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File: 2nd Primarch 2.jpg (1.07 MB, 2581x1629)
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Previous thread: http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/qstarchive/4510838/
-
You are Lieren, Great hunter of the wilds, bringer of prosperity and plenty, Hero of the common folk, and Golden eyed and Iron haired Giant of the village of Nothing, and unknown to yourself the 2nd primarch and the Emperor's son. Having become the Administrator of Lord Gao's Lands in the Kingdom of Yan, you set about building a road that would connect every farm, village, town and city together and creating a safe route through dangerous fog covered land. Meeting an impasse in the form of a foul magical beast, you opened the path by slaying the Terrible Toad Dragon, a man eating monster with toxic breath that had once been a man.

With your great road nearing its completion, and manned by men loyal to you and the road itself, you returned to your home village and headquarters of your administrative duties, to spread improvements down the road from it's start point. Including better tool designs for farming, chemical treatments to enrich soil and crop yields, improved Irrigation and a more efficient system to forge and cast metal of higher quality than ever before.

Tax collector Ling, a greedy man blinded by worldly pleasures and wealth, has come to collect Nothing's tithe to the equally greedy minded Lord Gao. And having grown tired of the Tax Collector taking more than he was ordered to to fill his own vaults and pockets, for the good of the common folk and once starving farmers, you decide that it is now time to be rid of the disgusting worm once and for all
-
"Ah, this humble administrator of the lord's lands welcomes you into his home, please treat it as your own, friend Ling" You say, clasping your hands together and bowing to greet the greedy devil before your eyes, containing the urge to tear his head from his shoulders you have fostered and hidden in the depths of your heart for nearly half a decade now. His looks are ragged, his eyes tired and panicked like he expects to find a knife in his neck at any second. Since you're arrival into Gao's service, he had lost much of the favor he once held, and had foolishly continued to take "gifts" from the tithes owed to Gao and from what little the people had left after giving what that greedy, fat slug would ask of them.

If he had only been a little less greedier, you may have let him live. But with such prosperity in the land that you've turned today, such greed will only drive him to steal greater and greater bounties from the people you've worked years to rise up from dust and hunger. Such men, who would take from those who have nothing, disgust you beyond most men's comprehensions, he is worse than the bandits that sought to predate your road and end your life. For he leaves his victims alive to suffer from his greed.
cont
>>
>>4531257

Ling's eyes dart over your meager accommodations, falling on the aged form of your adoptive father, Wenyan, who sits plucking a fowl by the cooking fire in the center of the main room of your shared abode.
He acts like a frightened field mouse, now that he sees how truly disposable he was to his master for all these years.

"This humble tax collector, thanks you, Lieren" He says, hiding his expression behind his ornate fan decorated with depictions of cliff jumpers, his dust covered robes of Pink and Maroon shifting as he moves to sit before you offer, a social faux paus

"You may sit Ling, and remember your manners, what word Gao say if he were in our presence today?" You ask, as you set yourself down across Ling from the fire, stretching your legs and lounging to relax your body. The short man's form tenses, no doubt as visions of his long, drawn out death flash through his mind's eye.

"Yes yes, what was I thinking, forgive this one's rudeness, my work is a stressful labor after all" Ling mutters, his adam's apple bobbing in his bird like neck as he takes his seat, kneeling ironically like a man who is soon to lose his head

"I can only imagine" You say pityingly, pulling at the stubble on your chin as Ling removes his symbol of office, his flat topped and wide brimmed hat, colored the same colors of his robes, first maroon and then accented with pink "keeping track and account for all of the wealth of Gao's land, every season, and to even miss a single bushel of rice would mean..."

Ling swallows again, eyes nearly bursting from his skull. Seems the "guilt" of all of his thievery comes home to roost in his heart when it will lead to his own demise.

"But it is important work" Ling says, with a nervous chuckle escaping his lips, as your father Wenyan glares at the despicable worm of a man, who has brought sorrow and hardship to his kin and yours for years as much if not even more than the cruel sadist Gao. All for his own greed

"So I must endure, as it is my duty to Gao, no the people to collect what is rightfully owed to the master of these lands" Ling continues, searching around the room, no doubt looking for servants and only finding the brothers Liang and Jiang, who are only barely restraining their own immense hatred for the man and what he stands for.

"Could one of you fetch us some drinks, my throat is dry and this conversation with your master will be as well if I do not wet it with something strong" He says as Jiang's hands shift slightly, and his brother turns to him with a serious expression in his gaze. Jiang wants to claim the tax collector's head.

"Ah yes, otherwise Gao would take your head, wouldn't he" Wenyan says with a smile as he grabs a crude bone splitting cleave and remove's the fowls head from his body. Ling's eyes flash with a rage but he remembers Wenyan is your father and silences his protests in his throat.
cont
>>
>>4531259

"Father, do not speak of such things around our honored guest" You say glancing at Jiang and lowering one of your hands as Ling is looking away, ordering your companion to stay his hand


"Even if Gao no longer favors Ling as he once did, he surely would not betray a loyal servant, who has for decades labored and worked for him and"

"The people" Jiang says through his teeth as you smile proudly at the young man, being able to restrain his temper and hatred for the man sitting before him.

"The people, yes exactly" you say, nodding as you move to stand "And I shall fetch some fruit and drink for Tax collector Ling, Honored Zian, in my personal larder, do we still have any of that bitter, strong tasting liqour"

"From Dragon's end village? the fisherman's brew made from fermented fish guts?" Zian asks as Ling visibly pales "I believe we have the jar of it you were gifted last time you past through there, and I would not be so certain in our friend's safety, Gao has always been a whimsical man, and quick too anger"

Ling choked, glancing between Zian, recognizing his uncovered scar and to you, no doubt wondering if you had heard of an order Gao had given that had been kept from his ears.

"Zian! did I not just say not to speak of such dreadful things, Ling is here as our guest, to share with us a meal before continuing his hard, stressful work" You say, swinging your arm towards the man, a smirk on his ruin of a face as you admonish him, raising your open hand into the air "And Gao is a wise man, he would not do away with a servant who is still useful to him, simply because he no longer favors him"

"Do away with" Ling mutters under his breath as you leave the room to fetch Ling his drink and something to subdue its strength and bitter flavor.

You decide on a platter of ripe peaches, dried plums and sour berries to accompany his drink. For even if he is a heartless villain, a man deserves an enjoyable "last meal" if it can be given. It is merely the virtuous thing to do, you'd even give Gao a sip of his prized liquor before you tear his head from his blubbery neck. Guozhi the wise monk, discussed such matters with you once, in his words it is said to put the soul at rest before it is reborn, remove lingering grudges and attachments. To your eyes, it is merely polite to do so, a way to know that you have not become as Heartless as men like Ling and Gao.

"Tax Collector Ling is Loyal, Tax collector Ling is wise" You say, resisting the urge to laugh and spit on the floor at the lies flying from your mouth like a flock of birds "He has done nothing to arose Gao's wrath, he has nothing to fear, after all Tax collector Ling is a friend of the people, Gao is a benevolent ruler"

You set the tray of fruits, an unglazed pitcher of fish gut liquor in front of Ling as his skin continues to pale and whiten to a color even lighter than freshly fallen snow.
Cont
>>
>>4531260

He must be reflecting on all he has done and taken that would very much draw Gao's ire and cruelty.


"Of course, of course wise as ever, Lieren" He says barely able to speak as you pour him a hearty glass of the liquor, crushing a few berries and the peach in a bowl before pouring it in the glass and mixing it with a dried piece of straw "He has no reason to do away with me, I have done nothing to him! My work is...is necessary"


"I can't imagine how many men desire a position as high as yours, Ling" You say as you raise the glass to his hands, crouched over him, casting him entirely in your own shadow "But who could ever replace one as skilled, as talented as yourself"

"Exactly, exactly" He nearly whined, drinking the offered drink is a single gulp and raising the glass for another, eyes haunted "I am irreplaceable, none may fufill my duties as I do"

"Unless you have angered Gao, some way" You laugh, as if in jest as you fill Ling's glass once again, setting the platter of dried plums closer to him "and even then, your replacement would not do your duties as well as you do now"

Ling remains silent, not waiting for you to prepare his drink properly before he drains his cup, eyes staring ahead, empty of any emotion except a deep, crawling dread.

"You have nothing to fear, you're an honest man" You lie as easily as you breath, sitting back and lounging as your father skewers the fowl he was preparing in full view of Ling, blood still dripping from it as he suspends it over the crackling fire, held in place by a long metal needle. "Come, relax those unwarranted worries of yours, Wenyan, when the bird is done, please save its organs for Ling, as our honored guest"

"I am humbled" Ling says, his eyes still staring into nothing, only seeing the terrible future to come "by your generosity, the mind wanders on the road, you see, brings forth dreams most dreadful"

"We're lucky Gao is such a generous and forgiving lord" Wenyan says happily as fat begins to drip from the fowl in the fire, its skin crisping already "free of cruelties and so full of mercies"

your father laughed as you smiled.

"Yes, yes exactly, if he were a sadistic man, one who forced farmers back to their ruined homes in the midst of a famine, or asked for more each season, why Ling you'd be as good as dead" You say, as if you were joking and trying to turn the mood of the room merry "but we are ever fortunate, to live under Gao's"

You raise your hands to warm them, keeping them an inch from the flames even though they will not burn your skin.|

"Benevolent rule" You finish as Ling nods.

"Exactly, if he..if he were a" He says, covering his face with a fan, sounding as if he's about to cry "a cruel man, I would be dead if he ever found a reason to take my head! I have, merely fallen out of favour, that is not reason enough for him to have me executed, a man as loyal and honest as myself"
cont
>>
>>4531261

"Yes, it is not like he has castrated his own sons or mutilated his own wives, after all" Zian says, eyes filled with spite as he turns to Ling again, showing him his ruined face as your father stares at the tax collector.

Ling laughs nervously as you turn to Zian and begin to scold him again for ruining the atmosphere, not seriously of course. But ling barely touches the food you offer him, and stops drinking after his third glass of hard liquor .


He tries to win your favor, and friendship during his short stay, but he misunderstand what kind of man you are, and every word from his mouth and story only servers to harden your resolve to see him dead. He stays the night and leaves in the morning, watched by your guards and the brothers of panthers for his entire stay. And when he sets off to leave with his force of guards, with this season's tithe, you send Zian, one of your most trusted guards after him.

With a chart of paths and splinters of your road to take to arrive at Gao's castle before Ling, and with a careful kept list of everything you sent to Gao since you become the head of Nothing and its people. and a letter written and signed by other lords, mentioning their fears of Ling taking more than he should be allowed from their lands. the words all coming from yourself, with you writing the bulk of the complaint. But Lady Qian let her aid, and contacted those who cared of their people enough to have their own suspicions of Ling but feared his position and power.

Gathered under your banner, and with Ling having fallen from favor, this changed, and now you sent proof of Ling's trickery and greed to Gao. Proof that he had stolen what was "rightfully" his for years, and allowed his men to do so as well.

To a man like Gao, it'd be like he found him stealing directly from his own treasury. and with that, you have sealed Ling's fate, without dirtying your hands with blood as foul as his.
-

When you next see Ling, it is when you travel to Gao's castle, accompanied by all your men, to ceremonially finish your great road at the gates of his palace. He is in six parts, outside of the city beneath Gao's castle. His limbs and head have been severed, and the only skin remaining upon him is on his hands and face. To show his greed led to his end, and so all may see the horror of his final moments. The parts that make him a man have been removed, his nails pulled out, and his tongue torn and nailed to his forehead to reflect his lies and deceit.

Brands and burns cover his skinless form, and his eyes have been removed, slowly put out with heated needles by Gao's own hands, you heard from Qian Xia. The theater playing the recently penned work "The fall of the snake Ling, his lies exposed by wise Lieren to benevolent lord gao" Leaves outs the specifics of his end.
cont
>>
>>4531262

How he bled and spewed secrets spitefully as he was dragged away, how he soiled himself and exposed to true natures of all present in his final words, an act that only made his end all the more painful.

Gao kept him as a plaything for half a season, before finally allowing him to die, by having him torn by tying his limbs and heads to six horses, that were then branded at once.

And then what remained of Ling was nailed for all who travel your road to see. Disgusting.

"So, a greedy man meets and unwholesome end" Guozhi sighs, having some how snuck up on you


"Ah, wise grandfather, I am sorry such a sight had to meet your eyes" You say, clasping your hands together to greet the elderly monk with young eyes.

"My eyes have seen far worse than this, I only wish such a man will find peace in his next life" Guozhi says, falling to his knees to pray for the dead tax collector.

There's music in the air, and cheering and festivities even this far from the city's center and the palace itself. Gao is waiting for your arrival, to claim his part in the construction of the road that has united his lands and saved its people. When he only contributed to line his own pockets and increase his personal wealth and power.

Disgusting.

What do you do, Lieren?
> Join the common folk in their celebrations
> Go to Gao so he may parade you around to visiting nobles, and incite him to lose his face before them
> Openly decry Gao for his wrong doings and sinful ways, at the party he is throwing for you
> Speak with Guozhi, and pen a letter with him to secretly distribute among the masses and honest nobles, calling for Gao's head
>Write in

new thread cause the old one was getting laggy from the sheer quantity of posts. It's girth was harder than terminator armor. RIP
>>
>>4531263
Honestly? Torture's not really something i reckon is necessary. It's pretty disgusting. I mean, i don't feel bad for him at all, but when it comes to these things you're better off just getting rid of the person quickly - making the death longer does nothing but satisfy sadism.

But eh, he won't be missed.
> Join the common folk in their celebrations
Let's celebrate with the common folk, because the nobles fucking suck. But, we should also follow the plan the other anon had in the thread
>Convince Gao to let us/someone we trust in charge of "reforming" the tax/economical system as to help "rooting out corruption that bleeds money which is rightfully his". With this, we will gain an even greater amount of control.

Inciting an rebellion would do nothing but show our face too early. We have to prepare.
>>
>>4531281
+1
>>
>>4531263
>> Go to Gao so he may parade you around to visiting nobles, and incite him to lose his face before them
>>Convince Gao to let us/someone we trust in charge of "reforming" the tax/economical system as to help "rooting out corruption that bleeds money which is rightfully his". With this, we will gain an even greater amount of control.
Supporting the write in. The nobility sucks, yes, but we should Wormtongue just a little bit more. Let's do this in preparation for overthrowing Gao.
>>
>>4531281
supporting both points on this. once we're in charge of the money, we can rebuild the country really easily
>>
>>4531292
This pretty much. I don't want to talk our way to the title of lord, we just need some more control to be able to develop an sufficient fighting force to pull off a coup.

If we manage to pull of a fast coup, we won't be bogged down. Lieren is strong, yes, but i'd rather not have to fight a thousand man all by ourselves.
>>
Damn, this quest is fucking awesome, no wonder why it got so popular. I hope you get a job at Black Library QM.
>>
>>4531281
This strikes me as a good way to save lives as well. In any prolonged war, the peasants suffer the most. All of the peasants united with the honest lords, equipped with our better gear, will make short, relatively clean work of things.
+1
>>
>>4531300
My goal is equipping our soldiers with muskets at some point, they're easy to manufacture (you don't need machines because artisans can make the same type of ammo easily), they can be put in the hands of peasants without much training (It's easier to teach someone to reload and aim than it is to train them to be fit enough to fight with a spear) and it goes straight through armor while also giving a massive morale minus to the enemies (at least the first ones who won't know what the fuck is a gun)
>>
>>4531263
> Go to Gao so he may parade you around to visiting nobles, and incite him to lose his face before them

>>4531281
Gao is shit
>>
>>4531292
We can celebrate later with the men on the street. For now, we have undetectable social sabotage to do.

I wonder what the next great project we should embark on.
>>
>>4531340
How about economic conquest?
>>
>>4531281
support

we could for a military role too and reform his army
>>
>>4531347
That's not a project like the roads which we can do publicly.

I was thinking stuff like the road. Maybe village renovations? Walls like nowhere
>>
>>4531310
I think Muskets or guns will be when we are fighting against other lords or more likely other countries or empires on our march to unify the world.
>>
>>4531354
>That's not a project like the roads which we can do publicly
You’d be surprised. China invented paper money and paper money is a powerful tool for economic conquest.
>>
>>4531292
Supporting.

>>4531310
Personally I think outfitting an *entire* army with muskets is a no go - a mix of firearm soldiers and melee soldiers is the way to go. Muskets being single-shot firearms, they are best used for squads and firing lines. Well, to my limited knowledge, that is.
If the Pod contained knowledge on rifling, muskets could be outfitted to snipers as well but Shangrala's ever present fog makes long-range firing non-viable without advanced tech.
>>
>>4531363
This is correct. GLORIOUS MELEE COMBAT will still be viable on this planet.
>>
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>>4531363
>>
>>4531293
also want to add to my own point that we should say a quick prayer with Guozhi before we do any of the other things.

Lieren condemned Ling to a very long and painful death, which is a pretty cruel action in and of itself.
>>
>>4531373
I like this. Lets make muskets with bayonettes.

>>4531374
I support this too.

Honestly I just want Gao disowned of his role so we can kill him, but I'll honestly support anything if it will lead to his eventual death.
>>
>>4531263
This >>4531281
Man, we're going to look like such bitches to our brothers, by this time angron already had all the slaves in revolt
Perhaps Bigge E killed lieren for not giving into his genetic predisposition for violence and being too much of a pacifist
>>
>>4531382
Maybe, but this is nicer.
>>
>>4531372
Oh don't get me wrong, I still want artillery and explosives in our army composition. Both will serve us extremely well in sieges and breaking/breaching enemy fortifications.

>>4531373
Okay, I grudgingly admit that I completely forgot about the existence of bayonets - but melee training should still be a part in the training program of our soldiers.


Hmm. Would we still need cavalry? Enemy cavalry will be completely nullified by a fortified position manned by gunmen, but we can't always have fortifications.

>>4531382
>by this time angron already had all the slaves in revolt
By then Angron also had the Butcher's Nails in his brain, which... didn't exactly help his rational thinking.
>>4531382
>Perhaps Bigge E killed lieren for not giving into his genetic predisposition for violence and being too much of a pacifist
Honestly? the way we're playing Lieren so far is more along the same line as Alpharius Omegon's style to war except, you know, more efficient to the point rather than pacifism imo
>>
>>4531360
Make paper money then, to create an easier method of unified trade and easier economic oversight?.....yes, this can work
>>
>>4531389
Melee training, bayonet training, war gear maintenance lessons. At most I think a soldier should have is a big k-bar that can be affixed as a bayonet, the rifle, a collapsible shovel (for back up melee), munitions, general supplies, armor, food.

Cavalry is a maybe if we can teach them to ride a horse and shoot a gun at the same time. They'll be good for lightning raids.
Now that I think about it, aren't bows & arrows faster than gun? Depending on the fortifications and tactics we implements, arrows might be more useful, but probably only for a couple of situations until we can develop a more semi-auto firearm.
>>
>>4531281
+1
>>
>>4531263
>>4531281

Support
>>
>>4531374
Ph yeah, a prayer for Ling. He was a bastard but he deserved death not torture.
>>
>>4531397
We already have the Bessemer process, we can set up the machinery we need to produce cartridges. No reason to use muskets now that we have a manufacturing base required for making more modern firearms
>>
>>4531397
A dedicated melee weapon like an axe is better for melee than any multi-tool or fancy do it all shovel.
>>
>>4531408
Swords might be better since they are easier to use with martial arts.
>>
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>>4531397
>Now that I think about it, aren't bows & arrows faster than gun?
Bow&arrow is faster than a musket, yes. But requires longer training for good accuracy. Hence the need for firing lines of muskets. First line fires and crouches down to reload, second line fires while the first is reloading and so on.

Speaking of bow and arrow. Since we're in Not!Asia, I wonder if repeating crossbows already exist on Shangrala. pic related
>>
>>4531281
support.
controlling money is always nice
>>
>>4531412
Well that would be better for stealth too considering all the fog.
>>
>>4531411
How about this, swords for officers and axes/something else for grunts.

*Maybe* non-folding combat shovels for combat engineers.
>>
>>4531420
I feel like we should just have melee units and gun units like every other army, and position them accordingly

Officers do get swords, though
>>
>>4531417
My understanding on what I'm about to say is shallow, but as far as I understand the repeater crossbow loses out on power compared to a standard one. So for stealth ambushes standard single shot crossbows may or may not be better.

Becomes somewhat of a moot point if the crossbow bolts are lathered with poison, but that's another can of worms entirely
>>
>>4531412
Range and Accuracy hardly matter when you already have an maxed out vision because of the fog. If anything, guns are even better because they don't require as much aiming, just firing lines - and they trade the range we can't use for power
>>
>>4531412
Repeating crossbows are only good against unarmored people, they don't have the power to pierce a gambeson, let alone plate

>>4531425
We can do large shields and SMGs at the front of the unit, then an even mix of dedicated spearmen and and bolt action rifles with bayonets. People are underestimating our new manufacturing capabilities. Muskets are a step backwards
>>
>>4531263
>>4531281
Support
>>
>>4531442
We're not THAT advanced, though. Rifled Muskets (breech-loaded, U.S civil war stuff).

Unless we have actual factories, making actual guns would be too difficult.
>>
>>4531446
I meant to say that rifled muskets and other stuff are reasonable, but SMGs feel like too much
>>
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>>4531446
I'd put us at late 1800s era. We have the bessemer process, mass production of steel, running water, and advanced chemistry. Standardized weapon designs from Leiren allows every weapon to be made to the same standards and interchangable parts, rather than the cottage industry of muskets. The town of Nothing can easily set up factories to make martini-henry style rifles.
>>4531448
Even if we can't produce enough SMGs to outfit everyone, we can use them as a supplement to our firepower. They'll be shorter range than our rifles, but could stop a charging army in its tracks. They can be our veterans, the frontline that doesn't waver when charged by heavy cavalry.
>>
>>4531446
Lieren is much MUCH more advanced, he has innate knowledge+egg's DAoT knowledge, the problem is the world's tech level. But Lieren is a particularly intelligent and wise Primarch, he can just change yan in a year, and then next year conquer the rest of the world with super steel armours, shields, automatic guns and pikes, bayonets, swords, etc for melee.
>>
>>4531469
Pretty much. In the 40k universe, guns don't make melee obsolete.

Really, what we need is a main force composed of riflemen and halberdiers (pikemen are good too), some cavalry and some veterans. Mix and match, and have regiments of each type complementing each other.

Not some sort of tercio thing, think of it as more like having gunners supported by melee.
>>
Alright, calling the vote now

Join the common folk:10
Convince Gao to give you more power:13
Let Gao parade you around: 4

Alright so joining the common folk in celebration and then convincing Gao to give you more power by playing on greed/ paranoia wins

Writing the update

>>4531296
Thanks, glad you're enjoying it
>>
>>4531340
Something key to understand about the lords of the feudal ages is that while their treasuries are notable, a *hell* of a lot of their wealth is tied up in land. These parties take a lot of money to go through with and they like them, so let's exploit their vice.

Make a bank, be generous with initial terms, but when they miss payments...

Bonus, if we build the back on Lord Gao's treasury, then we are able to leverage him to escalate to higher authorities, potentially the Emperor in order to expand his land and bring more and more transferred to his control that we can then improve. Land that would come to us with a simple coup, potentially backed by the Emperor via ties we establish during disputes.
>>
>>4531476
A bit disappointing that we aren't more directly sabotaging Gao. But if we at least pay him his due respects before fucking off to join the commoners then we can at least avoid arousing his suspicion.

As for playing on his paranoia, we can try the angle of "Ling had served you loyally for decades, yet was a snake who stole? Let us, who has done nothing but give to you, produce a better way to avoid this occurring again"
>>
>>4531476
We can probably throw in the promise of getting proper accounting and more taxes to him by simple fact of not stealing it, as Ling stole alot from him. I bet we can lower taxes for everyone AND get more to Gao just by not wetting our beak.
>>
>>4531482
>Bonus, if we build the back on Lord Gao's treasury, then we are able to leverage him to escalate to higher authorities, potentially the Emperor in order to expand his land and bring more and more transferred to his control that we can then improve
No, that's not good. If anything, trying to do that will make Gao more suspicious of us. No one is that loyal.

We should use the power we'll get to more safely develop our forces, then pull off an quick coup. No "sucking up to the emperor" or "winning through diplomacy", any moment spent not shooting these degenerates is a moment people are unjustly killed under their rule
>>
>>4531486
While I share your concerns, Economic conquest and pruning ala lady Qian [or perhaps a straight purge once we are in power] would be more effective with less peasant lives lost.

It's partly why I wanted Gao to lose face here. A noble without face means nobody cares when they turn up dead.
>>
>>4531486
This

We want to get this province and do a coup. We can get the rest of the province administration and probably the army too just because we are that good at it.
Then Gao goes out.
>>
>>4531494
It's not going to work. We'd only get so far until the nobles start getting worried and decide to put an end.

Don't try to play the noble's game. Crush them, and the planet is free.
>>
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>>4531454
>I'd put us at late 1800s era
>martini-henry style rifles
If we're gonna give our boys some gats, let's give them something that would actually match that era of technology.
Like pic related.
>>
>>4531500
Play the game until you are able to stand on your own two feet. This means holding the province and it's peoples, then gutting Gao.

Then we can try and move on with "peaceable" terms with the emperor. I highly doubt he is a virtuous soul, but if he is then great, it's a guy to work with.
Blood and ash isn't exactly our style
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>>4531263
> Speak with Guozhi, and pen a letter with him to secretly distribute among the masses and honest nobles, calling for Gao's head
If he manages to find out it was us, then we may have to stop being sneaky about our subversion and just go straight to installing ourselves as the new ruler of this province.
I say it's well worth the risk.
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>>4531504
>Play the game until you are able to stand on your own two feet.
Yes, which is why we need to get the power from gao so we can pull the rug, not make him distrustful of us.

>Then we can try and move on with "peaceable" terms with the emperor.
If he allows men like Gao to rule, he's not a good guy. We can try "diplomacy", but we shouldn't try to"ally" him or something, we should make it clear we're going to wipe out evil and that we will not be stopped

>Blood and ash isn't exactly our style
But neither is tongue and paper, we used our connection with gao only to have an excuse to better the peasant's lives.

We really should just take over the province (preferably near winter, because it's very unlikely that they'd launch an campaign in winter)
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>>4531502
I went for something that had bayonets since they're a staple of 40k. I don't know of lever actions had bayonets

If we equip any cavalry, lever action rifles would be pretty sick.
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>>4531509
>I went for something that had bayonets since they're a staple of 40k. I don't know of lever actions had bayonets
That's the best part anon. ANYTHING CAN HAVE A BAYONET ON IT!
It just needs a way of attaching it, and that's something we can take care of with slight design modifications.
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>>4531508
Good call on winter.

That he apparently favours Gao is, indeed, not a very good sign. But the idea in my head, at the very least, is once we dispose of Gao we try the same trick twice, offering to modernise the lands of Yan and become admin of the realm and expand the prosperity of the former lands of Gao to all lands....and in doing so, gain their adoration and bettering all their lives. Then modernise the economy [as we plan to do with our new powers], and then dispose of Yan when we've rooted our self in the power structure of the land.
If he refuses to make us an admin.....Well, we did try and be nice. Have fun facing down our guns mother fucker.
>>
Thinking about it...could we skip guns and make laslocks? I seem to recall a Napoleonic-like planet that could produce them and if we are at 1800s level...
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>>4531514
If we'd gone with electricity we might've, probably not right now
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>>4531514
I have to imagine if we had the time or the resources to make laslocks, they'd be very shitty laslocks that can't stand up to the conditions found in a warzone.
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>>4531514
That's way, way too complicate and expensive. We're not vulkan.

