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>>40135907
Date: Midnight on June 5th, 1955PC

>Following on from the scene at the end of last thread, where Talon decided he didn’t want to ride Sylvian as a dragon but instead wanted his own wings

You dismiss the waiting pair of dragons momentarily, instead focusing internally. The chance to show your true capabilities has finally emerged and all of that time you and Mal have spent spitballing about shit you can do with your astral powers will finally become useful.

You will grow wings and fly like an eagle.

It’s all about the image. That was the conclusion you had come to. All of your astral powers worked like that, so why would your wings be different? They might not be built-in like angels supposedly had but the idea of being an existence that could fly close to heaven was as strong an image as you could imagine. Your muscles tensed as you focused your energy, power building up within you. Like a coiled spring you wound yourself up, ready to unleash all of your power at once.

[DC18 Flight]

Anyway, some housekeeping. After this scene is finished, it will be a dedicated numbers thread. It will probably be a little different to usual, mostly because it’s a longer timeskip (6 years) and my poor pacing and other problems meant some of the little scenes and decisions never really took place as intended. So instead I’ll be tackling the following problems in this order:

Expenses, specifically soldier wages
Taxes, specifically property and trade taxes
Reconstruction after the siege
Military structure
Shropham issues
Daerfir issues
Research
Vampire integration
Construction (inc. Harrowmont)
Foundries/Military Recruitment

If there’s anything else, probably best to bring it up now so I can slot it in.

Rolled 11 (1d20)

>>40135921
Dice gods pls.

Rolled 11 (1d20)

>>40135921

Rolled 5 (1d20)

>>40135921

Rolled 3 (1d20)

>>40135921
Fuck you dice gods.

Rolled 1 (1d20)

>>40135921

>>40136039
To Late!

>>40135921
Didn't we roll last thread?

>>40136078
Nope. Posting Died

>>40136078
posting died at the end of the last thread and the last roll for the wings was a 11 anyway

>>40135921
Burn FR point!

We should jump off a cliff

The life or death situation should supercharge Talons instincts

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>>40135921
Mages/Summoners
New Towers
New Units?
Griffins?

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>>40136078
No, 4chan went down and didn't come back up for several hours.

>>40136214
Really?

>>40136214
I'll second that

>>40136252
No.

>>40136252
Yes
No
Maybe
I don't know
Can you repeat the question?

>>40136252
No

>>40136252
Yes really, ill burn the hell out if one of our 4 FR points for the GLORIOUS POWER OF FLIGHT

>>40136252
Nope.

>>40136252
No

>>40136252
Guys cmon really i think its worth it. We'll still have 3 left

>>40136252
Gods no. Crash and burn.

>>40136252
Hmmm. It would actually be really useful but i guess we could just get it later or work on it during the timeskip maybe? So no need to burn FR point for it at this point. We could always use more mobility both in and out of combat.

>>40136329
>>40136316
>>40136297
>>40136260
I bet you guys are really fun at parties

>>40136342
With our luck, we'll probably need all 4.

>>40136367
Really, why not? Anons tell me why

>>40136366
Honestly I would suggest trying to go for things to test Talons speed out instead. Because it's still 4 right now.

>>40136394
with flight we literally become superman

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>Target not met. No FR point

On the one hand, you didn’t grow wings and fly. On the other hand, if Sylvian’s claw had impacted you from a slightly different direction you probably could have said you had flown.

You glare at Sylvian, or attempt to given your awkward position. One of her massive claws had slammed into you and was pinning you to the ground, having disrupted your attempt to use your astral power to grow wings. Lynn watches the two of you with a wide-eyed expression while the helldragon merely gives you what you suspect to be an exasperated look.

“You’re not an angel, Talon. You’ll hurt yourself if you try to do something like that,” Sylvian says with a huff, her projected voice seeming to echo off the walls. “None of the Lords or their knights can fly and I suspect there’s a good reason for that. Even the Fae are incapable of such a feat – astral flight appears to be the sole domain of the angels. Plus, you’ll make Raphael upset if you get your own pair of wings.”

Trying to remove the claw from your back doesn’t really work. You’d thought it before but Sylvian really was far too huge – you wonder whether you would be able to block a blow from one of her massive claws in combat. Probably better to just dodge. After some time and arguing you instead apologies and she removes her appendage, letting you stand.

“Say, is Lairos as big as you are?” you ask, your thoughts having drifted to the size of these ancient dragons.

>continued

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>>40136464
Out of the corner of your eye you catch Caitlyn stiffen slightly, her mouth making an ‘O’ shape. Syl’s eyes briefly flicker to the natural-born feldragon with her black wings, claws and tail and you swear she’s grinning, though it’s a rather terrifying picture with those teeth of hers. Each was as big as you were.

“Lairos is bigger, as you’d expect of a musclehead type. I’m rather large, even for… my age,” Syl says, trying to neatly avoid referring to herself as an ancient dragon. “The only other members of the greater draconic race of similar longevity are smaller than myself.”

You think on that for a minute or so, ignoring the way that Syl slowly herds you towards her head with her claws. You’re also thinking on Lynn’s reaction, as she plays with a nearby rock with her feet, distracted. You…

>1. Leave the topic of Lynn’s father out of this for now and just go flying
>2. Ask Lynn about her father, hoping that she’ll mention it’s Lairos now
>3. Confront Lynn about her father being Lairos rather than Tylarne
>4. Custom

Next update will be the last of the scene, then it'll be other exciting things.

>>40136494
>3. Confront Lynn about her father being Lairos rather than Tylarne

WHATS.THE.WORST.THAT.CAN.POSSIBLY.HAPPEN?

>>40136494
>>2. Ask Lynn about her father, hoping that she’ll mention it’s Lairos now

>>40136494
3

I had completely forgotten we hadn't resolved that yet

>>40136494
>2. Ask Lynn about her father, hoping that she’ll mention it’s Lairos now
Though I thought it was mentioned way back when that we were going to talk to her about it. Eh, we never did it onscreen.

>>40136494

>2. Ask Lynn about her father, hoping that she’ll mention it’s Lairos now

>>40136494
>4. Just flat out say you know Lynn is related to Lairos and don't really care.


No need to go around in circles anymore.

>>40136494
>3. Confront Lynn about her father being Lairos rather than Tylarne
Anons you totally disappointed me back there

>>40136494
>3. Confront Lynn about her father being Lairos rather than Tylarne
>It makes no difference for us, who your father is, you know.

>>40136494
>3. Confront Lynn about her father being Lairos rather than Tylarne¨
The sublimity of a wreaking ball crashing into your living room.

>>40136699
Pretty much. When you honestly get down into it having Lynn being related may just give Talon some leverage to keep Lairos from trying to eat him due to having 2-3 of the guys most hated foes in one spot.

>>40136725
>2-3 of the guys most hated foes in one spot.
Whose those 2 or 3 goys?

>>40136494
WE COULD BE FLYING RIGHT NOW LIKE THE ANGELS YOU TOOLS

>>40136755
>Sylivan
>Rayza

>>40136761
>Implying we don't spend half of our free time over the timeskip practicing instead of lewding

>>40136835
Anon that's madness, there would be riots.

>>40136835
Why not both?

>You have gained strength 7 due to practicing with Taira.

>>40136835
>implying that was ever discussed at any point
>implying we'll get another chance to learn to make majestic ass astral wings

>>40136835
aspirational I think there's call to add flying lessons to our to do list

>>40136888
>Wanting wings
>Being a sissy flying man
>Instead of MANLY digger man.

>>40136761
We'll work on it in the future anon. We.Will.Fly. And fuck Sylvian. Literally.

>>40136968
I thought we already did, along with Alyce. Back when the Dice gods intervened in the hotsprings.

Popping in with something before I go out for the night. Have some names for the inevitable children Talon is going to have soon. I'm assuming they'll take their surname from their mother, being Sarah, and picked names with more omph behind them but all with a smaller nickname for fathering purposes.

Male
>Maximilian
>Sebastien
>Alexandre

Female
>Sophia
>Isabella
>Anastasia

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>>40136761
The FR point would have gotten you closer to the permanent ability but wouldn't have given it to you. As Syl implied, getting flight as an astral power user is hard for certain reasons. Even Saareg mostly just teleports around as he needs to despite having a stupidly OP ability that would otherwise let him fly.

>3.

“I suppose while we’re on this topic, I should probably clear this up. Lynn,” you say, getting the attention of your waifish grandmaster. “I know your father is Lairos, not Tylarne like you told me years ago. It makes no difference to me, so don’t act like that. It could even be a positive as I’m expecting the Wardragon to come around and try to melt my keep any day now because Rayza and Sylvian are here.”

While Caitlyn looks at you in shock, Syl nearly knocks you over with a blast of her air, projected magically from her head.

“As much as that great oaf might hate me and a royal dragon, he hasn’t fought me for centuries. He burns his reserves every decade or so and then goes back to sleep whereas I use my full power every few centuries. I could end him if he was foolish enough to engage us here, particularly as it would be hard to retreat with yourself, your elementals and the fox empress here to hold him,” Sylvian explains proudly, almost preening in her draconic form.

“Um, as interesting as that is, can we not talk about casually killing my father,” Caitlyn says, frowning. “He’s a bit…”

“Stupid?” Syl suggests.

“Yes. But that doesn’t mean he’s not my father. He promised to give me a birthday present once he woke up. Something about the destruction of my enemies,” she says.

