man nobody helped you?

I haven't GM'd in almost 15 years, but when I did I found having just a story concept facilitated a character driven adventure and was more fun all around.
My group wasn't too dedicated though, so having a vast story arch may work with different groups.

>>13131150
Pages 195, 196, and 211/212 for its effects.

Check the Postcombat section. Basically, Collatoral adds up during a battle, and afterwards you check how much Collat was caused on a chart to determine how much Surplus you get. Basically, the more property damage you do and the more money you have to sink into repairing the Evas, the less you've got for making GIANT LASERS and whatnot.

>>13131150

Okay, so. Here is the basic gist.

As the battle rages on, you probably end up trashing either the surrounding environment or your own Eva. The problem is that both of these are enormously expensive to repair. So, the more collateral damage you have at the end of the fight, the less money the UN has left over to send you to spend on now buildings or Research or stuff like that.

Collateral Damage is described on page 195, and Surplus (which collateral effects) is described on 211.

You probably are, but make sure you are using Adeptus Evangelion V2. Its flat out better than V1.

>>13131150

Tips:

Say "No" to players as little as possible. Instead, disincentivise them with consequences and let them dig their own graves.

Have a plot in mind, but don't set it in stone. Take inspiration from the things you see around you, and drop plot points steadily. Try and get players to create their own backstory and canon(make sure they're reasonable), and twist these things together to make it seem JUST AS PLANNED.

Do say no if you need to enforce purity of canon/reasonability. Some players are too terrible to know that their ideas suck(this depends on you being a good enough person to tell the difference)

Roll in secret. Fudge dice results when things are too hard/easy.

Create likeable(or hateable) NPCs who the players will care about. Strong emotion leads to attachment. You can invoke emotion simply by having a loved or hated NPC do a heel/face turn, either actively, or revealed later.

Find dedicated players who are all on the same page. I've been running a year, and I credit my game's success to my players. They're wonderful, dedicated, and all-around great people.

Remember that RPGs are a collaborative hobby. It's nice to let players have a hand in crafting the story. You are the GM, so you have most of the control, but make sure the ways they act and react matter. Take their ideas seriously.

>>13131277
Right, okay. Where does the surplus and actual purchasing of research fit into? What section is that?
>>13131276
Hella gracias for the specific pages, THG.
>>13131248
From what I've read up on the material, AE is a very character-driven story, and doesn't seem very suited for one-offs. That's actually part of the reason I want to get started on DH/AE's system.

>>13131371
No problem.

The thing about AdEva is that it's a rules-heavy, crunchy game that wants to be played almost like a freeform game. Absorb some of the weirder and more specific aspects, especially of DH as well.

The biggest point is in the end the characters though, yeah. In fact, we have a laundry list of good NPCs to have all prepared for situations like this. While not near every game can manage filling the entire thing out, it may give you ideas for angles you didn't realize could be covered.

>>13131410

I made a list of generic NPC roles for a standard AdEva campaign a while ago. The idea being you can just throw in a name, a single sentence description, and you can drop them in the middle of a scene if you see a need for them. The details you can just wing as you go on.

It covers potential recurring NERV staff, school environment NPCs, and generic characters the party can meet while doing their weekly training or just having a random life on the ground session.

NERV NPCs:
Commander
Vicecommander
Head of Security
Head of Science
Head of Medicine
Internal Communications Officer
External Communications Officer
Public Relations Director
Section II Agent
Technician

School NPCs:
Principal
Teacher of Generic Moderately Useful Class
Teacher of Joke Why Would You Do That Class
Teacher of Setting Specific Probably Important Class
Class Rep
Pilot Fan
Pilot Hater
Lazy Student
Romantic Interest
Backup Pilot

Other NPCs:
Gimmicky Shopkeeper A
Gimmicky Shopkeeper B
Annoying Neighbour A
Annoying Neighbour B
News Reporter
Crazy Gym Guy
Shooting Range Freak
Iaido Dojo Member
Library Owner
Bartender

Notes:
Many of these can be folded into each other to simplify things (the gimmicky shopkeeper is the class rep working part time, you have a bridge bunny as neighbour, NERV staff are the teachers, your classmates are all backup pilots, etc.)