Guns are better, easier and infinitely cheaper.
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>>4531513
He's not going to accept such an offer after we deposed Gao, it'd be obvious we would try to do it again and he'd just use the time to prepare his forces.

No matter what happens, there's going to be a war. We can choose whether it happens now and we take everyone else on, or we can wait to take everyone on later, when they're better prepared.
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>>4531508
Maybe the Emperor is a nice enough buy but Beauracracy(tm) is keeping the bad things going. It wouldn't be out of character for 40k.
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>>4531516
We did go with electricity.

>>4531520
Looking over things, it looks like I wasn't thinking of Las-Lockes in particular, but I swear there was a regiment with bolt-action lasguns styled roughly after the 1800s.
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>>4531524
We're in a medieval china, if there's any nation where an ruler could just depose an lord it would be medieval china...when it's unified, that is.
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>>4531526
That's just warhammer fashion, i mean have you looked at imperial tanks?
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>>4531526
>but I swear there was a regiment with bolt-action lasguns styled roughly after the 1800s
That's just their aesthetics in play. If they have reliable lasguns, they're lightyears ahead of us right now.
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>>4531526

>Chemicals:13
>Gunpowder:8
>Forges:12
>Electricity: 4

no we didn't, the first thread is still up, anyone can look at it.
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> A Las-Lock is an energy weapon that uses much of the same technology as a standard Lasgun or Laspistol, but more closely resembles a flintlock rifle. Las-Locks are, presumably, adaptations of present-day laser weapons technology that are used by less technologically advanced societies who have regressed from the modern day Imperial standard.
We might be able to make some.
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>>4531527
I'm talking about the bureaucrats, not the lords. The bureaucracy keeps the emperor in the dark, safe and happy and a puppet in his castle, then get to do whatever the fuck they want because they just go "trust me, bro, this is a good idea" and he stamps off on it because he doesn't know any better.
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>>4531543
I personally blame the Custodes for not acting in the Emperor's stead the past 10,000 years.
They have the authority to do so, but they're too chicken shit to do anything besides sit on all that administrative power.
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>>4531543
Oh you meant Emperor Yan, not The Emperor. My mistake.
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>>4531521
Even if it's obvious what we are doing......We are STILL providing miracles. Like this is the sort of bait that is just too good to pass up, even if the Fog panther is leering at you
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>>4531551
No, it makes them even more distrustful because they think we're going to take over like some sort of messianic cult.
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>>4531567
Even if they don't trust you, they need to get those improvements.

Anyway war is not the desired outcome due to the collateral damage in lives of the common folk drafted into the army wasted. So contain your warmongering to preparing and help come up with other options that we can try.
"Hope for the best, prepare for the worst" should be the motto here.

Hmm, if we did Coup in winter or just before the start of it, then news would travel far slower. Perhaps with our new titles and clout, we could try and cultivate allies of virtue in our surrounding lands then extend our road and dominion through them before Yan or any of the other bastards who are predisposed against us usurping Gao can move against us.
And the start of this plan can begin with a few words to lady Qian, to point out the lands around us which need tending to.
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>>4531547
The emperor didn't make them to rule like he did the primarchs
Their purpose is to protect the emperor and slay roudy subjects
It's likely that their genetically inclined to just sit on their ass instead of taking charge
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure the only time the custodes ever acted as a high lord was when they got tired of all the bullshit and started a purge
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>>4531580
>Even if they don't trust you, they need to get those improvements.
Ha! You are underestimating how greedy nobles can be. Have you ever heard about that one time an roman emperor executed an guy who had invented flexible fucking glass, just because he feared it'd damage the value of gold and silver? He destroyed that technology, and no one has been able to make it to this day. All because of greed. Do you expect them to be better?


If we couped in the winter, then we'd have a whole season to develop...we could get an army with guns and cannons, like it had been said.

After that, we basically make it clear that anyone who tries to take back the province will be blown to smithereens.
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>>4531583
I believe the Emperor had a grander purpose for the Custodes as opposed to just guarding the Imperial Palace.
To quote the Emperor himself on the subject of the Custodes
>"Each one of the Ten Thousand represents genetic lore acquired over many lifetimes. Each one of you is unique, a work of art never to be repeated. I am miserly with your lives, where I would spend so many others without a thought."
Now, if they were solely intended to be bodyguards, why treat them as such?
It's also to be noted that the Emperor approved the policies giving the Captain-General of the Adeptus Custodes "Magisterium Maxima", meaning they have complete authority over everything in the Imperium. That includes the Primarchs themselves.
The Custodes Codex mentions that the Captain-General still retains these powers as far as M42. So it'd be safe to assume, should the need arise, that the Captain-General would be able to take supreme control of the Imperium. I think the Emperor and Malcador being dead or otherwise unable to rule are reason enough to use these powers more than a handful of times in over 10 millennia.
I get being afraid of having absolute control of the Imperium, but sitting on all that power only lets all kind of rot set in while the enemies of mankind bolster their numbers and ravage worlds by the thousands.
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>>4531590
That isn't their duty. Their duty is to be utterly loyal to him and protect his mortal body. The rest of the imperium can burn, but the emperor must be protected.
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>>4531593
Kinda. They are also his closest companions.
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>>4531593
Despite being charged with protection of the Emperor, I maintain that they were given those administrative powers for a much better reason than being bodyguards.
One of those reasons being "Protect the Imperium in case I somehow fucking can't."
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>>4531584
No, I haven't. But still you are being paranoid, which is good, but keep your war boner in your pants until someone else tries shit.

So with a season to develop, We'd better have the technology already basically done [Ie have muskets or whatever the fuck gun] so we can begin moving them to mass production immediately after the coup.
Then after that, Open friendly ventures with the men and women of virtue in the surrounding courts, while the lesser corrupt and decadent nobles of Gao's land will be slain in the uprising.

>>4531601
The reason they were given Magistratirium Lex Ultima [complete authority, speaking with the emperors word] is because they were also agents of the emperor, sent out to do shit for him and he wasn't going to have any of his household defied. So he enshrined it in law that his custodes spoke with his authority, and he made sure that their loyalty was completely beyond any shadow of a doubt so that it wouldn't be abused.

And this doesn't translate to "protect the imperium", it is "protect the Emperor" which they have done with a frankly disturbing engineered obsession.
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>>4531614
No, anon. You don't understand. Do you really think they'll just let us be after we coup gao? No, they'll send armies after us. Which is why we need to prepare on winter, arm our soldiers and forge our cannons so when they come, the only ones who has to die is the enemy.
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>>4531614
TO ADD ONTO THIS!
The Emperor is explicitly and repeatedly says that he is a Human supremesist, Post humans like astartes, primarchs and custodes and himself are not fit to rule humanity. His intent was to reunify the imperium then vanish after taking the astartes and primarchs out back and putting a bullet between their eyes, save magnus who was going to control the imperial webway.

Why would the Emperor, man who was going to have his sons decommissioned or executed once their war use was expended due to being post human, give the other post humans control over the empire with the purpose of ruling it, if the emperor dies?

>>4531620
>Do you really think they will let us be?
Yes. Gao loses favour, he is slain and we take over, life goes on and nobody gives a shit. Welcome to ancient china.
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>>4531624
>Welcome to ancient china.
Or, more accurately, Gao is slain, the nobles go 'oh shit' when they realize that an charismatic genius giant just took down an lord and move to take him down before they become his next meal.
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"I wish the same, I knew his end would be a painful one, but such savagery I could not possibly imagine" You say quietly as the monk remains on his knees, and you remain staring at the dead man's eyeless gaze. You expected cruelty, sadism from Gao, but to such a degree, even you yourself could not have foretold the depths that that man would go to in fulfilling his sadistic pleasures. Ling deserved death, pain, but to what extent. Seeing his mutilated corpse unnerves you, even if you despised the Tax Collector from the day you first met him. You realize, that the minds of other men do not function as yours does, you've known this since you first watched the farmers of Nothing as they starved.

They take illogical courses of action, and do things inefficiently. You knew this, that your mind followed different paths than that of the common man. You simply couldn't see the point in extending an execution for days, for weeks, for months simply to torment the accused. It was pointless effort, just a way to exert power and inflict fear. Inefficient, terribly inefficient and needlessly cruel. Seeing Ling butchered reminds you of exactly what you're fighting against, with subtleties and benevolence. The true depravity of Gao, and his fellows. Disgusting beasts carousing in the skins of men, predating all beneath them, using lives as fuel for their sick sadistic vices.

"With a stroke of a brush, fate is decided, with a single pebble tossed into the sea, a wave is born" Guozhi says, breaking his silence but keeping his head down and eyes shut as he continues to prey for the sinful corpse before him "Young Lieren, your mind has no place for cruelty, like an untainted pond. I have seen your fury Lieren, and it is cold but not cruel. This is the monstrosity the Dai removed themselves from, look upon the work of souls twisted and corrupted, and know they would do the same for far less"

"I know, I've spoken with Gao and the truth of him was revealed to me, even before I looked upon him, I simply underestimated his sheer brutality" You whisper, even though you and Guozhi stand alone, off the path where Ling has been hung like a hunting trophy, broken and torn "Though I saw it for my own eyes and heard tales spoken of it, I could not fathom on expending so much effort on such a pointless thing, making another man suffer in such a terrible way"

"You would have done better to have plucked his head from his shoulders yourself, even if it would've dirtied your hands, instead of feeding him to a beast" Guozhi whispers back to you as he stands "But what is done, is done. I cannot fault you for seeking to remove the corruption Ling was an incarnate of, but I can mourn the man who suffered such a fate"

"As can I, even though my heart holds no sorrow for his death" You reply stoically, hardening your resolve as you turn and leave the corpse where it stands, nailed to wooden pillars to be made a mockery of long after his flesh rots away to nothing
Cont
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>>4531629

"The tragedy in his end, is that a cruel man was slain by another far crueler than himself, a man who yet remains amongst the living" You continue on, ruefully spitting upon the path as Guozhi nods.

"The man you yet serve" Guozhi mutters quietly, under his breath as you nod "and bring much wealth and bounty, for a good cause of course, but, even acts of kindness can bring suffering from the ripples they create"

"I will deal with the beast that devoured Ling, but not yet, it is too early, grandfather" You whisper as you walk the path to the city "Let us stop speaking of such things, lest we be heard"

"I do not fear death, Lieren, it is not the end" The old monk says, eyes still closed as he presses his palms together "Whatever actions you take, are your own and preformed with good intentions, if you were to act upon your impulses today, I would not reprimand you, for a man is only in control of his own fate"

"You do not know how tempted I am, oh wise one" You say through gritted teeth as you rap your wide knuckles on the gate into the city and raise your voice to a shout "Yah, Lieren of Nothing, Administrator of Gao approaches!"

"And now you once again place on your mask" Guozhi cackles quietly, as he turns to leave you, vanishing into the fog that surrounds the city, singing hymns and mantras to himself as he leaves "Good fortune, youth with the golden eyes, may your spirit ever find its way home"

"And to you as well, Grandfather" You call out to him, as the gates slowly creak open, unleashing a wave of sound and scents. Spiced food, alcohol, smoke from cooking meat, burning oil and wax and paper.

"Greetings, honored administrator, Gao awaits you at his palace" One of Gao's men, wearing his pink armor and jeering, laughing mask says. Your own men have been stationed further down the road, to protect them in case Gao has a mind to attempt to rid himself of you as well. A precaution that hopefully is not necessary

"Please" another man, with his face also hidden beneath a grinning mask says, clasping his hands together and bowing "Follow us to him, he is awaiting your arrival to start the festivites"

You look over the two men's heads and at the people celebrating and dancing, wearing white masks with golden circles painted around their eyes, and manes of feathers and wool died grey with ash. Cheering and laughing, young and old, men and women in a fevered festival. Sparks fly from piles of burning powder, and you can see entertainers snaking through the streets and plazas already. Balancing plates, making streams of brightly colored cloth of azure and plum dance in the air.

And past all of it, you can see a broad shouldered man, almost tall enough to reach your chest with his eyes dressed in ornate armor made of painted wood and leather, dancing around a great toad faced dragon colored black and grey made of fabric, puppeteered by a wooden framework held up by stakes held by ten men
cont
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>>4531633

"It seems to my eyes that the festival has already started" You say with a deep resonating laugh, originating from your stomach and loud enough to cause nearby metal to shake "Or have my eyes for the first time in my life upon Shangrala, deceive me?"

"The peasants festival is separate from the official celebration" The second guard replies as if by some mechanization worked into where his brain should be "You are the honored guest and as such it shall not begin without your presence"

You ignore the man as he tries to urge you to follow him.

"Tell great lord Gao I shall be with him shortly, I wish to partake in the local celebration before joining him and his other guests" You say, stepping past them, the younger of the two almost moving his spear to block your path before the older of the two snarls.

"You think to stop Lord Lieren? He slew a beast that devoured hundreds, he would break you as easily as a twig beneath his foot!" He yells before turning to you, eyes filled with panic as you slowly meander past the two of them, smiling a gentle and kindly smile as you do so "Do enjoy yourself as much as you please, oh honorable administrator of the lands of Gao"

"I thank you for your hospitality, may your journey find you well" You say as you join the throng of common men and women, smiling joyously as you see the ripest fruit of your most arduous of labors. People from all corners of Gao's lands, joined together in celebration, no longer terrified, no longer hungry. Hope and joy returned to their lives along with the food in their bellies, comfort introduced to even the most hard worked of laborers

Its a thing of beauty, and something truly rare happens as you soak in all the sights and sounds, all the laughter and joy. Tears well up in your eyes, and a sense of pride and accomplishment fills your chest and heart. You allow yourself to feel pride for what your hands have wrought, instead of merely imagining the next course of action to take, or what next to make with the result of your work. You have done it, in the lands of Gao, not one child goes hungry, not one man fears the fog or what winter will bring. You can see it! you can see it! The end result of a lifetime, however short, of toil and struggle. Of blood split and blisters made.

Against all that would see you stopped, and your labor made for naught, you had done it. Prosperity had come, plenty had come, to all men and women and children, to all souls that lived in Gao's lands. And then, these bright, happy thoughts were dashed away by a single thought.

'And Gao would ruin it all to satiate his own ego' you think, smile twisting into a snarl in an instant as a feral urge to protect those you had raised so high burns in your thoughts. How easily it'd be to remove Gao, to keep him from threatening this peace, this prosperity. From abusing all of your work and creations to wreck havoc and terror upon the common man, to feed his sadism! to feed his greed!
cont
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>>4531635

"Momma, momma, its the giant! the giant!" A small voice calls out, freeing you from the grasp of your own murderous rage as you see the world clearly again, and see a little girl, so thin and skinny, yet alive and healthy still "The giant has come, the giant has come!"

And suddenly, all the wrath, the fury at deeds yet uncommitted fades, as you see this small child, excitedly pointing at you, pulling on her mother's simple dress of spun cloth, both their eyes filled child like wonder at catching a glimpse of you. at merely spotting you, Lieren who came from nothing. Lieren who built the road, who brought the food, who slew the brigands, who connected the lands and made miracle. Lieren, a hero in there eyes. It astounded you.

After seeing the lengths would go to find pleasure, to find enjoyment, to please themselves, the fact that merely being among them would bring such pure, wholesome joy to someone was almost enough to make you cry again. Such purity, spending as long as you have among serpents and beasts, it was like a summer rain. Cleansing and purifying.

Slowly, awkwardly you raise you hand to greet the little girl, and next thing you know, men of all creeds and birth come up to you, wearing masks made in your own likeness, excitedly shouting your name and the titles that have been given to you by the common folk. Some are bold enough to touch you, others scream thanks and praises as you walk by them, other still throw flowers and alcohol at your feet. A musician begins to pluck his Guqin, another glides a bow across the Huqin, a Bawu's song joins in the chorus, followed by a veritable army of Guban pounded and tapped in unison.

The song "Kind Golden Eyes" Written by some of your own guards in your travels, Rong and Chen to be precise, is sung, by young women with heavenly voices, by the crowd, by the children. And, despite your great self control, you begin to laugh and even sing along with them, becoming to center of the festival as you travel the streets, simply enjoying the fact that such a celebration could exist outside of a castle walls, and remain untainted by excess and depravity.

It is a humbling experience, an enjoyable experience. And you are so entertained, for the first time in your short life, you've lost track of time, surrounded by such pure untainted joy and revelry. It is a very different sort than what Gao enjoys, what most of the nobles enjoy. It reminds you of your home, so distant from where you stand.

But unfortunately, all things must come to an end, and eventually, for the good of the people and those who serve Gao, you leave the adoring crowds and loving people, to join their cruel master in his own celebrations. They are so bold, the mob follows you up to the hill leading to Gao's dreadful palace of deprived decadence.
cont
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>>4531628
Anon, Are you under the illusion that I said "Don't make guns, train forces or prepare for a coutner attack" when I said "Move our guns to mass production, then after that move to trying to make friendly ties with our nabours" which I said in the hopes to avoid as much conflict with those nearest to us as possible?

Because you're acting like I'm saying we should do nothing after the coup and hope it works for the best.
And as for "welcome to ancient china" half of them will seek to inudate themselves with us, because we are a charismatic genius giant magic man with obvious potential to reach emperorship or other high status, while the other half tries to crush us while we are relatively small.
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>>4531590
>To quote the Emperor himself on the subject of the Custodes
This is getting into controversial nulore, but the emperor fakes love and affection for his creations. Quotes like that should really be taken with a grain of salt
>It's also to be noted that the Emperor approved the policies giving the Captain-General of the Adeptus Custodes "Magisterium Maxima", meaning they have complete authority over everything in the Imperium. That includes the Primarchs themselves.
In effect this just means the custodes can fufil his orders and do what needs be done without having to worry about red tape. Even when he was alive they did very little ruling
>I get being afraid of having absolute control of the Imperium,
I wouldn't call it being afraid, I'd call it being absolutely disintrested. The custodes are consistently characterized as being gigantic dicks who can at times make inquisitors look like salamanders, they care very little about anyone but the emperor and other custodes and they carry our purges without care.
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>>4531638

There are fresher bodies than Ling strung up along the road up to his castle, but behind you, you hear the fading cheers and cries of all the lives you've bettered and saved, and the fading notes of another song "Benevolence in azure and plum". You yourself, whistle a hunting tune, marching up past the dead, each body further cementing your ambitions to cut Gao's head from his disgusting neck the very moment and opportunity presents itself.

The guards outside of the gate stand at attention, as they spot you approaching, hands pressed together as if in prayer, flowers and beads strung around your arms and neck. A truly bright and stunning grin on your face, a joyful expression greeting the world with kindness and warmth.

They bring their spears to the wooden maroon and pink lacquered gate, announcing your arrival.

And not a breath after, the gates swing open, and you see tired, and exhausted noble men, with untouched tables of delicacies and drinks, barely clothed girls and women lounging alongside with musicians resting by their instruments.

There's a loud, hollow sounding cheer as you enter and spot Gao smoldering in anger in his high backed chair, either forged entirely of gold, or covered in gold leaf, shaped in the symbol of his family, the entwining twin dragons.

You clasp you hands together and bow as Gao glares at you and then smiles.

"At long last, the guest of honor has decided to bless us with his presences, now the feast may begin" Gao says, clapping his hands together as you calmly stride to his side, the other nobles ignoring you the second they're allowed to dig into their cold plates of food and pour themselves deep glasses of plum wine and peach brandy. Though you smell the scent of the liquor brewed from fish guts somewhere among the accompaniments.

"Enjoy to your hearts desires, these delicacies have only reach my kitchens thanks to Lieren's work and labor of my lands, at my behest" Gao says, turning a spiteful stare to you as you sit in the smaller chair beside him, smiling still. You don't touch the food in front of you, covered in cooled fat and thickened sauces.

"I see you've been furthering your reputation" Gao whispers to you, despite the two you sitting on a platform high above the rest of the guests, even visiting Lord Huang Tengfei and Lady Luó Biya "Oh how the common folk adore you, my giant"

"One must never miss and opportunity for advancement" You say, meaning something entirely different than what Gao imagines, no doubt, for you speak of advancement for others rather than yourself alone "And I am shocked that such a loyal servant as Ling would betray you in such a manner, I couldn't believe it myself, Lord Gao"

Gao clicks his tongue and downs his drink, looking over his guests with wild eyes.
cont
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>>4531641

"He was a worm who thought he was a dragon, bolder than the rest of these rats, but vermin still" Gao hisses, slamming his cup down as he glance to you with a relaxed smile "But not you, you know your place in this world, and seek only the favor of the masses, far wiser than any of these imbecile"

Imbeciles who include Lady Qian and the third son of Yin, who either could have Gao's head served to the King of Yan and be praised for it.

"That is why I favor you Lieren, you know the hand that feeds you and not to bite it" Gao continues, somehow still not noticing how much you despise him and his kind "And you make me a far richer man than I would be without your genius at my command"

"Oh that is far too great a compliment for a humble administrator" You laugh as Gao cackles, black grease coating his autumn red beard, reminding you off the Toad dragon. How easy it'd be to crush his skull, right now, with just your two hands. Outwardly, you continue to smile blissfully

"Oh stop with the act, would you have me believe you played with the peasants as their humble hero merely for their enjoyment as well? HAR~!" He says, sounding on the edge of hysterics "None of the dogs can hear us from here, they are not deserving to hear my voice, not even the lord of Huang, not even the mother of young lord Luó, they are all beneath us, Lieren, all of them, suckling at my teats like starving infants"

You keep smiling, calculating how far you could throw this bloated bastard if you really put your back into the effort.

"Of course, of course" You say, to keep from saying more and losing your self control, and ending this worm's life with a twist of your wrist. it'd be as easy as snapping the neck of a fowl.

"Still not drinking eh? they can see you I suppose, and you must keep up that virtuous monk like facade you so cultivate" Gao says with a swine like snort "So, the road is finished, and already I am as rich as Yan himself, if not more so, I have heard of miracles created by your hand"

"Oh I was keeping that a surprise for you" You chuckle as Gao cackles, snorting and wheezing as he does so "A gift to alongside the bounty of the road'

"HAR!" He bellows, slapping his knee "Soon Gao will be an even brighter gem in the crown of Yan, brighter than noble Yan himself, but enough boasting, I want more, Lieren, more jade in my lands, more wealth in my hands. Tell me, what is your next endeavor for the prosperity of the "people"

Gao twists a strand of his beard, licking his lips hungrily

"Well, Ling's betrayal has alerted me to a problem, a cancer in the lands of Gao" You say with a gentle and soft tone, closing your eyes as you spoke "A choking corruption with in your system of taxation and economy, who knows much wealth greedy men have taken from the people, from you, my most benevolent lord"

"Oh, do you intend to slaughter my tax men?" He asks, as if amused by the idea, eyes twinkling with joy at the thought
cont
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>>4531642

"I'd love to see all those worms strung up high, and sent to join that bastard Ling in hell!

He slams his fist into the table between the two of you, shaking the plates and alcohol upon it

"I suggest, that I be allowed to reform the organization, to root out the corrupt who would bleed wealth from your coffers, to utterly remake the economy of Gao" You say, placing a hand between your twin hearts "I have set the groundwork, for true prosperity in your lands, Let me build upon it, and construct an idol of jade from all the pieces I have lain"

Gao waves his hand dismissively.

"As always you have my full support, and backing" Gao says bluntly, still waving his hand in the air as he takes a long drink from his chalice "Whatever you need, I shall pay and give freely, so long as I see results, I expect my tithes to be heavier and more bountiful than ever, in exchange for letting you run rampant"

And like that, you have permission to remove any "Weeds" you wish from the Lands of Gao. The fool didn't realize what you were having him order you to do.

Tax collectors, scribes, soldiers, generals, and noble men. All have rotten foundations, and impact the flow of wealth and prosperity. And can be removed upon your command, with this decree

"As you command" You say barely able to hide your glee and excitement at the reforms and changes you shall bring to the lands of Gao "My most benevolent lord".

"Tch, how stifling" Gao complains under his breath "Bring me Jade and gold, and I shall allow anything, give you whatever you desire"

His eyes glint with greed

"And speaking of desire, my daughters have been blossoming wonderfully in the last years" He says in a most vulgar manner. How easy it'd be to end his disgusting life

What do you do, Lieren?
> Accept the invitation to be introduced to his daughters, to save them from this monster
> With the aid of Xia and Lei, begin Gao's downfall, by removing his long time supporters from power
> Mention to Gao you have plans beyond brining prosperity, and could bring a yet unseen miracle to his court if he were to pay you more (Pay which would go to the people and your efforts to benefit all of them)
> Ask if Gao would like to hear the story of how you slew a dragon, and use the chance to vent your hatred of the man to him openly
>Write in
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>>4531644
>> With the aid of Xia and Lei, begin Gao's downfall, by removing his long time supporters from power
>>
>>4531644
> Accept the invitation to be introduced to his daughters, to save them from this monster
> With the aid of Xia and Lei, begin Gao's downfall, by removing his long time supporters from power
>>
>>4531644
Does someone have an excuse as to why not see his daughters? Trying to save them as of now would not work, it'd just pop up questions. We will deal that once gao is hanging from the gallows.
>Ask if Gao would like to hear the story of how you slew a dragon, and use the chance to vent your hatred of the man to him openly
This works as an way to redirect the talk and allows lieren to let off some steam without the fool discovering any of it.

Other than that,
> With the aid of Xia and Lei, begin Gao's downfall, by removing his long time supporters from power
They're corrupt. We just need to make gao think that this corruption is hurting him.
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>>4531644
>Remove his supporters

>>4531660
Still not a noble, I think, so we still don't "deserve" the daughters. And lets be frank, we aren't served by meeting them, except perhaps finding some savant among their number.
Yeah, I guess if we wanted to look for useful people amongst his daughters, then that'd be a reason to go with this course of action. If we find none, then we at least know who is cruel and who is not for when the purge comes.
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>>4531660
More specifically, i'm trying to say, is why we're going full friendly with the daughters but not actually doing anything. Because we're not going to do anything.

Maybe something about being a commoner or keeping the appearance of being an good pure monk?
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>>4531664
>Still not a noble, I think, so we still don't "deserve" the daughters.
Gao still thinks we're just like him but happen to be keeping the appearance of someone who is humble. It'd be wiser to make it less "Oh, i'm not worthy" and more of an "At a later date" (because there will be no later, so there's nothing to worry about)
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>>4531644
> Politely decline the invitation to be introduce to his daughters. Cite the sheer size difference between yourself and most women as the most prevalent incompatibility
At the very least, Gao would interpret it as a dick joke and almost die laughing.
> With the aid of Xia and Lei, begin Gao's downfall, by removing his long time supporters from power
IT BEGINS
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>>4531644
>With the aid of Xia and Lei, begin Gao's downfall, by removing his long time supporters from power
Daughters will help us little, the only power they could give us is to denounce gao in public, and that would be shameful of them to do in not-chinaland
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>>4531665
Oh right, you wanted one for Gao personally.

