>>7985793

crossover is wod's cancer

>>7985844
sadly agree, good anon

maybe I'm just not the superfriends type though

>>7985793
i think that certain areas would have supernatural populations that reflect the setting, like in NW America a large number of wolfblood line would be of Indian and farmer (pioneer) descent, and the changeling population would largely reflect indian myths or modern urban legends. Detroit would have a large number of prometheans and geists to reflect its decaying nature. In Shadows of Mexico it covers a large segment of the local werewolf and vampire population as being descended from Aztec stock, also conquistadors brought European vampires with them.

>>7985873
You're a triptroll, not worthy of the attention I express with this post. I'm just feeding the troll.

>>7985844
Disagree.

Crossover is practically what it was made for. Otherwise, they'd use vastly different systems.

It's like going: "We're playing 4E. If we use classes and races from Divine Power, we can't use any races from the PHB."

>>7985793

Changelings can effectively work with anyone, since they don't have any great overarching plans or plots and just want to be left the hell alone. If working together with some Vampires will get rid of the Hunter network that's been making life difficult for both of them, well, that's what they'll do.

>>7985844
crossover is perfectly fine if done right, therein is the problem: most asshats just can't do it, because they have to be the super-special all-powerful attention whore.

Anyone else find the chick in the OP's image unbearably cute?

Anywhere with tall buildings is Mage territory.

>>7985938
help me be better, anon

vampires would probably be more abundant in large cities, yeah?

are there hillbilly vampires living in tiny towns in the american southwest?

>>7985979
Yes. Every fucking time it gets reposted.

>>7985996
yeah i think there is one group called the gethsiem (sp.?) that are redneck vamps.

>>7985979

I do, even if that's partly because short tomboys with glasses are my "thing" for some reason. Never mind the fur, I'd still do her.

>>7985995
Oh god. Mages of Dubai? This requires more detail.
>>7985950
Until the vampires find out Changelings are delicious and begin to harvest them.
>>7985979
It's just the exaggerated nipples.

>>7986025

>gethsiem
You mean Gethsemani? They're a religious Nosferatu bloodline.

Oberlochs very much fit the redneck hick stereotype, though.

Also,
>>7985996
>yeah?
STOP THAT. RIGHT NOW GODDAMNIT.

>>7986061
I think there's also appeal in the fact that she's dressed normally and has a fairly normal-looking body (aside from the fey-ness).

>>7986116
Perhaps that also helps, yes.

>>7986099
you are right, i fucked up. i don't many of the vamp bloodlines except the Ancient bloodlines, and those whacky Spina.

>>7986061
>Mages of Dubai?
There are more places than Dubai with tall buildings.

Mages draw power from Mana Hollows which are more powerful the higher up off the ground they are.

>>7986116
Dressed normally? She's a sceneemogothpunkrocker. Just look at her. You're attracted to that hipster trash?

>>7986146
Still, I wouldn't be surprised if the Burj Dubai is a secret Mage research complex.

>>7986136

Spina are fucking awesome. Always wanted to play one

>>7986061
yeah I think I'd have a greater appreciation for pointlessly sexualized women in fantasy art if they resembled normal people at all

Australia's gotta be lycanthrope territory, at least in the Outback. Nothing else could survive there.

>>7986250
maybe a gangrel or a beast changeling, but they would be rare. I have this idea of the outback being a common area for prommies too though.

WoD Crossovers are shit, always have been shit, always will be shit. The systems are the same not because they are meant to be played side-by-side, but because A) WW is too lazy to invent whole new systems for different games, and B) they figure you dickheads will buy more books of they "work together."

Long story short: The dominant supernaturals in a given area either the PCs or the antagonists, because either the PCs have to hide from/overthrow the other supernatural group, or stop the NPCs from doing likewise.

Too much crossover fucks the settings. The supernatural communities canonically don't interact at the starting-PC level much, and it should stay that way.

>>7985942
>It's like going: "We're playing 4E. If we use classes and races from Divine Power, we can't use any races from the PHB."

Actually, it's more like going "D&D is d20. So is this Modern supplement! Of course they were made to cross over!"

>>7986373
ORCS!!! WITH GUNS!!!!

>>7986373
D20 Modern and D&D use entirely different mechanics. There are very few similarities.

This does not apply to WoD species.

>>7986317

This may have been true of oWoD, but not so much for nWoD. These game lines HAVE been designed to fit together with each other better. Not perfectly, but better. It's always up to the players and the GM to make sure it's all working right.

And again on the fluff-side. It's not "canon" for the races to be at each others throats anymore. There are several cases in the core rulebooks of vampires and werewolves working together, for example.

>>7986460
This.

It was cancer in oWoD.
Not in nWoD

>>7986419
4e D&D maybe
3/3.5 D&D, no not a lot.

>>7986460
>>7985977

these guys have got it right, In oWoD it was a mechanical nightmare, and it made no sense to fluff-wise. In nWoD it's doable but likely to fail due to idiot players/poor storytelling.

>>7986460
>>7986490
>>7986505

So, the take-home message is: Crossovers are no longer a nightmare in terms of mechanics or setting, just a headache in terms of theme and the inevitable Superfriends?

>>7986505
Especially those parties that don't bother to learn the difference.

Then start listing things that could go wrong in crossover games.
Maybe some ways to fix them will arise.

>>7986460
>And again on the fluff-side. It's not "canon" for the races to be at each others throats anymore. There are several cases in the core rulebooks of vampires and werewolves working together, for example.

