse to wear dresses that allow her to walk with grace and good balance. Especially given how much fun we had helping her last time.


Could someone clean that up please? I'm dealing with like three distractions over here.

>>30394992

I've always been of the opinion that the whole "Emperor" title would come in due time. Mostly a side note as it were. Imperator seems to work just fine as it stands and being a ruling body through that name doesn't put ourselves out their much but just enough.

>>30394933

I actually don't think so. I agree with her on Aaron, until proven otherwise. And if Mal has something to say, probably should get his word as well. Wouldn't mind calling him in with her.

>>30395106
Technically, the ruling cabinet had at least 4 members. Though separating head of parliament (or senate or whatever we want to call it) from head of royal council sounds like a good idea. (Give Aaron one and not the other.)
>>30395164
from the lorebin:
>For the most part, religion is not tremendously widespread amongst humanity. Or, more accurately, organised religion is not terribly widespread. Most people have beliefs, many of which are shared, about the origin of the world and the role of the fantastic beings that shape it so much more than humanity in general. These typically revolve around archangels, magic, the gods and sometimes the infernals.

>As for organised religion, there are only four of decent size. The Order of Malataine (which is also a nation); the Disciples of Theros; the Grand Church of the Maker (the 'Cult of Death', colloquially); the Gathering of Immortal Humanity (the 'Cult of Life', colloquially). Malataine is about pacifism and is very widespread (if not widely supported), though also maintains a powerful militant arm in its home city (see 2.8.). The Disciples of Theros worship the angels and believe the Barrier of Marie to be symbolic of their sacrifice as it was humanity's reckless pursuit of power that caused the monsters to emerge. The cults of death and life are as ancient as they are underrepresented - they date back to the Cataclysm, supposedly, and have a great deal of influence despite their small presence.

>>30395112
>Maybe ask her a bit about the minor houses. We haven't had much interaction with them.

Sarah shrugs. "Merchants and land-holders for the most part. Most of them have connections or are vassals to the larger houses, a mage tower or a knightly order. There are some larger minor houses such as House Argyle. House Yuril is probably the only one of note, and they own much of Port Temby. Also, you'll need to decide what you'll do with the former vassals of House Oaln - I'd suggest forgiveness but be a bit harsh on those who try to oppose you."

>>30395164
>>30395211
Darlesia, along with Vitria, has some chapels of the Order of Malataine (along with almost every city on the continent) though these aren't usually connected to the nation of the same name. Vitria also has small churches/chapels to the other three religions for travellers.

VOTE
>1. Call in Maloric and send Sarah out. You may be a little 'late' to the gathering.
>2. Call in Maloric but leave Sarah in the study. You may be a little 'late' to the gathering.
>3. Head to the gathering, and maybe talk to Mal on the way.
>4. Custom

>>30395288
>1. Call in Maloric and send Sarah out. You may be a little 'late' to the gathering.

>>30395288
>1. Call in Maloric and send Sarah out. You may be a little 'late' to the gathering.

>>30395288
>3.

>>30395288
>1. Call in Maloric and send Sarah out. You may be a little 'late' to the gathering.
He might have sensitive information, but have Sarah entertain the nobles, maybe with Udine in tow.

>>30395288
>1. Call in Maloric and send Sarah out. You may be a little 'late' to the gathering.

Being late doesn't bother me.

>>30395288
>1. Call in Maloric and send Sarah out. You may be a little 'late' to the gathering.
We are not at the beck and call of petty nobles, they can wait for us.

>>30395435
>>30395416
>>30395385
>>30395377
can we send Sarah ahead to distract them?

>>30395475
why not?

>>30395475
Sure, unless there's any opposition to the idea.

>>30395475

I'd personally like our first interaction with the them to be as the collective whole we've established. Anticipation may help some of the weaker willed fall in line as well with nervousness.

>>30395211
Hmm, thanks for the information. I guess the religious route is out - unless we want to form our own church, ha.

Maybe once word spreads of our ability to perform miracles (aka astral magic), we can claim divine right to rule based on our blood, similar to the RSK.

>>30395532
We can overcome this with a grand entrance.

>>30395580
i'm not a fan of making a cult, i prefer just going with military and spies since to take a province we just need to take 1-4 major locations.

>>30395614
>>30395580
plus there are beings that use astral magic and are worlds stronger than us.

>>30395288

>1. Call in Maloric and send Sarah out. You may be a little 'late' to the gathering

>>30395517
How come you haven't added the summon pastebin to the master pastebin?

>>30395475
Hmm, how would it be perceived if she entered on her own? I'd rather have her come in with our contingent.

>>30395829
we should still send some one then, maybe that guy who did jack shit.
Also what else is left to fix up at harrowmont?

>>30395829
Maybe she should walk in with four of our soldiers in HMK plate.

We shouldn't really trust these people, and this would also show that we're in charge.

>>30395798
You mean the bestiary? Or did I promise an extra pastebin? Either way, I haven't spent much time working on the quest lately, so the lorebin updates aren't done yet. I'll try to get them done tonight before starting the next thread.

>1. Sarah is still around, as there's some people wanting a grand entrance.

“Sarah, would you mind stepping out and asking Maloric to come in?” you ask her. “I have a feeling that what he wants to talk about isn’t something he wants to share widely.”

Sarah gives you a nod and a curtsy before stepping aside. She seems to have actively placed a formal mask over her feelings and you make a note not to break it by flirting with her. If she needs to speak at the gathering it will be best if she can do so calmly.

Maloric steps in and closes the door. He looks a little annoyed and you suspect it’s not from when you hit him earlier. You lean against the large oak table in the study, waiting for him to speak but instead he simply paces back and forth for a while.

“The hell is up, Mal? I hear you want to talk to me about some ruling council or something?” you ask after a while, fed up with his strange behaviour.

He gives you a dark look. “I met with Grand Magister Spoker last night, of the Pax Vitria tower. There seems to be some interesting ideas running through the heads of the mages in this city. There’s been some similar noises made by a few that came from the RSK, too.”

Pax Vitria is the largest mage tower in the city, you recall. Spoker’s a grand magister mostly by age, being almost one hundred years old, but that means he’ll be a wily bastard if not a powerful one. Still, the ‘ideas’ they have make you cautious, as you have an idea of what they might be.

>continued

>>30395916
good to know.

>>30395916
“Let me guess, Mal, they don’t want to merely partner with ruling houses, but want to be one?” you ask.

He lets out a harsh breath. “More or less. They’re hoping they’ll get their slice of the pie. Mages have always been honorary nobles, but just that – honorary. They want to have the same status and power.”

“So, they want to live in the Magi League,” you say.

“Hell no,” he says. “They don’t want to wage a ‘noble’ war against nobility and royalty. They want to join them. Spoker wants Pax Vitria to be on the same level as one of the ruling houses, and for each tower to be on the level of the other houses in terms of whatever power they’ll have in the future.”

You scratch your head. “They don’t even know that I’m keeping the ruling houses. And hell, if I do that I’ll have no choice but to do the same with the knightly orders or else I’ll anger them. Did he make threats about what he’d do if he didn’t get his way?”

“Not really, but then he doesn’t really need to actively voice them. If you want to keep growing your empire, Talon, you’re going to need the mages onside.”

You curse under your breath. Just what you need. Particularly as a few of your current mages are of the same mind. Maybe you should try to speak with Grand Magister Spoker or Grandmaster Lucas before addressing the nobles.

>Anything to ask Mal before heading to the gathering?

Oh, you once asked if we had come up with any new ideas for paths our power could take. I did come up with some interesting idea's for a potential water path. Between storms, and tidal waves, all the way to holy water, baptism and transubstantiation there are all sorts of interesting things you could justify.

>>30395798
Wait, now I remember. This is the pastebin with all the Champion's char sheets. I'll add that to the masterbin now and link it here for those who missed it.

http://pastebin.com/zr0asVhp

>>30395963
If you can connect a a philosophy or a characterisation of actions to this, it's something that can be done. Astral power reflects emotions and thought, rather than the other way around.

>>30395940
ask him if we can contact them right now through sending.

Instead of making all mage towers equal to a house can we group them all into a council with which each tower has a representative and make that council on equal footing with the strongest Houses? And then we can do the same with the fighter's guild.

>>30395940
What about a bribe...err...compromise? We make the grandmaster and his inner circle full nobles, with all of the assorted rights, but not the tower itself. The position will be inherited not by sons or daughters, but by the people who claim those positions upon the old owners death.

>>30396023
As they're likely at the gathering now, it might be difficult to do this as they probably won't have a sending device on hand. Normal sendings are more like emails or text messages - not really good for detailed communication or negotiation.