>>13131305
V2? Is that the version that includes the Google Documents upgrades, or the one I got in pdf form? Some of the PDFs have v2 after them, so I'll assume that's what you're talking about.
>>13131359
So dice fudging is the mark of a good GM? Kidding. I have friends who like RPGs, although a few of them might be some of the annoying types.

>>13131465
The google thing was a leak of unfinished material. FORGET THEM~

But yes, if it has v2 on it, then it should be the right one. I'm not quite sure v1 is even up on /rs/ anymore.

As for dice fudging...well, it is always best to roll behind the screen and go with what's the most dramatically appropriate, whether that's for or against the players. Only make it obvious when you've saved their asses, though.

>>13131465

Dear god, yes. If you have a story to tell, fudge.

Halfway through my campaign, I basically told myself I wasn't going to kill the PCs. They were in it till the end.

And well, I'm the kind of person who, when a combat encounter is too easy, ramps it up secretly(in AdEva, where an angel attack is a singular encounter that may take a whole session, there's too much to lose in making a combat encounter boring)

I'll also make combats easier, or if a combat bogs down and becomes boring, will just say "Well, you guys have beat on it enough and you're obviously winning. Finish it and make it sound cool". I'm a storyteller at heart.

And yeah, nobody's great when they start out. It took me years to become a good roleplayer. I was pretty damn terrible when I started.

It takes a good environment with good people.

Always remember to declare as dramatically as possible: "ROLL TO CONFIRM RIGHTEOUS FURY!" It regularly makes that game mechanic infinitely more satisfying than simple critical hits.

>>13131305
So, the UN can afford to pay off dozens of points of collateral, or, if you do well, devote tons of Surplus to research. But if there isn't a battle in six months, you're still stuck with 1 Surplus per week. I mean, what the hell? So, the Angel attack spontaneously creates money to repair damage and supply projects?

For example, if you battle an Angel, there's collateral, sure. But unless you do fucking horribly, there's going to be at least a few points of Surplus earned as well. How can they afford to give you 1d10 or 20 or whatever it is for an average battle after there's been collateral, but they can't give you decent surplus when there aren't battles? I know it's likely for balance, but saying that they can afford to give you 20 Surplus from only inflicting ~10 Collateral during a battle that lasts only a few minutes yet can't give more than 1 Surplus per week when there's no battles and no repairs to be done just seems ridiculous.

Or at least, that's my unasked for two cents.

>>13131150
I tend to view AE this way.
Are you in combat? No? Then you probably dont need to worry about rolling for most things. You get the knowladge, skill, and ability checks for stuff like fixing a car, picking a lock, convenceing the section 2 agents that you totally did not swipe that book without paying for it when you have a salary, that kind of thing.

Doing virtually anything with your Eva? Rollin time. the game seems to lend itself to three modes of play.

Hanging out slice of life style freeforming: cooking dinner, getting supplys from the store, keeping from going crazy due to bordom during class, sitting on standby in the breakroom, ect.

Investigating mysterys social working: Trying to get permission for a school trip, figuring out who disassembled the engine on your motorcycle and rebuilt it on your bed while you were out, convencing the scientific director that a wrestling match in your Eva will provide good data, negotiating with the majority shareholder of a major corperation so you can get their sweet prototype Trident for the next operation. That kind of thing calls for some rolling to modify their actions.

Dramatic Action: Guy in front of you in line pulls out a gun to rob the 7-11, Terrorists pick the worst bus load of children to hold hostadge, Suddenly JSSDF commandos EVERYWHERE. An angel attacks, get to da choppa! The new NERV base MAGI have turned homicidal, take your Evas and smash our commando team a way inside. this is where all that crunch comes in.