>"I must maintain my image as a relentless task master, devoid of pleasures. A wife would break this mask."
Pun in that it would reveal just how much I hate you to her, no longer appearing as the sycophant of Gao
>"Your daughters are not mathmaticians or scribes, they are of no use to my efforts to bring you wealth good lord"
More blunt but gets the point across
>"I would hate to kill them on the marriage bed, I'm sure you yourself can relate to the problems of being to "large" for your partner"
A joke which is framed as a dick joke, with a gesture to the lower regions, while actully being a jab at him being a fat and ugly bastard whore.
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>>4531668
Actually, that's an fair excuse. I mean, they're chinese noblewomen, have you read about the kind of shit they did to keep them 'good looking'? They literally stunted their development, they're probably thin as fuck too. If we tried to do something they'd actually die, no joke.
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>>4531674
I think an mix of
>Dude, i'm way too large, i'd probably kill your duaghters (end it at that, the simplest the better) and then
>Also, an wife would most likely make me seem like less of an pure, completely serious peasant figure
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>>4531675
>have you read about the kind of shit they did to keep them 'good looking'?
The most I know of it lead based makeup, starving them constantly, and smashing their feet to keep them small.
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>>4531677
That'd probably work well.
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>>4531644
> With the aid of Xia and Lei, begin Gao's downfall, by removing his long time supporters from power
>>
>>4531678
That's a big part of it, but there's also other stuff like their teeth treatment.

Regardless, i'm fairly certain that only some kind of amazon would even be able to handle a primarch. I don't know how tall we are compared to our brothers, but we're without a doubt taller than 3 meters.

We would actually kill if we tried to get in bed with an normal woman.
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>>4531644
>> Ask if Gao would like to hear the story of how you slew a dragon, and use the chance to vent your hatred of the man to him openly
>> With the aid of Xia and Lei, begin Gao's downfall, by removing his long time supporters from power
time for coup
>>
>>4531689
How can Chaste kisses on the cheeks and gentle cuddling under the covers Kill someone?
>>
>>4531689
>That's a big part of it, but there's also other stuff like their teeth treatment.
Elaborate.
>Regardless, i'm fairly certain that only some kind of amazon would even be able to handle a primarch
These terms are acceptable.
>>
>>4531695
We're a primarch anon, we don't have an romantical drive.Most likely because the emperor doesn't them to spawn an stable race of superhumans.

I mean, can you imagine if fucking fulgrim could have kids like normal people?
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>>4531699
I remember the han chinese had a bunch of stuff about teeth blackening or something. Real fucking weird.
>These terms are acceptable.
Too bad emps removed our ability to appreciate amazons, huh?
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>>4531701
It was a joke that Lieren was too pure to consider sex, similar to the monks others purport him to be. I know the lore well enough.
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>>4531703
>Too bad emps removed our ability to appreciate amazons, huh?
DAMN YOU EMPEROR!
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>>4531705
>The emperor made us in the image of the perfect human form, to fight against that which would defile it.
>He also removed our ability to appreciate the perfect human form, leaving us to defend things we have no concept of the value it holds.

Like pottery
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>>4531707
Man when you put it that way, no wonder half of them fell to chaos.
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>>4531703
I thought that was the japanese? Apparently it helps prevent tooth decay

Though it seems like Gao uses something like betel nut, with black juice rather than red. Shit's disgusting, every street in the solomon islands is strained with the spit from it
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>>4531709
Who wants to fight for an empire which denies you cuddles with the cute/muscly girls?
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>>4531707
Honestly, i don't know whether that's the emperor having literally zero foresight while trying to make it so we don't spawn a whole race of our own or if it was tzeentch playing him in 900th dimensional chess (because the emperor had to deal with chaos to get the primarchs, if i remember correctly)
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>>4531714
To be fair, the normals still have that opportunity, it's just primarchs and marines which don't have it because the emperors sees them as replaceable tools made for an specific purpose.

Too bad the average normal doesn't have the strength or wealth required to go to an deathworld and find himself a bonafide amazon waifu, though.
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>>4531714
Truly none can escape the grim darkness of the far future.
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>>4531709
I think about it like this:
The emperor delibreatly created multiple unbalanced, min-maxed, children, knowingly programed their personality flaws and other such things into their genetics. It should come as no suprise that the primarch project produced absolute manchildren like perturabo and mortarion and that his sons were constantly at each others throats. He's only really blameless for angron and lorgar being fucked up
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>>4531722
Presumably the character flaws would've been dealt with by being raised among the custodes and tutors. Growing up as a slave, watched over by the eye of terror or implanted with butcher's nails really messes with a growing boy's mental state
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>>4531728
Not sure if a tutor could help someone like Konrad, tbf.
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>>4531746
If not the Tutors, then the Emperor himself.
I'm sure he'd have been able to help with Konrad's constant visions.
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>>4531746
he'd probably need a psychologist from birth, but I think a lot of his problems were environmental. If he'd known that his other brothers were plagued with visions of the future and could change them, he wouldn't have become so insane. Probably still a sociopath, but that's a lot better than being psycho batman
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>>4531722
There’s also the fact he was negligent. Like seriously half of the problems could have been avoided if he bothered to be a father.
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>>4531644
>With the aid of Xia and Lei, begin Gao's downfall, by removing his long time supporters from power
>>
>>4531754
He had 30,000 years to learn how to be one, never did.
Some things just aren't meant to be.
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>>4531754
This is assuming that when malcador said primarch war was a feature, not a bug, he was lying.

Which fair, he lies a lot, but it isnt out of the question that the emperor deliberately intended for a chaos less heresy to occur and decimate the primarch ranks.
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>>4531644
>Accept the invitation to be introduced to his daughters, to save them from this monster
>With the aid of Xia and Lei, begin Gao's downfall, by removing his long time supporters from power

Both of these
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>>4531796
I don't know about that, he got rid of second and eleventh real quick, and he sure as hell didn't intend for magnus to fuck up and destroy the webway project.

If anything, i feel like this was a multi-faceted problem: the emperor was a shitty father, the planet where the primarchs grew up were (mostly) shitty, the chaos gods played them for a trick because emps had to deal with the devil to get the primarchs in the first place and the primarchs themselves were also asshats of their own volition.
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>>4531802
>he got rid of second and eleventh real quick
That does bring up another thing.
What might Lieren do that causes him to be all but erased from existence?
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>>4531829
To be fair, the second primarch wasn't lieren.

Lieren is the effect of the second primarch being flung into a different planet by malal, the wannabe chaos god.

As for what he did, i'm going to guess there's probably a big chance he might have sided with xenos or tried to betray the empire cold turkey, as opposed to lorgar's slower chaos heresy.
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>>4531835
Lieren seems predisposed to diplomacy and compassionate enough to attempt to negotiate with non-hostile xenos. That might be a bit of repeated history, if the 2nd canon primarch allied with xenos as well.
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>>4531839
Not really, from what we got the IInd primarch was some kind of cold, joyless bitter hypocrite.
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>>4531846
So mortarion?
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>>4531846
What does that have to do with whether or not Lieren will use diplomacy with xenos or break with the Imperium?
>>
Calling the vote now

Begin the downfall of Gao:10
Help his daughters: 3
Tell the story of how you killed the TD:2

Alright, so Lieren will begin to set in motion Gao's downfall.

Writing the update
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>>4531644
>> With the aid of Xia and Lei, begin Gao's downfall, by removing his long time supporters from power
>> Mention to Gao you have plans beyond brining prosperity, and could bring a yet unseen miracle to his court if he were to pay you more (Pay which would go to the people and your efforts to benefit all of them)
Start strangling his powerbase and his treasury.
>>
"Unfortunately, my most generous lord" You say, setting your hands on top of your knees as you glance over to Gao, his bloated stomach rising and falling as as he practically inhales his liquor through his nose as he samples its aroma instead of merely guzzling it down like a man dying from sun stroke given water "I will once again have to decline the offer to meet with your children, after all, what would the people think if their hero met with the lords daughters"

Gao growls, taking a extended moment to sip his plum wine as holding up a hand, commanding you to remain silent so he may fully enjoy. He takes a breath, vapors visibly rising from his lips as his eyes roll back.

"Speak" he barks as you resist the ever present urge to end this monster of a man's life, there's a fruit cutting knife on the table between the two of you, clean of grim and juice. It'd slide easily past his skin, cutting fat and meat a like to open his throat. With your reflexes, Gao would be choking on his fading life within to span of two short breaths. Smiling despite the foulness sitting next to you, you calmly continue explaining your refusal to pointless meet the spawn of Lord Gao's tainted loins.

"And, how few have been given the delight of knowing even one of your daughters" you say casually as Gao grins and swirls his drink in his hands, clearly drawing his own conclusions about you once again "Rats grow jealous when they see a loyal hound fed, after all"

"Speaking like a monk again. But you have a point, if word spread of the "meeting" I'm sure we'd both be troubled by no end of banal bickering and complaints" Gao sighed, pouring a peach liquor into the glass of his plum wine, despite it still being half way filled "I have many hidden rooms in my estates, it could remain a secret till the end of time itself"

"And, I do not wish to harm any member of your family, consider the stallion, a mighty beast worthy of respect. Consider the fragile flower, a beauty for all to enjoy" You explain, trying your best to politely avoid the very topic of meeting any members of Gao's abused and perhaps terribly twisted family "But when they meet, the flower is irrevocably damaged, destroyed"

Gao shook his head.

"Bah, I have many daughters, find one who can endure it" Gao says, igniting your smoldering fury once more with his casual disregard for his own kin, it takes all of you will to to not take the heavy set bottle resting between you and using it to crack his skull, dashing the corroded grey matter within over the feast below. How many of the guests would cease their gluttony? How many below would truly care outside of their own safety.

"The rest are useless to me anyways, their spawn will not be of my line, so they have no value outside of what others place in them" Gao explains, with a soft, almost gentle expression in his face like he was an old woman talking about her flower garden "What's one or two daughters less, hah! what is one or two sons less"
cont
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>>4532000

The fat slug smiles despite the poison that just left his lips.

"It would" You say, staring straight ahead, trying to picture a serene lake upon a mountain, with only a light blanket of fog. Bird song, the feeling of the wind, cool winter air, the scent of cooking meat the result of a successful hunt, the company of friends. Casual laughter. Nothing else, bliss, calm bliss.

"Ah some hesitation" Gao cackles, raising one his red eyebrows as he raises his silk covered arm towards you laughing "Could it be your act is finally breaking down, that I have found the one temptation you will allow yourself to devour"

Don't kill Gao, don't kill Gao, don't kill Gao. it will only lead to chaos and further bloodshed, do not kill Gao. you'd rather have dinner with that damnable Toad Dragon! at least that abomination did not speak its disgusting thoughts, nor revel in its degeneracy. Every time you meet with Gao you leave furious on the edge of having ended the dog's miserable life. You can't stand men like Gao, at least Ling didn't create a false Lieren in his mind to the degree Gao does. He thinks your soul and virtue is as corroded as his has become.

"It would ruin the image I have so carefully cultivated, of a humble and wise farmer risen to a position at which he can help his fellow man, throughout your lands, throughout Yan, throughout all of Shangrala" You explain, pressing your hands together as Gao gives you a disbelieving look but you can see in his eyes he "understands" your reasoning "If I mingled with the daughters of my employer and master, it would simply ruin my image as pure and serious laborer"

"Perhaps I should snip one of the buds growing in my realm, I'm certain there's a family we could be rid of" Gao muttered looking over "Then you wouldn't have to worry about that image of yours, and could freely indulge like a normal man, with your own land beyond a remote village"

Normal man? how different a world did Gao must live in. And you'd be pruning his "Garden" of many "buds" soon enough. And Remote? More trade passed through Nothing than Gao's own city! How blind was this greedy swine? You had thought he had at least some sense to be aware of the world around him. He only saw the profit, not the function of trade and its routes. What a fool, what a hopeless fool.

"Face is more important than any land or title, Lord Gao" You say with a smile, resting your head against your knuckles as Gao shrugs

"Won't buy armies, food or drink, money is worth more than face, how's that for sagely wisdom" Gao snorts shaking his head "There, no we both talk like those fools at Dai, happy now?"

You laugh at what Gao considers a joke, turning your thoughts from your desires to be rid of Gao and what method would be the quickest and cleanest to cut his life short with, to thoughts on where to strike first, in terms of which "Weeds" to pull, who to remove.
cont
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>>4532001

The best method, would be to remove Gao's foremost supporters, and then spread out from their, purging the nobility under Gao of its rotten elements, either destroying their lines if all of them are lost to the corruption that has consumed so many or allowing them to be replaced by a more virtuous heir, more loyal to you, Qian Xia, and Yin Lei than Gao.

To accomplish this, you'll have Lady Qian use her wiles and connections to reveal or forge crimes against Gao, from among his most loyal of supporters. This will drive Gao further into paranoia, trusting you as his loyal hunting hound as you remove the pillars that keep his extravagant lifestyle a float. Unfortunately, Qian will ask of her own favors and use you as an instrument towards her own designs. But, that should be simple enough and will align with your task in the end anyways. The removal of corrupt elements from Gao's court. it will be a thorough cleansing.

and for it to work, you'll need the black general, the Unbroken Thunder's howl, Yin lei and his tactical genius on your side. Nobility will not lie down and die like a wounded cliff jumper, they'll fight tooth and nail and call every ally and favor they have to survive. Qian may be able to isolate most lords beneath Gao, but she cannot take command of their armies away. And should they see their coming death fast approaching, by your hands, Yin's or Gao's, they will huddle behind their walls and armies.

A careful, delicate hand will be required to pluck these weeds from the garden. You'll need to know which men to remove first, to weaken the foundations of Gao's rule. And for that, you will need to speak with Qian. Which may take some time, especially since Gao may grow envious of your closeness with her or become insulted that you prefer her company to his daughters. A letter would suffice.

But while you wait, there is work to be done else where. It would be a much easier work than making the road, surely
-

"Please, please my lord have mercy, I..I merely lost the shipments, I swear this upon the courts, all eight courts! have meeercy" A liar screams as your men prepare to kick the chair holding him up and keeping his neck intact from under his feet. He was one of Late Ling's kin, a tax collector who grew fat on "extra tithes" He took for himself, you had caught him trying to enforce his own demands on a village you had personally saved.

And out of tax season, and his men had admitted to his actions when you and your personal guard came upon them. His sentence was decided, all that was left was to carry it out. Rong stood next to the man, trying not the breath lest the stench of the Tax collector's soiled silk garments and the filth within overcame his heightened since of smell.

The man might have gotten a less public death, if he had only not threatened a child with in this lonely village as you approached. That action condemned him to a public, and humiliating death under the eyes of those he abused.
cont
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>>4532003

"By Lord Gao's decree, any who are found embezzling Lord Gao's wealth, or pilfering tithes destined for his coffers, shall be executed as his administrator decides" You read from a scroll giving you this power to decide if a man lives or die, with the twin gold dragons of the Gao family woven into its scarlet back "As well as any who plot against Lord Gao, harbor traitorous thoughts or disrupt trade through his lands among other crimes, by the title and power bestowed upon me, I declare Tax Collector Yunru guilty of the"

"PLEASE PLEASE I HAVE MONEY! I HAVE A LOT OF MONEY! I'LL PAY YOU ANYTHING YOU WANT, I'LL PAY ANYTHING ANY OF YOU WAAAANT, JUST LET ME LIVE, PLEAAAAASE" The Tax collector screams, thrashing and kicking around as yet more urine drips down his legs, soiling his robes

"Crimes of stealing from the master of these lands, terrorizing the populace, and disrupting the flow of trade and prosperity, it is my sentence that you be condemned to death by hanging" You proclaim, closing the scroll as the gathered crowd cheers and you raise your hand to command Rong to end the man's pleading.

And the moment before you do, the fool falls off the chair himself and begins to dance at the end of the rope, kicking his legs and choking, his face turning the color of a ripe plum.

"End his suffering quickly, Rong, the fool has hung himself' You sigh sadly, as the crowd boos and hisses at the man enduring the agony of a slow strangulation, and at the man ending his pain. All you do is hang your head in shame, trying to ignore the chokes and gasps for air.

"Tough luck" Rong says before spearing the tax collector through his throat, leaving his corpse to hand and drift in the winds. It is better this way, to execute them yourself rather than let them enjoy Gao's tender mercies.

You turn away as the mob of furious villagers throw stones and refuse at the corpse hanging by the flowering tree, and see a man dressed in the bright, vivid reds that house Qian favors to color themselves and servants in. He is accompanied by Zian, dressed in the azure and plum of those loyal to you. Colors of hope in the eyes of the common man, nowadays.

"Lieren, message from Qian Xia" Zian says, clasping his hands together and bowing as the breathless messenger kneels before you and holds out a scroll pressed between two lengths of laquered wood.

"Thank you, rest in this village and continue on your journey" You say as the man nods, breathing heavily, but pausing before he rushes off to find hospitality, no doubt awed that he actually came face to face with "Gao's Giant", the only title you've been given that you despise utterly.

Pulling the scroll open, you read its contents. it is written very formally, but cut straights to the point. It seems that Qian is very excited to deal with Gao's favorite toadies once and for all, and has included within the message all necessary information to remove them from power and take their heads.
cont
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>>4532005

Their habits, what they give Gao, what is each man's personality, their allies, the allies that will aid them, the allies that will betray them, their personal guards number and discipline, lords who pay them homage, natural defenses , their wealth and how they maintain their power both in society and the region they govern.

Four men, each one a key pillar to the castle of Gao, each one a rapid supporter of the man, each one with a heart as black as their master. When you pull one out, the others will rush to knock it down, when you remove one, they shall begin to work to prove their loyalty to Gao before they end up at the executioner's block.

Even Gao will be suspicious if you remove all four of them at once, even if the others didn't close rank and tighten their defenses. Two, is the most you could do away with, before the remaining two wise up and Gao starts getting suspicious. After that, you'll have to remove smaller snakes from the pond, and burn away more obvious weeds from Gao's garden, to keep him content and sure of your "loyalty" above all others.

You have traveled through all of these lords' lands, and know them well. Your road travels through all of them, and men loyal to you and what the road represents are stationed within them.

Which crony of Gao does Lieren set about destroying first?
> Cui Fu, whose lands are bountiful in only men and provides Gao with most of his levies and generals, without him, Gao's forces will be untrained and without leadership
> Tao Song, the lord in the mountains, his land, nestled in the mountains of the center of Gao's lands, provide bountiful Minerals, stone and iron to Gao, without him, Gao's forces would be forced to wear damaged armor and wield weakened spears
>Zhou Wenyan, Whose lands sit on the border of Gao's lands and the center of Yan itself, and deals with the taxes going to Yan and the trade coming into Gao. Without him, Gao will be reliant on your road and reforms for the Panther's share of his growing wealth
> Shen Bohai, Owner of Gao's most fertile lands, and supplier of most of his armies rations and his own larder, Without him, Gao's army will march on food supplied by you, and thus at your command, his army shall starve
> Write in?
>>
> Accept the invitation to be introduced to his daughters, to save them from this monster
Second time this has been mentioned...I wonder if there's a hint of something being there...
> With the aid of Xia and Lei, begin Gao's downfall, by removing his long time supporters from power
>>
>>4532010
Eh, nevermind, too late.

Let's go with:
>Zhou Wenyan, Whose lands sit on the border of Gao's lands and the center of Yan itself, and deals with the taxes going to Yan and the trade coming into Gao. Without him, Gao will be reliant on your road and reforms for the Panther's share of his growing wealth

That way, we can take the existing trade routes and redirect them to our road under the guise of improving the infrastructure.
>>
>>4532008
> Cui Fu, whose lands are bountiful in only men and provides Gao with most of his levies and generals, without him, Gao's forces will be untrained and without leadership

All of the options are really good but they can have decent gear but if they don't have any real leadership they'll break once they see the giant charge.
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>>4532008
>> Cui Fu, whose lands are bountiful in only men and provides Gao with most of his levies and generals, without him, Gao's forces will be untrained and without leadership
>>
>>4532008
> Cui Fu, whose lands are bountiful in only men and provides Gao with most of his levies and generals, without him, Gao's forces will be untrained and without leadership
>>
>>4532008
>>Zhou Wenyan, Whose lands sit on the border of Gao's lands and the center of Yan itself, and deals with the taxes going to Yan and the trade coming into Gao. Without him, Gao will be reliant on your road and reforms for the Panther's share of his growing wealth
I think this is the best option. we can consolidate our hold on the wealth flow and really get those forges going
>>
>>4532008
>> Tao Song, the lord in the mountains, his land, nestled in the mountains of the center of Gao's lands, provide bountiful Minerals, stone and iron to Gao, without him, Gao's forces would be forced to wear damaged armor and wield weakened spears

> Cui Fu, whose lands are bountiful in only men and provides Gao with most of his levies and generals, without him, Gao's forces will be untrained and without leadership
Gao isn't the brightest but will definitely notice if he loses tax revenue or misses a meal. He won't notice the sorry state of his army, as he only sees his honorguard who will be kept in good supply via nepotism
>>
>>4531754
Well... Depending on how you interpret the lore, he was such a father to Horus, being pretty damn close to him from the beginning. There's even a few theories that he was always on Terra, so I don't think that you can really blame emps too much for not being a father to the kids.

>>4531829
We don't know, but there's a few very scant facts people have dug up. The biggest one to me is that the og IInd visited some Necron monolith, prior to his destruction. Might have been that we got too close to the whole void dragon thing, or it could be something else entirely. Would work well into how much we're getting into the whole wise purity aspect, maybe some fundamental disagreement with the nature of the Imperium and the Emperor and warp in general.
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>>4532008
>Zhou Wenyan, Whose lands sit on the border of Gao's lands and the center of Yan itself, and deals with the taxes going to Yan and the trade coming into Gao. Without him, Gao will be reliant on your road and reforms for the Panther's share of his growing wealth

Consolidating our position seems like a good idea. After that I think we should go after the food, the others two are mostly incidental though I would like to nab a mountain area as a base.
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>>4532074
The only thing that is clear about II and XI are that they were involved in some way with something that would have shaken the foundation of the Crusade itself, presumed to be related to the Rangdan given the purges that had.
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>>4532083
*And it is something even the traitor primarchs won't talk about despite being traitors and the decree shouldn't really apply to them anymore.
>>
>>4532008
>> Shen Bohai, Owner of Gao's most fertile lands, and supplier of most of his armies rations and his own larder, Without him, Gao's army will march on food supplied by you, and thus at your command, his army shall starve
An army marches on its stomach after all. They can't put up a fight if they're starving.
Fitting that Gao's ilk would have to go hungry for once.
>>
>>4532086
>*And it is something even the traitor primarchs won't talk about despite being traitors and the decree shouldn't really apply to them anymore.
As far as I know, most of the Primarchs actually can't remember the missing ones as a result of some psychic fuckery. Supposedly approved by Rogal Dorn himself.
>>
>>4532008
>Shen Bohai, Owner of Gao's most fertile lands, and supplier of most of his armies rations and his own larder, Without him, Gao's army will march on food supplied by you, and thus at your command, his army shall starve

The number of men don’t matter if the are starving
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>>4532008
> Cui Fu, whose lands are bountiful in only men and provides Gao with most of his levies and generals, without him, Gao's forces will be untrained and without leadership

And the second one we will destroy should be Tao Song. Bad equipment, no training and no leadership will make destroying his army easy for us.
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>>4532120
Remember the last time a Chinese army ran out of food?
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>>4532207
That's terrible! Knowing them they'd probably start eating the civilians.
>>
>>4532207
All the better if they act like the beasts they are. It only makes us look better when we burn them.
>>
>>4532212
but think about all the innocent civilians that would be sacrificed.
>>
Wait fuck was the last thread archieved yet?
>>
Lieren is such a good man. I wonder what his reaction will be when he finds out that the only reason for his existence is to conquer the galaxy
>>
>>4532226
Can't be all bad. Some people are probably Gao tier's of shitty and needs a good waffle stomping.
>>
>>4532226
Well at least he would be able to bring prosperity, virtue and knowledge to the systems him and his legion take or move in. And uniting humanity can be considered a noble goal (at least it would be better than leaving it in the current state of the galaxy. Besides some exceptions most of humanity is in a sorry state right now)
>>
>>4532008
>Zhou Wenyan, Whose lands sit on the border of Gao's lands and the center of Yan itself, and deals with the taxes going to Yan and the trade coming into Gao. Without him, Gao will be reliant on your road and reforms for the Panther's share of his growing wealth
Mobility and the flows of resources and people.
>>
>>4532225
Nah, it's still on page 5 or so.

>>4532226
Well, he did get purged for some reason or other, though maybe not with the malal interference. Hell, we might end up rebelling either way if we disagree too much with emps.
>>
>>4532271
>Hell, we might end up rebelling either way if we disagree too much with emps.
I can imagine as soon as we see the living conditions most of the Imperium are stuck with, Lieren's gonna make Angron's tantrums look like model behavior.
Though I imagine we might also have some of the same misgivings as Jaghatai Khan as we observe the leadership structure of the Imperium itself.
>>
>>4532008
>> Cui Fu, whose lands are bountiful in only men and provides Gao with most of his levies and generals, without him, Gao's forces will be untrained and without leadership
>>
>>4532008
>Zhou and Cui

We can be rid of half before we turn our inquisition eyes on the rest of the nobility, but if we never get a chance again, removing his trained army will be essential since we have a master general on our side, and having us provide most of his wealth will further solidify our position.
>>
If new canon has a from supposed to be the empathic understanding primarch (before his butchers nails) are we going to be the on purpose angry boy?
>>
>>4532285
Jesus phone posting sucks.

Is meant to say If new canon has angron as the empathic primarch, are we supposed to be the angry boy?
>>
>>4532286
big if true
>>
>>4532008
> Cui Fu, whose lands are bountiful in only men and provides Gao with most of his levies and generals, without him, Gao's forces will be untrained and without leadership
> Tao Song, the lord in the mountains, his land, nestled in the mountains of the center of Gao's lands, provide bountiful Minerals, stone and iron to Gao, without him, Gao's forces would be forced to wear damaged armor and wield weakened spears
Let's hit him where it will hurt, this way he won't notice what's happening until later.
>>
>>4532304
Yeah, the other anons should also be picking a second option, since there isn't any large benefit to restraining ourselves to 1 rather than 2.
>>
>>4532271
I thought we were rescued from being Censured
>>
>>4532277
> Shen Bohai, Owner of Gao's most fertile lands, and supplier of most of his armies rations and his own larder, Without him, Gao's army will march on food supplied by you, and thus at your command, his army shall starve

Adding this to my vote

>>4532312
Good point
>>
>>4532312
We have the option of going for another, QM is just asking for which one we want to get rid of first.
>>
>>4532324
On one hand, I probably misread something, for which I apologise.
On the other, giving both votes now makes it more expedient.
>>
And another question. How the fuck is Gao one of the premier Nobles of Yan? He's a moron without a trace of awareness of his realm, he spends all his time throwing lavish parties and can't tell a monk from a pretender.

How in the 8 heavenly courts did this motherfucker rise to power? That he has maintained it at all is a miracle
>>
>>4532008
>Zhou Wenyan, Whose lands sit on the border of Gao's lands and the center of Yan itself, and deals with the taxes going to Yan and the trade coming into Gao. Without him, Gao will be reliant on your road and reforms for the Panther's share of his growing wealth
> Shen Bohai, Owner of Gao's most fertile lands, and supplier of most of his armies rations and his own larder, Without him, Gao's army will march on food supplied by you, and thus at your command, his army shall starve
Just FUCK my logistics up bro
>>4532286
Would be rather ironic and would make Emps keeping angron around make sense. We ended up fufilling each others functions despite our natural inclinations being polar opposites. I also imagine angron would fucking hate us for being a high rider bitch
>>
>>4532338
Simple. Gao's an easily manipulated and appeased fool of a tool. Now, we can't really make any judgement of character on the emperor of Yan, but I would guess that he'd keep a simplistic fool in a high position of power rather than an ambitious man of vision.