Actually, I've been running a vampire game for a friend, and I did some cramming to know what the stuff I'd need to know is. Vampire makes "Lupines" out to be the boogeymen.

the thing to remember when running a Crossover game is... there's less emphasis on the "groups". Ordo Dracul, Invictus, Blood Talons, Storm Lords, Free Council, Adamantine Arrow... All that stuff doesn't matter as much, because not everyone in the party will care about them. Leave them by the wayside, bring them up sparingly.

The best way to run a crossover game is to throw out the whole "Superfriends" idea, and run a down-and-dirty close-knit game. Focus on the smaller picture of protecting families, friends, neighborhood against the darkness. "Monster of the Week" works really well. Things just get complicated when you throw politics into it

>>7986689
yes.

>>7986741
Idiots try to project oWoD cross over problems into nWoD... problem.
They are summarily executed... problem fixed.

>>7986777
That said, that's just a minor thing.

Supernaturals are incredibly capable of getting along once they get over their fear and paranoia.

Block By Bloody Block shows how well they can.

The main problem is creating a problem where a Vampire, Changeling, and Werewolf would want to work on the same thing without them being friends.
But then again, that depends on what kind of tone you want.

Do you like it where Supernaturals are few and far between? Is a Vampire unlikely to ever see another besides his Sire? Will a Werewolf ever be more than a Ghost Wolf, because she'll never see a member of the tribes? Will a Changeling escape from the Hedge only to find no one like himself?

Or is it like Dresden Files, where everyone is at least partially familiar with everyone else, and the principle of like calling to like is followed?

>>7986793
or you could use the groups as common ground, for example a iron master, an ordo dracul, and a free council might all have interest in the same macguffin.

or you could run your game like this.

>>7986317

This this this this.

I ran a nWoD crossover once, and it was fun, but it wasn't horror.

It just gets stupid when there's more than one supernatural.

Let vampires live with vampires, let Changelings be with changelings.

>>7986793
I don't think that WoD does MotW very well. I mean, it can, there's always a Supernatural type game, but I don't think that's what it's best for.

And you can always get politics involved. The clash between the Ventrue Prince and the Fairest Vernal King could create an incredibly good chronicle. I mean, hell, one of my Mage detective's clients is the former Summer Lord.
That said, I never much care for the politics anyway, because the best way to do a political game is to force everyone into the same group, or to have them as some cross group superfriends. And that's superfriends of just being a motley of Spring, Summer, Autumn, and Winter changelings, or Invictus, Lancae Sanctum, and Ordo Dracul vampires.

The problem with protecting family being the goal is that... why would the others care about your families?

>>7986689
Not nessesarily. The different "supers" all have radically different power levels, or at least work in incredibly different ways. For example, changelings or mages can control fire from very early on, which basically means vampires and prometheans stand no chance againsts them.

Also, geists are ridiculous.

>>7986862

A BPRD nWoD game.


would that work?

>>7986862
This.

Give everyone a problem where they have to work together. Something I've wanted to try is a crossover of the Big Three where someone is killing supernaturals and stealing their bodyparts.

Nothing brings a Mage, Werewolf, and Vampire together like someone killing Mages, Werewolves, and Vampires.

I always thought there'd be communities of Prometheans out in nuclear test zones... like in the desert in Nevada or something.

There's more vampires than anything else, seeing as they basically spread much like AIDS.

Step 1: All PCs were related in mundane life (cousins, went to college together).
Step 2: ????
Step 3: Supernatural hijinks ensue.

>>7986973
Very well.

>>7986948
Mages control it at the 3rd dot of Forces, Changelings at the second dot of Elements (and only if they choose Fire as their element).

Prometheans can also send out a jolt of Torment charged aggravated damage early on, and can rip apart a werewolf.
Vampires have Claws of the Wild at Protean 3, which because someone was stricken with the dumb, does AGGRAVATED damage.
At 3 dots, The Pyre-Flame Rage becomes real fire instead of bashing damage burns.


Everyone can kill everyone.

What does that have to do with working together? As long as the Mage or changeling don't set themselves on fire three feet from the vampire and he goes into Rotschreck and freaks the fuck out, what does it matter? They're not killing each other.
Also mages aren't as strong as they're made out to be.

It would be far better if there were no crossovers, because then the system could be better tweaked to each supernatural.

The nWoD system does a poor job of reflecting each supernatural. It's best for mortals.

>>7987024

step 2 for vamps and changelings = "raep" and mindraep.

>>7986973
im tossing the idea around in my head. you could do it two ways, everyone is hunter, or second sight books. with access to the TF: Valykrie, malleus maleficum, and Aegis (those relic guys) endowments. Or you could be a large number of supernaturals. abe sapien with his lack of memories, affinty for water, and surreal backstory (geneticists on a south pacific island hundreds of years ago turn him into what he is now) could easily be explained by a durance for a swimmerskin changeling.

>>7986978
>Nothing brings a Mage, Werewolf, and Vampire together like someone killing Mages, Werewolves, and Vampires.

See, I would think nothing drives paranormal types apart like someone killing members of their group.

"Oh, sure, the Vampires SAY they're taking casualties... but we all KNOW Griswold pissed off some of the bloodsuckers last year, and now he's DEAD."

>>7986973
roger is a promethean obviously, now what about Liz sherman, an Obrimos mage with control issues?

>Implying anyplace would have a big Promethean "Popultaion" or a population of prometheans of any kind.

Look how dumb you are!