>continued

>>40137028
We should name them Bob and Bobba.

>>40136930
Dwarf detected

>>40137008
I helped with that
I rolled the 20 at the end that got us laid

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>>40137059
“Next time we’re in trouble, I’ll ask you to send off a ‘please help me, daddy’ message then,” you say. “And what do you mean that he blows his power every decade? I didn’t think magic works like that.”

“Being in this form is a double-edged sword. I could fight any of the Lords or an Archangel one-on-one as I am now but the cost is immense,” Sylvian explains. “Dragons with lesser reserves like your dear royal dragon might need a week for every day they’re active in their true form but as you get older our ability to project power increases exponentially, but not our ability to generate it. The result is that it can take years to rebuild our reserves after a short burst of activity.”

Good to know, you think. That means you’ll need to be careful using Syl as full strength. She could probably level Ahm but the cost could be not having her around to do the insane feats of power she has done in history. Like single-handedly overwhelming the Lord of Ember’s armies and forcing him to a draw.

>End scene

>>40137008
Yes, that happened. I'm hoping to write the scene over the next two weekends.

>>40137028
I might do a vote on the children issue if there's spare time. Not a big concern right now.

>>40137094
I rolled the Nat1 that got Alyce "drunk." The Dice Gods truly smiled upon us that night, even though the choices we made before did not earn such favor. We must strive to truly earn their gifts.

>>40137099
>Children issue

Pls no. Maybe in a decade or two of game time. Unless you mean the names there.

>>40137028
I still can't help but laugh whenever I think of Talons children.

>"There's a monster that lives under children's beds? Awesome! Imma get a sword then stab it in the face and I'll be just like daddy"

>>40137028
>mfw my son is named Maximilian

Good choice anon.

>>40137028
Male
>Magnus
>Dante
>John

Female
>Anabelle
>Syri
>Alice

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Okay, so numeratic action time. I’ve done a few little tweaks to the Empire Sheet, but that thing is so stupidly complicated that I’d be surprised if anybody really noticed them as most are quite small. Also, I’ll be trying to add character input here rather than just explanations.

The big thing is that you took a fair bit of damage from the demonic attack, meaning you’ll lose taxes from Harrowmont and Mier for a year. Even once that is fixed there’s a bigger problem – the fact that you’re barely balancing your books.

With the extra income from the canal I think you’re only in a small functional deficit (losing more money than you’re taking in, without any additional spending). The largest expenses are paying your massive military and running your foundries. There’s also the fact that your income side is a bit funky – I think Phillias once pointed out in-quest that most other nations have the benefit of there being supplementary income to taxes in the form of the businesses of the nobles or towers. You don’t have that, which means that they’re actually getting a net gain unless you increase taxes.

So we’ll tackle these in order. First is soldier pay.

Sarah: “Given the activity levels of our army, we’re paying them far too much. The pay rate for all of our active soldiers is that of fighting soldiers abroad and we’re not expanding rapidly now. We’ve expanded so rapidly that we need to turn our attention inwards and that means the army is mostly resting. I propose that we half the pay of the professional military in times of peace.”

>continued

Anyway I finally wrote up a fast 30 minute before quest idea for our military and the likes. I'll probably post it once we get to the military structure since it's a wall of unorganized text.

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>>40137414
Sylvian: “Alternatively, you could just lower the pay of the entire force, leaving higher pay only for truly elite knights. This would reflect the fact that you’ve matured the nation and now they’ll spend most time resting and training, not marching and fighting. It would also remove the incentive to start wars or prolong them, where the soldiers would get paid more.”

Phillias: “The biggest concern of adjusting the salaries of the soldiers is their unrest. It would still be a profitable job and if you combine it with official announcements that they can settle in to homes rather than billets, they’ll be more understanding. Most of your men have been without homes for years so they’ll appreciate it. The rest… well, you can just churn the unsatisfied and pay the veterans more.”

>Discussion on this issue. Note that military salaries make up literally a third of your yearly expense.

>>40137487
What are all you guys' thoughts on urbanization? Good or bad? Because if we're putting our soldiers at rest, then it's most likely that they'll be headed to the cities.

>>40137487
Personally I say we should combine Phillias and Sylivan's ideas here.

>>40137487
I agree with Phillias. We actually have a good chance to settle most of them in Harrowmont itself with the construction, or similar locations. That would seem a worthy prize.

No matter how we do it, there is going to be unhappiness though.

>>40137487
I'm thinking a combination of Phillas and Sylvians ideas is a good one.

>>40137545
>Urbanization

Something we strive for. It's easier to keep a heavily Urban population under control.

>>40137561
What about the soldiers abroad? Our armies are kinda split right now. We can probably house some soldiers in our fortress, but where would the soldiers from the other force be housed?

>>40137575
>>40137558
So we're going to offer housing to the lesser skilled/experienced/potent soldiers, and continue paying combat wages to retain specialists/knights/etc.?

Sylvian and Phillas ideas together are good.

Would we have an idea of how big the cities we stick most of the soldiers in would grow? ANd would we keep the soldiers abroad near where he were or move the cross country?

>>40137487
I like Phillias' idea the most.

>>40137487
Don't let them be useless during peacetime, have them help with the reconstruction of Harrowmont and the expansion of the canal and the road network,

>>40137611
>So we're going to offer housing to the lesser skilled/experienced/potent soldiers, and continue paying combat wages to retain specialists/knights/etc.?

Pretty much. I'm thinking something like the specialized Mage knights like LMK/HMK/FMK have a slightly higher wage then the MMK which are the bulk. Just because their job tends to be more dangerous given their specialties.

Then we keep true combat wages for the knights and other really powerful units like vampires or the likes.

>>40137545
Urbanization? That it's a fact as is.

What we want to be careful with is how we approach the bonus of moving into a home or city. A mass of suddenly reduce pay soldiers could turn a sector of city into a lower middle class area pretty quickly. Soldiers might begin to form up in anger/protest and clash with the locals or the garrison. If we want to move a bunch of them somewhere, I'd say we do it at Harrowmont itself and do it properly. Having work and industry at the ready for them to utilize and help out during peacetime on regards to their pay grade and our infrastructure. Idle hands and all at. We could also so as the US military does and offer them enrollment/tuition to the Academies for those interested.

>>40137662
It may be useful to have them build their own houses if they need one actually. Rome did very well with having soldiers constantly building. So we may want to riff off of them here.

>>40137662
Construction is rather hard work mate, and it requires constant effort. If you reduce their wages while they're in peacetime, that's one thing. If you expect them to still work for you and take extra responsibility, you're gonna have a bad time.

>>40137713
That's exactly what I'm worried. I'd like to propose we create cities or suburban areas just for combat veterans, sorta like what many countries did post-WW2.

>>40137713
I'd say that's a terrible idea. Mainly because there is no room for them. Personally, I'm in favor of sticking a substantial number of them in Vitria. All canals lead to Vitria after all.

>>40137713
Depends on how much of a decrease as well really. I don't think we will have much riot issues given they have seen Talon in action.

Tuition wise that may be a good idea. Maybe offer any children they have a chance to test to become a mage or something like that? I think we should already have a retirement pension but it may be a good idea to look into that one.

>>40137800
Don't we already allow everyone to test for magic?

>>40137765
What? We're going to tack on another 6000 spots with the new expansion, there have been talks of upgrading the pop den of the residential district, the canal/terrace districts are being rebuilt and we could do the same for them, and a few other things that'll get brought up in the construction bit that we could possibly do. There's plenty of room.

>>40137738
>Construction is rather hard work mate, and it requires constant effort. If you reduce their wages while they're in peacetime, that's one thing. If you expect them to still work for you and take extra responsibility, you're gonna have a bad time.

I'm pretty sure we already use them for military road building anyway. I'm thinking we should heighten some other benefits with the drop.

Would their be anyway to have them settle in an area which could lead to a larger presence of a military tradition or culture within a village town city etc?

>>40137738
Give them a choice between working on construction and having their wages reduced, it'll save us some money and give us a big workforce for our projects.

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>>40137662
>>40137713
It's not that their useless or inactive during 'peacetime' (especially because you're never really at peace, with banditry and hostile nations at your borders). They'd be maintaining forts, training, patrolling and helping with repairs and maintenance at towns and villages. The idea would be that they'd settle in the rural areas they're defending and active in.

Unless people do want to demilitarise and only have the military be active during times of active war. That would mean they would settle in cities and the like and just be responsible for training themselves.

Also, if you keep them on construction work even when they're soldiers then you can't really settle them in as they'll be moving across the nation.

>>40137699
>I'm thinking something like the specialized Mage knights like LMK/HMK/FMK have a slightly higher wage then the MMK which are the bulk.
To keep things simple on my end (something I need to do more of) I'll simply be setting an average wage for the army and using that for all soldiers. If the military greatly changes in structure (smaller, more specialised) I might make it more complicated.

>>40137834
That's stupidly hard to do given the pure numbers of people. So it might be a decent idea to try for the middle class via the soldiers first then spread it out over time to get more mages for the academy.

>>40137872
Now there's an idea. I can support that.

>>40137856
there are 90k proffesional soldiers anon.

>>40137872
That's a decent idea. On the other hand I worry that it would lead to them thinking they have too much of a choice if they are ordered to do it.

That and most of them will probably say yes. Because most of them will be young men who have a while to work.