That and Gao more than likely inherited his position early after his father had an... unfortunate accident.
>>
>>4532338
Even in feudal china, nepotism can get one far
Just look at dong zhuo, fat fuck antagonized everyone in his service but he still had a fuck ton of power, he only died after his own personal giant(lu bu) got tired of his shit and killed him
Hell, gao was tame compared to him
>>
>>4532344
Nepotism makes sense. I just don't get how he could have been anything other than son of the previous noble.
Keeping power with parties was easier than starting it up.
>>
>>4532338
Well consider how greedy he is, it s probably for the amount of coin he has. Not to mention that recently we have turn the province he rules from the devasted and miserable place it was, to an increasingly productive, innovative, prosperous and populated one.
>>
>>4532349
>Nepotism
I was actually suggesting that Gao may have had his father assassinated one way or another. He's already proven that he doesn't care about his wives or children, why would Gao care about his parents?
>>
>>4532358
It was more to my point that he cannot have built himself up to his station here, because he lacks any skills in that [or any] department.
So being the son of a priory important noble, who got offed makes sense.

>>4532357
He was the favoured of Yan before we got here.
>>
>>4532008
> Cui Fu, whose lands are bountiful in only men and provides Gao with most of his levies and generals, without him, Gao's forces will be untrained and without leadership
>>
>>4532008
Forgot a second one so choices are:
>Zhou Wenyan, Whose lands sit on the border of Gao's lands and the center of Yan itself, and deals with the taxes going to Yan and the trade coming into Gao. Without him, Gao will be reliant on your road and reforms for the Panther's share of his growing wealth
> Cui Fu, whose lands are bountiful in only men and provides Gao with most of his levies and generals, without him, Gao's forces will be untrained and without leadership
>>
>>4532362
In a world like this, maintaining the status quo might be enough to remain a major noble. Gao pays his due on time and in full, no matter the damage it does to his people
>>
Alright, calling the vote NOW!

Zhou:6
Cui:10
Tao:2
Shen:4

So Cui is the first on the chopping block, writing the update now
>>
Have we considered not killing everyone?

Maybe we can have them sent to exile or educate them to be better persons (e.g. ~ 5-9 years of forced manual labor, stripping them of their power, titles and property...)
>>
>>4532506
In a word NO.
This people are near-cultists, some without tue near. This quest follows the rules of the W40K universe (the important ones), and the first of said laws is "once you go Chaos willingly, you don't go back"
>>
>>4532506
We don't plan to kill those of virtue. But otherwise....Dead.
>>
>>4532506
>letting borderline Chaos cultists live instead of removing them out by the roots
Why though?
>>
>>4532506
>1ID post
>>
>>4532506
You don't offer mercy to Chaos. You burn it out, root and stem.
>>
>>4532506
Most of these people are so corrupt that such an attempt would be wasted. Were Slaanesh and the other Chaos gods not so weak right now, Gao would if not a high ranking champion of Silver prince, be on his way to be one. Most of the nobles are bad but to a lesser degree from the looks of it. If this was later in the timeline this world would probably have fallen to chaos already. So no, it needs to be culled, lest it spread.
>>
>>4532547
I wouldn’t be surprised if Chaos actually controlled the planet during the AoS.
>>
File: 904.png (1.13 MB, 847x454)
1.13 MB
1.13 MB PNG
>>4532285
>>4532286
>>4532341
Imagine the Emperor scanning his son's minds every time he finds a new Primarch, and contrasting their thoughts, acts and original role:
>Name: Angron
>Role: Primarch psicologist and psychic comfort blanket of calm and good vives.
>Notable thoughts and memories: ̸̾ͅŔ̵͓R̸̝̄Ṟ̶̀À̷̩A̶̛̳A̴̦͂Å̵̞A̷͋Ą̶̈́Å̶A̵̧̔A̷̔A̵̮̍Ǎ̴Ả̶̼Á̷̮A̸͚̋A̴̞͂A̵̖̍A̴͍̋Ä̵͙́Ġ̴̤H̶̻̚!̸̬͛!̴̧̇!̴̗͝
>Acts: [Exists] ̸̾ͅŔ̵͓R̸̝̄Ṟ̶̀À̷̩A̶̛̳A̴̦͂Å̵̞A̷͋Ą̶̈́Å̶A̵̧̔A̷̔A̵̮̍Ǎ̴Ả̶̼Á̷̮A̸͚̋A̴̞͂A̵̖̍A̴͍̋Ä̵͙́Ġ̴̤H̶̻̚!̸̬͛!̴̧̇!̴̗͝ [proceeds to murder something/
someone/someone's world and civilization]

>Name: Lieren
>Role": The Emperor's murderblender Primarch
>Notable thoughts and memories:
>>4531638
Acts: Helping all humans grow into the best they can be, using benevolence and exchanging wisdom when possible, while trying to keep both casualties and interference with their development to a minimum.
>>
>>4532555
"Well I guess everything worked out alright!"
>>
Among the four men, members of the corrupted and decadent nobility each, Cui Fu is the pillar that holds most of Gao's power. His family's lands, poorer than the rest of Gao's domain, are only wealthy in hardy men, who eek out and existence in plains of infertile soil and rocky cliffs. Historically most of the levies that make up The Gao's armies have come from the harsh lands Cui rules, and the best local generals both past and present have come from the stubborn stock of men that the Cui family has cultivated. By forcing generations to live in a land so scares of life the cliffjumpers there have became carnivorous, and no fields are grown.

Cui is also a man you wish to see removed from power, even if you could convince the Toady to turn against his master and aid you. For he hampered your efforts in improving his land, and only relented when Gao threatened him with castration for stopping your efforts of spreading prosperity and bounty throughout the land. And the reason for this lesser lord's foolish actions? He didn't want the peasantry under his control to grow "Weak", he didn't want the comforts and ease of living you brought where ever you walked to come to his home. So his people would starve, and only the strong and worthy would be able to live.

All so he could pretend his people were of an elite pedigree and the pride of Gao's army and lands, at the cost of starving children and culling the weak in times of famine. He disgusts you more than Gao himself, if such a thing is possible. Gao merely doesn't care about his people and how they live so long as taxes and wealth flow into his vaults one way or another. Cui on the other hand, actively worsens the lot of his common folks' living conditions and lives, so they can be "Strong". He battled with you, to keep you from bringing food into his lands, from bringing fertilizers and minerals to improve the soil his farmers worked, even from building forts and fire towers to keep the road safe in his lands.

The man was worse than a fool, he was a fool who thought himself a genius. He hid behind traditions and used them as an excuse to bring suffering to his people, and you do not doubt he is already working to remove the innovations you brought to his lands solely so they do not "weaken his flock". He even saw fit to scold you for "overstepping" your authority by removing a bandit clan from his lands, claiming it was his duty to do so.

When they had festered there for generations, draining what little wealth the common man could hold from them, and bleeding them in brutal conflict. No doubt with Cui's permission and perhaps even full endorsement. He is a brute, who imagines himself a scholar, who lives and breathes of philosophy of suffering and hardship. If there could be a man whose beliefs were more opposed to your own than Cui, you have not met him nor heard tale of his foulness.

cont
>>
>>4532568

Cui would meet his end for the crimes he and his line have committed for generations, of cruelly oppressing the people in their lands. Though his actual sentence would be a charge of treason for attempting to overthrow Gao, and stealing wealth from him, that mattered not. You had judge him guilty of the crime of pointless cruelty and halting the spread of your prosperity for half a season. And for that you would have him dead and buried, by your own hand.

Closing the scroll Qian had written for you, you whistle sharply, raising your hand to command your men to follow closely as you move on from this lonely village near a spring, among blossoming trees.


"Leave the thief hanging" You command, whistling again as you begin to march down the road that leads, eventually, to the struggling lands of Cui "We ride for the lands of Cui, I have been alerted of corruption festering in the court of its lord, we shall bring the traitors of Gao to justice"

Your men raise there spears, as the crowd of villagers continue assaulting Yunru's corpse with stones and rotten fruit. at least his death was quick, if not painless
-

The Lands under the Cui family, dust covered and empty, the sun beats through the fog here, burning the land that has been so long abused and untended. By your hand it could flourish and become as a greed slab of jade in the lands of Gao, the increased sunlight making it more bountiful than the lands of the Shen family. Grey and rust colored earth, dust mingling with fog, bones and signs of forgotten battles littering the land. You have done what you can to help the people under Cui's rule, but there's only so much you could force upon the man, and no doubt he has already began taking away the gifts and tools you've given to the poor souls who live beneath him.

But, he was not bold enough to touch your road, or the garrisons upon it. The people no longer starved, but they needed a better steward, to truly prosper.

"What a depressing sight lays before us Lieren" Jinhai asks as you give Zian and Rong their written orders to scout ahead with five men each "Dust, ash and bones, and men living among them like scavengers. What can be salvaged from the lords of such a tortured land?"

"We shall see, the roots of Cui run deep and rotten" You say as you sit down to rest with your men "We shall turn this starving land green, this I swear to you, to the people, and to the very earth itself"
cont
>>
>>4532570

How do you remove the Cuis from power, Lieren?
> Using the nobles Qian wishes you to deal with as bait, draw him into a conspiracy that can be twisted into a charge of treason
> Incite his peasantry into a revolt, a great show of weakness for the cultivator of Gao's military, Gao will remove him from power without any lies from your mouth
>Merely march into his court and accuse him of treason and thievery, for impeding the spread of prosperity and wealth through his lands
>Bring Jiang and Liang from Nothing, and issue a challenge for any man of the Cuis to best them in a test of strength, thus exposing his incompetent rule, and crushing his idiotic ideology.
>Write in?
>>
>>4532511
We do not yet have that much knowledge of the wider scope of supposed 40k rules. Also, remember that penitents are a common theme. The guilt can never be reversed completely, but some guilty persons DO go back.

>>4532539
>1ID post
> Low quality
> No verb
Some people have different influences than image boards in their lifes. Occasionally, this forces them to switch devices. Maybe, you prefer the non-anonymous variety?
>>
>>4532572
>> Using the nobles Qian wishes you to deal with as bait, draw him into a conspiracy that can be twisted into a charge of treason
>>
>>4532572
> Using the nobles Qian wishes you to deal with as bait, draw him into a conspiracy that can be twisted into a charge of treason

>>4532575
Whatever you say anon.
>>
>>4532572
>>Merely march into his court and accuse him of treason and thievery, for impeding the spread of prosperity and wealth through his lands
as much as i'd like to incite the peasantry i don't want to hand over another prisoner to Gao. We should just make accusation, have trial, and execute today.
>>
>>4532572
>Merely march into his court and accuse him of treason and thievery, for impeding the spread of prosperity and wealth through his lands

This is personal. Armor and Guandao ready.
>>
>>4532572
>> Using the nobles Qian wishes you to deal with as bait, draw him into a conspiracy that can be twisted into a charge of treason
>>
>>4532566
Yeah, until the marines start to get acclimated to shangralan culture and he has to hear
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oH2uGJyXHiA nonstop for ten thousand years
>>
>>4532568
>He didn't want the peasantry under his control to grow "Weak", he didn't want the comforts and ease of living you brought where ever you walked to come to his home. So his people would starve, and only the strong and worthy would be able to live.
Hmmmm.
>>4532572
>Bring Jiang and Liang from Nothing, and issue a challenge for any man of the Cuis to best them in a test of strength, thus exposing his incompetent rule, and crushing his idiotic ideology.
If he wants to talk about strength, then we will show him strength then execute for being an idiot.
>>
>>4532572
> Using the nobles Qian wishes you to deal with as bait, draw him into a conspiracy that can be twisted into a charge of treason
We'd be able to get rid of multiple corrupt noblemen, as well as ease gao's fear of a rebellion by our part.
>>
>>4532572
>Use the Nobles.
Just make sure we are not Having it traced back to us.

>>4532596
You always deserve what you sow.
>>
>>4532572
>Using the nobles
>>
>>4532572
> Using the nobles Qian wishes you to deal with as bait, draw him into a conspiracy that can be twisted into a charge of treason
>>
>>4532568
Lieren is not going to like how the some of the other primarchs leave their worlds as death worlds
>>4532572
>Merely march into his court and accuse him of treason and thievery, for impeding the spread of prosperity and wealth through his lands
>>
>>4532596
no this is how it is going to be:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zJMt3pJwIhY
ten thousand years of asian balnakn war propaganda knockoffs

heh. it would be funny if our prosperity drive and the fog like nature of the world will turn it all into a balkan wars neverending edition that we just gave up upon and will continue with that particular sport even throughout the imperium.
>>
>>4532572
>Using the nobles Qian wishes you to deal with as bait, draw him into a conspiracy that can be twisted into a charge of treason
>>
>>4532572
>>Merely march into his court and accuse him of treason and thievery, for impeding the spread of prosperity and wealth through his lands
>>
>>4532572
>Merely march into his court and accuse him of treason and thievery, for impeding the spread of prosperity and wealth through his lands
>>
should i draw fanart of Lieren?
>>
>>4532752
If you want man.
>>
>>4532572
>Bring Jiang and Liang from Nothing, and issue a challenge for any man of the Cuis to best them in a test of strength, thus exposing his incompetent rule, and crushing his idiotic ideology.
Showing that his way of making strong men is a lie.
>>
>>4532598
>>Bring Jiang and Liang from Nothing, and issue a challenge for any man of the Cuis to best them in a test of strength, thus exposing his incompetent rule, and crushing his idiotic ideology.

Hmm...sounds interesting, though given the way the tides are shifting, I'll go with:

>> Using the nobles Qian wishes you to deal with as bait, draw him into a conspiracy that can be twisted into a charge of treason
>>
We can accuse him and stab him for his treachery after we've cleaned the coop out with the other bad eggs.

Why shouldn't we use the conspiracy to make our jobs that much more effecient.
>>
>>4532752
That would be cool, my dude
>>
>>4532752
I was considering doing the same thing but unfortunately I can't come up with a hairstyle I'm happy with.
>>
What are some of your anticipated / most wanted primarch interactions with lieren?

I'm hoping we can be with the emperor when he finds angron and help with that whole mess.
>>
>>4532820
Pert, Lorgar and Khan.

We were asked about this last thread, but I think we have a lot in common and a lot of ground to make with Perty boy. And come on man, we're probably the only one's who would appreciate and not abuse his creations.
>>
Alright, calling the vote now.

Use the nobles and kill two birds with one stone: 9
Just march to his court and accuse Cui: 5
Bring the brothers in:2

So, Lieren will construct a conspiracy, so he has just cause to remove Cui from power, so as not to arose suspicion.

Writing the update

>>4532752
Rad.
>>
>>4532820
Kinda wanna see XI and if we come across Nuceria first, Angron. Perhaps Leman because of the whole norse culture (which includes Finns to a degree) meeting with Leiran's asiatic (which includes Korea), as well as how close the names are.
>>
>>4532827
vile traitors and one cool dude for a horse barbarian.
Perturabo is major grade autistic, beyond even most other primarchs* and a spiteful introvert who was never satisfied with what he could get. He had a nice family and he fucked it up all on his very own.
Perturabo is not a nice dude, and he is way to asocial to open up to his new 'family'.
Lorgar is just trash who grew up on a stealth chaos world and had some serious gay dad issues, but chanced by luck on having his lectitio divinatus be the groundwork for the imperial creed that fights of chaos gods by turning the emperor into a warp god.

I am interested in the Lion, and the Rangdan Xenocides. Would be nice if we can make the Dark Angels have fewer losses.

Also interested in the Custodes. Getting a Custodes and Silent Sisters squads as honourguard for all the primarchs would be very nice in solidifying the links of the imperial household and getting blanks around primarchs via the sisters and better personal security from the custodes.
>>
>>4532863
I mean, that's not true.

Pert is ungrateful, envious and brooding but he is also very happy when getting to design things. But the reason I think we should be trying to forge links with him is A] the contrast between his petulance and our Zen in regards to how glory is split could have a stabilizing effect perhaps and B] our policy of "the most qualified man does the job" can see us talking to Pert about designs to better the prosperity of the worlds we must rebuild which gives us some common ground to talk to.

Lorgar, himself, is not that bad. Call me an apologist, but he isn't. His worst traits are his mercurial nature and childish Naivity, while his best is his Loyalty and Faith. Because believe it or not Lorgar is supremely loyal to those he gives it to, to the point it takes point blank rejection and betrayal to turn him away [See Monarchia, Magnus' astropathic conversations]. He didn't give his loyalty to Horus, and mistakenly believed horus was as zealious as he was, which resulted in his attempted betrayal.
But the interactions here are on talks of faith and philosophy, which is always interesting to talk about IC.

Khan is space Mongol to our space China. nuff said.

But don't expect many custodes. If daddies favorites are with us, it usually isn't good.
>>
>>4532890
Pert did decimate his legion upon first meeting them and the only reason they weren't the largest was due to how many casualties they expended. Emps tried to moderate him a bit by giving a balance of tasks, but it got real bad with Horus in charge where Pert got all siege all the time.
>>
>>4532911
His treatment of his legion was retarded and actively harmful [no shit sherlock], And he should have been censored for the act.

But that doesn't change that we can be a good influence. If we're not, so be it.
>>
>>4532913
*censured
>>
>>4532935
No, Pert must have black bars put all over him so that others cannot look upon his form or face.

Thank you for that.
>>
I’m starting to wonder if Lieren ever be introduced to Taoism.
>>
>>4532957
Technically speaking we kinda have? But there's no Tao here, so they probably just call it by some other name. Kinda like how we talk with the buddhist monk guy.
>>
I personally want to follow the Imperial Thruth but giving it some philosophical wisdom twists, so we can add love (pure), generosity, empathy (with humans, but also not to kill useful, nonharmful xenos like the jockaeiro) and a sense of brotherhood/general patriotism (so all worlds integrate properly and contribute all they can to the Imperium despite differences in culture) as two pillars that benefit the Imperium without reinforcing the Chaos gods
>>
>>4532985
*As the pillars of society that benefit the Imperium
>>
If Lieren does fall, I fear it will be to Khorne for (initially) altruistic reasons twisted to an industrial warmachine. We need to maintain inner peace and foresightedness for the plight of the unaugmented man.
>>
>>4532964
>Technically speaking we kinda have?
Not really. Taoism (when described) sounds more like some kind of psyker shit.
>>
>>4532940
But of course

You're welcome
>>
>>4532992
Honestly with the way we’re currently going, it’ll be Tzeentch. Like seriously have you been paying attention? We’ve been favoring underhanded schemes than outright violence.
>>
>>4533005
He's constantly boiling with rage and his goals are to end the impoverishment of the commoners by getting rid of the nobility, not uplifting himself for his own ambitions. I could see him sliding to Khorne very easily but Tzeentch is also a possibility because he's been trying to spread knowledge, bring hope to the masses, and has already slain what was either a Nurglite Chaos Spawn or Minor Daemon Prince.
>>
>>4533005
Lieren's pretty angry too, though.

I mean, it's like i said it at the middle of the previous thread, there should be a counter for how many times Lieren's thought about how easy it would be to kill someone.

I mean, how many times has he had to visibly hold back himself as to not go in a giant rage fit and kill everyone? It's been a lot of times.

Personally, i think an mix between tzeentch and khorne would be the most likely, IF he were to fall.
>>
>>4533008
What makes me think he's most likely to fall to Khorne is that most of his rage has been directed toward the wastefulness of the nobility, which is the textbook anti-Slaaneshi impulse that causes a great deal of Khornate corruption in the 41st millennia. I think we should be appropriately paranoid of and extremely violent towards any signs of heresy.
>>
Of course, Cui may be an ignorant fool like the rest of his kind, but that does not mean he is harmless. His personal guard contains more members than Gao's own, and from it a pedigree of fighting generals has sprung forth, who will remain loyal to Cui unless he is dealt with. While you have no doubt you could easily best a man as foolish as Cui Fu in battle, either massed or personal, he wouldn't attack with just the soldiers sworn to his service. He'd press every man in his lands into an army with which he would use like a hammer, and break it against your superior intellect and Yin's tactical genius.

A cornered animal, after all, is the most dangerous. And to remove Cui and the support he gives to Gao at the cost of thousands of innocent lives, would leave a most bitter taste in your mouth. You could not forgive yourself if innocent blood was shed at your command or even by your own arms. Which means, to defeat Cui and end his small tyranny, you must employ a gentler method to orchestrate his demise. Much like plucking a flower with a thorns along its stem, care must be taken when removing a man from his seat of power, when he commands most of the armies in the land.

Staring into the embers of the growing fire your guards have started to tend and feed in your makeshift camp along the side of your road, you begin to weave a plan, with which to pull the Cui family from Yan, root and stem and all. Qian, as expected has asked for your assistant in dealing with spendthrifts and sadists alike, men who desire her but are too tightly tangle in her web for her to cut down herself.

Men who do so despise the golden eyed giant who speaks so freely with their beloved scarlet blossom, not knowing the poison the jade beauty hides beneath her smiles and gentle manner. Cui would align himself with anyone if they promised him the privilege of taking your head, such is the hatred he holds for you for interfering and trying to fix the ruin he and his ancestors have made of a land filled with such potential. The men Qian wants to see dead or other wise dealt with, are ambitious, and will reach far beyond your death if they are confident in their combined power and the secrecy of their conspiracy.

Sparks fly as one of the moister logs in the fresh fire snaps and cracks open, as the path you shall take forward takes shape in the depths of your mind. Qian can set the pawns into place, maneuvering her targets into the proper positions for them to meet, and give them all reasons to join together and ally with one another for your demise. Then, it would only take a few manipulations on your end and hers to grow the fools' combined confidence enough to bring one as powerful as Cui into their fold. Qian will supply the evidence of their activities over the coming days, weeks even, and then all it will take is for you to present it to Gao.
cont
>>
>>4533057

If the threat of losing his Jade conjuring giant is not enough for the fat slug to do away with Cui and his new compatriots, all you must do is "reveal" to him the hidden treason within whatever form of evidence Lady Qian gathers, or mention that Cui's lands are being wasted upon a man of such low intellect and cunning. And then he shall all but hand you the axe to remove their heads himself, if he does not order their prolonged torture and drawn out deaths but, it is hard to apprehend criminals alive after all and even a fool like Gao can understand that.

An accident in the journey to bring them back to his cruel hands, all traitors slain in an escape attempt. Their bodies will feed the Mist Jackals. An easy death, a clean death, a merciful death. You will not consign another man to Ling's fate. and your conscious will be clear as an untouched spring, for Fu has taken no wife, as none have matched the standards he demands according Qian Xia, and his siblings died young. As the Cui bloodline, for all their cruelty and foulness, at least practices the same culling they force upon the land among their own ranks.

No innocent victims, no children murdered to appease Gao's fury, pride and sadism. A historied line snuffed out, because it wore itself thin and stood in the way of the path of progress and prosperity. A simple act, a purifying act. Cleansing the land and courts. Simple and easy.
-
There were few things Cui fu feared in this world, for few things could truly threaten a man of his size and stature. Since birth he was raised as a warrior, among warriors, following a tradition of warlords and fighters of legend. The scares that traced across his face and chest told a story, of hardship and struggle. It was the only way a man of his family could be considered proper, like all those who served beneath them. Blood was their trade, Iron their wealth. But, in recent years, the young lord had met a creature that could illicit fear eve into a heart as cold and hardened as his own.

A Giant with eyes like the setting sun, and hair like fresh iron. A man who did not fear death nor bowed to the proper order of the world. A simple farmer, who had wormed his way into the good graces of Gao, despite giving him nothing but promises and fat, weak workers. A man who would soften the people of Gao's lands into mere farm animals, content and happy despite their birth and station. Unused to hardship, weak. A slow, insidious poison that would doubt bring ruin to all who lived under the benevolent arms of the Gao line.

The twin dragons of Gao would endure, Cui fu would do all in his power to ensure it. The Gao's had earned their position generations ago, and brought his ancestors their first defeat. The carp of Cui would forever support the dragons of Gao, even over the Yan kings themselves. And no mere farmer, with pretty little babbles and grand ambitions, would fell the combined might of Gao and Cui.
cont
>>
>>4533059

And yet wise Lord Gao, could not see the traitor in his court, wasting his wealth, wasting his man power and weakening his people! No, Gao could not see, he did not understand! The foul sorcerer Lieren, with his alchemy and witchcraft, must have enchanted his mind somehow, for why else would Gao allow him to trod over and build through lands that have for centuries belonged to the same line?! Why else would he give that thrice damned giant whatever he asked for or desired! The line of Gao was in danger, its branches twisted by an iron scaled snake.

And for seasons, for years, Cui Fu has wracked his mind, trying to find anyway to remove this parasite from his Lord's side. If he did not act with haste, Lieren would pollute his own lands with his corruptive sorcery, and seductive comforts he offered with open hands. Poison, poison, poison! it was all poison. The land would sour from the mixtures he fed it, devils and spirits would come at his call to feast upon the fattened herd of men he had created with bountiful food and empty lives and he would rule a land empty of men. Cui Fu knew this, for his line warned of such methods, the stories that lulled him to sleep spoke of men such as Lieren, and he would not let his land, nor any Land of beneath the Gaos fall to such foul manipulations.

But, an army to slay one man? Foolishness. And to ask Gao, to plead with the benevolent patriarch of that most noble of lines, would be impossible, for Lieren had twisted his mind, weakened it. Cui could do nothing but watch, for two years, as the people outside of his lands grew fat on prosperity, like swine for the slaughter, as the Giant strode across the lands of family's as bright as his own, plucking all danger and struggle from them like he was taking flowers from a garden.

Weak, weak weak! they were all so weak and foolish! nothing could be done! unless the giant was slain, ruin and decay would come upon great wings! devour them all, slay them all! The Giant would destroy generations of tradition and ruin the stock of all men of Gao for his own ambition.

But there was nothing a warrior as mighty as Cui Fu could do, he knew he could not slay Lieren in personal combat, he doubted even all his men combined could drag the Giant to hell together! and Gao did not see the farmer for the trickster he was! If Fu was not a Cui, he may have given into despair, and found a battle to die in before he had to see the degeneration of his people with his own eyes, to spare his family the shame of being weakened like the rest.

But Cuis did not give up, they did not retreat, and in autumn, as the winds cooled and the trees turned shades of blood and rust, after months, years of waiting, listening and hoping to find another soul in power that was no caught in the Giant's spell, Cui Fu found them. Men like him, men with strong minds and wills of iron, who had escaped the enchantment that fallen over the rest of the land.
cont
>>
>>4533061

Men who saw Lieren for what he was, knew the poison and corruption he spread with every step, and had come together to orchestrate his end. And free the people from his tricks and manipulations. For weeks now, Cui Fu has met with these men, nobles who hid their faces with blank masks when he met, but he knew them. They were seven noble men, powerful men, and with the might of the Cui and the generals fu and his father before him had nurtured, even a monster like the golden eyed giant could not escape death.

With their combined might and minds, Lieren would fall, and Gao would be free of his influence, and things would return to how they rightfully should be.

The lord of blood and Iron had received word, that they would soon move to claim the head of a giant and that he would be allowed to know the identities of his fellow conspirators, now that he had fully committed to the cause. They would meet at a small inn, built by the giant's own hands along the edge of the lands of the Cui, and there, they would set in motion events that would consign their names to legends, as heroes.

As always, Cui fu was dressed in his armor, all hues of red and grey, covered by a grey cloak of wool, roughly spun, accompanied by only two of his most trusted guards. Leaving his strong, war bred horse to his servants, he entered the small, lonely building alone. The scent of roasting meat and drying alcohol assaulted his senses, the mystical flames the giant set upon the road that would burn for hours before they turned to ask lighting every corner of the building.

