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Good Morning America, The Long Night is over.
Welcome to Enclave Remnant Quest Thread 3

Here's the Archive: http://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/qstarchive.html?tags=Enclave+Remnant+Quest

The Character sheets and general information can be found here: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1--Lg-RaDz7yqRx1DwUsE6P3qZzQyJlgBekMXIHUR_WU/edit?usp=sharing
The base calculations for Squad and larger scale combat can be found here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/19aZKpugV9t3Y8P4zmBPgpuAASRjE1kHmDyEb3iUY5fQ/edit?usp=sharing
Those calculations do not account for situational modifiers like commander competence, tactics, terrain etc.

System goes as follows I will ask 3 posters to roll xd100 depending on the number of tests in the post calling for the roll
If there's 1 test 3 posters will roll 1d100 each
if there's 2 tests 3 posters will roll 2d100 each etc.
Each roll that is below the given DV (Example 50) of the test will be counted as a success
The result of the test depends on how many successes out of 3 were gotten on the test.
Critical success is a 1 and critical failure is 100, they override, and if you get both they negate.

If there is a tie at the end of the designated voting period then a designated tie breaker period will be established if by the end of the period the tie isn't broken I will roll a d100 and it will be split accordingly to decide.

I know I'm running another game at the moment as well, but considering how slow that one is to get votes I don't think there'll be an impact

A refresher on the events that happened last time. You successfully evacuated The New Reno cell, though with major casualties, you then proceeded to establish a forwards operating base in the North, where you improved the moral of the Infiltration team, you had an election after merging your cell with the one from Redding to choose who would be the President of your burgeoning Enclave Remnant, Your father was selected after much politicking, with your mother as his vice president. Then you went to Vault City to see if you could do anything to deal with their energy problems, met a very interesting courier, and found out that the Traitor Granite would be in town. You've opted to ambush him and the detachment of soldiers he had with him from his mercenary company, and you've seen some rather solid success in that regard, but not without sustaining some rather nasty counter fire in return.

_________

Results:
3 successes: They're age is finally showing it'd seem (You manage to fall back and take cover, one enemy takes a crit wound)
1 Success: Keep Charging! (Two squad members take 1 wound, Ambush reduced by 5)

Status:
Jacob: 1+1/3 wounds remaining, currently Enraged
Grant: 5+1/6 wounds remaining
Rosaline: 1/3 wounds remaining
Elizabeth: 3/3 wounds remaining
Thomas: 3/3 wounds remaining
Ford: 8/9 wounds remaining

Granite Company Status:
Granite: 9/9 wounds Remaining
Oswald: 6/6 wounds remaining
Roger: 3/3 wounds remaining -> dead from crit wound

_________
>>
It was a moment that seemed to last an eternity, Jacob was unloading hot plasma having to be dragged back by the cuff by Grant as you continued to fall back as the Ex-Enclave Veterans continued their desperate charge. Your men laying down what fire they could as they fell back finally reaching sufficient cover as a few boulders were splayed about at the entrance to the cliff.

The errant plasma and weaponry flying everywhere was bound to hit one of them eventually and down went the last of the men not in power armor. It was down to Just Granite and Oswald, together they had weathered the worst of the worst possible, together they survived Poseidon oil rig, together they worked with the Chosen One to kill that abomination Frank Horrigan, they'll be damned, if this is how they die, if this is where they'll die.

Not without taking at least one of those rotten bastards with them. They unload their weapons, the Gatling laser roaring to life sweeping across the field as Granite continues to move forwards firing the whole while his own plasma rifle, the rage of wars long past, the fires of survival burned with in him as he battled what was in his mind the sins of his past, the ghosts that had haunted him from the moment he turned his back on the Enclave.

He had become a hero to the wastelanders, people told tales of Granite company from Vault City to Shady Sands. There was still much left to do to right the sins of the past, but he knew what he had to do. He fired his plasma rifle landing a glancing blow on you as you fall behind the cover, the unholy stream of laser fire from the Gatling laser nicking Rosaline as well, she was not in good condition, even with power armor she'd likely go down unconscious if she took another hit like that, you were certain that Jacob would to if it weren't for the sheer rage he was fighting with. You've never seen the man this mad before.

You needed to come up with a way to end this fight now, because if what you suspect is true, these two here may well be able to take all of you on by themselves.

What do you do?
>Granite's attention seems to be squarely on you, if you can occupy him long enough, the rest of the squad can deal with the Gatling laser and move in to help you
>There's no where left to fall back to, hold the line here, and just unload everything you have into them
>Wait for a lull in the suppressing fire, they think they've got us on the back foot? We'll show them just how wrong they are with a charge, wounded staying behind to provide cover fire.
>Write in
>>
>>5205187
>>Granite's attention seems to be squarely on you, if you can occupy him long enough, the rest of the squad can deal with the Gatling laser and move in to help you
>>
>>5205187
OH SHIT THE MOST BASED QUEST IS BACK

>Wait for a lull in the suppressing fire, they think they've got us on the back foot? We'll show them just how wrong they are with a charge, wounded staying behind to provide cover fire.
>>
>>5205187
>Wait for a lull in the suppressing fire, they think they've got us on the back foot? We'll show them just how wrong they are with a charge, wounded staying behind to provide cover fire.
Do we have any grenades? Otherwise we are kinda fucked until they need to reload. Gatling laser and miniguns are no joke in terms of suppression.
>>
>>5205187
What does the +1/3 wounds remaining and the 5+1/6 wounds remaining mean for jacob and Grant again? It means they have extras temp health right?

>Granite's attention seems to be squarely on you, if you can occupy him long enough, the rest of the squad can deal with the Gatling laser and move in to help you

>>5205199
>>5205212
>Charging into suppressing laser fire
That uh. You sure about that? That's going to really hurt us. Ford on the other hand has plenty of health to spare. If the party can at least take Oswald out of the fight then it won't matter if Ford is reduced to 3HP for tanking the hits since Granite would be all alone.
>>
For those of you interested, Warden's other quest is Beneath the Pale Moon, if any are interested in speeding it up a bit.

>>5195170
>>5195170
>>5195170

>>5205187
>Granite's attention seems to be squarely on you, if you can occupy him long enough, the rest of the squad can deal with the Gatling laser and move in to help you

DUEL
>>
>>5205214
Essentially the +1 means they can ignore a wound. You can think of it as temp hp though it's effectively the same.
>>
>>5205212
Now memory is a but fuzzy checking back on the kits and the actions taken at the end of the last thread but I believe all grenades have been used except for a pulse grenade, which is a 1 turn stun on power armor.
>>
>>5205229
Nice. Jacob and Grant are extra tanky.

>>5205231
If majority vote is to distract them, can we pass the plasma grenade to someone else? That way while they're focused on Ford, they'll be less likely to immediately notice it land at their feet?
>>
>>5205232
Pulse grenade, and yes that's a plausible strategy.
>>
>>5205231
Since he's focused on us it should be possible to hit him a pulse grenade due to him being distracted and shutdown the gatling laser giving us a chance to close in before we get turned swiss cheese. The tricky part will be his buddy since he might be paying attention.
>>
>>5205236
Shut down their gatling laser, and their power armor? I think they're wearing power armor. If we lucky his buddy might be watching us. Fingers crossed Ford proves to be an extremely good distraction.
>>
>>5205239
Yeah I'll change my vote to tossing the pulse grenade and being a distraction. With the pulse grenade, we should be able to shut down their power armor and Gatling laser long enough to close in before they can reactivate gatling laser.

The problem is his buddy. If he notices the pulse grenade we are gonna be in trouble. We can afford to let him slip(it will be painful for us) but it will be very bad if he can save his friend from the pulse.

Basically take out the fucking big gun while being a distraction with a pulse grenade and bum rush him to prevent them from reactivating it.
>>
>>5205234
If we do good by Vault City, could we earn enough god favor with them to get some implants installed in us or anyone else? Subdermal armor, Monocyte Breeder, SPECIAL boosters. Anyone in our faction in need of a new limb? Fingers? Eyes?
Does some old dude need there bones and joints reinforced in addition to some muscle upgrades?
>>
>>5205187
>>Wait for a lull in the suppressing fire, they think they've got us on the back foot? We'll show them just how wrong they are with a charge, wounded staying behind to provide cover fire.

FinallyWelcome back !
I didn't thought you would have return. Really nice.
>>
>>5205300
Actually change to this vote

>>5205187

>Granite's attention seems to be squarely on you, if you can occupy him long enough, the rest of the squad can deal with the Gatling laser and move in to help you

And give some healing to Jacob and Rosaline, if we have stimpacks.
>>
>>5205187
>>Wait for a lull in the suppressing fire, they think they've got us on the back foot? We'll show them just how wrong they are with a charge, wounded staying behind to provide cover fire.

HERE WE GO BOYSSSSSSSS
>>
File: Granite Company.jpg (1.74 MB, 2761x1386)
1.74 MB
1.74 MB JPG
Looks like it was a relatively close vote by my count
5 votes for
>Granite's attention seems to be squarely on you, if you can occupy him long enough, the rest of the squad can deal with the Gatling laser and move in to help you

to 3 votes for
>Wait for a lull in the suppressing fire, they think they've got us on the back foot? We'll show them just how wrong they are with a charge, wounded staying behind to provide cover fire.

As an addendum you'll hand off your pulse grenade before engaging Granite personally to use against Oswald

3 Anons each give me 2d100

Brutal Combat Leadership Check DV 30

YOU HAVE ONE REROLL

Perfect Ambush spot +5
AMBUSH +5
Pulse Grenade! +10
Grant +15

Ex-Enclave Veterans -20

Roll under 45

Critical Failure: Impossible! (The Gunner shoots the Pulse Grenade out of the air stunning your group and 3 squad mates take 1 wound)
0 Successes: I suppose it was to much to ask for the Grenades to behave three times (It's a dud, 2 squad mates take 1 wound)
1 Success: It missed?! At least we got a few shots off back... (Pulse Grenade misses, 2 squad mates take 1 wound, deal 2 wounds to Oswald)
2 Successes: He's down Fire for effect now! (Pulse Grenade hits, 1 squad mate takes 1 wound, Oswald takes a crit wound)
3 Successes: Seize the opportunity End him! (Pulse Grenade hits, oswald takes a crit wound, DV for Combat roll with Granite increases by 10)
Crit Success: Someone forgot to do maintenance. (Pulse Grenade hits, Oswald died from damage and his Gatling laser exploding, DV for combat roll with Granite increases by 15)


_______

Engage the Traitor
Challenging Personal Combat Check DV 50

T-51B Power Armor +10
Gauss Rifle +15
Living Anatomy +5
Hated Enemy +10

vs

APA -15
Plasma Rifle -10
Survived Frank Fucking Horrigan -20
S.P.E.C.I.A.L -10

Roll under 35

Critical Failure: What. The. Fuck! (Granite has closed the distance, Fight for your life! Take 1 crit wound and a -5 to the next personal combat roll)
0 Successes: Is that the best you've got kid? (Granite has closed the distance, Fight for your life! Take 1 Crit wound)
1 Success: More bite here than I thought! (Granite has closed the distance, Fight for your life! take 2 wounds, deal 1 wound)
2 Successes: Come on you fucking Traitor! (Granite does not close the distance, Take 2 wounds, deal 2 wounds)
3 Successes: You should have died on the rig you coward! (Granite does not close the distance, take 1 wound, deal a crit wound)
Crit Success: AAAARGH! (Granite does not close the distance, deal a crit wound and 2 damage, he's knocked prone)
>>
Rolled 55, 15 = 70 (2d100)

>>5205355
>>
Rolled 27, 14 = 41 (2d100)

>>5205355
>>
Rolled 92, 16 = 108 (2d100)

>>5205355
>>
Rolled 61, 83 = 144 (2d100)

>>5205355
>>
Woo. Thank god I missed the roll window, my roll sucked.
>>
Rolled 2, 1 = 3 (2d5)

Well Ford was always meant to be a combat monster.
1 Success: It missed?! At least we got a few shots off back... (Pulse Grenade misses, 2 squad mates take 1 wound, deal 2 wounds to Oswald)
3 Successes: You should have died on the rig you coward! (Granite does not close the distance, take 1 wound, deal a crit wound)

Lets see who gets shot, Ford is not available, Rosaline is staying back, so dice need to hit her twice to actually hit her.

Status:
1.Jacob: 1+1/3 wounds remaining, currently Enraged
2.Grant: 5+1/6 wounds remaining
3.Rosaline: 1/3 wounds remaining
4.Elizabeth: 3/3 wounds remaining
5.Thomas: 3/3 wounds remaining
Ford: 7/9 wounds remaining

Granite Company Status:
Granite: 6/9 wounds Remaining, Critically wounded -5 to rolls
Oswald: 4/6 wounds remaining
>>
Jacob auto ignores that wound
Do you want Grant to ignore the wound?
>Yes
>No
>>
>>5205371
>Yes
Eh, why not.
>>
>>5205371
Any reason why we wouldn't?
>>
>>5205374
Could save it for a situation like Jacobs where if he didn't have it he'd be unconscious or dead.
>>
>>5205371
>>No
>>
>>5205376
Any reason why we would use it then?
>>
>>5205380
If you take 3 wounds and have more than 1 crit wound you take a -5 penalty to all rolls.
Grant is nominally in charge while Ford fights so if he gets brought down to 3 wounds the Difficulty increases as all his rolls are at a -5 from the wound penalty.
So you could use it to delay that as well.
>>
>>5205381
Essentially every 3 wounds is a crit wound, each crit wound is a -5 to your rolls, so Ford has 3 crit wounds, he can take 2 before going unconscious at the third. Grant has 2 so he can take 1 before going unconscious.

So the decision is do you want to delay a running negative, or do you want to delay death? They might be one in the same, but you never know if that -5 might change things or if you need the extra round at the edge of the fight.
Hence why I put it to a vote.
>>
>>5205381
>>5205382
Then I guess the real question is, is Ford stuck in personal combat with Granite? Now that I've seen the numbers and consequences, I realize that the it was foolhardy to engage in personal combat with Granite, and we got extremely lucky that we didn't get our shit kicked in. I'd like for Ford to return to leading his men instead of engaging with extremely unfavorable odds.
>>
>>5205384
"Granite does not close the distance"
You're not committed yet, you'll see the options and get a chance at a write in when the write up drops after this is decided.
>>
>>5205371
>>Yes
>>
>>5205386
Doesn't Grant ignore Critical Wound maluses anyway though?

Regardless, I'm tempted to try a Speech/Intimidation, since it seems that we really specialized our unit into speech instead of combat. Don't know the likelihood of that.
>>
>>5205396
You are correct he does, doesn't really matter then if he ignores it now or at 1 wound then, well that's my bad.

Then
>Yes he ignores the wound

Writing.
>>
File: Enclave Gatling.png (2.12 MB, 1294x924)
2.12 MB
2.12 MB PNG
Status:
Jacob: 1/3 wounds remaining, currently Enraged
Grant: 5/6 wounds remaining
Rosaline: 1/3 wounds remaining
Elizabeth: 3/3 wounds remaining
Thomas: 3/3 wounds remaining
Ford: 7/9 wounds remaining

Granite Company Status:
Granite: 6/9 wounds Remaining, Critically wounded
Oswald: 4/6 wounds remaining

_____________

You pop your head out from your cover for a moment only to have to duck it back just barely avoiding plasma to the face, "Fuck." you slam your hand on the rock crack it slightly. You look to the rest of your team nodding, a plan forming in the back of your head. "Grant, catch." you toss your pulse grenade over to him, "Hit the one with the Gatling laser with that, and lay down the pressure thick, I'll keep Granite distracted."

He catches the Grenade and nods to you, before turning to the rest, "We've got orders, on my mark we'll begin counter fire against the one suppressing us."

With that you wait for the mark, 3 seconds pass, "Mark!" the grenade flies over the rock and you jump out firing your gauss rifle as fast as you physically can.

Granite is charging forwards at breakneck speed, the NCR bear emblazoned on his APA shoulder, a brown cloak in the wind, he is returning each shot back.

You hit him square on the shoulder twice and once in center of mass, but it only staggers him, the Advanced Power Armor denting with the impact of each. One step back, before the charge resumes. The hell is this man made of?!

What could have made him betray the Enclave like he did?

Your thoughts are interrupted as a ball of searing hot plasma grazes your own power armor shaving off part of it and knocking you back behind cover. Swearing heavily, looking down. The graze cauterized the wound.

On the other side the Grenade had impacted behind Oswald he gave it a look diving forwards just in the nick of time as the emp just barely misses him. Rolling to his feet he is shot one hitting his leg as he goes to a kneel and the other in his shoulder. He grunts in pain and grits his teeth rearing the Gatling laser up again and unloading. Grant is hit first, but the laser discharges to little effect.

Following the sweep Jacob is then hit once again dealing minimal damage, just barely hitting the wrong angle and failing to penetrate.

You've dealt them both damage, but they're still standing and that Gatling laser is still raining hell down on you, what do you do?
>You'll likely be flanked by Granite at this rate, but it's clear that the real threat here is that damned Gatling, it needs to go down, focus all fire on him.
>Continue to hold Granite's attention, he won't be an easy fight, but you can't afford to have him flanking all of you while the Gatling is still alive.
>What we need is someone to flank that Gatling, though Rosaline is very injured, she's the best chance you have for this, hold the gunners attention while she sneaks around.
>Write in
>>
>>5205429
>You'll likely be flanked by Granite at this rate, but it's clear that the real threat here is that damned Gatling, it needs to go down, focus all fire on him.
We can take a few blows, we need to give our other guys some room to breath.
>>
>>5205429
>>Continue to hold Granite's attention, he won't be an easy fight, but you can't afford to have him flanking all of you while the Gatling is still alive.
>>
>>5205429
>Continue to hold Granite's attention, he won't be an easy fight, but you can't afford to have him flanking all of you while the Gatling is still alive.

It's 5v1, unless they're all right next to each other, Oswald can't keep supressing everybody. Grant should draw his attention to allow the others to get a shot. I say all this but looking at the modifiers of the previous roll, I don't see anything to account for Oswald being outnumbered so maybe Im just talking out of my ass.
>>
>>5205429
>Continue to hold Granite's attention, he won't be an easy fight, but you can't afford to have him flanking all of you while the Gatling is still alive.
>>
>>5205429
>>>Continue to hold Granite's attention, he won't be an easy fight, but you can't afford to have him flanking all of you while the Gatling is still alive.
>>
File: Granite Company 2.jpg (131 KB, 1280x960)
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131 KB JPG
>Continue to hold Granite's attention, he won't be an easy fight, but you can't afford to have him flanking all of you while the Gatling is still alive.

Wins with 4 votes

3 anons give me 2d100

Engage the Traitor
Challenging Personal Combat Check DV 50

T-51B Power Armor +10
Gauss Rifle +15
Living Anatomy +5
Hated Enemy +10
Enemy is Critically wounded +5

vs

APA -15
Plasma Rifle -10
Survived Frank Fucking Horrigan -20
S.P.E.C.I.A.L -10

Roll under 40


Critical Failure: What. The. Fuck! (Granite has closed the distance, Fight for your life! Take 1 crit wound and a -5 to the next personal combat roll)
0 Successes: Is that the best you've got kid? (Granite has closed the distance, Fight for your life! Take 1 Crit wound)
1 Success: More bite here than I thought! (Granite has closed the distance, Fight for your life! take 2 wounds, deal 1 wound)
2 Successes: Come on you fucking Traitor! (Granite has closed the distance, Fight for your life! Take 2 wounds, deal 2 wounds)
3 Successes: You should have died on the rig you coward! (Granite does not close the distance, take 1 wound, deal a crit wound)
Crit Success: AAAARGH! (Granite does not close the distance, deal a crit wound and 2 damage, he's knocked prone)

_______

Battle Against the Gatling Laser
Brutal Combat Leadership Check DV 30
YOU HAVE ONE REROLL

Perfect Ambush spot +5
AMBUSH +5
Grant +15
Weight of Numbers rising +10 (will increase to +20 next turn, and +30 the turn after)

Ex-Enclave Veterans -20

Roll under 45


Critical Failure: When is he gun run out of charge?! (3 squad mates take 1 wound, Ambush removed)
0 Successes: If you can't shoot for shit why are you SHOOTING AT ALL!? (2 squad mates take 1 wound)
1 Success: Keep firing, If you're wounded stay back! (2 squad mates take 1 wound, deal 2 wounds to Oswald)
2 Successes: Don't stop shooting, spread out, he can't focus on all of us at once. (1 squad mate takes 1 wound, Oswald Takes a crit wound)
3 Successes: I'm going in, cover me! (Oswald is killed, Grant seizes the Gatling Laser, DV for combat with Granite increases by 15)
Crit Success: Split up, round the flanks, keep close to cover and low to the ground (Oswald is killed, Grant seizes the Gatling Laser, DV for combat with Granite increases by 25 as he becomes surrounded)
>>
Rolled 84, 56 = 140 (2d100)

>>5205602
Last time I rolled, I rolled a crit fail. Let's see if it happens again shall we?
>>
Rolled 61, 22 = 83 (2d100)

>>5205602
For the Enclave
>>
Rolled 66, 23 = 89 (2d100)

>>5205602
>>
god damn guys why did you pick this fight under prepared
>>
>>5205622
Actually there were six of them originally in the second thread, the ambush basically killed all but the two toughest bastards in the group, there were another 2 power armored individuals in that to about as tough as Oswald.

So they're doing relatively well considering it's 1 round to Oswalds death (possibly now if the reroll of that 84 lands under 45) and then support with Granite.
>>
>>5205622
Not really.
We had actually thought about this and prepared for the fight ahead, see the ambush, explosives and so on.

This enemies though are strong and above what we usually fight.
But the oppurtunity to deal with them was good, really good and stopping the NCR activity here in Vault City would help us in the long run. It would show that the NCR is not invincible, and even their strongest allies can fall.
Beside if this traitors die, the NCR will not have their help again. Ever.

In addition it would be a morale help to bring their heads home. Or if they are alive them. Perfect for starting the preparations to our exodus
>>
Rolled 76 (1d100)

>>5205606
Just to keep things moving, rerolling Grant's 56 here
>>
>>5205628
So do I roll 2d100 again?
>>
>>5205645
No you would have just rolled 1d100 as it's only applicable to Grants rolls, the rolls go in decending order so 84 was Ford, 56 was grant
61 ford, 22 grant etc.
>>
Rolled 2 (1d3)

0 Successes: Is that the best you've got kid? (Granite has closed the distance, Fight for your life! Take 1 Crit wound)
2 Successes: Don't stop shooting, spread out, he can't focus on all of us at once. (1 squad mate takes 1 wound, Oswald Takes a crit wound)

[Jacob, Rosaline and Ford are not available targets for the 1d3]

Status:
Jacob: 1/3 wounds remaining, currently Enraged
1.Grant: 5/6 wounds remaining
Rosaline: 1/3 wounds remaining
2. Elizabeth: 3/3 wounds remaining
3. Thomas: 3/3 wounds remaining
Ford: 4/9 wounds remaining, Critically wounded -5 to all rolls

Granite Company Status:
Granite: 6/9 wounds Remaining, Critically wounded
Oswald: 1/6 wounds remaining, Critically wounded -5 to all rolls
>>
File: Advanced Power Armor.png (1.71 MB, 1366x768)
1.71 MB
1.71 MB PNG
You pull back out from cover intent on keeping Granite from completing his flank, but he was anticipating you this time, a barrage of plasma follows you as you pull out scoring solid hits across your body, The pain was immense.

You grit your teeth and shoulder your gauss rifle but by that point it was too late, he had closed the distance his own plasma rifle going slack against his frame as he rocks you with a power armored fist straight to the helmet knocking you back two steps and causing the world to spin for a brief moment.

He threw his next punch knocked your gun slack against its strap and was followed by a third strike to your armpit, bypassing most of the plating on your armor.

You manage to shove him back and take your own stance, his visor meets your own, "You must think your some hot shit to have pulled this stunt!" he shouts, he was mad, furious even, "But all you're about to be is six feet under ground punk."

You roll your shoulders once squaring up eyes drifting to the side as your squad begins to split up and gain ground on the one with the Gatling laser.

The Stream of continued fire was wearing Oswald down, he swore to himself a grimace hidden beneath his helmet as each shot brought him closer and closer to the ground, he could feel the weight of it all bearing down on him, but still he continued to fire. Looking at the charge left he knew that this was it, he had maybe a few more seconds of ammo left before he'd be done for.

How humiliating he thought to himself, he looked off to the side, brining his hand up to his head, "Granite, I'm about out, disengage I'll hold the line."

Granite paused for a moment a moment of doubt as he looked around himself.

This was your chance, he was distracted.

What do you do?
>You'll never have a better chance than now grip your rifle and ram it into his armor and fire from the hip, point blank, the squad will handle the rest.
>Fall back, you're not certain that even with him being distracted you can win this fight, regroup with your team that's still near by and have them provide you cover fire.
>You might not be able to beat him in a fight, but maybe you can stall him with words, attempt to keep him in place argue with him, whatever it takes so he doesn't get away.
>Write in
>>
>>5205664
>You'll never have a better chance than now grip your rifle and ram it into his armor and fire from the hip, point blank, the squad will handle the rest
All or nothing lads
>>
>>5205664
>You might not be able to beat him in a fight, but maybe you can stall him with words, attempt to keep him in place argue with him, whatever it takes so he doesn't get away.

You fucks were supposed to get back to our group, not take on a DC of 40 that can deal us critical wounds while we only deal one back if we're lucky.
>>
>>5205664
>>You'll never have a better chance than now grip your rifle and ram it into his armor and fire from the hip, point blank, the squad will handle the rest.
>>
>>5205673
Your gonna get nothing because we're back to trying a DC of 35 again. We have better odds surviving by engaging him in conversation than we do by attempting combat.
>>
>>5205664
>>5205673
>>5205676
>>5205687
>>5205710
Do we have any Stimpaks? If yes, we can recover some wounds.
>>
>>5205711
Your squad comes with 18 of them, equally distributed, so you have 3. You can take 1 a combat round.
You have 2 doctors bag, those heal critical wounds (3 wounds) but can only be applied out of combat.

You also have combat drugs, Psycho would give you a +20 to combat rolls until the end of the encounter but you take a -10 to every roll for the rest of the mission, continued usage may lead to psychosis

Jet would give +10 to that and leadership for 2 rounds you take a -5 to all rolls afterwards for the day, but the malus goes away on the next hit, but when that wears of its a -10 and so on, after 3 hits in a day each subsequent hit deals a crit wound.

You can take both, but it's not recommended.

Med-x will ignore all critical wound penalties, but is highly addictive and can cause you to take escalating maluses that only go away when on med-x.

Buffout will give you an extra critical wound and let you ignore a wound, at the end of combat you take a crit wound that will only ever knock you out if you drop below or to 0 wounds.
>>
>>5205726
Honestly, we're better off not using drugs unless we're up against a Chosen One level threat. I remember the drug mechanics in play from last time, and I didn't like them. Besides, we can't always rely on combat drugs to get us out of a pinch, we'd be addicted in no time for less benefit to combat. Better to tactically use them in the beginning of combat to get the full use outta them, without any wound maluses.
>>
>>5205726
Then I have a suggestion for everyone.

>Fall back, you're not certain that even with him being distracted you can win this fight, regroup with your team that's still near by and have them provide you cover fire.
Ford should self administer. Rosaline should self heal and heal others if she can do that
>>
>>5205731
The first time taking a drug is a freebie I think, but I don't think you can get addicted to Stimpaks thankfully.
>>
>>5205732
Too late mate, we're too close to Granite to successfully cut and run back to our men. We need to distract him to give our men time to clean up Oswald and come to our aid.
>>
>>5205733
You indeed can not get addicted to regular stimpaks.
Now if you had Super Stimpaks that's a different story and those are liable to kill you if you abuse them.
>>
>>5205733
In the Fallout games maybe, but that's not how I remembered addiction working in this quest.
>>
How much we are in the open now ? Like would it possible to leg it and get behind something that doesn't get destroyed by his plasma rifle.
I wouldn't bet on speech in a combat situation of life and death, not with a traitor that helped killing his own people. And hunted down survivors.
>>
>>5205741
The only cover is the cover in front of you, the rather large rock you were using before, he's been spending this whole time chasing you down that pass where all the cover was to get his squad engaged in close quarters with yours with minimal cover.

He has succeeded in that regard, but I wouldn't say he's in the best position as he to is completely out in the open, it's a question of can you survive and deal enough damage this turn to end him the next turn because Oswald is almost certainly going to die regardless of your choice this turn.

Personally I don't think you're quite down and out yet, it'll be a close one though.
>>
>>5205741
Remember, the speech check isn't to Talk-no-jutsu our way out of this, it's to distract him long enough to make Oswald's last stand meaningless. It's a delaying tactic, not a real appeal to surrender or mercy.
>>
>>5205664
>You might not be able to beat him in a fight, but maybe you can stall him with words, attempt to keep him in place argue with him, whatever it takes so he doesn't get away.
If the squad actually manage to kill Oswald and come for us in time.
>You'll never have a better chance than now grip your rifle and ram it into his armor and fire from the hip, point blank, the squad will handle the rest.
Will be the mark to start shooting Granite they show up.

In other words, stall for time then shoot Granite when they show up.
>>
>>5205737
>>5205739
see here dipshit >>5205738
regular stimpaks are safe.
>>
>>5205775
I was referring to the combat drugs you dumb motherfucker. You know, the shit that would make a major difference in this fight?
>>
>>5205664
>>You might not be able to beat him in a fight, but maybe you can stall him with words, attempt to keep him in place argue with him, whatever it takes so he doesn't get away.

attacking is dumb and retreat is not an option use our cha you fools
>>
>>5205664
>>You might not be able to beat him in a fight, but maybe you can stall him with words, attempt to keep him in place argue with him, whatever it takes so he doesn't get away.

Ready our weapon anyway for shoot him, he has a shorter weapon so he doesn't need to position his arm like us. I have my doubts on this he could just shoot us now, this trick isn't exactly new.
>>
>>5205664
>You might not be able to beat him in a fight, but maybe you can stall him with words, attempt to keep him in place argue with him, whatever it takes so he doesn't get away.


Well this is something I never thought would come back.
>>
>>5205664

> Ask this savage motherfucker how he could betray America?

> Sing national anthem as best able while avoiding getting Fisted or Ripped a new one.
>>
>>5205818
How about instead of singing the national anthem we instead say the pledge of allegiance, less time wasted for more impact, cause I'm sure every child raised as American knows it by heart, and this will bring up old memories and sentiments that will distract him.
>>
>>5205761
Sure but ... what we say ?
He knows we want him death.
He has detach himself from the enclave that he is now a foe of it, so something related to that will not work. Something emotional ?
It doesn't seem to affect him being called traitor. And he probably killed plenty of companions

Something dumb or random then ?
>>
>>5205825
The pledge is good too. Remind him of his broken oaths.
>>
>>5205828

C'mon Anon. That whole trash compactor thing is another story. The pledge not only jabs at the insecurities of this defector to a degenerate mutant republic, abhorrent in its mockery of America with it's commie bear flag and red star, but reinforces our own sense of purpose and duty.
>>
>>5205828
Something an idealistic American Enclave would say. Put Granite in the position of realizing that he's fighting against a teenage Granite, who no doubt felt the same way Ford did at his age. It'll put a sliver of doubt in his soul at least.
>>
>>5205848
I should probably add young and dumb, make him realize that he is fighting a kid (Ford is, what? 16, 18?)
>>
>>5205867
19 going on 20 in less than a year, but yes young and dumb.
>>
>You might not be able to beat him in a fight, but maybe you can stall him with words, attempt to keep him in place argue with him, whatever it takes so he doesn't get away.

