To the south, her efforts seem to have had sufficient momentum. The tribesmen of the jungles seem content to accept the change, and your administrators and officials seem capable of dealing with them without offending the primitive's sensibilities. The results are felt on your treasury- Barely. Poor as they are, they barely produce any net profit compared to the costs of expanding your domain, but of what little there is, a tithe is sent back to Mza.

With Liergrad on the verge of open resistance to your presence, you find it prudent to leave Lorekeeper's castle in orbit around the city. It doesn't cast it's shadow on the populace or block out the sun, but it remains in sight and a constant reminder of quite how the war ended up. Were it not for the fact that they started the conflict, you suspect you'd be having an even harder time.

##########

Without your mobile fortress, your plans for sealing up the caverns the drow are using to attack require you to approach on the ground, and in person. Naturally, you refrain from doing so alone. The most blooded of your northern guard units is mobilized and march into the mountains, searching for the tunnels adventurers claim to exist. They are harried repeatedly, first by orcs and goblinoids, then by actual drow, picking off a guard or two in the night as they ascend the mountains. By the time they do locate the tunnels the adventurers reported, they have racked up sizable casualty and kill counts, and are near mutiny.

This is easily rectified when you and Azyra arrive personally with your guards. You explain why they and you are here, and what you intend to do. They are actually rather impressed with the idea, and dig in around the cavern with genuine enthusiasm. Over the few days it takes to prepare the ritual again, they keep the site safe, and repulsing a few scattered attacks with steel and spell. You contribute to the defenses when you are not wholly occupied with the preparation of the ritual, and do manage to keep Azyra protected from the combat. She's reluctant to be isolated so, but you are more than capable of manipulating her into accepting it gracefully, particularly with the ability to read her thoughts. You are assisted in the matter by most of the soldiers present- they seem to have taken a shine to your daughter, and are surprisingly subtle in keeping her distracted, safe, or otherwise preventing her from becoming involved in the skirmishes.

It again takes nearly five days to prepare the ritual. Not because you are triple-checking Azyra's work- You're checking it, of course, but you have more confidence in her capabilities -The real problem is the fact that massive ritual circles are difficult to construct in a natural cavern, particularly not one that simply isn't wide enough for them. What time you save with your new confidence in Azyra is wasted reshaping the cavern with the aid of your imprisoned Dao.

Sadly, the drow seem aware of what you intend. Attacks intensify, culminating in a large press as you finish preparations. Though you intended to immediately move on to casting once you were ready, you are forced to contribute to warding off a massive assault, drow attacking in the night using orcs and goblins as bladefodder. The attack is significant enough that even Azyra's guards are roped into supporting your soldiers, or fighting beside them. The sorceress in particular proves almost as powerful as she seems to think she is, slinging various forms of lightning and a few other evocations with abandon and without apparent end.

Your troops hold fast, however, and eventually the assault dwindles, the last of the orcs being spent to cover the drow retreat. As soon as it's certain they're gone, your troops move to care for the wounded and dead, and you check on Azyra. She looks sick, but uninjured- no, there's one of the drow hand-crossbow darts in her shoulder, but not deep. A merest pinprick- probably deflected into her, you decide, and insufficient to trigger the contingency spells you insisted on placing upon her. And she should be immune to whatever poison was upon the dart, so her unhealthy pallor... There is blood on her, but none of it hers, and even some on her sword, though there are no bodies at her feet. Julianos, the mad one, stands next to her, humming absently to himself as he cleans his sword. Two bodies do lie at his feet, and you know he was not stationary throughout combat... Pausing, you focus on Azyra's thoughts and detect a frightened, adrenaline-tinged jumble. Of course. Her first real combat, weapons drawn, people dying... That would explain why she looks on the verge of throwing up.

“Azyra. I'm sending you back to Mza.” you inform her. It would be quite redundant to ask if she were alright when you know very well. You are surprised when she nods meekly, and you pause to contact her mother, informing Scinnari telepathically that she might want to make time. Once done, you poke her in the shoulder with the dart- The contingencies activate, and she vanishes. Mind at ease, you turn to repairing the damage the attack did, and finishing the drow problem once and for all.

############

These rifts, you do not bother to close. The turgid layer of molten rock- magma, you suppose, considering that it's underground,- flows deeper into the caves, and you seal the cavern behind you and your troops. Pure elemental fire makes a good enough pyre for those who died in your service, consuming bodies and equipment, and this way the drow can choke upon the toxic fumes, rather than let them leak out over your kingdom. Your soldiers seem rather impressed with the result, too, and you pause to magically inscribe a memorial for your fallen minions upon the sealed cave wall. With that you order them down the mountain, and depart to attend to the other business on your rather full schedule...


###############

[Other stuff either needed more seconding, or I found difficult to cover in an OP. Sorry for missing last week.]

Azyra's Familiar - While we are doing this we should have a talk with her about her first taste of combat.

Visit Nehmaska - Bring a gift tailored to her from the history we learn form Watcher. Don't tell it specifically why we are asking about her history so it doesn't get any ideas about sowing chaos. Just get a rundown of big events in her life and her tastes and such then base the gift off that.

Dragonscale Armor - Enchanted to be truly unique and powerful, present it on a special occasion. Ideally will have a contingent recall back to our lair for if she is near death or about to be, as well as a permanent foresight spell.

Cygnis - Just need a brief update of how she is progressing, I assume we already know "in character" due to being involved with her training.

Adamantine Dragon Armor - Do we have enough yet? If not, how long roughly?

I'd like to pretty much second all of the above suggestions, though I presume you've got your own stuff planned for Cygnis, or something must have happened to prompt an 'event' with her.

I rather liked the suggestion in the last thread in regards to teleporting swords for Scinnari, where each is linked to a stone she carries on her armour and all she needs do is hold that one and that particular sword pops into her hand- making her have an appropriately deadly sword for each encounter she has.

Icing on the cake really, but it was nice.

>>15116663
>Azyra's Familiar
It hatched recently, and though she didn't take it with her (fearing, and rightly so, for the miniature dragon,) it has otherwise been following her everywhere. Generally she carries it or it rides on her shoulder.

>Ask Watcher; Visit Nehmaska
Without a doubt, the single largest event on her life to date would be being cornered in her lair, then hounded and chased from the mountains by a red four to six times her age. Regarding that, it seems like your best advice would be to buy her a ring of fire resistance, but not only do you doubt she would trust such a gift, you have an unsettling feeling that she probably has already acquired one.

>Dragonscale armor
I'll grant that you have enough, and can get to work on getting it made/enchanted. Expect it within a month or two.

>Cygnis
Scinnari thinks she has made excellent progress, finally reaching a plateau of sorts in regards to Cygnariassis' behavior. As Scinnari describes it, she is no longer paying lipservice; even in her own mind, she genuinely believes what she says. You are less confident in Scinnari's claims, reluctant to believe even an dragon like Cygnariassis could be brought so low, but cannot claim to dislike the results.

>Admantium armor
You have enough, assuming you're willing to drain what stockpile you have.