Tables were set out, travelers and merchants filled every inch of the building, eating and growing fatter, no doubt spreading the Giant's poison further. Cui fu for a moment, wondered if he had came to the wrong location, before he spotted a blank wooden mask along a long table. Grinning wickedly, Gao's hound strode over to the table and took a seat without announcing himself.

His comrades turned to face them, draped in robes of simple wool, the same as he was. He recognized the faces of only one. He Tao, a man he had always thought of as soft, yet he sat at a place of honor at the table. A trader of wine and spirits, he did not think he would have escape the Giant's wiles.

"Ah, brother fu, you've joined us at last, the day of our glory is soon at hand" He spoke, glancing around, no doubt searching for any listeners or spies "And the giant will be brought low once more, before his end"

"At our hands, tell me, when will we mobilize, my armies are ready" Cui fu said as he took clasped his hands together, glancing at the faces of the other lords sat alongside him "To strike as soon as the order is given"
-
cont
>>
>>4533064

"So, you'll spare us then? and let our families eat well for once?" Cui fu's man asks, with a tired look in his eyes as you easily stride down the hill from your hiding place along the ridge, where your men still lie in wait. Joined by a few of your hunting companions from Nothing, and backed up by guards gathered along the road's of Cui fu's lands.

"All men, women and children of these lands shall eat well, and your loyalty will be remembered, both of you" You say, clasping your hands together "The end of the traitor Cui is at hand, and I shall protect you from those who would call you betrayer"

"Lord Lieren's benevolence is as bountiful as the stories say" The man sighs, shoulders slumping as he sits down into the dust "though I would have welcomed death, if only my wife would be able to have a nice meal"

"I would have if I could only live long enough to see that madman butchered as he has done to so many others" The other says, removing his mask and spitting into the dust as he sat by his brother in arms "Make it hurt, giant"

The sun hung in the sky, crimson among a sea of golds, pinks and plum. Dust filled the air, and the fog was heavy this night. A dramatic setting, for a dramatic end.

How you end the conspiracy you've spun, Lieren
> Announce your presence and list the crimes of the accused, proclaiming the sentence Gao has passed already
> Blow the whistle you've trained the men stationed in the inn, ordering them to strike the gathered group of traitors
> Ring the bell outside of the Inn, alerting the men inside the leave and bar the exists as they do. Then set the building alight with only the eight traitors inside
> "CUI FU! though in my heart there naught but hatred for you, I shall allow you one final honor, one final battle! Draw your sword and face me so I may deliver you to hell myself!"
> Write in
>>
>>4533061
The foul sorcerer Lieren, with his alchemy and witchcraft, must have enchanted his mind somehow, for why else would Gao allow him to trod over and build through lands that have for centuries belonged to the same line?!
It’s like a Khornate whining about a Tzeentchian sorcerer
>>
>>4533066
> "CUI FU! though in my heart there naught but hatred for you, I shall allow you one final honor, one final battle! Draw your sword and face me so I may deliver you to hell myself!"
I feel the need to punch the Khornate in the face.
>>
>>4533066
> "CUI FU! though in my heart there naught but hatred for you, I shall allow you one final honor, one final battle! Draw your sword and face me so I may deliver you to hell myself!"
>Have the men stationed INN go after the group of traitors from behind, expect for Cui fu's
>>
>>4533066
> "CUI FU! though in my heart there naught but hatred for you, I shall allow you one final honor, one final battle! Draw your sword and face me so I may deliver you to hell myself!"

Have your men be ready to catch any of the other noblemen who try to escape. Though Cui Fu is an bastard, i can't help but respect his belief in strength and willingness to fight for it. Let's give him a warrior's death.
>>
>>4533066
> "CUI FU! though in my heart there naught but hatred for you, I shall allow you one final honor, one final battle! Draw your sword and face me so I may deliver you to hell myself!
At least he's no coward.
>>
>>4533066
> "CUI FU! though in my heart there naught but hatred for you, I shall allow you one final honor, one final battle! Draw your sword and face me so I may deliver you to hell myself!"
>>
I wonder if he can last longer than two seconds. If he can manage to actually nick our robes I'll assume that he's been Chaos corrupted or has lingering gene-craft from the DAoT.
>>
>>4533066
>> "CUI FU! though in my heart there naught but hatred for you, I shall allow you one final honor, one final battle! Draw your sword and face me so I may deliver you to hell myself!"
>eight traitors
Something tells me this planet is deeper in Chaos fuckery than we initially thought.
>>
> "CUI FU! though in my heart there naught but hatred for you, I shall allow you one final honor, one final battle! Draw your sword and face me so I may deliver you to hell myself!"
>Have men stationed around the inn prevent the traitors from leaving as you do so.
>>
>>4533066
>> "CUI FU! though in my heart there naught but hatred for you, I shall allow you one final honor, one final battle! Draw your sword and face me so I may deliver you to hell myself!"
>>Have men stationed around the inn prevent the traitors from leaving as you do so.
>>
>>4533091
Neither the party of degenerates all wearing pink nor the Chaos corrupted monk of Nurgle didn’t tip you off.
>>
>>4533066
>Summon the general outside while the men inside gather the other traitors. He deserves to die fighting for his beliefs.
>>
>>4533103
Pure coincidence.
>>
>>4533119
Keep telling yourself that.
>>
>>4533121
Anon, you mean to tell me you think that a world with a noble class of debaucherous hedonists that dress in pink and purple, a monk who turned into an acid-spewing toad dragon, and a geopolitical power with eight noble families and a group of eight people plotting against us, all in this setting at this point in time is explicit proof of Chaos corruption? Seems like a bit of a stretch imo.
>>
>>4533130
Seems par for the course in this setting.
>>
>>4533066
> "CUI FU! though in my heart there naught but hatred for you, I shall allow you one final honor, one final battle! Draw your sword and face me so I may deliver you to hell myself!"
>Have the men stationed INN go after the group of traitors from behind, expect for Cui fu's
>>
>>4533066
>> "CUI FU! though in my heart there naught but hatred for you, I shall allow you one final honor, one final battle! Draw your sword and face me so I may deliver you to hell myself!"
>>
>>4533130
i'm banking on a a third-act twist where the machine in the mountains that produces the fog is Necron.

we're gonna spend a lifetime building up this planet only to unleash a Necron army and have to evacuate overnight.

just seems in line with how methodic and patient Lieren is only to make a very decisive action when the reason comes to do so.
>>
>>4533066
>> "CUI FU! though in my heart there naught but hatred for you, I shall allow you one final honor, one final battle! Draw your sword and face me so I may deliver you to hell myself!"
>>
>>4533066
> "CUI FU! though in my heart there naught but hatred for you, I shall allow you one final honor, one final battle! Draw your sword and face me so I may deliver you to hell myself!"
>>
>>4533066
>> "CUI FU! though in my heart there naught but hatred for you, I shall allow you one final honor, one final battle! Draw your sword and face me so I may deliver you to hell myself!"

M O R T A L K O M B A T
>>
>>4533066
> "CUI FU! though in my heart there naught but hatred for you, I shall allow you one final honor, one final battle! Draw your sword and face me so I may deliver you to hell myself!"

We're really going to hate the Imperium when we meet it, aren't we?
>>
>>4533351
What gets to me most about the whole situation is that Cui Fu is grimdark hellhole planetary governor material. Lieren is going to have a lot to come to terms with when the Great Crusade reaches him.
>>
>>4533373
What specifically do you think he wont like?
>>
>>4533410
the exploitations of everyone in order to achieve the goal of the great crusade? MaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaayBeeeeeee?
>>
>>4533410
The Thallax come to mind.
>>
>>4533428
Servitors are gonna be a big problem, though I suppose some are vatgrown or criminals
>>
>>4533455
>some
This is Lieren we're talking about. He's a moral absolutionist and that won't remotely mesh well with the Imperium in the long run even if he's willing to play ball for the sake of humanity in the short run.
>>
>>4533458
Hopefully we can shift the course of history and start championing some serious reforms.
Though we'll have to make sure the Imperium is actually in a decent position for em.
We're gonna have to kill an unprecedented amount of xenos for that.
>>
>>4533459
I wonder how much we can change the imperium from canon, were just one primarch but I'd like the think were going to be one of the most connected primarchs with normal humans.
>>
>>4533459
I dunno man, if any primarch aside from Gorillaman 10,000 years from now would look favorably on xenos, it'd be Lieren... I think it's well in his character to try to ally with xenos first, and only break out the bolters if that doesn't work. Even then, he'd probably accept surrenders.
>>
>>4533462
We might go for a vassal state system when it comes to xenos rather than directly purging them if they appeal to our sensibilities (ie. not a bunch of fucking chaos worshipers or orks).
>>
>>4533462
Depends on if the Emperor managed to hardcode hatred of xenos in. Even chaos marines will shoot a xeno before a loyalist, and Vulkan of all people will fry eldar on sight
>>
File: gorillaman.png (7.34 MB, 2582x3212)
7.34 MB
7.34 MB PNG
>>4533462
>Gorillaman
The Imperium would certainly be a lot better off in the hands of Robust Gorillaman.
>>
>>4533470
That was my thinking as well. I must say I like the idea.
>>4533471
You have a point, though that scene with Vulkan and that eldar child was a bit more complicated than just "Xenos? Set flamers to char."
>>4533474
All hail he, the Avenging Ape, the Uncrowned Monkey, the Lord of Bananamar.
>>
>>4533470
>Lieren is excommunicated for unintentionally proving that Xenos could possibly live beside humanity in a stable manner
>fucks off and take his geneseed with him to the outer reaches of the Galaxy after the Imperium attempts to detain him
>>
>>4533512
The Imperium does allow for protectorate species of xenos, just gotta be completely subservient and more valuable alive than dead. Knowing grimdark, I'm positive some sentient xenos are kept alive for their scales/meat/terraforming.
>>
>>4533516
>The Imperium does allow for protectorate species of xenos
Oh, that's cool.
>just gotta be completely subservient and more valuable alive than dead
And there's where Lieren might have a problem with it.
I can see him growing just a bit too fond of his "subjects" for the Emperor's liking.
>>
>>4533458
>>4533459
>>4533461
I'll laugh if we end up causing the Heresy early.
>>
>>4533373
Heh. I hope the planet itself will force our primarch to change his views a bit before that.
>>4533458
>>4533459
>>4533527
Fuck xenos. Like seriously fuck them. The universe has shown that all xenos are out for themselves and at best will use other xenos as servants or catspaws that will be put down as soon as they represent a credible potential threat or resource competition that is not paid more through their servile existence.
Thus a similar stance of human civilization towards xenos is entirely justified and reciprocal. Indeed not having such a stance is tantamount to civilizational suicide.
>>
>>4533580
hear hear, it's bad enough that some on other forms, when given the options, will go the "all [insert xeno] are good, just misunderstood and it's the humans that are bad and racist (looking at you spacebattles)"

ether we enslave/kill the xenos or we will get enslaves/killed/worse-than-death deal by them.
>>
>>4533590
Early the majority of people have adopted the tainted ethics and morality of universal equality and equity even if unknowingly/unconsciously and act on it. Hopefully we of the more outcast 4ch can have a more pragmatic and nouanced approach.


Basically the Ur-Quan path with a case by case basis if we follow Kzer-Za or Kohr-Ah with this or that particular bunch of deformed intelligent blobs

Tl;dr Purge the alien! Xenocide now!
>>
>>4533612
>Early
Sadly
Fuck autocorrect and mobile devices.
Also jannies ofc.
>>
>>4533580
>The universe has shown that all xenos are out for themselves and at best will use other xenos as servants or catspaws that will be put down as soon as they represent a credible potential threat or resource competition that is not paid more through their servile existence.
>Thus a similar stance of human civilization towards xenos is entirely justified and reciprocal. Indeed not having such a stance is tantamount to civilizational suicide.
The Interex, Diasporex, people of Kharaatan, and pre-Heresy Eldar all would like words with you. Hell, the Eldar, notorious for their view of human inferiority, tried to stop the Horus Heresy, an event that didn't really impact them.
>>4533590
All xenos most certainly are not good, but nor are they all bad. Races like the Laer, Slaugth, Rangda, etc. deserve to be glassed, the Eldar, Tau & co, and other, not evil or Chaotic races do not.
>>
>>4533614
Human Supremacy is non negociable. Anyone contesting that gets purged even if they are human.
That is the core ethos of the great crusade.
>>
>>4533616
>Human Supremacy is non negociable. Anyone contesting that gets purged even if they are human.
Point to me where I said that we didn't have to be human supremacists. The High Lords of Terra wanted Fulgrim to make the Laer a vassal species, and while this wouldn't have worked out even if he'd tried, it's proof that the Imperium didn't render every species they came across extinct.
>>
>>4533614
Also the eldar in the conspiracy I recall wanted Horus to win and leave to few humans to sustain the chaos gods. Necron cribbed notes and half assed overcomplex troll plans that demanded the sacrifice of the human species to save the galaxy or some such drek.

Eldar should be shot in the face on principle for creating the eye of terror.

Interest and Diasporex were tainted from the get go. Most of humanity suffered under alien overlords or raiders before the great crusade. Cooperation and cohabitation with the xenos is not in the political lexicon of the nascent imperium at large. The only one who would even have such a thought in the first place as keeping the xenos as perpetual vassals instead of xenocide is emps and the sigilite.

Getting such ideas would instantly make our primarch suspicious to his brothers.
>>
>>4533627
>Eldar should be shot in the face on principle for creating the eye of terror.
And Slaanesh as well.
>>
>>4533628
I don't know Anon. Slaneesh would probably get off on it somehow.
>>
>>4533627
For the record, I don't think we have to be human supremacists. I don't think it fit's Lieren's character in the slightest. If our divergence from the canon 2nd Primarch's personality is the Emperor's doing, then he's made us compassionate, understanding, and kind for a reason. If it's Malal's we might get purged anyway. If we aren't perhaps we can speak to our father about not being a xenocidal dumbass, as Orks, Tyrandis, and Chaos are not human-excusive threats, but rather things that would benefit from maximum possible firepower (xenos included) directed towards them.

As I recall, Eldrad wanted Fulgrim to tell the Imperium of Chaos and it's threat so they could fight it. Only problem was that Fulgrim was already gone. The Necrons I don't think we have to worry about, nothing to my knowledge has happened to shake them out of their nap.

Regarding punishment for creating the Eye of Terror, Commorragh should be razed and the Drukhari put in a gellar field-shielded room and killed so as to not further empower Slaanesh. The Exodites and Craftworlders are not actively or inherently working against the interests of humanity.

Despite your high school freshman vocab words, your point about the Interex and Diasporex is wrong. The Interex knew what Chaos was and opposed it (though I will concede they did not do so strongly enough) and the Diasporex is an example of a flourishing pluralistic society that was exterminated as a result of the already-present ideological rot that plagued the Imperium. You say that the Imperium at this stage cannot ally themselves with xenos, but fail to give a reason as to why that is. As we show the signs of becoming a rather diplomatically-inclined Primarch, we will be the person who can popularize the idea of talking first and shooting only when that doesn't work among exploratory fleets. I have no idea what point you were to make about Malcador and the Emperor being the only people who could conceive something like diplomacy and xenos vassalhood. In any case, that seems implausible.

Vulkan would be open to it so long as we don't try it with dark eldar, Guilliman, being a statesman and open to the idea in ten or so millenia would be open to it, Sanguinius would be open to it as he's pretty much Jesus to Emp's God, and I'm sure there are more. We have an advantage as the 3rd Primarch rediscovered to help shape the Crusade. I doubt the primarchs popped out of their pods as massive human supremacists and most of their pre-recovery lives, minus Vulkan (as mentioned above) and Mortarion didn't have any horrible experiences with nonhumans.
>>
>>4533066
> Announce your presence and list the crimes of the accused, proclaiming the sentence Gao has passed already
>>
>>4533066
> "CUI FU! though in my heart there naught but hatred for you, I shall allow you one final honor, one final battle! Draw your sword and face me so I may deliver you to hell myself!"
>>
>>4532008
>Zhou Wenyan, Whose lands sit on the border of Gao's lands and the center of Yan itself, and deals with the taxes going to Yan and the trade coming into Gao. Without him, Gao will be reliant on your road and reforms for the Panther's share of his growing wealth

Pull the pug on him at any time, it would be a great treat to see him have to pay out of his own coffers for men and material. He would be beyond fuming and seething with impotent rage.
>>
>>4533666
The thing is, xenophobia is basically required in this future. The xeno empires of the great crusade are stubborn, dangerous, and have been enslaving and culling humans for thousands of years. It's just too risky, there simply is no time or room to deal with them all peacefully, there is the ever present danger of the knife in the back, and of course the chance that it's a chaos enhanced species like the laer.
If it makes you feel better the imperium also culled and sometimes genocided large human enclaves that refused to join and went to in human means to retain their power
>>
>>4533808
Also the eldar(craftworld in specific) are the only xenos the imperium has ever had more than a kill on sight relationship with, and even then things are usually spotty between the two as eldar foght for the eldar and humans fight for humans. Sometimes their goals align, but for the most part the two are too stubborn and self-intrested to form anything long term, even eldrad falls into this pit.
>>
>>4533808
>xenophobia is basically required in this future
I've listed instances where that isn't the case. Enough to make me think, at least that such instances are not merely acceptations to the rule, but rather the rule itself.
>If it makes you feel better the imperium also culled and sometimes genocided large human enclaves that refused to join and went to in human means to retain their power
It doesn't and we're a good enough talker to try and mitigate such instances.
>>4533810
God knows Eldrad is a stubborn asshole, I'm hoping Lieren can be a little more flexible.
>>
>>4533839
>I've listed instances where that isn't the case.
The instances you named were based purely off of eldar, who will take any advantage and make alliances as needed. Even then they're xenophobic fucks who won't blink twice about betraying said alliances if they're no longer needed
>It doesn't and we're a good enough talker to try and mitigate such instances
It's not about talking. There are powers you simply can't talk down. Techno-lords like those you see in kiavar, psykers who have enslaved their people to the point of ruling over what is essentually thoughtless flesh, nobles like those on nostromo, upper classes that keep their populations in check with drugs or horrific modification like the butcher's nails. If the imperium is to not make a joke of it's ideals it can't accept these things
>I'm hoping Lieren can be a little more flexible.
It's not about being flexible. It's about realizing long term alliances are foolish in the dark future of the 41st millenium. Trust xenos too much abd you will be used, like how alpharius was used by the cabal. This is just an unfortunate truth of the universe, even a sheltered, idealistic species like the tau have started to realize this
>>
We'll never actually ally with xenon. Empra really is a supremecist and I doubt he'll make exceptions for one of his tools.
>>
I have finally caught up to this quest, man it was a long one. The first thread kept messing with my phone and I had to keep refinding my place.


>>4533143
Support
>>
>>4533872
There are beneficial and non-hostile xenos, beneficial but hostile xenos and just straight up montruous species. For the first ones, I see no problem making a vassal, for the second one, we just learn all we need and just kill them all, for the third type we use phospex. I see no point in wasting resources if we are sure (or at least have enough info to reasonably think) that it won't bite us in the ass. Your repetitive arguments have proven wrong several times alredy, we won't kill all xenos, just all menaces
>>
Calling the vote now

CUI FU!!!:17
Announce your presence: 1
Have your men detain the other traitors first: 5

So Lieren will give Cui Fu the honor of one final battle, before hanging the rest of the traitors, well the ones who don't try to run and end up meeting the spears of the giant's guard at least

Writing the update now
>>
>>4533924
*Have been proven
>>
>>4533924
Unfortunately the menaces are a majority.
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>>4533940
That's not unfortunate, we just kill them and move on. Remember that killing a planet and taking it's resources is easier than having to manage the population, it's just that some xenos like the jockaeiro (probabli got the name wrong) are totally worth it. Others just don't deserve to die.
>>
>>4533957
Agreed there. From what I’ve read, this Second is a completly against not only senseless death, but also the death of innocents in general. If that extends to Xenos, it might serve useful. Not saying we try to be friends with all of them, but as some have said, being willing to work and take in those Xenos willing to live the way of Jade Giant
>>
>>4533886
We ain't allying, we are making them vassals.

Besides, which sounds better:
>Expend several lives trying to kill off xenos to take the planet with damaged infrastructure
or
>Convince the xenos to be vassalized and keep the infrastructure intact and no lives lost, and the xenos can eventually be used as meatshields.
>>
>>4533957
Jokaero
>>
Striding to the part of the road connecting to the inn, a thin line of white stone under a wooden arch. The gate leading into the safety of the waystation was swung wide open, the Iron bar that would hold it against all but the most furious of assaults laying upon the dry, red hued ground cast in the light of the rapidly fading sun. Horses stood, feeding upon grains and dried grass, the wind whistled around you, the torch like of your followers banishing away the shroud of dust and fog.

Swiftly, you grab your blank iron war mask, and move it to cover your face and hide your expression. Now fully armored, you turn, the plants and chains of your handcrafted armor chiming in the wind as they did when you faced your greatest and worst foe, the Toad Dragon. You have made improvements on the design of your personal armor, refining and curving the plates of steel to fit closer to your form, without sacrificing agility or movement. Using less steel for the same amount of protection has also lightened the load it bares upon your shoulders and back, but to a degree that will be unlikely to impact your fighting abilities for the better, at least while fighting against a mundane opponent.

For all of Cui's skill in the art of war and killing, he was but a man, a man above most others, but you were of a different stock entirely. One of the Primarch people, and to compare you to him would be to compare a common farm fowl to a Cliffjumper, or a kitten to a fog panther. You were simply two different breeds, entirely, but that did not mean you would not face Cui fu in battle.
He was a cruel man, he was fool who brought naught but suffering, but he was a warrior and unlike many nobles, he truly believed the philosophy he lived.

At the very least, he deserved on final honor, a last respect given to a man condemned to death by your hand alone. One final battle for Gao's War hound, one last fight for the scarred lord. This was the final meal you would give unto the last of the Cui line. A glorious death, an honorable death. The only death Cui fu himself would desire. It was a far better fate than what Gao would give unto him, the payment for generations of loyalty.

You closed you eyes, hiding their golden hue from the world as you gathered all your resolve, all your fury and hate for what must be done. For the man you will slay today. If only you had hatched from the mechanical egg that spawned you a few years earlier, perhaps you could've salvaged Fu as you did Jinhai, Lei, and Xia, before corruption could creep into his soul. Before the madness of his gospel of strength, savagery and slaughter had the chance to soak into his very bones. But to mourn what could have been and what you could have done, is pointless. You can only change the future with your actions, not the past. Perhaps it was Cui Fu's destiny to become a monster, perhaps not.

It did not matter now, the road he had taken has led to his death tonight, beneath the setting sun's glare.
cont
>>
>>4534087

In single in honorable combat, it was the least you could do to put his wrathful soul to rest, if he will walk Shangrala again in another life, or reaches the courts or simply ceases to be. Cui Fu shall die the one way he would be happy with, broken and bleeding at the height of a battle to the death.

Swinging your new Guandao into the air, you twirl it over your head and move it to your left side, before with all your might, slamming its pole into the ground. A loud thud is followed by a resonating ring as the metal shakes, the ground beneath it cracked and broken open.

Taking a deep breath, you puff out your chest, standing boldly as you issue your challenge to the man who has soaked his own lands in blood and bones.

"CUI FU!!!" You bellow, as loud as your prodigious lungs will allow you to yell, shaking the walls around you and even causing the windows upon the Inn to shiver from the sheer power of your voice. Then, you raise your weapon into the air, as you take another deep breath of dust contaminated air, tasting rust and ash upon your teeth as you do.

"THOUGH IN MY HEART THERE IS NAUGHT BUT HATRED FOR YOU" You continue, slamming your Guandao back to the earth, throwing up dust and stone to announce your challenge to Cui Fu and his lesser companions "I SHALL ALLOW YOU ONE FINAL HONOR, ONE FINAL BATTLE!"
-

Cui Fu was frozen, the Giant had found them, no doubt through foul sorcery or magical rite or demonic servants among them. The seven of his comrades were in a panic, rushing to find a route for escape, shouting orders and demands at the merchants and traders who sat among them. None of the common folk reacted, or even paid heed to the words of their betters. The lord of war took a long breath, grabbing a drink abandoned by He Tao as he sought escape from the Giant's wrath.

Gao would avenge him, he was sure, Cui had no disillusions of being able to escape alive to see the next dawn. This would be his end, his honor and legacy would not allow him to retreat even if there was a chance, however small, to survive. To flee or plead for his life would taint the legacy of the Cui, and all his ancestors. All their battlers, their victories, and strength would become worthless if he acted the coward now.

Swishing the strong liquor in his mouth, Cui Fu remained sitting, calm and content. Lieren had showed his hand, Gao would have his head. Fu himself would die, but he would be a martyr, along with his seven brave comrades who saw the devilry of the giant as well. The lands of Gao would be saved, the lives of eight men were a small price to pay. The line Cui which had endured centuries would be snuffed out.

But its flame would not flicker and fade, it would burn out in one final act of glory. One last act of loyalty.

"For Gao" Cui Fu sighed, setting the empty bottle to the table, before rising to his feet "For Yan, for Strength!"
cont
>>
>>4534090

"DRAW YOUR SWORD AND FACE ME SO I MAY DELIVER YOU TO HELL MYSELF!" The Giant roared once more, mighty enough to shake the very foundations of the building and quake the earth. Cui fu could taste his rage in the air, so thick, so potent. If only Lieren had rose from his lands. He would have made a wonderful weapon if he had not been allowed to grow ambitious an corrupt in mind and soul.

Was he destined to be a trickster? A traitor? or could he have been forged into a loyal, virtuous man? Who could know, who would care. His hands would be stained with noble blood tonight, and that is a grime even the Giant will not be able to scrub from his face. Cui Fu knew he would die, but at least his most hated of foes would soon join him in the halls of hell.

Throwing off his hood, he turned away from his fellow conspirators, who were desperately searching for a way to survive, to keep the embers of hope burning into this long night. It'd be pointless, the giant was no fool. He was not alone. All eight would meet their deaths today.

But only Cui Fu would so unafraid. With a mighty kick, he shattered wooden door blocking his path to his last battle. And his eyes beheld the giant himself. Lieren, coated in a fine armor of steel, and standing in the one route of escape like a living wall. Cui's arm shook before he commanded the fear to leave them and his heart utterly. there were no colors painted onto his armor, no loyalties shown. Not even the Azure and Plum heraldry Gao had gifted to the ambitious administrator for his personal use alone.

The only loyalty the giant held was to himself. It was plain, but of the highest quality, and in his hand he held a Guandao, like he had slain a dragon with, its pole wrapped in panther leather. The giant's favored prey.

Chains and plates of mail danced in the wind, chiming a funeral song as the beast beneath them stood stoic and proud.

His burning golden eyes, as bright as molten metal fell on Cui Fu, and all the lord's inborn instincts and knowledge screamed at him to run, to flee. That this was not a foe he could best. But he continue his march up to the Giant.

"Hmmmph" The giant grunted, hefting his massive pole of iron from the ruined ground with as much ease as a normal man would a stick from the ground.

"So, it has come to to this" Cui fu spoke, pulling his sheathed blade from his side, removing the plain scabbard of red lacquered wood and tossing it aside, he had no use for it now "One last match before I got to meet my fathers"

"Cui Fu, you are the first man to face me in battle unafraid" The giant said, taking a massive stride to the side, as Fu entered his favored stance, an aggressive open shouldered one that would allow him to preform his family's martial style to its full potential "for that, you will have my respect"

Cui Fu snarled, how dare he speak of honor and respect, he was a snake, a parasite.
cont
>>
>>4534091

"I will be the first to bring the fear of death to your iron heart, Giant!" Cui Fu bellowed as he circled, keeping himself matched with Lieren's casual stride "Until your last breaths, my memory shall haunt you wherever you walk!"

