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/tg/ - Traditional Games

>What the hell is that
The rpg is inspired by Beer and Pretzel games such as Kobolds Ate my Baby, Warhamster and other such "lite" titles.

It's fun little game I found the other day involving less than lucky sentient lizards scrabbling for survival in the Squam after the The Great Big Blammo. Of course, if that wasn't enough, Wizards seek the lizards out as their gribbly bits are highly valued as components for spells.

I and a few other anons thought this game would be more fun if it had a bit more content in it; and as such we made a thread for ideas and play testing. I'll just be reposting some of the ideas in this thread as we didn't want to hijack the original thread any further.

>What can I do
Read through the pdf, contribute ideas for improving the system or just take a looksie. It's a spur of the moment kind of thing anyhoo.
Reposting from the hijacked thread. The base idea suggested by another anon is that every new session or adventure is started in a completely new area. Representing the Lizards having to move from place to place, getting what they need and moving on. The only consistent thing would be the camp itself.

With that in mind here's what I'm thinking for this "Advanced" Lizards vs. Wizards. We use the Wizard's dawn amount of hexes as a starting point. 10 spaces long, 8 hexes tall, maybe even smaller if it would serve the game better.

First you would roll for season each one perhaps having an effect linked with it. Possibly a sub table with 1-4 different effects for each season (to add variety to game play.)

>1. Spring
>The Birds and the Bees

The creatures of the Squam have been getting busy lately. X% chance of having a mate or additional young with them. Or maybe just a flat increase of monsters encountered.

>2. Summer
>Heat Wave

Every X hexes traveled without water (or drink of any kind) incurs a survival check with a kill factor of Y.

>3. Fall
>Squalls in the Squam

Rain storms and whipping winds send your lizards tumbling to and fro. Make an X cunning check or become hopelessly lost rolling to see what hex you end up in!

>4. Winter
>Oh no, SNOW!

Lizards HATE snow. Lizards reduce all food gained by half (rounded down) and move at half speed unless bundled up. Travel speed is reduced as well, taking twice as long to explore a new hex.
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Then you would generate your landscape rolling on the table for each hex on this table (the land doesn't have to make sense, The Squam is a messed up place. Feel free to add additional landmarks or switch it around, what ever you want!) Maybe each roll could have a chance of some weird terrain on a small chance. Just spitballing.

>The Squam

>1. Plain

>2. Hill


>4. Forest

>5. Water (25% chance of connecting river)

>6. Swamp

Then the Lizard's camp would be set in a random hex (maybe by rolling a d10 and a d8, or dropping a dice onto the map and seeing where it lands) or decided by the Monitor alone. Not quite sure how to do this one...
And of course, most importantly THE WIZARD. There is always one wizard (or more!) lurking within the Squam. They're like cockroaches, reality warping, completely insane, magic mumbling, cockroaches. Additional wizards may appear by will of the Squam encounter table (coming soon-ish)

Wizards are generated as per the Lizards Vs. Wizards handbook but with the additional step of giving them their own lair! Roll on this table to see where they have decided to live. (numbers subject to change, rooms per floor either left to Monitors discretion or will be given a value based on feedback or my poor judgement)

Lairs of the Wizards! 1d6

>1. A Cave: This wizard either really appreciates the camouflage and natural defenses afforded by the many cave systems of the Squam: or they are a complete and utter failure as a Wizard. Living no better than the Lizards! For shame! 1d4+1 "rooms" 1 goon per "room"

>2. A Rift: A pocket dimension openend up and formed by the wizards desires. Not incredibly stable, certainly not homey, but it gets the job done. Gives you a headache after a while. 1d6+2 rooms with 1d2 goons per room

>3. An Ancient Dwelling: The Wizard has set up shop in a ruin made before The Great Big Blammo. This place can be an office, a restaurant, a post office or even just a normal house. Always filled with shinies! 1d2 floors with 1d8 rooms. 1d3 goons per room/floor

>4. A Tower: You know it, you love it, it's the perennial classic. No self respecting wizard should be without one. 1d4+2 Floors/Rooms and 1d4 goons per floor/rooms