I had a chronicle concept where all the supernaturals (except for Sin-Eaters) had been captured by a Hunter co-conspiracy plot and being used to track down and destroy threats like Infernals, Immortals and Slashers. They were each armed with a collar that would explode if they removed it with anything but the control in the hands of a couple Hunter wranglers. So, no mage hax or promethean strength to free them.

The more I think about the more I want to eliminate mages from the protagonist equation (make them bag guys) since they're over powered anyway. I'm leaving Sin-eaters open as an option for the Hunters if they should die.

>>7987043
Claws of the Wild is badly designed, a relic of oWoD which was translated into nWoD before the production team decided that aggravated damage would be much more serious. The later splats don't have this excuse.

>>7987043
>What does that have to do with working together?

I believe the point was that things that are "challenging" to certain supernatural types are a cakewalk to others - which was the problem in the oWoD. I don't know about the new one, but there was a sort of RPS dynamic. A PREPARED mage could school anyone, but he was squishy if caught unprepared. Weres were combat BEASTS on a moment's notice, but couldn't match the Mages for preptime or the Vamps for mindfuckery, Vamps had a fairly rounded centre...

Put them all together, and they essentially shored up each other's weaknesses and magnified their strengths. Not a bad thing, per se, but makes it hard to find good challenges for a party.

>>7987116
What would Hellboy be?
Krauss could just be a ghost, I guess.

Captain Daimio, my favorite, also brings up several questions. is he an ex-hunter who after his fateful encounter in the amazon became a geist? it makes sense, isn't there a geist archetype that involves dying in the wild/mauled by animals? or is he a werejaguar from the skinchangers book?

>>7987088
Actually the plot hook is that people are dying. It starts with fortune tellers who can tell fortunes, and then things like Wolfblooded and ghouls. It's only a matter of time before someone kills someone important.

The Big Three realize that this is something they need to work together on, and so the leaders of the city meet up, and arrange for the three players to work together to stop it.

It's basically like a Law and Order crossover episode.

>>7987198
hellboy would be a hunter based demon with dread powers, krauss is a ghost with medium merits and a suit.

>Implying that a population of prometheans would even be possible.

What the fuck is wrong with you guys?

>>7987088
More likely it would go along the lines of "The hell? Davis is gone? Anyone have any idea why? Didn't he have something to do with those vampires? That's probably it."

tl;dr, I doubt the vampires would publicise the fact that they're being hit.

>>7987131
Sin-Eaters have to have been sensitive to Death in some way, first.

That's something my Mage has needed to get around to save his friend from dying of cancer. I had to give him a magic relic that will let him see ghosts, but lose a dot of Morality so that he can bond with a geist when he kicks the bucket. I don't even know about the Geist, yet... this suddenly seems stupid. Maybe I should vet the thing first...

But yeah, there's a suggestion in Slasher of a Suicide Squad of crazy evil vampires and werewolves and slashers having bombs implanted in them and working for VASCU.

>>7987226
I imagine Prometheans living off the grid in hippy communes in the middle of nowhere.

>>7987203

IIRC, "low-level mages dying" was the plot of a recent Dresden Files novel. The idea being that a rogue sect wanted the White Council of wizards to declare war on the White Court of Vampires and vice versa.

Could work either way - I'm just saying, healthy paranoia is a natural response when members of your community die in odd ways.

>>7987121
>>7987226
>man nobody heard me the first time so i'd better repeat myself!

canonically there are promethean groups the population is migratory, but they have a centralized stopping point.
http://wiki.white-wolf.com/worldofdarkness/index.php?title=Chicago_Promethean_History

>>7987226
The original design intent for prometheans was for there to be about a dozen of them, in total, on Earth. It was pretty late on that they decided there should be thousands of them.

>>7987226

They're idiots who want to take something that's supposed to be horror, and turn it into The Dresden Files or some other bullshit.

Crap like this is why I play Unknown Armies.

>>7987253

TBH, I don't know that ANY supernatural community would advertise its weakness to another such community. Sounds like an invitation to raep.

I think your best bet would be to generate PCs that have some innate reason to trust each other (HA!), and who can discover the problems existing in all their communities. Then they have to act on their own to discover if there's a relationship without alerting higher-ups prematurely. Feels a bit more WoD to me, that way, less Superfriends/Scooby Gang.

>>7987286
Something like that. I think it was specifically that they wanted to kill the Ordo Lebes.

But the idea here is from Antagonists. There's a creature called a Thief that eats the organs of supernaturals to become more human, and get stronger.
At the same time, there was going to be a crazy Promethean trying to create THE BEST progeny ever in the hopes of achieving Mortality that way, who was going around killing supers and taking their body parts.
Took that idea from the first Dean Koontz' Frankenstein book.

The Thief would also have had a cult growing up around it.

>>7987310
I find Unknown Armies impossible to learn more about, because I can't get over the fact that there's magic based on fast food.

And what's wrong with Dresden Files? You can still have horror in a crossover. In fact, you can have MORE horror that way.
Do you think the average vampire is going to know what to do if they somehow accidentally summon an Abyssal creature?

Except the Khebit. They fight Cthulhu or some shit.

>>7987346
I don't think I'd want to be dragged into one of your superfriends adventures, lace

could maybe call a truce with the vampires to take out some well-armed band of hillbilly hunters

>>7987346

Nah, Ordo Lesbos just happened to be the weakest "wizards" around - it was happening in several places. One of the White Court vamps wanted to prove the Wizards were too weak to protect their own, forcing the White King to either throw in with the war started by the Red Court, or risk being overthrown by the bloodline that was killing the weaker mages.