3 Anons Roll me 2d100

Distract the Traitor
Challenging Speech Check DV 50

What happens in Reno Stays in Reno +5
Enemy is Critically wounded +5
Enemy is Distracted +5

vs

S.P.E.C.I.A.L -10
You're Critically wounded -5

Roll under 50


Critical Failure: Wait Wait wait! (You take a Crit wound and a -5 to the next roll)
0 Successes: You don't know a damn thing kid! (You take a Crit wound, He begins falling back)
1 Success: I'm gonna start beating you and I don't know when I'll stop (You take 2 wound, but he stays where he is)
2 Successes: You think you're fighting for America? Kid you don't know the first thing about America! (You take 1 wound, but he begins to engage you in debate distracting him)
3 Successes: How old are you? (Granite's taken aback by your fervor)
Crit Success: I pledge allegiance to the flag... (You manage to fast talk for your life, he can't even get a word in edge wise.)

_______

Battle Against the Gatling Laser
Brutal Combat Leadership Check DV 30
YOU HAVE ONE REROLL

Perfect Ambush spot +5
Enemy is Critically wounded +5
Grant +15
Weight of Numbers rising +20 (will increase to +30 next turn)

Ex-Enclave Veterans -20

Roll under 55


Critical Failure: Where the hell did he go? (He pops smoke, 3 squad mates take 1 wound)
0 Successes: If you can't shoot for shit why are you SHOOTING AT ALL!? (2 squad mates take 1 wound)
1 Success: Keep firing, If you're wounded stay back! (2 squad mates take 1 wound, Oswald dies)
2 Successes: He's down, get around Granite surround him! (1 squad mate takes 1 wound, Oswald Takes dies, deals 1 wound to Granite)
3 Successes: I'm going in, cover me! (Oswald is killed, Grant seizes the Gatling Laser, deals 2 wound to Granite)
Crit Success: Split up, round the flanks, keep close to cover and low to the ground (Oswald is killed, Grant seizes the Gatling Laser, Granite takes a Crit wound)
>>
Rolled 14, 2 = 16 (2d100)

>>5205876
>>
Rolled 41, 94 = 135 (2d100)

>>5205876
>>
Rolled 54, 99 = 153 (2d100)

>>5205835
>>5205848
Sound okay

>>5205876
>>
we need to us the reroll
>>
Rolled 46 (1d100)

Reroll that 99, believe in the manifest destiny of the dice.
>>
alright so 2 successes for both nice
>>
Rolled 3 (1d3)

>>5205892
Blessed is the die that gives you success.

2 Successes: You think you're fighting for America? Kid you don't know the first thing about America! (You take 1 wound, but he begins to engage you in debate distracting him)

2 Successes: He's down, get around Granite surround him! (1 squad mate takes 1 wound, Oswald Takes dies, deals 1 wound to Granite)

[Jacob, Rosaline and Ford are not available targets for the 1d3]

Status:
Jacob: 1/3 wounds remaining, currently Enraged
1.Grant: 5/6 wounds remaining
Rosaline: 1/3 wounds remaining
2. Elizabeth: 2/3 wounds remaining
3. Thomas: 3/3 wounds remaining
Ford: 3/9 wounds remaining, Critically wounded -10 to all rolls

Granite Company Status:
Granite: 5/9 wounds Remaining, Critically wounded
Oswald: 1/6 wounds remaining, Critically wounded -5 to all rolls -> DEAD
>>
>>5205892
Nice
>>
>>5205902

Yeah, but now that we're in our last HP block it might be time to start dodging like a SCOTUS nominee dodges questions about their judicial philosophy. Do you know how much this armor costs? According to Sarge, it's 510 year's pay.
>>
>>5205898
>when you think you should take some Med-x just to throw Granite though a loop with 3 successes on a Speech check
>>
>>5205914
Kek
Thankfully ours is "just" a T-51B, and not a standard APA of the enclave.
In regard to dodging idk, he currently has given his back to our squad which is arriving. He is kind of toasted. Hopefully.

If we could use a stimpack right now it would be nice
>>
>>5205927

Float like a vertibird, sting like a vaccine?
>>
File: IMG_3129.png (201 KB, 500x769)
201 KB
201 KB PNG
>>5205936
>>
>>5205898
>>5205902
>>5205914
>>5205927
WE NEED HEALING!
>>
You need to grab his attention, hold him here, but you can't do it with violence, you know full well this man is the better fighter than you. You dodge to the side as he throws a fist at you. You have to keep close just to keep his attention, whatever he noticed has him on edge.

Another fist flies you attempt to dodge it but you realize to late it's a faint as he jabs you in the Ribs sending you a few steps back, he begins to back up, "Don't you dare run away you Traitor!" you shout at him.

He stops, "Traitor? Kid you don't even know what the hell you're talking about." he says back fists still up, you catch your breath putting your own up for a moment, before continuing, "I don't? I'm not the one who threw away everything because some savage with a pipboy and pretty words convinced me to betray my nation!"

He shakes his head, "You're fucking kidding me right? You don't know shit about the truth of the matter, I did what needed to be done. To Stop the senseless killing, to end the monster that was Frank Horrigan, to survive! Whatever shlock you've been fed at birth you need to throw it away right the hell now and realize this world ain't the old world, and it never will be again. The America you idolize, that you think you fight for, it's been long dead." he's starting to lower his guard, the sanctimonious bastard.

On the other end of the field the battle rages on finally the Gatling laser runs out of ammo, Oswald attempts to slam another pack in, but finds himself unable to as his arm is blown off by a shot gun blast at point blank range.

He stairs at it for a moment, then looks up at Grant, and then just breaths once, "Well Fuck." and falls over dead. The rest of the squad dispersing to encircle you and Granite.

Perfect, everything is in place now, but you want to wrap this up, "You're only trying to justify your failures, your cowardice in the face of death on the Oil Rig!" you shout.

Granite sighs at this, "I'm not justifying a god damn thing to you, you fucking child, I'm telling you the facts. You want to know what the Enclave was at it's height? It was cruelty personified, it was a Giant Green monster, more machine than man tearing a god damn Deathclaw in half, it was execution after execution. It was watching bodies burn, and people die and shrivel up because they didn't make the cut. It was the very silence of death itself if you so much as thought one wrong thought, think damn well and hard about what you think America is kid, because that Ain't Fucking it!"

You've had enough of his assertions and signal the attack to begin by quickly grabbing your rifle and firing it from your hip, a wild shot which knicks him in the shoulder.

He swears, "Fucking Damn it, every last one of you is the same, I shoulda figured the ones that didn't listen at Navarro's kids would be no better. Have you're Enclave, and have your empire of Ash, because that's what it will be not a Republic!"

[continue]
>>
What do you do?
>End this farce now, erase this mistake of the past (He will die, but we will see how much damage he does going down.)
>Attempt to take him alive, we might not have many resources, but the best way to prove him wrong is with a trial, lets seem him call us an empire of ashes then (He will go down, but we will see how much damage he does going down)
>Something else? (Write in)

Regardless you take a stimpak

Status:
Jacob: 1/3 wounds remaining, currently Enraged
1.Grant: 5/6 wounds remaining
Rosaline: 1/3 wounds remaining
2. Elizabeth: 2/3 wounds remaining
3. Thomas: 3/3 wounds remaining
Ford: 4/9 wounds remaining, Critically wounded

Granite Company Status:
Granite: 5/9 wounds Remaining, Critically wounded
>>
>>5206060
>>Attempt to take him alive, we might not have many resources, but the best way to prove him wrong is with a trial, lets seem him call us an empire of ashes then (He will go down, but we will see how much damage he does going down)
>>
>>5206060
>Attempt to take him alive, we might not have many resources, but the best way to prove him wrong is with a trial, lets seem him call us an empire of ashes then (He will go down, but we will see how much damage he does going down)
>Distract him with a Speech

How many innocents did you slaughter at the Oil Rig? Did you even try to save anyone, or did you just condemn them to death simply because they were Enclave? Are you sure you didn’t proclaim the Enclave monstrous simply to ease your guilt in killing children when the rig blew?
>>
>>5206060
>Attempt to take him alive, we might not have many resources, but the best way to prove him wrong is with a trial, lets seem him call us an empire of ashes then (He will go down, but we will see how much damage he does going down)
>>
I'll see you all in the morning, until then this is Warden Signing off
Good night America.
>>
>>5206060
>Attempt to take him alive, we might not have many resources, but the best way to prove him wrong is with a trial, lets seem him call us an empire of ashes then (He will go down, but we will see how much damage he does going down)

>>5206075
+1 speech

>>5206085
Why arent our team mates taking their stimmy juice?
>>
>>5206060
>>Attempt to take him alive, we might not have many resources, but the best way to prove him wrong is with a trial, lets seem him call us an empire of ashes then (He will go down, but we will see how much damage he does going down)
a trial ?

Interrogation, followed by denounce of his long list of crimes against the Enclave and then public execution. At home.
Tie him up very well and take of him everything he has beside clothing.
>>
>>5206060
>Attempt to take him alive, we might not have many resources, but the best way to prove him wrong is with a trial, lets seem him call us an empire of ashes then (He will go down, but we will see how much damage he does going down)
Yo this is back awesome, alright time for a trial which he will surely be sentenced to death at.
>>
>Attempt to take him alive, we might not have many resources, but the best way to prove him wrong is with a trial, lets seem him call us an empire of ashes then (He will go down, but we will see how much damage he does going down)

>>5206121
Not noted just because it's not relevant, you're the primary target of his ire so you're the only one who is going to take damage, but they're taking stims in the background right now to heal up to full. Thankfully no one took enough damage other than yourself to require a doctors bag, though Jacob is going to be incapacitated for the rest of the mission due to the after effects of Nerd Rage

Take him Alive!
Challenging Combat Leadership Check DV 50
YOU HAVE ONE REROLL

Perfect Ambush Spot +5
Weight of Numbers +30
Officers Brat +5
Officers child +5
Grant +7
Enemy is Critically wounded +5

S.P.E.C.I.A.L -10
You're critically wounded -10 (Penalty remains until doctors bags are applied, will require both to heal fully)

Roll under 87

Critical Failure: Not possible
0 Successes: He goes down fighting ferociously (You are knocked unconscious but so is he, he deals 1 wound to a squadmate)
1 Success: He Goes down fighting (You are knocked unconscious but so is he)
2 Successes: He is overwhelmed (You take 2 wounds He is knocked unconscious)
3 Successes: He is completely overwhelmed (You take 1 wound He is knocked unconscious)
Critical Success: There was nothing he could do (He is knocked unconscious)
>>
Rolled 30 (1d100)

>>5206235
Roll like this?
>>
>>5206238
Yup, simple 1d100.
I forgot to put it in, but 3 anons give me 1d100
>>
Rolled 31 (1d100)

>>5206235
STAY DOWN, YOU DOG.
>>
Rolled 55 (1d100)

>>5206235
>>
And so the battle ends.

Final Stats before Medical aid is applied
Status:
Jacob: 1/3 wounds remaining -> Incapacitated
Grant: 5/6 wounds remaining
Rosaline: 1/3 wounds remaining
Elizabeth: 2/3 wounds remaining
Thomas: 2/3 wounds remaining
Ford: 3/9 wounds remaining, Critically wounded x2

Granite Company Status:
Granite: 5/9 wounds Remaining, Critically wounded -> Unconcious

No one escaped this battle uninjured.
Total supplies required for healing:
13 stimpaks/17 remaining
2 doctors bags/2 reamining

Jacob is Incapacitated for the rest of the mission, you may not utilize his trait or perks until next mission, he will not participate in any further combat.

But you caught Granite

Writing
>>
You go to shoulder your rifle just barely dodging the punch that Granite threw after hostilities resumed, you slam it into his side, "Take him Alive!" you shout over comms.

There was only a brief moment of confusion before Grant got everyone under control, "You heard the order, take him alive!" and with that the squad swarmed him.

He ducked under a fist from Jacob rolling his body over his own onto the ground, before blocking another from Elizabeth. Rosaline jumped him from behind slamming her rifle but into the back of his head, causing him to stagger forwards. Giving Grant just enough time to Rush up to him and grapple him. However he broke free shoving Grant off of him and pulling Elizabeth's next punch through causing her to fall into Rosaline who was behind him.

You rush in yourself slamming a fist into the side of his head and he returns one to your chin, the force of it breaking the seal and connection between the helmet and your armor. God your Neck was sore, everything was. However he was tackled from behind this time by Grant taking him to the ground before pounding on him, everyone still standing joined in and before long the power armor stopped moving.

You activate the emergency locks to take his helmet off, the old man was still breathing, good.

You then proceed to strip him of his equipment and weaponry before having him tied up as tightly as possible.

You take your own helmet off, you were exhausted, blood was dripping down your face, and you could feel ever single impact from the fight start to catch up to you. You fell to one knee and began coughing, a little bit of blood coming up onto the ground.

Oh that wasn't good, you spit standing up taking a sharp and painful breath, "Status report, how does everyone look?"

Jacob was still laying on the ground, Rosaline had taken his helmet off, looks like he's passed out. He's probably never exerted himself like that before, not surprising, but still concerning. Rosaline herself wasn't much better off, she looked like she was about to keel over, but a stimpak or two and she immediately feels better, even if she doesn't look it.

Elizabeth, Thomas and Grant have mostly grazing wounds, but it looks like no one managed to finish this fight without being wounded in some capacity. If you had to give Granite and his men any praise it's that they would have killed all of you in a straight and fair fight.

It's a good thing you didn't give them one.

You pull out the doctors bags from your kit and get to work fixing yourself up, closing wounds and stitching what needs stitching, a few lesser pain killers that won't dull the senses and just about all of the stimpaks you can afford to use.

You roll your shoulders, looking to the ground then looking up as everyone set themselves up, Jacob was in the recovery position, you'd have to make sure he hadn't broken his neck.

Honestly you weren't sure that Granite hadn't broken your own with that last punch.

[continue]
>>
You rub it, it's tender, but the fact you're rubbing it at all or even standing is enough to assuage such fears for now.

The hard part would be where to take the loot, you couldn't exactly head back to base at this point, you still needed to investigate that house that Rosaline had noted while tailing Granite. Thankfully you wouldn't need to fight those dissidents, just report them.

You sighed and then cringed gripping your ribs, also where would you hold Granite?

You shake your head, You could have a few people in the squad peel off and start to take him back to base ahead of the rest of the squad along with the loot, you'd likely finish up here in a day or to and would be able to catch up with them if they started on foot.

Alternatively you could just take him into the rooms you were staying in, but that place is about a secure as a wet paper bag, not exactly an appealing solution.

You lean onto a rock as Grant comes up, "Here's a tally of everything we've managed to salvage from them. 1 Gatling Laser, 2 damaged sets of Advanced Power Armor, 2 plasma pistols, 1 plasma rifle, 2 assault rifles, and 2 damaged sets of combat armor. The rest has been gooified by the plasma grenade." you just sigh at that, you think you remember 2 more sets of advanced power armor with them, shame you wouldn't be able to take them.

He gives you a long look, "Are you alright?" you nod your head, "I can't say I've been through worse, but I'm definitely alive." you look over at Granite.

How do you want to handle this?
>Pick 2 squad members to take Jacob and Granite back to base ahead of the rest of you while you stay behind to finish your business here.
>Find a discrete spot to dump the loot and come back for it later, throw a bag over Granite's head and take him with you to your rooms outside of Vault City proper.
>Something else (write in?)
>>
>>5206494
>>Find a discrete spot to dump the loot and come back for it later, throw a bag over Granite's head and take him with you to your rooms outside of Vault City proper.

he is a high value target better to take him back
>>
>>5206494
What's the time limit for the job?
>Pick 2 squad members to take Jacob and Granite back to base ahead of the rest of you while you stay behind to finish your business here.
Grant and Elizabeth will head back to base to ensure the VIP makes it back. If they're not able to take the armor and weapons back with them in the car, we can leave it some place.
We did bring the car with us right? They can just shove all the loot in there with them?

What's our funds looking like? Can we purchase additional stimpaks from the locals?

>>5206503
Why not take him back to base? Would he not be more secured there? Plus after he's been deposited back home our two squad mates can come back with additional ammo and medical supplies.
>>
you know Granite is right about the empire of ashe, if we are serious about rebuilding America then we need to do it right, staying extremist enclave is the path to eventual ruin, we have to adapt or die. hell as is our MC has a pragmatic look on things and as a pragmatist should realize the Enclave needs to change and deradicalize enough that allowing the wastelanders to exist is not grounds for execution.
>>
>>5206508
Do you think Ford would feel sympathy for the Vault members what were slaughtered by the old Enclave? That was a crying shame.
>>
>>5206507
I don't believe that two people is enough to properly escort him back to home base this is fucking granite we are talking about. either we leave early as a group or we take him to the hotel room. All he needs is one slip up from the two-guard escort and boom he is in the wind and two over our people are dead. It is not a risk I think is worth the potential reward.
>>
>>5206494
>Pick 2 squad members to take Jacob and Granite back to base ahead of the rest of you while you stay behind to finish your business here.
Grant and Elizabeth. I rather not have the dude we struggled to limp away, lest you want to do a Benny Hill chase.
>>
>>5206514
No strict time limit on the mission, but what's left to do isn't much maybe a day or twos worth of work in setting.
>>
>>5206513
He seems like a true patriot to the ideals on which the old republic was founded so I think he would. Eventually, the dogma of the Radical enclave will have to come into conflict with his Constitutionalist ideas, and either we vote to go with the Constitution and live up to the ideals of America, or we go with the dogma and embrace the hypocrisy that comes with it.
>>
>>5206514
Granite was a danger when he was armed and in power armor. If you propperly cuff, tie up, or duct tape up a man theres very little he could do. Plus he's an old man. If you're really afraid that he might slip up, what we can do is purchase a roll of duct tape for fuck all, I don't know 5 caps at most? Expend the entire roll to tie him up. There is no was an elderly man out of power armor is breaking out of that. If that doesn't work, we can drug him with enough sedative's to put down a deathclaw.

I feel like you're seriously over estimating his threat level.

>>5206517
Cool. Looks like we can send em back, give Rosaline a few hours to lick her wounds, then send her out to do some legwork.

>>5206518
It's gonna be tough trying to find a balance between the two. No matter what we try, we can't make everyone happy. I think the best thing we could do is invest more in our speech craft and slowly change the ideals of every Enclave Cell in the country into one uniform ideal. Something closer to the idealized version of old war America, without Armageddon 2 Electric boogaloo. Because the last time the Enclave tried that we got our asses kicked by a histories strongest tribal.
>>
>>5206494
>>Something else (write in?)
Camp outside, and remain there until we finish the mission. We avoid attention and can guard the loot and prisoners well.

Find a spot that is not easily seen or near beasts. Then we just leave a squad member with a good gun and armor there with them.

Going in the wastelands in two is ill advised. Going in the wastelands in two with loot and two prisoners even less. We need to go with all our group, max security.

Also comms home of the mission development, this is a good news.
Search for written orders or any vocal registration of them, on the corpses.
And tie really really well this two.
>>
>>5206524
>Going in the wastelands in two is ill advised
Counter point. Going in the wastelands in two is ill advised....if you do not have power armor and advanced energy weapons. We have those. We also traveled here. How do you think we traveled to Vault City all the way from base? By car of course. We have a car by the way, in addition to a Vertibird we need to repair.

Does anyone else want to go back to Navarro to get the last remaining files there? Me thinks we should invest in additional sneak and hacking training, in addition to utilizing the layout information and previous guard patrols to make a second infiltration easier than it would be. Because a second time will probably be harder.
>>
>>5206527
Vertibird is actually functional, but it only has enough fuel for one trip
>>
>>5206527
>if you do not have power armor and advanced energy weapons. We have those. We also traveled here. How do you think we traveled to Vault City all the way from base? By car of course. We have a car by the way, in addition to a Vertibird we need to repair.

Already know all of that still prefer max security. The mission takes at best another day or two. Waiting in a safe location will not hurt anybody, the fact that it would be away from the eyes in the city also helps.
Having all of that equipment, still doesn't mean is secure for two to travel back to base. Especially with two dangerous prisoners to control.
>>
>>5206534
One dangerous prisoner.
Jacob is an ally who is incapacitated.
>>
>>5206535
Ah right the other is dead.
Doesn't change much for me.
>>
>>5206532
Can we convert the Vertibird to run on Fison batteries?

>>5206534
>>5206537
Car. Put man in car. Put loot in trunk. Duct tape man. Drug man tranq him. He sleepy no wakey no movie tie up tapie.
One soldier guard one man and loot for 1-2 days = he slip up, he die cuz Granite sneakie.
We move Granite while he unconscious. We move fast, he at base fast in less than 1-2 days.
You know words?
>>
>>5206539
Possibly, but it'd be a pretty complicated endeavor, you'd basically be exchanging a combustion engine for an electrical one and all that entails. Not that the Fission batteries can't supply the required energy to move it, just that it'd be resource intensive.

It would also turn it into a flying nuke given the way most fission and fusion powered things are in Fallout when they take sufficient damage.
>>
>>5206543
The same goes for your run of the mill vertibird back in fallout 3. Those things do down like wet cardboard, plus they explode just as much running on fuel in 3 and 4.
Well what if we did that think in fallout 2 where you upgrade that car so it can accept fuel cells as fuel?

https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Highwayman
>The Chryslus Highwayman has a fully analog system with no electronics, over 800 horsepower, and reaches 60 mph in under a second. It has a spacious trunk and an interior capable of accommodating as much as seven people, including a super mutant, robobrain, and a deathclaw.

>The flow of power is regulated by the fuel cell controller, which is also the one part that tends to break down the most, usually burning out due to rapid acceleration. A fuel cell regulator was an optional upgrade that some drivers installed to improve the mileage while others didn't concern themselves with energy usage.

>The battery can be charged with either microfusion cells or small energy cells. A full pack of SEC (40) charges it by 20%, a full pack of MFC (50) charges it by 50%.

>Fuel cell regulator from Klamath (found in a wrecked Highwayman after going to the end of the Rat Caves in Trapper Town), doubles mileage. Installed by Smitty.
>Blower in NCR, improves speed. Installed by Ratch.
>In the Chop Shop in New Reno, T-Ray can install a speed and trunk space upgrade. He can also install a speed and fuel-saving enhancement called the grav-plates after completion of the game, obtainable by having the car stolen after blowing up the Enclave Oil Rig, without having it stolen prior.

Damn man can we equip the Vertibird with some of this shit?
>>
>>5206539
You did not specify any of that before.
Neither did the vote, and I don't remember us having any drugs that works like that either.

We cannot be sure it would go like that too for the one that will guard Granite. It s not like the mission will be longer, what we need to do now is checking a building not exactly something that takes a lot of time. We could tie him up well and knocking him unconscious here too, Granite is still a human at the end.

I prefer to be in more. A car is a vehicle, it can be stopped even if it's fast. I prefer all the security we can have, since it will not take a lot of time to end our mission. You prefer to go immediatly.
If you are afraid of votes, just wait. More anons are going to vote. It s not the end of the world.
>>
>>5206557
You'll get opportunities to upgrade it when you have the resources to do so.
Also fair point they do explode quite spectacularly in Fallout 3 and 4, but those vertis had been converted to fission/fusion power by that point.

But yeah like I said you'll have opportunities to upgrade it, and converting it to fission/fusion power will be one, it'll just be expensive and take some time.
>>
>>5206494
>>Find a discrete spot to dump the loot and come back for it later, throw a bag over Granite's head and take him with you to your rooms outside of Vault City proper.
>>
>>5206515
Support
>>
>>5206515
+1 super ort
>>
>>5206494

>Pick 2 squad members to take Jacob and Granite back t base ahead of the rest while you stay behind to finish your business here.

> Grant and Elizabeth. Maybe the long trip home with a shared purpose will help them bond.
>>
>>5206494
>Pick 2 squad members to take Jacob and Granite back to base ahead of the rest of you while you stay behind to finish your business here.
But we should try to be careful. We could get ambushed by those people who split from Granite.
>>5206648
How romantic
>>
>>5206494
>Pick 2 squad members to take Jacob and Granite back to base ahead of the rest of you while you stay behind to finish your business here.

>Grant and Elizabeth
>>
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Also
I still picture Ford as a one legged man who is dreaming all these events during his post battle coma.
>The 3 stooges advocating for dueling a legendary death law
>That one anon with the absolute worst fucking rolls (and tried to say they deserved it lmao)
>The posterior pulverization that resulted from Rutherford losing his field goal kicker
This is a great quest. There's struggle, triumph, good ideas, and absolute retardation.
>PS we should start looking up the romance. Anons are right. Enclave America isn't going to breed itself.
Lil sis for Grant.
Jacob and Rosaline.
Ford and pic related
>>
>>5206686
I want Fors to be strong enough to our muscle a deathclaw out of armor, then proceed to mating press it into submission.

I miss that one Deathclaw fucker quest. That was fun.
>>
>Pick 2 squad members to take Jacob and Granite back t base ahead of the rest while you stay behind to finish your business here.
wins
and
Grant and Elizabeth were chosen.
Writing
>>
>>5206776
What about our dream deathblow wife with big milky milkers?
>>
You look back to Grant, "I want you to get Elizabeth and take the Traitor there back home after we radio ahead regarding it, take the equipment with you as well, we'll be done here in a few short days anyways." you get up off the rock and begin walking back to the city putting on your rather damaged T-51B power armor, it groans as the servos engage. "Also take Jacob back with you, if the load seems to heavy for just the two of you take the car, it won't matter if we're hear a day or two longer waiting for it to get back."

Grant gives you a nod walking over to Elizabeth who seems to look back at him for a moment then at you, it's a bit far away so it's hard to see how she's reacting exactly.

Still heading back into town you end up stopping at the car and taking out the radio equipment and making sure you were alone before dialing in the frequency, "Columbus Actual this is Amerigo 1 do you copy?"

The Radio buzzes back, "This is Columbus Actual, we read you Amerigo 1, what's your operations code?"

"Fort Quebec" you cough as you reply, "Acknowledged." was the reply.

You start, "We've had an auspicious development out here, we've managed to gain access to some advanced equipment, but also an individual of note, I'm sending part of my squad back with the individual and equipment ahead of the rest of us, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised." The radio operator on the other side paused for a moment, "Please confirm individuals identity please."

You shake your head, "Identity isn't comms secure, suffice it to say individual had prior ties to our organization and left on bad terms in one of the worst ways possible."

There's silence for a few moments, "Acknowledged. Is there anything else you'd like to report Amerigo 1?"

You roll your shoulder and lean on the car for a moment, "ETA to mission completion should be a few days from now, 1-3 is my estimate, nothing else of note, Amerigo 1 out."

"Acknowledged, Columbus Actual out." and the radio begins to buzz with dead air and you hang it up.

With that handled you head back to the place you were staying, noting that as expected only Rosaline and Thomas were there, Rosaline seemed pretty disgruntled with current events. You can't blame her, getting the shit kicked out of you sucked, you should know it's a wonder your still even walking. Thomas was drinking some sort of local drink trying to forget the battle as quickly as he could.

For your part, everything had a dull pain about it, but you were still good to go after you treated the major damage.

You sit down at the bar with them and order a drink of your own, "You both did well today."

There wasn't much of a reply, Thomas just gave a nod and Rosaline just had a small scowl on her face. You just sigh, and take the drink that was put in front of you, "We'll be heading out soon anyways... I know that wasn't exactly the easiest situation to handle."

[continue]
>>
Rosaline just scowls slightly, and Thomas shrugs. It seems you need another team building exercise when you get back to base. You wonder what exactly it is that has both of them in such poor spirits...

You shake your head, you can figure that out in do time, for now just give it a few hours so everyone can catch their breath.

You take a drink and you mind drifts back to what the Traitor Granite had said. An Empire of Ashes. You shake your head, you can't seem to wrap your head around what exactly it is that man was fighting for anyways, what leads a man to throw everything away like that?

Could it have been as horrible as he tried to make it sound? Was it just rhetoric to make himself feel exonerated of his guilt? It had to be... and yet there was something scratching at the back of your mind. That burning question from over a year ago. The Wastelanders... did he come to see them as human? He had to have the way he spoke. Perhaps much the same way you came to respect Ranger Bradley and those of his ilk he came to some understanding with the Chosen one?

You grunt downing your drink quickly, it tasted awful, but the bitter flavor helped clear you mind and think a little more straight.

You look up at the bartender and then at your squad mates, you think back to the battle. Not the one most recently fought, but the one with Ranger Bradley, your hand drawn to your pocket, though unable to grasp the tags.
Once again you find yourself thinking about the matter, what were you fighting for?

America, that much was obvious, and as far as you could tell the Enclave was America...
But was it the America you want to fight for? There had been elections, snap and emergency elections, but it was democratic... not ideal, but well ideal was a long way away regardless.

In fact, bearing back to the constitution, you're fairly certain that there's been several violations of it through out the whole matter. Yet, you are in a state of unprecedented crisis, and the Enclave has maintained the knowledge and traditions of the old world...

Then what the hell was eating at you?
You lean back for a bit staring at the ceiling, trying to figure it out, but you just can't place your finger on it.

It was frustrating, immensely so. You shift your thoughts, what would cause someone to betray the Enclave like Granite did? Was it the honeyed words of the Chosen one? He never once mentioned him, all he talked about was the so called 'horrors' of the Enclave. You think on it, and while furious, there was an odd sense of genuine concern in his voice, he sounded... exhausted just thinking about it all.

[continue]
>>
Well of course he would, living a lie is going to be mentally draining no matter what...

That still doesn't answer the question of why. You'd reckon it to be the greatest betrayal in American history seeing as how it destroyed what was left of the Federal government. There weren't even States or Commonwealths. You suppose you could consider the NCR as a rogue state of California or some amalgamation of the western commonwealths..

But that'd be recognizing that the Wastelanders government was a government. It wasn't, at least not a legitimate one. You sigh taking another drink from your freshly refilled mug.
And then it struck you, sitting here, just outside of Vault City, being served by a wastelander.

That question that you had set aside so long ago... does it matter that they're human?

You wonder... if that's the question that Granite asked himself so long ago...
You felt sick to your stomach, you tried to think of something else but you couldn't, the question repeating itself over and and over again in your mind.

Are they human? What of the plans to come? Even if they aren't does it justify the untold death of so many?
Was there a better way?