"Courage in the face of death, how admirable, but your rule must come to an end, for the greater good" Lieren said, calm and evenly, as if he was unaware of the battle to come or simply saw it as beneath him to care for such petty, mortal things "of Gao, and Yan"

"Silence your lies dog!" Cui Fu roared, gripping his undecorated sword in both hands "I will not be led astray by your promises of comfort and prosperity, your lie of benevolence, if I am to die by your hand, spare me your insipid ramblings!"

The Giant bowed his head, and stopped his pacing, Cui Fu stopped circling as well. this was it, he could see his end coming for him.

"Yes, it is pointless to try and show you the truth of the world now, let us cease talking and do battle, you may begin, Lord Cui" Lieren growled through his featureless war mask, as a show of his lack of connection to the world, an utter lack of conviction and ideals.

The Lord did not wait a moment, charging forward with a valiant war cry. The giant did not move a single inch as he came upon him. Like a serpent, he curled out of the path of Fu's strike, one meant to pierce armor and break spines.

"Impressive" Lieren muttered, not taking the chance to strike. Fu responded with force, stomping his foot to the ground, using the sudden stop of his charge, the moment of remaining momentum to power his swing. Switch the hilt of his blade in his hand, changing its position and direct, he swung upwards in a bent crescent, aiming for the Giant's throat above his head.

"Incredible agility and reflexes" is all the giant said in reply, having caught the blade between two fingers clothed in leather and armored with steel upon the joints, twisting the blade between his fingers as if he were playing with a flower's stem.

Fu pulled his steel back, as the Giant stepped forward. Letting his blade drop low, he stood defiantly as the shadow of the giant fell over him.

And he struck once again, as the giant swung his Guandao, ducking beneath his strike and driving the point of his sword into the armor of Lieren's side.

It didn't break through, but it scratched the steel. Fu smiled, as the blade was wrenched from his hands, the giant's own weapon flicking against it with such speed it could not be the movement of a natural man. The sword he had wielded for years flew through the air. The air was knocked out of his lungs, something broke inside him, and Fu found himself on the ground, struggling to breath.

The Giant remained silent, simply walking towards Cui Fu's prone form. Fu roared, jumping back to his feet and drawing a dagger from his side, throwing away any idea of survival or self preservation, he once more rushed the giant.
cont
>>
>>4534094
And with a flick of his arm, threw his blade at his golden, contemptible eyes.


Lieren swung his Guandao up, the blade bouncing off its thicker steel, but it gave fu enough time to close in. Lieren dropped his blade, and reached his hands down. Fu met his gaze, and saw a look of boredom in those ponds of gold.

"Clever" the giant said, as a father would to a disobedient child "A breath quicker and you would have drawn blood, Lord Cui, a better showing than any man I have fought before"

The dagger was caught in the Giant's massive hand, the steel was groaning, screaming. A moment later it snapped, and Fu was left with a hilt. Worthless. He drew another dagger, and drove it towards the Giant's armpit, the weakest point in any armor.

His wrist snapped as Lieren gripped it with his other hands and with contemptuous ease, threw Fu through the air.

Fu found it hard to breath, groans and gasps escaping his throat as he pushed himself off the ground, something had become bruised in side him, or burst. Bones were broken and his right hand hung limply at the end of his arm. Lieren was a monster. But Fu stood again, drawing his side sword from his hip. as the Giant walked to him, leaving his own weapon on the ground. They circled again, and Lieren retrieved Fu's blade from the dust it had fallen to.

"Face me" Fu growled, dropping the scabbard of his secondary sword to the dust. Lieren nodded, and charged, shaking the earth with every step. Fu couldn't follow his movements, he become a blur of steel and fury.

He was cut, he was sliced, he was cut. Every strike crippled him further. A cut tendon here, pierced and ruined muscle there. Lieren was breaking him down, cutting through his defense and guards as if he were cutting weeds. Blood, pain, anger. Fu couldn't fight back, even with his skill.

In moments, he was broken, unable to lift his functioning arm any longer, his legs refusing to move, their muscles pulled taught forever more. The Giant had ruined his body, in a set of strikes so quick Fu could not even seen them. He'd be a cripple if he lived beyond this fight.

"Marvelous, simply..." Fu laughed, before his own blade was driven through his neck and pulled back. A killing blow, blood flowed freely from his mouth as his body fell to the dust. His breath escaped through the wound in his throat.

But Fu did not die, his eyes fell on the giant's Guandao, and using his mangled hand, he began to pull himself to it.

"Even when the jaws of death wrap around your throat, you continue to fight on, impressive" The giant spoke again, watching fu drag himself to his own weapon "You faced me with no fear in your heart, bravely. Like charging into a storm head on, tackling into a panther mid pounce. Glorious, Cui Fu, Glorious"

The Lord of strength and hardship forced himself up, screaming in pain as his shattered wrist obliterated itself as he pushed his body off the ground. The giant's shadow fell upon him.

cont
>>
>>4534095
Fu's vision blurred, the pain began to fade from his body. He was weakening, he could feel death creeping into his bones, his already ruined body was failing. He would not die like this, he would not die like a dog...
-

Cui Fu's head falls to the ground, as you deliver a merciful stroke, slicing through his neck. His body remains in place, kneeling. One of his crippled arms forced under your titanic weapon.

"In the end, you tried to lift my Guandao" You say solemnly, amazed at the beast of a man's spirit and will, pools of red forming around his corpse "a glorious last stand, Lord Cui, may you find peace in your next life, or whatever truly comes after death"

Gently, you set his sword into his lap, the four cuts you made to his limbs to cripple him and render him defenseless are now bleeding through his armor. He had lasted half a minute in battle against you, several times longer than any bandit you've faced in building your road. Longer than most Fog Panthers. What a ferocious man he was.

He Tao, lord of lands of orchards drowned in alcohol and the vices it cultivates, breaks through a window, trying to run for the road, screaming and crying in blind fear as he sees what remains of Cui Fu. With a whistle from your lips, archers upon the hill fill him with arrows.

Ending the first member of your conspiracy. You kick the corpse over, to hide the horrid expression on his face, and turn to the inn.

"MEN, CAPTURE THE TRAITORS! THEY SHALL HANG FOR THEIR CRIMES AGAINST GAO AND THE LANDS!" You roar so all of your men and the six remaining nobles will hear your command.

They are captured easily, and by nightfall, you have ropes around their necks, hanging before the empty road by the inn. They beg, they plead. None of them face death with the dignity Fu did. You read them their crimes, they try to bribe you, to bargain, to lie. And then the ropes around their necks pull taught, and they hang lifeless in the wind. Clean deaths.

As it should be. Lord who had everything, partook in their every desire and drowned in extravagance, die in the lands which had nothing. It is poetic in away. They do not taint that land with their blood. But as this land was Cui Fu's home, you allow his body to feed the soil, and bury him with your own hands, except his head.

Proof of his death, which Gao will no doubt add to his gruesome collection of such trophies.

"Why do you mourn him?" Rong asks, as Zian pulls arrows from Lord He's corpse "He was a bastard like the rest"

"Brother Rong, do you not see? It is not Fu as he was that Lieren mourns" Jinhai says as Liang marches from the cliff with a sorrowful look in his eyes

"But rather the man Fu could have been, if he was raised differently" Liang chimes in as you smile and set Fu's head down into a small crate of tree sap and resin, to preserve it.
>>
>>4534097

"It is exactly as you say, what Fu became, was a waste of his potential, a tragedy a lifetime in the making" You reply as you turn to the small tomb you constructed for the man by the inn "I may have hated what he was, but I cannot help but grieve for what he could've been, in another life"

You stand to your full height, freeing your Iron colored hair from your helmet as you remove it.

"But there is work to be done still, let us move on and continue our labor brothers" You say, clicking your tongue "Liang, return the brothers of panther to nothing, Zian, leading the Road Guard back to their stations, Rong, Jinhai, with me!"

What is your next course of action, Lieren?
> Remove another one of Gao's "Pillars"
> Convince Gao to give the burden of raising levies and training generals to you, after all you are the black general's own student
> Stay in the former lands of Cui, and turn its fields of bone, into verdant farmland
> Spread your personal philosophy through the lands of Gao and beyond
> Write in
>>
>>4534099
>> Remove another one of Gao's "Pillars"
And then, once this is done, Gao himself.
>>
>>4534099
> Stay in the former lands of Cui, and turn its fields of bone, into verdant farmland

It is the most populous land rendered the lowest. Improving it...
>>
>>4534099
>Stay in the lands of Cui
>Spread our Philosophy as we do so

For the greater good!
...Wait
>>
>>4534099
>> Convince Gao to give the burden of raising levies and training generals to you, after all you are the black general's own student
>> Stay in the former lands of Cui, and turn its fields of bone, into verdant farmland
>> Spread your personal philosophy through the lands of Gao and beyond
>>
>>4534099
>> Convince Gao to give the burden of raising levies and training generals to you, after all you are the black general's own student
>>
>>4534108
So are you proposing to enrich the lands that we have now taken, and train the men through skill rather than hunger, then use these trainings to spread our personal philosophy and secure our position?

Renovating the lands of Cui before removing the next pillar also gives us results to show to Gao as justification for their removal.
>>
>>4534099
> Convince Gao to give the burden of raising levies and training generals to you, after all you are the black general's own student
>>
>>4534099
> Spread your personal philosophy through the lands of Gao and beyond
> Stay in the former lands of Cui, and turn its fields of bone, into verdant farmland
>>
>>4534099
>Stay in the former lands of Cui, and turn its fields of bone, into verdant farmland
I wonder if any of the remaining "Pillars" will wise up to Lieren's game now that Cui Fu is dead. It won't really matter or help them in a meaningful way, but I still wonder.

Cui Fu wasn't even completely wrong in what he saw Lieren to be. Most of his judgement was twisted to hell and back, but seeing that Lieren had zero loyalty to Gao is already plenty impressive when compared to most nobles we've met.
Not to mention he landed a blow on a Primarch. What a goddamn waste. In another time, he may have been fantastic Astartes material.
>>
>>4534141
Too old, but yes, the man was impressive.
>>
>>4534141
Custodes material, if he got to be Astartes, he would swiftly get to Captain/Champion/Chapter Master level.
>>
>>4534146
Come to think if it, what is our philosophy that we will be spreading?
>>
>>4534155
Zen Buddhist Asceticism?
>>
>>4534099
>"Hmmmph" The giant grunted, hefting his massive pole of iron from the ruined ground with as much ease as a normal man would a stick from the ground.
>and then he fixed the road right after breaking it

> Spread your personal philosophy through the lands of Gao and beyond
>>
>>4534155
I dont think we have properly articulated it, and so it is not codified. Seems to be more of a gestalt of the OPs and anons impressions
>>
>>4534099
> Stay in the former lands of Cui, and turn its fields of bone, into verdant farmland
May others see that we leave the land better then it was before.
>>
>>4534171
Which is why I fell like we should articulate it.

Prosperity for all and "virtue" are the only things which I can safely say that everyone would agree are parts of it.
>>
>>4534171
May as well figure one out then.

"Emotion is natural but one should be mindful not to blindly indulge. Moderation of oneself is necessary." seems to be one potential tenet. Leiren likes the celebrations of the peasants but hates those of the nobility due to the latter being of blind indulgence that is wasteful.
>>
>>4534164
>>4534155
>>4534171
>>4534206

I imagine it to be a mix of modern stoicism, Buddhism, and some Taoism.

Basically, master your emotions to master the world around you, do not act rashly or inefficiently, and do not let base shallow pleasures dull your path to true joy.

Leiren seems to follow these principles, mastering his emotions and rage so that he may conquer the world around him, he acts in ways that are effecient because waste (of material or even potential) are sins to his nature, and as we saw he is disgusted with excess and hedonism yet when confronted with true joy and the fruits of his labor, he is overwhelmed with true love and joy that even breaks through his stoic nature.

We could name it Leiric Daism, since it seems close to what the wise old man, the wise virtuous soul, himself practiced but changed to how we desire it.
>>
I would like some stuff on change, self-improvement, suffering, honor, etc.
>>
>>4534099
>Stay in the former lands of Cui, and turn its fields of bone, into verdant farmland
>>
>>4534099
> Stay in the former lands of Cui, and turn its fields of bone, into verdant farmland
Did Cui Fu really not have any heirs? Not even bastards?
As bad as he was, his genetics were pretty damn impressive. If nothing else, his line would make admirable Astartes.
>>
>>4534293
According to OP he was trying to get it on with the lady in red, and saw no other woman as fitting his standards.

Dude was like a crusader kings character trying to get the best traits
>>
>>4534321
>Dude was like a crusader kings character trying to get the best traits
RIP to a legend I guess
>>
>>4534321
Pretty retarded player then, everyone knows 15 stats in everything and "partying" specialisation will win the game in a single life.
>>
>>4534321
based
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>>4534099
>Stay in Cui’s land
>Spread your philosophy
Second one seems good, especially if we can get more lords or people of importance on our side without fighting
>>
>>4534099
> Stay in the former lands of Cui, and turn its fields of bone, into verdant farmland
>>
>>4534394
Spreading our influence and reputation is a fantastic idea, especially since it could start making other lords try to buy or barter for our services, meaning if we refuse them/let Gao handle the terms then it'd resolidify his trust in us.
>>
>>4534099
> Stay in the former lands of Cui, and turn its fields of bone, into verdant farmland
> Spread your personal philosophy through the lands of Gao and beyond
>>
>>4534099
> Stay in the former lands of Cui, and turn its fields of bone, into verdant farmland
> Spread your personal philosophy through the lands of Gao and beyondq.
After we turn the lands of Cui i to jade:
> Convince Gao to give the burden of raising levies and training generals to you, after all you are the black general's own student.
If he asks why wold we destroy our humble peasant facade, we tell him that it could not last forever, so bstter bs seen as a "fair, just and honorable lord that understands the common people" than to strech the peasant disguise until no one believes it. If he offers one of his daughter's hands in marriage, we accept and select the best (virtuous, smart, wise, etc) and after making sure she is not a spy, we tell her about our plans and ask her about info on Gao's personal life, etc (so we can hate him even more and maybe so we can predict possible daemon invocation to fight us).
>>
>>4534480
Why would our peasant disguise fail? There is nothing we havent already done which would damage our humble facade?
>>
>>4534480
No
>>
>>4534496
Taking on the burden of raising armies for Gao, I think
>>
>>4534327
Maybe that's why Gao is doing what he is...

Also, you can't win the game in a single life unless you get the immortal trait, as the stated goal is to retain any amount of land and a living house until the games end date, somewhere in the 1500s
>>
>>4534501
We already play about with the peasants as though they are going to learn anything (contain evil grin).
Doing it seriously would not break our disguise from Gaos perspective.

>>4534509
I meant just taking over the world, but neat.
>>
>Stay in the former lands of Cui, and turn its fields of bone, into verdant farmland
let's not start making ways with the philosophy just yet. Dai monks got purged so until we have our own army best to not rock the boat with that just yet. Seems that space feudal China also has a problem with new religions, philosophies or whatever belief structure you care to name upsetting the status quo and thus they either get purged, suppressed or coopted.
>>
>>4534547
>>4534099
Durrrrr hurrrrr
>>
>>4534321
Sad we had to kill him indeed.
>>4534327
Bah, faggotry. If you are not conquering the land its just not the fucking same.
>>
>>4534554
Not sad that he had to be slain, it was merely sad that he couldnt have been salvaged.
>>
>unaugmented human
>faces Primarch in duel
>manages to scratch armor
Holy fuck. How long has the Cui clan been practicing eugenics? All of that, gone in half a minute. I was expecting him to be a decadent hedonist with empty pretensions of hardening the peasantry, not borderline superhuman.
>>
>>4534601
He also tried to wield Lieren’s weapon.
>>
>>4534601
To be fair, Liren wasnt putting his back into it.

The only impressive thing was his diversion attack which was well done, and his spirit to keep fighting. How long he lasted isnt really impressive against an impassive opponent who didnt give it their all.
>>
>>4534612
I think we actually were trying, just not very hard
>>
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70 KB JPG
>>4534601
Probably some leftover genemods from the DAoT propagating down his family line. It explains why some people like Catachans are able to become inhumanly strong on a diet of explosive toads and mud. One managed to snap the neck of a ravener with a chokehold

I think we were playing with him as well. Primarchs can dodge bullets, a guy with a sword isn't gonna touch them
>>
>>4534627
2 things, I think the stated reason Catachans are so great is because the planet is hostile enough for evolution to kick in.

Also, I'd like to think that Cui Fu was just that much of a chad.
>>
>>4534625
That he got two free swings without any reprisal discounts that theory.
When we got somewhat serious, we diced the fuckers limbs in half a second.
>>
>>4534635
Plenty other worlds make people that can shrug off insane wounds and have superhuman strength. Yarrick routinely gets wounded to the point of death for other people. Bragg was on par with space marines in strength, able to use an Autocannon without power armor. That's not mentioning the way people manage to survive all the pollution of various worlds.

Humanity of 40k isn't the humanity of today, 30k years of evolution and genetic modification to survive on new worlds.
>>
>>4534675
To be fair, Yarric dies, but the WAAAGH brings him back because the orks think that he is immortal
>>
>>4534099
Damn. Cui Fui was a badass. RIP. He might have even been a good ally if things had gone differently.

> Remove another one of Gao's "Pillars"
Going against the tide here but I feel that we're wasting time in only one area, we can uplift everything once we've taken control over all of Gao's lands.
>>
>>4534099
> Stay in the former lands of Cui, and turn its fields of bone, into verdant farmland.
>>
>>4534697
If we go after everyone at once, Gao's noted to likely get suspicious. We need to space things out a bit so we choose when to rebel, not being forced to because he's coming after us.
>>
Calling the vote now

Remove another pillar:2
Fix the Cui family's mess:14
Spread your philosophy: 7
Convince Gao to give you his army:4

Alright, so Lieren will work to properly fix the land that has been under the Cuis rule now that Fu is dead, and bring prosperity to the people living within

writing the update
>>
So what are our Terminators going to look like?
>>
>>4534883
Pattern wise, I prefer Tartaros. Color wise, that depends on what we want our legion to look like. Or we could do what Horus has with the Justaerin and give them a paint job separate from our regular legionnaires. All comes down to a vote, really.
>>
The Cui family has abused and missed used the demesne for generations, for centuries. A quick survey of the land that once belonged to the respected and storied bloodline that you had ended mere days before reveals this even more clearly than the fields of dust, sand and bleached bone. The soil has been eroded from constant battle and riding, exposing the nutrient and mineral rich soil to the cutting winds of the plains and canyons, removing any fertility it once have. This is of course a problem, and means that too make the people and land prosperous you will have to do more than simply spread fertilizer and mineral and vitamin supplements to the locals.

Too make this land into farm land, or even graze land once again, the soil must be anchored to something, so you must important low hanging shrubs and hardy grasses. To make the soil fertile you will need to not only improve its natural quality, but encourage livestock to feed and on the meager plants you do bring to the battle scarred landscape. Their corpses and waste will help improve the soil quality. Another issue is water, which is in low supply in these lands outside of springs fed by underground rivers and lakes. To irrigate the land you will need to build canals, streams and river yourself. And with that you could plant trees and other hardy plants to further strengthen the top soil. Once you start the effort, the peasantry, tired of constant struggle and battle, will gladly take up hoes and carry buckets of water wherever you command them to work.

Until then, imported food and water from Gao's supply, as well as materials to build standing reservoirs of water, with which to hydrate the land and keep the workers alive as they tend to the fields and orchards of young trees. It will take years to properly revitalize these lands, but once you get past the hurdle the weakened, exposed soil presents, it will solve itself so long as efforts continue.

Maybe import manure, grind the bones covering the land and use them as a fertilizers to encourage early grass growth, before adding the chemicals and nutrient mixtures you've devised over the new upper soil layer. Gao would probably order all animal waste gathered if you asked for it, thinking it was a final insult to a "Traitor".

"Disgusting what one man can wrought, isn't it?" Jinhai says, keeping Fu's horse standing by your side, it was a beast that was worthy of its master, and the only one that was able to bare you upon its back. With its fur the color of fresh unfired clay and with a mane as black as coal, you had taken a liking to the beast, and took it as your own, knowing it would starve or be abused under Gao's care. Beneath its heavy, shaggy fur, it had a brutality to it, a fierceness. It tower over other horses as you towered over other men.
cont
>>
>>4534913

"This is not the work of one man, but rather the result of tradition and poisonous philosophy" You state as Jinhai ponders your words, glancing over the desolation before you, patting your steed upon its scarred hide "Carried out over generations, over centuries"

"The Cui family were all like Fu? So uncaring, so brutal, so barbaric?" Jinhai asks, sounding horrified as you scoop up a handful of red dirt and let it fall through your fingers "And they remained in power"

"Yan itself is ill with the same sickness that befell this land, they just sing a different gospel of decay is all, the end result is the same. If Gao and Cui switched places, the lands would still suffer, but in different ways. This is merely an enclave of a different kind of cruelty" You muse as you shake your hand free of dirt and dust, but the color remains on your fingers "One that sought to create strong men, but only created suffering and pain. The cruelty of the other nobility is solely for their own enjoyment and pleasure, their gluttony. The Cui's cruelty, is both lesser and greater than the rest and for the same reason. How paradoxical"

"Ah, because they had a goal, instead of merely consuming and abusing the resources at hand" Jinhai says, gasping as if a divine revelation had reached him

"Exactly, Friend Jinhai, it had a purpose, but the purpose was cruel. The others do not know how terrible a cost their debauchery raises, The Cui knew, and they continued on anyways, they were worse than the rest but at least held ideals beyond hedonistic degeneration" You snarl, clenching your red colored hand into a fist as you look over the empty plain "The rest were cruel for no reason, the Cui were cruel to an end, but they were more terrible for it in the end"

"Fu had strength, perhaps their methods had some success after all, though I know you would not care if that is true or not, suffering of others drives you in a terrible furry, Friend Lieren" Jinhai said with a nod, resting against his spear, a sad look in his eyes "And even if the lost Cui were right, I would never endorse their methods"

"Because the Cui family unknowingly strengthened their line, not through hardship, but rather breeding" You explain, stepping to the edge of the cliff face you have taken Jinhai to overlook "While struggle can make an individual stronger, it weakens the people as a whole. Fu was mighty because he was of the Cui, he was mighty because he fought his own battles and never sought rest or comfort, for one man, such things would make him mighty, but to an entire land"

"It creates this wasteland" Jinhai says closing his eyes as the wind throws a cloud of dust through the thin fog "How will you possibly save these people, brother"
cont
>>
>>4534917

"I have plans, plans that honored Zian and respect Rong are setting into motion, that is why I sent them with letters requesting aid and supplies, I shall save the land of the Cui, even if I could not save the Cui from themselves" You say solemnly as Fu's horse stomps its feet, impatient and annoyed it has to stand in such cold air so high above the ground "My duty, our duty remains the same"

"Prosperity and plenty for all men of Gao, of Yan, and of Shangrala" Jinhai says with a nod before sighing and shaking his head "Will we live to see this land repaired, Lieren? or shall our children, our sons see the fruits of our labor here and witness these fields of bones turn green and jade like, as all lands you touch do?"

"It will recover in a few years, begin to at least. It will take decades, at least two, for the trees and bushes to fully mature. Which will bring back all the wildlife that had fled these lands so long ago, the cliffjumpers here shall remain carnivorous for generations, many generations. But, forests and fields will dot this land once again, when we are both old men" You laugh happily, smiling confidently as Jinhai nods

"If we are not killed before then" He says morosely, in a dour mood from all he has seen and heard today "if you do age, brother, who knows, maybe Rong's joking that you will one day tower above mountains is in fact a vision of the future"

"Hmm, then I shall lay down to keep from disrupting life with my sheer size" You chuckle, closing your eyes as you imagine, briefly what this land shall look like when you have left the mortal coil and gone off to discover the greatest mystery of life "You know, my friend Jiang made the same joke once"

"Ah yes the rat eater" Jinhai says with a dismissive snort "I can't understand why he scarfs down vermin like they're a delicacy"

"Well there's a story to it, actually, a rather long one" You explain turning from the cliff edge, motioning for Jinhai to follow you back to the camp your men have made "I'll tell it to you and the rest, Chen will find it funny, though my friend Wei tells it better than I do"

"Ah, a rare delicacy, Lieren telling stories of home" Jinhai says, whistling as he follows you, leading Fu's horse behind the two of you as the great beast snorts and spits angrily
-

Building the foundations to allow the land to heal and recover, take the rest of the season, and much politicking, as it seems word has spread you intend to take the lands for your own. Though Gao makes the offer, you politely and humbly refuse with the excuse that it would tarnish your image of a humble hero, and in the same visit demonstrate how much of a drain the land is if it is kept in the state it has been for generations and centuries before.
cont
>>
>>4534918

By showing how infertile the soil is, and a chart of how much imported food is needed to feed the populace. That is enough to convince Gao to abandon the tradition the Cui fostered, and to lend a portion of his wealth to the efforts to rebuild their lands, outside of the supplies he has given you. Though you did lie about how soon it would be until it was as prosperous as the rest of his lands.

But Gao would not live to discover that small deception. Over looking a field of workers, tending to bushes and trees that shall not bear fruit for years, as water floods the rust colored fields of dirt outside of the villages you have built, so the people could migrate from their homes at the bottom of canyons along dry streams, and leave their cliff side abodes. Though many by choice remain within.

But you have found a way for them to tend to farms as well, though most of the work of the cliff and canyon folk is relegated to merely making sure the new streams and rivers remain flowing, as most pass by a collection of such communities.

Sighing, you sit down by a small pond you've made, watching insects and amphibians live their small lives, taking a moment of rest by the Inn where this land's fate was changed by your hands.

"Cui Fu, your blood nurtures this valley, and brings life to it once more" You say, brushing off the tomb of your foe, as some vandal had place slivers of words covered in curses upon the warriors resting place "I know you'd hate to see such a thing, think it was poison or some trick to weaken your people. But I did so to strengthen them, as your family meant to"

You look upon the silent stone, carved with the Cui's symbol of three carp circling each other and sig.

"If only I met you when you were young, Fu" You say sadly, hanging your head "Perhaps, if I did, you would be in my company now, your strength and talent not wasted with your death. a fresh legacy for the Cui instead of their last scion"

You brush dust from the face of his grave, his weapons serving as a marker upon the ground.

"Perhaps, in another life, I could have called you brother" You muse wistfully, mourning the loss of a man as great as Fu, and the man he could have been if he had lived another life. His death was necessary, the extinction of his bloodline was needed. But it was still a tragedy, that such a thing had to come to pass. But, there was no time to reflect on what could have been, it was pointless.

The past would remain unchanged, and Fu would remain dead. His lands would heal, and its people would flourish under your guidance. The bloody legacy of the Brutal Cui would be forgotten, left to the ash and dust. Perhaps mothers would tell their children of monstrous devils that once ruled their ancestors, in a few generations.