However, it WAS eventually solved by two mages and a vampire, with some help from a fairy, IIRC. So it might still provide a bit of a crossover template...

>>7987384
Hey there, little one. We know where you are. We're tracking you. I'll rip your traitorous throat out!

>>7987384

Moment of Personal Horror: When hillbilly hunter informs one of the vampires he "Sho' got a purty mouth."

>>7987394
>However, it WAS eventually solved by two mages and a vampire, with some help from a fairy, IIRC. So it might still provide a bit of a crossover template...
That's not how I remember it.

The way I remember it, it was Wardens Dresden and Ramirez going in strapped to the nines ("Want a grenade?" "Nah, I'm good"), then in the middle of the duel, opening up a portal in the Nevernever where MARCONE'S SHEER AWESOMENESS killed all the vampires. All of them.

Seriously, dude's a badass.
Marcone is the best character in the series.
Ramirez, with all his talk of sexual conquests is also great ("You brought me a /virgin/?!")
And we can't forget Michael.

Wait, what were we talking about again?

>>7987367

No, it's a group of adepts that put magick in fast food. Though theoretically, you could have a school of magic based on obesity, and eat at fast food joints all day.

Besides, Mac Attax is going to get destroyed when The New Inquisition or someone like that finds them an annoyance.

>>7987367
>I find Unknown Armies impossible to learn more about, because I can't get over the fact that there's magic based on fast food

It's not based on fast food. It's based on using the most ubiquitous corporate mascot in the world to bring about a magical renaissance - magic for EVERYBODY - whether the rest of the mages, or the rest of humanity, for that matter, want it or not. In the setting, the Max Attak are responsible for the general feel of peace and good cheer that greeted Y2K instead of computers crashing, anger and warfare.

I think some cities can totally harbor many different kinds of supernatural that don't interfere with each other.

Take Paris. Between the Gay Paree rife with Glamour for Changeling, the huge city for Vampires, the violent suburbs that make for great Werewolf territories, the people of cultural and financial power hopping around some neighborhoods for Mages, the annual death count for Sin-Eaters...
And Paris is big enough to have all of this at the same time. And their plots don't even have to intertwine. Some do, I guess, but I'm certain you can actually run a whole campaign of a game in a big city with little to no crossover.

Smaller cities are a different matter, of course, because it would be plain stupid to have three hundred supernaturals among a population of fifty thousand.

But from my point of view, they don't have to fight over territory because they don't have to be dicks about controlling stuff they barely notice. Why would a freehold give a shit about who is the local spirit police? And why would the local krewes care about a handful of decent-humanity, seldom-killing bloodsuckers pulling strings behind the city council? If the ST want it to matter, so be it, but forced crossover for the sake of the crossover potential sucks balls.

>>7987418
did you finally get gary to set up your monkey toy laptop for you?

these people have some strange ideas about us working together with all the freaks, eh?

>>7987449
wyrm-creature or not, nothing deserves that kind of depravity, good anon

I might rescue it just to give the leech a humane death

>>7987503
I think he was implying that the Hunter would get his dick bitten off.

Also
>Wyrm tainted
Go away. This is not oWoD. Cease your faggotry.

>>7987554
. . . sorry, lace

your interpretation is still depravity

>>7985793
>>7985793

"hell, that little island would practically be Changeling-only territory when it comes to supernaturals"

OP is a faggot

>>7987460
>it would be plain stupid to have three hundred supernaturals among a population of fifty thousand.

I dont see why. The only super that actually need to worry about too large numbers are vampires, simply because they have to feed, but even then, people just feel a bit weak and headachy after being fed on. I could easily see hundreds of people dismissing this as a hangover.

I've seen the idea of these incredibly small estimates of supernatural populations before, and I think that, for vampires at least there could be far far more.

>>7985793
>hell, that little island would practically be Changeling-only territory when it comes to supernaturals.

l2forsaken

>>7987675

The point of supernaturals is that they're rare.
If everyone and their dog is a super, it stops being bizarre and monstruous and starts being another ordinary trait, like being blonde or having broad shoulders.

And the personal horror fades.

>>7987450

Yeah... and Thomas Raith had nothing to do with figuring it all out.

Point was, while it's Harry's book, it was a "crossover" plot. Marcone's a Badass Normal, and Vampire was just the odd one out.

>>7987723
White Court Vampires are actually just Changelings.

Raith are Spring Courtiers, Skavis are Autumn, and Malvora are Winter.

>>7987722
The main problem I have with it is vampire. The game is supposed to be based on a byzantine and ancient social structure, but according to some of the population estimates I've seen there would be about 20 in London, or about 40 in New York. I just don't see how you can have a society of any complexity when there's a pathetic number of members.

>>7987807
there's probably 20 of them way up here outside of marquette, anon

new york might have enough vampires to elect leeches to office

>>7987768
>Now I'm going to nitpick

Whatever. They call themselves Vampires and have a Hunger inside them.

It was a plot involving Mages, a White Court Vampchangeling, a Badass Normal/Hunter, all on the same side. It didn't suck, though it wasn't rife with Personal Horror - that could have been introduced, though. QED.

>>7987807

Those numbers are laughable.
Source?

(In my setting of Changeling in Cuzco, Peru, there were about sixty Changelings in all the city, plus a single pack of Uratha, one Mage and a handful of Vampires)

>>7987839
Those are the most ridiculous numbers I've seen, but they were from some some reliable posters on the White Wolf forums. The general concensus was 1 or 2 to 500000.

>>7987890
In that case, that would actually make London contain 18 vampires.