Your head began to spin and you stood up, "I think I'm going to head to bed for the night..." you say walking away, the other two looking over their shoulders as you left.

You closed and locked the door behind you sitting down on the makeshift bed, taking your armor off, settling down you pull out the Dog tag.

Glaring at it, you felt pity, hatred, admiration, fear, doubt.

Well Ford?
Are they human?
>Yes....
>No! NO! NO!
>It shouldn't matter... we're doing what's right for America...
>What America?
>Write in
>>
>>5206956
>It shouldn't matter... we're doing what's right for America...

Man were once mice once upon a time, does that make mice human? It doesn't matter if they're human or not, all that matters is the restoration of America and it's values, else all the rights and liberties we fought so hard to keep alive will be for naught.
>>
>>5206956
>No! NO! NO!
>They are foreigners squatting on RIGHTFUL AMERICAN LAND.
>>
>>5206990
All the sacrifices, as well. Don't forget what happened to our friends at New Reno. Would Bishop be considered human?
>>
>>5206956
>I don't know
I don't think Ford would jump straight to saying they are human but considering everything he has seen, there should be doubt in that they aren't.

>>5206990
But it does matter, since
>the restoration of America and it's values
requires knowing what a human is because that's who those rights and liberties apply to.
>All the sacrifices, as well. Don't forget what happened to our friends at New Reno. Would Bishop be considered human?
Maybe, maybe not. He still deserves to die for what he did though.
>>
>>5206956
>>It shouldn't matter... we're doing what's right for America...
but .... what's "right" still needs to be done. and decided.
Did our actions so far created horrible massacres ? No. We killed soldiers of the Bos and NCR, looters by nature and corrupted in their philosopies. Our actions so far did not create what Granite did or did see, we took back what was of the Enclave and ensured the safety of our community.
Even if we can reflect and look on the words of Granite, America only chance is within the Enclave. This is a fact.
Tribals, mutants, raiders or primitive states like NCR or Vault City do not fit. Neither the cultists of the BOS.
They cannot restore it like us. And most of them don't want to restore America at all. Or care for it.

We have a vision, a vision that we want to realize and one we want the Enclave to have. For accomplish it we need to become something more for our community. Not just a member, soldier, friend, brother or son.
Looking back at the forefathers of our nation might give ideas for the future we want to create and how to reach it.
>>
>>5206956
>>It shouldn't matter... we're doing what's right for America...
>>
>>5207037
This is an interesting direction but I don't think the prompt correlates with it. Wouldn't knowing if wastelanders are human or not be relevant in deciding what is a horrible massacre and what isn't? What methods we should or shouldn't use in pursuit of our goals? I agree with looking back at the founders for guidance though, maybe there is something there that can set us on the right path to restore America.
>>
>>5206956
>>It shouldn't matter... we're doing what's right for America...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eCGoA-dZBzo
>>
> It doesn't matter. Drunken philosophical internal monologue inbound. Brace for impact.

They aren't citizens. Look at what they've built here, outside the light of American Civilization, beyond the wings of the Eagle. First, the New California Republic. A parody of democracy, flying a soviet bear beneath an inverted sino-star. Corruption was rampant. The vote an illusion, a single dictator floating on bribery and personal favors. A 'nation' built around power and personality rather than Law. Short sighted personal interest rather than duty. The promise of protection from petty warlords rather than the dream of self-determination. It might as well be called the Peoples Democratic Republic of California.

Then there was the Brotherhood. For all their differences, the Brotherhood too was based on American virtues. However, these were military virtues. Duty, brotherhood, obedience, information control. Incomplete, they were like an engine rusting away in the desert, potentially powerful but waiting for someone to restore them and put them to use. Like a Vindicator, looking for someone to aim and pull the trigger.

Then there was Caesar's Legion. It sounded like they were chasing the dream of the Roman Empire rather than the Republic. Another state held together through fear rather than duty. A cult of personality rather than God or Law. Rome, another civilization brought low by the sickle of communism. Gracchus, who redistributed wealth and interrupted a successful military campaign out of envy, jealousy, and fear. A communist in spirit and action long before Marx called for worker to break chains that President Lincoln had already shattered. Look who was wearing chains now.

As for the petty warlords, the Van Graffs and the Bishops of the world, they were to be expected in a savage setting.

What of the Enclave? The last beacon of civilian America? The heir to its government and a Republican heritage stretching back to the Roman Republic that Caesar apparently found no value in. The War had hit her hard too. The great factories built on economic liberty and freedom from government interference and the inevitable corruption that went with it were skeletons and ash. The courts that distributed predictable justice by judges beholden to law and precedent rather than the whims of the politician of the day. They sat empty, the blades of justice dulled and the scales unbalanced. The remnants of the Enclave were too small, run like the Families, the Warlord, the Raiders. More than the genetic differences, it was American Culture that kept those of the Enclave superior to their neighbors. The memory and love of Liberty, Justice, Duty, and loyalty to the Law and the American Dream rather than any one tyrant. It was Mother who had instilled that Culture the strongest. The strong and unwavering patriotic fervor that a man could cling to in times of doubt.
>>
If the NCR had the virtues of American Duty and Law, their citizens would have the patriotic fervor to eliminate the warlords. If the Brotherhood had American Exceptionalism and Vision, the factories would roar with life, and the wasteland would bloom under the effects of automated irrigation and heavy machinery, the second amendment could be in full force, and the NCR would find few brahmin brained people to milk. If the Warlords had American Patriotism and the American Dream, they could form a federated republic, combine their strength, and throw down the corrupt and the barbaric. If the Legion had American Liberty and Yankee Innovation, their laser beams could form a second sun. If any of these were true, the beasts, such as the deathclaws, the radscorpions, the gekos, the FEV horrors, these would be culled and little danger to these near-humans. The Enclave remembered these virtues. Civic Duty, Precidential Justice, Unifying Patriotism, Ambitious Vision, even Innovative Liberty. It might be a thousand years before the wastelanders could get all these virtues together, if their mutated minds could even manage it. Thus, it didn't matter how human they were, they were Un-American, each in their own way, and that was enough.

The American Dream had come through the fires of war, the famine of nuclear winter, and the FEV plague. The death of the warlords, and the communists, and the raiders, and the barbarians were necessary steps to restoring America and achieving her Manifest Destiny. God Bless America, and Goodnight.

~ Pass out
>>
Vote will remain open until tomorrow morning, I'm going to try and go to sleep early for once.
>>
>>5206990
supporting
>>
>>5206956
>It shouldn't matter... we're doing what's right for America...
>>
>>5206956
>It shouldn't matter... we're doing what's right for America...
>>
File: SOLEMNSOLUTE.png (1.53 MB, 1920x1080)
1.53 MB
1.53 MB PNG
>>5207151
>>5207154
Damn, almost enough to make a grown man cry. God Bless The United States of America.
>>
>>5206956
>Yes....

>>5207151
>>5207154
+1 God bless America and this patriot poster
>>
>>5207151
>>5207154
+1 GOD BLESS AMERICA!
>>
>>5207151
>>5207154
Really good, and god bless the USA
>>
>>5207151
>>5207154
Backing. Goddamn this is perfect. Shame nobody would hear us.
>>
>>5206956
>>5207151
Backing, based and Enclave pilled.
>>
7 votes for this:
>>5207151
7 Votes for
>It shouldn't matter... we're doing what's right for America...
1 vote for this:
>>5206992
1 vote for
>Yes....

From what I gather this >>5207151 is a more specific form of "It shouldn't matter... we're doing what's right for America..."

However I'd like to make sure I'm getting the essence of the write in correct, which from what I can gather is basically, "It doesn't matter if the wastelanders are human or not, because they're not American, if they were American it still wouldn't matter because they'd be Americans." So it favors a more nationalistic view over the straight purist dogma, and is more focused on revitalizing the wastelands than it is purging wastelanders to do so, however it views the path to revitalizing the wastes as one where the regimes of the wasteland must be destroyed for America to prosper.

Just want to make sure I get this right, need to be able to internalize it so I can write the way Ford's world view shifts from this.
>>
>>5206956
>>Yes....
>It shouldn't matter... we're doing what's right for America...

>>5207151
>>5207154
Support, from the angle of they are human, but human or not they are not American, but if they were then it would not matter if they were human because they would be American

If we truly believe in Amercia then her ideals can't only be for humans
>>
>Yes....
admit the truth

>No! NO! NO!
Embrace the dogma

>It shouldn't matter... we're doing what's right for America...
Dodge the question hiding behind, "moral high ground"

>What America?
dig even deeper

sad to see we are making ford a hypocrite
>>
>>5207557
I say we are making Ford a pretty good character. We will get to dig even deeper into America's raison d'etre at a later date, especialy since we'll be going into NV territory.
>>
>>5207562
Likely not going to happen given the cell wants to put out the FEV plague to wipe out the wastelanders and with the option that won, ford wouldn't have a reason to say anything against it after all it doesn't matter if they are human, they are not "American" and unless QM tells me I am wrong on this point, then Fords now nothing more than a hypocrite which is a damn shame.
>>
>>5207564
Trying to figure that out myself actually, as I've asked for clarification regarding what exactly the write in is getting at.
Right now I'm fairly certain it's just replacing the genetic purism justification with a nationalistic one in terms of Enclave dogma, though more of a tolerance through apathy twist to it. I don't think it's inherently hostile to the inhabitants of the wasteland, more so than the societal structures that have cropped up.

That said I'm not quite sure hence why I'm asking for peoples opinions on it and clarification as I want to know exactly what I'm going to be writing about.
>>
>>5207570
Well for my part I like that interpretation of it and would like to see that be the angle to take.
>>
>>5207535

It is a version of > It shouldn't matter... we're doing what's right for America. It answers the question of whether it's OK to kill the wastelanders, without committing to the fact that they are morally worthy of human rights. They're still mutants, and definitely Other. Maybe some or all of them could be brought into the fold of American Culture. Hard to say what their mutant minds are capable of at this point in time. But if mutants need to die for America to thrive, so be it. And the foreign governments need to be eliminated as independent forces. They are all flawed. If the mutants are capable of sharing in the American Dream, then so be it. If they can't, then they'll need to be culled like the radscorpions and the deathclaws. It's also very patriotic and I tried to lace it with hooks such as Enclave being the fourth horseman or the missing virtues of the Enclave (tolerance and wholistic independence). Love for mother, love for country, love for virtue. Hate for communism, corruption, and barbarism. Seeing the Enclave as the last bastion of a great civilization, carrying it's memories even if it can't always live up to the ideals. If the Enclave is lost, then America is lost.
>>
>>5207535
>>5207570
More patriotic than nationalistic me feels, but generally correct. And if you're wondering what the difference is, patriotism is more based in community and connections to the land and the people, while nationalism is more of an belief in the abstract idea of the nation and the state.

And I do see the 'It shouldn't matter... we're doing what's right for America...' as the patriotic option. Doing it for you family, friends, and community first and foremost.
>>
>>5207535

I also tried to give some ideas on how Ford might approach pulling the wastelander factions into America, the flaws that would need to be corrected. That's if Ford sees a opportunity to do so, it isn't setting a goal to have the muties raise the flag. Not now anyway.
>>
>>5207576
Focus of community and friendship first and foremost, we can create an ideological rationale for it after the fact. You don't need to justify a feel after all, only the reason for having them.
>>
>>5207575
I believe it is important that we keep ford a patriot of the United States rather than a nationalist to the united states.

there is a subtle difference a Patriot is loyal to the nation and founding ideals on which it was built, a nationalist is loyal to the government of the day ideals or abuses be damned. it might be a subtle difference for some but it is a critical distinction because when you get right down to it, the enclave while being the best shot a bringing back America is also the best chance at raising up an empire of evil and darkness cloaking in the skinned remains of the American Dream. Either America is for all her children, human and mutant or it's not really America.
>>
Ok so to summarize one more time with new information and context:
It's more about Ford's inherent patriotism, his desire to restore the United States, and that it's irrelevant whether or not wastelanders are mutants or humans, they're either supporting the restoration of the United States or acting against that. If they're supporting it then they're allies and to be treated with respect and if they're against it they're enemies to be treated with scorn.

In turn it just drops the purist aspect of Humanity vs Mutants, and cares more about America vs the Wasteland, and any wastelander/vault dweller/Enclave member that wants to help rebuild America is an American, where those that oppose it are the enemy.

Yay, nay?
>>
>>5207585
Yes, I love it and I can fully get behind it, very well articulated warden
>>
Basically yay.

It pragmatically ignores the purist aspect of Humanity vs Mutants, at least as far at the human looking wastelanders are concerned. No comment on things like super-mutants or sentient deathclaws or stuff like that.
>>
>>5206956
>No! NO! NO!

Anons pussyfoot around too much
>>
I'm thinking 1920's America here. The wastelanders are basically foreign immigrants. They can participate in the economic life of the nation, and benefit from its virtues like Law and Justice. But they might not be able to handle voting or belong in the halls of power.
>>
>>5207585
Yea, I think that's generally correct. I think more focus on community and the bonds we share with people should be focused on, but I can settle for this.

The reason why I don't want to really answer this human purist question is mostly because I don't want to drive a wedge between us and our family, which will be a deal breaker for me. Families shouldn't break up and fight one another over politics and political beliefs, and I would rather see the Wasteland burn than break our family up over politics.
>>
>>5207593
Baby steps are the best way to reform the Enclave push too hard and it shatters under the stress of reality vs dogma. In time The Full enfranchisement of the wastelanders will come and the rights and duties all Americans share will be extended to them but that is for waaaaay down the line. right now we have to make sure there is an America to one day extend rights from.
>>
>>5207601
>...I would rather see the Wasteland burn than break our family up over politics.

Then any America we built wouldn't be worth the genocide it was founded on eventually it would just rot once more from the inside out just as it did at the start of the great war. You can't rebuild on a foundation of lies, hate, and fear. In the end, it would just prove to be our undoing once more. there is a necessary level of conflict in all aspects of life and if it means we have to argue even go against the family if it is what's best for America and the right thing to do, then so be it. cold truth is better than a warm lie any day the lies will only end up suffocating you.
>>
Alright I'm ready to start doing the write up.
>It shouldn't matter... we're doing what's right for America...
with flavors of this >>5207151

wins

Writing
>>
>>5207608
America was built on family values, and to intentionally break up our family over ideology will just turn us into the commies. I ain't having it.

Besides, we ain't creating a foundation of untruths and 1984 repression, we can simply establish and spread the right values in ways that won't tear our family apart.
>>
>>5207619
>America was built on family values, and to intentionally break up our family over ideology will just turn us into the commies. I ain't having it.

A bold statement given the only civil war America has ever had was over ideological differences over the value of human life. The bonds of blood are not so strong as to out restrain right and wrong. If anything it is our rich heritage of being able to voice our ideological differences and debate them, even fight over them that has made America so great. though Free speech seems to be a lost virtue in the Enclave if it doesn't call exactly in line with the party dogma, which if you ask me sounds a lot like how commies act.
>>
hey yo! Nice seeing you again.
I have editing permits in the excel and word for some reason, so hey cool
>>
>>5207631
Byproduct of when I thought I wasn't going to run it again, had set the docs to be available to anyone just in case they wanted to pick up the quest in my place.
Guess I forgot to change it back.
>>
>>5207627
You do not gain strength by killing your brother over a difference of politics, and the fact that you had to bring up the tragedy that was the Civil War and state that meat grinder was what made America great shows how little you understand of America and it's values, and the tragedy of the situation. And it's the commies that advocate the dissolution of the family unit in favor of ideology.

Good night America.
>>
>>5207652
The civil war resulted in the abolishment of slavery be it a by-product of the northern need for soldiers to hold the union together, or a genuine belief on the part of Lincon the result is the same, The south wanted to keep humans as livestock to be used and owned and the north did not. Had America just sat on its hands and done nothing who knows if and when slavery would have ended in the US. besides blind loyalty to the family at the expense of what is right and wrong is not an American value, that would be more in line with how fascists and authoritarians think. pretend you have the high ground all you like but if you would sit by and allow the FEV plague to be released in the name of family, then your no American at all, just a dogmatic boot licker in love with his empire of ash.
>>
>>5207657
Family is above your country
>>
>>5207673
conscience, righteousness, and right and wrong before blood, if they are asking you to do something you know to be wrong making it a choice between family and morality then they aren't good blood, to begin with.
>>
You pocket the dog tags laying down and staring at the ceiling of the room you were in. Why should it matter if they're human or not? No your dedication, your cause is to America, if they can comprehend what America stands for and fight for it, then they're worth your respect. Yet of those in the wasteland, you've yet to meet one that understands it... though perhaps that's because you've never really tried to engage in such a dialogue before. You know full well though that the Governments, the failed joke of a state that is the NCR is still your enemy. They play at democracy while being hopelessly corrupt, continuously electing a single leader into power for decades on end, the cult of personality still in full force even today as Tandists argue for the continued expansion of the NCR while revering their founder of who failed them on inception by refusing to give up power until their death.

You know what the founding fathers would call that? A dictatorship, the powers that be the Brahmin barons that rose up in her wake and her very political establishment? An Aristocracy. Yes truly the NCR was a joke, and one in poor taste.

Then there was the Brotherhood of Steel, the rebellious military remnant of the American Military. They're militant isolationism and their swing to a violent technophobic state automatically disqualifies them, instead of using their significant resources and knowledge to restore and revitalize America they horde it because it is 'to dangerous' for the average wastelander. Perhaps, perhaps, and yet they squander it none the less, what few innovations are seen from them come from the necessities of conflict. Fitting given their origin as a fragment of the military, that they would only know how to build and expand their capacity to subjugate. The biggest failure of the Brotherhood is not their training or their technology, but their leadership.

But what of the many tribals and warlords of the wastes? They've yet to advance far enough ideologically to see beyond the value of survival, to see what needs be done. They live and die by the sword, and are put under heel by Machiavellian and Byzantine structures to keep their autocrats in place. You've little patience for this as well.

All around you, you see leadership fail its people again and again, you see an America in ruins and no one trying to restore it to it's glory. The Enclave claims to do so, as do you, but the goal seems so distant and the whole of your small group seems ever so tiny before your gargantuan task. No less how disunited you are in the face of it. Senator Rockefeller has no respect for democratic tradition, a political snake through and through, no it's no wonder the man wants to subvert the NCR, he'd find quite a home there amongst it's petty aristocracy. But even beyond him, the Enclave was faltering in it's duties as well, we had no judiciary, we had no senate, we had so few people one could hardly argue we were an entity at all.

[continue]
>>
All we have left are the virtues and knowledge of the American Republic, what once was, the old world ideal, and even that was straining under the emergency powers and hardline principals of the old guard of the Enclave. Though you take some solace and certainty that they will agree to the trial you will propose for Granite, as it is his right, traitor or not as an American citizen to be judge before a jury of his peers.

You roll over in your bed and close your eyes, what trails were ahead you knew the course that was needed.

The Enclave must become united, wise words were once spoken long ago in the face of the destruction of the American Dream and her spirit, 'And if a house be divided against itself, that house cannot stand.'
You knew that the Enclave was standing on the precipice of either thriving or utter self destruction. What troubled your dreams was whether or not there was a damn thing you could do about it.

_______

You later awake to a rasp on your door, you groggily get out of bed and open the door, it was the Senator.
A fine way to start your day, "Yes?" you respond.

He gives you a dry look, "Where is the rest of your team and why the hell do you look so beaten up?"

You roll your shoulder once, "We captured the insurgents contact, as well as identified their base of operation. I had the contact sent back to base." you hold up a hand as he's about to object and pull him closer, "It was Alexander Granite, the traitor."

He is silent for a moment, "I see... well I can't fault your initiative on the matter, but I would have liked to have been conferred with on the matter none the less."

You shrug, "You weren't there and I needed to act quickly, now is there anything else that you need?"

He shakes his head, "No you've answered my original question as well as the ones I actually asked."

You step out of the room following behind him as he heads back out, "A moment Senator I think we should discuss our long term plans with Vault City for a few moments before we resolve this matter. I don't think you place quite enough value on having them as long term Allies."

The senator sighs, "Diplomatically trepidatious waters that they're in, they're more a liability as a long term ally. Short term they have much that they can provide us with from expertise to equipment, to knowledge in general, and that should be exploited regardless of our intentions. Still if it sets you at ease I had it in mind that when they inevitably fall prey to the NCR we would act as a bastion for their refugees and inherit their knowledge base and expertise with known of the baggage of it's state."

It doesn't and you shake your head, "We've come up with some proposals none the less, you wanted to be conferred with, I apologize for not being able to, but I'd like to be conferred with here, if you have the time please listen to them."

He sighs grabbing a seat, "Very well then, what are your proposals?"

[continue]
>>
You sit across from him, "Vault City runs predominately on the power from Gecko and the power generated from their reactor in the Vault correct?"

He nods, "Yes, and the Reactor is currently running under suboptimal conditions, hence the need to subvert the ghouls as the easiest means to get more out of it."

You shake your head, "What if instead of that we collected several other Vault reactors and transported them here for their usage?"

He looks at you like you're a chicken with its head cut off, "Well yes I suppose that could work, but such a matter would be a herculean task, where do you propose we get the manpower for such an endeavor let alone finance it? We've got our hands full moving our operations to the Mojave as is." he leans back for a moment, "It's incredibly audacious and costly, but it does skirt around a lot of diplomatic issues, unfortunately this is also not a long term solution. Vault City suffers from diplomatic isolation due to it's civil and domestic policies more than it does from it's need for better foreign policy. Not that I blame them for the system chosen, they just happened to bite a poisoned bullet when taking the Chosen ones original deal. I suspect he did it on purpose as well the clever bastard."

You nod, "It's not necessarily a long term solution, but it buys us a good amount of more time to look for one, more so than your own as it's an outsourced one that doesn't inherently antagonize the NCR."

He frowns a little, "Which was part of the point, You do realize how much equipment and personnel we're moving to the Mojave yes? The more distracted and hamstrung the NCR is the less likely we're to be discovered, the best way to do that is to get them actively bogged down in conflict, draw more resources away from the direction we want to head."

You shake your head, "Those will be military assets, not covert ones, we can subvert military assets through strategic movement and subterfuge plenty well, but doing it my way will draw more covert forces to Vault City instead, which I suspect we'd have a harder time coping with."

He pauses for a moment, "Perhaps." is all he says, "Perhaps. I suppose I can present it as an alternative option in my talks with the First Citizen, then it'll be in their hands to decide their own fate."

You sigh, that's about the best you could hope for, "Alright, that's all I have." you finish

He nods, "Very well then, get that list of insurgents and bring it to me, and I'll provide the first citizen with the terms and details of our aid package."

You nod back, and look around, neither Rosaline or Thomas where there, so you head to their rooms and knock on them, both opening their respective door.

You give both of them a look, they look better than they did the night before, seems the slept well enough, "Alright lets get this over with, Rosaline, Thomas, get some disguises set up, I need a list of names of people that frequent that building now so we can get out of here."

[continue]
>>
3 anons roll me 2d100

Infiltrate the Insurgents meeting
Challenging Stealth Check DV 50
+1 Success automatically used as this is the last stealth check of the mission

Venemous words +10
Light Step +5
Strike First +5
Hiding in Plain Sight +5
It's Just good Business +2

Roll Under 77

Critical Failure: Looks like they've scattered (Insurgents scatter, it'll take a long time before they set up again, but you get nothing)
0 Successes: Not possible
1 Success: "Who are the new guys?" (Insurgents are suspicious -5 to subsequent speech check DV)
2 Successes: "Welcome, here's our platform" (Insurgents are welcoming, but professional)
3 Successes: "Let me introduce you to our leader" (Insurgents are welcoming, and friendly +5 to the subsequent speech check DV)
Crit Success: It would seem we stumbled upon a prime strategy meeting (Same as 3 successes, but you gain incriminating evidence against the NCR)

________

Get the Names of everyone present
Challenging Speech Check DV 50
You have 2 automatic successes you may spend

Fortunate Son +15
Devils Advocate +5
Venomous Words +5

Roll Under 75

Critical Failure: Wait what did you just say? (Insurgents get suspicious and clam up, no names gathered, but you get their faces, they scatter after the meeting)
0 Successes: Not much for conversation are they... (Insurgents get Suspicious and clam up, no names gathered, but you get their faces)
1 Success: Oh well you see... (You get a third of the names before the ending of the meeting)
2 Successes: Ah, what was your name again, I'm... (You get 2/3rds of the names before the ending of the meeting)
3 Successes: This is really interesting, what about... (You get all of their names.)
Critical Success: Hey how about we meet up again later at... (You get all of their names, and priority targets are lured into a trap)
>>
Rolled 55, 6 = 61 (2d100)

>>5207701
You got it boss
>>
Rolled 11, 3 = 14 (2d100)

>>5207701
>>
Rolled 38, 41 = 79 (2d100)

>>5207701
>>
3 Successes: "Let me introduce you to our leader" (Insurgents are welcoming, and friendly +5 to the subsequent speech check DV)
3 Successes: This is really interesting, what about... (You get all of their names.)

Hook line and sinker

Writing.
>>
>>5207710
I mean if this is the last leg of the race, sure let's use all those auto auto successes.
Going above 3 successes makes it a crit success, yes? No?
>>
>>5207717
No.
>>
fucking nice solid rolls anons

>>5207717
also if this anon is right then yeah I agree lets burn those autos for crits
>>
>>5207717
>>5207718
>>5207720
Well, it was worth asking.
>>
>>5207680
so what. They are the only ones that have your back
>>
>>5207723
my immortal soul isn't worth bad blood it's as simple as that. I think this conversation run its natural course. We have similar, but different core values at the end of the day. Besides if family is asking me to do something that in my heart I know is wrong or lose them, well then they weren't really family at all.
>>
>>5207718
Is the option to raid Navarro for data again still on the table? We got the files for the FEV and K-9 experiments. I still want to get the files for the MK2, the Experimental tesla power armor, and the !!!!! Crit success file that is probably tied to The Divide. Getting access to that before the NCR cracks the code will ensure that we prevent the destruction of the place, because we all know the NCR fucked it all up when they sent the courier their with that package. If we dont get the codes, we could be the ones getting raw hided by nuclear destruction.
>>
>>5207728
It will be, just be aware that canonically your characters aren't aware of the nuclear codes, they know there's data still in Navarro because Jacob could tell there were still some very heavily encrypted files left to crack and that's it, and choices if the mission is taken will reflect that lack of information.

So bare that in mind when the option comes up in probably a few posts from now.
>>
> Though you take some solace and certainty that they will agree to the trial you will propose for Granite, as it is his right, traitor or not as an American citizen to be judge before a jury of his peers.

I wonder if the summary execution before he even gets back of granite will open up his eyes to how deeply the dogma has corrupted the ideals of the Constitution within the Enclave. Because I don't believe for a second he will get a trial, and expect the mother would push for his father to execute him as soon as possible.
>>
>>5207736
I think they will allow a trail, but our mother just need to have someone list all his crimes. Being a traitor is a big deal
>>
>>5207740
>>5207736
If a trial is allowed it will basically be a kangaroo court if no one says anything regarding procedure.
>>
the result will be the same anyway.
And rightfully let's be honest the remnants are in this village at the edge of civilization because of traitors like Granite. I really doubt anyone would take pity on him lol
>>
>>5207741
I feel like ford being the person he is will push for a fair trial, but we will see how anons vote when the time comes.
>>
>>5207734
Jacob hunts for the hidden Enclave Records
Challenging Tech Roll DV 50
Mr Fixerupper +10
Old Enclave Codes +10

Roll under 70

3 successes: "There's the overrides, and it looks like there's some experimental files here too..." (you find all 3 records)

Looks like we're going for the biscuit.
>YOU MAY USE +1 TECH SUCCESS FROM MR. FIXERUPPER
Jacob Pushes for more
Brutal Tech Check DV 30
Mr Fixerupper +10

Roll under 40

Crit Success: "Dear God..." (Extra record obtained, Something Potentially Cataclysmic has been discovered)

>Looks like a prototype for an improved model of Advanced Power Armor, called the Mk. II
>Advanced Power armor Tesla variant schematics? Like what Captain Nelson was wearing? Awesome.

(MISSION RESULTS: OVERWHELMING SUCCESS, RECORDS OBTAINED, ADDITIONAL RECORDS OBTAINED, CAMP NAVARRO FORCES WEAKENED, BROTHERHOOD FORCES WEAKNED)

Taking some notes from the last thread. What really has my interest is the note of Navarro forces being weakened. Weaker as they might be, the NCR may or may not eventually find those three dead bodies we made. So they might bolster their security in a sense to make up for the weaker forces, so the difficulty is reset back to where it was to balance things out of that makes sense?

All I'm saying is, I think going back there will be at the same difficulty as the first time, or possibly lower. I think we should get Jacob some additional hacking training. Say what are the pros and cons of eating mentats? Does Fixer exist in this quest? Can Fixer be addictive? Would taking fixer right after taking a drug mitigate the drawbacks?
>>
>>5207750
Maybe some improvments. But we have a lot of training has a squad to do honestly. We are all quite young.

In regard to Navarro, we need a better distraction and maybe put on fire the console alongside Navarro. For distraction something that takes away far more guards than what we did before. I am not sure what, but it needs to engage the NCR troops there. Preferably in combat.
Beyond that ... poisonous fumes maybe ? If there is some wind we could kill some troops. They don't have masks. We could send a shipment of food, with venom that needs some hours for act. It would take time but it can work, the NCR is corrupted and there is incompetence in their ranks.

This said Jacob has probably done a good job, and i honestly doubt the NCR would crack those codes anytime soon. They also don't have facilities or enough people for understand this kind of data.
>>
>>5207750
Mentats would be +10 to Science and Tech rolls, +10 to leadership rolls, +5 to speech rolls for 3 rounds, but a -5 to all rolls for the rest of the mission and is highly addictive compounding the malus when not on mentats.
Fixer does exist, it would remove any addictions, but if you use it during a mission you'll suffer -10 to the rolls during the mission, however you still remain at a higher risk of becoming readdicted if the drug you were addicted to is reintroduced or used again.
>>
>>5207750
>>5207768
How about just stealing the hardware the data is stored on? Maybe there's a good reason why we can't but it would make the whole process of decrypting the files much easier and safer.
>>
>>5207768
>distractions
Those are some good ideas, but theres one even more insidious. Instead of outright killing guards with lethally tainted food, we give them MRE's that give them the shits. All personnel on base will suffer apocalyptic bowel movements so terrible that there will be long lines queued up to use the restrooms, only for the toilets to be so flooded with shit and ass stank that they cant help but fleed from base to the civilian residential areas to ask for their toilets. It will be glorious.

Oh uhm we could also shoe horn retarded local raider gangs to do it. Despite the NCR's best efforts they're still willing to use their Unpowerarmored shock troopers to protect their brahmin ranches. So we just move the raiders and gangers their way and boom. Distractions.