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Found the full size provincial map. I'd recommend opening it in a new tab. Where do you guys think we ought to settle our troops? Borders, for defense/force projection? Or internally, which might lead to higher order since they get to mesh with the common people and live with their families?

>>40137989
It could be useful though for getting our armed forces experience at building roads and buildings for later.

>>40137875
>Unless people do want to demilitarise and only have the military be active during times of active war.

We could create an Army Reserve Corps. They'll still do more training as a whole together maybe bimonthly. It works in the US at least, couple it with the reduced pay as part of the plan and play up the benefits of starting a family, career, tuition to various locations. It also fits with your wanting to get rid of the veterancy mechanic, we'll only keep our top on active military payroll and the fall under the average as they are

>>40137875
Fair enough. Continue on with your idea then.

>>40138068
>They'll still do more training as a whole together maybe bimonthly. It works in the US at least, couple it with the reduced pay as part of the plan and play up the benefits of starting a family, career, tuition to various locations. It also fits with your wanting to get rid of the veterancy mechanic, we'll only keep our top on active military payroll and the fall under the average as they are
That is literally the garrison.

>>40138108
Well with the way Aspirational was talking about it, it seems they'd be taking up a Garrison sort of role regardless.

>>40137872
How about we have a revolving list? Half on construction, Half at home? Then after so many months the list changes based on volunteers to stay. But if it's under half then someone gets ordered to do it.

>>40138040
Whoops. That map is severely outdated. It was handy to view the symbols and explanations though. Here's the small size current provincial map.

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/wyOPQQl1J-emJvHkfowmPWtgAdCFlHHsQ_jEYBexOzWd2peQpTpugQAgySaXslTMn7C2jbehio-EpjE=w1342-h547-rw

>>40137875
Any chance you can upload the current provincial map in full size to imgur so that we can take a good gander at it?

>>40138175
That sounds good to me.

>>40137875
>Unless people do want to demilitarise
No, not ever. A standing professional army is essential to us to have a standing chance in the event of a surprise attack, such as the Infernal attack on Harrowmont.

So how about we combined the reduced pay with war pay? Soldiers generally get paid less and more standardized, with more money for the Elites since they perform much better. Then when war hits they get a pay increase due to... well war. Saves us money during those long years with no wars and keeps moral high during wartime due to better regular pay.

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>>40138040
That's an old map, anon. The updated province and world maps are at >>40135921 and >>40136252 respectively. I separated them due to how huge they were.

>>40138068
The new veterancy is basically: Reserve, soldiers who only do occasional training and patrolling. Professional, soldiers who actively train and work. Elites, soldiers who are a cut above professional (Dracogriffs, certain noble knight orders etc).

Anyway, voting time.

MILITARY PAY VOTE
>1. Halve the pay of your soldiers as per Sarah's idea but offer them the choice to continue construction work at full wages. Will mean you'll never need to hire labourers in peacetime but will also mean you don't really lower your military expense (most will accept).
>2. Take on Syl's idea and reduce your average soldier's pay to 2/3rds in conjunction with resettlement during peacetime. Will keep them mostly happy and save a fair bit of money.
>3. Take on Syl's idea and reduce your average soldier's pay to a half in conjunction with resettlement during peacetime. Will annoy quite a few soldiers in the short-term but will save a lot of money and their anger will die down over time.

RESETTLEMENT
>1. Move them into cities, keeping them on active training but contributing to them economy and defenses there. Will improve the wealth of cities. Will mean that losing cities will create enormous angst in soldiers.
>2. Move them into rural areas for extra garrison work. Will ensure higher Control and Order across the board.

>>40138236
>>2. Take on Syl's idea and reduce your average soldier's pay to 2/3rds in conjunction with resettlement during peacetime. Will keep them mostly happy and save a fair bit of money.

>1. Move them into cities, keeping them on active training but contributing to them economy and defenses there. Will improve the wealth of cities. Will mean that losing cities will create enormous angst in soldiers.

>>40138236
3, 1

>>40138175
This may actually be a good time to add a architect department to our Academy. That way we can take anyone skilled at it and give them training for being a military architect.

>>40138236
>>2. Take on Syl's idea and reduce your average soldier's pay to 2/3rds in conjunction with resettlement during peacetime. Will keep them mostly happy and save a fair bit of money.
>1. Move them into cities, keeping them on active training but contributing to them economy and defenses there. Will improve the wealth of cities. Will mean that losing cities will create enormous angst in soldiers.

>>40138236
>>1. Halve the pay of your soldiers as per Sarah's idea but offer them the choice to continue construction work at full wages. Will mean you'll never need to hire labourers in peacetime but will also mean you don't really lower your military expense (most will accept).

>>40138236
>3 Long term over short term
>2 Province wide stability and order over city defenses.

>>40138236
>3. Take on Syl's idea and reduce your average soldier's pay to a half in conjunction with resettlement during peacetime. Will annoy quite a few soldiers in the short-term but will save a lot of money and their anger will die down over time.

>1. Move them into cities, keeping them on active training but contributing to them economy and defenses there. Will improve the wealth of cities. Will mean that losing cities will create enormous angst in soldiers.

>>40138236
>3. Take on Syl's idea and reduce your average soldier's pay to a half in conjunction with resettlement during peacetime. Will annoy quite a few soldiers in the short-term but will save a lot of money and their anger will die down over time.

>2. Move them into rural areas for extra garrison work. Will ensure higher Control and Order across the board.

>>40138236
>>2. Take on Syl's idea and reduce your average soldier's pay to 2/3rds in conjunction with resettlement during peacetime. Will keep them mostly happy and save a fair bit of money.
>>>2. Move them into rural areas for extra garrison work. Will ensure higher Control and Order across the board.

>>40138068

We could couple this with rotations going to the Barrier, when you're on active duty there, your pay is normal, back home reduced. I'd imagine professional soldiers would seize up on that idea as opposed to viewing the Barrier as a death sentence.

>>40138236
>3
>1

Good
Good
Let them channel the anger of loss towards our enemies.
We shall crush them.

>>40138236
>>3. Take on Syl's idea and reduce your average soldier's pay to a half in conjunction with resettlement during peacetime. Will annoy quite a few soldiers in the short-term but will save a lot of money and their anger will die down over time.
>2. Move them into rural areas for extra garrison work. Will ensure higher Control and Order across the board.

>>40138377
Not really. Because it is a death sentence. Even if you offered three times wages a job that say "You got a 50 percent chance to die." Is not going to get very popular.

>>40138236
>>3. Take on Syl's idea and reduce your average soldier's pay to a half in conjunction with resettlement during peacetime. Will annoy quite a few soldiers in the short-term but will save a lot of money and their anger will die down over time.

>1. Move them into cities, keeping them on active training but contributing to them economy and defenses there. Will improve the wealth of cities. Will mean that losing cities will create enormous angst in soldiers.

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>>40138377
Soldiers that go to the barrier will never be part of your active service again. The tour of duty either kills them, gets them to permanently stay to defend the barrier or retire. The men and equipment sent to the barrier just became a growing expense item (it's 10k soldiers now, but Raph implied that was less than expected and you'll probably be hit up again shortly after the timeskip).

>Looks like 3 and 1. Going to enter this into the Empire Sheet now.

Next up is taxes.

>>40138236
3
2

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>>40138505
>taxes

>>40138505
>Next up is taxes

Tax everything that moves on two legs. Done.

>>40138505
>taxes
Oh boy.

>>40138505
not sure if its worth noting, but the Ranger's part of the organizations tab uses the old experience system.

>>40138505
I love taxation.

>>40138631
>not taxing cattle.
>every one cow born out of three goes to the empire and every one litre of milk out of ten goes to the empire.

>>40138505
>taxes

>one of the issues will be nobles
>it'll be brought up they aren't pulling their weight as a secondary income source as was brought up above
>they'll get blamed entirely for this and taxes increased

Calling it now. If encryptions didn't have a collective stick up their asses about working with Nobles the hundreds of times it has been offered we might have a secondary income and better relations with them right now. Yeah this could only possibly go well.

>>40138765
*if everyone

Fucking auto correct

>>40138765
Hmm? I honestly view nobles as really useful.

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Okay, empire sheet updated. Huge profit and military expenses solved.

So last numbers thread everybody agreed to raise property taxes over time. Things are a little more complicated now but with the siege you’ve got a good chance of implementing sweeping tax changes under the guise of rebuilding the nation. Note that the IC stuff takes place later in 1955PC for those wondering, though some of it will take place earlier. I’m just handling things in the most efficienct order rather than the chronological one. Pretend that Talon is using his amazing powers of prescience.

Phillias: “Your biggest issue is that you have no personal income. You own no land or enterprise, unless you count the empire itself. That means all income is taxation. Aside from perhaps Malataine this is unprecedented – royal nations tend to have large amounts of productive assets that can contribute to the bottom line and require nobles to contribute their own soldiers and assistance. The League has the towers contribute to a lot of public works and their armies and mages, saving on costs. The Guard is deeply involved in all economic transactions across their land, ensuring that they pull in enormous amounts from sales taxes.

“You can either fix this problem by reforming the tax structure and making everybody deeply unhappy. Or you can simply expand your own asset pool and build a private estate that could generate revenue to contribute to the bottom line. There’s plentiful opportunity but you would certainly give more of an appearance of being a royal family if you did so. As there aren’t any greater organisation contributing to the empire you would be using the empire’s power to build your wealth and cement your control.”