>>30395940
>>30395860
OUTSIDE THE WALLS [X] – this is immediate surroundings of the outer wall of the fortress, up to the cliffs. It is currently overgrown.
+ Inner courtyard [X] – The inner courtyard surrounds the keep, which is itself built into the cliff side. The entire courtyard is paved with flagstones, which are overgrown with moss and weeds, and many are missing making for a treacherous battlefield.
KEEP [X] – Harrowmont’s keep is a large, multi-level castle with many rooms and supply stores. The keep interior has been restored to a structurally safe state, but the outside is still in need of repair. The keep itself extends into the cliff.
+ Lower floors [X] – The lower floors include audience chambers, guard rooms and supply rooms for the most part. It is the working area of the keep. Most rooms are empty and dirty.
+ Upper floors [X] – the upper floors are where all the bedrooms and private hearing rooms are. Most rooms are empty and dirty.
Mostly cosmetic, but we can probrably add stuff here.
+ Noble manors [X] – the fortress has a dedicated area for three small manors, all of which are in ruin.
+ Underground [X] – vaults and supply stores lie under the keep. Not all of these areas are structurally sound. Bartom is currently working to fix any problems and build some additional extensions.
Can be fixed up.
Underground area finish date: July 15th, 1952 (Bartom only)

>>30396022
Fluidity and flexibility would probably describe the path of action I suppose. One moment a raging storm the next a calm blessing. Yin and yangish.

>>30396077
How about telling them to meet us personally after the meeting?

>>30396059
>>30396042
either of these can work for me.

>>30396126
Sounds good to me. Personally, I'm in favor of making Pax Vitria the fourth great house, but not a ruling house on the same plane as Sarah.

>>30396114
Hmm, I like that and can even see how to include it.

VOTE
>1. Try to meet with Grandmaster Lucas and Grand Magister before you address the gathering
>2. Try to talk with Grandmaster Lucas and Grand Magister at the gathering
>3. Meet with Grandmaster Lucas and Grand Magister after the gathering.
>4. Custom

>>30396187
3

>>30396187
>1

>>30396187
1

>>30396187
>3. Meet with Grandmaster Lucas and Grand Magister after the gathering.

>>30396187
>1. Try to meet with Grandmaster Lucas and Grand Magister before you address the gathering

>>30396187
3

>>30396187
> 1

>>30396277
>>30396250
>>30396223
I think we should talk to them first since we will be making a choice about the ruling houses and the like.

>>30396187
>3. Meet with Grandmaster Lucas and Grand Magister after the gathering.

>>30396187
1

I'm going to close votes here. I didn't think this would be so contested.

>1.

“Mal, can you let both Spoker and Lucas know that I want to meet with them before the gathering in a private room in the Certam spire?” you ask.

In short order, you gather your retinue and make a discreet entrance into the spire to meet with the two. You’ll make a grand entrance for the nobles later, but for now you have some negotiations to do. You decide to simply bring your existing retinue into the room, and find that Grandmaster Toren of the Golden Bears has wrangled his way into the room.

You take a seat around the large table they’re seated at and look over the representatives. Spoker looks older than you expected, but could easily pass as a fit fifty year-old man. Lucas and Toren are in formal dress rather than armour, but their forms are still rather imposing despite that. The knights and mage and on opposite sides of the table and you have a feeling they already know what this is about.

“So, Spoker,” you say, “why don’t you tell us openly what you’re interested in for the mages?”

The old man gives you a wry smile as he realises your plan. If he’s unwilling to back the mages with his bold wishes in front of both you and the knights, there’s no point in offering him anything.

“Very well, Imperator,” he says. “With the changing of the guard taking place among the nobility of Vitria, I wish for the mages to be properly represented. Although we are only four hundred in number overall, we add far more value to the city as a whole than many of the noble houses. I would like you to consider recognising our value to both the city and your future war effort by raising us to the same status as noble houses. Pax Vitria, of course, could represent all tower among any ruling council.”

There’s several moments of silence as everybody around you digests his words. Surprisingly, it’s Gnome who is the first to respond.

>continued

>>30396595
“You want this to be like the Magi League?” she asks suddenly, voicing the thoughts of many in the room.

“Hardly. I have no problems with nobility or royalty. I merely wish for mages to be properly recognised as such,” he says.

Nobody else says anything and you suspect the two grandmasters are waiting on your words. Lucas of the Black Stone knights looks thoughtful. Toren of the Golden Bears is unreadable and you damn his poker face to hell.

>1. Agree to his proposal, but go into more specifics
>2. Counter with the suggestion of amalgamating all mages into a single effective house
>3. Ask the grandmasters for their thoughts.
>4. Custom

>>30396622
2

>>30395940
I would like to point out that both mage towers and knightly orders are more worthy of being nobles then... well, nobles.
Having both as "houses" which swear fealty to us is AWESOME and was a dream of mine.

>>30396622
>3. Ask the grandmasters for their thoughts.
Let's not rush into things.

Ask them for their thoughts as of we want to hear all parties out, and not in the manner that we're looking for support on any decision we make. An Emperor has to be able to make decisions sometimes contrary to popular wishes.

>>30396622
>2. Counter with the suggestion of amalgamating all mages into a single effective house
>1. Agree to his proposal, but go into more specifics

>>30396622
> 3

>>30396622
>1
This should require only mild adjustments to our original plan. I don't want Pax Vitria to combine with the other towers, as that will create a "house" that will probably be more powerful than Hawkins, which is bad. Better to divide them.

>>30396622
>2. Counter with the suggestion of amalgamating all mages into a single effective house
Why would we WANT to do that? That makes all the mages a single unified super power.
It makes them more difficult to control and wrangle

I would actually prefer the opposite. Heck... rather then having his tower automatically in charge we could have the different towers VOTE on who is in charge from among them. With ability to change their support.

>>30396622

3.

could we set up a ruling council of three, one noble, one mage, one military (garrison or knight order)? Each group elect their representative for the council...

>>30396789
that could work

>>30396764
You should probably make more clear that you are voting against that. That said, I agree. Funnily enough, the Archduchy plan gives them like 90% of what they want.
>>30396789
>>30396799
Hell no. That weakens Sarah's power far too much.

>>30396831

I think the idea is Sarah is still the overall head, while the ruling council is her delegates and representatives when she is without.

>>30396655
replying to self here...

What if we actually said that any organization of sufficient power, mages, knights, merchant guilds, mercenary guilds, whatever... who can field sufficient power to contribute to our war efforts, and is willing to swear fealty, will be recognize as a noble house.

We are after all famous among our troops for being supportive of "troops rights" so to speak and ability to get promotions.

>>30396789
This would be a huge slap in the face to the nobles as it cuts their power by 1/3rd and is not actually necessary.
Noble houses can be subservient to other noble houses, if we recognizes the knightly orders and the mage towers as a type of noble houses then we allow them to be subservient or superior to other houses as their own power dictates.
Not to mention completely cuts off sarah's powerbase.

If they are "just another minor noble" they are a lot less of an issue than "you have 1/3rd vote of everything"

>>30396789
>>30396799
>Make Sarah only one of three leading figures, and only if she wins a vote
No.

>>30396868 replying to self
>What if we actually said that any organization of sufficient power, mages, knights, merchant guilds, mercenary guilds, whatever... who can field sufficient power to contribute to our war efforts, and is willing to swear fealty, will be recognize as a noble house.
To clarify further, this would also means that mage towers or knightly orders do NOT automatically receive a noble status.
Rather, we grant them individually to those who actually serve us. And revoke them if they fail to meet their duties.

>>30396862
Still far less elegant than that other proposal.

>>30396883
>>30396868
>>30396831
sarah would still be the ruler, but everyone else would be below her.

>>30396933
Still like the weighted parliament idea a lot better.

>>30396831

Sarah has literally implied that she wants a permanent position in our cabinet, but doing that and running Viteria is unfeasable... We could always assign her the title of 'Adjudicator' so that she ensures the competent and functional operation and leadership of Viteria, thusly still having authority over it, but also sufficient free reign to spend elongated periods of time in our cabinet...

>>30396933
1. what about aaron
2. if sarash is above the 3 of them, then what is their power?

>>30396964
Nope. I want her to rule the place.

>>30396964
Nah, She's the only one I really trust to rule the place. Plus, she deserves it.

>>30397007
she has said that she wants to be in our cabinet and even implied on leaving behind people to rule for her.
>>30396970
Equal to hers like we first agreed to it.

>>30397031
so you want to go against her wishes?

>>30397047
Oh, I know. I want her to be the formal ruler however. Also, I think your idea is just terrible.

>>30397064
Huh? Oh, no. I want her to be in the cabinet as well. If she wants to delegate a bunch of the ruling she can. Like Narhman did in the Safehold series for example.

>>30396906
Sounds good to me. No blanket granting of nobility, but rather on a case by case basis.

>>30397070
not my idea.

>>30397109
...Then why are you answering questions about the idea like you made it?

>3.

“Grandmasters, I would like to hear your thoughts on this,” you ask them. “You have as much a stake in this as anybody as both important figures for Vitria and representatives for all knights and soldiers in the city.”

Toren looks openly to Lucas, which you find odd. Lucas, at least, obliges you.