>This said Jacob has probably done a good job, and i honestly doubt the NCR would crack those codes anytime soon. They also don't have facilities or enough people for understand this kind of data.
They will eventually, and when they do, BOOM! The Divide is destroyed with us in it. Plus its more of a matter of denying the NCR resources and assets they can use if we can decrypt the codes before they do.
>>
>>5207775
That could work just as well too, but that would probably require a brutal stealth check of 20 or 30 before and posative modifiers to make the roll easier. We'd have to go to the physical location of where the data banks were stored, which is undoubtably heavily guarded and in use.
>>
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>>5207779
Yes, and the data banks would be extremely heavy, The Fallout universe didn't exactly specialize in downsizing their general use computational machines, and the Enclave ones would have a lot of data on them.
pic related.
>>
>>5207775
I think we would have try that in the mission. Maybe it breaks or something if we take it away. I suspect there is a security measure in the console if we try that.
We can try and see if it works.

>>5207777
>MRE
that could be funny, though i am not sure the NCR feeds that to their troops. I remember one of their cooks being really bad, so they might accept and buy a shipment of food that looks fine to eat. I think we could try that and the poisonous fumes. If the effects are good enough, maybe we can do something more than just take the remaining data (if there is vehicles, it would be a major boon to take them for us)

We need to find a way for avoid that NCR finds a contact between us and the gangers/raiders, if we use them.
>>
>>5207781
If data is still so cumbersome to store then how do they make the robots work? Do they just hold the all the data required separately and then transmit it to the body? If so, that seems like an enormous liability.
>>
>>5207789
magic, probably.
>>
>>5207789
Honestly, it's a detail that I don't think was explored heavily in the Fallout games, most of the major computational equipment seems to be wired, or massive in setting. The Robots probably have some sort of specialized solution that involved miniaturization, but that sort of runs contrary to the whole vacuum tube atom punk aesthetic of the setting. Ultimately I'd say the creators wanted there to be robots and there were, not considering how exactly that would function with everything else the way that it was.

Realistically speaking, the fact that pipboys existed and advanced AI's like Eden or the Calculator or other such entites did exist as well, is that the government just didn't make the miniaturization technology publicly avaliable and took it off the market if it leaked. Old World America wasn't exactly the bastion of Free Market Economics and Democracy it liked to say it was in Fallout.
>>
>>5207803
Alternatively they opted for such things at all the secure locations because it was harder for infiltrators to abscond with it physically.
*shrug* it's definitely a hole in the world building that's for sure.
>>
>>5207788
Now that I think about it, doing poisonous fumes or spamming Mustard Gas will run red alarm and draw a lot of attention when people start coughing up blood. It wont kill them immediately, so they will get an alarm out eventually. It will be a real big priority one if it kills a lot of people. At least with giving everyone the shits it wont set off enough red flags all the while reducing overall Navarro combat effectiveness. Plus, now that I think about it. We can disguise ourselves as Brotherhood members and hire raiders and gangers to go harrass Navarro. That way it'll reinforce the fight between the NCR and Brotherhood of Steel.

Also this is the NCR we're talking about. Feeding their troops tainted food because it's cheaper? It's their moto, just like in real life.
>>
>>5207813
Alright, if you say it will be so let's just dismiss that issue.
>Alternatively they opted for such things at all the secure locations because it was harder for infiltrators to abscond with it physically.
Im not tech literate but there must be some other vulnerability created by still using such bulky storage devices. Maybe make it easier to access the data if you can interact with the hardware? Any suggestions?
>>
>>5207831
Being there next to the data banks will 100% make it easier to get the paydirt.
Now tell me this. How would we do that exactly in a building with security and people moving about, in addition to other people actively using the databanks?
Dont answer that, I'm not feeling so hot about entering a building with armed guards. If we fumble a roll it might end as a combat encounter that will slow us down or trap us inside.
>>
>>5207833
>How would we do that exactly in a building with security and people moving about, in addition to other people actively using the databanks?
It depends. How much security? How many guards? How many nerds? What's the layout of the building? What approach will we take? What resources will we have? What contingencies will we make? etc.
>Dont answer that, I'm not feeling so hot about entering a building with armed guards. If we fumble a roll it might end as a combat encounter that will slow us down or trap us inside.
See above.
>>
>>5207840
Needing to enter the physical location seems unnessassary when we could do the same thing as last time and access it remotely. Why put ourselves in additional danger and over complicate things with additional steps? More steps like that means more complications are possible. If going for the data banks was a better idea, we would had gone with that plan instead of going for them remotely. Plus we still have the codes to that terminal unless they've been changed.
>>
>>5207851
>Needing to enter the physical location seems unnessassary when we could do the same thing as last time and access it remotely. Why put ourselves in additional danger and over complicate things with additional steps? More steps like that means more complications are possible
Im not saying we need to go for the physical location but what im thinking of is the tradeoff of having to access the terminal multiple times or go for the data banks and get everything in one go.

>If going for the data banks was a better idea, we would had gone with that plan instead of going for them remotely.
We didn't know how important the data was at the time and how much of it there is.

Anyway, my original idea involved actually being able to take the hardware with us but this >>5207781 made that a lot more untenable.
>>
>>5207865
Then we just do the same method as last time. "If it ain't broke" as they say.
>>
>>5207813
Theoretically, how hard would it be to pretend we're BoS members, and bribe gangers/raiders into attacking the Navarro base to act as a distraction? Caps are probably not that useful to them unless they know people that can get them goods, so I think bribes in the form of combat drugs, food, and stimpaks might be worth it.
>>
>>5207880
>>5207883
So what, do we just raid the same way until we get everything? Or are you planning a big enough distraction that we can get everything on this try? What if we get caught? Will we just try it on another terminal? Try my method? Give up? I'd rather this all be laid out beforehand.
>>
>>5207888
We do the same method as last time but using raiders as fodder to draw guards away for a time to make infiltration and hacking easier.
For additional prep work, we can try figuring out the who and how the food is slipped inside so we can replace them with poor or expired quality foods. Soldiers with stomach problems will leave their shifts more frequently and be more distracted.
From there we'll see where things go. No reason a plan cant be simple.
>>
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A few bribes here, a disguise dawned, and the right mark and they were in. It was all to easy as they worked their way through the various insurgents, recording their faces and names with ease. The group wasn't insubstantial either much of the Vault City youth had been subverted here. Perhaps some credit had to be given to the cover operations of the NCR, they were much more thorough with their agitations here than they were in Redding, much more subtle as well.

Perhaps its because Redding didn't need to the subtlety to them or perhaps it was because they had learned from their failures in Redding, regardless it was a concerning development.
However said covert element weren't here to prevent you from gaining entrance and subverting the whole of this operation they began. If nothing else while effective they still seem to be inexperienced or uncertain of their own capabilities if they're unwilling to under go long term operations in the place they're subverting.

But before long Rosaline and Thomas had returned to you with the list of names, as well as some details regarding the meeting, and what to look out for to find other potential members that may not have attended, all and all a perfect operation.

You give them both a good nod, "Great work, with this we should be done here for now."

You head over to the gate's to Vault City and into the city hall where the Senator was waiting and hand him the list. He looks it over once and gives an approving nod before heading inside. You follow with him, yourself no longer in Power Armor, but instead swapped out for Combat armor and a full face covering, your armor needed repairs and the First Citizen didn't need to see that.

The Senator waited to be addressed as the First Citizen turned around taking a seat, "My you do indeed work fast, lets see it." she held out her hand.

The Senator the spoke, "First, just a confirmation of our prior agreement, this was as you put a trial run, I believe you'll find the work satisfactory. We will continue such work afterwards upon your satisfaction with the results correct?"

Lynette just sighed, "Yes, yes, now hand it over."

The Senator hands her the list, and she begins flipping through it, nodding approvingly, "Mmm, very good, notation is exceptional, details are very vivid, names are recorded. Good handwriting, better than I'd expect from Wastelanders... Very well I believe we can do business." she says opening a drawer in her desk and slipping the list into it before closing it again.

She leaned forwards, "As to your prior proposal regarding the issue of the Gecko Power Plant I believe we may move forwards with it as you intended."

The Senator holds up a hand, "Before that, I would also like to propose an alternative proposal for your consideration." He looks over to you, then back to her, "We have come into the knowledge regarding several Vaults that are in, relatively pristine condition, and with no current occupants."

[continue]
>>
He pauses waiting to see her response, but she continues stone faced, "While not as much power as can be generated by Gecko running at full capacity, it is perhaps less diplomatically fraught of a solution, we propose to retrieve these vaults Generators to supplement your own. The price being the same as before, though we may require additional manpower for the uninstalling and transportation of such large pieces of industrial equipment." He says with a nod.

Then sitting himself down across from her, "Of course the other offer remains on the table as well, but we can not do both, at least not within any reasonable time frame."

Lynette ponders the proposal for some time, eyeing Senator Rockefeller carefully, there was a tension in the air, one of distrust, but also one of desperation.

She sighed, "How far away are these generators and how many?"

The Senator responds at a leisurely pace, "4 Generators, 3 in the Mojave, 1 in southern California, Vaults 12, 11, 19, and 22"

Lynette frowned at this, "You expect to haul 4 Generators here from over 500 miles away? I don't know exactly what resources you have, but I doubt you'd need us if you were even remotely capable of such a feat."

The senator shook his head, "Come now don't be such a skeptic, you saw my entourage, we came here with modern transportation wearing power armor wielding weapons beyond what even your people utilize. We may be few, but trust me we're capable of such a feat, all we need are hands to do so in a timely manner."

Lynette eyed him carefully, "And how long do you propose it would take you to obtain the closest of these generators?"

He doesn't even flinch, "I'd say 2 months, maybe 3, however once the process is refined, 1 month per generator."
That was just a wild estimate, but it's astounding the amount of confidence he has behind such an unsubstantiated claim.

Lynette doesn't seem totally convinced, "And the manpower, how many people would you need?"

He continues forwards, "20-30 men, mostly for manual labor, though a few technical hands to aid in the removal of sensitive materials would be helpful as well, it would be preferable if they all came equipped to handle radiation hazards as well as these generators especially Vault 12's are rather... old and may need some minor repairs before being transported."

She spends a few minutes contemplating the matter, "I'll have to confer with some of the other citizens on this matter.... however I do like the prospects of the proposal more than the one you proposed earlier. Assuming your capable of upholding your end of the bargain."

He nods, "We're more than capable of doing so. When your deliberations are done I would like a written version of our agreement, in triplicate."

[continue]
>>
he nods in return and we leave the office.

several minutes later several individuals go in and over about 2 hours of discussion later they exit and The Senator is handed three pieces of paper detailing the deal.
4 generators, the first one to arrive in 3 months time, and each following one in 1 month, Payment will be issued in full upon completion of the contract, resulting in honorary citizenship status, conferring full benefits and rights. 20 laborers and 5 technicians will be provided for the duration of this contract."

The Senator nods and signs his name on all three, before handing one back to the man who handed it to him.

Heading out of the building he turns to you, "Well it would seem that we've 2 months of head time on this matter." You just shake your head, "That's certainly going to eat into our time table for moving."
He nods, "Yes, but it was your suggestion, so I suggest that you prioritize it when we get back, I can work with Nelson regarding the Logistics while you handle that."

Oh so that's his game, you say nothing noting his satisfaction on the matter.

Regardless it seems you'll be heading home, luckily the time it took to resolve the job and recuperate means you only had to wait a day for the car to return and you head back that day.
__________

[Time to see how the Infiltration team handled their job]

3 Anons give me 1d100

Infiltration Team infiltrate's Gecko
Average Stealth Check DV 70
In for the Long Haul +17

Roll under 87

Critical Failure: Who the hell gave those Ghouls NVGs?! (Infiltration team is driven out of Gecko, no relevant information gained, subsequent attempts to infiltrate are now Challenging)
0 Successes: This is by far the worst luck I've seen since I played craps (Infiltration Team is driven out of gecko, no relevant information gained)
1 Success: Looks like the NCR are wooing those ghouls something fierce (Infiltration team discovers status of Geckos Relationship with the NCR)
2 Successes: Power plant ain't running as well as it could be that's for sure (Infiltration team confirms status of Gecko's reactor as well as 1 success results)
3 Successes: Well well well, what do we have here? (Infiltration team plants a false flag against the NCR, including information gained, Relations with the NCR sour slightly)
Critical Success: You know, sometimes you just gotta roll the dice. (Infiltration team's false flag gets the NCR diplomats kicked out of Gecko, including all other information gained)
>>
>>5207888
>What if we get caught?
If able, bullshit our way out. If that does work, stealth kill. If that draws more attention, fight our way out. What do YOU think we should do if we vort caught in general?

>Will we just try it on another terminal?
If we're locked out of the first terminal and not caught yet, than we'll try that.

>Try my method?
IMO it seems needlessly dangerous. You'd have to enter the base, then enter the building with the data banks. We would be going further into Navarro. At least with accessing the data banks remotely we wont be so deep within enemy territory to make exfiltration an RNG nightmare.
>roll to enter the military base
>roll hackerman bullshit
>now roll to leave with the data

or your idea of going directly to the data banks
>roll to enter the base
>now roll to enter the building holding the databanks
>roll hackz
>roll to leave building un noticed
>now roll to leave base
It might be me but it feels like going there would be hard. Rosaline is the one that could get inside, but lacks the tech knowledge to know what to do when in there. Jacob on the other hand only needs the bare minimum of stealth to enter the base, then use his expertise to get the data.
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>>5207914
Note when it says including information gained, that's me saying the results of 1 and 2 successes as well.
>>
Rolled 36 (1d100)

>>5207914
>>
Rolled 74 (1d100)

>>5207914
watch it be a nat 100
>>
Rolled 53 (1d100)

>>5207914
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>>5207908
>We do the same method as last time but using raiders as fodder to draw guards away for a time to make infiltration and hacking easier. For additional prep work, we can try figuring out the who and how the food is slipped inside so we can replace them with poor or expired quality foods. Soldiers with stomach problems will leave their shifts more frequently and be more distracted.
So we convince raiders to attack a military base? Or is it a civilian target and then we tell the soldiers about it? We then also need to sneak into their food supply, poison it, sneak out and then do the rest of the plan.

>From there we'll see where things go. No reason a plan cant be simple.
I don't think your plan is that simple

>>5207917
>IMO it seems needlessly dangerous. You'd have to enter the base, then enter the building with the data banks. We would be going further into Navarro. At least with accessing the data banks remotely we wont be so deep within enemy territory to make exfiltration an RNG nightmare.
Your forgot you own raider and food poisoning idea. Plus, you will have to infiltrate the base multiple times to get everything so that multiplies the number of times we will have to roll which is why I suggested the hardware idea. It was to lower the total amount of rolls but at the cost of an increased risk.
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My recollection is that many of the robots were robo-brains and harnessed the powers of a living mind. Also, instead of aiming for the eyes you'd aim for the CPU and make them go berserk. So the pre-war era had chips and didn't do everything reel to reel. As was said, maybe the data was intentionally stored in a way that made it harder to steal or access remotely. That or some general didn't want to learn a new systems, so he forced the military to keep using the same technology that he learned on when he was young.
>>
We do know that the transistor was invented very late, meaning that the good vacuum had years and years to be improved and perfected. Only because there wasn't the one (1) thing chips use the most it doesn't mean there were no other alternatives.

What I am saying is that it is possible they made very very very very good magnetic tapes and floppys and what happened was a horizontal development between transistors and other forms of computing.

And the storage of information doesn't have to do much with transistors, thinking of the servers we want to snatch.
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>>5207999
Nice poster.
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>>5207657
You obviously know jack shit about ideology and history.

First, it wasn't just about morality of slavery, but the economics as well. Many in the North didn't want slavery abolished, they just didn't want to lose their paying job to slavery. Second was the issue of State rights, and whether the Federal government had the authority to pose it's will on the government. You really think a bunch of poor Rednecks would die to protect slavery? Southerners often joined the army outta love for their State instead of the Federal authorities, best exemplified by General Lee fighting for Virginia, whether Virgina stayed in the Union or not. Third, to think family values is fascist and authoritarian is laughable, oftentimes Youth Leagues were told to rat on their parents if they were 'nationalistic' enough, which would get them killed by the Gestapo. You pretend to know what you're talking about, but reality is more complex than the US propaganda would make it seems. I'm not saying to let the plague happen, I'm just saying that tearing apart the family is a no-go for me.
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>>5207680
Morality is always subjective. Oftentimes, an attack on family perpetuated by evil (such as the commies or fascists) for the sake of their own power. It's a dangerous game that ruins people's lives over ideology they think is right, but then in praxis commits greater evils and atrocities down the line.
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(POSIEDON ENERGY ATOMIC POWERPLANT NO. 5, NORTHWEST COMMONWEALTH, SEPTEMBER 2271)
(MISSION PARAMETERS: INFILITRATE GECKO, AND ASCERTAIN THE STATUS OF THE GHOULS AND THEIR POWER PLANT)
(MISSION RESULTS: SUCCESS, ALL RELAVENT DATA POINTS EXTRACTED, RELATIONS BETWEEN ROGUE STATES DAMAGED)
(RECOMMENDED ACTIONS.... COMPUTING... EXTERMINATE GHOUL POPULATION, CONTINUE FALSE FLAG ATTACKS, SEIZE REACTOR)


Gerald and his boys hadn't gone on a short term operation like this in a long while, but it's a good rust dusting operation. After all ghoul's ain't nearly as scary or determined as the Bishop's.

He gathered the group together, his best shots would stick back a ways in power armor, ready to radio in the Combat Vets while he and the others got some civilian clothing, a bucket of rad-x and radaway and got close to the city, engaging with the ghouls under the guise that they were small time merchants and mechanics.

The ghouls were affable folk, but Gerald wasn't about to start getting chummy with the corpses beyond what he needed to do. What he did learn in his time at Gecko was that the NCR had become their foremost trade partner shipping Uranium to the power plant, in return for whatever goods the ghouls could give in return, it was a pretty one sided trade deal in favor of the Ghouls and that's what got Gerald's attention more than anything else.

If what he knew about Vault city was true, then he suspected this was all part of some grand diplomacy play, where they keep Gecko running in hopes that Vault City either slips up with their relations with it, or they run out of alternatives. With the NCR being the only suppliers of Uranium it would inexorably tie Vault City to the NCR via the Uranium Trade. That's a pretty nasty catch 22.

He also noted in his report that the Ghouls had attempted to optimize the reactor before, get more power per uranium rod as it were, but their last chance at that was just about 30 years ago when the chosen one had fixed their reactor leak. For whatever reason he decided not to ease the tension between Vault City and Gecko. That man was either playing the longest game ever, or really just didn't care, and Gerald didn't know which it was.

None the less, he was able to do something about the matter, if only to delay the inevitable warming of relations between the NCR and the Ghouls, and start a small false flag operation where in he framed the NCR for some aggressive assaults on some ghouls, made it look like the diplomats soldiers had decided they didn't like the ghouls.

Cause a bit of a diplomatic incident, but there wasn't much Gecko could really do about it, as Broken Hill was mined out of Uranium, and the NCR were the only ones capable of supplying it now.

Still all and all as successful as the operation could have been.

____________
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Arriving back at home you're immediately pulled to the side by your father, mother, and Captain Nelson. Senator Rockefeller decides to come along for the ride.

You're not told exactly what's going, but you have a suspicion that it's regarding Granite. That suspicion is confirmed not long after as you're presented with a rather beaten and battered man restrained in what appear to be stocks.
Your father nods at him then at you, "You managed to capture one of the worst traitors to America, for that Son I can safely say I'm incredibly proud, that you sent him here was just the icing on the cake." He looked supremely pleased.

Granite on the other hand was bleeding from his face and could barely see out of his swollen eyes, still managed to spit at the statement said about him, though it was mostly blood, "Ain't nothing changed." was all he said.
Frankly it was impressive as you figured the mans jaw had been broken by the looks of it.

Your mother just scowls at the man, "We had a long discussion about what to do with him while you were away, but we ultimately decided that since you're the one that beat him, and brought him before us, you'd get the honor of executing the traitor."

You heart skipped a beat at that.
Just straight to execution?
You took a breath, "But what about a trial?"

Your mother laughed, "Oh son, Traitors like this don't get trials, they get bullets. Though I have to commend you on keeping him alive enough for the rest of the cell to witness this it'll be a great boost to morale seeing what happens to traitors."

Your father just shook his head, "I have to agree, we don't exactly have the resources or time to give him anything resembling a trial, besides everyone here already knows his guilt, he aided and abetted the greatest disaster to the Enclave Cause ever, he helped blow up the Poseidon oil rig, he's quite literally accomplice to the assassination of a President. Really all it'd be is delaying the inevitable."

You bit down hard on your teeth.
Well Ford what do you say?
>"Even Still, its a matter of principal, we're more than just some rag tag band that executes on a whim, no matter how true that whim is, we're what's left of America, he should be given a trial."
>Remain silent and take in the scene before you, "Are you sure? Traitor or no he was Enclave, and at that an American."
>Lower your head in resignation and take the gun, though it makes your stomach sick.
>Write in
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>>5207777
We could just outright bribe the NCR officers/officials for a crack at those file through the Van Graphs. Provides covert cover and an open backdoor for us to exploit.
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>>5208145
>"Even Still, its a matter of principal, we're more than just some rag tag band that executes on a whim, no matter how true that whim is, we're what's left of America, he should be given a trial."
Stick to the principles
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>>5207999
Based art poster fren

>>5208175
We should run all these plans through our people. These are all good ideas.

>>5208145
>"Even Still, its a matter of principal, we're more than just some rag tag band that executes on a whim, no matter how true that whim is, we're what's left of America, he should be given a trial."
We're all absolutely going to kill him, but its the principal that matters.
>>
>>5208145
>"Even Still, its a matter of principal, we're more than just some rag tag band that executes on a whim, no matter how true that whim is, we're what's left of America, he should be given a trial."
>Are we America or do we act just like the savages of the waste?
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>>5208145
>"Even Still, its a matter of principal, we're more than just some rag tag band that executes on a whim, no matter how true that whim is, we're what's left of America, he should be given a trial."
>>
>>5208145
>>"Even Still, its a matter of principal, we're more than just some rag tag band that executes on a whim, no matter how true that whim is, we're what's left of America, he should be given a trial."


I knew it they want to just kill him without a trial, dogmatic to the end.
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>>5208145
>>Lower your head in resignation and take the gun, though it makes your stomach sick.

A matter of principal? I don't remember us being in highschool! This is the goddamn enclave son, and you better grow some pubes and realize that leadership is way dirtier than what you think. Now grease your 5.56 and what is done is done
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>>5208145
>Remain silent and take in the scene before you, "Are you sure? Traitor or no he was Enclave, and at that an American."
>>
>>5208204
>t. wastelander
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>>5208145
Also, did you get any useful information outta him? The NCR's posterboy must have something useful on him.
>>
>>5208131
>>5208135
All this blathering about accessory issues and neither you nor him nor the other guy have maintained focus on the crux of the issue which is:

How far should you go in maitaining a familial relationship? If a family member demanded something of you and staked your relationship with them on it, when do you say no? Theft? Robbery? Rape? Torture? Murder? Genocide? What is the limit?

That is the heart of the matter, all the other topics are extraneous.

>>5208145
>"Even Still, its a matter of principal, we're more than just some rag tag band that executes on a whim, no matter how true that whim is, we're what's left of America, he should be given a trial."
Wonder if that namefag will come up with something amazingly patriotic again.
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>>5208131
>First, it wasn't just about morality of slavery, but the economics as well. Many in the North didn't want slavery abolished, they just didn't want to lose their paying job to slavery.

The souths economy was slavery trying to pretend a core pillar of the war wasn't over slavery is a lie.


>Second was the issue of State rights, and whether the Federal government had the authority to pose its will on the government.

The southern states right to keep and own slaves they even codified slavery into the southern Constitution.

>You really think a bunch of poor Rednecks would die to protect slavery?

as said above they viewed slavery as their right so they did.

>Southerners often joined the army outta love for their State instead of the Federal authorities, best exemplified by General Lee fighting for Virginia, whether Virgina stayed in the Union or not.

yeah, they loved there state and the rights it afforded them which at the heart of it was slavery.


>Third, to think family values is fascist and authoritarian is laughable, oftentimes Youth Leagues were told to rat on their parents if they were 'nationalistic' enough, which would get them killed by the Gestapo.

what your talking about isn't family value if your family is asking you to do something evil you should refuse family or not, like aiding in the genocide of "subhuman" any "family" that would force you into such a compromised position isn't a real family. what ford was born into it more akin to a cult.

>You pretend to know what you're talking about, but reality is more complex than the US propaganda would make it seems.

and who died and make you the supreme authority on America you cunt?

>I'm not saying to let the plague happen, I'm just saying that tearing apart the family is a no-go for me.

and if the only way to stop it is to tear the family apart what then do you think we should stand by and allow it to happen even though Ford has come to the realization that the mutants are capable of becoming American? if so then you really are a dogmatic bootlicker.

>Morality is always subjective. Oftentimes, an attack on family perpetuated by evil (such as the commies or fascists) for the sake of their own power. It's a dangerous game that ruins people's lives over ideology they think is right, but then in praxis commits greater evils and atrocities down the line.

Moral relativism is a liberal/leftist bullshit talking point there are things that are objectively evil and things that are objectively good to pretend any different is the height of stupidity and liberal naivety
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>>5208214
absolutely based there is a line in the sands that I will not cross once you hit that line and if you try to force me past it blood or not you are dead to me.
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>>5208217
Oh boy, the insults have come out. Is it time for yet another internet slapfight?
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>>5208222
I addressed his points with counter-evidence of my own what insults are you talking about anon
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>>5208225
>and who died and make you the supreme authority on America you cunt?
It's only one but it's still an insult.
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>>5208145
>"Even Still, its a matter of principal, we're more than just some rag tag band that executes on a whim, no matter how true that whim is, we're what's left of America, he should be given a trial."

>>5207781
>>5207779
>>5207775
This is true but there is one key missing component that is critical for our future operations. That is transferring the encrypted data into a robot and blowing up the data banks before GTFO. The best in terms of data storage capacity would be a robobrain but we would likely get stuck using a Mr. Gutsy or Assaultron.

Download whatever data we can rip into a robot, destroy what's left, and leave. Robots in Fallout for whatever reason have great data capacity and analysis(especially robobrains) cause Fallout tech is wonky despite how bulky yet powerful the rest of their computer systems are. We simply have to use Robots+pip boys as a vehicle to transfer and transport massive amounts of data from those large Fallout computers.

Once we loot some vaults we will have access to pipboys but they're small and limited. We can however easily modify some bots to improve their stealth and data storage capacity. Truthfully we only need the bots for transport and aid in retreival. This was our mistake the first time we went but now we can afford to properly modify and equip ourselves with a robotic aid to make sure we rip out EVERY piece of data the next time. We don't even need to crack it just copy it and destroy as much as we can before withdrawing.
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>>5208214
>That is the heart of the matter, all the other topics are extraneous.

But I love extraneous topics!

Not being a smart ass, but we're already doing 4 of those 6 things listed, and even then circumstances may lead us astray. It sorta reminds me of the moral questions of WW2, where dropping two nukes on civilians were considered more ethical than the Firebombing campaign the US was already doing to Japan at the time, or a general invasion of the home islands leading to a mass suicidal defense by civilians. The problem wasn't the escalation of violence, the problem was the decision that mass civilian casualties were acceptable if it hastened an end to the conflict.
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>>5208226
with how he is acting anon deserved it, think of it as a description of his attitude, as a passed to a pure insult though if you prefer I suppose he is also being a karen.

but yes I suppose that is an insult
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>>5208231
> but yes I suppose that is an insult
Of course

>>5208230
Look, all im saying is if you're gonna argue about what we should and shouldn't do in this or any other quest and actually have a productive conversation, you need to adress things succinctly. Getting bogged down in other topics goes nowhere, trust me, I've done it and seen it multiple times.

Anyways, I hope somebody learned something from this.
>>
>>5207999
Neat

>>5208145
>>"Even Still, its a matter of principal, we're more than just some rag tag band that executes on a whim, no matter how true that whim is, we're what's left of America, he should be given a trial."
"This is only for principal. We all know he is guilty. I think hear me out, that it would be good for future cases. A return of trials would be better than no trials. When it was the last time we had one ?"
"If nothing else everyone is reminded of the number of crimes he did, before he dies."
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>>5208145

>"Even Still, its a matter of principal, we're more than just some rag tag band that executes on a whim, not matter how true that whim is, we're what's left of America, he should be given a trial."

He was an Enclave soldier, presumably he's still a citizen. Since he is safely in our custody, he should be told what his crimes are, and given the chance to speak in his own defense. Then be judged by his peers (us).
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>>5208217
>south ecconomy
I wasn't saying slavery wasn't a big issue, I'm saying slavery wasn't the only issue that caused the South to sperg out, Mr. Stawman.

>state rights
Yes it was, and you forget that America was a project of decentralization of power, with the Federal gov being a necessary evil the founders found necessary to keep the US functioning as a united entity against foreign powers. The argument of the borders between State and Federal right was alive and well into the civil conflict.

>Redneck
Dismissing that they were fighting on behalf of their States doesn't make that point invalid.

>yeah, they loved there state and the rights it afforded them which at the heart of it was slavery.
Have you considered that it was State patriotism instead that motivated them?

>morality
The problem is that your arguing with subjective Western standards and bias, the majority of other cultures around the world thinks the others are subhuman in some shape or form. Getting into a debate over a complex and nuanced subject as subjective cultural morality is more something for Pol or the like, not Qst.

>and who died and make you the supreme authority on America you cunt?
Nobody, but I clearly know more about this subject than your bitch-ass can comprehend. Try reading a book that delves deeper into the nuances of a subject than regurgitating popular political positions and slogans you brainlet.

>and if the only way to stop it is to tear the family apart
You're missing the point that you shouldn't tear apart your family over politics. You're the one dogmatically parroting the idea that politics should come before family.

>Moral relativism is a liberal/leftist bullshit talking point
I wholeheartedly agree, and they use it as an excuse to disgrace themselves and justify they're ignorance and decadence, but that doesn't make the opposite true, of their being only one moral authority all should obey unquestionably. It's a nuisanced, complex subject that I won't get into right here, but suffice to say, most moral conflicts are often a conflict over moral ascetics than anything objective.
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>>5208261
"I know our vengeance is righteous, even so, I believe we deserve more than to act like those savages or corrupted people of the wastelands. I don't want us to act like them."
"Father, Mother. I believe that the return of an american tradition like a trial, combined with the proper death given to the traitor would reinforce morale further."
"Not only a blackguard would be put to justice, but a tradition of america would return. We would be more like our ancestors, another step in the direction for restore our nation and values."


>>5208268
I love this images
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>>5208231
Bro, stop acting like a triggered Karen justified in your personal attacks.

>>5208251
I can see the reason in that, it's probably my inexperience with being succinct that gunks up the conversation. Oftentimes I find that it's the uninformed worldview I have more of a problem with, and that's coming from only a slightly better informed 4-chaner. Sorry for stinking up the thread.
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>>5208278
Ok Karen

>>5208268
good stuff man, love the propoganda
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>>5208278
>Bro, stop acting like a triggered Karen justified in your personal attacks.
I know that you know that you aren't helping with this.