>>13131631
Actually, they're supposed to be reserve funds only to be given to NERV in the case of an Angel attack. Whatever's left over from the standard package after repairs is what goes into research. After all, the UN doesn't want to pour the world's money into something that may end up killing two aliens then never doing a thing for years, no matter how wrong that is.

>>13131631

It's a plot abstraction.

Hell, in most games, NERV is depicted as destitute and lazy, and only after fights, do scientists get up off their asses when they realize if they don't develop some shit, that they'll all die, and thus, innovation follows combat. Either that, or scraps recovered from the angel during the fight spurs technical innovation.

>>13131631

Rather than the UN, its the Committee which gives out the money, but the Committee is also SEELE, and SEELE appears to know when it is that Angels attack, with the bonus that they also don't want NERV to be more powerful than strictly needed.

They quite simply only give away money after every Angel attack because they're douches, in essence.

>tyrannical ropershy

>>13131150

Have a plan! This goes double for AdEva, where by nature of most set-ups will have trouble coming to the players, as opposed to the players looking for trouble. The set-up means that the PCs react to GM actions, as opposed to most fantasy adventurer style campaigns where the GM reacts to PC actions. Sandboxing is very, very hard in the default AdEva setup.
A good AdEva campaign should have a definite beginning, middle, and end-game - it should play out similarly to a TV series, with things slowly building together over time.

Having a good idea of where you want the campaign to go and play out. A good way to structure it is to pick a number of Angels to throw at your players, along with any relevant plot twists/politicking, then set a ratio of non-combat sessions to combat sessions.

A sample campaign might be for example, 11 angels + 1 personal scale combat encounter. Then perhaps you'll want one noncombat session for each combat session, which means 24 sessions total. If you play once a week, you'll be done in 6 months - a fairly reasonable timeframe.

Don't be afraid to restrict the technology options and pace them out in order to preserve the campaign balance. Players who do very well could have S2 drives or other very powerful weaponry by the third Angel you throw at them if they decide to spend all their points on the tech. Players are usually okay with the tech restrictions if you're up-front about it, and some players might even enjoy the challenge.

>>13131672
>>13131669
>>13131651
Ah, okay then. Thanks. Fucking SEELE...

>>13131794
Understood. Campaigns sure are involved, aren't they...

I DO like the idea of ground combat, especially >>13131634 's idea of terrorists being stupid and grabbing the Children's bus. I need a very definite idea of the endgame, huh? A always did like the idea of having a Metatron/Apocalyptic angel as the final encounter, but what sort of Third Impacts do you people like?

>>13131651
my favorate explanation for that odd funding mechanic so far is "An angel could have killed everyone in this city. Here is a huge mound of cash... are the press gone? Ok. Now STOP ASKING ME FOR MONEY, GOD ALMIGHTY!" combined with 'every NERV branch on the planet is competeing for the same pool of funds, when you win a battle, we ride that for every haypenny its worth.' the other one is "We have a god damn world to rebuild, we can't afford to hand over cash gotten by starving people to NERV every damn month without a good reason."

There are several ways to work it. the most negative is perhaps "Listen to me, we are handed a large sum of money after a battle to fix things, then I get the cheapest contractors possible so we have this surplus. tens of thousands starve so you people have ammunition, and pleanty more will die because of me cutting costs and hording that money meant for reconstruction for our use. They starve for food, or you starve for ammo, and if you starve they die anyhow. This is war, get used to it kid."

>>13131907

It doesn't need to be ultra-definite, especially not at the beginning. In fact, I'd recommend against fleshing out your end-game in too much detail - it's easier to incorporate player input.

What's more important is the pacing - that you actually get to an awesome end-game. If you don't have a big picture idea of when to start putting things into gear then it's very easy for the campaign to run on past the point of player interest.