So no far from the truth.

>>7987832
I wasn't trying to disprove anything you said. I agree wholehearedly. I'm just talking about Dresden at this point.

And DIDN'T that book have personal horror? The main villain caused people to kill themselves while in the throws of ecstasy. Not to mention the flashbacks to the ghouls in New Mexico, and the White Court as a whole.

And I think Harry had Lash at that point as well.

>>7987912

It had some horror, slightly more than before. It still didn't come near what I consider a good WoD-level. Admittedly, Mage (oMage, anyway, I haven't bought into the new books) had less of that angle, and that's Dresden's schtick... but while there were horrible EVENTS, they weren't played up as horrific. They were a backdrop for what was primarily an adventure/gumshoe novel.

>>7987909
I'd believe there's 1,800 leeches in london, anon

such small numbers would make genocide much easier

>>7987979
That would be about 1:5000. Much more reasonable.

>>7987979
Makes sense.
For my chronicle, I had about three hundred London Changelings.

"Hey, frakenstein buddy! Let's hang out with 20 other Prometheans!"

*DISQUIET AND WASTLEAND*

"Oh noes D:"

>>7988070
for my chronicle the freehold has only 20 changelings, how significantly different is a game based on a large scale community?

>>7987722
it's not so much that things are rare, i think its more of a i live longer then a normal person and are more aware of the supernatural then one. If a mage finds a corpse with huge claw marks in it in the big city, he's not gonna think wild animal he's gonna think werewolf

>>7988115

Larger scales means people don't know all of the other people. Mistrust is waaaaaaay up and inner struggles have more room. On the whole, if you want to work on building trust and want to have a somewhat happy ending, smaller scale is better. If you want to weave a fabric of paranoia and lies, go with large scale.

>>7985873

Does your name start with an A, is your nickname an ethnicity, or do you usually wear your hair in a ponytail?

>>7988174
maybe the mage is speciesist, eh?

vampires and magesnacks might live for a long time, but we don't usually hit 40

>>7988240
personal question, no trolling, have you read or played a game of W:tF?

>>7988281
we all read it, anon, 5 garou

I grew up in the 90s with alice in chains and soundgarden

you really want to drag me kicking and screaming into the nwod?

>>7988174
A mage? He'll think another mage did it, or something a mage summoned did it.

If a vampire saw it he would think it was a vampire, and so on for every major splat.

>>7988333

Except when the player is a metagaming fucktard.

>>7988312
so did i, but i made the transition fine. i'm just saying you look pretentious and ignorant shitting up threads you theoretically could enjoy, kinda like that fat kid who still thinks playstation one is the best ever and will never try anything else.

You're not overweight are you?

Do they even have fat werewolves?

>>7988395
what, you want a photo, good anon?

I've never seen a fat werewolf

>>7988415

You mean you can't imagine a nice fat Shadow Lord Ahroun, smoking a fat cigar and explaining to people how much violence can be concentrated in the pulling of a small piece of metal called "trigger" until their minds break and they spit out every piece of info they have?

Come on, fat is an invaluable asset in some character types!

>>7988115
No one knows everyone. You've got your small groups of friends and that's about it. Tensions are higher. People are closer to their courts since they can afford to survive without others. When a culture gets large enough, subcultures are spawned. These subcultures usually end up competing - violently.

In my game, the True Fae went through routine purges of London every few decades, leaving behind only some of the Winter Court, who were sensible enough to hide - which is why the city is so dull and dreary most of the time.

Pretty pleased with how that game went.

>>7988415
nah, i was just wondering if you actually have played nwod. Speaking of, have you ever even played anything besides W:tA?

>>7988458
shadow lords, bone gnawers and children of gaia might be able to get away with being fat, eh?

not fenrir though

>>7988469
haven't, no

I live in a small town way up north

I'm lucky to have the friends that I do

>>7988462
You don't just say "pretty good game" and don't tell us a story about it.

>>7988516
You should find an online game or get your friends to try a quick game of something else, you might even like it.

>>7988462
i did a similar thing with my small group. it was after a purge that involved the freehold being sold out by loyalists, so despite its small setting paranoia was still rampant.

I'm sorry, but

>who rule over places practically drowning in myths, such as Miami

no one gives a fuck about Miami. seriously. It's like Reno Nevada smalltime. Myths Over Miami article aside, which was admittedly pretty awesome. but that was about homeless kids making up their own subculture, not actual mythology innate to the city. They have those legends everywhere.

New Orleans has mythology. It's overwhelmed by Vampire Faggotry, however. Look for something in New England, like Salem or something.

Miami? seriously?

am I the only one who found that to be the most retarded part of the OP?

>>7988372
>>Except when the player is a metagaming fucktard.

And this is the problem of almost all crossovers - they all but DEMAND the players metagame in order to work together without fucking one another over.

>>7988583

There's really nothing interesting about Florida.

I should know. I live there.

>>7988583
i found it to be a poor place for the canon changeling setting but yet it is. Boston, and Salem by extension, is the mage setting.

New York, as always, is probably the best place to do a crossover game. In the US, anyway.

Aside from it being the default setting for Sin-Eaters, it has high buildings for mages, an enormous population for vampires to feed on, enough culture and emotion going on to provide ample glamour for any variety of changeling, plenty of space in which a Promethean can move around to minimize Wasteland and Disquiet issues, a wide variety of parks and other places where spirits would gather for the werewolves, and hunters drawn by the fuckton of supernaturals in New York.