Also, I forgot to mention paying Seffestranias. She was not happy, but did not object loudly to your refusal to pay her desired sum. You ended up paying about eighty thousand gold worth of adamantine, and twenty thousand actual gold. She seems sated for the time being.

>>15116831

We'll be wanting Scinnari to prove that progress to us, if its indeed happened.

Nehmaska....seems scarily capable of covering her bases. Perhaps we should simply say she's earned a boon from us and ask her what she wants?

And I say go for the armour; we aren't using the adamantium for much other than to fill Seffy's coffers anyway.

>>15117104
I like the boon Idea. Perhaps something for her hord or our help in taking down that red.

I want to make it very clear that there are "employee benefits" to working for us.

>>15116831
Well then.

I suggest we continue our business. Advance a year or two, maybe a tad more and hit the following high points:

1. Greatly expand our spies, infiltration, and subterfuge in Seffy's lands. I'm talking large safehouses we could operate guerilla warfare out of, highly placed ministers, the works.

2. Check the devil situation. If Scinnari needs help we help. Very important for many reasons.

3. Presentation of armor to Scinnari.

4. Talk with Azyra about her first combat and how she felt about it. Should have Scinnari there too, family time.

5. Spend time with the family in general, I guess. I suggest hosting a royal ball/feast and inviting dignitaries, nobility, high ranking personages, the works. A relaxing evening where we can spend time with our waifu/daughteru and get to know our highest ranking ministers personally. After all, can't lead a nation without knowing who your underlings are.

6. Related to the above, make sure that admiral who did so awesome during the war gets high honors. Appoint him admiral of the western ocean or something, a highly prestigious post.

7. Obviously begin setting up our secret police and such in our newly conquered territories. Also I suggest things like soup kitchens and other works to improve the outlook of people towards us. Don't invest too much, though.

8. Adamantium armor is a go. The dwarves should know we have a silver working for us, after all. Use spells to alter our scales to silver if we need to go to the fittings. Make sure it's expandable as we age.

9. Open up the pass to Aquitaine and let's establish trade now that we are on semi-friendly terms.

>>15117144
>our help in taking down that red.
I don't think so Tim.

>>15117161

Aside from those that actually will take time, I'd prefer to hold off on a timeskip until certain conversations have been dealt with.

>>15117144

I think she's smart enough *NOT* to ask us for help in taking down the red. It has to be a request within reason.

When you return, you find Azyra with Scinnari. It looks like she might have quite recently been crying into her mother's shoulder, but seems to be somewhat more calm, and certainly a bit healthier looking than she was when you sent her away. Her pseudo-dragon familiar rests in her lap, and she sits near her mother, near the roaring fireplace. Hardly necessary, but comforting, you suppose, and none of your family are bothered by such conditions.

“Hello, father.” she greets quietly. “How did it go?”

“Quite well, actually. The soldiers managed to hold them back quite well, only minimal damage was done to the ritual circle.” you answer calmly, moving to sit beside her. “It was quite easy to repair. I trust you are... better?”

“Yes father. Mother helped- I feel better now. I'm sorry for-”

“For what? You did nothing wrong.” Scinnari interrupts her. “If anything, you did well in spite of your terror.” At her mother's words, Azyra seems to flush slightly, bowing her head in attempt to hide it. Ashamed that you knew she was afraid... Her earnest need for your approval is charming, really. You continue your consort's work.

“It's entirely reasonable to be terrified, considering you were surrounded by creatures intent on your death. That is, in fact, the standard reaction.” you observe mildly. “I'd be quite concerned if you weren't. That would be a sign of insanity, recklessness... foolishness. It's the /right/ reaction, Azyra.” She nods and mumbles briefly, and while you can't determine what she said, you can read her thoughts. Feeling somewhat better, and partially reassured by your words. “That said, aside from the prefectly reasonable fear, how did you like your first taste of true combat?” you ask.

“It was... chaotic. Confused. I couldn't tell what was going on, I just saw the swords and.. bodies.” Azyra answers unsteadily. “I.. I don't think I liked it. Until then, it was fine, I was fine. I liked the soldiers, I liked watching them fight off the raids- When you weren't keeping me out of the way.” she pauses, and you hold up a hand in mock-surrender to the jab. “But.. I didn't like being in it. It was... It was not... enjoyable.” she answers at length. “I didn't like it.” she repeats in summation, looking away, but with her attention focused on you. Not wishing to disappoint.


[In other news, fuck maximum post length.]

>>15117253
"There will be times you need to fight, just as you have seen me do. But you should note that I do not fight unless I /must/ do so. To put yourself in danger is a last resort, an action for when your plans and strategies falter or fail, at least in my eyes.

"There are others -- such as the 'great' Queen of Beren or your mad bodyguard -- who view this differently. I would give you more examples but I am afraid they are all very dead, much as eventually Seffestranias and your bodyguard will be as well. To fight as a first resort means that you will eventually face a fight you can not win... without knowing beforehand. This is why your mother and I have bodyguards, despite being powerful combatants ourselves.

"Any battle you put yourself into should be decided long before you draw your blade. That is my advice to you."

>>15117253

Lets speak of how reasonable a position that is, use it to reaffirm *why* we try to protect her so much, and nudge toward respect for those who do fight- and indeed, how rational it is not to like fighting when you have other means at your disposal.

Telling her off for being a yella-bellied pinko sumbitch won't help matters; but at the same time, we need to make her understand that, though fighting is distasteful, it is often necessary for the powerful to grow ever more in power, such as we. Life, my child, is just one fight after another.

>>15117371
>nudge toward respect for those who do fight
I disagree with that. We should point out that fights are sometimes needed, but those who fight all the time are either minions or short lived. They should be treated with less respect because of that, not more. That's how we've always viewed them after all. We hardly think Seffy is SMART for viewing every problem as a nail, now do we?

>>15117253

Hmm... We need to get her more acclimatised to combat. Even if we don't want her in the thick of war, its reasonable to expect attempts on her life. That kind of reaction could lead to hesitation, which might get her killed.

Lets intensify her sparring, take her hunting, get her accustomed to blood and gore. Make sure to praise her more and take the progress slowly, so that we don't just end up terrifying her even more.

"Fighting seldom is enjoyable, hence why both myself and your mother always try to win through guile and forethought rather than through force. Your will and your wits are your greatest weapons Azyra, not your sword; remember that when next you find yourself in such circumstance, and I know you will acquit yourself well."

>>15117415

And yet it takes bravery and confidence to act so, and in the end, could we have won our war if people were not willing to fight?

Not all of our underlings are in our contempt or beneath notice.

>>15117521
And? That doesn't change what I said at all. No, not all our underlings are contemptuous, but it's the underlings that are smart and use their heads who we promote. We would have problems without the meat fodder, but don't think for a second they aren't largely expendable. That's why we got them, after all. To take the swords and die so we don't need to.

With the war over we should work on the stability of the nation, in all aspects.

Financially we should reactivated the commerce with Rhasver get things back up and running with profits back to prewar standard, choose form amongst the guilds that were more active or loyal during the war to help with the reconstruction and integration of Liergrad.