>continued

>>40139017
>Or you can simply expand your own asset pool and build a private estate that could generate revenue to contribute to the bottom line.

Yes. Approved.
Moving on

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>>40139017
Sarah: “Whilst I do think that building an estate would be smart, I believe that reforming taxes would be smarter. The reality is that the canal and certain trade agreements are distorting the economy. The dwarves have invested enormous amounts of capital and are moving more in. They’re even expanding Vitria’s port to bring in more food. This is strengthening Vitria but not the tax base. They’re exempted from all trade tariffs and they’ve made large purchases of private marketplaces in Vitria. Not to mention that most of their food trade is exempt from sales taxes. We make the most income from the dwarves using the canal tolls, which is absurd given the sheer amount of them and their wealth.”

In other words, the dwarves have enormous amounts of property and much of their transactions are untaxed. Probably because private marketplaces are exempt from sales tax and they pay no tax on their property. Removing the exemptions would rapidly increase income but could hamper trade, just like tariffs. On the other hand, increasing property taxes will capture the portion of income that you don’t get from a private estate but will annoy the nobles.

Or you could just ‘acquire’ some assets for personal use and ignore the tax issues for now. The inequities will probably start causing problems in the long-run, however. You can’t imagine the peasantry appreciating the fact that the holders of most wealth in the empire contribute the least to it.

>Discussion

>>40139170

Could we turn the IECs into a multinational company? Or loan them out, or however we want to do it. We've certainly built a reputation of knowing how to build some shit, I'd say Harrowmont itself and Canalem Imperum is a testament to that. I don't really know how they are set up as is, we pretty much own it anyway since Gareth and Bartom, Gnome, and Laryya are all on our direct payroll.

>>40139170
I know nothing of taxes and they frighten me yet I support any motion of building a private estate

We'll call it The Gryphon's Roost

>>40139170
We did crush the peasants movement so we should do something to keep the nobles in check. Simply increasing their taxes would probably just make them try and extract more from the peasants though.

>>40139170
I'm thinking a sales tax would be smart.

>>40139170
Personally I say we should build a private estate then Make a small Property tax of something like 4-5 percent to increase long term income.

>>40139170
I'd think a combination of the two would work, we can't let that inequality reach a peak, even if it hurts our bottom line in regards to trade.

But to mitigate that effect we should probably get some assets and begin to grow them. Perhaps asking for help from the people we just threw more taxes at.

Also, I'm really surprised Sarah was the one that suggested the latter point.

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>>40139271
>Simply increasing their taxes would probably just make them try and extract more from the peasants though.
They can't. The empire owns all the food-producing land and takes 25% of all production as 'rent'. Nobles/private citizens only own the large cash-crop plantations (Coffee, olives) and their own private enterprises, plus any income they receive from the empire because you took their land.

>>40139243
So far you've done a good job of keeping the IEC busy so you'd have to pull back on home projects if you did that.

>>40139170
I find doing both is the best option that way we fix the tax issue and have funds not fully linked with the empire

>>40139170
Sarah makes a good point. Tax reform is the way to go I think. But we can add in to that and lessen the toll on people by making some state owned businesses (instead of creating a house talon which wouldn't serve any purpose other than to create a noble class and fuck up the things we worked to settle before. we already own the damn empire). Selling tech and ores are what comes to mind first.

>>40139399
>So far you've done a good job of keeping the IEC busy so you'd have to pull back on home projects if you did that.

I thought last time we had 6 of them just sitting around doing nothing in particular though? And we've gained what, 3-4 more? Granted the reconstruction efforts during the timeskip are probably going to eat them up but nothing wrong with having consultations and survey teams out there making lucrative contracts in the years to follow. I'm also super biased in thinking our architecture is da best since I made a lot of it. But I can't think of anything else that the Empire is known for as an asset.

>>40139558
>(instead of creating a house talon

Just put the successor of the land and assets as the empire itself. That way there is no house Talon only land talon owns personally.

>>40139170
Introduce a VAT, that'll solve all economical problems forever.

>>40139558
>ores

Voting we send an IEC on an archeological survey to find those damn rare metals we haven't talked about in 50 threads.

>>40139608
By shutting down the economy.

>>40139571
They're building canals. We've got a lot of canals to cover.
>>40139608
Jokes aside, that would be an administrative nightmare in a pre computer era.

>>40139642
>They're building canals

Some but not all. The construction tab literally says we had 6 teams doing nothing special. Probably because it cost too much to do it.

It would be better to not acquire a private state. Talon is the empire and the empire is Talon. His welth is the emoire's wealth, and vice versa.

>>40139722
that's the entire point of the private state though, it's the empire creating industry for profit, with said profits going to fund the government, it's not like it's suddenly going into Talons pocket exclusively or anything.

>>40139771
Yeah. Honestly it may be a decent idea. It could also make for some good advertisement.

"York bank. Your money is in good hands"

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>>40139571
>I thought last time we had 6 of them just sitting around doing nothing in particular though?
Nope. They were all busy on the canal and academy until the siege occured (I just removed those projects). They're just currently unassigned afterwards (and will be voted on this thread).

>>40139608
That's sales tax, anon. It's just that it's only charged where the value-add occurs (i.e. where the final demand is) because everybody else can claim it back. Assuming VAT works like GST in Australia. In any case, it's not really feasible to set-up a proper VAT as it's administratively complex.

Anyway, looks like there's no new input here. Though it does occur to me that you probably should also start charging royalties on the mines (rent for it).

>vote incoming

>>40139812
Anon mentioned rare ores earlier what's that about?

>>40139805
Actually to think on it this is actually a fucking good idea.

Make a private estate bank. If it hits a net loss then we can always borrow assets directly from the York Empire. Give out Business loans and things like that then use any spare money to buy out businesses and other assets. Or if someone defaults.

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VOTE

Note that not changing taxes will create inequity issues between the peasants and nobles and they'll gradually get unhappy.

SALES TAX
>1. Remove the exemptions on private marketplaces, meaning that all transactions excluding primary goods attract sales tax. This will have a slight dampening effect on trade but will prevent inefficiencies in the current system.
>2. Don't change sales tax, meaning it only applies as a fee for using empire-run marketplaces.

PROPERTY TAX
>1. Snap rise in property tax under the guise of a reconstruction levy. Mostly to capture land value as it's not like they can move the land across the border or hide it.
>2. Continue the slow rise in property tax over the timeskip.
>3. No changes to property tax.

TALON ESTATE
>1. Make some large acquisitions of assets that nobody really owns (namely, those that belonged to people who died when you invaded them) and add their profit to the empire's bottom line but owned by Talon or his estate.
>2. Make some small acquisitions so that you have an estate that could be used by any children.
>3. No acquisitions.

EMPIRE BUSINESSES
>1. Have the empire get into the role of making a profit from assets and trade. This could involve exploiting natural assets (mines) and plantations, as well as merchants and more marketplaces. Will hamper city wealth and growth in exchange for a better bottom line.
>2. Turn some of the empire-specific organisations into for-profit businesses, such as the Engineering Corps and Mage Towers (inc. their banking operations).
>3. Leave the empire out of private affairs.

Feel free to propose anything else.

>>40139865
>>1. Remove the exemptions on private marketplaces, meaning that all transactions excluding primary goods attract sales tax. This will have a slight dampening effect on trade but will prevent inefficiencies in the current system.
>2. Continue the slow rise in property tax over the timeskip.
>1. Make some large acquisitions of assets that nobody really owns (namely, those that belonged to people who died when you invaded them) and add their profit to the empire's bottom line but owned by Talon or his estate.
>2. Turn some of the empire-specific organisations into for-profit businesses, such as the Engineering Corps and Mage Towers (inc. their banking operations).

>>40139865
>1
>1
>1
>3

>>40139865
1, 2, 2, 2

>>40139865
>1
>2
>1
>2

>>40139865
>1
>2
>1
>2

>>40139912
>>40139865
I support this guy.

>1. Snap rise in property tax under the guise of a reconstruction levy. Mostly to capture land value as it's not like they can move the land across the border or hide it.
>2. Continue the slow rise in property tax over the timeskip.
>1. Make some large acquisitions of assets that nobody really owns (namely, those that belonged to people who died when you invaded them) and add their profit to the empire's bottom line but owned by Talon or his estate.
>2. Turn some of the empire-specific organisations into for-profit businesses, such as the Engineering Corps and Mage Towers (inc. their banking operations).

>>40139865
>1
>2
>1
>2

>>40139865
2
1
1
2

>>40139865
>>1. Remove the exemptions on private marketplaces, meaning that all transactions excluding primary goods attract sales tax. This will have a slight dampening effect on trade but will prevent inefficiencies in the current system.
>1. Snap rise in property tax under the guise of a reconstruction levy. Mostly to capture land value as it's not like they can move the land across the border or hide it.
>2. Make some small acquisitions so that you have an estate that could be used by any children.
>3. Leave the empire out of private affairs.

Aw yeah soon, Mage Banks and Engineering Contacts. That's where the money is.

Hell we might get lucky and someone will pay us to build canals connected to ours, win-win there.

>>40140066
A big advantage banking wise would be it would have Talon name on it. So you can be pretty sure your money is safe when the ruler of a nation is protecting it.