“I’m not opposed to the idea of the mage towers, rather than just those mages of noble lineage, having the same status as nobles. If you begin to recognise mage towers as more than just a group of nobles or people, and assign them power within the city, what would that mean for our orders?” Lucas says.

Toren grunts and then launches into his own minor tirade, “We’re beating around the bush here. In this room are the most important people in the city right now. Lucas and I represent the military, Spoker and Reegan the mages, Lady Hawkins the nobility and you rule the city by personal might. If we come to an agreement, the city will bend, whether the rest of the nobles like it or not. They want things to remain the same as much as possible, and Spoker’s proposition reflects that. But, how do you intend on the city being ruled, Imperator?”

>1. Reveal your intentions and discuss them here. [This will lead to votes on the structure and simplify later things]
>2. Decline revealing your hand and ask him his opinion on the mage towers becoming noble houses in status.
>3. Custom

>>30397146
>1. Reveal your intentions and discuss them here. [This will lead to votes on the structure and simplify later things]

I would like to point out that if we conquer taour and darlesia then we will need to place somewhere there. The nobles there are all thralls or vampires and have to be removed.
This means a huge amount of openings.
Future reorganizations will probably involve reorganizing vitria as well. Especially if ambitious groups within it support our war effort on the vampires

Aaron might prove himself useful in the battles against taour. Some other house might as well.
Ultimately we have to appoint a king/queen of darlesia, and king/queen of Taour. Plus nobles for the myriad taourian territories.

Although Darlesia's future king (under us) should probably be the leader of the current anti vampire resistance...
Unless we just rule darlesia directly and avoid mini powers... this actually might be a good idea.

There is no reason that parts of former vitria districts couldn't directly swear to us instead of swearing to vitria. Heck it can encourage lords to behave better if they know their vassals can just switch from them to us.

>>30397047
Sarah stated that she is sticking close to us and needs someone underneath her to be given true authority in vitria. Basically, one of her vassal houses needs to be raised to a great house... for example, they can replace house ooln itself.

>>30397146
1

>>30397146
>1. Reveal your intentions and discuss them here. [This will lead to votes on the structure and simplify later things]

>>30397146
>1. Reveal your intentions and discuss them here. [This will lead to votes on the structure and simplify later things]

This is the true meeting. Quit beating around the bush and let's get it going. The other noble gathering is just a farce where we will entertain trivial bullshit more than anything else.

>>30397146

>1

so we have 2 representatives from each group already? Excellent. that makes things much easier. Sarah and Aaron are the Noble representatives, Toren and Lucas are the Military representatives, and Spoker and Reegan are the Mage representatives...

Sarah will probably want to delegate her position to one of her subordinates while she serves in our cabinet...

>>30397146
what was the name of the mage tower that actually helped us?
If I am not mistaken this guy represents ANOTHER mage tower. This means he is asking (among other things) to be put over them, even though they were the ones who helped us take the city.

>>30397303
>Sarah will probably want to delegate her position to one of her subordinates while she serves in our cabinet...
That's not what she said. She said she wanted an additional someone in a position to delegate to when necessary. Not that she wanted to delegate the position of ruler of Vitria.

Okay, looks like we'll be deciding Vitria's structure now. I'll call a few votes in a single post shortly (about 10-15min). As there's been a lot of discussion already, I won't leave any extra time beyond this. I'll be adding Talon's thoughts to the decisions to give an idea of how I view the impacts.

I won't be revisiting this for a while, due to the amount of time it will take. Everything decided here will be taken to the noble gathering.

Main decisions will be around where Sarah sits, who are the main rulers (houses, delegates etc), where mages/orders fall, how much Vitria (the city) controls of the territory, and whether to declare yourself Emperor or what else.

>>30397303
Aaron's not immediately present.

>>30397342
Tower of Kassick. probably the tower most on the outer as it represents mage disciplines that aren't well looked upon.

>>30397371
so you will give in character dialogue before the choices or after one is chosen?

>>30397560
After. Talon's thoughts will be part of the vote, though and will alrgely represent the results.

If people don't mind this taking much longer, I'm happy to break up the vote with more dialogue, though.

>>30397662
i'm up for it.

>>30397662
I don't mind since this is an important decision, plus we can change it later on.

>>30397684
>>30397717
Alright then. I may also use this structure as a template for future cities that can be tweaked as necessary.

>>30397755
how far is mal on his anti-thrall research?
Also what other research projects are going on right now?(we should organize this)

>>30397662
More dialog is good.

Also, I'd like to prompt our cabinet to express their views and tell us if we are being silly before we actually do something. Promise not to be insulted.

ps. am I the only one worried about the RSK v Magi war and how each side will take whatever we decide?
>RSK: They gave nobility to mages? Sounds like they are siding with the magi!

>>30397791
You've been a bit busy and not much time has passed, so not much movement yet.

>>30397804
>ps. am I the only one worried about the RSK v Magi war and how each side will take whatever we decide?

That was one of the side-effects.

>>30397804
we at near beginning said fuck em both, and didn't want to ally with either of them since they both are ass hole rulers.

>>30397791
>how far is mal on his anti-thrall research?
We wanted anti thrall research, but I don't remember it being assigned specifically to mal. Is he even a specialist in that field? Regardless we have several full magi towers now. So we should have an entire TEAM of specialists working on it.

Also, a potentially good way to draw more mages to our harromont tower is to make it one of the of the noble towers.

>>30397849
Yes, but we don't want them to become outright hostile.

>>30397849

Wasn't it more to do with not wanting to burn any bridges before we needed them?
Also, pissing off RSK will end our plan to save Nial from the suicide position under the bastard meat-grinder general...

>>30397875
>but I don't remember it being assigned
he got hooked on it and we told him to go work on it since we knew it would distract him from his other work, also i don't think we had set them to research anything as of yet.
>>30397875
>Also, a potentially good way to draw more mages to our harromont tower is to make it one of the of the noble towers.
I like the idea, but i want there to be a way to test them since its at our capital.plus we don't know what the source does to people at the castle.

>>30397908
it was more to do, with that we won't rely on them and will come to face them when the time comes.
>>30397875
>become outright hostile.
True, but you can't please every one.

>3.

“Very well, then let me lay out what I’m thinking of and we can come to agreement that will determine the city’s future,” you say.

SARAH’S POSITION

“Vitria itself will become an archduchy under my larger rule. The city will be the centre of this, but it’s important to note that the provinces under the archduchy still owe fealty to me. Sarah will rule as Archduchess of the city and may also serve as a member of my cabinet, meaning she may have to delegate authority. At the moment, I was considering Aaron Tabeth for the position given his current position as General of Tembin.”

Toren blinks at the news of Aaron having unseated Habell, the first breach of his poker face since the meeting started. Lucas frowns when you mention Aaron, though, but before he can speak Sarah says her bit.

“It’s not ‘may’, it’s ‘will,’” Sarah says. “I would again recommend that there be several delegates, not just Aaron.”

Lucas nods. “That may be for the best. Aaron is not of the mind to have such power just yet. Still, why do you not wish to rule Vitria directly, Lady Hawkins? That was always your mother’s aim. I feel you could add much more to the city if you were to be here all the time.”

“Vitria is not merely its own city or territory now, Grandmaster Lucas,” Sarah replies. “It is part of something much greater. I will still rule and guide Vitria as I have always wished to, but I cannot pass up the chance to represent Vitria in the bigger picture.”

Toren nods vigorously at that and gives his assent. “The Golden Bears will also be happy to assist you with your work, Imperator.”

>continued

>>30397875
Putting Sarah as the ruler will probably pacify both of them. She's both a noble and a highly talented mage.

So, about the emperor thing.
By definition we are now one. but a very small one. (we are the emperor of micro kingdoms)

The thing is, emperor is a nobility thing. But Imperator is a title that also belonged to some emperors of the past. Specifically Military General Emperors.

I say we stick with Imperator. Its in a way emperor+
But at the same time the focus is on the military general. Honestly, I don't want Talon to even get stuck up on titles too much

>>30397948
>True, but you can't please every one.
But you CAN avoid prematurely going to war with one of the world's super powers.

>>30397998
Spoker looks a bit odd, but as he looks thoughtfully at Maloric you suspect it’s about something else.

Sarah’s position will be…

>1. Sarah will be a token ruler of the city but spend most of her time helping you with the empire at large.
Not strictly what Sarah wants, but you feel she wouldn’t be too opposed. This will ensure she’s always on hand to help you with larger issues and will limit the need for another cabinet member to help there, but will leave Vitria in the hands of others who are less reliable.
>2. Sarah will be the overall ruler of the city, with special powers akin to a modern day president, but will often delegate authority as she helps you with the empire.
This appears to be what Sarah wants, but you’ll need another cabinet member to fill in the gaps while she’s away and you’ll need to determine who to delegate power to when she’s away from Vitria.
>3. Sarah will be the dedicated ruler of the city and help you very little with the empire.
This will annoy Sarah a bit, even as it sticks strictly to your agreement with her. It will guarantee strong control of the city so long as Sarah is on your side.