I need places to run that AREN'T New York.
All I've ever played in was NYC. I need a change.
The way Paris was written above in this thread was good stuff, for example.

>>7988844

Compton.

>>7988864
Be... a lot more descriptive.

>>7988563
It was different in this game.

It was set at the beginning of an approaching purge, with some of the Gentry being spotted in the outskirts of the city in larger numbers than usual. People started whispering about purges, teams were sent out to take and locate remote motleys on the city borders, to inform them of a gathering at the freehold.

As you'd guess, everyone began to squabble about how to deal with the Fae. The Courts went their seperate way and the group that grew close during the mission was almost split, but they decided on a rather radical option in the end.

Only Winter had been left in the past. Only Winter's techniques worked. They weren't about to let the other Courts die off, though. In order for the other Courts to survive, they needed to hide, they needed to be slapped out of their blissful denial and their righteous fury. So, the team took rather drastic steps to instill despair.

This involved all sorts of schemes, from propaganda to staging Gentry attacks by kidnapping lone motleys, killing them and disposing of the body to assassinating important leaders. Anything to drop morale.

It worked. Pretty much half of the non-Winter freehold swallowed their pride and followed the directions of the Court of Sorrow before the purge started. By this point, there wasn't a single PC with Clarity above 3. They were all pretty fucking deranged after everything than they had done. One of the characters dropped to 0 before the chronicle was over and had to be put down. Everyone else ended the chronicle with a 9mm retirement plan. They did some pretty twisted shit to ensure that the Freehold survived.

>>7988844

Hoboken

I'm fucking serious.

>>7988844
Any major city. Washington DC, Houston, London, Paris, Berlin, Moscow, Rome, etc.

Philidelphia is sort-of Hunter territory, that much is certain. If memory serves, they purged all the Werewolves in Philly, by chasing them into a park and gunning them all down. Man, that must've been their finest fucking hour.

>>7988896

Hoboken used to be cool, until the fucking yuppies moved in.

>>7988844
Sao Paolo, Rio de Janeiro, Mumbai, Bangkok, Mexico City, New Delhi, Los Angeles. Any reasonably cosmopolitan city with a population in the millions or tens of millions that has immense wealth and grinding poverty in close proximity is an excellent place to set a crossover campaign.

>>7988885
okay, that is hideously grimdark.

>>7988910
Except that all it did was it got them Philly. That's not much of a prize.

Although Camden is probably a great place to train people in urban warfare...

>>7988395

In WoD, they have a coked-up metabolism, so I don't believe there are fat werewolves. As a side note, will you all be so kind as to share your alternate werewolf origin stories (as in, the origins of werewolves as a race)?

>>7988910
and we're supposed to be the 'monsters', good anon?

hunters are worse than vampires

>>7988844

Motherfucking Newark, NJ. You want your grimdark gothic punk? I got your grimdark gothic punk right here.

>>7988930

Regardless, it must have sent one hell of a message. The werewolves and vampires feel invincible, they think that they are totally in control, but Philidelphia was a demonstration in human brutality.

>>7988949

Some would say that, but it's Hunters that stop Cthullu eating Earth (lolKnightsofStGeorge).

>>7988936
are you going to tell these monkeys and leeches all of my secrets, anon?

what sort of origin story are you looking for anyway?

>>7988885
Impressive.
>>7988949
Those hunters did the right thing; wild dogs need to be put down.
>>7988956
new jersey is grimdark as all hell, it's like one giant mass of urban blight.

>>7989003
I wonder what sos's reaction to DNA is.

>>7989016

I would normally argue with you, but I'm talking about Newark. Newark is more or less what everyone outside of Jersey thinks of when they think of Jersey.

If Newark isn't the asshole of the US, it's at least the taint.

>>7989016
Pine Barrens say Hi.

>>7989003

Well, my origin story for the Werewolves involves Father Wolf consuming the greatest of the spirits of humanity, which tainted him, thus making the werewolves. When he made it clear he planned to kill them for being tainted by man, they killed him. The Forsaken/Pure thing is just a cultural schism, ant utterly pointless. Lunacy is humanity's reminder that the remaining human spirits are trapped in endless agony, deep in the Shadow. If they were to be set free...

>>7989049
trust me i know- Eastern shore MD. Newark is a rough lookin' town.

>>7989049
Camden is what everyone inside of Jersey thinks of when they think of "hey, it could be worse".

Unless they actually live in Camden, in which case most of sub-Saharan Africa would be a major step up.

>>7989016
speciesist, drunken hillbillies with high powered rifles need to be put down, anon

I don't hurt innocent people, eh?

>>7989074
the problem with that origin story is that if father wolf was weak enough to be killed by his get, he deserved to die, yeah?

I identify with the predator kings, don't I?

>>7989067

No, the Pine Barrens are what people think of when they have to hide the bodies.

>>7989090
Camden's where NJ's pedophiles and gang rapists go when they die.

>>7989130
>claims to maul humans and other supernaturals
> identifies with Get of Fenris and predator kings, notoriously intolerant groups
> talks constantly of his racial superiority

you sicken me, whelp.

>>7989130

Get, I am disappoint.

>>7989016
>>7988928
Thanks. The party consisted of a Spring Court Muse trophy wife, an Autumn Court Gargantuan builder, an Autumn Court Chatelaine civil servant, a Winter Windwing school teacher and a Winter Court Minstrel who was part of a jazz band.

Autumn Court Chatelaine didn't make it. He was so obsessed with no being discovered that he mimicked the Gentry every way he could, including desecrating corpses in terrifying manners to display as a 'warning'. After all, no Changeling could do that to another one of its kind, right? Well he did and the bastard paid for it.