>>13131907
In the end, AE is an incredibly GM-intensive system. While it wouldn't be my first choice for a first attempt in GMing, at least without having gone through it as a player, but it can work.

Now, third impact. Basically if you're absolutely idea-stumped, wait for the non-apocalyptic plots to develop and see what the most natural end for the group would be. Don't be afraid to have players talk and work with you privately, especially if one of them actually OFFERS to be the endboss or something. Whatever it is, don't have it come out of nowhere. Prepare for it, introduce it in some way beforehand, set it up. Maybe even make an entire final arc out of it.

>>13131950

To elaborate on this, a lot of the advancement in AdEva eventually caps out, and the general setting is the "eve of the apocalypse" so to speak.

In regular fantasy adventurer campaigns you could probably always manufacture another plot hook or location to keep players from burning out, but AdEva is definitely geared towards telling a story.

Also, you may want to consider messing around with the default mythology. Many AdEva campaigns usually throw in some sort of gimmick. Some campaigns use alternate mythologies, like Aboriginal or Arthurian motifs. Other campaigns change the time period, like having steampunk-styled Evas in the 40s and 50s.

How important is it for there to be an operations director in the PCs camp? Are they utterly screwed without one, or will there be difficult RPing issues?

armisael and arael have got to be WAY Bigger than that. Arael was in fuckin' space! Though I guess the Lance was fairly large in comparison...

>>13132062
I'd recommend having the requisite Gendo figure have some basic OD talents (precision targeting, dummy plug, remote care, research IOU, etc.) in case absolutely nobody wants to play one. A game without one entirely is both easier and more difficult--on one hand, there are now a lot of resources and tools denied you, but on the other hand you don't have one player doing an entirely different game than the rest of them at points.

>>13132062

The Operations Director can easily be handled as a GM PC if necessary. You can always handwave the initial interception phase. There might be a little adjustment needed but it can be cut as a PC role if needed.

Well, under advice its been suggested I leave this link here.

http://pastebin.com/zfpRZ5UB

Its a long and arduous rant I wrote that covers some of the most common mistakes we've seen happen with campaigns of Adeptus Evangelion in the past. Naturally some of these will seem obvious and goddamn its long, but if you plan on GMing AdEva, its well worth a read, or so I am told by current feedback.

>>13132062
Pretty important. Though the OD in the actual anime is Misto, in AdEva they really play a roll in between Misato and Gendo. What with things like When Suddenly... and having contacts, etc, and being in charge of things like shocks to help them in cases of Insanity or feedback or to keep them from going too high in SR.

While it's not required, it'll certainly suffer if you don't have one, and while the OD could be an NPC that puts unnecessary pressure on YOU, the DM. If none of the players wants to be an OD, then it won't kill the game but it will be a bit more difficult.

>>13131907
Actually the general plan for the game I am running now is to not really have a third impact. all the ingrediants get trashed in the 30 xanitos pileup, and the world falls into infighting. I mena, look at EoE, at least two 3I's are attempted, and in the end everyone's plans are screwed.

thing about personal scale combat is that its extremely high risk compared to Eva combat. (to your life, not your sanity and individuality). when you can survive perhaps 20-30 wounds worth of damage (counting soak and perhaps armor) and everything does 1d10+X... the thing about a Apoclaiptic level final angel in counter (in my view) is that every angel should feel that way. something like sachiel feels that way because the PC's have never done this before. Zuriel speaks for himself/herself/itself. Ramiel nearly has to throw the fight for the PC's to win. (Infinate range GPC, reaction to shoot you with it.) and then you have good old Tabris, it of the ATS 40, remote Eva jacking shennanigans who could just smash into terminal dogma and end the world before anyone can do a damn thing. (Hell, he is a nightmare in direct combat. -30 size to hit him, immense ATS and light of the soul combined with things like Rising Cross and Angels Cross)

>>13131631
Don't forget, the world is in fucking shambles. Literally every dollar the UN has is what is pretty much feeding every person on earth and building every house. There's few countries, and most of the population is homeless and starving. The "apocalypse" hit with Second Impact. You're trying to stop worse.