Military we should review the status of our arm forces, rewarding competence and discipline, see that the regular regiments and divisions are back to full strength in reasonable time. Same thing with our navy.

In the political and social fields we should adopted post war measures to stop the typical problems that come with the times, no mass layoffs of troops they need something to do like work in the reconstruction of Liergrad, see if its profitable to colonize the coast west the Ivory gates its good to have new land and new opportunities for the retiring soldiers and it may open up new resources and products to the reopening Rhasver market.

What was the consensus on how to deal with Seffy? Were we going to give her the gold or tell her to shove it?

>>15117916
Addressed already here >>15116831

“That is a good stance on the matter.” you reply. “Fighting is rarely something that should be sought out- One of those skills it is best to have, but find unnecessary to use. Your mother and I, for instance, are skilled combatants- But always use alternate means, when an equally viable option is available. Entering a fight is a risk, often an unacceptable one. Entering a fight that you do not already know the outcome to is never acceptable- That is my advice to you, Azyra, if you must enter a battle, know the result before you do so.”

“But... Isn't it what... what's always necessary?” Azyra asks, absently stroking the pseudo-dragon in her lap. It twists it's head, directing her petting towards the side of it's neck, and half-closes it's eyes, though they remain fixed on you. “Isn't that why we... you fought Rhasver last year?”

“We fought because fighting was the best option- We did not do so because we /desire/ to fight, or we find /glory/ in combat.” Scinnari answers, and you nod in agreement. “Individuals like... What is your guard's name, Julianos? Or 'great' Seffestranias, they are not smart, and certainly not wise. They seek fights out, and will eventually encounter battles they cannot win. Such an eventuality will almost certainly result in their deaths. Battles should be fought with wit and guile, if you can, and only if you must should you resort to risking your own life. Not to say that you should not fight, but that it is not something to pursue. It is a sign that something has gone wrong, and you have failed somewhere, if you have to enter a combat you are not certain of winning.”

“But... The fact remains that eventually, something will go wrong, or you will fail somewhere. If it becomes necessary to fight, it is best to be capable and prepared to do so, and to do so without hesitation.” you reply. “If necessary. Always remember that your mind is your greatest weapon.” She nods, and the matter is settled.

###############

She seems fully recovered by the next day, and you turn your attention to other matters. You find it most demeaning to pose as a silver dragon, and fitting is nearly unbearable, but you do manage to make enough time for the dwarves of Mza to take measurements, and begin work. Sadly, rumors do spread about what friendly terms Lord Prestor has for dragons, but some of them do bother to include 'silver' in the descriptor, making you feel that the degrading disguise may have been worth it, in some small way.

It is most definitely not, however, when Nehmaska asks you how you like being Silver. You feign confusion, and she corrects 'you' to 'Lord Prestor', seeing as word has it that /he's/ the one commissioning armor for a silver dragon, but her barbs strike home.

“A significant error, there, and you would be rather arrogant to presume you are the only dragon Lord Prestor is acquainted with, especially indirectly.”

“True, but judging by the tasks you find worth assigning me, you are probably the one who's fate is most... tightly bound with the Kingdom of Mza. Or is it an empire these days?” Nehmaska asks politely.

“I believe the structure would fall under Empire, though Prestor's authority is supreme anywhere in the state.” you reply blandly. “Regardless. I see that the kobolds I sent you have been put to good use?”

>>15116831
>You are less confident in Scinnari's claims, reluctant to believe even an dragon like Cygnariassis could be brought so low, but cannot claim to dislike the results.
We have the ability to probe Cygnis' mind all but effortlessly. Can't we do so in order to confirm this? Surely even a dragon would not be able to hide every last scrap of independence from us, if it's there to find. Look through her thoughts thoroughly, on multiple occasions, and when she is being subjected to a variety of stimuli in order to be particularly thorough about this.

If we're satisfied that Cygnis actually believes herself to be worthless on her own and happiest as our ornament and slave, that she is in love with us and gave herself to us, and that we are the only one who will ever truly appreciate her, then we can probably move her from pure ornamentation to serving us- in small ways at first, of course; keep her humanoid and have her act as our personal servant about the lair, get her used to reflexively performing whatever task we ask of her for our convenience, amusement, and pleasure. Once she's done that for a few years and we still think she's stable we can move towards giving her slightly more freedom of movement, since obviously as our mount she'll need to be able to go anywhere. Only after we're confident in her willingness and ability to act obediently and devotedly in a relatively harmless humanoid form can we consider training her in larger and more dangerous forms. It will probably take several decades to slowly stage her up to being ridden around as a gold dragon.

“And still. They were remarkably forthcoming with information on various matters. Freeport, for instance- They claim- or at least think.” Nehmaska pauses, as if considering the difference between the two, “that their clan originally came from Freeport, of all places. I suppose plausible, considering their reputation for looking the other way.”

“Quite.” you reply shortly, “However, if you no longer need their services for the modification of your lair, I am willing to repossess them.”

“Not at all. They have proven dutiful miners. Almost as skilled as dwarves.” Nehmaska replies. “Ah, my manners. Do come in, oh 'Great Red Lord'.”. You pretend not to notice as she leads the way into her lair. No longer a hollow under a cliff, it's actually been dug out fairly competently, and looks like the kobolds are in the process of finishing sections of it. Regardless, the the tunnel extends almost a hundred feet, rising to a large lair chamber. Still mostly bare, it is a roomy enough chamber even for both of your in your natural forms- though mostly due to having several craggy ledges at different heights around the room. The central 'floor' seems to be the focus of her lair, and her hoard of silver coins seems to have been replaced with a small carpet of rubies. Most of poor quality, presumably as a means of making her resources go further, but the barely veiled remark remains.

“..though, admittedly, the seem to have been greatly aided by pre-existing details. Most of this cavern, for instance.” Nehmaska replies, turning and settling on the 'bed' of cheap rubies. “Do take a seat. What was it you said you needed me for?”

>>15117986

Why people keep thinking she's going to end up loving us is beyond me. I'll settle simply for acknowledging us as her master.

And where's the 'Riding her as a Gold' idea coming from?! It ALWAYS comes up and it NEVER STOPS being a bad idea!

>>15117990

Rubies. Hilarious. Lets just tell her she's earned a boon for her service; maybe scope her out some. Has her time in our service changed her looks any (ballista-holes, for one)?

>>15117990

Red rubies... cute.

Well, even if she hates us personally she is at least keeping her word. That alone makes her an extremely valuable asset. I wonder how hard she will try to kill us when her term of service expires?

It would be nice to get her to trust us a bit more, if thats even possible. With our fledgling empire growing it would be good to have someone looking out for the people under our dominion; after all, a happy population is a productive and cooperative one.

>>15117990
Cute. Do the dragon equivalent of rolling one's eyes at the bed of rubies.

Let's be friendly while we are here. We brought a chessboard or something, maybe that game the old Sultan taught us to play in Tashz. Play with her some.

>>15117990

Red rubies... cute.

Well, even if she hates us personally she is at least keeping her word. That alone makes her an extremely valuable asset. I wonder how hard she will try to kill us when her term of service expires?