>>30398020
>2. Sarah will be the overall ruler of the city, with special powers akin to a modern day president, but will often delegate authority as she helps you with the empire.

>>30398020
2

>>30398020
>2.
I see no good reason at this time to renege or twist our prior arrangement with Sarah.

After all, a good emperor knows when to be loyal to his own subjects, and when to betray their interests.

>>30398020
>2. Sarah will be the overall ruler of the city, with special powers akin to a modern day president, but will often delegate authority as she helps you with the empire.

>>30398020
I think 3 is right out.
Having a tough time choosing between 1 and 2.
Leaning towards 2 since this is what she wants. And she can always transition from 2 towards 1 later on as/if needed.

>>30398013
>avoid prematurely going to war with one
this won't cause them to attack us, they are already at war.

>2.

“Although Sarah’s rule will be important to Vitria, and she will be more than a token ruler for that matter, her skills are invaluable to me,” you say. “That leaves the matter of the delegates, however.

“I mentioned Aaron as Sarah’s delegate earlier. My current thoughts are that the rest of the ruling cabinet will be made up of several of the ruling houses. Before I can touch on that matter, comes where the mage towers and knightly orders fall.”

Spoker pays attention to you once more as you invite additional input. Toren shrugs, his opinion clearly not that different to Lucas’ – or maybe he simply doesn’t care.

Sarah says, “The other noble houses won’t like it, but it may be for the best, Imperator. The difference between a noble house and a mage tower or order is thin. After all, individual knights and mages can form houses and have representation under the old system – it’s just that the order or tower has no real status beyond under-the-table deals.”

Gnome adds, “No matter what decision is made here, the greater powers will see it in their own way. That includes the Mage Guard, who will likely violently oppose any attempt to grant noble status to the mage towers. The historical reason behind mages only being honorary nobles, unlike knights who are actual nobles, is that the Mage Guard inquisitors were opposed.”

“I would worry more about the RSK’s opinion of things than the Mage Guard’s,” Mal adds bitterly. “They won’t take kindly to such a decision.”

>continued

>>30398241
“Of course,” Spoker adds, “if you elevate the knightly orders alongside us, that may take the sting out of such an approach.”

Your decision is…

>1. Let all major organisations, including towers and orders, have the status of a noble house with the permission of the city’s ruler.
This goes a bit beyond what they’re requesting and may annoy the knights a bit as they won’t be so special, but it may make some things such as Ranger Orders easier. The RSK won’t be as unhappy with you either as you’re not favouring mages.
>2. Give the towers and orders specific status that is not open to other organisations as yet.
This will make both sides happy at the expense of granting them more power and upsetting the RSK by granting the mages special status.
>3. Let the towers and orders have a council representing them in aggregate which has the status of a noble house.
This won’t make them too happy, but will avoid offending the RSK too much. It does run the risk of granting them more power than they would have separately though.
>4. Refuse the status request
The mages would be upset and you may find it difficult to get their assistance.

>>30398263
>1. Let all major organisations, including towers and orders, have the status of a noble house with the permission of the city’s ruler.

>>30398241
>Gnome adds, “No matter what decision is made here, the greater powers will see it in their own way. That includes the Mage Guard, who will likely violently oppose any attempt to grant noble status to the mage towers. The historical reason behind mages only being honorary nobles, unlike knights who are actual nobles, is that the Mage Guard inquisitors were opposed.”
>“I would worry more about the RSK’s opinion of things than the Mage Guard’s,” Mal adds bitterly. “They won’t take kindly to such a decision.”
Suggestion...
We will promise nobility to them, BUT, not immediate.
Explaining further, we point out that our goal is to conquer taour, then expand north and conquer the territory directly north of of us. At that point we will have a border with the mage guard, and also be 2/3rd the size of the mage guard instead of 1/6th their size.
Only at that point will we suddenly reveal our position, at which point we expect the mage guard to attack us.

>>30398263
>1. Let all major organisations, including towers and orders, have the status of a noble house with the permission of the city’s ruler.
You had me at ranger Order, plus this can get the battle warriors order going as well.

>>30398263
>1. Let all major organisations, including towers and orders, have the status of a noble house with the permission of the city’s ruler.

>>30398263
>1. Let all major organisations, including towers and orders, have the status of a noble house with the permission of the city’s ruler.

>>30398263
>1. Let all major organisations, including towers and orders, have the status of a noble house with the permission of the city’s ruler.


As a side note: add in an addendum that recognition of additional houses other than the initial ones that spring up will have to be delegated to a future discussion.

>>30398353
Ah, so you want recognition of noble houses themselves to be at Sarah's discretion and not just other organisations?

>>30398263
1

>>30398387
Is it possible to revive the battle order?

>>30398426
You mean Felix's order? There's nothing that really stops you - you can grant nobility to whoever you please.

>>30398387
Not that guy, but I am in favor of that.

Give individual recognition rather then a blanket recognition to all mages or all knights. This also increases their prestige.

And require that whomever gets it, knights, mages, mercenary guild, ranger order... that whomever gets it must publicly declare some sort of contribution to the national defense (eg, pledge support vs taour)

>>30398447
ah good, since i like the idea of making an elite order that is under our rule, with Felix being the head of it.

>>30398387
It would give us a finer modicum of control over affairs in vitra. Since any up and coming would be nobles after this affair would be interested in appeasing our establishment.

It also cuts down on the hate we will get from our neighbors as they will see it as a one time unique organization or two that pop up instead of long time noble status recognition. And if not seen as such we can bluff to them that it is.

This would, in time, let us have our cake and eat it while not pissing off the folks here of current.

>>30398466
The only problem with felix is that he likes a good challenge so we can't pair him up with too many good people if we send him to control an army, since he would decide that 1 general is good enough and ends up joining the fight himself.like we do sometimes

>>30398466
+1
of course, we have to further convince him of that. :)

>>30398447

I have this feeling that in the not-too-distant future, noble titles are going to be worth piss-all because of our actions here today.

Whatevs. Right now it's a grandiose way to glorify the bureaucracy. Once we start raising the average standard of living, *there won't be a need* to glorify it.

>>30398263
>1. Let all major organisations, including towers and orders, have the status of a noble house with the permission of the city’s ruler.

>>30398515
that just means we have to send him towards tougher opponents. and the continent is full of tougher opponents.

>>30398466
Sure why not.

>1.

“As a compromise,” you say, to Spoker’s narrowed eyes, “I will change the rules of having House status to be available to any major organisation or noble with the approval of the city’s ruler. That would be Sarah or her delegate.”

Lucas frowns. “Any order? Isn’t that unnecessarily broad?”

“On the contrary, I think it’s exactly as broad as it needs to be,” Spoker says. “This avoids arguments over where merchant’s guilds fall, for instance.”

You feel Spoker’s support is a bit fake, but if he’s happy with your decision you won’t complain. The knights will fight out of duty but the mages can make things very difficult if they’re unhappy.

“As I mentioned earlier, the decision over what composition the ruling cabinet will have is still here. I was thinking that there would be such a cabinet whose composition would be chosen by Sarah.”

“I still worry over having a delegate without true authority,” Sarah says. “A council of three, which includes Aaron, that acts as my delegate when I am away would be suitable atop the ruling cabinet.”

“Or,” Undine says, “could we not set aside positions in the ruling cabinet for knightly orders and mage towers? Aaron won’t be the ruler of the city, just someone with status. The ruling cabinet could offset his lack of experience.”

“Then how is the representative chosen?” Toren asks. “Member size? Because that will still create all manner of problems. The Golden Bears are the largest knightly order, even after our losses, but we do not desire such a position and other orders do not want us as representatives.”

“Voting,” you say offhandedly. “Have the mages and knights chose the representative themselves.”

Spoker chuckles at that. “Is that not the same thing?”

>continued

>>30398627
You shrug. “Who is to say the largest tower will have the necessary votes? After all, it’s not like they would have half the total members and if they did, surely they would be the best representative in the ruling cabinet by default then.”

Your decision is…

>1. Ruling cabinet as chosen by the ruler of the city (aka Sarah) like in >>30394453. Sarah may have a delegate from her house to fill in for her.
May become unrepresentative where Sarah is away for long periods of time given Aaron’s influence.

>2. A representative council that sits below Sarah but above any ruling cabinet. The council would take Aaron’s role and also act as Sarah’s delegate and consist of one noble, one mage and one military representative. Sarah would have veto of any of their decisions.
This would temper Aaron’s influence, but is going back on the spirit of the deal you made with him.

>3. Ruling cabinet as in Option 1 but have specified positions for knightly orders and mage towers, where the representative is chosen by a vote by all members of said orders and towers.
A middle-of-the-road option, but may cause discontent amongst the orders and mage towers.

>>30398661
>2. A representative council that sits below Sarah but above any ruling cabinet. The council would take Aaron’s role and also act as Sarah’s delegate and consist of one noble, one mage and one military representative. Sarah would have veto of any of their decisions.