>5. A Fortress: For the imposing and well off Wizard in all of us. Goons flock to wizards with a functional fortress. 1d4+3 Floors/Rooms with 1d6+2 goons per floor/room

>6. A Castle: Now we're getting serious. Not even the most foolish Lizard would try to storm a Wizards castle. But a stupid and desperate one might! 3d4 towers guarding the keep (towers and keep generated as normal) 1d8 guards per floor/room
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Unfortunately that's all I got time for tonight, got work in the morning. Another anon said he'd post his stuff, so hopefully the thread will be able to survive till I wake up. I'll make sure to make a document to save everything, just in case.
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It's different from the base mechanics of LVW, but still very very simple.

I plan on fleshing out the different colors more, giving them "racial" abilities that are essentially just micro feats.

I've approached design with the idea in mind that your characters should not be surviving often, and with that said the system as it is right now isn't built to accommodate characters who survive more than 3-4 adventures.

planned features:
>magic/ways to use Brain in combat
>rules/mechanics for the Hub, your home base. All meta based, and built around making your lizards stronger and stronger starting out the more you play with the same Hub.
>more explanation of weapons
>finishing the Hazard Tables for Professions, make Expertise Tables for Weapons

hope it's not shit!
Well damn if that don't be blow me outta the water. Good job anon!
Well apparently I'm a damn liar. Because I got one more in me.


Cowardly, snivelling, barbaric and cruel. Mooks, cronies, toadies, henchmen, whatever you call them, they’re Goons through and through! Goons come in all shapes and sizes but usually have a couple things in common. They’re vaguely humanoid, two arms and two legs, and have a face only a mother could tolerate. Goons are also stupid, incredibly stupid, relying on the patronage and brains of the Wizard they have pledged themselves to. Finally, they are loyal… to a degree. As long as the Wizard they serve lives nothing can sway them away… unless you offered them food, or shinies, or weapons, or… alright they’re not THAT loyal. But they do know how to do their job (“Grimmle, destroy that Lizard!” “Farstrag, fetch me the golden spindle!” “ And Hurk! QUIT PICKING YOUR NOSE.”) and you can’t really ask for more than that.

Every Wizard needs Goons, for they have made enemies of the Lizards, the beasts of the Squam are untameable; and all other sentient beings know to stay far, far away from. Thus it falls to the lowly goon to help realize the plans and dreams of the often mad wizard. No one knows where a Goon actually comes from, perhaps they are made in a black cauldron, bubbling with possibilities and all things foul. Maybe they are the children of sorcery itself; The waste and runoff of a Wizards endless meddling of the cosmos. Or perhaps they just simply sense the wizard and show up on their doorstep ready and willing. But really, who cares?
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These table will guide you through the creation of a particular Wizards Goons. While there may be a small variety in a Wizards fairweather army for simplicity's sake we assume they have some sort of uniformity. Warning, math for Goon bonuses is haphazard craftsmanship at it's worst.

Gather the Goons!

Size: How big are your goons? d10

>1: Itty Bitty(+30 Speed, -30 Survival)

>2-4: Runty (+15 Speed -15 Survival. +15 Cunning)

>5-7: “Normal” (+10 to one stat of choice)

>8-9: Big Guy (-15 Speed, +30 Survival, -20 Cunning)

>10: Freakishly Huge (+40 Survival, -30 Cunning, -30 Speed)

Armor: Whatcha wearing? d6

>1-2: In the Buff (+1d10 speed)
Well maybe they got some scraps, or a tasteful loincloth but not much else beyond that.

>3-4: Fur, Scales, Chitin and Shells (+1d5 survival)Not as good as a piece of armor, but it helps! Also looks really scary!

>5-6: Armor (+1d10 Survival)
Well blessed be! Honest to Zoltromos armor! You don’t get many wizards giving that away no sir!

Weapons: You gotta be packing something! (includes melee and ranged weapon) 1d8

>1: Fisticuffs and random junk
The boss said you had the hands of a warrior. You just think he’s got the wallet of a miser.