It would be nice to get her to trust us a bit more, if thats even possible. With our fledgling empire growing it would be good to have someone looking out for the welfare of the people under our dominion; after all, a happy population is a productive and cooperative one.

>>15118081

We could just ask her, but that might be impolite so early on in our 'partnership'.

Lets ask her how she felt about the whole war and her part in it- oh, or maybe...yeah, ask her what she thinks of Seffy, and that other Gold at the diplomacy table. And what she thought of the merc. Just get an idea of where she's at with others.

>>15117990

Play dumb and ask her whats with the rubies. See what amusing false flattery she can cook up.

>>15118149

She'd probably feign ignorance of a meaning. Best we try to ignore it; we can one-up her again later if we feel like it.

>>15118126

She didn't seem to like the gold at the diplomacy table too much.

Since shes pretty young for a Silver, it might be worth pointing out the benefits of remaining under the aegis of an established and cunning Red. Maybe in time we will rub off on her.

>>15118181
>Silver willingly seconding herself to a Red.
Excuse me while I laugh.

>>15118081
>Red rubies... cute.

Not just red rubies, /shitty/ red rubies. Well, if she wants to lie around on a red bed, who are we to stop her... Who knows, if we get lucky maybe she'll get some stuck in her hide, that'll be good for a laugh.

Anyways, supporting the "get her opinion on the other dragons, ask her what she would choose if granted a boon, admire adorable kobolds with mittens and fluffy hats" option. Not sure about playing chess with her, Silvers having higher mental stats than Reds, after all.

>>15118185
Hey, it's worked so far.

For a rather stretched definition of "willing," admittedly, but it's not like we Dominate Monster-ed her into it.

>>15118185

No one said there wouldn't be some level of manipulation involved. As her stated primary concern is for the welfare of a population we can always have her running around and checking that people have drinking water, and generalyl doing all the boring humanitarian crap that is generalyl beneath our notice.

>>15118199
We all but did. We said serve us or die. Get your head out of the clouds.

We should be aware that while Rhasver just made peace with us here, they'll be holding a serious grudge over this. We completely showed them up- a fifty-year-old fledgling kingdom has upstaged their proud military tradition of hundreds of years, and to add insult to injury has taken one of their cities! Their children will be raised to think ill of us for this. They will be spending a lot of time and money planning the next war, and in a generation or so they will attack us once again- this time with planned countermeasures for all the tricks that we used in the latest conflict.

So. As a long-lived creature, we need to match their long term thinking. Get our best military types together- some of those in our navy, army, intelligence, and arcana who proved themselves highly competent in the latest war- and tell them that we'll need contingency plans, that we need to lay the groundwork now for assets which could win us another war against Rhasver fifteen or twenty years down the road. Give them a few months to think it over and work out- under our supervision- a comprehensive plan, including things like public relations, espionage and R&D elements, for success in Rhasver War II, assuming that we cannot or choose not to deflect it diplomatically. Then we see about implementing the best of their ideas.

>>15118208
Goddamn typos...

>>15118215
Agreed.
We need case studies prepared, and probable attack plans and counter-attack scenarios prepared.
My guess is that they will likely initiate another war in about 18 to 20 years, long enough for them to fully replenish their human stocks of troops.

>>15118187
>Not sure about playing chess with her, Silvers having higher mental stats than Reds, after all.
Our stats are biased towards mental over physical as compared to most reds. We've also magically enhanced ourselves for greater mental and spellcasting attributes at no small expense, because that's what we care about. We easily outclass a standard silver.

Whether she is standard, well... I suppose we can't guarantee that, but she seems more the physical than cerebral type to me, in spite of her fondness for subtle barbs.

>>15118214
You misunderstand. She could easily have chosen to die instead, which many Lawful Good individuals would rather do than pledge to serve an Evil being, particularly one that is traditionally Chaotic Evil and has just attacked them without provocation.
With Dominate Monster, or an equivalent (say, Mind Rape), that choice would not have existed.
The difference is seemingly small, but it's the difference between the Silver Dragon serving loyally, if reluctantly, and the Silver Dragon taking the first chance it gets to eat our face once our back is turned.

Plus, it makes an infernal contract 'tenuous' rather than 'lolOBJECTION.'

>>15118283
True. Perhaps we should make use of the fact Silvers are generally smarter than Reds, and see if we can fool her into thinking we're... well, not just another idiot like Seffy, we've proven that false, but still not the smartest Dragon in the Draconomicon. She'll probably be doing something similar (hell, she may already be doing so with her "Make fights not smalltalk" exterior), but hopefully we can get some kind of idea as to just how we match up without letting her do the same.

>>15118283

We're really not much like a normal Red, are we? And she doesn't seem much like a normal Silver, nearly LN. She strikes me as more passive aggressive about us beating her ass than someone plotting our demise.

Lets get a summation of her personal code of honour. She clearly isn't going to violate it any time soon so it might be worth learning her take on morality a bit more. We could even turn it into a discussion of philosophy.

>>15118335
I figure she's lawful good, like silvers are supposed to be, but less rabid about it. Poor wording. More like: She doesn't like us going around and slaughtering innocents, but doesn't consider humans quite as important. She'll try and keep us from doing it, and she doesn't like it, but it's not enough to spur her into action.

>>15116324
>The tribesmen of the jungles seem content to accept the change, and your administrators and officials seem capable of dealing with them without offending the primitive's sensibilities. The results are felt on your treasury- Barely. Poor as they are, they barely produce any net profit compared to the costs of expanding your domain, but of what little there is, a tithe is sent back to Mza.
The jungles aren't very profitable for now, but that can change. The money in jungle regions comes from harvesting exotic materials/animals and from identifying useful plants either native to or suited for the climate (rubber, cocoa, coffee, cotton, sugar, etc.) and replacing the jungle with extremely lucrative plantation land.

The key to exploiting this smoothly, assuming that we don't just want to go in and force it, will be economics. We in the civilized regions have all kinds of nice shit that the tribespeople don't thanks to our higher tech level; get them eager for our wonderful things. They- or at least a segment of their population- will quickly begin to focus more on extracting salable goods from the region around them than they will on continuing their existing lifestyle, simply because it's easier and more profitable to sell to us and buy our things than it is to make things themselves. As their economies become increasingly centered around getting good for sale, our ability to effectively pressure their decisions will grow.

>>15118335

I'd like this, as she's currently rather a-typical for a Silver.

However, perhaps not now. It's hard to gauge when is a good time for bringing up her honour, as it's one of the things that has landed her in her current situation- even if the current situation is a marked improvement over her old one.

>>15118373

I figure so long as we remain subtle, she won't find cause to start any crusades against us. Might be worth getting a non-agression pact out of her when she leaves too, just to be sure.

>>15118391


Once that's happened, encourage them to clear patches of jungle and plant usable plants; when they realize that's unworkable on a large scale for their populations and very hard work, facilitate the raiding of bordering tribes not beholden to us for slaves that they will be able to use as relatively inexpensive plantation labor. (Note: Keep an eye on that necromantic tribe; zombies make excellent plantation workers. Perhaps work out some kind of quiet and highly profitable exception to the law for them.) Use our military force to keep jungle monsters down and ensure that there is plenty of food for the population; this should increase their numbers significantly and provide us with a larger plantation labor base.