>>40139865
1
2
1
2

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>1, 2, 1, 2

Some of these changes I can make now to the empire sheet. Others I'll estimate the impact of and work out later.

Most of the estate acquisitions will be in Farun, Harrowmont, Darlesia, Taour and Shropham. Which is to say, only Vitria, Compagnon Termina are really exempt. I imagine the focus would be in Taourlesia and Shropham, really. Talon will likely appropriate the coffee plantation immediately.

Next will be the reconstruction effort, which is mostly about how much money and support is to be given to the reconstruction of Mier and Harrowmont (outside of the fortress).

>>40140194
>likely appropriate the coffee plantation immediately.

"Hello I am Talon York and I like fine Coffee. Do you like fine coffee? Then try York coffee. Because sometimes even an Imperator needs a relaxing drink after a hard day."

>>40140433
>"I'm Imperator Talon York, and this is my favorite coffee on the continent."

>>40139865
1
1
2
2

>>40140454
Soon to be the ONLY coffee on the continent. The industry shall bend to Talon's iron rule of God-beans.

>>40140194
>Talon will likely appropriate the coffee plantation immediately.

They had heard the rumors but had paid them no mind.

So what if the Imperator likes coffee?

So what if he had apparently already taken all the farm land?

What harm could come to them?

Then they came, the agents of the Empire.

All the land was seized, every plant, every bean.

They should have watched carefully for now it is all gone.

In the distance the can hear it, the Imperator.... brewing

>>40140433
>creation of a coffee industry

I'm starting to get nam flashbacks of an evil party game I ran where the party went full corporate evil. They took over not!mordor and saw the volcanic ash wastelands as an opportunity to grow coffee beans. Enslaved kobolds to work the plantations, reinvented starbucks, got everyone hooked, then started using potions of suggestion in the brew.

>>40140433
who the hell drinks coffee to relax
who the hell drinks coffee after a hard day and not before

>>40140599
Me anon me. I fucking hate to drink coffee before a hard day. Afterwards is good but before makes me sick.

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>Reconstruction

Okay, so now the empire is swimming in dosh and Talon now has a massive estate. It’s now time to look at the expenses of reconstruction.

The three biggest problems are: Harrowmont (fortress) got wrecked; there’s a hundreds of thousands homeless with lots of towns and villages destroyed or evacuated; the siege occur at the height of the harvest, so there’s an enormous amount of lost food.

There was a vote a while ago to focus on military affairs, at least for appearances sake, so that is a guaranteed expense that will come up later. The reconstruction efforts and food problems are optional expenses.

Reconstruction comes down to whether you want to invest money in getting the towns and villages up and running. IEC teams won’t cover all of it, as a part of it is just the livelihoods of the citizens as well as expanding on the plans that Carl brought up (rice fields, larger villages etc). It’s about 100TBY to expand it to the two affected provinces but it will improve their fertility afterwards and speed up recovery. Otherwise, it can be left as is and Carl will continue with his personal project with Glynn’s support.

The food problem is the fact that 400TBY of food was lost and this means that there a lot of people will no homes or income right now. The exemption of taxes on the provinces simulates the supply of rations but if you choose to cover the lost food in part or in whole you’ll also prevent the rural and town areas from seeing a sharp decline in their wealth.

Also, bring up any other plans to rebuild after the siege. Projects or ideas that aren’t related to reconstructing Harrowmont (fortress).

>Discussion

>>40139865
1
1
2
1

>>40140654
youre crazy

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>>40140684
Oh, and the balance right now is 3100. Net revenue per year is about 2600 now so there's plenty of money for construction projects and military expansion leftover.

>>40140531
>Far far in the future there is no food.
>There is only a magical mega structure going upwards.
>In each level there is coffee beans growing. Entire families being paid and work to do nothing but make coffee
>This has went on for so long none remember why or how this happened.
>But they say the closer you get to the bottom the more laughter you can hear. Like a thirsting god devouring his prey.

>>40140684
Do it. That's a damn pittance.

There were talks about making certain areas flood plains though, connected to the canal, could we do that as well?

>>40140684
Personally I say we do both here. Maybe work on some irrigation in the area around harrowmont.

Other then that there really isn't much we need done.

>>40140684
go for it

>>40140684
I'm inclined to spend the money, and as for construction projects, here's what I've got:
Defensive fortification in Meire
The "Concealed bunker" plan.

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>>40140782
>>40140806
The irrigation project is a bigger one intended for the much later construction topic (as it involves IEC teams).

VOTE
>1. Do both ideas in >>40140684. Costs 500TBY
>2. Do the expansion but not the food. 100TBY
>3. Do the food but not the expansion. 400TBY
>4. Do neither.

>>40140684
Well there's the memorial
That survey some anon brought up

>>40140904
>>1. Do both ideas in >>40140684. Costs 500TBY

>>40140904
>1

>>40140904
1

>>40140904
>1

Sure

>>40140904
1

I'll take obvious votes for 100.

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>>40140915
>That survey some anon brought up
What?

>Anyway, 1 won. Kind of saw that coming.

Okay, military and emprie structure next. I remember somebody posting or emailing me some new structure for governance or military at some point, so if they're here then they might want to post it.

>>40141065

Dis>>40139627

Apparently we have rare ores?

>>40141065
I emailed you one a long time ago. It got voted down. Maybe you're reffering to my nobility/military structure?

>>40141197
Post it man

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>>40141125
You probably have some of the nigh-indestructible metal ore in Marnn. I might bring it up later in the construction phase as extracting that stuff is horrendously expensive, even if you do have a dwarven smith who can work it.

>>40141197
Possibly? I remember something new after the legislative structure got voted down.

Anyway since this is close enough to military issues I'll post out my ideas on how we should build up our military doctrines. It's a bit earlier then the research and recruitment but I might as well give some things to think about while it's kind of relevant to what we are discussing.

Army wise I would suggest we do this.


We have a decent core doctrine right now. Use our Mage knights in a Combined arms approach. Humans are much more expendable then nonhumans due to pure numbers and we have a lot of humans in comparison. So personally I think we should fuse Magi League+RSK basic doctrines then use our Nonhuman units as we can. That way even if we get in a situation where we can't rely on elves or the likes we will always have a basic core that can handle the issues. This means we should be building more factories in order to build up more LMK/FMK/JMK when we finally build them I think we have enough MMK factories however.

Use Foxes, Siege archers, and Arcane archers as our armies core ranged combat units. Each one to handle part of the others weaknesses and allows us to not have to always rely on mages.

Mage wise I"m thinking we should use them in attack or defense as needed. I've had an idea that we may want to train all our battle mages in how to use a basic summon. That way we can use rituals to mass power expendable units. On the other hand this would mostly only be really efficient if we could use Mal's magic battery in the rituals in order to cause mass spamming.

I noticed that our army lacks some magic power in the frontlines. My suggestion is that we Take a hint from the DracoGriffs on this one. Given we will have a SpellBlade academy up and running soon as well as daywalkers. I say what we should do is mix them with our mage knights so there is so many mage knights per spell blade fighting in the front lines. The mage knights to take the blows and lower the spell blades Glass Cannoness.

>>40141243
The spell blades to put battle mage tier magic power in the front lines so we don't need to rely so much on backfield battle mage support. Add in daywalkers forces as needed or combine them to have a daywalker/Spellblade force.

Another combo to keep in mind is Juggernaughts+NLMK. One to push the forces forwards. The other to use the immense speed and strength to constantly hack and retreat around foes.

Pattern wise I"m thinking our first one should be something basic. After reading the battle with our dear demon lord friend I was struck with an idea. Make our first pattern a Steel four armed large man. The advantage being we could focus mostly on just speed, Strength and durability. It will also have four arms compared to most units two and we have seen how deadly that can be when you only have one weapon to block with during the Talon vs Demon lord battle. After that work on fusing them with magitech factories and on the niche units. This will give us use of the Infernals "Feel no pain or morale." Tactics as well as give us units that we can keep producing and replace with ease unlike humans.

Knight order wise I would suggest using the new Dwarven deal in order to outfit the most loyal with Dwarven armor and weapons. Both as a way of increasing our knight orders strength and giving us more control. We should also start refining our royal order via tightening the requirements as the order matures in order to start building our own Knights of Basette.

Units wise we may want to experiment with Daerfir LMK. See if we can get any Daywalker elves. Even if only a few Elves go for it they could be quite useful given their absurd regen and suicidal fighting style.

>>40141222
>>40141231
Trying to find it. To give the TL:DR, Social NATO style rank equivalencies.

>>40141285
Upgrade wise I think we should go for all the templates we are lacking. Other then that the speed increase in HMK is godly given what it could do with NHMK as well as allow our normal ones to keep up much easier. Mal's battery is probably a good idea to get just due to allowing us five times as many Nightwalkers even if I think we should just go deep enough to get that active. That way we can focus on Magitech and patterns. Daywalker Eugenics is obviously a ASAP research to go into. I'm also thinking we should activate the speed increase with the MMK or get the anti-magic wards. I've noticed that a lot of the times our MMK tend to get a bit of damage due to the pure magic power battles toss out. I would suggest both but we do like our ambushes so Silent movement may be to valuable to lose out on.

I think if we can combine all this we will have all we need for most battles. Summons to weaken, Patterns for moraleless unaging units and for whatever niche we need, Mages and spellblades for the magic, MageKnights as the core, Knights as the Linebreakers, Nonhumans for their specialities. Siege archers/Arcane archers for the long ranged power.