>>7989223
>>7989246
. . . have you been stalking me?

all of that was in the past, yeah?

hurting innocents is weakness

>>7989205
Speaking of Camden, Camden Town in London is a pretty nice place for Changeling shit to happen. Hell, for any WoD shit to happen. The place is always alive.

>>7989281
SCARED OF SHADOWS.

DOES THE ORGANIZATION "DNA" RING A BELL?

>>7989310
it doesn't, good anon

you'll tell me about how they'll cut me into little pieces or something though, yeah?

Stop picking on the glorious Garden State you bastards!

>>7989330
No, I am talking about how they'll cure you of Genetic Lycanthrope Syndrome.

>>7989337
when your state's greatest contribution is a tolled turnpike and a show about white trash, it's gonna happen.

>>7989346
why would hunters capture me alive to maim me to death later?

you shitheads are more bloodthirsty than I ever was

London:
Canary Wharf is actually a complex for one of the Mage orders.
Camden Town is a hive of Changeling activity.
Central London is a pretty big gathering place for vampires in South-East England.
Croydon, Bromley and other boroughs that lead out into Surrey are filled with werewolves.

>>7989337

Dude, we're not picking on NJ. We're picking on NEWARK and CAMDEN. That's like saying we're picking on people because we admit human assholes stink.

>>7989382
Relax. We just want to help you.

>>7989337

Why? It totally deserves it.

>>7989430
you'd have to drag an angry get ahroun into your torture chamber alive, hunter-anon

you better at least have beef jerky, eh?

>>7989457
No, but we have tasty kibble!

Look at how your... "brother" is enjoying it!

>>7989494

Hi, newWoDfag here. Is this Pentex?

>>7989494
what's wrong with you, hunter-anon?

I need to get going

you anons can direct insults to my aim handle in the email field

>>7989337
I used to live in Woodbridge. I have mockery rights.

>>7989524
No, another organization called DNA. Exists in the "Book of the Weaver" splatbook. Google "Book of the Weaver". Near the bottom of the first page, download link.

>>7989542

Ah. Will read.

In the meantime, can we give him to Pentex?

>>7989552
Pentex = Wyrm
DNA = Weaver

A changer or a destroyer.

Which one do you think'll be worse?

>>7989389
And the entire city has a surprising number of Avernian Gates.

Although honestly any city that's more than a thousand years old is going to be of interest to the Bound.

>>7989566

I'd have to say the one that turns him into a horrible abomination that stands for everything he's against, in which he'll tear into his own clanmates before being put down like an animal. Possibly infecting them in the process.

There was crap like that in Freak Legion, wasn't there? I mean, sos is a metis, right?

>>7989588
>I'd have to say the one that turns him into a horrible abomination that stands for everything he's against, in which he'll tear into his own clanmates before being put down like an animal. Possibly infecting them in the process.

Right, so the Weaver or the Wyrm. Now you have to pick one.

Well, I'd have to go with the evil that I know, so that'd be the Wyrm.

>>7989672
Drat. Weaver is so much more entertaining.

>>7989689
And more evil.

Remember, in oWoD Werewolf everything was actually the Weaver's fault.

Although the Wyld is pretty damned scary too; it's basically what you'd get if the entirety of nWoD Arcadia was itself sentient, was intimately tied into the fabric of reality, and was becoming more desperate and violent as the Weaver and the Wyrm both got crazier.

>>7989768

Well, you could always have him half-mutated by one, and then kidnapped by the other in a raid.

>>7989457

Or poison you with a VX nerve agent and massive dosage of Kolokol-1 bombing and leave you to it, in which case you're constantly regenerating and degenerating health in perpetual torment with massive penalties to your skills and attributes.

And that's when we hit you with an electrified net, and drag that net into a reinforced container, which is inside a reinforced 18 wheeler trailer. We'll keep electrifying you in three second increments. Just a quick ten thousand volt buzz hooked up to a generator built into an armored segment of the trailer, which, by the by, is rated for carrying hazardous materials such as explosives, biological, and chemical agents.

And when we drive back into our little secluded hideaway that'd make the labyrinth of Crete look like a fucking etch-a-sketch maze drawn by a two year old, we'll winch you out by a hook in your still-convulsing shoulder and maybe, MAYBE we'll give you the atropine injection that'll end the pain and allow you, over a period of weeks, to gain back your intelligence, wits, and resolve to above that of a quarter-wit bitch-of-ours into the good old half-wit human you used to be. And if you don't want to go, we'll cut out your frontal lobe and plate silver against the bit of you that's been flattened by our blades, then send you back out into the world, as a happy, productive, and above all, drooling, insensate member of human society, with no concept of what a horrible thing you used to be, you speciesist, fairy-faggot parasite to humanity.

All your talents, merits, racial abilities, and magical powers just got assfucked by resource five.

>>7989768

Actually, the important thing about the oWoD was that there was no "good guy." No setting, no mythology, had a clear "good guy" if you thought about things for a few seconds. The only "good" was in the balance - and PCs *usually* represented balancing factors in the main books (with the exception of Vampires, who represented giant faggots).

>>with the exception of Vampires, who represented giant faggots).

I chuckled quietly in an attempt not to wake my roomie. Thanks for the laugh, anon.

>>7989389

One of the strangest nights of my life was in Camden. A friend and I had been hanging out in London all day. Ended up in a titty bar in Soho, where we got chatting to this utterly weird goth girl. She was all over my friend who was desperate for any type of female attention. After a night of getting totally pissed she ended up taking us both back to her place, a dingy squat in camden. Where we met her friends.