I give it maybe ten years of this plan before our jungle holdings will be making bank, assuming that we get some competent people who know what they're up to in charge of handling relations with the natives and seeing that imports/exports are done with manipulating events like this in mind.

Anyone else, feel free to chime in with refinements.

>>15118394

That's the good thing about knowing she keeps her word, we can weedle much out of her in return for freedom.

Including this current 80 years of service.

>>15118394
>non-aggression pact when she leaves

Lulwot.

>>15118409

If it's not banana plantations, I don't want to hear about it.

>>15118446
We can grow whatever the hell we want, including bananas.

>>15118441

Simple as that. She keeps her snout out of our affairs (being by that time presumably armed with intimate knowledge of our dealings), and we don't have a reason to pull her wings off and feed them to her.

Add in sub-clauses like she isnt allowed to pass information on to third parties, directly of otherwise.

Because she is so honourable, if she agrees she will keep her word.

>>15118335
I don't think she's LN at all.

People seem to be confusing LG with Lawful Nice. She's a dragon too. Metallics are nice to humanoids but they hardly consider them equals and even metallics don't think twice about fucking them over in service to "the greater good".

So really no, she's still LG in my books until we see some other type of act.

Also Silvers have better mental stats than reds but why would we care? Play the game, if we lose we lose it's just a game. At the end of the day she's still our slave.

>>15118457
Fuck that shit, she's going nowhere unless she extends her service. Even taking into account her swearing not to pass stuff on, there are plenty of spells and creatures that can read minds, and we are not leaving free individuals with that kind of access to our knowledge.

>>15118569

This is assuming that she knows anything by that point.

So far all she SUSPECTS is that we are Lord Prestor, and...

...well that's about it. Just keep her in relative ignorance and we should be fine.

Dammit, you guys, Nehmaska's ultimate fate isn't going to be a problem for seventy years. Stop worrying about it now and make some practical plans.

“I do not believe I mentioned needing you for anything.” you reply mildly.

“Of course, but I doubt this is a social call...?” Nehmaska asks.

“Actually, I suppose you could say it is.” you reply, stepping to one side, up onto one of the ledges. The effect is something like a tiered amphitheater, with her lair proper as the central stage. A bit too uneven, and the tiers too large, perhaps, but it is an interesting look. “I intended to offer you a boon, and perhaps extend an invitation.” you answer.

“Offer a boon, and perhaps extend an invitation. Generosity is certainly not what most Reds are renown for. She answers with feigned awe. You feel the urge to point out that granting one possession to another hardly makes you poorer, but resist the temptation. “Dare I ask what this invitation is regarding?”

“Evidently you do.” you answer. “Specifically, a game, should you so desire.” you say, revealing the case.

“Ah... How unexpected. Very well, I consent.” she replies, taking interest. You nod, and move down to join her, commencing setup. She calls a kobold forth to deal with the pieces, and you retreat to your perch, the nearest and lowest of the surrounding 'seats'. The kobold is capable of following instructions, and you each settle down for the game, the kobold in the middle moving pieces as per you instructions.

“So, if I may inquire...” you ask, after allowing her to resume conversation if she wanted to.

“Questions are free.” she replies with disinterest, focusing on the board.

“What was your opinion of the dragons at the Mza/Rhasver peace-talks?” you ask. “I shall confess, there were a surprising number of other dragons around the table.

“Ah, yes. Let us recount.. Great Seffestranias the Red... Clytavernax the Gold... And, while she wasn't present, I presume you're asking my opinion on Halyiestraka, the Bronze, too?”

“I confess my interests.” you reply, pausing, then following your statement up with instructions to the kobold.

“The the remaining dragons would be Silver Nehmaska, and Azaladon the Red. Incidentally, have you considered what an /amazing/ match Seffestranias and yourself would make?” she asks, you're fairly certain sarcastically.

“Those would indeed be the remaining dragons involved in the war, and regarding your question, only when highly intoxicated.” you reply blandly, pausing as she starts giving orders to the kobold. “The last two, though, I would not presume to ask for your opinions on.”

“Or at least, not presume to expect an answer on.” Nehmaska replies. “Very well. Seffestranias is... An exquisite example of your particular breed. Blunt. Fond of brute force. I would expect greedy, though I suppose you are the one who handled negotiations with her, so you'd know better on that subject.”

“You are correct on both accounts.” you reply with an air of pain. “Do continue.”

“Very well. Greedy, not terribly bright, proud, but surprisingly difficult to manipulate.” Nehmaska continues. “I would consider her quite dangerous. Certainly considering her actions in the war. I understand she was somewhat more effective than I was.”

“I can't agree with that, but she was certainly more lucky.” you reply. “Nothing closer than a graze or three. She didn't, ah, get such a direct hit as you did. I trust your shoulder is recovered?”

“No different from the last time you asked.” Nehmaska replies. “Which is to say yes. Next, then, would be Clytavernax. He... -I find myself surprised, but I suppose it was inevitable- I expect we'll agree that he is a bit too full of himself and too proud of his stature as a /gold/.” the way she says it sounds almost mocking, but not quite. “My experience in dealing with him suggested that he thinks he knows exactly what is happening, and that everything would be so much easier if people would just always listen to him. A trait common in many people, but rarely so pronounced.” she finishes. “I'd put him in the same rank as Seffestranias, perhaps lower, considering that she has an empire at her beck and call. Dangerous, potentially manipulable, and a relatively average example of his breed, if a bit... tempestuous. Impatient. ...Not quite impulsive, I think. Still, an individual I would not want to cross, though perhaps you would feel differently?”

“I am sure I shall decide when the time comes.” you reply. You wonder how she percieves it, whether it sounds like you fear her, or perhaps she thinks you're trying to be foolishly secure in order to trick her... No point in bothering about that, you suppose.

“I'm sure. Very well. The next would be Halyiestraka. She is... capable. Young. I think she is more interested in building up her hoard than in politics or who rules what. I think she insisted on attending the conference because she saw it as something someone of her importance should attend. Perhaps also to see quite what her efforts have accomplished, though I think less of that. The last two would then be Nehmaska and Azaladon...”

“And you believe it would be more polite to refrain from commenting on those?” you guess sardonically.

“Perhaps. Now about this boon you mentioned earlier...”

“I have been quite pleased with your services so far, and wish to offer a token of my pleasure.” you answer neutrally. “Seeing as I am not terribly inclined to give you some trinket of fire warding, nor do I think you would trust one if I gave it to you, I figured I should ask you.”

“Not, perhaps, your wife or consort?” she asks innocently. You actually almost respond, but merely remain pointedly quiet. “Ah, of course. Well, seeing as you are unlikely to be willing to grant me my freedom....” she pauses here, so you affirm with a nod, and take the opportunity to issue some orders to the kobold. She's ahead, but you think you see an opening... “Then I might ask for something more reasonable.”