I assume the surplus they give you is 1 + however much your OD can get out of them. If there's a ton of damage, you just say "I need a ton of money" and then its spent. If there's left over, thats what makes up the 1d10+ that you receive.

So, I have a question. What with Angels having x2 TB, AP up the wazoo, and multiple locations with sometimes monstrous amounts of wounds, how are the players expected to kill them in a reasonably quick (real-time) fashion, or even damage them at all? For example, say you have an Angel with 5 AP on its body and 40 T. Even if an Eva hits it, you've got 13 points of damage soak right there. If the Eva's using anything but some heavy-ass weaponry, nothing gets through. Is there something I'm missing here?

>>13132307
You either need to be using heavy weapons or weapons with high RoF in hopes of triggering Fury. Weapons with Tearing are also good for this.

>>13132335
And that's the only solution? What's the point of any of the normal weapons, then, if your Skirmisher can't deal any damage with his pimped-out Bolter? Has anyone tried doubling TB for purposes of Wound calculation, but leaving it as is for damage soak?

>>13132307
Look at it this way. A comparable DH enemy to an angel should be a lone boss fight that can still pose a challenge while being vastly outnumbered.

The players find ways to hurt these things. Generally via righteous fury. Trust me on this. TBx2 and reasonable AP is utterly necessary for them to survive even a round.

I ran an angel with 50 body wounds and TB12. It had to burn fate in the first round of combat.

>>13132307


Early game, it can be rough. And mid-game, if your group is unoptimized it can also be rough against Zeruel-level enemies with exotic abilities.

But late game? Expect to see the damage-focused players do earth-shattering amounts of damage. Berserkers and Skirmishers can dish it out. Likewise, ATTs can bypass damage reduction, and pointmen get a suite of damage-mitigation abilities, good weapons access, and only slightly lag behind skirmishers in the melee department.

It's not uncommon for an endgame berserker to deal in the neighborhood of 2d10+12 and up progressive with a weapon, or do 1d10+1d5+12 flexible, tearing with unarmed attacks, crit+1d5-1, and they get swift attack, and rarely miss.

In v2, skirmishers can literally get 4 attacks, using shell shock(with an integrated, auto-aiming boltpistol no less) or positron breach before laying into the enemy with a hyperprogressive weapon that erodes AT Fields, doing TONS of damage.

>>13132307

You target the weakest limbs. Arms and Head will do nicely, as their limbs go down they will start to take heavy penalties to everything (including that damn TB).

Just be mindful of heavy Regenerators and those with the Stuff of Nightmares trait.

But yes, defeating Angels is more often than not an endurance battle.

>>13132307

You have to remember that the Eva's have the Angel outnumbered. Simply put, you get so many more chances to hit it than it has to hit you that even WITH that damage soak in games with more than 4 Evas the battles become almost pathetically easy unless the GM really steps up their game.

Which is something we intend to fix, BTW.

>>13132360
Well, that's really the only way I've been able to see it. On the one hand, Angels are supposed to be tough. In the reference material (ie the anime) you rarely saw the Angel taking little bits of damage over time before becoming overwhelmed. It was always one or two good hits that ended them. I mean, how long did Shinji wail on Sachiel/Shamshel (I forget which)'s core before he finally got a Fury and it broke?

You're right though, essentially relying on luck with everything except heavy weapons isn't as fun. Personally, I've been using a couple of house rules. One is that for every full 2 points of penetration left over after negating an Angel's AC, the Angel's TB is lowered by 1 for that attack. So if the Angel has AC 3 and takes a hit from an AP 5 weapon, they not only don't gain the benefit of their armor but also subtract one less from the total damage due to TB.