>2-4: Clubs, hammers, daggers and slings
If it can slice belly open, and club a lizards head in, it’s good enough for me!

>5-7: Spears,swords, axes and bows
Now we’re getting somewhere!

>8: Guns and ammo to spare!
Who thought this was a good idea?
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Looks: More like look away, am I right? Roll D20 twice and combine the results

>1-2: Fat and 1-2 Lumpy

>3-4: Spindly and 3-4 lanky

>5-6: Stout and 5-6 Brutish

>7-8: Fake and 7-8 Mechanical

>9-10: Bestial and 9-10 Dirty

>11-12: Horrifying and 11-12 Shifty

>13-14: Muscled and 13-14 Scar riddled

>15-16: Warty and 15-16 Infected

>17-18: Feathery and 17-18 Knobbled

>19-20: Half formed and 19-20 Gooey

Attitude: At least they have personality

>1-2: Greedy

>3-4: Cunning

>5-6: Stressed

>7-8: Irritated

>9-10: Lonely

>11-12: Confused

>13-14: Insane

>15-16: Lazy

>17-18: Bloodthirsty


And lo and behold an army fit for an aspiring megalomaniac
Damn thumbnails. I also just realized, that the weapons second tier should have been natural weapons, then "real" weapons for tier three. I'll have to fix that.

But now I'm done! Hopefully see you lads in the morning!
bump for the good morning
Now this is the creative fun I’ve been looking for on /tg/.
this is really neat you guys have you worked on the landmarks at all?
I think it'd be neat to make then more broad terms that each Monitor could kind of have leeway with as far as what they actually are

>Caves have treasure and monsters in spades. Lizards typically have a sense of where Caves are at naturally, from their more slithery ancestors.

>Ruins are former places of wonder from the now dead races of before the Squam. Better treasures than Caves, but the enemies living there are far tougher.

>Villages are very rare, as the Squam is no place for people congregating. Roll 1d6 to discover the nature of the villagers towards outsiders. If friendly, you may rest here.
Skimming through the rulebook, is this basically lite and whacky version of Mouse Guard, except with lizards?
yes, but from what I've heard about Mouseguard's tone I would say way more wacky and lighthearted
>mfw you literally said wacky in your original post
goddamnit I suck
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couple of pics I snapped on the farm, thought it helped catch the vibe of the setting
OP here, morning everyone, good to see all is well!

Not yet. I was planning to knock out some landmarks during lunchtime. I like the more customisable approach you got going. I'll make sure to have a little sample table for each, just to give an idea what a monitor could put there. Then we move on to encounters and beasties...
Oh these are nice, I like these. Reminds me of my Aunt's. Except less marshy.
For beasties there are feral dogs, cats, varieties of birds, or even other insane Lizards.
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Most certainly.

>tfw boss made you work almost five hours in a row with no break and almost marks you for a missed punch.

Alright, I'm here to post, and just in time it seems
I'm getting fucked up for NYE but I'll probably have the finished product of my autism tomorrow night if the threads still alive
Hey no rush my man. You have a Happy New Years Eve!
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No one goes out to Squam for the scenery, in fact most wouldn't want anything to do with it in the first place. But go the Lizards must, if they have any inclination to survive. Food must be hunted or foraged, beasts must be driven off, scrap dug up and scavenged, and Wizards in need of a severe attitude adjustment are abound. But where to go? Why not take a peek into these allegedly deserted, and often fatal, locales? Bring your friends, bring your family, I'm sure that bloke over there with the wiry hair, eight eyes and wide smile would be happy to see them!

Roll a D20 for each hex seeing whether or not something interesting has popped up (encounter rate subject change. Not quite sure how many should pop up on a small map like this.) Do not roll for the Camp Hex and Wizard Tower.

Wish You Were Here! 1d20

>1-11: Nuffin to see here.
Unlike you enjoy muddy blasted hellscapes that is. The Hex for all intents and purpose is empty.