“Like?” you ask, when it becomes clear that she desires further prompting.

“Hmm... Perhaps permission to... go shopping, I suppose.” she states. You stare at her, and see that she's innocently focusing her attention on the board.

“You want to go /shopping/.” you say. Not so much a question as a statement.

“Well, that's hardly the right term,” she answers, “but it's close enough. Playing markets is remarkably easy provided a long enough attention span. Besides, frozen food is...” she pauses, punctuating it with a chuff of exhalation. The kobold shivers, and moves away from her. “Well, I confess, I have a weakness for humanoid cookery. Either way, I hardly intend to end up with less than I started with, over the long term, at least.”

“I see. And, if you do not mind me asking, have you not been doing so previously?” you ask. You do not need to gesture at the low-quality gemstones, or the various new jewelry she happens to be wearing. You can smell some of the magic from here.

“Indeed. However, my request stands.” she replies calmly. You suppose half of what she gets from this is the insult and infuriating qualities of the request.

>>15118945

I sense a trick. Shes asking to do something that she has no problem taking her own initiative on, sounds like shes subtly testing the bonds of the pact she made. Better question her more thoroughly on why she wants to go 'shopping' and what for exactly, maybe quietly invoke a ward of truth just to be certain.

>>15118945
"Well then, so be it. Consider it done. Now that it is finished, however, I confess I am a bit surprised as well as relieved. When I deign to give a boon I mean it truly, and what you asked is hardly a fraction of what I was willing to provide for your able services."

Smile.

"Still, a deal is a deal. I am afraid you will have to live with what you chose."

FUCK YES DRAGONQUEST!

Give the caveat that she must not hinder the trade of Mza, though hindering other organizations is certainly fine. Say it's because we don't particularly want to cheese off Lord Prestor, imply that last time we did the result was... unpleasant, and we would rather not repeat.

>>15119020

I...think she knows what she's asking for, and how much more we could have given her.

I arrived a tad late.
FUCKYEAH DRAGONQUEST.
Ehem.

>>15118945
Laugh. "Nehmaska, I came here to play one game and dispense one boon, not play two games. Enjoy your 'shopping'. Don't do anything I would likely disapprove of. Tell me of anything particularly interesting that happens... three things which I know, as a faithful and loyal servant apparently fond of shopping, you doubtless would have anyway."

>>15119046
Do not give her the satisfaction of either provoking our paranoia or of seeing through our obvious lies. Every time we insist that we're not Lord Prestor when she knows that's bullshit, we look weaker; when one is letting an obvious falsehood stand, one should not constantly point it out.

Ask her what she's shopping for. May as well continue this smalltalk while the game goes on.

Hel-whatever sounds interesting; at least more worthwile than the Gold.

“Shopping.” you say shortly, not really worried about showing quite how much the request surprised you.

“Surely your generosity is sufficient to grant such a modest request?” Nehmaska asks as if she didn't notice. Her tone takes a turn for the taunting, though. “Perhaps... Perhaps if you feel you cannot trust me, you may insist upon accompanying me? I am always in need of someone to... carry things.”

“I'll bet.” you reply back. “May I ask what, precisely, you intend to go shopping for?”

“Oh, things.” she replies in a bored tone. “While your kobolds have done work, this is more 'cave' than 'lair'. Perhaps something to make it feel more like one. Tapestries or wall-hangings, perhaps. Cushions, for what time I spend in humanoid form. Perhaps a carpet.”

“And yet, I can't shake the feeling that you have designs you are not mentioning here.” you reply dryly. “Any special plots you'd like to fill me in on? Have you located an escape clause in our pact?”

“I couldn't say.” she replies blandly. “Can I break it by wearing high-heels?”. You pause and give her a level stare, which she returns with amusement.

“I can't say I imagined you as that particular type.” you answer. “And can't you manifest it anyway?” She doesn't answer your question, instead issuing further instructions to the kobold.

“It was an example.” she replies, surrendering the issue. “Still. My boon?”

>>15119266
let her enjoy her shopping

>>15119266
Well, that was disgustingly incompetent of us. Should have followed >>15119117.

But hey, whatever, I guess. We'll just have to live with the shame of having socially danced for Nehmaska's amusement like her puppet on strings.

>>15119266
>“Still. My boon?”
"Still, you didn't actually answer what it was you wished to buy or do. I am not adverse to it, but I must admit I am curious."

Once again, if she's going to be playing the markets she can not hinder Mzian trade.

>>15119266

Lets just give her her silly little wish; let her play her silly little games with herself.

>>15119360

There's a point- but it seems the more interest we take in this whim of hers the more egg gets on our face.

How irritating.

Send an escort that has control of the purse-strings and has some mind protection related magic items on her. Document everything in triplicate after it's done just to show it's a bureaucratic affair for us. Bonus points if we restrict the shopping to a city under our control (obviously not Mza).

Girl apparently just wants to go on a shopping spree on the master's dime.

>>15119354
This. Could we please NOT act like some kind of socially inept child, to chase after every teasing response like they are made of crystallized sex? Do we not know how to navigate a simple conversation?

Find out what she wants, exactly. We give boons, we don't give open ended boons. Tell her that while we appreciate that she's trying to be all evasive we don't really appreciate it. If she WANTS to turn her 70 remaining years into 70 years of hell on earth in our tenure then that's fine with us. We can surely provide. We were attempting to be civil and nice here, and if she attempts to throw it back in our face with cutting comments we can damn well relocate her to a 120 degree barren wasteland away from civilization.

more dragons sex

>>15119463

All she'd do if we did that is change tack. I'd prefer passive-aggressive poking than some weird duplicitous attitude with more behind-the-scenes resentment and scheming.

>>15119512
>implying she's not already being duplicitous and doing exactly that

>>15119453
Her use of the term "shopping" doesn't mean "go out and pay for things", it means "use superior draconic abilities and intellect to make tons of profits by taking advantage of the free market".

>>15119575

>Implying it can't get worse

But seriously, what do we need to DO to get her to not poke us so much?

>>15119611
We need to poke HER

ifyaknowwhatImean

>>15119602
So long as she promises to take no action that she believes might destabilize the Mza economy, and in fact make our nation's products more profitable, then perhaps we ought to encourage that she do just that.

>>15119651
Not happening. I do like this one, though.

>>15119611
When people try to poke you, you should try to bite them. I'm sure it's applicable somehow.

>>15119675

Man I would not want to be you friend.

>>15119675
>>15119651
No really, the more she likes, the less we have to worry about her. Not that we WILL be less cautious, but still

>>15119611
Stop acting like she's bamboozling us with this slight-of-words act. We don't write blank checks, she has to spill if she wants the boon. Honestly spill it all.

Hell, imply that we might well have more honor than she does, because we're at least keeping to the spirit of the agreement (to the best of her knowledge) while she is trying to be all deceptive. That will get her riled and be a jab that stings.

>>15119760
That hurts. Uh, emphasis on try to bite?

>>15119761
Silvers especially dislike Reds, and she is literally forced to be in her position. There's no doubt in my mind that she has bad intentions for us and will act on them eventually. Her growing to like Azaladon much is sort of out of the question.