>Oftentimes I find that it's the uninformed worldview I have more of a problem with
And you think you'll be able to persuade him about that?

>>5208280
>Ok Karen
Alright, if you're actually gonna have the internet slap fight then come up with something funnier. Both of you.

>>5208268
These posters are always a treat.
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>>5208287
>These posters are always a treat.

yeah our drawfag is honestly a gem, I am loving his work, can't wait to see what he comes up with next his anon decides to continue with it.

>Alright, if you're actually gonna have the internet slap fight then come up with something funnier. Both of you.

nah that was my parting shot getting into pointless arguments on 4 chan was fun at one time but now all these years later it's just tiring. Besides that anon isn't going to listen to what I have to say on it he's already made up his mind.
>>
I really hope we can make our argument for having the trial nice. Is honestly something important and a tradition. And it makes us different from the wasteland.

Beyond that, the trial is going to be a description ? Or a post ? While a nice thing for the story, i don't see having it a different end. Beyond immediate execution, or trial and execution.

Granite can t really deny what he did against the Enclave. And honestly our community doesn't have even one high command member, so anyone he would be against wouldn't be here to point the finger. Unless he says that all adults are involved and guilty, and that we should punish them. Which would be absurd in our situation, the Remnants have payed enough for the sins of the enclave. They are few and alone, surrounded
by enemies and in need of a secure home
He also kept hunting our people with his company.
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>>5208297
>i don't see having it a different end. Beyond immediate execution, or trial and execution.
Even if the end is the same, the means by which we got there are still important. What im wondering is the specifics of those means. Who's going to be the judge? The defense? The prosecutor? The jury? What about all the procedure in regards to evidence and testimony? Will there be appeals after the trial?

And those are just what came from the top of my head and I know jack about law, let alone american law.
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>>5208301
Well i agree.
I am not sure how we do those specifics. And there is not evidence or testimony laying around. Beside some stuff like when the remnants needed to flee or the service of Granite to the enclave as a soldier and to NCR as a mercenary.

Keeping every document is not a priority when your foes try to exterminate you, to the last men, women and child.
We also don"t have really much money or even a building for do this properly.
We will have to work with what we have, the exodus to the divide needs all the resources we can gather.
At the very least is a return of trials.
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>>5208145
>"Even Still, its a matter of principal, we're more than just some rag tag band that executes on a whim, no matter how true that whim is, we're what's left of America, he should be given a trial."
>"Do I need to repeat the Sixth Amendment? Every man deserves a public trial without delay, a right to a lawyer, a right to know who your accusers are...and the closest thing to an impartial jury. Even if it's an open and shut case, even if everyone agrees to execute him, a man deserves some sort of defense.

He deserves something, at least. Every American deserves these rights, and even if he's a traitor, he deserves this much at least. Don't take this as a defense on him as a person, I have no ill will towards punishing someone who deserves it.

But if we do not give these universal, constitutional rights to even the worst of Americans, then what is the purpose of those rights if they are not applied to everyone? They are meant to be a standing stone to the American foundation. Without it, we may as well be a pale imitation of what America is supposed to stand for. And do we exactly want to be the NCR here?"
>>
This is a fallout quest alright
>>
>>5208330
>And there is not evidence or testimony laying around.
Imagine the shitstorm if Granite is acquitted due to lack of evidence.
>>
>>5208145
>"Even Still, its a matter of principal, we're more than just some rag tag band that executes on a whim, no matter how true that whim is, we're what's left of America, he should be given a trial."
>>
>>5208222
>>5208221
Man I missed you guys.

>>5208145
In fallout 3, and enclave Family received a call from Presedent Eden at Raven rock and traveled from the west to east coast I think. When will we recieve Edens call?
>>
>>5208268
You can tell a quest is popular if it has art fags.
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>>5208287
>I know that you know that you aren't helping with this.
Wait, we ain't on 4-chan? Oh shit, muh socal credit score went down!

>And you think you'll be able to persuade him about that?
No, in all honesty we're probably two people hyped up on tism about our worldviews. You could argue it's merely a difference of opinion, but I think it has more to do with how we actually perceive and interpret the world around us than a mere disagreement, because what would be the point in sperging out if we simply thought it was a matter of opinion and not the truths we hold dear?

>>5208292
We both already made up our minds, the problem is our tism clouding our objectivity and the lack of shared prerequisite information for us to make an informed opinion on the matter. I enjoy detailed history, in-depth talks about morality and ideology, and a diversity of opinion. You probably enjoy something entirely different, and this doesn't include the biases of our own sources of information as well. Hence why I think it's more of a conflict of worldviews than it is a simple disagreement of opinion.
>>
>"Even Still, its a matter of principal, we're more than just some rag tag band that executes on a whim, no matter how true that whim is, we're what's left of America, he should be given a trial."
Wins

Get the Dead man his due process.

3 anons roll me 1d100

Brutal Speech Check DV 30
TRAITOR'S MUST BLEED -20
Appropriate Arguments +20
!Thomas Rockefeller Aids you! +7
The Fortunate Son +1 Success

Crit Fail: "Son... I order you to put a bullet in that mans head right now."
0 Successes: "I appreciate the sentiment, when we're in a better position we can hold one post homously, until then..." [not possible due to +1 success]
1 Success: "Fine, fine, you make a fair enough point, but we do it here and now." (You hold an impromptu kangaroo court to judge Granite)
2 Successes: "Alright we'll do it your way, and since you're so adamant about due process, you can be the state appointed defense." (You will hold court tomorrow, you have been assigned as Granite's defense)
3 Successes: "Very well then, you're right. It will take a few days to get what's necessary though." (You will hold court in 1 weeks time, Granite will have the chance to request his defense, and if none is obtained will have one appointed to him)
Crit Success: [Not possible, he is the arch traitor]
>>
>>5208414
>Wait, we ain't on 4-chan? Oh shit, muh socal credit score went down!
No, you're on 4chan just not on right board. This is /qst/, the collaborative storytelling board. You want /pol/, that's the place you should go if you want to endlessly and smugly argue about your worldview.
>>
>>5208441
Woops Final DV 37
roll under 37 anons
>>
Rolled 80 (1d100)

>>5208441
Man that's a bad check.
>>
Rolled 19 (1d100)

>>5208441
>>
Rolled 56 (1d100)

>>5208441
>>
2 Successes: "Alright we'll do it your way, and since you're so adamant about due process, you can be the state appointed defense." (You will hold court tomorrow, you have been assigned as Granite's defense)

Writing
Get your attorney hats on anons, you're the defense.
>>
>>5208442
I'm an American, and I believe in my freedom to say whatever half-assed opinion I have wherever I goddamn please. It's the only American thing to do.
>>
>>5208495
Oh shit lads, here we go. Rutherford Jefferson-Jackson IV: Ace Attorney
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3H2zgtu9X0
>>
"Justice is not blind. I am her eyes" - Frank Horrigan, probably
>>
Oh shit boy we are gonna get to put out money where our mouth is, and stand for American Ideals
>>
>>5208495
in what rolls there are two success
>>
>>5208588
You got +1 from Thomas Using his trait to help.
you only rolled 1 success.
So 1+1=2
>>
Update for Character Sheet

Pragmatic Prejudice Becomes Jeffersonian Patriotism:
Going beyond the dogma you were born into you've come to terms with the fact that the only thing that your goal is to restore America,
Mutants or pure blooded humans it doesn't matter, you will see that done.
(+10 to all combat checks made against any member of a hostile faction, +5 to all Leadership checks, -5 to speech checks made against any member of a hostile faction, unless they're a veteran/elite unit)

Fight the Power Becomes Revolt against the Aristocracy:
The false democracy and aristocratic tendancies of Wasteland governance will come to an end, and it will be a violent one.
(+15 to all combat checks made against Wastelander Factions, -5 to all non intimidation speech checks with them, does not apply to veteran/elite units)

You lose Sneering Imperialist

Living Anatomy description update - You've a keen eye, and your understanding of biology means you know just where to target, so long as it looks human that is. (+5 to medicine checks for humanoids, +5 to all combat checks made against humanoids)
>>
>>5208591
aaah, fortunate son. Yes yes
>>
>>5208592
After doing the Gecko and Vault Cuty jobs, in addition to this trial, will we have done enough to level up a bit?
>>
>>5208592
Would it be possible to make a deal with Granite? Give him a last meal, send someone a message or deliver a family heirloom in his stead, in exchange for hin telling us some secrets?
>>
>>5208592
I'm not sure how the fuck we are gonna do this court case justice.
>>
>>5208626
Dude, this is a level up. Granted, I expect our free time to help gain equipment or traits, both for us and our teammates. I'm wondering if we can delegate some on our buddies just to get more done.

>>5208633
GL with that.

>>5208643
He ain't gonna get outta this, it's going to be a mix of reasonable doubt, pleading the fifth, and not adhering to unlawful or unethical orders in a military court, unless Granite, Tom, or anons have a better play in mind. By the way, we are poaching Thomas Rockefeller for our defense team. Not only is it a smart move for the defense, but a good bonding opportunity for us both, to cement our relationship. Rose could be our investigator, if we need one. I'd like to bond with her as well.
>>
>>5208667
Under the constitutional law of treason, any person who is potentially subject to an American treason prosecution must be tried in a civilian court and may not be detained by the military as an enemy combatant or subjected to military tribunals.

So it won't be military court de jure, though it's gonna be run like one regardless.
>>
We need to try out Honest best to win this court case no throwing we are after all serious about the country and Constitution, I think our best moves are to get Thomas Rockefeller on our side and get granite to give us his side of the story fully, then brainstorm up a legal defense, we have 24 hours so no sleep will be had
>>
You take a deep breath and look your father in the eyes, "Even still, it's a matter of principal, we're above just wanton executions, no matter how deserving they are or irrefutable their guilt is. We're all that's left of America, we need to seize this opportunity to reinforce out traditions not discard them."

Your Father closes his eyes with a sigh and your mother is just shaking her head. You grit your teeth, "Whether you like it or not, he was an Enclave soldier, by definition that makes him an American Citizen, in that regard he has rights under the 6th amendment of the constitution, He deserves a public trial, the right to a lawyer, to confront his accusers and as close to an impartial jury as is possible."

Your Father opens his eyes again, staring right back at you, you know he doesn't care for a thing you just said, he'd rather just be done with the affair and have the man put down right here and now, you can see it in his eyes, in his body language. Yet there's also a sense of conflict, and maybe just maybe a hint of pride.

Your mother on the other hand is fuming, "Last I checked." she said, "We were still under emergency powers, this is ostensibly a military tribunal, we're under no obligation to do anything here. Drop this right now, and do as you were told."

Your father eyes her for a moment, about to say something when from the peanut gallery Thomas speaks up stepping forwards, "Ford is right. We can't debase ourselves like this, military tribunal or not, emergency powers or not, it's patently unamerican and goes against the core of our values to hold an execution without trial!"

The Senator grabs him by the arm, "Shut your mouth boy, no one gave you permiss-" he pulls his arm away, "You know I'm right! Everyone of you knows I'm right, and everyone of you especially knows that Ford is Right!" he was breathing heavily and shaking.

The Senator for his part looks utterly furious like his about to hit him at this very moment, but the tension in the air is broken when Nelson speaks up, "I agree with them, we all hate his guts, and it may ultimately just be for posterities sake, but we might as well."

Your mother is about to start a completely different shouting match when your father holds up his hands, "Very well then. We'll do it your way Son. Treason is to be tried in civilian court, we're limited on legal expertise, and I doubt anyone here has passed the BAR, so we'll make do. I appoint you as the states defense Rutherford, Thomas feel free to be his aid in this matter. As for the prosecution, Senator Rockefeller I appoint you to be it. The rest of us will draw lots on who will be in the Jury, I'll will be Judge. You have one day to prepare your opening statements. You're all dismissed."

There's a silence in the air as nobody moves and your father just gets irritated, "I said dismissed!" and the crowd slowly disperses.

[continue]
>>
You breath a sigh of relief, looking over to Thomas, "You didn't need to do that."
He shakes his head, "It's not about needing to, you were right, someone had to say something." the man looks like he's about to collapse onto his knees.

You pat his back, "Thank you." he just nods heading over to a nearby bench practically collapsing onto it.

Senator Rockefeller had hung back as well, waiting for the exchange to be over, "You've some nerve boy. I respect that, but all you've done is subject us all to a farce. I suppose I'll see you in court tomorrow." he says in a dry tone. He looks over at Thomas his eyes cold before walking away.

You walk over to Granite, "Well, it would seem somethings have changed no?"

He coughs, "It'll be a kangaroo court, you're not even a constitutionally valid lawyer kid."

You just look at him, "So what do you want to plead."

He spits out some blood as he rolls his jaw, "Not Guilty."

Somehow you're not surprised by that, "Alright then. I don't agree with it, I'd think it'd be better to plea Guilty and make this as smooth as possible, but I'll do what I can if that's what your plea is going to be."

He looks up swollen eyed and says it again, "Not. Guilty."

You just shake your head, "Alright, we'll do this the hard way then, not guilty it is."

What will you do?
>Gather Granite's testimony
>Recruit someone to your defense team (Who?)
>Request the Prosecutions evidence
>Gather evidence (Research the sequence of events leading up to the oil rig)
>Petition for an extension [Impossible difficulty speech check, pass or fail check]
>Write in
>>
>>5208710
>>Gather Granite's testimony
>Gather evidence (Research the sequence of events leading up to the oil rig)
>Request the Prosecutions evidence

fuck sleep we have a duty as an American to give this our all, do these in this order
>>
I have serious doubts that anyone else will want to or be willing to be on our legal team.
>>
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>>5208718
>Gather Granite's Testimony
(honestly I thought that he was going to defend himself, but OK). So what's your story punk? Got anything you want to say to the Enclave?

>Recruit someone to your defense team
Thomas Rockefeller

>Request the Prosecutions evidence
Because we love history

>Request the Prosecution's list of charges
So that we know what we are defending against

>Read a fucking book
Look up the elements of the charges the Rockefeller Sr. is using and see if we can think up a legitimate defense. Discuss with Granite and defense team if we find anything.

> Keep the drinking down to, say, 6 shots maximum tonight. Need to stay sharp.

>>5208720

What about young Mr. T. Rockefeller? He seems like the kind of pinko bleeding heart that would jump at the opportunity to assist the defense.

For the record, so long as Granite gets the opportunity to tell his side of the story, that's justice enough for me.
>>
>>5208710
>Recruit someone to your defense team (Thomas and Rose)
>Gather Granite's testimony
>Request the Prosecutions evidence
>Gather evidence (Research the sequence of events leading up to the oil rig)
>>
>>5208718
>>Recruit someone to your defense team
>Thomas Rockefeller
add this to my action

>>5208758
good point on Thomas
>>
>>5208718
supporting
>>
>>5208710
I really want to stay here and try to help but sleep calls. I'll throw my support behind this >>5208758, leave you with some more music
https://youtube.com/watch?v=9zZHIDGghP8
And wish you all good luck!
>>
Vote will remain open until I wake up tomorrow.
Until then Good Night America, this is Warden signing off.
>>
>>5208710
>Gather Granite's testimony
>Recruit someone to your defense team (Rockefeller)
>Request the Prosecutions evidence
>Gather evidence (Research the sequence of events leading up to the oil rig)
Honestly, I'll admit, Granite is going to die. This is less of a trial and moreso us giving him a moment to explain himself before an execution.

We might as well make his last words right, though.
>>
>>5208758
>Support
>>
>>5208758
Support well done
Granite is being a pain in the butt.

I am not sure how he can explain that he isn't but sure. Like Granite you wheren t exactly saving the Enclave so far lmao. And he isn't even a member anymore since he became a merc.
If nothing else this might make some light on a dark history we don't know, though I ll be honest this kind of documents are likely to be few and damaged. We where all escaping from our death before becoming a cell.
Not to mention we don't have any high command member, which would limit by a lot what we actually know.

He still isn't getting out of here, if he isn't guilty (which will be unlikely). Or sending messages outside. While a trial is an american tradition, the Remnants still risk to be massacred or hunted if found so we need to keep secrecy. Beside we killed his entire squad of fellow traitors, so he certainly doesn't love us or our little community.
>>
We will need to spend some social time with our family soon. The mission did go very well so we should talk of it, it should make them happy to hear it. We could even talk of what we did eat, people found and so on. That would be an observation of Vault City, and it would be interesting to hear.
We should probably mention we found a man that claimed to have pass the divide. We will need to verify those claims, but having a guide would be really useful. If what he says is true.
>>
>>5209061
+1
>>
[Good Morning America!]

>Gather Granite's testimony
>Gather evidence (Research the sequence of events leading up to the oil rig)
>Request the Prosecutions evidence
>Request the Prosecution's list of charges
>Recruit someone to your defense team (Thomas Rockefeller)
>Read a fucking book
> Keep the drinking down to, say, 6 shots maximum tonight. Need to stay sharp.

Wins

Ford has no doubts in his mind that Granite will die after this trial, after all it's basically a formality that he barely got passed.
For Granite's part he's just playing along because A. it means he gets to live longer and B. Gets to be a thorn in the side of his inevitable killers for another day.

Writing
>>
>>5209098
I would be only interested in
>Gather evidence (Research the sequence of events leading up to the oil rig)
so lil' protag learns more about the whathapps
>>
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You set to your work, might as well start with the most important part and the quickest to get since you were there to begin with. First you grabbed a chair from one of the buildings and sat it down in front of Granite's Stockade.

You then sat in it, "Tell me your side of the story Granite."

The beaten man laughed, "Alright sure, it'll be the first piece of genuine Enclave history you'll ever hear. Let's start from the top, I was Sargent Alexander Granite of the Enclave Control Company, I commanded a squad of 4 soldiers that acted as the perimeter patrol for Enclave territory. We had been assigned Special Agent Frank Horrigan to deploy with us in the year of 2241, what an absolute monster of a man, Think a Super Mutant, then think bigger, meaner and in power armor with a special crafted plasma canon strapped to their arm. Think something that could literally tear a Deathclaw in half and not break a sweat, think of the most powerful terrifying force and double it. That. Was Frank Fucking Horrigan." his voice was measured despite his injuries as he retold his life story from the year 2241.

He chewed the side of his mouth for a few moments while thinking, "I can't begin to tell you the number of Wastelanders and monstrosities we killed while out on patrol, they were given 1 warning, that they were in violation of Protocol 312, 'Any Illegal Aliens trespassing in Enclave Territory were to be eliminated' sometimes we didn't even give them a warning, usually that was when Horrigan decided he didn't like them. Mostly because that beast was literally uncontrollable by anyone that wasn't the God Damned President of the United States. No I served with distinction until the Control Company was recalled to Poseidon energy rig."

He sighed, "You want to know why we were recalled? We were the last line of defense against that Tribal. One. Tribal and a motley army of companions." he chuckled, "What a fucking menagerie of bullshit. He had a robot dog, a super mutant, and several other wastelanders with him, everyone that could be decked out in power armor was, they were all carrying the heaviest weaponry that they could physically. The Super Mutant, his name was Marcus, big fucker, smart too, I'd watch out for him."

He shakes his head, "They'd torn through the oil rig by the time we got there, so Horrigan in his infinite wisdom the big fucking brute, decided, 'This muttie will die here, end of the line.' and by all means I wasn't about to argue with the man even though it'd likely mean my own death when the rig blew up at the time. You want to know the truth kid? I was tired. I was tired of all the killing." his head slumps, "I'd spent my whole life doing nothing but killing in the name of some glorious purpose, of fighting to see America pure again." he looked up right at you, "And my reward for that? I was gonna die at the hands of some hick ass mutant, American made or from the wasteland."

[continue]
>>
He spit on the ground, "So when the Chosen one didn't immediately shoot me in the head I decided that we'd have a little chat. Thought I'd warn him about Horrigan, and just consign myself to dying on the oil rig... but I couldn't, the more he talked the more I realized that it didn't have to be that way. So I talked with my squad and we all agreed, if we were going to die it'd be on our own terms. We hated Horrigan, he was a fucking monster, the greatest embodiment of Enclave Hypocrisy. No love lost we joined the Chosen one to escape certain death, just to face almost certain death fighting him."

He looked away, "It was almost 10 to 1, it still wasn't a fair fight. That monster floored almost all of us, and yet the Chosen One continued fighting on. I don't know what the hell he was made of but he fought that beast 1 on 1 while the rest of us were on the ground nearly dead. It was a spectacle to behold. Hot plasma was flying all over as the clock ticked down announcing our doom, and yet he managed to land a killing blow. Horrigan's body couldn't handle the trauma, He blew up in half, the torso still crawling towards the Chosen One at the end."

He shook his head, "I'll give him this, if there was one thing the Frank Horrigan was, it was Loyal. 'Semper Fi'. was the last thing to come out of that things mouth. Chosen one hit us all with some med-x and dragged a few of us out onto a tanker. We watched in awe as the Oil Rig blew up. You want to know the fuck of it. Enclave was on the verge of deploying Curling-13, it'd passed trials, was successfully vaccinated and everything. If he'd been one day late, the whole wasteland would be nothing but corpses."

he laughed, "Empire of Ashes. I went on to get tried by the NCR as a war criminal, but the Chosen One had me exonerated under the conditions that I'd lend my expertise to the NCR. So I did. Found a Wife beautiful lady, had a kid, I've got Grand kids boy. You know how fucked up this is? How many of those wastelanders I wasted just to end up marrying one and have kids? Too good for me. I might die, but at least my legacy won't be one of death and destruction. I built a family, I saved lives, I fought for something, that's more than I can say anyone here has done. You're a cult not a family, a cult to something that should have stayed dead, but here we are."

You sat there do your best not to punch him in the face for his last comments, and take a deep breath, "Is that all you have to say?"

He laughed, "Yeah kid, that's all I have to say, the cold hard truth, I ain't guilty of Treason because there was no USA government to commit treason against, Enclave ain't legitimate boy."

You punched him that time, and all he did was laugh.

You walked away you feel like if you spent any longer with him you'd lose your temper and something unfortunate might happen.

[continue]
>>
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Walking over to Thomas who was still sitting on the bench you sit down beside him, "So you want to help me put my money where my mouth is?" he just laughed still composing himself, "Yeah sure, why not, we're defending him? Ain't that just ironic? Mr. President sure does know how to doll out an unusual punishment." he sighs, "Why'd you even do this Ford? I agree with you he deserves a trial, but why?"

You purse your lips leaning back on the bench, before leaning forwards a bit, "I wanted to prove Granite wrong is part of it.... but it's also because we can't afford to leave what makes us American behind in the face of tough times. We've got so little left, and I know they all want him dead, there's no way in hell we can convince a jury he's innocent, I heard his testimony, wrote it down, mans guilty as can be." You sigh handing it over to Thomas who looks it over, "but ultimately we're nothing without our principals. I can't let it happen... I just can't." You refused to let everything you've read, and everything you've been taught and done have been for nothing.

Thomas nods, still looking over the testimony, "Jesus Christ... maybe we could make an argument of coercion, temporary bout of insanity perhaps?" You shrug, "seems pretty lucid to me, lucid enough to mock us constantly despite being beaten to shit in stocks... which frankly might qualify him for insane actually." you say rubbing the back of your head.

You stand up, "You look that over and get some books on legal precedent and law practice, I'm going to go ask for the 'Prosecution's' evidence and his list of charges."

Thomas nods, "Alright I'll see what I can do."

You head over to the Rockefeller house and knock on the door, the Senator answers with a dry look, "What do you want? Shouldn't you be I don't know attempting to find away to exonerate the corpse over there?" his voice dripping with hostility.

You don't flinch, "Exactly what I'm doing, since your the prosecution, I request you inform me of all evidence you have, as well as the list of charges being brought to bare."

He rolls his eyes, "I'll start with the charges then, 1 Count of Aggravated Murder in the 2nd Degree, 80 counts of involuntary manslaughter, 1 count to conspiracy to commit treason against the United States, 1 count of Treason against the United States. I'd like to say he committed 81 counts of murder in the 1st degree and treason, but I'm being charitable."

[continue]
>>
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he sighs, "As for evidence, there's not much, some transcripts were saved, and there were a few security camera's that had footage backed up of the faithful day, but I can tell you as someone who practically lived on that Oil Rig myself exactly the protocol for the matter, he and his men were Control Company, that meant they were perimeter defense, and it also meant that in the event of an invasion of the Oil Rig they were supposed to stop any such invader from escaping. He didn't, Horrigan died and he was attached to Horrigan, ergo he either let Horrigan die or he helped kill him, either way doesn't matter, he aided and abetted the Chosen one's destruction of the Oil Rig."

He closes his eyes, "Go check the records in your fathers library for the transcripts and security camera footage, we're done here."
and with that he closed the door, quite harshly in your face.

And you do just that heading home and down into the command bunker to gather evidence and look through what evidence was there.
It wasn't much, but the transcripts did log the arrival of Enclave Control Team just a few minutes before the Oil Rigs explosion and Granite was registered in the IFF system at that point. Apparently a Tanker had pulled up to the platform a few hours prior.

Camera footage show a group that matches the description that Granite gave of the Chosen ones team exiting it and entering the rig. All hell broke lose after that, switching from camera feed to camera feed that was still functional you could see a myriad of Enclave soldiers get mowed down as the Chosen One burned his way through the Rig finally reaching the President, there's a conversation of sorts, unfortunately you can't read lips and the footage is poor, but it's clear that he is killed at the end of it. Some sort of access key is taken. He seems to find what looked to be the Vice President in an isolation room of sorts. Which is odd, they seem to have some sort of conversation and the Chosen One talks to the other members of his team before patting the man on the back and just moving on.

Why didn't he kill him? Wait... you remember something about the vaccine testing, the Vice President had volunteered to be one of the first for testing, though the results were redacted for some reason.
That was concerning.

None the less the footage continued for a bit until the Chosen One reached some terminal where it suddenly cuts out.
You curse.

You shake your head. You had spent a good portion of the day here at this point mulling over the video logs and transcripts and data of that date, along with the FEV records.
The Chosen One seems to have broken into the Oil Rig to both eliminate the Enclave, but also retrieve his tribe, they had apparently been taken from the village of Arroyo a few week earlier.

[continue]
>>
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Heading out you meet up with Thomas who has brought out some scotch and about 12 shot glasses, "Something to ease the headache from the constant reading." He also put some Mentats on the table, "Just in case."

It was perhaps the longest night of your life, 6 shots in, reading legal book after legal book, searching for anything and everything you could to form even the semblance of a defense.
You sighed, there just weren't enough hours in a day for this shit.

But eventually the hour came, and you and Thomas were called before a makeshift court.

Your father sitting in a chair on a platform, "All here, we've come for the trial of one Sargent Alexander Granite, would the prosecution please read the charges."
"The State Charges Sargent Alexander Granite with 1 Count of Aggrevated Murder in the 2nd degree, 80 counts of involuntary manslaughter, 1 count of conspiracy to commit Treason, and 1 count of Treason."

He nods, "Defense your opening statements?"

You're fairly sure this isn't how the proceedings are supposed to go, but you're all sort of winging this anyways.
What is your opening Statement?
>Write in
>>
>>5209128
We mentioned something about insanity? We could mention something about him developing cases of insanity due to all the peoples his killed and his weak psyche. I dont know man I'm leaving the write in to smarter anons.

On a side note what will it take to get a semi-truck up and running?
>>
>>5209128
Oh god. I don't know the laws which we're working under.
>reading legal book after legal book, searching for anything and everything you could to form even the semblance of a defense.
Did we not get anything out of this? Any strategy besides the ones already mentioned?

>>5209163
I think insanity is a really weak defense both legally and for the message we want to send in this trial
>>
>>5209198
State of California laws.
Strategy wise, your best bet is mitigating the charges. Murder in the 2nd degree can be argued against if you can seing the testimony to be they were fighting to escape thsn kill. Then it could be murder in the 3rd/manslaughter or even slef defense if you can prove he exhausted his duty to retreat.

Involuntary manslaughter is tied to criminal negligence of his duty as commander of envlave control company, if you can prove he attempted all possible avenues before failing you might overturn that.

Treason is the tough one as its tied to aiding the chosen one and his testimony doesn't paint a pretty picture, you could try to swing it if you can argue for self defense but then you're unlikely to argue against the manslaughter charges.
Which will be enough for them to execute on though technically the state of california abolished the death penalty in our timeline I think it's likely it either wasn't or was reinstated in the fallout one.
>>
>>5209219
Ya chief, I ain't a law man and I hate Commieforna. So good luck with the other anons on this.
>>
I am in favor of granite being treated and judged as a soldier because that is what he is even now. He failed his country just to save his hide and there is no justification for that. He was expected to die fighting and he didn't.
>>
>>5209223
As noted they can't try him for treason in a court martial.
They can for murder and manslaughter but not treason.
Doesn't particularly matter as he'll be executed either way, but if they're going to hold court they're gonna officially declare him a traitor, so civilian court it will be.
>>
>>5208758
Namefag! We need you now more than ever!

But I'll just throw something out, though I have no fucking idea what im doing

"The defense argues not guilty on the basis of self-defense, that the accused did only what was needed to defend his own life."

This is barely a statement, please help me. Im drawing a blank.
>>
>>5209163
Might I ask why?
Probably a week or 2 if you could find one in good condition, maybe 3 or 4 in bad and you had to salvage/buy/make parts to answer the question.
>>
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>>5209261
Fug, we need a big brainer
>>
If it helps I'll put up a vote if in the next 7 hours there's no consensus to have thomas take the wheel for a speech check just to keep it moving.
I've got other obligations until tgen however and will only be available to answer questions.
>>
>>5209261
This is what fucking people wanted last night, And this is karma. None of them are here now.
>>
Man, I am happy with the quest being back but anons had to choose the most boring option. Yea sure, gringoland good & ideals important but is that any fun for a /qst/ choose your own adventure type of story? Now QM has to study on legal procedures just to make a coherent scenario and anon (me too) can't be bothered to do the same.
Now QM will be forced to write the Defense and the Prosecutors all by themselves. See you in 5-7 days when interesting stuff happens that we can vote on.

Idk, have granite betray the NCR and give us as much info as possible and then die, since he loves being a traitor so much
>>
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>>5209274
>>5209288
I knew that this would happen from the start but it needed to be done. It's still painful though.
>>
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>>5209293
Aren't you just the brightest ray of sunshine? Make sure the door doesn't hit you on the way out.
>>
>>5209271
Because we need one to transfer all those generators from all the Vaults, plus when we're done we can still use it to help hail everything and everyone to the divide.
>>
>>5209128
>>5209261
I know 0 of law, and the ones of California.
But maybe this could be used as writing ? Or part of it ? If it s just hot garbage don't use it. I have put it on a pastebin so is not here in thread.

I have try to take it on the point of Control Company, with Frank Horrigan and the Chosen One being the reasons why they decided to change sides. As well the desperate situation of the rig at the time. I don't think i did something great, but if it can be used for create a better thing that would be good.

https://pastebin.com/w8s4etxp
>>
>>5209298
It literally didn't, he was a traitor. Proof is there and the lads still gonna die. Instead of doing anything more productive half of us are stuck just waiting now while those who wanted this ree about not knowing what to do.
>>
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>>5209367
It's a start.