What an unpleasant thought. Whatever family came to rule these lands in the future, you could only hope they were kinder than the Cui
cont
>>
>>4534922

What is your next work, Lieren?
> Weakening Gao further by cutting down another of his "pillars"
> Returning to nothing and innovate, bringing another miracle to the world
> Laying low for a season and picking off lesser lords and corrupt officials, pruning the garden of weeds
> Recording your philosophy and world view, so long after you are gone, men may learn to view the world as you do
> Write in?
>>
>>4534924
> Laying low for a season and picking off lesser lords and corrupt officials, pruning the garden of weeds
> Recording your philosophy and world view, so long after you are gone, men may learn to view the world as you do
>>
Do we know how to read and write?
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>>4534924
> Weakening Gao further by cutting down another of his "pillars"
Down with Shen Bohai. What use are knives of iron and bowls of silver without meat to cut and wine to fill them? There is no more time to waste.
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>>4534924
>> Weakening Gao further by cutting down another of his "pillars"
]>> Recording your philosophy and world view, so long after you are gone, men may learn to view the world as you do
Through removing another pillar from the House of Gao, it becomes all the easier to topple. And by recording and sharing our philosophy, we invite people to question it, so we may learn from the flaws they find.
>>
> Laying low for a season and picking off lesser lords and corrupt officials, pruning the garden of weeds
> Recording your philosophy and world view, so long after you are gone, men may learn to view the world as you do
>>
>>4534924
>> Laying low for a season and picking off lesser lords and corrupt officials, pruning the garden of weeds
> Recording your philosophy and world view, so long after you are gone, men may learn to view the world as you do
>>
>>4534924
> Laying low for a season and picking off lesser lords and corrupt officials, pruning the garden of weeds
> Recording your philosophy and world view, so long after you are gone, men may learn to view the world as you do
>>4534927
Given how Lieren's been able to draw architectural plans, read High Gothic, and double check calculations, I'd say yes.
>>
>>4534937
...actually, append something to the latter:
>Begin work on transcribing the methods used to improve the lands. Maintain its secrecy for now under the stance of being an unfinished work.

The Emperor made the Lex Imperialis for Law. Guilliman made the Codex Astartes for the Astartes. Let us begin work on a work to uplift societies so the Imperium doesn't get stuck with innumerable Feudal worlds.
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>>4534956
Oh that's not a bad idea. Supporting as well.
>>
How would everyone feel about developing a wargame to help teach tactics?
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>>4534966
Would said wargame involve overly expensive miniature models and bizarrely complex rules?
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>>4534966
I'd rather wait til we meet Perterabo so we can just get introduced to the one he uses. Hell, maybe could get him to pen a bit on fortifying a planet in the uplift book.
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>>4534970
Don't forget the expensive paint that is extremely difficult to get
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>>4534977
Or we could start now and have something to compare and upgrade notes by then...
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>>4534970
We'll call it The Art of War
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>>4534956
supporting this.
>>
Thinking about that uplift book and the idea of having others contribute...wonder if it could evolve into a Book(s) of the Primarchs with each contributing one facet they are interested in...

Not all might be interested, but still.

>>4534981
True.
>>
>>4534922
> Laying low for a season and picking off lesser lords and corrupt officials, pruning the garden of weeds
> Recording your philosophy and world view, so long after you are gone, men may learn to view the world as you do.
>Begin work on transcribing the methods used to improve the lands. Maintain its secrecy for now under the stance of being an unfinished work.
Writing is good for destressing, let's write a lot. Mixing our uplifiting program with Perturabo's will end with technically perfect infraestructure, defenses and also a well fed, healthy and fullfilled population. So overall trillons upon trillons of happy people living happy lives and sending good vives into the warp. Chaos is going to be SOOO pissed off...
>>
>>4534998
Well, Slaanesh might try to push people to indulge further. Maybe have Angron write a "How to tell if your leaders are fucking High Riders" trieste?
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>>4534995
Perturabo: Build defenses!
Gulliman: Taxes, Taxes!
Sanguinius: I could give them hugs. And chainsaws.
Angron: MURDER THEM, THE SOIL WILL BE ENRICHED FOR THE NEXT COLONISTS THAT SETTLE. THEN MURDER THOSE TOO.
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>>4535006
Magnus: The Power of Psykers
Leman: The Dangers of Maleficarium
Magnus: The Follies of Leman
Leman: The Failures of Magnus
>etc.
>>
You know, I think it’s kinda sad our Primarch is never going to take to the arts well unless something changes.
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>>4535005
We should put a giant picture of Angron in every Administration office and datapad with a recording of the primarch saying "every time you overindulge, I get closer to FUCKING MURDER YOU, YOUR FAMILY, YOUR NEIGHBOURS, THEIR DOG AND THE WHOLE FUCKING PLANET"
>>
>>4535014
Caligraphy as a meditative exercise is something I can see Lieren doing.
Same with poetry.
>>
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>>4535016
What a handsome young lad
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>>4535014
War is an art. An ugly one, but an art nontheless
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>>4535017
I could see him maintaining a zen garden or something like that
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>>4535017
There are a lot of artistic pursuits in Asia that are of great cultural importance and spiritual significance.
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>>4535022
I'll happily vote for us to install one on our gloriana once dad comes to pick us up.
>>
I still want to explore the planet.
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>>4535027
>I still want to explore the planet.
Exploring is a part of conquering, and we're gonna be doing plenty of that.
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>>4535028
Hoping to find a Vimana and Astra equivalents.
>>
>>4535028
[A song starts and the primarch sing]
Sangunius: Join the Guard~
Robust Gorillaman: See the world~
Magnus: Explore the Galaxy~
Mortarion: PPPPPOSPHEEEEX~
>>
>>4534924
> Weakening Gao further by cutting down another of his "pillars"
>Returning to nothing and innovate, bringing another miracle to the world
I want boom boom.
>>
>>4534956
I think this is better pursued for after we've united the planet. Would work very well to cement our position within the wider Imperium anyway.

>>4534924
> Weakening Gao further by cutting down another of his "pillars"

Once we take control of the kingdom we can get into turbo uplifting mode.
>>
>>4534998
Supporting these
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>>4534924
>> Returning to nothing and innovate, bringing another miracle to the world
>>
>>4534924
> Laying low for a season and picking off lesser lords and corrupt officials, pruning the garden of weeds
> Recording your philosophy and world view, so long after you are gone, men may learn to view the world as you do
Don't want to arouse too much suspicion, and it will allow us to clear out the more cruel nobles. The other three pillars are vital to Gao but don't seem to be as needlessly destructive to the lives of their people. I assume the miner one is pretty bad though, we should do him next
>>
>>4535033
I think it was mentioned that the Vishnu, who are extremely likely to be the Hindu analog on Shangrala, had some cool technology. Not sure what that means, but I hope we don't have to shoot down flying palaces.
>>
> Laying low for a season and picking off lesser lords and corrupt officials, pruning the garden of weeds
> Recording your philosophy and world view, so long after you are gone, men may learn to view the world as you do
i agree that we should probabaly do this to lower potential suspicion on us, Cui was onto us real damn fast
>>
>>4535242
Seemed like they are good warriors, considering some went in to fight the toad dragon. Don't know if they have any better tech, especially compared to us now
>>
>>4535185
>>4535276
I feel like you're all being too cautious about Gao, the guy completely trusts us based on our last interaction with him, and we can probably afford to speed up the removal of his other close advisors. As long as we keep him happy with results, he won't do a thing against us. Though admittedly, we might want to avoid the other lords doing something, but that could also work in our favour by allowing us to get rid of them in one fell swoop.
>>
>>4535345
>>4535242
Traditionally, Indians IRL were really, really good at ironwork, so maybe they're just good at metalurgy
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>>4535406
I was thinking that they might have some of the larger stocks of archeotech on the planet or at least more than we have right now. The Indians pretty much invented science fiction, I can see Malal referencing that with the Vishnus.
>>
>>4534924
> Laying low for a season and picking off lesser lords and corrupt officials, pruning the garden of weeds
> Recording your philosophy and world view, so long after you are gone, men may learn to view the world as you do
>>
>>4534995
I like this idea. For each of the twenty sons, what would everyone provide?
>Perterabo: how to siege planets and Hive cities properly with safety tape
>Dorn: proper trench digging techniques, one hundred uses for a shovel (including melee and ranged combat)
>Russ: How to tame big fucking animals, fuck bitches, and kick ass
>Robute: governance or something
>Angron: fuck all just kill them and paint yourself with their blood
>Alpharius & Omegon: just meme your opposition to death
>Fulgrim: personal health tips and proper grooming, moral boosts.
>Manus: PT instructions on how to get /fit/ for baseline humans
>Magnus: dont talk to spoopy ghosts
>Horus: I forgot what this guy does
>Jagatai: how to travel FAST in any situations. Propper tires for ground vehicles, check turbines on valkyries, advanced vehicular combat maneuvers
>Vulkan: Imperials cook book with promethium
>Sanguinius: Sympathy or something?
>Lion: I'm drawing blanks here.
>Mortarion: toxins that will not immediately kill a human, and how to delay your death until help arrives
>Lorgar: a list of imperial songs people can sing during long marches, on shoreleave, or drills.
>Konrad: how to make quilts out of the corpses of your enemies, or generally how to fix the fabrics of your war gear. Konrad comes off as someone good at knitting to me.
>Corvus: how to be stealth and creative uses for Guardsmen tier stealth cloaks
>Lieren: meditation techniques?

>>4535016
Supporting this so hard. God we need to do this. I hope we remember to do this some time in the future.

>>4535024
This too. I think some of Horus's boys did the same thing. At least that Cerberus fellow did before the whole Heresy.

>>4535412
If they had a large stock of archeotech, then they would be the ones to rule this world. They don't, so they probably dont have much in the ways of archeotech. Perhaps they got autoguns and people think they're magic.
>>
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>>4535486
Angron would obviously include his knowledge on raising dogs and keeping them as pets
>>
>>4535499
Any suggestions of what we should so when we first meet Angron in person? Depending on when we're found, we might encounter him before the Emperor finds him, or after. I just wanna get those damn nails out of his head.
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>>4535502
>Any suggestions of what we should so when we first meet Angron in person?
It depends on what we know about him.
If all we get beforehand is his name, then all we can really do is give him a proper greeting as equals.
If we get his backstory and the circumstances around his meeting with the Emperor, the only right thing to do is tell him we will do whatever we can to make sure his people didn't die for nothing.
Also yeah we gotta get those fucking nails out of his head.
>>
>>4535502
Best case scenario is that we're with Daddy E when he comes to Nuceria and convince him to teleport down the War Hounds during Angron's final stand to turn the tide. Make things cinematic as all hell. But that is, again, the best case scenario. Unlikely to happen.

pls malal
>>
>>4535512
Would be cool though. Imagine brother Lieren coming to help save the day via teleporting with a crew of marines with Jetpacks and Guandaos. That or jetpacks with unarmed combat. Wither works.
>>
>>4535517
Angron wouldn't want our help. He'd hate some outsider swooping in to save him and kill the nobles that had tortured and oppressed him and his fellow gladiators. He might not even want to win, really, but the most help I can see him accepting is his legion, fully under his command. That's the best-case scenario, not us swooping down to save him, but Angron saving himself.
>>
>>4535519
The problem is that he can't save himself, but I feel certain that he would probably prefer to save the lives of his fellow gladiators and taking a hit to his pride, than to have them all be dead. He'd probably eventually fill up him empathic role more once we get those nails out of him to boot. Why so you think he would not want help?
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>>4535517
I say we drop the War Hounds in nearest to Angron to secure him and start their relationship off on a good foot.
This would also probably be in the thickest part of the battle, so they'd have a chance to show off to Angron as well.
Meanwhile Lieren's forces can come from the back of Angron's foes and box them in. Afterwards we can start offering aid to what's left of Angron's gladiator forces.
That small act of compassion would at the very least make him think twice about betraying us.
>>
>>4535520
He couldn't save himself in the canon timeline because he was one primarch leading a bunch of ex-slaves. If we got the Emperor to send down even half of the legion of War Hounds, he'd be able to take Nuceria. As for why he wouldn't want help, you said it just now. Pride.
>>
>>4535520
>Why so you think he would not want help?
It's still a blow to his martial pride. He went into the conflict thinking he could win and would do so or die trying. It's just how he conducted himself.
Regardless of what we do, he's likely to be sore about it.
That said, the way it happened canonically is probably the worst since it ended up with Angron being incredibly resentful of the Emperor for snatching him from a warrior's death and leaving his forces to die.
>>
>>4535406
It’s literally nanotech done by hand
>>
>>4535524
>>4535525
Between being saved by the Emperor while dooming his allies, or going down there to save him and his allies, which do you think he would hate the least?
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>>4535530
Why would we choose either of those options when there's a better third one?
>>
>>4535542
What would that be?
>>
>>4534924
> Laying low for a season and picking off lesser lords and corrupt officials, pruning the garden of weeds
> Recording your philosophy and world view, so long after you are gone, men may learn to view the world as you do

>>4534956
We can do this has a free time activity. If we have any free time to spare that isn t already filled with reading, thinkering, meditation or training.
>>
>>4534924
>Pull down another Pillar
>Record our personal philosophy
>Record our own codex thing for making planets better.
>>
>>4535542
What third option?
>>
>>4534924
> Recording your philosophy and world view, so long after you are gone, men may learn to view the world as you do
> Laying low for a season and picking off lesser lords and corrupt officials, pruning the garden of weeds
>>
>>4535502
I think we are too late for that, even if we met him immediately after emps found him and got him looked at.
We'd have to speed up the timeline and find him before they have had years to crystalise.

As for aiding him, Handing him weapons and waiting until his forces are about to be wiped out will probably make him less bitter.

"I'm sorry brother Angron, but I couldn't stand to see you and your kin wiped out. Hate me for this if you must, but you and those left will survive this battle."
sorta thing
>>
>>4534924
> Recording your philosophy and world view, so long after you are gone, men may learn to view the world as you do
We're a primarch, we must write an fancy book. If Lorgar can have his Lex Divinitatus, we can have some fancy chinese zen book.
>>
I'm going to be honest here, all this talk of specifically going to help people like angron in a way that doesn't piss them off, it feels a bit...metagamey.

I mean, it's not thing to have lieren be overall friendly, it's another thing to specifically go at it in a way that wouldn't piss these primarchs off. Why would Lieren specifically know that angron would get angry if someone were to just teleport him and his crew, or to steal his victory away?

Or to specifically go with the emperor?

I get that you people want to help, but it just feels like you're metagaming. Trying to be some kind of redemption guy for all the primarchs honestly feels cringey.
>>
>>4535639
Truth be told, it started as anons desire to get rid of his nails, an explicitly OOC desire. The conversation is going to be forgotten by the tme we actually meet him and then we will roll how the anons roll.

Besides, Metagaming is a thing we've been doing for a while with regards to technology that Lieren may or may not have any idea exists to use, as well as coming up with designs, emblems and other paraphernalia that goes with our legion. This talk of Angron is only different because we are talking about a hypothetical net positive change to anothers character arc.

As for your questions about "Why would we go with the emperor at all?" we A] would want to meet our brothers, the people we know we are a part of yet never known and B] it's quite common for Primarchs to be present at the finding of a new one.

Magnus was with Lorgar, Fulgrim with Kurze, so on and so forth. It's often the start of strong bonds of brotherhood.
>>
>>4535643
There's a difference between knowing technology related stuff that's quite easy for an primarch who's not just made for murderboning to learn and knowing how to try to redeem other primarchs.
>>
>>4535544
>>4535558
Sending down the War Hounds and letting him win his own fights? Like I said twice?
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>>4535647
Not that much from the perspective of "anon wants it, let's talk about it"
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>>4535643
Which of Lieren’s brothers would be the best to accompany the emperor to his retrieval?

Which would be the worst?

And which do you think Lieren would enjoy and connect with the most?

I feel him and Dorn would have a lot to connect over, stoicism and their love of efficiency, and the same with Perterabo cause they both desire to create public works and a desire for perfection.

I think Lieren might not care for Roboute, due to Rouboute’s more political nature. Not that he’s a politician, just Lieren’s bad experience and taste for politics (though I may be mistaken on this perception)
>>
To be fair about the Angron thing, I really doubt Lieren would be happy just abandoning angrons army
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>>4535672
>Which of Lieren’s brothers would be the best to accompany the emperor to his retrieval?
If we're still the 3rd primarch discovered, Horus and Leman are our only options. If not, maybe Rabbit Guillotine or Fulgrim. The former can appreciate skillful politicing and the latter can appreciate lifting up an entire planet culturally and technologically.

>And which do you think Lieren would enjoy and connect with the most?
He'd try his best to get along well with everyone, but I think he'd actually feel brotherly towards Vulkan, Fulgrim, Lorgar, Roboute, Corax, and Horus. Maybe more.

Lieren has never struck me as stoic. He grieves, he feels joy, and is pretty open with it. If anything, his philosophizing would confuse Dorn and his way with words would make him jealous. I agree with Perturabo, however, though Lieren has never stuck me as a perfectionist.

Lieren has bad experience with despots and fools in power. Roboute has done pretty well balancing the hard choices a ruler has to make with doing what is good for the people. But who knows? Maybe they just won't like each other. But you know who Lieren's toppling of tyrants will endear him to? Curze.
>>
>>4535672
Now, I know he won't be there to discover Lieren, Alpharius Omegon would be pretty polarizing to meet. I feel that Lieren could appreciate Alpharius' crafty way of fighting, but be driven up the wall by his insistence on showing off (Operation "Waste-of the Emperor's-bolt-shells" for example).

Konrad Curze is another Primarch who would grind Lieren's gears. Tyrannically ruling by terror is extremely inefficient in the long run, and hearing what Curze did to his victims on Nostramo would no doubt remind Lieren of what Gao did to Ling.

Can't really say about the other Primarchs, not familiar enough with them.
>>
>>4535690
Reminder that Lieren had a barely restain desire to go on a killing spree at the party.
>>
>>4535698
That he restrained his base instinct is more of a bonus than a mark against him.
He managed to put on a smile, even.
>>
>>4535698
I wasn't saying Lieren would disapprove of Konrad killing people, but rather he'd disapprove of Konrad's methods (flaying people and hanging the skin onto bridges to be seen, crucifying mutilated bodies onto buildings and other such brutalities).
>>
>>4535689
I call him stoic because he is someone who controls his emotions, not because he never shows outward emotion. He controls himself.

But yeah his Philosophical side would grate on Dorn. Fulgrim would like it though.

I also think that Lieren would probably be someone the Emperor would not be the most excited about. Cause he’s not going to invade a planet, risk it’s innocents, destroy it, and leave it without good reason. He is someone who will take a plent in such a way that is tasteful to him, that is efficient in the long term rather than focus on short term gain.

I can see him pulling a Lorgar to help rebuild societies and cultures, but not for religion but to function better and be virtuous.
>>
>>4535782
For that he is better than Lorgar.
>>
>>4535782
We may want to work on the book, as we do so, though. Ullanor's about to go Krork, so we can't really dally. We can do some for a couple so we can get the book done for more than just Feudal worlds, but eventually we want to go 'conquer -> here's a book to rebuild and get better -> next planet.' Once Ullanor is done, we do a once-over to polish things up a bit.
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>>4535830
*There's also the Rangdan.
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>>4535782
Rebuilding the worlds is actually better long term. We won't pull a Lorgar because we know how to delegate. We'll just write down our philosophy as complete and clear as possible, make an uplifting package that allows worlds to survive and be functional at first, and to be fullfilled and happy at last (at least to an acceptable point) and leave all but the most vital stuff (food, water and shelter) for our troops to build. We could also add an educational package included into our philosophy so we can help humans help themselves even more. In the end, we just get in, do diplomacy, a quick takeover with the least ammount of destruction or death necessary (and then repair the vital infraestructure and services and leave to conquer another planet while the loyal population repairs the rest and our philosophy turns the rest loyal), or bombard the planet from orbit if the worlds are hostile/chaos and then march our troops and kill all survivors if there is any left, then call the colonists and make sure to clean any dangerous remains of the war, or at least warn the colonist about them.
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>>4535830
Yep. Basically, we want to conquer creating the least ammount of hatred possible among the population, create an stable foundation for their survival, uplifting and lives in general; and then move on to another world and repeat. We keep the Crusade as fast as possible but without neglecting the worlds we conquer, gaining the respect of both our martial-inclined brothers by being a strong warrior and general, and our intelectually inclined brothers for being a benevolent, wise and intelligent ruler. We could be the commong ground between most Primarchs.
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>>4534924
best quest i have seen so far op, keep up the good work
> Returning to nothing and innovate, bringing another miracle to the world
> Laying low for a season and picking off lesser lords and corrupt officials, pruning the garden of weeds
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>>4535833
Supporting this. Have a (you).
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>>4535833
Think it might be good to do a leapfrog style of conquest? As in, we have half the fleet conquer a world and stick around to work on it, the other half goes and conquers the next planet where they stick around while the first half, now done with the first world, goes on to the next planet?
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>>4535925
If we did that, it’d be best to personally lead the assault fleet, while our trusted sons handle the worlds rebuilding. Educating, choosing trusted mortals, and always ready to help
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>>4535925
Half might be too much to leave behind. At most we leave behind a sixth or a tenth, minimum if 1 Battle Barge worth of marines to help with rebuilding, while the rest continues onwards.
>>
Calling the vote now

Laying low:12
Recording you philosophy: 14
Weaken Gao: 4
Begin transcribing methods to improve lands: 6
Return to nothing and innovate:3

So, Lieren will begin to codify his world view and philosophy, so future generations will be able to benefit from his wisdom and beliefs. While pruning Gao's court and lands further, as that got more than half the total votes, thus building a larger support base among the nobility by grateful second sons and similar.

Writing the update

>>4535013
Hilarious, I just imagine a separate edition of the biggest space book that is just Magnus and Leman insulting the each other

>>4535859
Thanks, glad you're enjoying it
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>>4535925
Doesn't the great crusade go over god know how many thousands of countries? Leaving any considerable amount of marines would be too much. It might be smarter to just have some auxiliaries trailing us to do the rebuilding.
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>>4535952
Each planet can be macro-dealt with, and there are often years between viable worlds.

Leaving 10 marines to oversee and auxilaries to fix worlds will be easy enough to do.
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>>4535957
Maybe, if our legion's actually legion sized as opposed to being an slightly larger chapter similar to the white scars.

Regardless, i wonder what the book's title will be.
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>>4535966
"How not to be a degenerate wasteful slug or student of the Gross Atrophying Orangutan school of life living for Dummies and None-nobles"
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>>4535957
10 marines plus some solar Auxilias and governing dudes sound good.
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>>4535975
We would have to handle the first few planets recovery personally while we teach our sons how to repair it. But after that point we should be fine.
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>>4535957
Ten marines sounds solid as an advisory Corp, able to physically enforce their guidance if needed.
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>>4535978
It'll be slow going for us at first, but things should start picking up after those few planets. Yeah I like it.
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>>4535989
We'd only need about 50 astartes to know how to deal with the worlds, with by the time the first is done, we'd be about 3 planets ahead, leaving them about 2 planetary conquests for them to stay in shape
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>>4535966
There were no hard limits on Legion size during the Great Crusade.

We just need to personally increase the number of marines we have after the Emps gives us the first Terran born marines.

Transform Shangrala into a vibrant garden world - with industry located in space or on moons would be a good goal.

Does 40k have space elevators, not sure if I’ve ever heard them referenced.
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>>4535978
Man imagine if we got a super rage sadist legion
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>>4535994
Technology in 40k is very weird, sometimes they've got ultra fancy teleportation gates, other times they can't create something as simple as the internet or long-distance radio.
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>>4535990
>>4535995
And another thing. We should probably stamp out that "Astartes and Mortals" crap from our legion. Keep them somewhat humble will keep their ego's from being easy to manipulate.
We can try and make them view people as people through using one of lorgars tactics, astartes and human mixing spaces to break down the "Never needs to interact with them" barriers.

As for if we've got a sadistic legion.....Well, they can be salvaged. If they can't, then they will be dealt with.
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>>4535992
Sounds like we’ll be forming our own micro-empire, just like the smurfs.

I guess the key difference will be the leadership style. Our empire will be full of vassal and tributary states who provide fit the common defence, but otherwise have full autonomy.

Our governing philosophy seems to revolve around empowerment. We actively intervene to better people’s situation, while also building their individual and collective capacity to drive change and take the reigns of leadership.
>>
>>4536008
Not exactly, as the realms of ultramar were worlds guilliman himself conquered I think before the introduction of the astartes, which was then expanded.

This is just making the worlds we conquer standard worlds in the imperium. Fully autonomous tributaries to the greater imperium, possibly with us dictating the tithes we need. We are just becoming the administratum before the administratum is a thing.
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>>4536014
They weren't though? Lol what
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>>4535995
>>4536002
I doubt it, at least when it came to the original astartes, they usually had quite a bit in common with their primarch.

I do wonder if our geneseed's got some defect though. But considering nothing's happened to Lieren so far, i doubt it.
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>>4536020
I may have been mistaken, but didn't Gilly make a space empire before Emps found him? Could have swore he did.

>>4536026
And I present to you, sanguinius and his legion prior to his arrival. It is as night and day
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>>4536032
Not every case's going to be the same because of the planets, but it is an general rule of thumb. Basically, i doubt our legion is going to be bloodthirsty because lieren himself doesn't seem to have any bloodthirsty defect.
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>>4536032
He had some worlds under his control but not the fucking full realm of ultramar.
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>>4536051
No, not the full realm. I'll say it again "The realms of ultramar were worlds guilliman himself conquered before he met the emperor, which was then expanded when he got his space marine legion."

5 worlds is still "the realm of ultramar" even if it was expanded a hundredfold later
>>
>>4536058
I wouldn't call it that, but each there own.
>>
>>4535947
>Hilarious, I just imagine a separate edition of the biggest space book that is just Magnus and Leman insulting the each other
Even better, Lieren could start a live show and have other Primarchs on.
Imagine getting to hear Magnus and Russ talking shit live.
>>
>>4536073
Lieren becomes the talk show Primarch.

“Welcome back dear viewers, virtuous citizens. I’m your host, Primarch Lieren, Second son of our Honorable Father the Emperor. Today, we’ll be having our brother, Leman Russ or the Primarch of the Vylka Fenrika. Welcome honored brother.”

Leman, clearly uncomfortable in this very calm talk show room with tea set up. “What is this weak drink?”
>>
Thoughts of death and legacy cloud your mind, like grime catching between the wheel and axel slowing or otherwise utterly stopping the cart, so to do these thoughts slow and muddy the progress of your thoughts, impeding your planning and careful calculations for the future. It is not ego, pride or fear that nurtures and grows these grim thoughts, but rather a realization. Brought about by the extinction of the line of Cui and the end of generations upon generations of labor and work. All crushed and wiped away in a single lifetime.

While their efforts brought only suffering, pain and hardship and thus deserved to be undone by your hand, what of your own lifetime of labor? all of your work to raise up the common, to feed the warmer and let the worker rest? The road was maintained and guarded now, traded flowed now, prosperity and bounty washed over the lands like a cleansing summer rain, but what of the future? Would those who followed in your wake do the same? would they see the value in caring for the common man? For all men to live lives of hope and plenty? For all men of Shangrala to see one another as brothers and sisters, joined beneath the same heavens?

Or would they only see personal gain, wasted resources and threats among simple farmers who only wish to go to bed with a full belly, to see their children live to adulthood and not have to fear the coming night, the coming winter. It was a most disquieting thought, a most upsetting thought. For you had only began this labor of yours, began the grand ambition to make the lands of Gao, the Lands of Yan and all Shangrala prosper, out of empathy for your fellow man. Your beliefs are what lead you forward down the path you carved for yourself and so many others.