>>30398661
>CUSTOM
>1. but with popular ratification

>Sarah chooses the ruling cabinet
>each member is ratified(approved) by their appropriate constituency
>in case of disapproval, Sarah simply chooses another one.

>>30398661
>2. A representative council that sits below Sarah but above any ruling cabinet. The council would take Aaron’s role and also act as Sarah’s delegate and consist of one noble, one mage and one military representative. Sarah would have veto of any of their decisions.
1, leaves too much power to Aaron, and 3 is asking for back ground alliances and bribes to happen, plus we don't really care about his feelings on the matter.

>>30398776
I forgot to add that it 2 still keeps the deal, while 3 breaks it.

>>30398661
>>2. A representative council that sits below Sarah but above any ruling cabinet. The council would take Aaron’s role and also act as Sarah’s delegate and consist of one noble, one mage and one military representative. Sarah would have veto of any of their decisions.
>This would temper Aaron’s influence, but is going back on the spirit of the deal you made with him.

That nigga was useless, he should be grateful we're giving him this much.

>>30398661
>2. A representative council that sits below Sarah but above any ruling cabinet. The council would take Aaron’s role and also act as Sarah’s delegate and consist of one noble, one mage and one military representative. Sarah would have veto of any of their decisions.

>>30398661
4. council with more than just 3 voters. Make it the council of noble houses with high, middle, and low nobles.
SPECIFIC mage towers or knightly orders are recognized as specific levels of nobility and must maintain that position by maintaining good relationship with us.
To begin with it will be granted to specific towers. But it can change in the future. And its open to non towers, get a few guilds in there too.

We are not grating mages at large authority, we are granting specific towers position.

>>30398844
>Make it the council of noble houses with high, middle, and low nobles.
And by that i mean they have different degrees of authority

>We are not grating mages at large authority, we are granting specific towers position.
Also, this means we expect their actual support in our endeavors, this means research vampires, and war efforts

>>30398661
>2. A representative council that sits below Sarah but above any ruling cabinet. The council would take Aaron’s role and also act as Sarah’s delegate and consist of one noble, one mage and one military representative. Sarah would have veto of any of their decisions.

>>30398661
what is sarah's take on this?

>>30398844
I like that idea

>>30398996
She favours her idea over Undine's, but still prefers Undine's over the standard cabinet.

>>30399029
which one is which?

>>30399040
Sarah - Option 2
Undine - Option 3

>>30398661
>This would temper Aaron’s influence, but is going back on the spirit of the deal you made with him.
problem with this, aaron just took over as the general of our border with taour. He might actually be competent. And it is a shame to waste him, also I don't like going back on our word

>1. Ruling cabinet as chosen by the ruler of the city (aka Sarah) like in >>30394453. Sarah may have a delegate from her house to fill in for her.
May become unrepresentative where Sarah is away for long periods of time given Aaron’s influence.
Surely there are ways to temper this without outright going back on our deal

>2.

“I believe the council delegate idea would work best,” you say. “The representatives can be chosen by Sarah, though Aaron will need to be the initial noble representative in order not to renege on my deal with him. When Sarah is away, the council will represent her position to the ruling cabinet which will also contain a direct delegate of Sarah’s from her house.”

You receive a round of nods from that, and note that Toren in particular seems happier with that. No surprise there, he seems to favour anything that centralises power in the capable.

The next issue is a personal one: whether to declare yourself emperor or not. The title itself is merely symbolic, but what is important is what you state to the populace. Right now, from talking and listening, you appear to be viewed as a large scale equivalent to the wandering hero. You have an army and personal might and are uniting everybody in a grand alliance. Not really your intention in the grand scheme of things, even if it does avoid the debates and complaints surrounding sovereignty and nationality.

If you declare yourself undisputed ruler of the city and its territory and Sarah to be your regent, you will likely stir up opposition. The longer you wait, however, the more opposition you will face, even if you will be in a better position. Even so, it appears those that matter, which largely consists of your cabinet and the others in this room, already know what your ambitions are.

The decision then is whether to make open to the public your ambitions or to continue to let them envisage whatever they feel is best. This decision won’t matter here but instead when you go to address the gathered nobles shortly.

>1. Declare yourself emperor of Vitria (does not necessitate a title change)
>2. Talk mostly about how you will continue to ‘assist and monitor’ Sarah

>>30399205
>1. Declare yourself emperor of Vitria (does not necessitate a title change)
I rather not be faced with a civil war down the line.

>>30399205
>2

>>30399205
>1

>>30399205
Oh, I seem to have misunderstood the whole issue then.

I would like to hear the cabinet's views on this.

>>30399264
here,
>>30399300
I second this notion.

>>30399300
Do you want to bring it up in front of the Vitrian reps here or just with your personal cabinet (i.e. excluding the two grandmasters and the grand magister)?

>>30399205
>1. Declare yourself emperor of Vitria (does not necessitate a title change)

Let's not make any illusion of what we want here. The sooner people start thinking of us as an Emperor the better.

>>30399205
>3. Declare yourself Grand Protector of Vitria

We provide security for the people, and having this gives us a middle step to jump up to Emperor later on.

We need greater legitimacy and a good reason (I.e. Divine blood), to adopt an imperial title. We will adopt it eventually, just not now.

>>30399407
>We need greater legitimacy and a good reason (I.e. Divine blood)
No, emperor means "king of kings".
A ruler who controls multiple kingdom. Divine heritage is irrelevant here and does not provide any legitimacy, only raw power. Especially because the so called "Gods" are widely known to be human sorcerer's who ascended via a magical ritual rather then a creator being.

I don't understand the problem with being viewed as the "wandering hero".

Talon seems to have changed a bit even over the course of this quest, his dealings with people and suddenly being vested with power to protect and serve them has really shown he's a true leader, the way this is going the whole Emperor thing sounds like it is ruling with an iron fist.

>>30399205
>1. Declare yourself emperor of Vitria (does not necessitate a title change)

I still want to keep Imperator though, it's cooler and probably less common.

>>30399330
Mmmm... not sure. Go ahead and include them.

>>30399498
Declare ourselves imperator? :)
"It means I am general first, ruler second." eh?

>>30399471
That is a somewhat good point

Do remember that whatever conspires here will end up in the ears of the RSK and Magi League.

I doubt they will sit pretty and quiet if they hear that we have become an emperor...

>>30399471
>I don't understand the problem with being viewed as the "wandering hero".

The difference is mostly that being a 'wandering hero general' means they don't actually view you as ruler, but merely a protector or military power that intervenes to stop problems. By declaring yourself ruler/emperor, you become the ruler openly at the risk of people not wanting you to be one. Whether you rule with an iron fist is another matter, which you could do no matter the decision made here.

>I'll put up a bit of dialogue around the decision and probably call a second vote on it

>>30399549
they know we became one anyways.
And remember neir said that as soon as we take vitria she arranges for us to be recognizd as a foreign power. The prerequisite of which is taking out an existing recognized power (vitria).

This is more of an issue of how much sovernity Vitria has.
Is vitria a vassal nation to talon's empire. Or is it an "independent" ally which knows that we will take out corrupt rulers.
This also affect how the man on the street views us

>>30399205
1


captcha: ascending wnigge

>>30399594

I was of the impression Talon has viewed as a ruler/leader type already. At least in Mier and the others. Is this specifically for Vitria then? or is it overall?

>>30399596
I like the Sovereign Monarch method used in Safehold. Essentially, Sarah is the ruler of the Archduchy of Vitria, which is a component part of our larger empire.

>>30399205
>1. Declare yourself emperor of Vitria (does not necessitate a title change)

>>30399686
I thought that is how empires work in general

>>30399639
Vitria, but it will affect overall perception. Some of the Darlesian territories probably view you as possibly acting to restore Darlesia and will view what you say here through that lens.

>More information

“The next decision is a personal one, really,” you say. “You all know or have a pretty good idea of my ambitions and it wasn’t to save Vitria from Oaln or save the world from evil. It’s to rule and to make something better for people, including my soldiers. Right now, it strikes me that people don’t believe that of me. I’m a wandering hero general, not a ruler.”

“And you wonder how Vitria will react if you disabuse them of the notion,” Spoker says. “That’s simple – the nobles will get uppity, we mages and knights won’t care as we’re not as blinded as they are, and the general populace will judge you for your actions”

Sarah nods but Undine has something to add, “You might need to decide where you fall in terms of royalty, however. If you declare yourself overall ruler, the Magi League will want to know whether that means you are creating a new royal line. The RSK might want to take advantage of that, too.”

“It will also change how Farun will act towards you,” Lucas says, to your surprise. “They’ll likely be upset over your militancy if you declare yourself ruler but not royalty.”

“If you don’t challenge their perception now,” Toren says, “then they will continue to view you as a protector and may see you as a usurper if you reveal differently in the future.”

>continued

>>30399821
“Or, if you find a suitable justification, maybe it will make things easier,” Gnome says. “Ultimately, I think the matter is yours to decide, Talon. You have the power to succeed no matter the route you take.”