>>13132434
This works for the low levels, but when everyone can afford to have a progsword, GPC or heavy bolter and when the ATT group synchs with everyone that isn't neutralizing to fire off 1d10+20 blasts that ignore fields or 4d10 blasts that ignore EVERYTHING, you may want to rethink this.

Of course we're fixing all of this, though. AdEva is an incomplete product.

>>13132552

It's even slightly overpowering at low levels, due to Precision Targeting, which is an OD staple.

>>13132552
Oh, I'm aware of that. It just means that the Angels are going to be a bit tougher. Also, there's the possibility to throw things at them that aren't as easy to deal with. That prog sword won't help much of the Angel is in space and you've only got the two prototype suits that the Base starts with, and a heavy bolter probably won't work as effectively if the Angel is near the bottom of a deep-sea trench, etc.

>>13132434
High lethality weaponry, especially melee weapons where you can have nice dice, progressive, good AP, and stack stregnth bonius on top of that makes angel killing possible. Aside from positron and bolt weapons, your goal is to spam bullets and hope for that lucky hit when in ranged fighting. Melee is much more decisive. (rather fitting with the show here) When a good melee fighter RF's things tend to lose a limb, burn fate, or die immediately. That said I have been poking around with more ways to temporarily lower an angels Toughness soak. The really fun part comes when players realize that any weapon that can down an angel will do ruinius damage on a hit to an Eva.

>>13132681
Except that non-heavy Positron weapons aren't that good for damage either. The much-vaunted ability to penetrate AT-Fields doesn't matter when your shots are only doing 1d10+1 damage AP 3. An Angel with 10 TB and AC 3 (an "average" angel, if you will) will ignore that literally nine times out of ten. Only on a 10 will you do any damage, and if you don't confirm Fury it's only 1 damage.

It really does mean that better damage with few shots trumps many shots with less damage. You're absolutely right, Melee weapons are a good choice because of the bonus damage from Strength, getting to roll an extra damage die and drop the lowest, and so on.

Yet on the other hand, the weapons Angels have available to them can put all that to shame too. As has been said earlier, just look at Ramiel. Fucker's got a GPC as his main weapon and can use it as a Reaction Action. Then you've got Zeruel with his foil arms of death, etc etc etc. And that's not even mentioning AT Powers which Angels can use much less conservatively given their high SR. Whereas a PC with 7 ATS using AT Wave sacrifices almost all their ATS and deflecting ability to use that single power, and Angel can use it and still have 100% or more chance to deflect. Granted, there's neutralization, but if it's engaged at a distance to begin with and can fire at the PCs at range, the first few turns it can pretty much go wild.

Now, I'll admit, I'm no expert. I've only been in 2 AE games, and didn't GM either time, only fought 3 Angels total. But from what I've seen and experienced, it does make Angels a bitch to deal with at first. I don't have experience with the higher levels of AE, having never gotten there myself. Maybe it really does get easier like BMJ and others have been saying in the thread, but at the beginning at least you're struggling to even hurt the damn things.

>>13132779
Ramiel's specific weakness, surprisingly enough, is ignoring everything they did in the show and piling up on melee.

However, the first two or three angels SHOULD be rather weak anyway to compensate for your relative suck. If you're going 800 experience per Angel, then they should get to acceptable levels of talents.

Plus there's also general newness to the system, forgetting rules, etc. Everyone struggles with Sachiel the very first time they encounter it because they forget situational modifiers and how certain rules work.

Just rewatch the last two Episodes of of Neon Genesis after staying up for 48 hours.

mybrainisfulloffuck.jpg

>>13132841
How does piling in on him work? I mean, figuring a generous two rounds of him shooting before they get to him should be enough to disarm an EVA. Or disleg. Or.... you get the joke. And then once they're in CC with him, it can still shoot at you as a reaction, can't it? Not to mention, even if you negate its AT field, you're still looking at TB 4 and AC 10.

And this all assumes it pops up right over Nerv and starts drilling. What happens if it acts smart and comes down away from the base, a few kilometers away, say, and thus gives itself plenty of time to shoot the EVAs as they try to close the distance?