>12-19: Hey I found sumthin'!
Roll on the Encounter table

>20: “Scrim, you might wanna see this.”
You found something, something big. Roll on the It's a Big Squam out there table
Seems lunch was shorter than I thought. I'll post the sub tables when I get back. Happy New Year everyone!
I think it may be a bit extreme for a full half of everything to be nothing in terms of scenery, especially considering that the time of the apocalypse is in an unknown past. (Granted that could be 10 days, but still)
So what are you thinking? Like maybe bump it down to a 1-5 "@#&%!" Squat 6-18 encounter and 19 to 20 for big stuff? Or just keep the big stuff at a 20?
Make it 1-5 “@&$&! I wish that wasn’t there!” (Toxic water, bad berries, competing small animals, etc)
6-9 barren. Just nothing of use.
10-19 we found some stuff! Good stuff! (Fresh water, good berries, dry sunny spot, etc.)
20 “Scrim, you might want to see this.” (This is good, really good. Hope nobody else wants it.)

I’m going about this as if they are scrounging about, and thus guessing on what would be on those hexes. Encounters would likely be separate.
I would even go as far to say that multiple 1’s would mean there’s a remnant of the Big Kaboom around.
Well know you got me thinking. So this scrounging table, would it be used the moment when the players announce they are exploring the hex? Or would it be used as another modifier, preset and to be discovered when the players make that line of inquiry?

And while we're on this subject, would this apply to encounters too? Should encounters be generated when the map is generated and seeded on a hex when a dice roll says so (in example, every hex has a X% chance of having an encounter of any type on it or even possibly different chances based on hex type/ how much you can scavenge from it) or to keep in line with the more fast and loosey goosey gameplay; should "mainline" encounters be generated on the fly just like a random encounter? While there are merits to the latter, I can't help but feel like if you rolled a keep, ruins, caves and the like it would be harder for a potential Monitor to keep the game going at a decent pace or keep things interesting. You know when compared to being given a bit of beforehand prep by rolling up and prepping these bigger encounters.

I'm sorry if I rambled on a bit, I just feel like you're on to something and that it can make design later easier. Not to mention along with some other great ideas (especially the seasonal table affecting what kind of encounter you could get.) I would like to make sure I have a better idea of what I'm going to do when I forge out the rest of this blessed mess. I have never done something to this level before and I have no clue what I'm doingbutIamhavingfunohgodpleasehelp

It also just occurred to me I forgot to also record kill factors for the Goon Weapons.
This is also a good idea
Is that pic from Wizards?
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Damn straight.
Bump before bed.
New Years bump, and a hope for new ideas!
How much armor can we use?
I could see bucket helmets being rather common, with clever lizards fulling them with soft stuff before wearing for extra protection.
hey guys, so I'm on a mechanical idea and I want your opinion.

What if we made special weapons and armor, just the bits that were either notably well made or simply good enough to be worth carrying when compared to what some lizards use (a sword vs a wooden spoon for instance) have roll tables?

if you've skimmed any of my rough ideas in the PDF all of my ideas are using a d4 system, and I'd assume so would these tables. You'd attach straight effects to them like killing blows or successful dodge rolls in the case of armor.
I think we could even take this into the magic system if you wanted magic. Give each lizard color a d4 roll table with one starting effect and more that unlock with Skill/Stat Points. Maybe even make Skills the different effects you can put on a roll table for a Lizard.

We could even make Profession Die what you use to roll on the effects tables, as well as what tables outside of your lizard's you can access? any thoughts or comment?
This sounds rather good so far, but I don’t think we should have a magic system. At least not one useable by the players. We’re just little lizards going up against mad Wizards who can use potions, spells, and traps to catch us as ingredients. And we are just sneaking up and defeating them because they underestimate us.
definitely a super valid point, do you agree with the idea of giving lizards special abilities beyond attacking and dodging though? Fluffed however but mechanically speaking just little effects like free damage, heals, and that sorta thing. I think it'd be a simple system that would add depth, but of course the whole appeal of the system and setting is the lack of cumbersome depth.