>>15119769
>because we're at least keeping to the spirit of the agreement (to the best of her knowledge)
I approve because we aren't keeping to the spirit of the agreement at all and planning to kill or re-enslave her already. That makes the jab double delicious because we know we zinged her with something that wasn't even true.

>>15119796

Maybe if we had a sense of humor she'd like us.

But for now lets just jab back at her and see how she likes it

>>15119820
Thirding (fourthing?) "jabbing" at her. ;)

>>15119796
Not the same person, but I would like to point out that she was also attacked and almost killed by another red who then stole her hoard. Then we came along, beat her nearly to death, then forced her to sign an infernal pact with her soul on the line.

So she is not only a natural default red-hater, she has genuine reason to hate reds even moreso.

>>15119862
Most of this paranoia is pointless, we have ~80 years of service, at least 40 until we need to worry about it. Remember that Tiamat already blew our cover to non-chromatics, whom we aren't fond of anyway.

As to conversation, we don't like golds either. Though I think blacks would be our least favorite considering we've plotted against and killed more of them than any other.

>>15119987
I'm guessing we also don't like white dragons either, considering one of them pretty much went ARAGHRAGHGHARAHGHG when we tried to hire it.

Really, greens and blues are the chromatics to make deals with.

>>15120115
>greens

Hahahahano. They may be LE, but even greens don't bother with making deals with other greens because they know better than to trust a green to keep it's word.

>>15120168
Short-term deals with greens are fine. Just make sure that you have enough force available to ensure that they keep their end of the bargain.

Long-term deals, you've got the right of it.

>>15120168
See upper left corner, #16.

More dragon sex!

>>15120315
can we get an update on this ,ap

>>15120315
Too busy drooling at the map to make any observations of it.

>>15120325
No! Bad you! ...actually, there was someone writing some kind of DQ fapfic at one point. Very likely related.

>>15120336

As soon as I get the new Map borders, sure.

[Sorry to you in-thread types. Managed it on chat, but didn't manage to post a warning about my impending dinner-absence. That's why this post is relatively short.]

You pause, considering her prompting, and contemplate pressing her for her reasons. You discard it after a few moments, deciding on a different tack.

“Of course, I should have remembered!” you say, letting out a rumble of a chuckle after a few moments, something that does seem to catch Nehmaska by surprise.

“Oh?”

“I should have remembered, dear Nehmaska, I came here to play one game and dispense one boon, not play two games. Enjoy your 'shopping'. Don't do anything I would likely disapprove of. Tell me of anything particularly interesting that happens... three things which I know, as a faithful and loyal servant apparently fond of shopping, you doubtless would have anyway."

“Ah, very well. Thank you, my liege.” Nehmaska replies with a hint of mockery. Not deliberate, you think- perhaps a sign of you rattling /her/ for a change. It occurs to you that you may be unintentionally creating an image for her- But if you're doing it without trying to, is it truly an act? You decide to put that aside before you go crazy, and return to the game. Nehmaska remains mostly quiet for the rest of the game, though you do maintain amiable banter, and end up narrowly winning. Again, you consider the possibility that she let you win, but settle on the fact that she probably didn't- From what you think you know of her, she'd far prefer to play honestly and leave your paranoia to do the rest than to actually feign a loss. Visit concluded, she sees you out, and you depart.

########

The next few months go fairly smoothly, even well. Scinnari seems to have her fellow devils under control, despite the best efforts of the followers of Mammon. In celebration of the event, and her successful negotiation with Aquitaine for continued good relations, you present her with the armor you had made for her. She seems as impressed as you'd hoped, and barring a few minor details that can easily be fixed, the armor fits her perfectly. She acts like it too, overjoyed. An extremely pleasant week or two follows, and Scinnari eagerly shows off the progress you've missed with Cygnariassis. She is, indeed, as Scinnari claimed, quite subservient, and does seem to honestly believe it is her role in life, her proper one at that. Harmless... Obedient... Loyal... Safe, it seems. You heap praise upon Scinnari for her excellent work, and she demurely accepts, though you can tell she is secretly delighted herself.

In the midst of spring, however, something arises. The Red you attempted to assist, Firelady, has finally given in and called for your assistance. You can tell there is panic under her thin veneer of composure.

“A blue has moved south of me. He... does not intend to leave, and is likely to start expanding his territory in my direction. He further holds my... dominion in contempt, and refuses to work with me in any way.” she explains, mostly calmly. “Worse, someone must have- Word travels fast, apparently. I have adventurers stalking the jungle, seeking my tribe, and probably myself. I cannot depose them on my own, and I do not favor my odds, should they force a confrontation by encountering my tribe. You said you might be able to render assistance when you spoke with me, and I seem to need it.” she replies. The hint of panic is definitely there.

I guess we should get Cygnis on that steed training now, then.

>>15120536

Oh Cygnis, what has she DONE to you?

>>15120536
Well. Let's scry this blue first off.

When we go to aid Firelady we should teleport in with a full battalion of our adamantine-armored chosen. Be confident, impressive, and overwhelmingly powerful. Send the lizardfolk out to slaughter the adventurers in the jungles, as they do best.

Perhaps this would be a good trial for our own adamantine armor if we think we might need it for the blue. (I trust it's enchanted appropriately with anti-lightning, anti-cold, anti-acid, protection from missiles, blah blah... everything we would need to make draconic combat much easier and have it naturally ward off any non-enchanted ballista bolts. We should of course before anything gather info and go in with an attack plan at the ready.

Mind you, it's possible we might just be able to TALK to the blue and say "Dude, gtfo." Might be better than pissing off some fucking bloooozzzz.

>>15120600
Ditto. Going to emphasize the diplomacy, but there really isn't anything else to add.

>>15120562
Yes, now is time to mount Cygnis.

I you know what I mean

>>15120536
Our protege calls! Let's go help and be suitably impressive about it but check out the blue and adventurers before hand with our magic. We should have the spies in that area check into any rumors about people posting bounties for a red dragon too so we can find out who is doing it.

>>15120653
I mean sex

>>15120600
Doing this will effectively openly declare to the world that Firelady is nothing more than our puppet. I thought that the idea here was to do a mentor thing- that is, encourage her to grow and become competent on her own, not to solve all her problems for her.

I mean, we certainly can sweep in and basically declare her holdings our protectorate and her nothing more than a subordinate that we're leaving in charge, but I didn't think that was our stated objective with her.

>>15120700
And an alternative solution?

>>15120562
Yup. Or servant first and then steed; either way, it's time to begin teaching her to serve us actively.

>>15120696
Honestly, I figured we were doing that already whenever we felt like it and WD just wasn't mentioning it because it wasn't that important.

>>15120700
That's basically how it's going to be anyway though. She just can NOT defeat any dragon of significantly older age. Doesn't have the resources or the power. That's what we're there for. We will teach her how to do things and let her experiment on her own. It's her territory to do with as she pleases. We're just there to keep the 100 year old blues and such away, and we'll be teaching her how to do it herself as she becomes capable of doing so.