Do forgive how unorganized this shit is. I basically just typed it up in 20 minutes or so.

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I’m eating lunch right now, so sorry if this is a bit rushed. I’ll do an updated post with character viewpoints in about 30 minutes or so but I wanted to get discussion happening as any changes here will hopefully happen from player input.

There’s two issues here – the first being governance. Although the whole ‘nation behind nations’ thing is still working out, the problem is that nobody really knows who is in charge of anything. Talon is boss of everything, naturally, but when he’s absent or busy it’s a question of who has authority. Right now, Sarah can handle administrative matters but she’s stepping back soon to focus on her studies. If it’s military then Lynn or the generals can be consulted.

The problem is that if people want a ‘stamp of authority’ for more general things that go through the Imperator’s Office (and hearings etc) then Finn is basically the only person who would count, even though he has no formal position. This also goes back to the heir issue, in that nobody really has a claim because there’s no formal structure for the Imperial side of the empire beyond Sarah’s administrative bit. Hence why Finn is probably the only person who would hold authority due to being Talon’s second/squire.

For military, there’s both the question of potentially revisiting the way you approach your conflict (and an anon just posted his idea on that) and build your army. There’s also leadership. You’ve got 100k soldiers right now, with the likelihood of getting more. It’s probably time to appoint a Lord General to oversee all military matters that Talon isn’t. If you don’t then you would probably appoint one temporarily any time you set up a new battlefront or leave Harrowmont. You should also probably formalise Finn’s position.

>Basically, general discussion on whether you want to assign more authority, who to and what authority.

Now, I meantioned a while back that I was working on a potential system of nobility for when we finally have to address it, this is my attempt, which combines European, and Chinese nobility with some elements from NATO's rank protocol. There are two kinds of nobility. The first is the traditional nobility, which consists of the old nobility that Talon hasn't had murdered of disenfranchised for one reason or another (killing their king, illegal research, general principles), which operates exactly like it used to, with one kid inheriting the full title, but the noble titles are homogenized because Talon can't be bothered to remember a hundred local variations. The second is branch or positional nobility. Someone gets a position that comes with a title, and their kids get the title below that, and their kids the title below that, ect until someone either gets a title higher than their current one or they fall off the tree.
List:

Tier 1: Imperator

Tier 2: Archduchess/archduke Lord Generals, Elven Champion, Lord Admiral, Chief of the Six Star Alliance (technically foreign nobility, but whatever), Lord Magister of the Empire, Grandmaster of the Order of the Griffon,

Tier 3: Governors, Grand Dukes, Special Agent of the Empire, Ranger Commandant

Tier 4: Generals, Dukes, Clan Chief, Admirals

Tier 5: Marquess, Master of the Order of the Griffon, Grand Magister, Pathfinder (Silver arrow)

Tier 6: LT General, Count, Grandmaster (Minor order), Commandant (Minor order), Archmagister of a Tower

Tier 7: Viscount, Master (Major order), Magister

Tier 8: Baron, Captain, Master (minor order)

Tier 9: Baronet, Knight, Journeyman Mage, Lieutenant

>>40141325

To help ground that, a Count would usually be the senior noble in a rural province, Anisette is a Duchess, a grand duke would usually be the head of a major imperial agency (intelligence, treasury, engineering, justice, probably one or two others, and yes, Karise outranks her “clan head” in TYE terms, entirely deliberate.) A marquess would be a major noble family, similar to Vitria’s greats. The upshot of this is that nobles are pushed to join the military or knightly orders.

Benefits of nobility: Not going to bother to go too in depth here, beyond noting that its somewhere between "peasants have no rights" and "everyone is equal under the law," other than to note a prerogative regarding the Imperial Tourney. Every five years on the anniversary of the day we captured Harrowmount we have a big tourney like the one we did in the quest. There will be a bunch of events, probably everything we did in the first tourney plus some events for Fluffy tails (including Under 4 events so Vad's kids can show off) and elves. Talon and his retinue will attend some of the events and parties, and the nobles will be able to get spots to meet with him through some sort of lottery system, allowing them to bypass the bureaucracy that normally limits access to him. They can bring up any issues they have directly with him, the traditional one being: that bureaucracy is starting to get corrupt and are abusing their power for personal gain, go punch them in the face.

I'm basically trying to push the militarization of the nobility (and thus increased numbers of noble knights) while making the mages, knights and Magi League very happy, while keeping the nobility placated. Mal will probably be grumpy, but its not like his title has any actual duties.

>>40141231

I can remember some kind of organization change Idea. But I kind of like how we already have our organized since there is no real blatant inefficiencies.

>>40141348
We should definitely make an executive office of the imperator, to handle more bureaucratic issues. But it is only granted authority by Talon, it should have no staying power in the empire if we die. We want it to be as difficult as possible for our empire to survive if we die

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>>40141438
>We want it to be as difficult as possible for our empire to survive if we die

Wat?

>>40141389
Remind me of the difference between a Duke and an Archduke?
I like this for the most part though

>>40141389
>>40141415
Here is my thingy. Feel free to tell me I am terrible.
Also, its copy pasted from several months ago, and I had underestimated the importance of Finn's position, so that's a thing

>>40141496
So people don't think it's a good idea to stage a coup for personal power

>>40141389
>Someone gets a position that comes with a title, and their kids get the title below that, and their kids the title below that, ect until someone either gets a title higher than their current one or they fall off the tree.

Not sure I like that idea. It works all right in China but there is some different cultural ideas here.

>Tier 2: Archduchess/archduke Lord Generals, Elven Champion, Lord Admiral,

I'd move Lord Generals up to tier 0.5. I think they should be the final say so military wise so there shouldn't be anyone with Equal military rank to them other then another one or Talon.

I say we promote, Hartman, Phrace, Moss, maybe Rayza, try to convince Felix to take it up again. And promote either Fuurin, Arail, or Lynn to Lord General.

Also boink Sarah and get some real heirs.

>>40141517
Historically, Archduke was basically another word for prince, or extremely powerful duke. In our empire, a Duke is a city level noble, an Archduke is Sarah.

>>40141496
It's kind of something I see Talon doing in a way. Making it so anyone that claims his throne needs to prove they have the ability to hold it.

On the other hand making it difficult to survive is not something I see him doing. He would want it to survive just be really hard to take over unless you have the skill to rule it.

>>40141538
>Not sure I like that idea. It works all right in China but there is some different cultural ideas here.
Fair, I was vacillating between branch and life (IE, not inherited) titles.

>>40141545
>Lord general.

I honestly still think we don't have anyone good enough to be a lord general. Other then the helldragon and Finn with a few more years of experience at war.

>Felix

We should proably make him the leader of a vampire group or something like that. OR just keep him a bodyguard.

Hartman, Phrace might be good to promote but they do their jobs well so I don't know how the successors would do.

>>40141538
>I'd move Lord Generals up to tier 0.5. I think they should be the final say so military wise so there shouldn't be anyone with Equal military rank to them other then another one or Talon.
On the other hand, that would make it more difficult to keep appointing Sarah as regent.

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>>40141582
Talon York on inheritance

>>40141641
>Finn
Not really he barely has a mind to move armies like chess

>>40141545
>Also boink Sarah and get some real heirs.

I honestly can't see Talon actually giving his children a free ride to anything funny enough. I kind of see him giving them the best tutors in the world and things like that.

Then just tossing them out and telling them to build their own power because they're not getting any true political power without earning it the hard way.

>>40141678
Father Talons love must be EARNED

>>40141671
That's why I said more experienced. Much more experienced with Talon teaching him tactics.

>>40141646
Not really? Sarah isn't really in the military and has her own entire system for herself.

The big things with Lord Generals is that they were meant to be the deal breaker in case there needs something done on this battle front right now and Talon isn't there.

That way we have an experienced being there that can be trusted to make good decisions on the battle front. Their power doesn't really work outside of the military though.

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>>40141389
This is pretty good, though has a strong military bent (as you admitted). It still doesn't solve the nuisance issue of who calls the shots when Talon is absent or busy, especially as you won't be able to use Sarah as regent as much if you want her to do her studies and become a talented mage (as was voted for). All those positions in Tier 2 mean that any problem that cuts across multiple domains of the empire will need agreement from a bunch of people with potentially conflicting drives.

>>40141641
>I honestly still think we don't have anyone good enough to be a lord general.
Well, you'll end up giving the same level of authority to somebody any time you leave for a battlefront. The idea is that if you head off to fight the Guard, you'll need somebody to call the shots on the homefront if Falwick kicks up a fuss and that's a lot of authority to hold. If you promote somebody permanently, they could develop into it instead of constantly doing acting positions. Alternatively, you can try to use the 'War Council' idea but that ran into issues when attacknig Farun as the commanders on the council got in each other's way.

Sylvian is probably by far your best general now, though. Except maybe for Talon. Caitlyn has Leadership II and Finn Leadership I. Taira could probably organise a battlefront and campaign if she wanted to, but can't lead her way out of a paper bag.

>Writing character viewpoints now

>>40141750
Come to think on it Lynn also is a good candidate for Lord General once she is more experienced. A big thing I feel though is that the Lord Generals are basically the darth vaders of the empire.

In general we can just use a councils of generals for most battle fronts. A lord general on the battle front should be like a Great godknight, Or a RSK magister general.