I definitely want there to be some incentives to keep lizards alive for multiple adventures with progression, but obviously there's tons of ways to do that without necessarily making the game any more complicated for the player
Yeah, I also want them to have some skills and ability to actually win against the outside world.
The first prf gave me the impression that survival rolls were “roll to not die”, which seems a bit brutal for a silly game. Silly to me is being squashed flat and spending a turn peeling yourself off the floor and re-inflating yourself. I’d say deaths would be “you were eaten by an animal or turned into a potion by a wizard”.
Holy crap it's still alive. Good job lads! Still groggy from last night and still getting the Encounter skeleton up.

Also I was thinking while most of the contents of the squam are randomized (besides the camp and Wizard). I was thinking maybe would should an XP/VP table that rewards and incentives the lizards to do greater risks; the largest being of course attacking wizard himself. With maybe a bonus for exceeding a xp threshold and having a certain of lizards NOT die. What do you think?
If we’re going to embrace the silliness of this game, some abilities could be color change (look, I’m one of you! Now one of them! Now I’m both!),
camouflage (see, this beastie was looking for me and I was concentrating REALLY hard on not being seen and suddenly I was no longer there! Well, I was THERE, but my body was gone!)
Long Tongue (my mama says it’s from my papa’s side. He says it’s from her side. Still, nobody can catch bugs like me.)
and Sticky Feet (hey down there! I’m on the ceiling! I can walk upside down on the ceiling! Yeah, it’s cool! ... how do I get down?)
so what if we made some basic random generation for world quests?

exactly what you're referring to, but instead of say a Monitor sitting down to script out the 5-10 different tasks that grant XP/VP, you'd have certain tasks that could only show up if certain world conditions were met.

Something like:
>Manbat Swarm!: If there are six or more Caves adjacent to one another, you may complete Manbat Swarm!
>A large swarm of Manbats has formed, defeat them to gain X XP

obviously super rough, but I think itd help make the world feel more purposeful even while being randomly generated.
I love all of these, and they gave me an idea for a better way to do stuff like that.

so to use Long Tongue, we'd give it 4 different outcomes when used, something like:

to start out with. you could either improve your results to have more Hits, or buy more skills. you wouldn't actually write out what each one does, instead just allowing the Monitor control of if a Skill may be rolled for a problem or not. this allows for some progression, an uncertain element to using Skills, and a relatively freeform application of them to problems
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I like it, I like it! Once I get the table done and slightly refined we'll have to brainstorm some quest combos that could occur. I really do like this, it gives purpose while still leaving for player based shenanigans. Also would help ease the Monitors workload.
I was actually thinking of something similar earlier, where multiple hexes of the same setting or scenery roll. Like three hexes being rolled as a 1 would mean there’s a powerful hazard there, like a wizard or toxic big Kaboom remnant.

My only suggestion would be that the caves or other threats don’t have to be directly adjacent for the encounter to become viable. So the larger an area the player lizards explore, the more they can become noticed by more threats.
a while back for a different project I looked into the ideas of changing roll tables.

Essentially, you'd have like a d10 table for instance, and every time you went through the hex, you'd roll on the table. So if you got a one say, you'd then replace the result for one with an extension or advancement of the original result the next time you rolled a one.

so if it was originally
>2d6 dogs are guarding a fresh kill

the next time you rolled that result it might be
>a former corpse has become reanimated

I think in terms of this, we could easily build in something like this, albeit in a much more vague and hidden way tied to the actual world generation like you talk about.

I think for that to work best though it'd help to make generation chunk based rather than individual hexes, allowing for you to keep track of how many of the same roll you got when generating a chunk.
So how many chunks should there be? Would ot be a preset amount (The monitor has X amount of small chunks, Y amount of Medium chunks and Z amount of Large chunks. Not counting the camp and Wizard Lair chunk.) Or would the amount be random? I feel like this needs a template some sort...
That’s very much what I had in mind.
I can also see failures as being rather humorous.
“Well, neither of you were able to entrap that snake with your tongues, and are now familiar with how each other tastes. You feel lesser for the experience.”
Or even saves after failures.
“So while the wizard is able to pick you up, they are shocked to see the floorboard you were sticking to breaks off along with you. You now have a hefty piece of 2 by 4.”
I would say a little bit of both. The starting area, like at the beginning of the season, would be set and help the players figure out how the game and party flows. The following areas the camp travels to would be either pre-generated for story purposes, or randomized for survival.
ooooh man I love the first one there, and you're absolutely right about the failures being a gold mine to inject some heart into the game right there alone