I'm sorry if it seems like I'm constantly throwing aside what you're saying over the past few comments, but these are just things that I know I'd do as a GM to up the challenge, and I figured it would be good to bring it up. I mean, Ramiel is a Distance Fighter. Sure, his Perception sucks but you'd think he'd put his average Int to the fore and realize that getting right on top of them where they can get to him is a BAD IDEA (tm). Not to mention, even if you try to GPC him, why wouldn't he strike out first? It always bugged me that he didn't just blast the GPC in the anime as they were setting it up. It seems like his real weakness is that he ONLY reacts, never acts.

>>13132779
an angel with 50 toughness (avridge was 30-40 range) is clearly a frontal assault angel, and the random creation rules explicitly limit their toughness in the opening stages, for that very reason. T soak being upericable makes it the end all be all of defense against damage, because it extends to every body part. An angel with armor 10 on the torso and core and a soak of 4 but with limbs to blow off is not as tough as it seems, because you can blow off limbs to trash its Toughness soak. (I had a simulated sachiel down to 1 soak, due to PC's deciding to called shot both arms off.) The soak issue is part of why I am seriusly considering a weapon effect that forces a toughness test to avoid having your TB halved for 1d5 rounds. (Thinking radiation poisioning here)

part of it is that an Angel needs to be able to threaten to exterminate the party, every single fight. Angel fights are not that often of an event, think of them as chapter bosses ala Diablo 2.

>>13132947
Alright, there's one thing you have to remember here: The movement system is rather broken. Either you can close most distances easily in one turn with a single use of Float, or you take three rounds to get into melee, depending on whether your AB is above or below 4.

When they're actually there, well... THIS is a bit of an assumption, but if you have a pointman, it can just afford to lose both its arms. Ramiel itself has two shots a turn and needs to target the same person with them to guarantee a hit, because the first one has an alright chance of just being dodged.

Now once everyone's in there, it just doesn't have enough actions to keep up unless it called shots heads while using Wrap Beam--but even then, that's leaving the others open to attack it while it focuses on one target.

Though regarding your previous post, you are right about positron weapons. Aside from the GPC, they suck unless you're a skirmisher that abuses Accurate, but that works with ANY Basic weapon. But again, unfinished product in that regard.

>>13133008
Hmm, I see what you mean about movement. Got a Skirmisher with Agi Bonus 4 and Sprint in one of the games. 96 DM a round. Then again, that's where starting off several MILES away comes in, and since Ramiel has essentially infinite range, it can afford to attack from such a distance. Or hell, it can float. Just go into orbit and hit them from there..... I guess I'm kind of reaching at this point.

>>13133042
You kind of are, but these sorts of questions are good to put to light. There's a lot of stuff we've already found and are covering, but sometimes a realization hits us out of nowhere.

>>13132947
Ramiel should not even bother with the dril. Just keep firing until you melt your way in. Ramiel is ultimately undone because its single minded obscession with its goal and infinite patience screws it over. Aside from the dick move of using Ramiel as an orbital sniper, or hiding in a blizzard and using AT Ping to find targets before roasting them like chestnuts, or blasting your way underground and tunneling into the objective and such, Ramiel presents the first "think about it" fight if your just going to run the cannon angels in order. Ramiel's ability to pop heads via called shot BS 90 wrap beam with a reroll shennigans means direct assaults are scuicide if you ask me. Ramiel is an example of angel where how the GM plays it ditermines how dangerous it is. Hand the task of playing Ramiel over to the players, and watch them come up with a set of devious nightmare plans. Actually, I might do that for a scession, have their scientific director set up some sims with known angel data, and watch them try to 'get inside the enemys head...core...whatever.'