>>40135907
I REALLY need to catch up on this. I got to the bit where he got that second elemental, or whatever, and then I had exams. Geez, what is this now, the seventy-fourth?

>>40141841
>RSK magister general.
To be fair, Phillas is probably that good. And the rest have a six year timeskip to get better.

>>40141889
lol dude you shouldn't even be commenting

>>40141826
How old is Moss by the way? I think he's getting near retirement.

>>40141826
>All those positions in Tier 2 mean that any problem that cuts across multiple domains of the empire will need agreement from a bunch of people with potentially conflicting drives.

Yeah that's the big thing I"m worried about. I'm honestly thinking we should let the governors be mostly autonomous in these cases.

>>40141826
I honestly do thing we should promote Sylvian there for now. Just because if anyone needs it it's our dragon right hand. We may want to toss finn into battles with a more commanding bent to make him learn more for getting him ready for it.

I like Lynn where she is.

>>40141889
Oh, sweet jesus. You are so far behind bro.

>>40141943
When moss finally retires I can just see Talon giving him a personal Ceremony for this guy.

>>40141826
>All those positions in Tier 2 mean that any problem that cuts across multiple domains of the empire will need agreement from a bunch of people with potentially conflicting drives.
Fair point. Of course, if we remove the knight and the mages it slights them, causing issues. Maybe bump Lord Admiral down to tier 3 along with Alliance Chief and Elven Champion?

>>40141943
Those guys probably won't retire until their 80s or 90s anyway, magic man. And then they can still arm chair general of need be

>>40142042
Moss is magic light though.

>>40142068
Funny enough though there is the Domain.

I imagine Talon probably does keep all the military and civil people that stays near his keep from aging.

>>40142068
I think the average lifespan can hit 150 or so? Just for regulars with modern magical science, IIRC.

>>40142099
Not that high. If I remeber right most High up mages only live to 150 due to infighting killing them before they can reach 400.

In a way it's kind of amazing how effective that makes Talons domain. Just because he can literally keep Mal around forever so long as he spends more time in the keep then out of it.

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Oh, and because I forgot to mention it, I’ll be updating all the character sheets before the next thread. This also means adding a bunch of new ones (Sylph, Sylvian, Esra etc).

>Governance

Sarah says, “I appreciate the clearer delineation of authority in the empire, even if it is a bit militaristic, but it still leaves the major concern of who can make decisions at your level or that cut across the highest levels of governance. We’ve already discussed the problems involved in my acting as your regent but the fact is that when security and economic matters collide I get no respect. Not to mention it’s hard to make diplomatic decisions. Finn’s already been pulled in to hold court in your place a few times.”

Finn says “It’s not that hard, really. Though I don’t get confronted with the really hard matters that Annette and Sarah speak of. I didn’t think it was my role, though but everybody says that I can stand in for you.”

First you’d heard of it. You’d wondered why you’d been getting badgered less about holding court when you got the kits or Marle dumped on you for the day. Kyria and the officials from your office had been having Finn sit in. You were going to have to grill Kyria and Mana about that.

Taira: “Really, you do need to decide who can make decisions. If Ren or Noah can’t find you they badger me about decisions for the foxes. You either need to officially nominate Finn or somebody to hold your authority where you’re not present or perhaps a council. Especially when you’re away for long periods of time – it’s not like somebody will chase you down when you’re on a battlefield to ask if they should let a group of dwarves buy half the merchant district in the capital.”

That about sums it up, though you don’t know if Taira is angling for a position or just annoyed.

>continued

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>>40142166
>Military structure

Sylvian: “I can see you eying me off as your Lord General but I don’t think it’s appropriate. You want somebody who can both negotiate with others and who you don’t want by your side. Unless you plan to leave me behind when you go fighting demons, Guard and God-Knights. I also have a lot of… history that might make others not trust me on a battlefield.”

Arail: “Honestly, I think the council idea could work well but the issue is just who to appoint to one anytime you need to set it up. Generals with conflicting ideas don’t restrain one another, they just make a mess.”

Lynn: “Isn’t the issue that you want somebody who can command a battlefront that you’re not on? Why not Phillias? Or Arail? Phillias has taught me a lot, and he also seems to specialise in defence, so…”

>I’ll call a vote shortly

>>40142099
No, that's mages who stop their aging. Human lifespans are no greater than they are now, though who can get access to good healing magic varies.

>>40141943
He's on the higher end of your active soldiery but he's not that old. Like Hartmann, he'll probably need to look at retirement in the next 5 years or so.

>>40142203
Council fosho. Finn Gnome Undine Mal Taira Sarah

>>40142203
>Arail: Generals with conflicting ideas don’t restrain one another, they just make a mess.”

I love Arail. Dude knows his shit.

Personally I think we should go with council for now. But we need to sit up a voting system or something so that conflict doesn't lead to a mess.

Governance wise honestly I think Locally we should have the governors basically be mostly autonomous. When Talon isn't there and there needs to be empire wide decisions then we may want a council.

>>40142203
I think a council would work, we just have to be judicious about our appointments.

>>40142302
Though we do want to start priming Finn a bit for larger command and making his own decisions. He could make for a good deal breaker or the likes.

The hard part is anyone that would want to rule while gone is going to be with us if Talon is gone.

>>40142352
Truth

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GOVERNANCE VOTES

PROPOSED TIERS
See >>40141389
>1. Adopt the proposed structure, after dropping Elven Champion, Lord Admiral and Alliance Chief to Tier 3.
>2. Don't adopt it.

REGENT VOTE
>1. Continue as currently, with nobody truly holding your authority in your absence unless you specifically grant it.
>2. Give Finn authority in your absence, followed by a council of the highest ranking individuals in the empire (Sarah, any Lord General, Lynn, advisors like Gnome, Taira etc).
>3. Give authority to a council of the highest ranking individuals in the empire (Sarah, any Lord General, Lynn, advisors like Gnome, Taira etc).

Propose alternative members of the council, keeping in mind you'll want members that won't be on a battlefront with you (though not all of them).

MILITARY

LORD GENERAL
>1. Appoint Sylvian, keeping in mind her grievances.
>2. Appoint Lynn.
>3. Appoint Phillias.
>4. Continue as currently with no Lord General, appointing individuals or a council as need be.

RAYZA PROMOTION
>1. Bump Rayza up to General, leaving the Dracogriffs as her command unit under Phrace.
>2. Leave her where she is.

FINN POSITION
>1. Make Finn a formal general, though only commanding small forces.
>2. Keep Finn with smaller, more ad-hoc commands.

Also, to get it out of the way, I'll do a vote on possible children after this with some more context.

>>40142391
1
3
4
1
2

>>40142391
>>1. Adopt the proposed structure, after dropping Elven Champion, Lord Admiral and Alliance Chief to Tier 3.>2. Give Finn authority in your absence, followed by a council of the highest ranking individuals in the empire (Sarah, any Lord General, Lynn, advisors like Gnome, Taira etc).
3
1
2

>>40142391
>1
>3
>3
>1
>2

>>40142391
1
2
3
1
2

>>40142391
>1
>3
>4
>1
>2

>>40142391
>1
>3
>3
>1
>2

>>40142391
>1. Adopt the proposed structure, after dropping Elven Champion, Lord Admiral and Alliance Chief to Tier 3.
>>2. Give Finn authority in your absence, followed by a council of the highest ranking individuals in the empire (Sarah, any Lord General, Lynn, advisors like Gnome, Taira etc).
>2. Appoint Lynn.
>2. Leave her where she is.
>1. Make Finn a formal general, though only commanding small forces.

Though I would move Lord General upwards a bit in military matters only. Other then that It all looks good to me.

Although another thing to think about is if we want to get Lynn and Finn more experience we will want to put them in situations where they can learn more.

>>40142549
Finns cool and can lead the fuck out of the elves. I don't want him to be leading the empire, that should be one of Talons children of it comes to that, or at least a human

>>40142391
>1

Regent: >3

LGen: >3

Rayza: >1

Finn: >2

>>40142593
Das racist

>>40142593
I honestly don't think Talon would want one of his kids doing anything with the empire unless he tested them himself to make sure they where good enough in his eyes to be worthy of it.

Finn has a good head on his shoulders but I kind of agree there. I mostly just want him to reach around lord general then stop around there.

Meaning Council idea seems to be best right now.

>>40142632
Yup people are racist. Hows the cannon fodder gonna feel if theyre dying for an elf, instead of a heroic demigod that inspires them

>>40142661
The main thing I see is we need someone to be a military Tiebreaker just due to how valuable speed is in military affairs.

Other then that civil wise it's best if we did have a council because a council tends to be slow but make pretty effective decisions so long as the info is good. As long as we have both of those I think it's all good.

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Winning options:
>1. Adopt the proposed structure, after dropping Elven Champion, Lord Admiral and Alliance Chief to Tier 3.
>3. Give authority to a council of the highest ranking individuals in the empire (Sarah, any Lord General, Lynn, advisors like Gnome, Taira etc).
>3. Appoint Phillias.
>1. Bump Rayza up to General, leaving the Dracogriffs as her command unit under Phrace.
>2. Keep Finn with smaller, more ad-hoc commands.

CHILDREN
Just going to settle this now, as it keeps coming up. Basically a vote on whether to have Talon have kids towards the end of the timeskip. Sarah and Taira are interested. I'll do proper scenes about it once we resume if the vote is yes, particularly as it becomes complicated to say yes to one and no to the other.