However, there's a problem. What is the argument that is being put forth? It seems to be more of a description of the events and not an argument for the innocence of Granite. The Frank Horrigan violating Enclave policy and being a mutant are good points but ultimately we need to fit that description with the laws stated by the QM here >>5209219.

> Murder in the 2nd degree can be argued against if you can seing the testimony to be they were fighting to escape thsn kill. Then it could be murder in the 3rd/manslaughter or even slef defense if you can prove he exhausted his duty to retreat.
This grammar is kind of confusing me but i think I get the gist of it. We could probably only argue for 3rd/manslaughter since there was nothing in the testimony or evidence about Granite running away from Horrigan. There is this next point though

> Involuntary manslaughter is tied to criminal negligence of his duty as commander of envlave control company, if you can prove he attempted all possible avenues before failing you might overturn that.
We could argue that there were no other avenues. Horrigan and the other soldiers never allowed escape or deescalation so the only option was to fight.

> Treason is the tough one as its tied to aiding the chosen one and his testimony doesn't paint a pretty picture, you could try to swing it if you can argue for self defense but then you're unlikely to argue against the manslaughter charges.
This I don't quite get. If we overturn the core of the prosecution's charges i.e. Granite was an unjustified agressor against those he killed with self defense, why shouldn't all the charges go with it?

>>5209370
Why are you complaining? You voted for a trial as well.
>>
>>5209373
Apologies, that was phone posting.

So the Treason and the Murder charge are tied together, because the charge of Treason is predicated on Granite aiding the Chosen one in escaping, and therefore the destruction of the Enclave Government and oil Rig.

The Manslaughter Charges aren't directly connected to the charge of treason or murder, but are a result of Granite not performing his duty as leader of the Enclave Control Company, regardless of whether or not he was justified in the preservation of his life, his duty was neglected, I.E. the protection of Enclave Personnel and the inhibition/elimination of hostile forces, of which the Chosen one was presented as, he didn't stop him, he didn't even try to stop him, so what few people were still alive on the Rig when it was going to self destruct are on his head.

At least that's the argument, in reality the oil rigs self destruction wasn't activated by the Chosen one, but by Frank Horrigan.
However there's literally no one alive that is aware of this beside the Chosen One, as all the other companions were basically in a daze after getting absolutely beaten to hell by Horrigan.
It's a piece of evidence that you literally could only get if you could get the Chosen One as a witness, which I'm sure you're aware that would lead to everyone here dying.
>>
>>5209373
The central issue I see is that we're in this kind of limbo between civilian court and military court. As a soldier, he was expected to give his life for his country (read: Die pointlessly against the Chosen One) but there is no such compulsion as a civilian.

>>5209379
Then the manslaughter charges can be dropped for lack of evidence. If there is no concrete evidence that the Chosen One was responsible for the explosion then Granite can't be charged for the death's caused by that same explosion
>>
>>5209379
Well Ford even become strong enough to be something close to the Chosen One or the Courier?
>>
>>5209383
Well he did struggle with Granite,
10 ST, 8 PE, 8 EN, 5 CH, 7 IN, 9 AG, 8 LK
that's Granite's SPECIAL block

Big Guns: 105%
Energy Weap.:140%
Melee Weap.: 105%
Small Guns: 120%
Throwing: 100%
Unarmed: 130%

his skill block.
You can assume that the Chosen one has at minimum 100% in everything and 10s in all SPECIAL blocks for a point of reference.

Does Ford have the capacity to get there? With enough time and trials yes.
Will he have the chance? That depends on whether or not you can survive long enough to get there.
>>
>>5209373
We could try playing on the fact that he felt that Frank Horrigan was a compromised actor who did not have the best intentions for him or the enclave, with the whole "being a violent mutant who disregards Enclave orders for his own animalistic desires" i.e beating the shit out of people without giving them a due warning.

Would any soldier be willing to listen to a clearly deranged, clearly out of his mind superior who is completely nuts?
>>
>>5209373
>>5209382
Now that the deaths caused by the explosion can be dismissed. The issue comes with the other two, the testimony Granite gave us is horrible but he can plead the 5th and not say anything to the court and if there is no other evidence or testimony of his betrayal then all charges can be dropped.

If he insists on destroying his own case, then we'll have to argue that he acted under coercion and did his utmost to de escalate or escape his predicament.

Am I missing anything?

>>5209390
Thinking about it again, I don't think talking about Frank is a good direction. We need to stay focused on dropping or reducing those charges and I don't think character evidence will help with that. We need to ride that "threat of imminent bodily harm" train as much as possible
>>
>>5209382
The only problem remaining that I see is his duty as soldier. That any other action other than fighting and dying against the Chosen One was treasonous. If that is a valid argument in this "civilian" court and Granite insist on destroying his own case then we're screwed.
>>
>>5209373 >>5209382 >>5209390 >>5209394 >>5209397

To summarize all this incoherent rambling

Plan A will be to hammer on the lack of evidence. If there is no evidence supporting the charges (Hearsay doesn't count) then there is no case against Granite.

Plan B (Granite insists on testifying and/or there is evidence against him) will be to hammer on coercion or self-defense where applicable. The arguments depending on the specifics of Granite's testimony and/or the evidence

And I ask again, am I missing anything?

If not, then maybe we can throw something together.
>>
>>5209387
To clarify the evidence question QM. Will Granite insist on testifying and is there direct evidence of his actions? I didn't see it in the posts but maybe I missed it.
>>
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>>5209387
When we start Vault delving, can we start collecting Pipboys? Those things are pretty damn valuable. Speaking of Vaults, who are we taking with us and what will we prioritize taking besides the generators?
>water purifiers + chips
>armory (standard Vault security equipment + potential goodies)
>Vault-Tec experimental data+equipment
>robots and turrets (some Vaults have these)
>Twin miniguns mounted in Overseer's desk (Fallout 1 had these)
>Pipboys
>medical supplies
>terminals and other bits of technology
>books and holotapes
>food?

>>5209271
For where to get truck parts and a pristine truck, one place come to mind from Thread #2. The Brutal difficulty might be lessen if Ford takes some people with him instead of going on his own. Say for example Jacob and Rosaline. Jacob's a smart guy that can bypass security, and Rosaline has a keep eye and senses to know if shit's gonna go down.
>Santa Rosa, or as it's known now Red Skies, something happened when the nukes hit there that has left the skies above Santa Rosa tinted a crimson color. (Was a regional civil defense headquarter for region 7, may have Advanced loot, Difficulty: Brutal)

Once considered a regional headquarter for the office of civil and defense mobilization, it regained military significance during the resource wars. Enclave Records imply that the military airport at Santa Rosa may have held some underground instillations for the American government in the region as did many of the military outposts during the end of the great war.

Brutal Scavenging Check DV 30:
+10 Enclave Security Codes

Roll under 40

Crit Fail: GHOUL HORDE! (You're driven from Red Skies, you gain nothing and will have one less crit wound for a turn)
0 Successes: The place is barren, the nukes ruined most of everything topside and the ghouls ravaged the rest, the research records are damaged (You gain some information about the Santa Rosa Black site's research)
1 success: There's something of value here after all, but not much... ( You gain the research records of the Santa Rosa Black Site)
2 successes: The Airfield and the black site have more than is immediately obvious (You gain the research records of the Santa Rosa Black Site, You have located a reliable source of Vertibird fuel)
3 successes: A few knocks in the right place, and a the right codes will work wonders (You gain the Research records of the Santa Rosa Black Site, reliable vertibird fuel source, Desiccated Aeronautics factory[Unlocks mission to establish an advanced workshop in Santa Rosa])
Crit Success: What in the world is this? (same as 3 successes, but you also discover a unique Robotics chasse)

So with this place having a military airport, we might get lucky and find some trucks there in addition to some fuel. The problem is having to fight off the ghoul hordes, but that shouldn't be as much as a problem so long as everyone is wearing fully sealed set of Power armor and we get that gatling laser up and operational again.
>>
>>5209408
I think that's the most we can even DO to defend him, considering how stacked the deck is.
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>>5209387
How many of the people in our Cell are proficient scavengers?
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>>5209410
There is evidence of his arrival at the oil rig, and everyone knows that the Chosen one escaped, his existence as chief/mayor of Arroyo is a well established fact, as is the death of Frank Horrigan, if he wasn't dead the Enclave would know.

It's not direct evidence, but it's extremely weighty circumstantial evidence considering that Granite, is in fact alive.

He will be called to the stand as essentially the only available witness to the events, however he's barely taking this seriously, his strategy is to draw this out as long as is humanly possible so he will plead the fifth if it makes the case take longer.
>>
>>5209420
Excellent, that's the best case scenario. Circumstancial evidence can't stand on a criminal trial (Or it isn't supposed to in this case).

Here's something, feel free to improve it:
"Your honor, the defense argues that there is no case against the accused."
"All of us have heard the story about Sergeant Granite, of the arch-traitor that betrayed the Enclave and murdered his fellow countrymen in favor of a tribal, the Chosen One."
"However... a court of law does not deal in stories. It deals in evidence. Concrete evidence befitting of a criminal trial."
"For it's only through the objective and direct confirmation of the facts that the court can call it's judgement justice."
"And justice distinguishes those who are present here from the wastelanders. It is a value that was cherished by our forefathers and foundational to our very nation. So I ask, will the court be able to call it's judgement justice and speak the truth?"
"If there is no evidence supporting the charges against the accused... no proof of wrongdoing. Then the only fair outcome would be a not guilty"
"The defense rests." (I don't know what the defense is supposed to say to close the statement)

Can't decide if it should be a dramatic tone or a dry one.
>>
>>5209373
I was following your first statement about the accused need to defend his life.
But essentially just for be brief i think Frank Horrigan presence in Control Company was a major impact on the morale and unity of their company. The battle of the rig going so bad and the presence of the Chosen One too.
Put it all together and it wouldn t be absurd for them to be desperate.


>>5209408
We could go plan B.

>>5209434
Or with this one.
I would say is justified for Ford to be short or even tired with having only one day of searching, after a long mission and brutal combat against traitors (Granite included in them). Beside he has no prior experience of trials.
>>
>>5209373
>Why are you complaining? You voted for a trial as well.

Because I hate my past self, Damn it.
>>
>>5209413
>When we start Vault delving, can we start collecting Pipboys? Those things are pretty damn valuable. Speaking of Vaults, who are we taking with us and what will we prioritize taking besides the generators?

I think this question is more one that we will answer when we are in front of one or if we prepare a mission to go to one. We will try to take what we can.

>Trucks
Trucks could be anywhere honestly. Some bases might have a few, on roads there might be a few to cannibalize and so on. I would say that we should try to take vehicles from enemy factions, because they likely have them and maintain them too. See NCR.
For Santa Rosa i would take our full squad, even so ghouls are a problem. I would try to put them in a kill zone with maybe something like an hole where they fall in and they don't charge us. If the horde is really big, i would ask our dad to use our two squads instead of just one. But honestly i don't want us to shoot too much the horde, if we will not use the place in the future.

>>5209419
I don't think there are that many, none of the named characters had those kind of skills.
>>
>>5209128
Your Honor, Sargent Alexander Granite did not murder these people, when Control Company arrived the Oil Rig was already on it's last legs, it's security forces completely decimated. Unable to comprehend the mass destruction brought by one man, Granite became unhinged and insane, which was then exploited by the Chosen One as he was unable to successfully rally his men to repel the attacking force, and being so pathetic the Chosen One spared Granite's life for him to forever live in humiliation of his failures.

(We can argue that the Chosen One spares pathetic individuals with the VP footage, which proves that survival isn't predicated on treason. We then mitigate the murder charges in >>5209219. Not the best plan I bet, but besides Rockefeller Senior here nobody's gonna really know or give a shit about us not knowing how to properly legally defend an obvious traitor.)
>>
>>5209460
>Your Honor, Sargent Alexander Granite did not murder these people, when Control Company arrived the Oil Rig was already on it's last legs, it's security forces completely decimated. Unable to comprehend the mass destruction brought by one man, Granite became unhinged and insane, which was then exploited by the Chosen One as he was unable to successfully rally his men to repel the attacking force, and being so pathetic the Chosen One spared Granite's life for him to forever live in humiliation of his failures
I don't think this is a good defense but

>We can argue that the Chosen One spares pathetic individuals with the VP footage, which proves that survival isn't predicated on treason.
This is an excellent retort to the circumstantial evidence but only if his duty allowed inaction against the Chosen One. As I said here >>5209397, If admitting that he met the tribal and did nothing counts as treason then I still prefer the plead the 5th strategy.
>>
>>5209128

> Open with Granite's claim that the Enclave isn't the legitimate government of the US. Make the Senator go through the documentation and paperwork. (do this one last, it's to throw out the treason charge, so we might as well leave it for last).

> Second, claim that Frank Horrigan was a super mutant modified by the FEV, and therefore killing him could not be construed as murder. How can one murder a super-mutant? Are they even human?

> Manslaughter requires that Granite take an action which results in the deaths. The Chosen One would have killed everyone whether Granite sided with him or not. The Chosen One basically soloed Frank. Therefore Granite's actions did not cause the deaths of the survivor's on the rig.

Hopefully the Senator going the history to explain why the Enclave is legit will boost our patriotic fervor, but we'll see.
>>
>>5209452
Nice big braining there.

Santa Rosa has its ups and downs. On one hand, raining death. On the other there's loot. An easy way to circumvent the feral ghoul hordes would be with a classic. You know how in Left 4 Dead you have those noisy pipe bombs that attracts all the zombies in a ball and blows them up? We can do the same by scavenging Fision batteries to make mini-nuke explosions, and attack a bunch of ghouls to them with some radio. Best thing to do would be to attach the radio high on a light pole and the bomb at the base somewhere.

Stealing NCR trucks is also a good idea, but something worries me. Doing that will draw some heat from them. We could circumvent that by disguising ourselves as the BoS, but then we might draw heat from them? I don't know, it's a hit or miss plan to me, but I know it's good. I think we should take that advanced workshop with us so we can finally start repairing all our power armor.
>>
>>5209434
>>5209460
So are we thinking something like this then?
>>
>>5209619
I've made my opinion clear. If Granite pleads the 5th and there is no concrete evidence against him then dismiss everything. Don't entertain the charges if there's no proof to back them up. As I already said in these posts >>5209408 >>5209434
>>
>>5209302
no fuc you
>>
>>5209619
To clarify, I don't think meshing those strategies is wise. Either go with one or the other.
>>
>>5209387
>Will he have the chance? That depends on whether or not you can survive long enough to get there.
Well last time Ford was going to lose a leg because of anon's bad decision making and they threw such a fit you reverted it.
>>
>>5209629
Because in part that was also my fuck up. I shouldn't have ran at that time and waited only an hour as I normally did.
If the majority of anons that play, over the course of time of several hours vote for a desicion that has terrible ramifications then that's that.
When it's 3 anons in a one hour span at the dead of night for a session that was on my whimsy, yeah, that's my fuck up I'll un do it.
>>
>>5209628
Sure, I just want to know what exactly we're going for, because it seems like there's a plan here, but I'm not quite sure which of those two people favor more.
>>
>>5209629
To be fair, it was both insanely out of character and was done in a major rush before anyone could go "wait wait wait hold on"

Difference between a fucky wucky and a big batch of anons digging their own graves.
>>
well yes, the whole deathclaw thing felt off at the time. Like a bad dream
>>
>>5209634

I count 1 vote and another maybe vote for pleading the 5th
>>5209434 >>5209437

1 vote for an insanity/incompetency defense
>>5209460

1 vote for a government illegitimacy, puritanical appeal and utilitarian ends defense
>>5209514
>>
>>5209638
If I had to throw my weight around, the third one would be my first vote, since that's what I was gonna write before burning out.
>>
Alright so 2 for pleading the 5th
and 2 for Harvey Birdman
1 hour tie breaker vote, if not broken I will roll a 1d100, 1-50 pleading the 5th, 51-100 Harvey Birdman.
>>
>>5209641
Why? I don't see it's purpose. Government legitimacy is probably the most recorded topic in the Enclave, appealing to the puritans is not why we're here and can be mitigated by their hipocrisy on Frank and the last one doesn't hold up in court. Don't take all this questioning disparagingly, it's just the rambling tism speaking.
>>
>>5209655
Yeah, appealing to the puritans after our little drunken revelation is a bit hypocritical
>>
>>5209651
gonna go with pleading the 5th here
>>
>>5209651
Fuck it, harvey bridman time.
>>
Rolled 76 (1d100)

3 votes Pleading the 5th
3 votes Harvey birdman.

Looks like its still a tie.
Rolling to break it.
1-50 pleading the 5th, 51-100 Harvey Birdman.
>>
Looks like we're going Harvey Birdman.
>>5209514


Writing.
>>
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>>5209713
You gonna explain, or are you gonna come in here and tie it again without saying shit as to why?
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>>5209723
I still don't get it. What was the point of all this then?
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>>5209729
I said it was a 1 hour tie breaker vote plain and clear what was going to happen at the end of that.
>>5209651
Or are you asking that because there's no roll for the court case? If so it's because you can't win it, this is to determine what arguments are used and how the flow of the court case goes.
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>>5209723
>>5209713
Please QM, this fucking tie was broken an hour ago and this guy just swoops in last fucking second with zero explanation for his vote. This is bullshit, no shot this is decided by a goddamn dice roll.
>>
>>5209734
>>5209728
I don't need to explain anything, Some of us do shit for a living. I vote and reply when I can.
>>
>>5209731
No, Im commenting on not understanding the reasoning behind the Harvey birdman defense. This whole trial is a symbolic thing and it goes against that expressed purpose and therefore I asked, what was the point in all of this?
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>>5209738
Yeah, no. You work nine to five at fucking walmart as palette pusher, I can just tell from the way you type. You can't afford a minute from your wage-cucking to explain why you re-tied a vote that was basically decided an hour with ZERO (0) discussion or input at all?
>>
>>5209743
Well in so far as I can garner the defense has a few points to it that can be interpreted.

The claim of illegitimacy, which is more a rhetorical device to agitate the Enclave.

The second one the claim regarding Frank Horrigans humanity, now that can be either seen as an appeal to the purists or an attempt to call them out on their hypocrisy, depends on how it's worded.

The Third one however doesn't have much stock as manslaughter can be charged due to criminal negligence and inaction can be interpreted as negligence just as much as action can. If you had a bowling ball rack that was busted and lisping and it broke and one of the balls fell and killed someone by hitting their head that's negligence by inaction.
>>
>>5209748
>Palette pusher
Sides in orbit
>>
If it would be preferable to the voters we can have a revote as I'm fine with writing out either of these, but if we have a revote I'm not doing a write up until tomorrow morning, because I've got stuff I want to do tonight, this should be sufficient time to get a single choice picked, and if it ties again then the tie breaker roll will be final.
>>
>>5209738
But you took the time to reply anyway.

>>5209751
1. What's the point in needlessly agitating our family and community? We're already doing enough just by doing all of this.
2. Calling out the hipocrisy of the purists isn't the point of a trial
3. You made my point for me

>>5209761
Regardless of the result. I hope we can all agree on some coherent direction for these kind of decisions, all of this could've been expedited if it was discussed more thoroughly beforehand. Better to ramble than to have these last minute ties again but that's mostly out of my control so I guess we'll see.
>>
>>5209773
I do agree, I'm not a fan of having to handle last minute ties for tie breaker votes. Feels like a catch 22, damned if I allow it damned if I don't, but it's not something that can be avoided every time.

Regarding the Defense, Wasn't commenting on the viability of it, just providing my understanding of what it's objectives were.

Yeah we're just going to have a Revote on this one

Anons here's your choices
>Work to invalidate any claims of evidence and take advantage of Granite's application of the 5th amendment

>Go for an aggressive defense that attempts to discredit the prosecutions claims, through legal loop holes.

Link to this post, select one of these two options.

Vote will be open for 11 hours.
>>
>>5209782
>Work to invalidate any claims of evidence and take advantage of Granite's application of the 5th amendment
>>
>>5209782
Fuck all your voter. roll a 1d2 to break ties.
>>
>>5209782

>Go for an aggressive defense that attempts to discredit the prosecutions claims, through legal loop holes.

Involuntary manslaughter requires criminal negligence. So what action did Granite fail to take, which would have eliminated the threat? What could Granite have done to stop the Chosen One, and was it reasonable for Granite to know to do that at the time?
>>
>>5209782
>Work to invalidate any claims of evidence and take advantage of Granite's application of the 5th amendment
>>
>>5209782
>>Go for an aggressive defense that attempts to discredit the prosecutions claims, through legal loop holes.

based and red pilled I like it
>>
>>5209782
>>Go for an aggressive defense that attempts to discredit the p
>>
damn man hard call
>>
>>5209782
>>Go for an aggressive defense that attempts to discredit the prosecutions claims, through legal loop holes.

but ultimately I think this is the right call
>>
>>5209782
>>Go for an aggressive defense that attempts to discredit the prosecutions claims, through legal loop holes.
>>
>>5209782
>>>Go for an aggressive defense that attempts to discredit the prosecutions claims, through legal loop holes.
>>
>>5209782
>Work to invalidate any claims of evidence and take advantage of Granite's application of the 5th amendment

I'd rather we not alienate and piss off our family, freinds, and coworkers, this will just hurt us in the long run and not lead to Granite's Not Guilty verdict or a change of opinion or worldview within the cell itself. All we'd be doing is shooting ourself and our beliefs in the foot, it's a bad play.
>>
>>5209782
>Work to invalidate any claims of evidence and take advantage of Granite's application of the 5th amendment
Safest choice
>>
>>5209784
>Work to invalidate any claims of evidence and take advantage of Granite's application of the 5th amendment
>>
>>5209902
Yeah I’d rather not call into question the legitimacy of our organization for the fucking traitor
>>
>>5209782
>Go for an aggressive defense that attempts to discredit the prosecutions claims, through legal loop holes
Add in shell shock, PTSD, insanity and the fact that whoever was responsible of Granite didn't notice the soldier's deteriorating psychology from the field operations.
>>
>>5209782
>>Go for an aggressive defense that attempts to discredit the prosecutions claims, through legal loop holes.
>>
>>5209816
>>5209840
>>5209841
>>5209853
>>5209873
>>5209886
>>5209981
>>5210020
Can I ask why y'all want to piss off everyone in our faction? Because if you're operating on principle rather than pragmatism, we're gonna get ourselves shot by our own mother at the rate y'all are going.
>>
>>5209782
>Work to invalidate any claims of evidence and take advantage of Granite's application of the 5th amendment

After everything is said and done, I don't want to make everyone seethe. This is the safer option, we don't have much stake in here besides following tradition
>>
>>5210026
Personally i was kind of undecided on what to pick. I have picked this one after reading yesterday it kind of looked like one that could work. Ford has been aggressive sometimes. Though i believe he is unexperienced in trials so either choice should be represented with his inexperience.
But i don't really have any desire of causing chaos, so i will change.
This said most of our people didn't like the trial idea that much, we did explain at least we wanted to do it for regain an american tradition. Which is a good thing, though is unfortunate Mr Granite was the first case. At the end he will die we can be all happy with that, plus our mission did go very well and we are all alive.

>>5210020
change my vote to this one

>>5209782

>Work to invalidate any claims of evidence and take advantage of Granite's application of the 5th amendment
>>
>>5206686
4 u
https://suptg.thisisnotatrueending.com/qstarchive/2019/3918379/
>>
This is pointless
>>
>>5209549
>You know how in Left 4 Dead you have those noisy pipe bombs that attracts all the zombies in a ball and blows them up?

Is a good idea. We could use some fuel or lesser explosives if those materials are too valuable to be used.

Yeah inevitably. Well at least they are still fighting eachother and can't confirm with eachother who did who.
We do have some materials for do things in both sides (look in the document at the top in first post, we have some damaged ncr armors that could be used as disguise. If we need to).

But is an option. At the very least NCR is usually more easier to fight. If we go to Navarro again, going away with some of their troop transports it would be great

>take that advanced workshop
If we could yeah. We will need vehicles to transport everything. Though we need to take it first.
>>
Well it would seem that it's a tie again by my count.
7 Votes for >Go for an aggressive defense that attempts to discredit the prosecutions claims, through legal loop holes
7 Votes for >Work to invalidate any claims of evidence and take advantage of Granite's application of the 5th amendment

Could some anon validate that to make sure I'm not miscounting?
Once Validated, unless someone wants to change their vote I'm rolling to determine it and that result is final.
>>
>>5210156
Ill switch to Invalidate
>>
>Work to invalidate any claims of evidence and take advantage of Granite's application of the 5th amendment

Wins then

Writing
>>
weak sauce, the aggravation defense was stronger imo and the fact the anons pushing it did so because (oooh don't make the family angery oooh) makes me dislike it even more
>>
>>5210170
*and the fact the anons pushing the 5th defense did so because
>>
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Some talking points for the aggressive option:

- Criminal negligence involves doing something that a reasonable person wouldn't do. There were four enclave soldiers, and they all went with the Arroyo Savage.

- Is the Arroyo Savage a psyker? He seems to know what everyone is going to do and can convince people to do crazy things. (tis a silly point, almost like he's lived it all before).

Special Agent Horrigan was mutated by the FEV. Though loyal to the United States of America, the FEV also made him highly aggressive and of reduced intellect.

Is it murder to kill a FEV mutant, even if they are loyal to the USA? If so, why not conscript the mutants to our cause? If not, then it wasn't murder.

By all accounts, the self destruct sequence didn't happen until after the Arroyo Savage attacked Special Agent Horrigan, so Granite could not have contributed to the death of the savage by delaying him, nor did he know at the time that the whole Rig would be destroyed, so not manslaughter. Better to live and serve America another day than die pointlessly.

By the testimony, this was essentially a fight between two super-powers, the Savage and Special Agent Horrigan, and the other parties did not affect the outcome, so Granite could not have prevented any of those deaths. His was only a moral failing, not a failure of action or duty.

Pleading the 5th doesn't help anyone. It's no different than if Granite pled guilty, as he's going to be pegged anyway.
>>
>>5210183
Just a few counter points for debate purposes
-four individuals is not a statistically relevant sample size for determining what is reasonable or not.

-He was negligent in his duty because he did not attempt to stop the savage, which were his direct orders and the duty of a soldier expects them to with in reason risk their lives. (Though what the Enclave considers reasonable risk is not at all likely the same as what the current military considers reasonable risk, by all accounts in our times his orders would be absolutely be counted as a suicide mission which can be disobeyed)

-No comment on Horrigan or Mutants

-What matters here is who initiated the Self Destruct Sequence, those records are lost, however while ultimately circumstantial the Arroyo savages actions do lead to the logical conclusion that it was he who set it off. (Even though we as players and QM know it was Horrigan)

-Pleading the 5th can help, it however requires that the jury be genuinely impartial and understanding that the implication of guilt does not equate guilt if that implication is not beyond doubt.

Alright I'm going to go back to writing now.
>>
4/4 ain't bad. Also, what actions did the VP take when confronted by the Savage? Certainly the VP was a reasonable American?

Granite is being tried for manslaughter, not dereliction of duty. What could Granite have done to save the lives of those on the Rig? Special Agent Horrigan couldn't stop the Savage, so how could Granite?

Could the Savage have activated the self destruct from the top of the Rig? Is it not possible that Special Agent Horrigan, in short sighted super-mutant fury at being defeated, decided to detonate the Rig to destroy this extremely dangerous enemy of the USA, without consideration for all the American lives that would be destroyed by this action? Either way, per Granite's testimony and our best knowledge, the self-destruct was activated after Granite and the other soldiers were incapacitated. (obviously couldn't use this line of argument if the jury wasn't buying the super-mutant thesis to begin with).

Alternatively: Granite wasn't capable of stopping the Savage, even Frank wasn't. How can Granite be blamed for the deaths on the rig? While not laudable, Granite didn't kill those people, through action or inaction. The Savage is the source of all that death.
>>
>>5210145
Fission battery are worth 75 caps and weighs 6 pounds. Mini nukes are worth 250 caps and weigh 3 pounds. Considering they both make mushroom explosives when blown up, Fission battery are the ways to go for nukes on the cheap. If we dont wsnt to go for the big explosives like that, what we could do instead is buy a big bulk of materials, chemical, and dynamite then let our egg heads make some explosives for us. We should probably run all these truck acquisition ideas through Ford's father.

>>5210170
>>5210171
lmao seethe
>>
>>5210278
Neck yourself fagget
>>
>>5210145
I double checked the docs like you suggested. Unfortunately the Ranger Veterans uniform and the NCR soldiers outfits are under the damaged equipment section, so with them being the way they are they're less likely to be passed off as NCR soldiers, and more likely as people who killed NCR personnel to get disguises, unless we can really sell getting assaulted by raiders or something then returning to base to get a check up? Or, if we do go to some NCR base to acquisition a truck, the people there will want to look at our "iniuries."
We could do what we did last time and ambush an NCR convoy dressed in PA, specifically in T-45d and T-51b suits of power armor. Again, we should probably run these ideas off Ford's dad and others to get their opinions.

https://fallout-archive.fandom.com/wiki/Miles_(Fallout)
https://fallout-archive.fandom.com/wiki/Harden_your_Power_Armor
https://fallout-archive.fandom.com/wiki/Crockett
https://fallout-archive.fandom.com/wiki/Hardened_power_armor_(Fallout_2)
In Fallout theres a way to make the T-51b almost as good as enclave power armor. In F1 you need to find a chemical journal and a set of T-51b and bring them to a chemist so he can enhance it. How fuck all a chemist with little PA know how is able to harden armor I don't know, but in the words of Todd Howard "it just works." In Fallout 2 you can go to the Hubologist and pay a dude 10k in NCR Bill's to harden your T-51b for you.
So, two, three things tops. One way to acquire our own set of harden T-51b's is to know someone who's good with chemicals, have a chemical journal, and have access to an advanced workshop (see Santa Rosa). Another method would be to shill big bucks to pay a guy to upgrade our armor for us (very expensive). If the first method cant be done by simply buying a journal, we could beat the shit out of all the BoS members in a bunker until we find their archives and eventually the secret to making hardened power armor.
You know it's a shame theres no hardened versions of the T-45d, or maybe I'm reading the details wrong.
>>
You stand up nodding to Thomas, looking at the jury, you wouldn't exactly call it an impartial one, but you would be lying if you thought that it would be.

Look back at your father who was looking at you expectantly, "Your honor, members of the Jury, the defense will present the following. That Sergeant Alexander Granite of the Enclave Control Company was at Poseidon Oil Rig, that he was indeed confronted by the Chosen one, however though it will be shown that the charges brought forth of Murder, Manslaughter and of conspiracy and Treason hold inadequate evidence to be considered, and therefore would ask the Jury to levy a not guilty verdict."