You…

>1. Openly declare yourself the outright ruler of all of your territory, including Vitria. You change your title to Emperor.
>2. Openly declare yourself the outright ruler of all of your territory, including Vitria. You keep the title of Imperator.
>3. Declare yourself to be the protector of Vitria and don’t challenge the preconceived notions many have of you.

Final vote. Votes will automatically close 10min after this post.

Also, if you have any other matters to raise before the noble gathering, raise them now. Felix, Aaron and Harrowmont matters will take place after that (and probably next thread).

>>30399756
Depends a lot. That particular method is notable for having a few (4 specifically) extremely powerful "nobles" who are actually princes (or kings or grand dukes) who rule a large territory (which used to be an independent country under their rule). The main difference between it and normal empires is a heavy focus on improving and assimilating the newly conquered territory rather than simply looting it to improve the home countries economy. There is a much stronger distinction between the conquerors and the conquered in a normal empire.

>>30399858
>2. Openly declare yourself the outright ruler of all of your territory, including Vitria. You keep the title of Imperator.

>>30399858
>2. Openly declare yourself the outright ruler of all of your territory, including Vitria. You keep the title of Imperator.

>>30399858
>1. Openly declare yourself the outright ruler of all of your territory, including Vitria. You change your title to Emperor.

>>30399821
>the Magi League will want to know whether that means you are creating a new royal line.
>The RSK might want to take advantage of that, too.”
>Farun likely be upset over your militancy if you declare yourself ruler but not royalty.”
ouch... mmm... any chance that we can drag them along with a "I haven't decided yet"?

>>30399999
You don't need to make this decision immediately, it's just a heads up you'll be confronted over it at some point in the future.

>>30399858
>2. Openly declare yourself the outright ruler of all of your territory, including Vitria. You keep the title of Imperator.

>>30399858
it occurs to me that we can declare ourselves "protector" and never outright declare ourselves ruler. Keep it as an open secret.
Works doubly well if we have a bunch of kids inherit position of the various kingdoms under us eventually.

This also raises the question of how open we are about our relationship with sarah.

>>30399999
The longer we wait to declare, the more people will be upset. Thats why I voted to unequivocally declare our intent to rule now, while the stakes are relatively low.

>>30400115
you misunderstand, I am saying what if we declare ourselves emperor, but string RSK and Magi Guild on whether or not we are founding a new royal bloodline or not.

It is a totally meaningless distinction that basically will piss off those who are pro divine mandate (farun, RSK) or those who are anti divine mandate (Magi League)

An advantage of being a "protector" is that if what we establish fails, we can sweep in and remove the systems WE put in place and put in new systems without taking ANY blame.
But if we are openly ruling then any bungle up and suffering of the people will be placed squarely on our shoulders.

>>30400150
that is basically option 2.

>2.

You make the internal decision that you’ll declare yourself the ruler of your territory, to hell with their preconceived notions. With that decision made, you dismiss the meeting and gather your retinue for your entrance.

>1. Powerful entrance. Enter the hall with your full retinue plus several of your heavy mage-knights. You’ll certainly make an impression, even if it reinforces the military side of your rule.
>2. Grand entrance. Enter the hall with your retinue with an open announcement of your arrival to all the present nobles. The openness of your rule will be obvious, but you’ll also appear more like ‘one of them’ to the nobles.
>3. Sneaky entrance. You’re already in the spire, so you can easily get to one of the large balconies overseeing the hall and begin to address them before they even know you’re here. It avoids appearing militaristic whilst making it clear you are not one of these nobles and don’t intend to play their games.
>4. Custom entrance.

The scene after this will be long-ish. If you have any write-in stuff for a speech or things you want me to touch on, let me know. I'm reworking this a bit to take into account the fact the planned votes have already been made in the meeting.

>>30400190
yea, aspirational explain in >>30400027
that it doesn't mean we have to immediately make this decision. Just that if we DO declare ourselves emperor/imperator, then this question HAS to be answered at some point in the future

I am really reminded of parson from erfworld saying how everyone but him is insane. (because they keep on doing tactically unsound things out of posturing, and religious beliefs in titanic mandate to royals, titanic mandate via tool ownership (which he INVENTED to destabilize the prior group) and Fate mandate)

>>30400229
>3. Sneaky entrance. You’re already in the spire, so you can easily get to one of the large balconies overseeing the hall and begin to address them before they even know you’re here. It avoids appearing militaristic whilst making it clear you are not one of these nobles and don’t intend to play their games.
don't want to seem like a dictator or a noblemen.

>>30400229
>3. Sneaky entrance. You’re already in the spire, so you can easily get to one of the large balconies overseeing the hall and begin to address them before they even know you’re here. It avoids appearing militaristic whilst making it clear you are not one of these nobles and don’t intend to play their games.
No one can corner the dorner...I mean Talon.

>>30400229
>1.
When was the last time we did anything for our soldiers? We keep on talking about how we want a better life for them, and advancement.
We really should figure out how we intend to do this at some point. And ultimately, we are a soldier first.

>>30400229
>3

>>30400229
>1

>>30400229
4. Carrying Sarah bridal style into congress, finishing with a kiss and "our new home, darling"
.. to clarify, this is a joke. Don't actually do this!

>>30400294
>>30400322
1 makes us out to be a dictator, and has 2 negative effects.
-nobles
-the people
2 makes us out as being one of them
+nobles
-peasants
3 has us be a wild card
+peasants
-nobles

>>30400410
that only views nobles and peasants.
There are also: soldiers, knights, mages
to consider.

>>30400410
How are the commoners going to know the exact specifics and social implications of our entrance to the noble moot?
It basically boils down to "insult nobles" or "respect nobles".

>>30400229
>2
best option

It's been long enough to go with 3 now. Still taking any write-ins for how you'll address the nobles.

>>30400497
they will here of this since news spreads fast.

>>30400294
changing this to 2
but please include some of our top military commanders with us and introduce them with fanfare instead of just having them as silent soldiers.
Also, bring the mage and knight reps with your retinue.

>>30400534
Since when are commoners allowed in the noble's moot?

>>30400559
servants will always over hear conversations and i doubt the part/meeting has no servants present.

>>30399892

Yeah empires have a lot of differing systems. The Chinese and the early roman empire where very different from each other let alone Persia and Macedon.

>>30400229

I'd honestly go for a fusion of one and two. Something to say "don't fuck with me." But at the same time seem similar enough to a noble that they will think of us as just a superior noble.

>>30400758
so, we are now at
3 votes for 3 >>30400251 >>30400267 >>30400320
2 votes for blend 1 & 2 >>30400537 >>30400758
1 vote for 1 >>30400322
1 vote for 2 >>30400500

Which is sort of like a tie.

and we forgot to ask advice of retinue again

>>30400885
I called votes here: >>30400528 due to how long the scene would take to write.

>3.

Striding quickly through the corridors of the Certam spire, you find yourself at the rear entrance of a large platform that overlooks the main hall. Several of your men are standing guard outside the door, careful not to be visible from the inside of the hall by anybody from another balcony. You give them a quick salute as you walk past them and your retinue follows. General Arail and a couple of your officers are lounging around in formal dress, and you note that the platform is large enough to fit twenty people comfortable.

The hall itself follows a similar trend, as bright golden beams trail down from the ceiling several storeys above you. As the source of the beams move around the ceiling in seemingly random patterns, illuminating the hall itself, innumerable torches line the walls down to the floor. Leaning over the balcony, you note that the drop is several storeys and you’re higher than most of the other platforms and balconies surrounding this circular hall. Hundreds of nobles in fancy dress mill about below, picking at tables of food and drink. It seems that despite the chaos, there’s no difficulty supplying a gathering like this.

Empowering your voice you address the gathered nobles, “Noblemen and women, I am Imperator Talon York.”

The bustle of the hall quickly ceases and you find yourself with hundreds of face looking up at you from the floor and balconies. Your retinue, including the grandmasters and the grand magister, flank you. There’s no small number of your men by the entrances, unarmoured but bearing weapons. With their attention gathered, you seize the initiative and let them know exactly how things will be from now on.

>continued

“I am Imperator Talon York,” you repeat, “and as many of you already know I have broken House Oaln and deposed both Viktor Oaln and Robert Tabeth. With the assistance of both Houses Hawkins and Tabeth, and the blessing of House Rorek, I have ended the civil war of Vitria. I have prevented Viktor Oaln’s plot to sell Vitria out to the Seraphs in exchange for title. I have prevented the opportunistic seizure of Vitria by Taour during your moment of weakness.

“I have already engaged in talks with Lady Hawkins, Lord Tabeth, Grandmasters Toren and Lucas and Grand Magister Spoker.” You gesture to each person in turn, except for Aaron who is not present. “With their support, I will be extending my title of Imperator over Vitria but I will not rule you directly. Lady Hawkins will become Archduchess of Vitria which will stand as its own archduchy in my lands. Vitria will still be Vitria, even as it part of something much greater. As you saw with the weakness the recent war brought, it is not enough to try to stand on your own against external threats. I seek to restore Vitria to its true and rightful glory, to bring it together with Darlesia and Taour as one mighty empire.”