Try to imagine a cross between emos, hells angels and ecohippies and you have some idea what this bunch was like. Turned out they were neo-pagans/wiccans or some such shit. They welcomed us both to their home with more booze and weed, and we got talking about all sorts of /x/ stuff because that's what they were into. Just as we're sort of on the verge of passing out due to the effects of both, the girl suggested somekind of weird blood drinking drinking game. It seemed like a good idea at the time. I don't know if you guys have ever tried vodka and blood before, it's not very pleasant.

I don't remember much else, My friend woke me up on their couch in the morning and we left without saying anything to them. Apparently when I passed out my friend had got with this girl. She'd bitten him all over whilst having sex, not on the neck but pretty much everywhere else, you could still see the teeth marks.

Like I said, fucking weird night,

>>7989870

You're welcome. I realized, as I wrote, that of the core lines, only V:tM seemed to violate my "balance" concept. Then I realized what they REALLY represented, in the long run, and it was all so clear.

>>7989830

Seriously. Anytime anyone ever whined about how to balance their human character in a mixed group, I always pointed out that they should get extra background points for free.

Why else would vampires and werewolves hang out with a human unless they had resources and contacts out of the ass?

Huh, yeah. Thinking about the other lines? All of the other supernaturals have SOME sort of purpose. Spirit policing for several, ghosts and underworld crap for others, the true fae for others.

Vampires, when they want to protect people against something, only protect them from other vampires. You could stake them all out in the sun and the world would be a better place. Buncha faggots.

>>7989909
Sounds like it.

In the Camden on this side of the ocean, all that's likely to happen to you is that you get carjacked, beaten, robbed, raped, and murdered, not necessarily in any particular order.

>>7989909
...I'm going to London in two weeks. My interest has never been higher.

>>7990007
Our Camden Town is basically a cultural hive. So... maybe not just changelings.

Everyfuckingthingoutthere.

this entire thread is based on the idea 'can't crossover because it would ruin the personal horror schtick' If you believe this, you're doing role playing wrong.

Remember, if any Promethean lasts for more than a day after completing their Pilgrimage without either dying, being turned into a vampire, or being abducted by a True Fae, you're doing it wrong. And if they die, they become a ghost, and one that's pretty much guaranteed to end up in the Underworld instead of ever passing on.

After all, it's called the World of DARKNESS for a reason.

>>7990000

Exactly. In the Cam vampire line, the Big Bads are... Vampires who exhibit less restraint than PCs. Mages fight Stasis (but if they won, it would suck, because they don't have a common consensus to replace the current one). Werewolves fight Corruption (but if they won, it would suck, because humankind would be dropped down the foodchain and forced out of a number of useful advances). Changelings fight Banality (but if they won, it would suck, because the world would be like a fucked up fairy tale).

Vampires fight other vampires, and no matter who wins, it still sucks. One kind just sucks in a more genteel fashion than does the other.

>>7990142
>I didn't read a single post in this thread.

Fixed.

>>7990039

I'm a londoner, well north londoner, and shit that strange has only happened that once. It was one of those moments where you get home and shower, look in the mirror and think, what the fuck was that!

Still cool stuff can happen. I got involved in a demonstration at the Ukranian embassy just for fun whilst passing by during their orange revolution and ended up giving an interview to some american tv crew dodgy eastern european accent and all.

I nearly got myself arrested for getting in a fight with a Japanese tourist over a giant robot elephant as well. That was pretty funny even at the time.

>>7990152
You're the kind of game-master who, if a player wanted to make a paladin. would excuse himself to go masturbate frantically over ways to make him fall, aren't you?

Just because it's the "World of Darkness" doesn't mean it's impossible for folks to find some form of a happy ending. Things are grimmer than what we consider normal, true, but it's not a total crapsack world.

>>7990194
Every big town has some alternative lifestylers. Their wimmenz are horny, but weird, and most have issues...

>>7990308
No, because just saying "lol, you fall" would be far too easy.

It would be more fun to steadily break his character's faith until the character and player willingly renounce their paladin status rather than continue to serve their god.

There's plenty of humans who fight back against the dark, and do some damage, make a name for themselves, and become the boogeyman in the closet for the unnatural monsters in the night. There's plenty more who live their lives without knowing of the secret wars waged in the shadows of the world.

>>7989999

Honestly, they should just get Badass Normal points equal to the points other characters get in supernatural powers.

Sure, Gentleman Johnny Marcone can't use Forces 3 like Dresden... but he can slip a knife from concealment and throw it hard enough to cut a rope while tied upside down and spinning. "Resources 5" doesn't cut it for that sort of thing, but "Badass Normal" points would.

"But.. but... but... that doesn't make SENSE" some say! "That's not REALISTIC!"

Neither is throwing a mortal in with a bunch of fucking monsters. Give him the fucking bonus points.

>>7990685
1-5 scale of dots for attributes.
Stealth 4 for unnoticeably pulling the knife out, Strength varying from 3-5 depending on the rope and how far away it is, weaponry skill 4-5. -3 penalty to hit the rope in the dark, offset if he listens with high perception to hear to rope swing and creak.

All that took a straight total of a few months out of his life learning from the right people, and doesn't invoke paradox. Fuck mages, who can half-kill themselves trying to turn on a lightbulb unprepared.

>>7991065

Bingo. Though you forgot his Blindfighting and That Fucking Badass merits.