You take a breath and continue, "The accused can not be proven culpable beyond doubt of murder as there is no direct evidence of the matter, The accused can not be proven guilty beyond doubt of manslaughter as there is not sufficient cause to claim his actions were criminally negligent, the accused can not be proven guilty beyond doubt of conspiracy or of treason as it can not be proven without doubt that he acted of his own accord regarding these matters."

You swallow and breath shallow eyes surveying the room for reactions, there are none thus far, in fact there is just an eerie silence.

"To summarize the witness testimony, of which has been given as recorded to the prosecution as well, Alexander Granite had arrived at the Enclave Oil Rig having been recalled there, His arrival was too late to be of any meaningful impact to prior events, however he was met with the Tribal Savage, the Wasteland colloquially knows as the Chosen One, not long after his arrival. There was some matter of discussion, and conflict ensued between the Savage and Special Agent Frank Horrigan who had arrived with Enclave Control Company. In the conflict Granite was knocked into a daze and witness the murder of Frank Horrigan before being removed from the Oil Rig by the Savage." You say giving the most charitable summary of the events as possible.

You look around again, some shaking their heads, a few scowls, but everyone remained cool, "We ask the Jury to consider the following as the trial proceeds, consider that justice is an unerring trait of the American legal system, and consider that such justice is predicated upon absolute and irrefutable facts. That one man should not be condemned if he can not be proven guilty beyond any doubt. You will find that by the conclusion of this trial that the Prosecution will be incapable of providing sufficient evidence to prove beyond any doubt that this man, the accused, Sergeant Alexander Granite, was guilty. Therefore I ask you to remember your duty as Americans and as Jurors to pursue justice impartially, and to provide a not guilty verdict at the end of this trial as is appropriate." You turn around and sit, "The Defense rests your honor."

[continue]
>>
You rub your eyes and your temples, you had barely gotten any sleep before being thrown into this.

Your father nods, "The prosecution may give their opening statement."

Senator Rockefeller stands, "Thank you your honor, Members of the jury, I ask that you recognize this man for what he is, guilty, the prosecution will prove without a shadow of a doubt that this mans actions and inaction has caused irrevocable and catastrophic damages to the American nation, the death of Special Agent Frank Horrigan, and the deaths of personnel that yet lived on Poseidon Energy Oil Rig whose number counts at least 80."

He raises his hand, "What we have here is a case where in a man has willingly aligned himself with a force malignant. One that had no sooner and earlier murdered, I note, irrefutably murdered President Dick Richardson, as well as some total of nearly 20+ Enclave veteran soldiers in an act of unmitigated violence against the people of the United States of America. To say he is not culpable of aiding or abetting the Savage due to a lack of evidence is unconscionable when we have strict records of arrival and departure of each and every individual on the oil rig, to say no less of the unbridled negligence shown in part of Sergeant Granite in not even attempting to stop the Savage in question. Such an act can only be described as Treason. With the subsequent events detailed in the coming summary of the witness testimony as nothing less than attempted murder in the 2nd, and nothing more than being party to murder in the 1st."

You stand up, "Objection, the prosecution is being argumentative."

Your father waves his hand, "Overruled, continue."

You sit down and breath out.

The Senator straightens his tie for a moment, "In regards to the accused's testimony, the defenses Summary was accurate albeit very charitable, it is noted in the records of it that the Sergeant and his men were recalled for the express purpose of defending the oil rig, to that note there was also the fact that was charitably excluded that Granite had assisted the Savage in the battle against Frank Horrigan, however beyond these details the Prosecution has nothing more to add to the summary."

He grabs a glass of water and takes a drink, "We the prosecution ask you to remember your duty as citizens of the United States of America, to acknowledge the facts as they are presented, and to deliver the verdict as it is due. To remember in full the ramifications of failing to do so-"

You stand up again, "Objection, the prosecution is attempting to coerce the jury."

Your father sighs, "Sustained, I suggest the prosecution picks their phrasing more carefully."

Senator Rockefeller nods, "My apologies your honor, to continue, as stated we request you to deliver the verdict as it is due, to acknowledge nothing more than the mans guilt for what he is guilty of and nothing else. The Prosecution rests."

[continue]
>>
The court case went on for hours, as Granite was summoned to the stand acting as witness, first for the prosecution then cross examined by yourself and Thomas. Granite pleaded the fifth whenever his interactions with the Chosen one or Horrigan came up on the oil rig, but otherwise was rather open and civil on the stand about his time in Control Company, his understanding of the situation on the Oil Rig and the capabilities of the Chosen One.

There was a fierce argument over how admissible the various and numerous pieces of circumstantial evidence as well as to their veracity. However ultimately it was a losing battle, for every piece of evidence you struck down another was admitted. It was an uphill battle to even discard various statements after the fact as hearsay.

To the credit of the court your Father and everyone here was at the very least treating the matter seriously, whether they thought it was a worth while way to spend their time was an entirely different matter.

However ultimately the case finally came to the deliberation of the jury and they were given an hour. Surprisingly they asked for an extension of another hour before they returned with their verdict.

Your father looked at them, "How does the Jury find the accused?"

one of the members steps forwards, "We the Jurry find the accused Not Guilty of 2nd degree Murder, Guilty of Manslaughter, Not Guilty of conspiracy to commit Treason, and Guilty of committing treason."

You give the jury a confused look, how could they find him guilty of committing treason if they don't find him guilty of murder? Is incompetence now culpable to treason?

The member continued, "We would however like to recommend a note of Guilty to accessory to murder regarding Special Agent Frank Horrigan's death, if such a charge can be brought forwards."

Your father nods, "I will allow it as a downgrade of the charge of 2nd degree murder at the jury's recommendation. Is that all?"

The juror nods.

Your father bangs the hammer he was using as a gavel, "Then we the people of the United States of America find you Sergeant Alexander Granite Guilty of being Accessory to the Murder of Frank Horrigan, culpable and guilty for the deaths of the people remaining on the Oil Rig for your incompetence and negligence and thus manslaughter, and guilty of Treason. Your Sentence is death by firing squad. May God have mercy on your soul."

He turns to everyone here, "Court is adjourned."

[continue]
>>
You sigh, it was the expected result, you don't inherently disagree with it either, but no one can say you didn't do your best.
Granite just shakes his head, "Well I won't lie, that was more of an actual court case than I thought it would be, good try kid." probably the only compliment he was going to give, "Still won't change the fact of where all this is heading." he says looking around.

You just frown, you disagreed, but it wasn't worth arguing with him over it, you just took him back to the stockade. He would be executed tomorrow morning regardless.
You look over to Thomas who had walked along side you, "We gave it our best." he nods in response, "As much of it as we could give...."

He goes to sit down motioning for you to follow so you do, "I'll be frank with you Rutherford, I think I pegged you wrong."
You laugh, "I don't think I pegged you wrong, you're still a bleeding heart and a fool, but for all that you're a pretty smart guy, just need to learn when to speak."

He shakes his head, "Not what I meant, no I thought you were I won't lie a bit thick headed... uh no real charitable way to put this, something of a jar head."

You give him a dry look and he holds up his hands, "Look I'm being honest okay, best just not to mince words, but I was wrong frankly I'm pretty impressed at the dedication and work you put in for all that."

You smile, "Don't sell yourself short, we wouldn't even be here if you hadn't spoken up when you did. So I guess I was wrong... at least partially to."

He snorts, "Yeah best I'm gonna get out of this eh?"

You nod, "Yeah best you're gonna get."

_____________________

Mission Complete:

Thomas Rockefeller's Loyalty Increased [5/10]=>[7/10]

You have been awarded the Distinguished Service Cross for your efforts in capturing the arch traitor Granite.
Now if only they could actually make the medal.

Regardless your efforts have been recognized
Select 1 reward
>1 additional Party Member
>Full Access to the Advanced Equipment (May requisition any equipment on the list for a mission)
>1 new Perk

You technically have 2 months of down time, however you need to deliver a generator to Vault City in 3 months
You have 2 free time actions What do you want to do?
>Talk to someone (Who?) [no longer consumes an action]
>Call a Strategic Meeting [allows you to trade an action for a mission that will only advance you forwards 1 month]
>Train your squad (in What?)
>Train a squad mate (who and in what?)
>Witness Granite's execution (no action consumed)
>Write in
>>
>>5210405
>1 new Perk
We're squad size is already considerably big. I think we're good. What we really need is something to boost Stealth, or leadership.

>Talk to someone (Who?) [no longer consumes an action]
Dad. Talk about methods to acquire engines from these posts.
>>5210363
>>5210145
>>5209549
>>5209452
>>5209419
>>5209413
What does he think about Scavanging in Santa Rosa ideas or raiding NCR transports?
>>
>>5210416
>>5210405
>Witness Granite's execution (no action consumed)
This too
>>
>>5210405
>Talk to someone (Rose, Gerald, Granite) [no longer consumes an action]
>Call a Strategic Meeting [allows you to trade an action for a mission that will only advance you forwards 1 month]
I assume we can't choose this twice, yea?
>Train your squad (In what?)
Cohesion, night-fighting, really it's a bonding exercise. Weren't we supposed to work on Rose and Thomas anyway?
>Witness Granite's execution (no action consumed)
I wanna take part.
>>
>>5210405
>>Witness Granite's execution (no action consumed)

>Talk to someone (Who?) [no longer consumes an action]
Dad. Talk about methods to acquire engines from these posts.
>>
>>5210405
>1 new Perk

>Witness Granite's execution (no action consumed)
>Talk to someone (Dad, about acquiring engines)
>Train your squad (In cohesion and night-fighting)
>Call a Strategic Meeting [allows you to trade an action for a mission that will only advance you forwards 1 month]
>>
>>5210405
>1 additional Party Member
Bro
>>
>>5210405
>>Full Access to the Advanced Equipment (May requisition any equipment on the list for a mission)
>>
>>5210405
>>1 additional Party Member
>Talk to someone (Who?) [no longer consumes an action]
Dad, future missions
Jacob, squad equipment how to improve it
Mom, heal our relationship. Is better to talk instead of remain silent, little by little it should heal.
Sister, what she thinks of the exodus idea and if she has anything to say about it.

>Train your squad (In what?)
Prolonged heavy fighting in urban zone (1 squad vs1 squad) . Position traps all around too. In addition learn to better maintain our equipment.

>Witness Granite's execution (no action consumed)


>Write in
Do an american family barbecue. That cross needs to be celebrated with all the family. A good time for relax and talk about small things, like what we did eat in Vault City or read in a book and so on. Also classical questions like "So son, did you talk with any girl lately ?".
Too bad we don't have a family dog.
>>
>>5210278
That s good enough then. We could use our caravan company for help us in find them and bring them here.


>>5210363
True is better to get their opinion.
It would be difficult to sell.... maybe a badly equipped squad that fought a few bandits ? We could repair those with some spare clothing. Not exactly the best but the NCR sometimes is just bad.
But I do like the idea of last time. An ambush, we assault them and get their stuff.
>>
>>5210466
support
>>
>>5210466
>+1
>>
>>5210433
Support
>>
>>5210405
backing this >>5210433

Damn shame we couldn't somehow win abit more but thats what ya get with sham trials.
>>
>>5210590
I'd consider the extended hour and the non-guilty verdicts a big win for us personally, considering the circumstances, and that's not including getting a trying in the first place and Tom's loyalty increase.
>>
>>5210607
>a trial* in the first place

Damn autocorrect
>>
>>5210607
You know what, Thats pretty fair my guy.
>>
When will I learn?
Here's the vote tally
Reward:
1 new perk - 4
1 additional party member - 4
advanced equipment - 1

Talk to someone:
Dad-8
Rose-1
Gerald-1
Granite-1
Jacob-3
Mom-3
Liz-3

Witness Granite's Execution-Unanimous

Call a Strategic Meeting - 4

Train your squad (Urban Warfare) - 3
Train your squad (Cohesion and Night fighting) -3
BBQ - 3

So this is what I got for certain:
You will be talking to your father
You will have a strategic meeting

Now to do this the way I should have to resolve the various ties and other details.
>>
Reward Pick 1
>New Perk
>New Party Member

link to this vote, only post what you want.
>>
>>5210692
>New Perk
>>
>>5210692
>>New Party Member
Im switching to team party member
>>
>>5210692
>New Perk
>>
>>5210692
>New Perk
>>
>>5210692
>>New Party Member
>>
for every part ?
How much we wait for doing each of this votes ?
>>
>>5210729
Just for the reward and the second action

For the other characters people want to talk to I'll work it proportional to the amount of votes they got.

As for how long, not saying, but soon enough that I'll get one last update before the day ends for me.
>>
>>5210692
>New Party Member
>>
>>5210405
>>1 additional Party Member
All the kids under our wing!
Can I still vote?
>>
>>5210750
>>5210692
I meant to reply to this post
>New Party Member
>>
Lastly, I hope the firing squad is outfitted with plasma, so we have to scoop up the green glowing goo and drop it on the compost bin
>>
>New Party Member

Wins

That'll be decided after the mission is after next update.

Now Pick one, link the vote to this post.
>Train your squad (Urban Warfare)
>Train your squad (Cohesion and Night fighting)
>BBQ
>>
>>5210769
>Train your squad (Cohesion and Night fighting)
Urban is pretty dumb when everywhere is rubble and wasteland.
>>
>>5210769
>>Train your squad (cohesion and night fighting)
We already did this once and it worked out great. It SHOULD help with the crisis the squad is going through.
A BBQ sounds like a lot of bitching, snarky comments and tension with no good moment to talk directly about the whathapps
>>
>>5210769
>>Train your squad (Cohesion and Night fighting)
>>
>>5210769
>Train your squad (Cohesion and Night fighting)
>>
>Train your squad (Cohesion and Night fighting)
Wins

Final out looks is the following:
Hold a Strategy meeting
Train your squad in night fighting and cohesion
Talk to some members of the Cell (Focusing on your father predominantly)
And You get one of the last two available companions.

Writing, I will warn it will either drop tonight, sometime next morning as I find myself much more exhausted tonight than I thought I would be.
>>
>>5210840
You mentioned we only have enough fuel for the Vertibird for a two way trip too and back, but exactly how far is that in terms of a grid based map of the USA?
Regarding the Vertibird we know that the BoS were originally using it. Can we get access to the blackbox/flight logs of the VTOL and find the BoS bunker location? That way we can either take their fuel, kill then all and take their base, or......something.
>>
>>5210777
Its for relaxing, not for making a fight.
Also if we talk with the rest of our family members we might improve further our relations with them. Leaving them silent and not interacting, is a recipe for disaster.
>>
Apologies for the delay it's gonna be a bit longer than anticipated, I had noticed an issue at my workplace that exploded into a minor crisis regarding a deadline and I've been shoveling shit since, so bare with me as I try to dig myself out of this pit.

Update will come, but when I don't know.
>>
>>5211044
thing is, ford won't be the one making the fight
>>
Ok, got a clearer picture now that I've gotten through most of the trouble, I should have free time again Friday, expect the update then.
Assuming work doesn't decide to have any more surprises.
>>
>>5211671
Right now it wouldn't happen, because they don't hate us, they are mainly against or skeptical/frustrated of our methods. Methods that we didn't explain, neither the reasons behind them.
And a BBQ is not a declaration of war, spending time together would do some good. Is not like we would make our relationship worse on purpose. We managed to not have a disagreement with our sister a long time ago (and she also changed a bit from her previous stance after we talked with her).
It takes time but it's better to start as soon as possible, especially when we are so few and there could be a chance of changing their ideas with our own.
Unless we want that divide to grow on purpose which wouldn't be a positive for the enclave remnants in my opinion.

>>5212506
thats okay thanks for saying it to us Warden
>>
>>5212525
BBQ's are always a plus for strengthening existing relationships, but considering the shenanigans we're gonna get into we're really going to need to night time fighting and stealth training.
The "short term" goals....
>raiding Navarro 2 Electric Boogaloo
>throw raiders hyped up on mega psycho at then for laughs
>getting the Divide codes
>scuttle all the data in Navarro
>acquire trucks
>dress up as BoS and shit kick more of the NCR for shits and giggles
>acquiring vault generators
>looting said vaults
>looting Santa Rosa for fuel, robot chassis, misc goods, mil-tech, vehicles, etc.
>vertibird blackbox to find BoS bunker
>possibly finding/repairing/refurbishing cars to improve our caravan buisness front in California
>shit on the NCR's president's front lawn
>acquire pet dogs. Dogs are 100% Anerica's best friend.

Long term goals...
>reestablish connection to the Mojave Enclave cell
>move into the Divide and attempt to integrate the society living there into the Enclave/acquire Courier ally
>reestablish connection to Capital Wasteland and Denver Enclave Cells before the Raven Rocks gets their shit rocked
>create MKII Advance Enclave Tesla Power Armor
>use the K-9 project to make our own cyber dogs
>btfo House and steal Vegas
>acquire platinum chip and get MKII securitrons
>find the Sierra Madre and Big Mountain
>I dont know I'm boarded
What are some other things we should ass to the list?
>>
>>5212614
>>btfo House and steal Vegas
wouldnt be better to ally with House and have it under his control
>>
>>5212745
House is a capitalist before patriotism. Dude only cares about creating his own empire than restoring America, plus he would be a future foe for us to deal with. It would be best to end him and replace him with some of ours, and some Vault dwellers. Preferably from the local Vaults in the region.
Plus, depending on how far before Fallout New Vegas begins, maybe we can catch him flat footed before he regains consciousness and reestablished control over Vegas. Oh wait never mind. I now recall OP mentioning House. Still, considering how his Securitrons are still running the MKI software I'm 100% we can take him on and secure control.

Anyone remember why House filled Vault 13 or 7 with cement? Was it to keep people from digging or accidentally blowing up the generators below the Lucky 38?
>>
>>5211434
What is your opinion of Fallout 4 and 76 in terms of canon? Fallout 4 & 76 fake and game? Pick and choose? Can PA let you fall from 100m in the air and survive? Will there be janky ass weapons like in Fallout 4 such as pipe weapons or hand cranked laser musket?
>>
>>5212797
I've little knowledge of Fallout 76 and as such will make no judgements and use no material from it.

Fallout 4 is liable to get some pick and choose done to it, but you can consider the vast majority of things to function as they would from New Vegas or back if it only appears in an earlier installment, unless stated otherwise.
>>
>>5212776
it was 21 you dummy. And I am not too sure, as I don't remember too much... vault 21 is not that interesting. But acquiring all that people before they disperse after losing that blackjack game is a must. Probably 80% of 'em died a week after leaving their vault too
>>
>>5212800
>>5212776
I asked a friend
>he didn't want an independant orginaziation in his area of influence which was the city of new vegas. The vault was essentially a fort that he didn't have control of, so to limit the threat he removed it's ability to hold large ammounts of people and supplies
>>
>>5212800
Definitely a lot of them died due to lack of preparation, knowledge, and raiders. We gotta save Vault 3 and 21 for sure. If we want to go for the 100% conpletionist route we'll need to save the few surviving members of Vault 34 before they die of radiation poisoning. You know, during that one mission in New Vegas where you either have save the Vault and contaminate the NCR sharecrops, or doom the Vault and save the crops. There's like 3 or 4 NPC's you can save, but considering we're a few years or a decade before the main events of FONV there should be a sizable number of Vault 34 memeber still alive right now.
Theres also Vault 24, but that was cut content.

>>5212812
That's disappointing, but hey. Once we control Vegas we can change that cant we?
>>
>>5212821
well I bet we can strike a deal with house or flat out telling its residents to go to our place after they are kicked out of the 21. Shieeet, what if we recruit doc mitch too? there would be no Fallout: New Vegas if we pull that one off tho...
>>
>>5212614
Our most important long term current objective is the exodus it self. But it presents several points and problems to resolve. First of all
The Exodus

Preparations :
We need to prepare for the travel our community. This means that we need a lot of things. Food&water, spare clothing, repair parts ecc... and vehicles. Because we have to carry even all our current stuff. Plus additional stuff that we aquire or loot. There is also three other things to consider:

- The Manifest Destiny Caravan Company (the one we made for make money with trade) might have a problem to continue business. So we will be disconnected for a while, we need to settle after all and secure a road.
- The Mojave Vaults. Our people would really prefer not to get with the wastelanders if there is a choice. Checking the mojave vaults is not just getting the stuff that is in them, is also pure people that needs to be integrated in our community. If we want we could get them while we travel to the Divide. Or we do it when settled. But our numbers are low, we can t just settle anywhere if we are too small.
- The Mojave Enclave Cell. Getting them to join would be a great boost. We both need each other, and it would increase the numbers of Enclave members. It would be + to morale too.

Travel:
Then the travel it self, preferably we want to know where to camp along the road, and know what kind of enemies and people we will encounter. We could scout while on the road or try a bit now.
We are capable to destroy small groups of enemies, but larger groups of them could be a problem. Larger bands of raiders with vehicles would be a serious problem.
If we get the people of the vaults and they join us on the road, our numbers would increase alongside our safety. If we do that though, we would need to prepare in advance.
Lastly entering the Divide, we need guides. Maybe even the Courier if we find him again.

Settle :
Depending how many did join us, we have more option for settle. We could still clear out a large installation as a small group and live there, but it becomes difficult to defend.
Preferably we want to know about the places to settle before entering the Divide. And which kind of enemies are here.
We also will need to decide if the ones that live here could be possibly integrated. Which is a big unknown. We might not need them if our numbers get large enough with vaults+mojave cells.
Otherwise we will need to think of some ideas like educational school for civilize tribals (something that the Enclave could find acceptable) and find pure people.

There is also minor stuff to consider like how to pay mr Courier or if we should get some mercs for better defense during travel. Mercs like good pay, but they talk when they go away. We could offer pay, a place to live and security. It has a good chance to secure their loyalty, and it avoids they go away.
And of course we can check if they are pure in a test before giving them our offer.
Preferably i would say no honestly.
>>
>>5212853
>Preparations :
Checks out. If we have cash to burn I'd suggest buying AGI, STR, or END implant and cybernetics for the elderly of our cell so they're fighting able should push come to shove.

>The Manifest Destiny Caravan Company
We can either leave it in control of someone we trust in the little village/settlement/town we live in, or give it to the Van Graff Enclave cell. Actually, maybe we can invest some vehicles in the caravan so they can make trade deliveries from California to Nevada some time later in the future after we've established our new foothold.

>The Mojave Vaults
You're right that our numbers are too small. My biggest hope is that the people of Hopeville aren't savages of the wastelands, but first gen Vault Dwellers of the region who left their Vault in an attempt to make a settlement. There were no evidence of a Vault in the Divide DLC, but I'll chalk that up to it being destroyed in the nuclear annihilation and burying under miles of concrete. Just saying, if they're Vault dwellers then more friends right? Besides that, we can move some of the Vault Dwellers to the Divide and begin indoctrinations, while some stay at their vault to use as fortifications and other industrials things.

>Travel
Stealing from the NCR, finding and repairing ones in Santa Rosa. It shouldn't be too much of an issue if we have enough functional suits of PA. I'd suggest we acquire the Advanced Workshop from SR so we can repair and upgrade our PA's, which should make traveling safer since there's enough suits to arm at least a third of our entire cell. Additionally, when we do go Vault delving, I think we should collect any turrets we come across. That way they can be used as night time sentries in case any bandits, raiders, or mutated wild life.
Honestly, if it's not a deathclaw or not wearing power armor, we can kill them all with great ease. A large group of raiders will ill maintained hunting rifles and smg's? Whatever will we do oooooohhh nooooooo!
Sarcasm aside, you can't get any more prepared that what we suggest.

>Courier
Abso-fucking-lutely. He's probably the only man alive that can help navigate our entire group through or too the Divide. Also I want him to fuck our sister to continue the Jackson bloodline. If the Choosen One's bastard some from the Bishops can 1v1 the entire Reno cell, image how powerful the Courier's kids will be.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=laGChAJmkR8

>Settle
Until we start recruiting more vault dwellers, we can substitute the lack of numbers with robots, turrets, and a camera system everywhere.

>educating tribals
Oh that's a big oof. That's gonna require a really strong Speech and leadership check to pull that off.

>security
The courier is a solid option. We could probably pay him in the form of a solid reliable firearm, caps, or a dirt bike since those are lighter than motorcycles.
If we have to go with mercenaries (which I doubt we need) they can't stay with us because they're impure savages.
>>
>>5212821
Vault 3 is running out of parts and needs a secure resupply. Vault 21 gets kicked out by House and needs a new home. Vault 34 suffers another civil war due to running out of supplies and living space resulting in catastrophic damage that results in their reactor failing and massive radiation leaks. In theory we could save all three but it would require us bum rushing all three vaults with everything they need to survive.

Vault 3 needs parts from other vaults and protection to guard against the wasteland.
Vault 21 needs a new home and training.
Vault 34 is suffering from overpopulation and supply shortages.

We would be arriving right before shit hits the fan in the still operational vaults in the Mojave. House honestly wouldn't care if we took the Vault 21 residents he gave literally 0 fucks about them and let them all die. Shit, he even gave what was left of vault 21 into a hotel for shits and giggles. We might even negotiate with him to loot it first in order to resupply vault 3 before he destroys it. As House honestly never gave a shit about what vault 21 contained. Vault 3 is the least urgent but they were literally running out of parts to keep shit running and were hopelessly naive about the wasteland which is why the Fiends raped them. Vault 34 were suffering severe shortages and were running out of living space(again) this is the SECOND time this happened. The first time they founded the Boomers in order to survive but this time around they killed themselves in a civil war. Last time they simply expelled a bunch of excess population.

When it comes to the vaults. The goal is to somehow rush in a bunch of resources and parts to keep the vaults running. While at the same time siphoning a bunch of population and offering training to them. It's a very careful balancing act. In order to pull it off, we are gonna need our caravan company to purchase and run all the supplying needs. The real hard part is somehow having enough people to train the vault dwellers AND managing to escort them safely to a new home. That is going to be a fucking bitch. We will need to somehow secure new quarters to house a shit ton of people and offer enough security to keep them alive and safe the entire journey there. How many mercs and robotics are we gonna need to pull something like that off? Is there any place nearby in the Mojave we can house them temporarily? Vault 21 and 34 are gonna dump a shit ton of people on us that isn't including whatever amount vault 3 will dump on us as well.
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>>5213302
Mr. House has a sizable Securitron Army. If we can take that, we can substitute the lack of man power with robot power. Alternatively we can seek out any other enclave cells in the region me might had missed here, or any in or passing through the Mojave.
Beyond the Mojave cell, in FONV you can complete a suit of Enclave PA by finding the suit in the
Deathclaw promontory, and the helmet in the Silver Peak Mine. Either some prospector learned how to use PA, or some other enclave group was here.
https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Crashed_vertibird
There was also this, but the notes mentioned it was mostly to pays homage to the crashed vertibird found in Klamath Canyon in Fallout 2.

I'm thinking that we should keep some Enclave members, including the Mojave cell, incharge of Vegas and the mojave region while another portion of our members will be dedicated to the moving, training, and day to day function of our other Base. It's gonna be a bitch to manage two bases, but at least we'll have more assets to work with. I don't trust members of Vault 21 to run any casinos if they're hard on the gambling part of their society, but the more reasonable members of their vault we can employee or run a casino. Better them than any of the backstabbing cannibalistic tribals.
>>
>>5213302
I'm blasting out my ass about taking over Vegas, because the only way to do that would be to fight through his securitron army, plus his casinos, plus possibly through Freeside. It would be a total slog fest. It sucks, but I know you're right, but I'm spiteful so I'll only say you're partially right.

>Thread #2: "it was soon to be 2272."

https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Vault_21
>In 2274, Robert House contacted Vault 21's residents with an offer of inclusion in the resurrection of Vegas.

https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Robert_House
>House regained consciousness in 2138.
>Biding his time, he entered the world stage once again in 2274, when Securitrons under his command emerged from the Lucky 38.
>This action was prompted by the arrival of New California Republic scouts at Hoover Dam.
>Mr. Houses' top priority was to re-acquire the platinum chip, lost to him on the eve of the Great War. For years during his awake period, House would spend cumulative millions of caps on scavenger teams and prospectors to find the platinum chip. The expenditure ultimately paid off in 2281 when the platinum chip was found after 204 years.

https://fallout.fandom.com/wiki/Vault_3
>Vault 3 was one of the seventeen control Vaults, resulting in it not having an experiment.
GECK! Gosh I should really go through the threads and make some notes. There is A LOT of good plans an ideas we could consolidate.
>>
>>5213382
For consideration

It is September 2271.

You've 9 months before exodus.

In 3 months time you'll need to provide a generator to vault city, and then 1 every month after for 3 months. (If you want to keep the deal)

The primary reason behind exodus is that the size of your cell has begun passively generating heat, after every mission between 5-10 heat is gained by relavnt factions. Events at 50 and 100 heat. Note that heat is not inherently hostile but more a matter of knowledge and interest. Extrapolate what you will from the entities in question.

Your capture of Granite has garnered the attention of a particular savage.

You may use your missions both normal or strategy meeting to lower heat to stave off potentially bad events.

And fun fact about the quest: its conception started as a way for me to brain storm a rework or tabletop campaign of Fallout 3s plot to breath life into the factions and to adjust their behavoirs to be more in line with the predecessing games. Most of the rework focused on Enclave internal factions between, purists(Eden) and reformists(Autumn) though Autumn was less democracy and freedom and more velvet iron fist without genocide kinda reformist. It also expanded upon the conflict between the Eastern BoS and the outcasts, I effectively swapped their rolls where Lyon and his supporters became the outcasts and the rest were the traditional BoS.

I've yet to decide how much of that rework will bleed into the quests version of DC but if we had started on the east coast it's likely that it would have heavily influenced the events at the time.
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>>5213432
>You may use your missions both normal or strategy meeting to lower heat to stave off potentially bad events.
How would missions or strategy meetings be used to lower heat, especially for that super evil savage we don't like?

>tabletop campaign of Fallout 3s plot
Hows that going so far?
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>>5213377
It's worth noting the robots around the crashed vertibird likely answer to Enclave codes and were placed there to secure the site against intrusion until they could recover it...which never happened. We could likely recover some very interesting data and very nice robotics from there.

In terms of using robotics to supplement our chronic manpower shortages that would require us getting a hold of a robotics factory...which just so happens New Vegas possesses a small scale factory in Freeside servicing robots. They also have a foundry and a tool factory trapped to hell. The best robotics in the region though is sadly located in Big MT. HOWEVER the Mojave Enclave Cell possesses a goddamn expert in Robobrain technology. We get him we gain access to robobrains, robodogs, AND advanced cybernetics.

...assuming we can even find the facilities to build the damn things. Sadly robotics factories capable of servicing robobrains are the rarest factories of all and top secret considering they use literal human brains. Only one nearby is yet again big MT. Honestly in terms of general logistics we are pretty fucked. We are just barely scraping by thanks to crit with the Van Graffs and the caravan that is relying upon scavenging to get by.

If we get lucky we can convince Mr. House to let some of the casinos be run by Vault 21 dwellers cause you not a bunch of uncivilized cannibalistic tribals. It would be a nice income for us as well.