The floor below is growing in volume and you fall silent and stare down at them, waiting for someone to speak. This continues for several minutes before the floor once again falls silent. You are about to resume when –

“What does this mean for us?” shouts somebody, a servant, oddly enough.

>continued

Smiling, you answer, “It means that you won’t need to worry of vampires enslaving you. Of the Seraphs turning you into fodder for their war against the mages. Of being forced into battle with your kin. There will be no more civil war, even as I return control of the city to the ruling houses with some adjustment. I will crush any person, any house, that feels they can challenge the peace and prosperity I seek to restore to Vitria.”

You briefly go through the addition of the knightly orders and mage towers to the ranks of the noble houses and the new structure of the system Then, as you are about to turn over to Sarah, the nobles quelled, somebody shouts, “What gives you the right to rule? I have noble blood, commoner! Why should you rule me?”

The speaker is a nobleman, his face red and his bushy mustache bristling. His wife, you assume, tries to calm him but he ignores her. You can fob him off, give a general answer or claim something dramatic.

>How do you respond?

>>30400965
I don't know what to do or say, but i want to some how make him feel like an ant, and lucky that we are even allowing such cowards to still be around after we asked for their help earlier.

>>30400965

If Latin existed here I would be so tempted to scream "Vae victis. MOTHERFUCKER!!"

>>30400965
I am torn between a bout of laughter (rolling on the floor even) and then not even dignifying this with a response.

To claiming something heroic about how its about time someone cleaned up the corruption which almost cost the people everything, the people who you are supposed to protect. Noblesse obligae and all that.

>>30400965
"What have you done - for Vitria?"

>>30400965

These two.

>>30401134
>>30401122

Laugh at him, then question him.

>>30401122
>>30401134
this is an EXCELLENT finisher
>To claiming something heroic about how its about time someone cleaned up the corruption which almost cost the people everything, the people who you are supposed to protect. Noblesse obligae and all that.
Maybe better phrasing
>My willingness and ability to save the people from death in a protracted civil war, saving them from becoming vampire livestock, and saving them from being slaughtered as disposable fodder for the magi-RSK war. Noblesse oblige. What have you done - for Vitria?

>>30401180
>>30401224
Laughing is a bit much for my taste, but i do like the idea of questioning and putting him down a notch.

>>30401180
As the person who wrote the laughter response, I should clarify that the reason I said I was torn is because LAUGHING at the concept of blood nobility will set us up pretty badly with the RSK.
I am extremely tempted to do so. But it would be an act that makes no sense politically while being extremely enjoyable. It would not be the right international message we want to send the RSK at this point in time (later on when we are too big, yes).

>>30401224
I completely bungled up the formatting of that post due to moving some senteances around.

My point was that we should actually say
>My willingness and ability to save the people from death in a protracted civil war, saving them from becoming vampire livestock, and saving them from being slaughtered as disposable fodder for the magi-RSK war. Noblesse oblige. What have you done - for Vitria?

Which is inspired by blending
>>30401122
>>30401134
minus the laughing

>>30401314
>My willingness and ability to save the people from death in a protracted civil war
rather then "from death" make it "from ruin". there was, after all, the complete grinding to a halt of all trade, in a coastal merchant city that is BAD.

>>30401314
If he doesn't back down after this, let's challenge him to try and take Vitria from us, right here and now. That'll force the reality of this situation on him.

>>30401314

Pretty much this. Ask him exactly what he has done lately when everything was collapsing.

Laughter bubbles up and bursts from your mouth uncontrollably. The hall falls silent apart from the echoes of your mirth. Your chest begins to ache as you try to bring yourself under control. To be questioned by such a fop after that speech. Did he simply stand there, bristling with anger

“What have I done to rule? Did you listen to me? Or did you merely stand there, shaking with anger, uncomprehending of my words. Perhaps it was my willingness and ability to save the people from ruin in a protracted civil war, or saving them from becoming vampire livestock, or saving them from being slaughtered as disposable fodder for the magi-RSK war. Or maybe it was all three. Soldiers fought me under my leadership. I forged alliances and agreements with nobles greater than you.

“What have you done for Vitria?” you say, casting your hand towards him, singling him out. “Beyond being born and merely blessing us with the joy of your ‘noble blood’? To be a noble and to rule is more than just existing, as the Seraphs regularly demonstrate.

“I say again, nobleman, what have you done for Vitria?”

You stand there, arm outstretched, palm open, inviting his response. Silence rises from the crowd as they are wary of attracting your attention. Your gaze remains fixed on the noble as he looks around for support. There is none to be found, of course, as the nobles here aren’t foolish enough to openly oppose you. Eventually, he fixes his gaze on the ground and it doesn’t raise. You pull your arm back in the end, disappointed that he couldn’t amuse you a little more with a response.

“Ladies and gentlemen, I bid you good day. I have a number of important matters to consider. If you have something to raise with me, I suggest you see one of my officers or one of the aforementioned ruling houses and they will help you.”

>continued

>>30401398
That is a bit too much, unless he is REALLY stepping out of line.
it will all depends on how far he pushes and how he goes on about it

>>30401448
Turning on your heel you exit as quickly as you arrived, slipping out of the spire unnoticed. Lucas, Toren and Spoker let you know they’ll speak to the towers and orders as you return to the Hawkins spire. Certam spire isn’t really set-up for work as much as meeting and gatherings, so you’ll use Sarah’s resources instead.

Slipping into one of the plush chairs in the common room near the study, you notice that at some point all of your retinue has split off to go elsewhere in the tower except…

>1. Undine
>2. Lynn
>3. Gnome
>4. Maloric

No custom choice here. I'll be doing a very short scene here, which may continue tomorrow, before ending the thread at 11pm EST.

>>30401469
>4. Maloric

File: 1393039371696.jpg-(78 KB, 639x595, Manly tears.jpg)

78 KB JPG

>>30401448
Glorious

>>30401469
>4. Maloric

>>30401469
>4. Maloric

>>30401469
>4. Maloric

>>30401469
>4. Maloric
Gotta hang with our main bro more.

>>30401469
>1. Undine

>>30401469
>1. Undine

>>30401469
>4. Maloric

>All those mal votes
Did we ever apologize to him for... well, anything?
For example, saying we didn't actually mean to break his nose last time, it was meant to be a friendly tap.

... actually, what is the story about us throwing him off a cliff

>>30401665

Mal and tals friendship seems to be of my old friends type. The type in which you don't apologize for nothing other then fucking the others girl.

Other then that all bets are off.

>>30401665
...clearly you do not understand our friendship with Mal if you're asking about whether we've apologized for any of the shit we've pulled, or he's apologized for any of the irrational fears he's inflicted upon us.

Short answer: No, and he'd start questioning our friendship and his safety in our presence if we did.

>>30401665
It more like a deep friendship bordering on being brothers.

>>30401719
>>30401722
>>30401728
Huh.
Thank you for clarifying

>4.

Maloric flops down in one of the other chairs across the coffee table. He’s probably feeling a bit stressed and tired, particularly with the mage issue that he brought up.

“Pretty grandiose speech back there,” he says. “Feeling the power a bit?”

“I’m rich and powerful now,” you say. “I’m allowed to act like it.”

“Rich?” he says, snorting. “You’re powerful, but I’d stop there. I have more money than you.”

“Sure, but you don’t have your hand in the tax take of an nation.”

Mal freezes. “You’re not supposed to do that?”

“Sure I am. I rule. Whatever I elect to spend the taxes on is up to me. I was thinking of turning Harrowmont into a gigantic castle made of diamond,” you say jokingly.

“Why? So you can blind your enemies instead of fight them?” he asks, and the two of you chuckle a bit. “So, what do you think you’ll do next?”

“Well, Farun’s on my radar. Gnome thinks there may be something important to learn about there,” you say, hedging about the reason why. “Taour’s still a problem and Vitria’s not in the greatest shape. Plenty of decisions.”

Mal frowns. “What are you interested in Farun for? I’d wager that conquering Taour is more important than that tiny royal city.”

“I wouldn’t be conquering it. Not yet,” you answer, trying to decide whether to let him know about your astral power.

>1. Let him in on it.
>2. Keep it a secret for now and continue to make small talk.
>3. Keep it a secret for now and get his advice on where to go from here.

>>30401779
>1. Let him in on it.

>>30401779
>2. Keep it a secret for now and continue to make small talk.

Not that I don't trust him. But just in case something like a memory screwing spell happens we should avoid letting anyone know about the astral power.

That was actually a pretty good speech there, especially that part about RSK.

Left ambiguous, so that the audience doesn't know whether they're an example of good, capable nobles, or useless slobs, or both, or neither

>>30401779
>1. Let him in on it.
Make him promise not to tell anyone, not even his girl.