I tried AdEva once was somewhat interesting but very weird and psychological, our mechs we found out, were the 4 horsemen of the apocalypse, that the angels are actually an alien race running tests to see for themselves if there truly is free will and earth was one of these testing grounds. Shit goes wrong when two of the assistants(Adam and Lilith) of the entity monitoring earth (Yahweh) rebel trying to speed up the progress of the experiment by influencing mankind taking many angels with them. Our mechs were the failsafe, but yahweh prevents the total annihilation of the planet because it wants to see the result of humanity in the face of this challenge so our mechs are pretty much degraded to keeping the status quo ie eliminating angels (and i mean eliminate with extreme prejudice when our gm let our mechs unleash their true forms they were unstopable War could take down hundreds of angels at a time no sweat, the gm would only limit it to one mech at a time and only when he deemed it necessary).

>>13133142
Indeed. In the end, it all comes down to the GM. I mean, how dangerous would the Angels be if they actually had some brains? Like, oh, hey, these EVA things are actually damaging me. Imma retreat and come back later to try again before they can fully repair the damage I've done. Maybe change my form to better repel them next time too."

The Angel's greatest undoing for the most part really seems like their choice, or inability, to think in the long term. Then again, as they're not human we can't really blame them for not thinking like we would, but still.

>>13133180
the endgame was ok, while we fought the rei entity we weren't the ones to kill it, yahweh deems that mankind's choice on will or instrumentality needs to be chosen by one who is pure and unaltered, a little boy who is the son of one of the soldiers who was killed during an angel raid. Us keeping the status quo allowed him to make the proper choice, that while mankind was coaxed by adam and lilith man did all the work, man made art, science, literature, the good and bad traits of his legacy by himself that even though instrumentality into a collective is an ideal paradise where your problems are worried by someone else, it is the basis that it is the individual who makes up the group is greater than the idea of a collective group for without the individual there no change or growth everything would be stagnate the ideas of one person can move many into something greater. Yahweh grants the boy true knowledge and wisdom of the universe and he ascends to an entity equal to that of the Rei (to the theme of Queens Bohemian Rhapsody, no seriously, our the guy running it claimed it as a song representing the greatest beauty of mans spirit while being the opposite of ode to joy was bohemian rhapsody) and then preceedes to defeat it while we prevent the angels from interfering and aiding rei. In the end Choice overcomes fate and instrumentality and the world is to reset mankind is returned to it's state from the Lcl and life goes on as normal. We were thinking of maybe continuing it by introducing Lucifer as manipulator behind Adam and Liliths rebellion, in that it didnt care about the experiment so it made lilith and adam rebel so the world would be scrapped by the horsemen and abandoned so he could swoop in and remake the world in his image, and since that planned failed he decides to launch his own attack on earth and we would start fighting demons, but it kinda got derailed after endgame.

>>13133384
sry for unending sentence i didnt realize i was using comas instead of periods

>>13133244
so... Sukiel Angel of Bravery? I used an angel whos entire stick was that tactic. It rolled twice and chose the better on regeneration tables, and once you knocked it into critical wounds at all, anywhere on its body, it started charging up its photon sucking in black wings of Mach 25 exit stratgy. Dinged around the world a couple of times, trashing Nerv bases and getting critically hurt to pick up a new trick. Then the PC's shot him with a GPC a second time, and followed it up with melee to finish Sukiel off.

it started out with 1 weak attack and a neat trick to hide its core. It wound up larger size catagory with flexable limbs and glowing energy damage pen 6 melee attacks, along with learning every AT power and spread pattern they used. Also a fear 4 retaliation for hitting its core. This is the pic I used to start with.

>>13133571
Fucking nice.

>>13133571

I personally love the idea of an Angel, perhaps even the second or third one your players meet, managing to escape. Then, about a dozen sessions later when the Endgame is finally in sight, have the bastard show up again tricked out to all hell and wearing absorbed trophies from Eva from other NERV branches.

>>13134250
I remember hearing about an Angel that was like a living eva carrier that flew. It would abduct Evas, upgrade them, and take control of them or something.