Honestly we aren't nearly as fucked as we could be if we didn't have a caravan set up which will handle the supply runs for the vaults and give us an excuse to move around. Not to mention making a deal with vault city help us out with some general manpower and expertise. Our biggest problem rather is housing the vault dwellers and manpower shortages until we train them up. The Divide is too far away and way too dangerous. We don't have nearly enough guns and firepower to escort that many people there. So we need some kind of base in the mojave to house them as we slowly ship them out to the Divide piecemeal.

So somehow we need to secure a shit ton of robots...but where and how? Fallout 4 has robotic workbenches but that tech is all the way in fucking Boston on the other side of the country. We need to go scouting. Find some robot scrapyards or repair stations. Something. Anything. Mojave Vault operations require too much manpower that we frankly just do not have. Shit the Capital Wasteland STILL has a bunch of pissed off robotics wandering around and still operational it was nuked to hell and back. We just need to find, debug, and override the damn things. The NCR at least isn't too fond of robotics...too expensive for their tastes and they prefer using people much cheaper. While the Legion flatout refuses to touch them...hm buying robots in Legion lands might be a great idea come to think of it.

If we can find enough robots our biggest problem for the Mojave operations will be solved right there.
>>
>>5213482
I'm fairly sure that we need to reduce our heat from the Bishops if we plan on doing anything in Redding anytime soon.
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>>5212853
Anon we need the Manifest Destiny Caravan Company in the Mojave very badly otherwise we are fucked. Especially to supply the still operational vaults in the region. Imagine how much we could profit if we got there before the Crimson Caravan shows up? We also need to set up an alibi and make it appear that the Manifest Destiny Caravan Company did NOT originate from the NCR. Otherwise we would be in deep shit if they follow the clues. Make it appear like an outside caravan moving into the NCR and Mojave. Like an external force and that will give us a perfect alibi. We even struck a deal with the Van Graffs as a distributor. So we look legit...except for our origins. Which is our key weakness.

In terms of preparations, we need to take the Manifest Destiny Caravan with us to the Mojave to establish a base of operations and more importantly what we need most of all is ROBOTS. We don't have nearly enough manpower to handle all our tasks and too much of it is far too sensitive to rely upon hired hands. It will also serve as our alibi for our trip there. By taking it with us we don't need to worry about resupplying.

In terms of travel, there are multiple routes to the Mojave the shortest and riskiest is the Divide. The only one who regularly makes trips there is the Courier and we can find him because is quite literally the only regular. So people know about him. It's how the NCR used him to send the nuke codes there in the first place. So finding him is not too difficult now that we know about him...but only if he is headed to the Divide because that is the only place he returns regularly. Since he's a regular we know the circles to send a job request and he won't turn down free money for a trip he will do anyway to the Divide. Getting him to guide us to other places though is gonna be unreliable as hell though.

Our biggest problem in terms of settlement is there are too many vault dwellers who need a place of residence in the Mojave before we can begin to consider shipping them to the Divide. The same is true for our own group and caravan. There is no way the Mojave Enclave Cell can house everyone. So we will need to secure someplace that hasn't gotten fucked yet, is easy to fortify, and easy reach of the vaults. I want to say Camp Golf or the Vegas Outskirts but fuck that's gonna be a big fight.

In terms of mercs the Van Graffs would be the best bet. They intend to go to the Mojave anyway. So we can offer to join up together with an initiative. We might even get the Van Graff Enclave Cell as official backup that way. To be specific they intend to send out some offspring who have a beef with the NCR and make deals with the Legion.
>>
>>5213302
>>5213377
Honestly we might need to take one vault at a time and then go back to the Divide. It would be multiple travels to do.
We could do it all in one go as well, but it's not easy. Though it would be a lot of numbers that will make anyone even the largest groups of our foes retreat.
In regard to House eeeh, i would prefer not to interact with him. If we need to interact being hostile would be a bad idea, he controls a large city and since this is lore fallout is not the games numbers we would face. He has a lot of securitrons, but at least they can't follow us too far away. But i wouldn't have a fight with him we would be overwhelmed and what we did would spread like fire in a summer field. I don't want that to happen.
Of course is obvious upon contact he has the info of our existance to offer has trade with other factions, if he wants to. And he likely has cameras for take pictures of us.


9 months.
And with that request from Vault City is 4 generators with 4 months.
Though we don't know how long the missions for retrieve each of them will last, neither the travels for get them out. It might take days or weeks, or could be longer.
Beyond that we have 5 months free. Currently we had ideas for another mission in Navarro and another one in Santa Rosa.
The rest of the time should be probably put for do missions with the exodus needs in mind.

>>5213432

i have guessed as much with heat. Thought even something minor could be our doom. We might even need to move away first if we can't lower it. Bishop and the Chosen one are a concern if they send someone.
Like someone said in past threads seeing a few PA s yeah you can sell those guys are mercs. Several of them and some clearly with that distinct green of APA s ? Nobody is going to believe we are normal guys. It doesn't help that we are a distinct community that stays on his own in the village we live in. Beyond having some interactions time to time, we don't talk much with the wastelanders that live in our same settlement. Thankfully no one was interested so far in us.
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>>5213482
The campqign never manifested due to mechanical issues, so I reworked the idea into this.
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>>5213488
>building and securing robots
Well, robo brains are a dime a dozen in the capital wasteland, and theres some military workshop in Santa Rosa. We get the doc, we get that tool factory, we get that robot factory in Freeside, and we get the New Vegas Steel factory up and running an we might have something going here (still want House's securitrons since he's not leaving his house yet and let the Vault 21 residence run the casinos under our management).

Vault 22 has a literal metric shit ton of robots and turrets in their sacrifice chamber.

The Repcom HQ has some robots there too.

>>5213500
Honestly? Pre-explosion Divide it was still a relatively dangerous place, but no where near as dangerous as shown in the DLC. If we can get people to move into the Divide, it should be easier to hunker down.

>>5213503
Heres an idea: what if we try to indoctrinate some of the Vault 34 memebers, or raid the armory of Vault 34?

>>5213503
>Of course is obvious upon contact he has the info of our existance to offer has trade with other factions, if he wants to. And he likely has cameras for take pictures of us.
Okay? Hes no reason to know who we arez so we should be safe. If he does know? We need to kill him before he leaves his front door.

All this talk about heat makes me reconsider raiding NCR trucks. Too much heat is bad all around.
>>
>>5213531
Do you run other quests?
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>>5213531
Following up missions to reduce heat are basically you redirecting interest and attention.
Subterfuge.

As for avoiding the chosen one.
Well you can delay him but he not someone you can get off your scent once on without going a long way away.

Consider his heat a countdown to a bossfight that will be unavoidable, just delayed and only so much.
Best you can do is pick and choose your fight with him carefully because even as an old man he's a force of nature.
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>>5213535
I run one other at the moment, beneath the pale moon, it's slower than this but I'm mostly fine with that so long as it keeps moving forwards.

I've ran 2 other quests in the past which i talked about in the last thread or the first i believe.
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>>5213503
Vault 3 is the easiest. They just need security and caravan runner. Vault 34 is the most urgent. Vault 21 is the hardest. Just too many people at once with no means to take care of themselves. At least vault 34 dwellers know how to protect themselves...

If we want Vault 21 there is no getting around Mr. House we have no choice but to go through him and he is the faction that is the least hostile to us. Plus the range of his Securitrons are shit its just terrible idea to pick a fight with him in New Vegas unless we wanna get our shit wrecked. The only reason he didn't pick a fight with NCR and Legion was that they were able to drown his robot army in bodies. Even after the upgrades, he doesn't expand cause flesh is cheap. We actually have the same problem. We also cannot counter the quantity they have at their disposal.

Mojave operation is big mainly because it demands just so many goddamn resources and manpower it's absurd. The Divide operation won't be that big since it's little more than a scouting trip to confirm its location and find a new home to move into. Plus we will be able to hire the Courier to guide us through. We can potentially loot some California vaults for Vault City which will also resolve Mojave Vault problems as well and help us locate more resources for ourselves as well. Santa Rosa is going to be a bloodbath that we will need to bring big guns and backup to fully take...in truth though I don't think we have enough manpower to hold Santa Rosa too. Shit, we don't even have enough for Mojave operations.

>>5213534
The biggest problem is servicing the robots. We can indeed loot vault 22 and Repconn HQ. Robobrains need super specialized facilities and training to handle. Not to mention fresh brains. There is a reason why the caravan is buying up all the hi tech it can but is sadly unable to produce anything itself. It buys whatever scavvers offer and refurbishes it cause we have the know how to do so. Van Graffs give us the Energy Weapons to shuffle through our caravan as well. In terms of development our caravan is not by any means low end but neither is high end.

All we can do is repair with whatever we can scavenge and salvage. We can only do this because we have Enclave tier knowledge base to play with. We just don't have the tools or materials to take advantage but we make enough to scrape by. New Vegas is honestly rather lacking in that regard. The regions that ISN'T are insanely fucking dangerous. However, it is pretty good in terms of raw resources and commerce.

Actually the Divide was still a dangerous place before getting nuked(again). The courier was only regular there who passed through regularly and the weather was notoriously terrible thanks to weather manipulation. It was however filthy rich in terms of sheer raw capacity, resources, defenses, and potential. It was also literally neighbors with Big MT even having a direct tunnel to it. Ulysses loved the place for a reason.
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>>5213546
I don't wanna go into the Divide since it was talked about in depth in past threads and why anons ultimately concluded why it was the best HQ despite the insane risks involved. Basically though Divide is still dangerous as hell but it has the security to deal with it. They only lost because they got blitzed by the NCR and Legion before getting nuked which resulted in them getting smothered in the cradle. Hence why Ulysess was so butthurt.

I mean shit their military stockpiles alone even AFTER getting nuked AGAIN was STILL insane. However even before getting nuked the Divide was still ridiciously dangerous. There was a reason why the NCR was so damned slow before blitzing it and the Legion ignored it for so long. Even then it was treated as a refuge for a bunch of hardcore motherfuckers who didn't take shit from anyone who managed to make a living there. I mean shit there was a reason why both Ulysess AND the Courier made the place their home. We only know it was an infantile faction just beginning to sprout that was oddly obsessed with Americana but were brimming with potential considering where they survived. Only to get nuked and got between a war that took them out.

>>5213536
So much for not keeping a low profile. What the hell is even the point of pinning the blame on other factions and covering our own asses. Much less lowering heat. The Bishops alone kicked our fucking asses and there is no way we can handle the Chosen One unless everyone is packing Fat Man and Gatling Lasers with X0 Power Armor.

I was hoping to treat him as a final boss. Plus I was hoping to encounter other dangers depending on what we did. Like whatever elite cyborg monsters the BOS had in store. Honestly, it really limits the point of keeping low Heat or purposefully setting up other factions or coming up with clever plans.
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>>5213546
>Santa Rosa is going to be a bloodbath that we will need to bring big guns and backup to fully take.
Not really. Hes the solution.
https://youtu.be/FhSmyqNaP1Y
We use fusion batter as cheaper mini nukes, rig them up to wireless detonators, and attach radios to them to attract large enough hordes to clear our an area. Buying or finding all the materials to make 10 of those set ups shouldnt cost more than 1200 caps, 2000 caps at most!
It's not a matter of holding Santa Rosa. It's a matter of clearing a portion of it of feral ghouls (for a time until they slowly shamble their way back in to fill the void) to make scavanging easier. We want the ghouls there to make it harder for scrabs to loot the place, and to keep the workshop safe until we can extract it.

Regarding the servicing of robots, Vault 34 might have some technical engineers as example of that one bald dude that thought he was a ghoul, and the Boomers rebuilding a functional bomber. It's a given that Vault 34 and 3 residents will have the brain power we need, especially Vault 3 since it's a controlled vault. They can fix robots, utilize the factories to make said robots, so and so. Hell they probably have some libraries.
Brains? Oh right those. Yeah shits fucked unless we can make the stuff or have an advanced science chem set. If the Dog Doc can fix Rex in his Mountain Lodge Lab, then maybe it should be impossible to get us some robot dogs in working order.

New Vegas is pretty good in terms of resources and fun things to grab. That's to House's intervention he was able to save a good chunk of the place.

The tunnel people didnt come out to play until the place got cracked, and the marked men didnt exist yet. That just left the brutal sand storms, radiation hot spots, deathclaws, and whatever creatures manage to slip through Big MT. Still dangerous, but think about it. If some bunkins and set up a Settlement called Hopeville, then an enclave cell can set up a practical utopian in no time.
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>>5213553
Perhaps my wording wasn't the best as it implies impending doom.

Let me rephrase that. The chosen ones heat can be reduced and he can be stalled for quiet some time. Obviously actions taken, free time or mission, that divert blame or push intrigue towards someone else will still effect him it just is less effective and he gains heat consistently and will for quite sometime even beyond your move from ncr territory which will stop passive hest gain for california factions like the bos, ncr and bishops etc.

Unavoidable was to strong of a word, it's just very difficult to get him off your trail.
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>>5213564
Still sounds unavoidable to me Warden, but I’ll learn to deal with an impending walking nuke looking to fuck our shit up.
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>>5213553
>We only know it was an infantile faction just beginning to sprout that was oddly obsessed with American
F-fuck bros, that either means they we enclave, vault dwellers, or real Americans.

>The Bishops
Correction. The bishop, as in one man. As in the Choosen One's bastard son with the Bishop's daughter in Fallout 2. You give the Bishops too much credit, it's the one guy we need to look out for.

>no way we can handle the Chosen One unless everyone is packing Fat Man and Gatling Lasers with X0 Power Armor.
Even then they would still beat them. See the way to cheese out a victory is to spam them with weapons that will ragdoll them, like high explosives.

>>5213564
What if he takes several rad scorpion stings to the head and moves to Novac as the resident crazy guy?
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>>5213568
You better learn to deal with it fast, because the Choosen One sure as shit ain't gonna wait for us. Gotta pick and choose our fights, and if we're not running from this guys every chance we get we're doing something wrong. If I'd know that the mission briefings would divert heat or delay the Choosen One I would had voted for it. For sure.

>>5213564
Would lathering up a wild dog in barbeque sauce, then throwing it out in the middle of Santa Rosa be a good idea to lure Feral Ghouls away? Since they would be preoccupied with chasing after the dog?
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>>5213488
>>5213500
Our best bet for robots is either find a place to salvage a decent number of them, or buy them. We could try to have Jacob build a few on his own but that would require time and cash. He could make a few in between missions maybe.

The problem with the company is that once we are on the road to the Divide, we don't make money if they stay with us. We wouldn't gain them either until we set up, but if they worked with the Van Graff it could help.
We could also use them like you said at least they could have a use and help us with the vault dwellers. And if House is fine with us, setting up an office in New Vegas before the Crimson Caravan would be nice.
I am not sure what we can do for say we aren't from the NCR, we did also register the caravan in Shady Sands. Moving away from our village might give us the alibi.
In regard to a middle place where to put the vault dwellers, i can't think of many. But if we have enough robots with us it shouldn't be a problem to capture a place like the one you suggested. The Van Graff mercs is a decent idea, and the Redding Cell that is now united with us knows how to talk with them. Plus they could gain something in New Vegas this early.

>>5213534

Well once we get to 34, we plan to get everything from it so it can work.
In regard to House, is a possibility. Is true that he could not understand who we are upon contact. That should give us some safety, unless he send someone to look at what we do in the Mojave we should be okay. I am not sure what where his views on the Enclave if he knows of it. Eitherway if doesn't learn who we are, or understand we should be good and avoid the blackmail.

>>5213546

Do you think he would ask for something in return for getting access to the people of 21 ? He doesn't care of them, but he could gain something. Maybe we can say we will bring more trade to the city, which is true with our Caravan and the Van Graff s.
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>>5213564
hm...that's a little better. At least my ideas aren't completely unsalvageable yet. I was hoping it take quite a lot to draw the Chosen One's attention. I was expecting to deal with the Bishop's first considering their NCR's Hatchetman and that one guy fucks his daughter before fleeing to New Vegas leading him right to our intended departure goal. He was still going to wreck our shit.

>>5213556
That's actually a clever idea. We can even make nuka grenades courtesy of Atom Cultists or Nuka Cola recipes.

The issue isn't with personnel its with tools and resources for robotics. Not to mention getting the actual damned robots. Protectrons and Handies would pretty much solve our hired hand problem. We could easily convert Handies into Gutsies for extra firepower. Not to mention Protectrons can easily drag carts like Brahman can even if their slow. Not to mention the other ones.

Biggest problem for robobrains is the incredibly specialized facilities and training required. There is a reason why practically only Black sites ever massproduced the damned things.

Good point I keep forgetting Mr. House saved most of Vegas from getting nuked and a LOT more resources would be available than is shown in the game. Who knows what else we could find that was never even hinted at in game and hasn't been looted yet since its before the game even started and hence hasn't been picked through yet by scavvers.

The Divide was STILL so Hostile that the NCR and Legion delayed claiming it for a very long time. The Terrain was notoriously hostile and weather terrible. It just wasn't outright lethal like it is after getting bombed again. However it is PRECISELY due to that fact which is is why its PRISTINE in terms of how much resources, salvage, and security it holds. Not to mention the military turned the area into a damned fortress in order to guard and supply big MT(they literally shipped hippies, Chinese POWs, and criminals through there to Big MT for experimentation in mass through hopeville and Asheton). They also oversaw experimental weapons development, manufacturing, massive military facilities, and had several entire cities in the area. Not to mention so much automated security.

The only reason the Divide was livable was due to the insane security apparatus built in. Otherwise, it was impossible to survive there given how rough the terrain is, awful weather, and terrible creatures. I'm not saying it's not worth the risk I'm just saying there is a reason why the NCR and Legion even the BOS stayed the fuck away from the Divide. Why the Courier was the only man with the sheer balls to make regular trips(see the ONLY man who kept the Divide connected to the rest of the world because no nobody else or caravan wanted to take the risk).

As the Enclave though we actually could simply because we have the firepower, armor, training, and most importantly overrides to do so. We just need a guide so we don't get lost and die like clueless idiots.
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>>5213570
Then he'd be nobark, but I've already said he ain't.
You wont have to concern yourselves with him for a few years unless you do something drastic assuming it's just passive heat gain. Gotta remember that the general time scale of missions is 1-2 months and heat is 5-10 per.
Even at fastest passive gain it'll take him a year and a half just to find you.
At the slowest with no impediments roughly 3 years. Accounting for impediments and smart play probably 4-6 years if he doesn’t give up within that time frame.

Thats a lot of missions and time to get stronger.

No comments on saucing dogs.
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>>5213579
Robots like Protectrons are/were a very common and cheap commercial robot to manufacture. Slow as all hell, they're decent to weak back up in a fight, but arent good front lines unless goy can make it run faster and give it longer arms. I would suggest that if we find any of these we make their targeting systems more accurate and replace their lasers with a stronger one that's not consumer grade. That's all we can really do for them.
Mr. Handy's however are just great. They can be converted into Mr. Gutsy's if we have the programs to make them more combat ready, and we can replace one of the limbs with either a Plasma or laser weapon, in addition to adding more armor to make it up to snuff. In terms of resources for crafting, I think it's one of those "dont think about it too hard" mechanics. Because if we needed to keep track of each unit of duct tape, scrap, metal, scrap electronics, and pilot light the QM probably would had asked us too.

We're resolve the robo dogs (not robo brains) issue when we get there.

Also recall that House is still in his house. Maybe we're lucky and he cant deploy all of his securitrons yet.

More reasons to set up in the Divide.

>>5213582
>4-6 years if he doesn’t give up within that time frame.
I'm voting for min maxing our time here to delay him for 6 years. We might not be strong enough to kill him, but there one thing that can. Time. The older he gets the closer he is to death, and that much more infirm. I 6 years we might stand a chance.
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In regards to Mr House, he is technically a pure human and an American citizen is he not? What he cares about is Vegas. Surely in some form or fashion we can negotiate with him. Ideally we could someone incorporate him into the government but I expect that would be the longest of shots, but what we can do is strike a deal with him to help restore Vegas perhaps. We are very well positioned to strike a deal such as this in my opinion, considering our caravan company, expertise, and connection to the Van Graffs. Consider also, he is opposed to the same groups that we are, I'm sure that we can find some common ground.

Perhaps we could claim Vault 21 as a headquarters for our caravan company and establish a settlement for the vault dwellers somewhere in the region? Or between the vault 21 residents and the New Reno cell we could operate a casino?

Lots of opportunity in working with House, in my opinion.
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>>5213798
Still not a fan of Mr. House. Now that I had some time to sleep, his securitron army ain't so tough. If we get some EMP weapons and grenades we could make short work of then all in no time, especially if everyone is totting around MKII advance power armor. We'd be unstoppable, then Begas would be ours!
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>>5213992
Going in guns blazing like that would undoubtedly gain us a ton of heat as well, worth thinking about.

Don't forget that one day the NCR and the legion will come knocking, it would be mutually beneficial to not waste manpower and resources unnecessarily.

I really do think our caravans specialty is perfect cover for working with House.

And besides, he's an American citizen, and an industrial magnate at that. How could we not at least attempt diplomacy?
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house will 100% attempt diplomacy with us, if we can put ourselves in the discussion table. Remember that the three families were House's efforts in putting himself on the table, because if he didn't take all those precautions and build up his forces, then NCR wouldn't have negotiated at all, going for the usual instead...

Ah, bargaining table, not discussion table.
>"To enforce, one must have force - a position of strength."

So house detects scouts in 2274 and begins creating the families. If we can somehow reach him before that, we might have a chance to strike an OK deal.
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>>5214085
I mean really we just have to give him what he wants, Vegas. With our aid it could be reconstructed better and faster, as well as being better protected.

I really think we should try to win House over to our cause, not just working with him. Some manner of economist/industrialist position. What he wants is Vegas, what we want is America. It's worth a shot at least, and would make securing the Vault populations comparatively easy. Though, we might have a better position if we save one of the Vaults before entering talks I suppose.
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>>5214144
Hmm... I can totally see house paying us to find the chip
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>>5214144
>>5214148
Sounds enticing. If we can get there before he opens his doors in 2274, we can convince him to accept the Vault 21 residents to staff the hotels instead of relying on backstabbing tribals. Both the Vault Dwellers and House would in a sense owe us for resolving both their issue (house dealing with the casino families bullshit and Vault 21 from being kicked out of Vegas entirely). Plus we could use the opportunity to stripe Vault 21 so we can send some of the stuff back to Vault City in addition to using the excess to fuel our Divide Base. I'm still of the opinion that we should do a complete take over, but if we can't then I guess we'll have to settle with House being the lord of Las Vegas.....so long as he shares some of his blue prints, schematics, plans, and caches with us.
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Does anyone remember if Vault 21 opened before or after House opened his doors in 2274? I'm thinking that, if we get there, and neither Vault 21 or House are open for business, we can use our Enclave codes to open the Vault for him. That way House doesn't need to spend a decade educated those tribals to work his casinos.
Would anyone be against improving Ford's speech craft? If we not going to kill House, the least we could to is sway him to our cause.

Side note: I recalled that the Oil Rig was originally a bunker for the social elite, rich, ceo's, etc. House probably got an invitation but didn't want to leave because he wanted to save Vegas.
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>>5214250
While not stated in Canon, I am of the mind that House did indeed receive an invitation and chose to disregard it, I also choose to believe he was as the head of Robco well aware of the Prewar Enclave, and by virtue of his extensive network of informants from his awakening in 2138 is also aware of the shenanigan's they got up to post apocalypse when they came out of hiding.

Its why he's got a permanent 15 heat on you all, he knows you're there he just doesn't have a reason to engage.
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>>5214211
I'm still not sold on settling in the divide, it would be logistical nightmare trying to ferry all those vault dwellers out there if nothing else. I think setting up camp in the Mojave would be a better call, after all it would make sense for our caravans headquarters to be there, as well as being close to Vegas and the vaults/industry around it.
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>>5214211
But house recruited tribals because he needed the manpower and the fighting experience. Sure, vault 21 has some mean blackjack dealers but... thats it
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>>5214295
That is where we come in, a small but elite and well equipped force able to train up and equip a sizeable portion of the vault dwellers in the area to a standard above that of wastelanders. Of course they would be our men, and he's still free to toy around with tribals if he likes.
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Personally I think turning vault 21 into an additional casino/caravan HQ/Enclave bunker is a grand idea.
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>>5214280
>>5214295
>>5214085
Normally I would be very against shoving our dick into the Mojave since we already have the Chosen One after us and the last thing we need is The Courier too. Saving the Divide is the best way to prevent the Courier from killing us as well as getting too involved with the future Mojave clusterfuck.

However...I now realize that I failed to consider the Mr. House angle. Previously I was thinking of us as an additional faction to the four party factions of the 4 options to New Vegas. However if we make a deal with Mr. House we would de facto replace the tribals of New Vegas with Vault 21 dwellers who would be trained by us to run the casinos for House instead. Unlike the tribals, they would actually know how to run a casino. We could offer protection and training. Provide us a base of operations for our 'caravan'. An excuse to show that we did NOt in fact come from the NCR. That we merely 'expanded' there in order to scout for customers for New Vegas reconstruction under the Request of our newfound Employer Mr House. Just like our caravan tracked down the Van Graffs for supplying Energy Weapons.

We do this House gets to keep Vegas. We get a secure base of operations and a friendly city state to draw heat away from us. WE want House to keep Vegas(or the Yes Man if it comes to it). As a result, there would be no Fifth faction of New Vegas. Merely an adjusted Mr House faction and an optional friendly sub faction for the Courier to get befriend(Enclave).

To do this however...we would need to make a deal with House in exchange for Vault 21. Caravan Passage. Training. Citizenship. Ect. House want his Securitrons to run security but he needs people to run his precious casinos and improve infrastructure. Especially considering his future grand plans for his city state ala Singapore. We simply give it to him. House plans to lay low until the Platinum Chip shows up with the Courier but he needs to keep the NCR and Legion at bay which is also what we want.

Most important of all...House has zero interest in expansion. He only wants Vegas. A single city state is a dictatorship.

If we help House turn the Mojave into a meat grinder for both the Legion and NCR...that gives us that much more breathing room to do so much more everywhere else. Turn into a distraction and heat sink. House is the perfect man for the job and fall guy for us.
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>>5213798
>>5214144

One thing is setting up a deal, the other is recognizing him politically in any way. Which is a no, he is a dictator on american soil. We all wanted to be some american paladin, if we do it with House then we can do it with everyone else too.
He will go down as well. We have no interest in doing it now since we can't face him at the moment without an all or nothing action. Which is a pretty bad idea right now because we don't have enough military strength. It doesn't help that an attempt to take Vegas now, would be a clear reveal that someone replaced the previous power, and it would be too much attention on us.
Also he is not one with a policy for allies, more of trade partners and people under him. And revealing who we are to someone like him ? No a risk we don't need we can set up a deal without revealing who we are, and we stand to lose far more than him if we say we are Enclave, plus this would give him free blackmail.
Setting up an headquarter for our caravan company and a casino in New Vegas would be a good idea, and House would welcome trade or any kind of improvement "his" city gets (unless he senses we are taking too much, which we will once there is a possibility to have the Courier put Yes Man in, and both NCR, Legion, Khans and BOS have kill each other enough than the sands and rocks of the Mojave are carmine). Neither of the two buildings picked, need to reveal we are Enclave since it's just work places not settlements.


>>5214280
The problem with settling in the Mojave is that is the next war zone, there is also a BOS presence, which would likely react to someone new like us. With the NCR expanding rapidly in all of the Mojave and the Legion trying the same any settlement would need to adapt or defend it self. One made by us wouldn't simply go unnoticed. And both NCR and Legion send a lot of numbers here.
The Divide instead is a really good place to start and would give us the means for restore our power and take back America.
If we are able to have the Courier on our side, he might use Yes Man. That scenario could give us access to the city, especially if we are able to convince him in joining.
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>>5214577
>Also he is not one with a policy for allies, more of trade partners and people under him. And revealing who we are to someone like him ? No a risk we don't need we can set up a deal without revealing who we are, and we stand to lose far more than him if we say we are Enclave, plus this would give him free blackmail.
I agree with all of this and could not find the word for what I was thinking before. All I can say is "he's a dick," but you summarized it way better.

If the Hopecvillains are enclave or Vault Dwellers, what we can do is use the GECK in Vault three to make the place exponentially more habitable.
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>>5214387
You've pretty well summed up my thoughts on the situation, I think that realistically it is one of the better options available to us.

>>5214577
It is a compromise to allow House Vegas, but has there not already been compromise on the question of wastelanders? We have to be realistic, we are too small to truly make a large enough impact in any reasonable amount of time. The NCR, among others, are vastly larger than we are and are constantly expanding. Supposing we do manage to establish a base in the Divide, the NCR will come regardless. While we spend time and resources attempting to to ferry vault dwellers and so forth into the area they will be expanding towards us. It would be far more efficient to set up shop in the Mojave, giving us more time to prepare for the eventual incursions by other factions.
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[Good Morning America, I am free from corporate crunch hell. As such we will be returning to our regular broadcasting.]

There was a lot you wanted to do, a lot you needed to do over the next coming months, but you still needed to set aside some time to talk with the other members of the cell. The Last year two years have been a whirlwind of events. It'll do you well to just talk with some people and take a breath of fresh air... well whatever qualifies for fresh in the wasteland.

Still there were matters regarding the exodus that concerned you, but you wanted to get a feel for the matters before proposing any plans or calling a strategic meeting. You head down to your Father's Study, a place of retreat, one both of you had made use of in the past has basically become the distant cousin to the oval office here in California. It's where he does and takes most of his work and meetings at this point. You have to say the last few months have aged him quite a bit, you knew the stress of leadership was heavy having been responsible for the lives of your squad, but you see that it bears extra wait when you're in charge of an entire community.

You may not necessarily come to exact terms or agreement with how the Enclave is run at this moment, but you find it difficult to not respect the sheer magnitude of the task and your Father's earnest devotion to it. It wasn't but a few years prior that you had wondered whether or not your Father was just about ready to settle for his lot in life in the wasteland. The Fight was all but gone from him, your mother the only thing that was managing to stoke the flames with her firebrand preaching of old Enclave dogma.

He sat there his greying hair as he went over report after report, a huge map splayed over his table, coffee or what passed as coffee in a glass to the side of the map. His eyes were heavy, the computer screen illuminating the room with a pale green pallor that contrasted the bright florescent lights that were overhead. He grumbled to himself taking a sip of the drink on the table before noticing you at the door.

Didn't have the manpower for a secretary, and Mom was too busy handling tasks delegated to her to be both the first lady and the Vice President, so she was mostly just the Vice President.

He looks up at you, "Son, what do you need? I'm rather busy at the moment." he says not even gesturing to the mess of work that had become his study.

You step inside looking at the chair across from his own and he nods and you sit.
Clearing your throat, "I wanted to discuss the logistics of the exodus with you as well as a few operations that might help in securing some of those resources."

He takes a deep breath, "You, Nelson and Rockefeller each. I should bless my stars that I have such dedicated subordinates in this matter, but I find myself continually harried over the matter." He coughs, "Doesn't matter, go on what are your suggestions?"

[continue]
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