But how quickly that path you've pioneered could be undone, how quickly an individual could undo all of your efforts in the name of greed and power. Hoard away the forges you built, cut off the road and separate the lands once more, outlaw your farming methods. Oppress the people with the steel you've made, use the roads to crush any rebellion in its infancy, silence dissent through fear. So many dreadful possibilities, and there would be no way for you to prevent them. For it can only occur when you have left this life, this world, and are in the ground or stored away in some nook as ashes in a jar.

Those with eyes who cannot see, will ruin, twist, and corrupt all the good you have brought to these lands, they will misunderstand it, they will abuse it. And then, in a generation, in two, in three, or maybe more if you impact the lives of those in power greatly enough and change the very heart of the Yan nobility. But as you and your virtues fade into memory and become legend, the miracles and wonders you have wrought shall be taken for granted, forgotten, or destroyed by those who fear the power they give to those so far beneath them.
cont
>>
>>4536087

Even the greatest waves created by a simple ripple in the sea, will eventually crash upon the shore and end, after all. Unless a new another stone is tossed to create another ripple, unless a fire is relit, unless the blind are made to see once again. If the way you see the world is recorded, saved and shared with all who need guidance, then the vision would not die with you, and all could see the world through golden eyes. Preserving your philosophy through text, through word, through art, through action and teaching, would ensure the road you walk is followed by many, many who would not stand by and allow the fruits of your labor be plucked by greedy hands or allowed to ferment and rot on their own.

Though a field of flowers may be viewed differently by all who see it, and actions speak different words to all who witness and hear of them, with a record, a book, a codified system of philosophy and world view would bind the people together and allow them to see the beauty you have created, the simple joy of satiation, the pride of hard work and effort, that all men are their fellows and brothers. Then, they shall see the world from the same perspective your golden eyes do now.

To guide the future generations long after you have died, to make them believe in something more, to learn, to appreciate the world and all its wonders beyond the pleasures it can bring, to control themselves, to check their greed and ambitions. That would be your greatest work yet. A measure to improve and nurture the virtuous and prevent the decadent from ever rising to true power again.

A spark of hope to light the fires of virtue and benevolence in the future, so the continued prosperity of the lands, of your people, would not be left to the cruel, uncaring hands of fate and the greed of those who come after you. Another giant from the heavens would not be needed to better the world for future generations, if his mindset were to be preserved and spread far enough across the world.

To even accomplish such a thing partially, to even preserve your world view and beliefs in but one lonely monastery of scholars and hermits, would be enough for you to meet you death content and happy. And like that, the fog clears from your head, your thoughts flow freely once more, fueled by a new ambition, a new goal you must reach. The excitement of bringing a benevolence to the land that shall outlast your own life, however long it may before.

Tracing letters into the sand and dust, you begin to write your thoughts, the beliefs that drive you ever forward, no matter how dark the coming night seems, no matter how bright the coming dawn appears. The philosophy of Lieren the wise, the benevolent, the great hunter of the wilds. The words of the giant. It helps you visualize the road forward, to begin writing tenets, codes and lessons that will be copied with ink, carved into stone, and written into the minds of those who come after you and all you know.
cont
>>
>>4536092

The first edition of the core text of this new school of philosophy, this new way of thinking and seeing the world, would fade when the wind came, but it would be the foundation with which you build all other works, the beginning of your greatest labor.

Changing the very soul of the lands under Gao, of the lands beneath Yan, of all men of Shangrala. Though not all would follow the path you lay for them, enough would see the wisdom in your words, and with that, fate would be altered even if only one man remained to teach the lessons you passed down, the ripples he creates would better the world and banish the darkness of men's hearts.
-

You continue this work, codifying and recording your thoughts and observations, reworking tenants and codes as you reflect on what you're writing, and change the words to fit your vision more properly. Lessons, exercises, meditations and phrases and sayings of your own design and those commonly spread among the farmers and workers of the lands, all are put to text, reworded and fixed to fit into your world view, to expand and deepen the philosophy you're creating, to spread to all corners of Shangrala.

But, your prior work continues even as you put most of your focus into ensuring that the future generation will have men and women like you, who see the value in the lives of even the lowest man, who grieve for even their foulest enemy, who work and think efficiently and clearly, their minds unclouded from the wiles of comfort, decadence and unrestrained hedonism.

Just now, you're penning a new passage in your text, after seeing how a minor noble abused his children and wife, and now hangs before his own estates, drifting on the wind from a tree older than his line. And yet, his family cried for his passing, it is confusing to you, but you can understand why they mourn the man. It incites you to change the wording to reveal that men are not born evil, but are twisted and corrupted to be so, and that one should mourn for who they were or could have been, rather than what they had become.
like you did with Cui Fu, you simply needed a good example to be able to include with it into your philosophy,, in a way that would allow most to be able to comprehend its meaning.

Winter was approaching through autumn, and as you pondered yourself and the beliefs you held, you pruned Gao's Garden, while Yin Lei did the same with his generals, claiming to be inspired by your actions to do so, while Qian worked to aid your efforts in removing weeds from the court. The parties of Gao became quieter affairs, and many who had attended your introduction to Gao and his celebration of your road now hung by branches as warning to their fellows, are had their heads displayed outside of Gao's castle to deter other's from having treasonous thoughts.

And while for the common man, you had brought peace and bounty, through the five years of your life, the world of the nobility had been thrown into chaos.
cont
>>
>>4536094

Power struggles in the houses killed more than your hangings and arrests did. Which made you job of cleaning their lines and purifying their rule all that much easier. None of them seemed aware that all of this was happening by your design, they were simply too engrossed in their daily struggles of power and blinded by their own decadences to notice. But, that would not last. Soon, Gao would grow suspicious of what it was you were writing, grow uneasy by how many of his court had betrayed him or worked against him for so long. And in his paranoia, will attempt to persecute you as well, or Lady Qian, or become bold enough to challenge the black general himself.

And what that happens, all your plans will be thrown into motions, to remove the slug from his throne once and for all. By next summer, you imagine, Gao's growing madness at being surrounded by treasonous dogs and men just like him would ignite the fires of war, one way or another. If it was waged against one of your allies in his court, you would act, if it was against one of his underlings, it may be more beneficial to allow him to slit his own throat.

But by then, your philosophy will have spread through all corners of his lands, and it would not be easily removed even with your death, should it come.

It is only through your natural wisdom and efficiency of thoughts that you could so quickly codify, record and explain your personal philosophy and world view in a way any man could pick up, and understand as naturally as you do.

What are the core tenants of your new school of philosophy, Lieren?
> Mastery of ones emotions, acting efficiently, and the condemnation of base pleasures, excess and hedonism
>Valuing every life, but accepting that all things are transient and must end, and celebrating the virtues of generosity, kindness and understanding
>That all men are free to follow their own paths, oppression should be challenged, but that unity is a greater strength than any army
>Valuing the natural world and nurturing the lands, that prosperity should be shared and spread, and that protecting these things is a duty natural to all men
> Write in!
>>
>>4536096
>What flavor of chaos do you wanna slurp down
DON'T MIND IF I DO MR. QM!

>> Mastery of ones emotions, acting efficiently, and the condemnation of base pleasures, excess and hedonism
>Valuing every life, but accepting that all things are transient and must end, and celebrating the virtues of generosity, kindness and understanding
>>
>>4536096
>Mastery of ones emotions, acting efficiently, and the condemnation of base pleasures, excess and hedonism
>Valuing the natural world and nurturing the lands, that prosperity should be shared and spread, and that protecting these things is a duty natural to all men
>>
>>4536096
> Mastery of ones emotions, acting efficiently, and the condemnation of base pleasures, excess and hedonism
>Valuing every life, but accepting that all things are transient and must end, and celebrating the virtues of generosity, kindness and understanding
>>
>>4536096
> Mastery of ones emotions, acting efficiently, and the condemnation of base pleasures, excess and hedonism
>Valuing every life, but accepting that all things are transient and must end, and celebrating the virtues of generosity, kindness and understanding
>That all men are free to follow their own paths, oppression should be challenged, but that unity is a greater strength than any army
>Valuing the natural world and nurturing the lands, that prosperity should be shared and spread, and that protecting these things is a duty natural to all men
>Self-improvement is an endless journey, slowly approaching perfection but never achieving it
I feel like Lieren should constantly expand and improve this book.
>>
>>4536096
>Mastery of one's emotions
>Value of every life AND the duty to aid it's survival while you are able [give a dying man medicine, a starving man food, ect]
>>
>>4536127
>a new edition of Lieren's codex is released every 5 standard Terran years
WHERE HAVE I SEEN THIS BEFORE?
>>
>>4536127
Supporting:
> Mastery of ones emotions, acting efficiently, and the condemnation of base pleasures, excess and hedonism
>Valuing every life, but accepting that all things are transient and must end, and celebrating the virtues of generosity, kindness and understanding
>That all men are free to follow their own paths, oppression should be challenged, but that unity is a greater strength than any army
>Valuing the natural world and nurturing the lands, that prosperity should be shared and spread, and that protecting these things is a duty natural to all men
>Self-improvement is an endless journey, slowly approaching perfection but never achieving it

The first two focus on the individual, the second two focus on society, and the last is a truth. Though I feel maybe we should include something like:

>Legacy is measured not merely by what you achieve, but in your impact upon others.

Give a focus on the future.
>>
>Mastery of ones emotions, acting efficiently, and the condemnation of base pleasures, excess and hedonism
>Valuing the natural world and nurturing the lands, that prosperity should be shared and spread, and that protecting these things is a duty natural to all men
>>
>>4536148
Sure but it seems no one else is really interested.
>>
>>4536165
While I am interested, it feels a bit cheap to just say "All of the above"

I will support
>Self improvement is an endless journey
>>
>>4536096
I should add something everyone forgets but is very important.
>One must remember balance in all things lest they fall into ruin.
>>
>>4536148
I mean sure I'll support this
>>
>>4536096
> Mastery of ones emotions, acting efficiently, and the condemnation of base pleasures, excess and hedonism
>Valuing every life, but accepting that all things are transient and must end, and celebrating the virtues of generosity, kindness and understanding
Now's the time to start manufacturing firearms in Nothing and take out the noble that provides steel to Gao so we have access to the rich ore veins
>>
>>4536148
support
>>
>>4536096
Self
>Mastery of ones emotions, acting efficiently, and the condemnation of base pleasures, excess and hedonism

Society
>Valuing every life, but accepting that all things are transient and must end, and celebrating the virtues of generosity, kindness and understanding

The world
>Valuing the natural world and nurturing the lands, that prosperity should be shared and spread, and that protecting these things is a duty natural to all men

These three are core
>>
>>4536101
>>4536110
>>4536127
>>4536130
Support
>>
>>4536168
>While I am interested, it feels a bit cheap to just say "All of the above"
There’s nothing wrong with saying all of the above if you agree with it. Really you should be thinking in terms of “why not” or “what stops us” instead of thinking “whether it’s cheap or not”.
But I find it annoying how some seem to impulse vote and the voting system makes getting everything I’d like impossible anyway.
Actually...
>>4536096
>>4536127
> Mastery of ones emotions, acting efficiently, and the condemnation of base pleasures, excess and hedonism
>Valuing every life, but accepting that all things are transient and must end, and celebrating the virtues of generosity, kindness and understanding
>Valuing the natural world and nurturing the lands, that prosperity should be shared and spread, and that protecting these things is a duty natural to all men
I’d like to remove my votes for these so as to improve the chance of my desire option to win.
>>
>>4536168
Support the self improvement inclusion. Humanity should always strive to better them selves and step closer to a perfection that can never be reached.

This idea that no one is perfect would be a good thing to have when papa E shows up. He is not perfect, he may be steps ahead of you, but he is just as far from perfect as any man.
>>
>>4536148
Support
>>
>>4536191
That's voting for you.
And funnily enough in the previous thread, someone said the exact opposite. "Why are you picking all of the above with no regard for the face you are being told to choose SOME."
You really can't win.

Anyway, all of the options sounds like shit Lierein would support, but the actual vote sounds like [to me] core tenants, not "every" tenant.
>>
>>4536096
>Mastery of ones emotions, acting efficiently, and the condemnation of base pleasures, excess and hedonism
>Valuing every life, but accepting that all things are transient and must end, and celebrating the virtues of generosity, kindness and understanding
Basically, don't fall into hedonism, but don't be cold either.

Also, jesus christ, some of those really sound like chaos shit. I mean, "all things are transient and must end"? Can we remove that nurglebait stuff?
>>
>>4536205
> Can we remove that nurglebait stuff?
You do realize Lieren actually does consider himself and everything else a temporary existence right?
>>
>>4536220
Yeah, but the whole "cycles of renewal n shit" stuff is extremely nurglebait and it's not really what was shown...I mean, when we were talking about this with the old philosopher guy in the party, it was Lieren himself who said that it wasn't as simple as just neverending cycles and leaving it at that.

'Accepting that all things must end' just sounds like defeatist nurglite stuff.
>>
>>4536225
I mean, sorta, but I think Nurgle ends up more on the 'life is good so it must never end, no matter what type'. After all, their worshipers are infected with huge amounts of disease, but they don't die.
>>
>>4536228
Hardly just that, Nurgle is also about the whole neverending cycle shit, you know being okay with decay and that type of thing because it's all part of the circle of life.
>>
>>4536231
That’s why balancing it out is necessary.
>>
>>4536231
>>4536235
Grandfather Nurgle may represent decay, and the eventual end of things, but he also represents renewal and life. There are good aspect to him that he represents, and just because we take the good doesn’t my meN we are taking from nurgle.

Besides, the gods represent the majority of mortal thoughts and experience, so it’s impossible to avoid them.
>>
>>4536246
>Besides, the gods represent the majority of mortal thoughts and experience, so it’s impossible to avoid them.
I know a shrieking skeleton on a golden toilet that says otherwise, but I get what you're saying.
>>
Anons let's not let the chaos bait influence our decisions here, makes for a more interesting story in the long run
>>
It’s more accurate to say the Chaos gods represent broad concepts taken to an unhealthy extreme.
>>
>>4536231
I will point that the gods are good things taken to parody levels of excess. Bare this in mind
>>
>>4536261
When we learn about them we are adding a tenant about the importance of balance.
>>
>>4536096
>> Mastery of ones emotions, acting efficiently, and the condemnation of base pleasures, excess and hedonism
>Valuing every life, but accepting that all things are transient and must end, and celebrating the virtues of generosity, kindness and understanding

This is the core of Leiren. These two things drive him.
>>
>>4536271
All of the things Malal listed are what drive Lieren.
>>
>>4536096


>mastery of emotions
>>
>>4536148
+1
>>
>>4536148
Supporting.

We will no doubt keep adding to this philosophy, and emps shouldn't try to purge it since its not based in religious dogma.
>>
If I may suggest a future axiom:

To be or act above another, once must act to do so.
(basically, dont be lazy and rely on other peoples acheivements to claim yourself superior).
>>
>>4536394
Here’s another.
>>4536170
>>
I just got caught up with the quest and I think I understand what role the Emperor designed us for. While Bobby was the maker of empires, Dorn was the builder of cities and Horus was the master of Diplomacy we are the great merchant, the logistician above all. We were designed to maximize the productivity and industry of any planet we set foot on, allocating resources to facilitate as much growth as possible, which would in turn radiate out to adjacent worlds. The culture we are building is one of great wealth but modest desires, investing their worldly possessions into yet greater works of industry and advancement. I believe the strategy of the Mist Panthers as a legion will be to conquer a world in the cleanest and most effective way possible, minimizing the damage to industry. Then once the world is compliant the planet will be entrusted to the care of 1-5 legionaries deemed worthy of the task of restructuring the world's economy and resources to facilitate growth. The exports of the planet would then be sent forward to the expeditionary fleets of Lieren. In addition the legionaries would also be given healthy amount of gene stock to begin Astares recruitment, those new Astartes serving as the escorts to the merchant convoys warding their spoils from all greedy hands. Druing the mercantile trade the occasional legionary will be dropped off and begin their own private business ventures, eventfully leading to that legionnaire becoming ludicrously productive and respected, spreading Asceticism and prosperity to yet another world untouched by greater prosperity.
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>>4536441
No.
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>>4536445
Can you give a greater description of you gripes with my sentiments? I am very interested in learning your point of view.
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>>4536441
I personally don't think this is what were intended for, I find Lierens interactions with the people more indicative of his purpose than his administrative skills
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>>4536461
Because Rogue Traders are the intended “merchants”, Primarches are generals and commanders. Also our legion isn’t mist panthers. Hell many were talking about taking whatever name we’re given.
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>>4536476
Dude I already know for a fact the more supremacist asartes are going to look at our legion and think were under valuing them just because we respect their past
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>>4536461
Space marines are temporary, the Emperor never intended for them to play a role beyond soldier. I could see Lieren being intended for uplifting feudal and feral world, I think it's a good thing to do even if it wasn't our purpose. But propagating astartes throughout commerce is antithetical to the ideals of the emperor. He wants to uplift humanity, not some genemodded freaks with multiple hearts. Thunder warriors and space marines are tools, to be discarded when they aren't needed anymore
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>>4536441
>One of Perturabo's legionares getting assigned garrison duty
This fucking sucks!! Why must I be forced to stay idile on this rock when there is glory to be had in the crusade?!
>One of Lieren's Legionares being assigned garrison duty
Want to watch me do a magic trick? *Rapidly industrializes a death world*
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>>4536476
Mist Panthers is a placeholder name, also I was thinking that our wheelhouse would more be centered around the optimization of planets with the trade of said goods only being managed by the legion in the earliest phases of it's colonization. The expeditionary fleets of the 2nd legion would be like the weapon we stabbed into the toad dragon a clean, sharp blade supported by a long, solid logistical network. By funneling larger amounts of manpower and material from our previous conquests towards the front of the crusade we would have ample resources not only to repair the damage inflected during the compliance of a conquered planet at a breakneck pace but also begin enhancing it in record time. Our legion would grow at an exponential pace with recruits gathered from previously conquered worlds replenishing causalities and bringing with them supplies, armaments and vehicles ready to be brought into the larger campaign. The armies of the 2nd would be inexhaustible, with well equipped reinforcements flooding into war zones day after day while the enemy continues to fall apart from attrition. Is it any wonder why Emps would use this supply chain in the Rangdan Xenocides?
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>>4536441
>Lieren is the primarch of the administratum
Fulgrim, Vulkan, and Perturabo all uplifted the worlds they landed on in much the same way we did. That isn't unique about us. What is, at least more so than most things, is our role as a philosopher, especially since we've created what's pretty much an anti-Chaos philosophy.
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>>4536441
Think 1-5 is too few and as noted Astartes are intended to be temporary. Still like the multi-fleet idea, maybe not half and number dependent on legion size. One fleet conquers world, sticks around to improve/industrialize, and another one comes to the fore to get the next world, and so on, first gets pulled forwards. Maybe can do legion recruitment at the same time, and if we encounter something big, all the fleets come together to obliterate. Sorta an aggressive, infrastructure version of Dorn's Last Wall protocol.
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alright, calling the vote now.

Mastery:16
Valuing life:15
All men are free:8
Natural world:10
Self improvement is a journey:9
Legacy is measured by impact: 6
Balance in all things:1

Alright, at a total of 17 votes, by the rules I use to determine what can be included/ combined into an update (1 less than half at least)
The CORE tenants of Lieren's school of philosophy he will teach are

Mastery of ones emotions, acting efficiently, and the condemnation of base pleasures, excess and hedonism

Valuing every life, but accepting that all things are transient and must end, and celebrating the virtues of generosity, kindness and understanding

Self-improvement is an endless journey, slowly approaching perfection but never achieving it

Valuing the natural world and nurturing the lands, that prosperity should be shared and spread, and that protecting these things is a duty natural to all men
and
That all men are free to follow their own paths, oppression should be challenged, but that unity is a greater strength than any army

Writing the update now.

Maybe think of a fancy name to call this school of philosophy.
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>>4536535
The Many Paths?
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>>4536535
We can still expand upon it right?
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>>4536535
The Path of Inner travel
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>>4536552
of course.
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>>4536535
The Way
>This is The Way
or possibly
Perseverance Philosophy or Philosophy of Perseverance.
seems like it generally sets around
>you must try to succeed
>you will likely never fully succeed
>you must try anyway, and see it through to the end
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>>4536535
Teachings from Nothing?
Tiānqǐ Zhǐnán (Guide to Celestial Enlightenment)?
Perhaps we should publish it under a pseudonym so Gao doesn't think we're overtly attacking his way of life, in which case I put forward the Five Tenets of Wù Jǐ, Wù and Jǐ being the heavenly stems with middle (balanced) wuxing correlations.
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>>4536535
Maybe something like The Journey? Still can be referred as the way or the path etc, chose this because no one will ever really reach the end and it's a journey of continuous improvement.
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>>4536592
I like this. We call it The Journey, but there are certain passages within it that have language like "Way" or "Path" or "Guide." Other people start to refer to it in different ways (similar to how we seem to have taken a few names) and when we walk our lands and see people arguing about our philosophy we can see that, it too is imperfect. Which is one of the central tenets.
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>>4536576
Our legions war cry
>You do not know Da Wae
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The Dragon's Road
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>>4536598
>>4536602
No reddit-tier drivel in this thread sir.
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>>4536592
>>4536596
rén shēnɡ lù chénɡ
translates to "life's journey"
they end up taking it as guidance
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>>4536602
Fucking based
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<Recorded Passages from original copy of <Data corrupted>, interred within the reliquary of <Data corrupted> held within a stasis field to preserve its condition. The object is a collection of texts, teachings, and lessons, written in poetic prose standard to the world of origin. The work is bound with a protective covering of <Data corrupted> that is covered in no more than 10ml of the blood of <Data corrupted> <Data corrupted> >

For one to follow these teachings, they begin a journey with no end, walk a road that spans a lifetime, follow a path they may walk from their birth to their death. To step from the path, to abandon its teachings and forget its lessons, is one's own choice. But the humble writer of these words pleads that one would at least keep the memory of these words in their hearts, in their minds, even if they should stray from the way set before by them. These texts are meant as merely a guide, not an authority on life or a zealot's gospel.

They are merely a container, for which the writer of these words has preserved his wisdom and knowledge, so those who wish to follow in his trail, may learn to see the world as though through his own eyes and understand it as he himself once did.
-
For one to be wise, to be virtuous, to be great, they must learn to control themselves, and eventually master their self. For one can not claim dominion of a handful of dirt or ownership of the most docile of creatures if they are not masters of their own emotions. Even joy, pure and clean, can become as dangerous a poison as rage if not properly reigned. Emotions are natural, but they should not rule you. If you must cry and grieve, cry and grieve, if you must smile and laugh, smile and laugh, but do let these feelings rule you. One must also take care not to smother their feelings, and only master and control them. For a man who has no emotion is as much of a man as lake without water is a lake....
-
....Efficiency, to act without it, it is to act wastefully. A moment spent aligning a blade saves the hand from its edge, tending a fire removes the need to build another. Such is the balance one must have in life. For one can overwork and overthink, just as one can be lazy or refuse to ponder the world around them. Excess of either is foolishness, one must know and learn when to do more and when to do less. A single spear may end a panther's life, a day of work can save a week of labor, just as a season of toil can allow for two of rest, or how the time spent forging a sturdier lock will prevent a thief from taking one's hard earned wealth or treasures.
Efficiency, is not always the quickest path, and it is not always the longest. it stands, not in the middle of the road, but throughout its entirety. To learn to find efficiency, whether for an action as simple as boiling water or as large as building a city, is a talent that few have inborn, and one that many will need time to learn...
cont
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>>4536689

-
The gravest sin, the greatest act of foolishness one can commit, is to chase and spend their energy, wealth or power in the pursuit of life's base pleasures. Gluttony, Lust, Revenge, Rest without work, and many more names are attributed to this most deadly of sins. Men may be beasts, Men may be animals, but to act as such is a sign of utter stupidity. A merely satiated stomach is much more pleasant than one filled to bursting, the love of a single partner more fulfilling than the touch of many, Understanding brings more peace to one's soul than blood revenge.

Excess, the name of this devil, this curse, this scourge upon man! Know this, students of this humble writer's words, Hedonism in life, is to invite the most terrible of punishments upon your fellow man and to corrupt and ruin your very soul. Decadence has brought only ruin to mankind throughout its history, learn the signs of its presence so you may make outcasts of the gospels of this religion of decay, this cult of...
-

From the farmer with nothing, to the king with everything, all life holds value. Every man is equal in this regard. Talent, Title, ability and form mean add and subtract nothing from this value. It is inborn in every life, no matter the creed, race, code, belief, or standing of said life. None may remove this value, and none may debase it. The fowl one has for dinner is just as valuable as their own existence, remember this. For every life you take in a meal, upon the field in battle, or cause to end by some other means, you waste value equal to yourself. No matter if you are king, peasant, wiseman, or fool. Under heaven, all men are equal. And thus, all men are brothers and peers.
Respect your enemies as you would respect your own kin, for no matter what enmity you hold for them or the cause, they are one and the same.
-

Do not cling to life, or its joys, do not cling to life, or its sorrows. This is the wisdom I give to you. For your life will end, no matter what you do to prevent it or delay it death shall come to you someday. But that does not mean life is meaningless, all things must end, but that does not mean they never existed. Every action one takes, affects the future, changes the land, and inspires those who come after. All things must end, from the Dragon to the Toad, all creatures know death someday. But that does not mean they never lived. Do not flee from death, embrace the time you have, for one day you shall fade this is true, and one day all your works shall turn to dust, this is true. But, even if memory of you and all you created fade from this world, they will live on in the changes wrought by your actions and mere presence.

Do not fear death, do not hate death. All things are transient and will one day end, but they shall remain. A mountain may be ground to dust, but the field that stands where it once stood remains. A farmer may die in his field, but his children will tend it.
Cont
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>>4536691

A warrior may die, but his final breath can change the course of nations.


Remember this, and know that while you will one day be forgotten, your actions no matter how small, shall shake the heavens themselves
-

To give when one has plenty, is virtuous, to share when one has little, is virtuous. Both are acts of generosity, a virtue that wears many masks. To be generous, is to be virtuous. If your tree bears an extra fruit, share it, if one looks at your fruit hungrily, share it, if you have one fruit and a child has none, split it in half and share it. Generosity is one of the most virtuous acts a man can commit, but do not do so for the sake of being virtuous.
Do so because you can. A man who can be generous without thinking, is more virtuous than the man who chooses to be generous so he may be praised. Do not give so others admire you, give to give. If you have nothing to give, then do not give what little you have....
-
...The stubborn mule came back for its master's child, but left its owner to drown. Cruelty has no reward, kindness has many. A man who is kind is rich even if he owns nothing, a child who is kind is a blessing from heaven. If you can be kind, be kind. Offer support, offer protection, offer shelter. Held the old farmer with his labor, be merry with the king who has lost his road in life.
To be kind costs nothing, takes nothing. To be cruel taxes the soul itself and costs you much. For a man who you were kind to, will return the favor, a man you have scorned shall return the favor.

Better the world, brighten it, be kind.
-
Learn from others, ponder their actions, do not turn your head from the foreigner, but learn from him. Do not fear the unknown, but embrace it. Every meeting is a chance to gain understanding, and this grander wisdom than any text can give you. For the knowledge gained from knowing your fellow man, from mingling with them and learning from them, is a far greater gift than any other.
A farmer can teacher a fisherman much, a blacksmith can tutor a soldier, a noble man has much to learn from his servants. Do not lock yourself away from the world, but wander freely and learn from your fellow man, instead of hating or fearing him
-

...To improve one's self, no matter the method or reas