how many Skills do you think there should be? and I'm using Skills here very tentatively as a place holder, I think they should probably just be lizard mutations really, but I guess in that case why not just make a d100 table of them? each having a unique little roll table with quips, as well as quips showing improvement of ability as you make more of the outcomes hits
One nice thing about the Squam is that there is always something to do. Now, whether or not you want to do said things, is completely out of your scaled hands. You, my brave and fearless volunteer are probably going to want to know what sort of things you might see out in that big beautiful Squam. Well sit back, quit bawling and let me tell you all about it!

These tables are of course rough, crappy and not too well thought out. Since everyone is leaning towards a bit more leeway in terms of content; the subtables are merely there to represent idea joggers.

>1-3 Ruins: Buildings, structures, and other things left behind after the Great Big Blammo.

These places usually have enough scrap to supply a camp for weeks, maybe even months! But, you know what they say;Uncertainty is the birthplace of fear. And the ruins of the Squam can make a Lizard very, very, uncertain.

>1: House
>2: Office
>3: Parking Garage
>4: Club
>5: Military base
>6: Lab
>7: Mall
>8: Temple
>9:Radio Station
>10: Pet Shop
>11: Power Plant
>12: Hotel
>13: Grocery Store
>14: Hobby Shop
>15: Restaurant
>16: Hardware Store
>17: Factory
>18: Library
>19: Cabin
>20: Skyscraper
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4-6 Caves: It’s said that the Lizards slithery ancestors used to make their homes in caves just like these! You’re not quite sure why though, seems like more trouble than it’s worth…

>1: Empty
It could be worse

>2 Deathtrap
The whole things coming down on us!
1: Cave in!
2: Quicksand!
3: Poison vapors!
4: Ancient Beastie Gullet!

>3: Trog Hovel
Low brows and bad attitudes. No idea where these gravel brains came from.

>4: Man-Bat Lair
Sun is up, they will not sup; Moon is high, get ready to die

>5: Fungus Among us!
A treasure trove of shrooms as far as the eye can see! You get 1d6...
>1: Battering Bludgecaps
>2: Mumbling Morels
>3: Enigimatic Enoki
>4: Slumbering Shiitake
>5: Crying Criminies
>6: Pulsing Portabellas

>6: Down and down we go (Big cave)
The cave goes a little deeper than you thought. Waaaaay, deeper. Was that glint of a shiny or the flashing teeth of some horrible beastie? There’s only one way to find out.
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I want to post the rest, but I am bushed from work. I wanted to make sure I posted at least something before I conked out. Sorry, things are taking so long.

>7-9 “Natural” Formations
One of the only “safe” things in the Squam. You know, scenery that generally stays in one place and doesn’t try to strangle you. I’m sure you’ve heard of it.

1: An upside down waterfall
2: A perfectly round stone sphere
3: A tree that looks like a Lizard
4: A lazy river
5: The skeleton of an Ancient Beastie
6: A lonely raincloud
7: A bottomless hole that echoes you ahead of time
8: Rows of leafless bushes bearing ripe, but hollow, fruit
Well, I have a couple ideas.
>Webbed Feet
“You see, I was running from this mean cat when I ran into a river. Now, I couldn’t stop running, so I didn’t, and I found I was running on top of the river! Then I heard a splash and a howl, so I turned around to see the upset cat, but that made me fall in. But I could swim!”

>Chameleon eyes
“I don’t look stupid. Stop saying I look stupid. I’ll have you know I’m able to look at that “pick me!” Wizard sign you put on my back without a mirror!”

Warm blooded
“All my friends and family love to huddle up to me on cold nights! But I’m always the one picked to go outside on cold days. Just because I can do it doesn’t mean I like it!”

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