>1. Talon to have children with both Sarah and Taira.
>2. Children with just Sarah.
>3. Children with just Taira
>4. No children.

FINN
So given how soundly any advancement for Finn was rejected, I'm curious to see what people want to do with him. I'm getting conflicted readings here, with some people clearly wanting him not to really do anything and others wanting him to be military but not to actually command (judging by votes). He's in a bit of a no-mans-land and the difference between rhetoric and actions is interesting and could have implications.

>Discussion and input on Finn's role in the empire

>>40142723
That Elf though is the squire of the Heroic demigod which helps there. Especially if that Heroic demigod is just away for a little bit.

Honestly I'm thinking something like a council but Finn has Tie breaker privileges would work decently.

>>40142770
>>1. Talon to have children with both Sarah and Taira.

>>40142770
>>2. Children with just Sarah.

>>40142770
>>1. Talon to have children with both Sarah and Taira.

Babies

>>40142770
1

I really wanted Finn to move up now. I'm not sure where to go with him if people keep shooting it down. Can't be a squire forever

>>40142770
1
I really like Finn and want him to be involved, in the same way Mal or Ren is involved. He should continue to squire under us and then take up a role alongside the other elf champion leading the elven troops

>>40142770
>1. Talon to have children with both Sarah and Taira.

>FINN

I feel we should Groom him over the long term to be a Lord General in the empire. I think we should switch him with Ad-hoc commands for a few years in different situations to get him experience for when we turn him into a general in a decade or so. Then let him build up from there.

>>40142829
>1
I agree that Finn shouldn develop along with the Daerfir as a Ren-type figure

>>40142770

>1. Talon to have children with both Sarah and Taira.

>>40142770
One option would be to put him in charge of the "combat magister level" troops. Elite Foxes, Dragon Knights, ect and lead powerful strike forces.

>>40142829
>alongside the other elf champion leading the elven troops

Kind of feel that would be a waste of Finn's Talents. Doesn't help he is a known murderer in that circle.

>>40142914
I also support this idea

>>40142770
I'm hoping Finn becomes some kind of elven commando, leading a small unit on special missions.

>>40142914
>>40142945

Actually this is kind of a decent idea. Though personally I will want him over time to slowly go upwards into high tier general or higher. Getting him experience with many situations and special missions would be pretty good.

>>40142945
Since Talon is immortal i think Finn sets a good precedent of Talon raising his most important/reliable lieutenants

>>40142945
I thought that was in stone seeing how he originally came from our Rangers?

I can't believe Talon is going to have children. Adorable god seed children.

>>40142770
Aspiring Emporer Quest- soon to be renamed Aspiring Father Quest
>1

>>40143028
We really should see what effects him being a god has on the kids.

Though this opens up a large can of worms.

Can't wait for Ren to find out Talon knocked up Taira. The look on his face will be golden

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>1.

Okay, so everybody wants children. I guess I’ll handle then when the story stuff resumes. Also, the folks relating Finn to the elves/Daerfir is new and doesn’t really relate to previous development. I think I’ll have to do some stuff on him to develop him in-quest, simply because last time this came up he was being pushed to develop as a squire/successor type of character and now most everybody seems to basically just want him being another commander.

DAERFIR ISSUES

Esraveel: “The Daerfir have settled in and Caeminn appears to be making excellent progress as hoped. Some of the elders and leaders are worried, however. There’s not too long before they begin to handover to the next generation of leaders and nobody really knows what they should be doing. They’ve spent their lives as warriors but now need to settle anew.”

Sylph: “I guess we need to decide what we want them to do. You could have them continue as warriors, with the empire supporting them at home but then they’ll simply go back to what they used to do with the elves. Or you could try to have them develop their own culture and society, so that they can begin trading and working with those nearby.”

It’s not exactly expensive to support ten thousand Daerfir but the question comes down to how you want to weigh up your military needs against developing the elves. Do you want the Daerfir to continue their warrior culture, with whatever new development Caeminn comes up with? Or do you want the majority of them to step away from their past and simply develop a new elven structure. If Esra has an opinion, it’s buried beneath her adulation of you.

>Discussion

I might revisit the Shropham issue later but I’m worried about time when it comes to the biggest matters. Also, research is next so if you have any projects to suggest then bring them up.

>>40143015
He shows more skills then just being a ranger though. He does have Leadership one after like a year of practice..

>>40143104
First 10 tailed Fox here we come, Ren is going to lose his mind trying to shore up his position as Chief for centuries

>>40143138
warrior culture

>>40143104
GUYS

This is a problem.

Image if you will someone born with Talons obsession with Fluffy Tails, that has their own Fluffy tails.

>>40143138
Personally I say we keep the warrior culture for the empire. Build some homes for them to live in but build a system of honor in battle and the miltary.

That way anyone that doesn't want to join the army can but most will want to join.

>>40143138
I'd say time to take a step back. They need to let go of old grudges, building on generations of them to further our ends might end up turning them against us someday

>>40143206
Talon could always grow his own tails to act like the foxes do to externalize his excess power in case we advance too fast.

>>40143138
Time to step back a bit. We promised them a new life, and they should have options.

>>40143210
The big thing I see though is we don't want to force them into the military culture. We want to keep it going but make it self sustaining and give those that don't want in an option not to go in.

>>40143147
No I mean I rather him be the head of commando units and their training than a full fledged general

>>40143138
Why not just do both? I'm assuming there are elves who want to change and those who don't.

Problem being friction between the two.

Thoughts? Basically just let then choose themselves with an emphasis on the fact that they have a choice

>>40143138
Personally Fin is a fun char but I don't see him as someone to lead an empire or lead at all really. Hes too naive and silly to be anything more than a strong fighter in my opinion.

>>40143138
We should probably let them develop on their own for a while, I vaguely remember some promises in that direction but that may have just been disscussion

>>40143270
>No I mean I rather him be the head of commando units and their training than a full fledged general

I can see that. Still it does seem a long term waste. That pretty much means he will forever be stuck in the middle ranks. Which is kind of sad for the squire of a demigod.

>>40143296
That's more because he is Naive though. As he gains experience he becomes less and less so.

>>40143296
... Yeah that's why you develop him into one. He has all the potential in the world and you guys want to waste it on just being an LT? For what purpose?

>>40143310
The first squire of a demigod. I dont think he should become middle ranks, i think he should be regent of the daerfir

>>40143380
Thing there is he is a murderer in those ranks even if most don't care and Ersa is already handling that pretty well. That and we probably don't really want them to gain regents of any sort considering their under the empire now. The foxes already had a system we had to work with.

>>40143380
Doesn't that have specific racial connotations we're trying to avoid though? A great leader is better for the Public opinion of other races, as opposed to a great elven leader.

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VOTE
>1. Warrior culture. This will mean you'll have around 7k Daerfir warriors available but they won't develop their society economically or culturally.
>2. Let them choose, with a focus on not requiring military service. You'll probably get around 1k Daerfir warriors and they'll begin to develop themselves in the empire.
>3. No military service required. Esra will still have her personal unit (200 Daerfir) but otherwise the rest will have to focus on building a new life.
>4. Custom

>>40143452
>2. Let them choose, with a focus on not requiring military service. You'll probably get around 1k Daerfir warriors and they'll begin to develop themselves in the empire.

>>40143440
ok. well the way I empire is puppet kings puppet kings puppet kings, so if thats not the way other people like it thats ok

>>40143452
2

With a focus on local integration

>>40143270
>Thoughts? Basically just let then choose themselves with an emphasis on the fact that they have a choice

Something like that. I think we should put a little pressure to go into the military but leave the option there if they really don't want to. They have a choice but the empire needs Elves.

>>40143452
>>2. Let them choose, with a focus on not requiring military service. You'll probably get around 1k Daerfir warriors and they'll begin to develop themselves in the empire.

>>40143452
>>2. Let them choose, with a focus on not requiring military service. You'll probably get around 1k Daerfir warriors and they'll begin to develop themselves in the empire.

>>40143452
2

>>40143452
>2. Let them choose, with a focus on not requiring military service. You'll probably get around 1k Daerfir warriors and they'll begin to develop themselves in the empire.

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>>40143310
>Which is kind of sad for the squire of a demigod.

Eh
>FreeShrugs.jpg

Wasn't really looking at it as a status thing. Sure being some high general is what you'd expect but the way I see it I much rather play into what he knows or what I assumed he knows from his days as a ranger rather than build him into something else like a general

Like him being the head of black ops training and commandos and shit that in itself carries a hella lot of prestige you know

>>40143477
Kind of.

Talon on the top. Then there is the people he invested power in. The archduchess, The Governors.

Other then that though I can't really see him as really having puppet kings so much as people he invests power into in a certain way. Thing is there really is no need for racial leaders unless the race already has a leadership already like the foxes.

>>40143452
>1. Warrior culture. This will mean you'll have around 7k Daerfir warriors available but they won't develop their society economically or culturally.

>>40143452
2

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>>40143477

>>40143514
But does nothing for the public image of elves. The highest and most recognizable Elf in the Empire is essentially a headhunter? That'll trickle down, the Daerfir probably are already have strained relations because of the whole insane self sacrificing warrior stereotype.

Finn needs to be a leader that changes the public view of elves. Not one that is the Emperor's pet murderer and someone to be feared