>>30401779
>1
This is Mal, we have no reason to keep anything secret from him.

>>30401779
>1. Let him in on it.

>>30401817
it won't be secret for long actually, and mal is pretty powerful himself.

>>30401779
1

>>30401779
>1. Let him in on it.
We don't keep that shit from our main bro!

>>30401779
>>1. Let him in on it.

>>30401779
Whatever we pick, don't forget to ask him about the research into reversing thrallhood!

>>30401916
Honestly, I want a major focus of all the mage towers under our control to be vampires.

How to kill vamps
How to turn them back human (or at least neuter them to not consume human blood (animal blood is ok) and not be able to enthral; which would allow defection of vampires, such as those turned against their will)
How to reverse thraldom
How to detect vamps
How to detect thralls
How to detect daywalkers
How to kill daywalkers more effectively.
An AoE spell to incapacitate or kill thralls which doesn't harm non thralls. etc.

Breakthroughs in any of those can really turn the tide of war for us.
Of course, it shouldn't be their ONLY focus, since there are still all the human armies for us to fight and further enemies in the future to face.

>>30401916
Oh yea, forgot about that. supporting

>1.

“Mal, you know how I mentioned the weird things I’ve been able to do lately and how I think the Source has something do with them?” you say.

“Not this again,” Mal says, sighing.

“Oh, I realise it’s not the Source. Gnome’s pretty damned certain I’m using astral power and always have been.”

Mal stares at you. “Gnome thinks that? Why the hell would she think that? It should be obvious if you’re throwing around astral power.”

“And it is. To her at least,” you say.

“Gnome, for all her power, is no more capable of sensing magic than I am,” he says. “Come on, Talon. You’ve done some impressive stuff lately, but what tips this over into demigod territory?”

Hesitating, you decide to tell him about the dragon. He doesn’t take the news well.

“You were the reason the dragon essentially disintegrated? That’s… alright, let’s say I take your word for it. Why aren’t you just wandering around reducing armies to dust?” he says, incredulous.

“That was a one-time thing,” you explain. “I don’t think I can repeat it.”

You go into a bit more detail about your abilities and your friend slowly comes to terms with it, though he’s thinking hard.

“So, you’re going to Farun to visit the monk temple, right?” he asks. “Why don’t you just call some attention to yourself and get some answers from somebody powerful? Like an archangel. Not really sure who else can help.”

>continued

>>30402084
“Because then I have to consider the possibility of said archangel trying to murder me,” you say flatly.

“Yeah, but you’ll always need to deal with that,” he says blithely. “I think it’ll be a while before you’re in a position to stop it and they’ll likely find out about you beforehand. I mean, if you keep raising the dead and whatnot.”

You click your tongue but can’t think of a good rejoinder beyond ‘too risky.’ You move onto a different topic, “How is the research into the thralls going?”

“Not really my area. The journeymen have already burnt through one of the thralls, unfortunately – the vegetable general went under the strain. Haven’t really found anything, other than they weren’t able to reverse the vegetative state.”

You banter a bit with him about his research, though it hasn’t really gone anywhere with how active you’ve been lately, dragging him around to help you fight. Maybe it would be a good idea to give him somewhere to sit, but then again, it might not be completely necessary with all the additional mages available, even if you do need to negotiate with them to get them to do your research.

>That’s the thread.

Next thread is tomorrow (22nd) at 5pm EST. It will be a little longer than this one. I’ll be covering some stuff such as the new military and the additional mages and resources (like the machinist and magitech).

I’ll be back in a few hours and I’ll answer any questions then if the thread is still alive.

So, I was thinking strategy.

We have 2 front lines with Taour.

Craol and Vale are fortified against Taour invasion, and border Raupe, taours massive blood farm and the most heavily fortified Taour location aside from the capital itself.

Olmm borders Darlesia and Crece. With Darlesia mage towers being in revolt against the vampires last we checked, they might have since fallen, or maybe still resist.

Crece is a natural wall with 2 entrances, both fortified.

So, we should mobilize as much as we can from vitria towards the two borders. "Fight the Vampire Menace" style.

Now, for the actual strategy:
1. Boost Vale and Craol troop counts somewhat and have some blustering on the border, maybe a raid or two on the blood shipments to draw attention to that border and the fortifications on it.
2. Meanwhile we personally liberate Darlesia ASAP.
3. Depending on how Taour mobilizes their troops, we either Take Crece via Gnome (tunnel into creece fortress town via the mines it has, from the mines in lmm, through Marnn). Or if they leave Taour capital undefended to deal with our forces bothering Raupe then we tunnel straight to Taour capital, sack it, and kill their 6 daywalker ruling council

>>30402095
Mal raises a good point.
What we need to do, is to personally befriend an individual archangel, and then make them our confidant on the issue.

>>30402343
how about having gnome dig a tunnle through Marrn, while we keep taour distracted.

>>30402401
Befriended sentient genocide engine, check!

>>30403405
They are sapient after all.
Heck, some of them go around having kids with humans (their angelic ancestry is what gives the Royal Seraphi Kingdom royals their mystical powers)

>>30403253
Basically the idea in step #3 :). Wide enough to march an army through

Only question is from where to where.
Could be into one of the two creece fortresses (the one which has mines inside the town fortress)
Could be right up to their capital.

>>30403432
>(their angelic ancestry is what gives the Royal Seraphi Kingdom royals their mystical powers)
I don't think I've said that? I can't find any mention of it in the archives, either, but if I have said it I wouldn't mind you pointing out where.

In any case, the main thing to note is that there aren't any regular angels around anymore. They all vanished a couple of centuries ago. Just the archangels, to your knowledge, and they're probably a bit different to the run-of-the-mill types. Given that Samael is missing, probably the only one you could even attempt to contact would be Raphael, who is obviously quite militant.

>>30404685
Well, since we're on the topic of archangels anyway, to what extent do the remaining ones posses free will and to what extent are their actions governed by their maker's intent?

>>30404783
Gnome says, "The archangels are independent beings with free will and no small amount of intelligence. The degree to which they use that is another matter, in my opinion. They do have some very strange values however, and although they can appear friendly or charismatic they view the world very narrowly. You either fit in that view, or you don't, and they'll excise you if you don't given the first opportunity. At the same time, they're also pragmatic - they've let no small number of villains or evil loose in the world if they think it will serve their ends, even if it results in widespread death or destruction. They value Order, or some bizarre interpretation of the word, on top of their domains such as Life or Death.

"Samael is the more reasonable one. Raphael is..." she hesitates, choosing her words very carefully, "incapable or unwilling of empathy of any kind. As for their makers, that is, so far as I know, existence itself. The archangels create angels but I'm not sure who or what creates the archangels, if anything."

>>30404977
"What creates elementals like yourself?"

>>30405226
The world itself, or the natural processes of magic, depending on how you look at it. I mentioned in a previous thread (which I can't find) but new elementals are occasionally created whenever existing ones are bound by mages or die or they otherwise just appear every so often. Places like Undine's lake create water elementals, for instance (including Undine).

>>30405296
>>30403491
>>30403253
can gnome do this?

>>30405336
Theoretically, yes, but it might take a fair while. SHe needs to make the tunnel a decent size, make it structurally safe, avoid anything such as old Dwarven cities infested with god knows what and she would need longer rest periods as she's quite far away from the Source. I would need to be a bit of research and calculations to determine the actual time, but it would (probably) be at least 10 days per half-mile of tunnel and it'd be a few miles of tunnel she'd need to dig.

>>30405296
So how does that make the four sisters?

>>30405453
Silly me, the previous mention I was looking for was in the lorebin.

This section from it should answer your question, I hope.

>Undine says: "Pure elementals are the most powerful and rare type of elemental. There are only three or four pure elementals of the four main elements alive at any one time (this excludes myself, as I am not truly connected to the land now). The world itself, through the flows of magical energy, tries to have at least one unbound elemental of each type to stabilise the connection between the magical and physical planes. This means that as elementals perish or are bound by mages as familiars, the world will create new pure elementals a necessary.

>"Furthermore, elementals have 'siblings' - though the nature of our creation means this is not the most accurate term. When creating new elementals, they are usually anchored to previously existing elementals of a different type (with earth elementals typically coming first). This anchoring ensures a fast maturation of new elementals. Anchoring can only involve one of each type and should one of the anchors perish, a replacement cannot be made. This means new elementals are occasionally create without anchoring, and they can take decades to mature."

>>30405508
Ah, got it. Thanks.

>>30405451
so lets say if we had her get help from the earth elemental, and maybe her sister/mages.

>>30404685
I don't remember where exactly you said it, I will have to look
But the mystical power I refer to is "cannot be killed unless they wronged someone". And in lorebin we have
>It was he who ordered the genocide of the Farloun, believing that he had somehow wronged the entire race and that any one of them could circumvent his divine protections.

Then again, maybe I misunderstood and angels magically granted them this ability rather then them getting said ability by being descended from angels.