What is with the dragonsex faggot today?

Ignore him WD.

>>15120749
Has it been hinted at? WD, Azaladon have sex with Cygnis? Confirm/Deny?

Personally, I'd like to see us ask her just how much support she wants us to give her. Always useful to have a good idea of how a characters pride and their practicality interact.

>>15120777
It hasn't been hinted at, now shut up.

>>15120777
We've had sex with her in elven form. Just before we captured her.

>>15120777
Once back in freeport, now drop it enough.

I say we quiz her more on what she thinks she needs, then give her exactly that to get the job done.

This is her first major crisis- I hope she realizes this is also her first major test.

>>15120791
>>15120792
But what about our dragon harem? D:

>>15120835
It doesn't exist.

>>15120850
Then we should get to work! It is after all an important extension of the hoard

>>15120876
Tell you what, we have a black male stuck in a hole in our lab for "research purposes," feel free to fap to that.

>>15120876
stop it, stop it now.

>>15120781
i like this idea

>>15120737
Alternative solution... well, if our goal here is to grow her up into a competent draconic ruler type, then we need to treat this as a learning problem. Teleport over and sit down for a conversation, get the details- how old is the blue? What conversations with him has she had? How does she know of the adventurers? How many has she encountered so far? What does she think is causing them to come?

Then move to a diplomacy lesson: She has a powerful ally, us, to call on for aid... but of course, nothing is entirely free even though our friendship comes at a steep discount. Assuming that we will expect her to return whatever favors we offer at some point, what specific assistance would she desire in solving her problems? Would she ask us to use force on her behalf? Diplomacy? Spies? Lend or gift her minions or magic items? Then make our evaluation of if that will be enough, and give her what she requests unless she wishes to change it.

The whole point of the Firelady project is to see how she grows and approaches problems, to see if she's someone worthwhile for keeping around. If we don't spend some time looking at what she wants and how she thinks, it's mostly pointless.

>>15120757
I know that we're supposed to give her backup, since she obviously can't handle problems of this size- but she can't have a completely protected sandbox, either.

>>15120900
Please, no need to project your fetish for black males onto others. No need to make this all worse.

>>15120572
Been kind, benevolent, and otherwise a very pleasant person to be around, barring a few personal quirks. Apparently that was enough.

#####################

"Tell me about these adventurers." you counter.

"They are coming south- They are searching for tribes and other indigenous populations, possibly to kill, though I haven't picked up quite why they are here beyond that.”

“I see. Do you know who sent them?”

“No.” Firelady is obviously agitated, you suppose due to the potential eviction or death she faces. Still... “They are capable, though. I attempted to lure a pack of abominations into them. They managed to kill three and evade the rest.”

“Abominations. Aberrations, you mean?” you ask. Firelady nods. “What kind?”

“I don't know!” Firelady answers with obvious frustration, coughing up a spurt of flame into the mirror.

“I am willing to help you, but please be patient. I cannot help you without knowing the scope of your problems, and considering that you are asking my help, you should be treating me better if you expect it.” you reply severely.

“I... You are correct. I apologize.” Firelady replies, though you can see it pains her pride to do so.

“Now, how close are they?”

“Two days march from encountering my tribe for certain. I have already issued orders to stay away from them to my tribe, but they- They seem to be heading straight for me.” she answers. Ah. That would explain her agitation. Already exhausted all her other options.

“And the Blue. Can you give me his- or her name?”

“No. He... claims to be looking to escape the Suzerainity, though, and having alighted on my domain as ripe for the taking.” Firelady replies. The anger in her voice is not feigned.

“Very well... I will see what I can do. Stand by.” you reply, before 'switching off'. Hurried scrying ensues, having to deal with the same time limit as your protégé in this matter. The Blue you cannot identify, though it is a male, and he seems to have quite meager hoard and lair for his age- Either he's still in the process of moving, which you doubt, he is establishing a summer home, which you also doubt, or he may have left under poor circumstances, being forced to leave behind most of his gains. Or something you have not yet thought to consider... You sigh. He is quite nearly your size, and you place his age at around two or three hundred years.


The adventurers are different all together. Six of them, them fill the traditional roles of an adventuring group, and seem to have hired a lizardman as a guide of sorts. From a tribe nearer to the shore, you decide, primitive, superstitious, and not terribly bright. Even beyond that, though, the seem relatively able to protect and handle themselves, though, and one of the group seems to be on good terms and to have learned quite a bit from their guide. While a weakness, he is not a crucial one.

Regarding the rest, the group has the same weird cohesion that most groups of adventurers do- for a bunch of mercenary sociopaths who excel in various forms of destruction, the are usually bizarrely loyal to each other. The most significant friction seems to be between the party thief and leader- apparently a long-running feud that verges on open combat, but for that incomprehensible reason, stays subdued and peaceful.

Their mission, as far as you are able to discern (scrying on them makes you wonder just how Firelady got her information,) is to scout a passage through the jungle, ideally to the mountains, and over, into Tashz. Ambitious, to be sure, and ultimately futile, you suspect. Not that that limits the damage they can do on the way, particularly to an individual like Firelady.

>>15120737
Take her in and actually educate her a little bit? A framework to base her activities on will make it easier to subdorn her later on, since we'll mostly understand the function of her quazi-empire, and the inhabitants won't resist as much if their culture is practically identical to the one conquering them.

Machiavelli understood this principle, so should you.

>>15120927

I was actually referring to what Scinnari did to Cygnis to get her to be like that.

>>15120939
Go away trollpharius.

>>15120937
Honestly the adventuers probably aren't anything we couldn't take care of by coming in invisibly from a few thousand feet overhead and then blasting with fire as we pull up from the dive.

That said, I would prefer to to use a projected image and talk to them instead. Tell them that this area is closed and advise they seek their path somewhere else. See what they say.

I would also like to use a projected image to talk with the blue. Tell him that we would prefer he move elsewhere and see what he says.

Sadly I think we're going to have to kill all of them. I advise attempting to contact the lizardfolk guide and use his innate superstition and lizardfolk worship of dragons to have him lead the adventurers into an ambush by our lizardfolk.

With the blue... well, we're going to have to come up with a plan. Scry everything around him. His lair, where he is exactly, things like that.

>>15120939
>easier to subdorn her later on, since we'll mostly understand the function of her quazi-empire, and the inhabitants won't resist as much if their culture is practically identical to the one conquering them.

It's like you haven't got a clue what we're trying to do here...

>>15120937
All right, I see some serious possibilities here. Chat with Firelady, and see what she would want done in a >>15120913 fashion, giving her what we've learned so far for free.

It's not the easy way to do it, but there's a chance we may be able to diplomance our way through this one to great profit. If the adventurers find a route through the jungle, Firelady and her tribe could secure it and charge tolls on it. Send the adventurers into the mountains afterward, and the blue will either die fighting them or can do the same for the mountain portion of it. We warn the blue off Firelady with some stern words about the fact that blues use the suzerainty structure for a reason and unless he wants to see why reds usually don't bother he shouldn't bully the little one. The adventurers get their route, Firelady and the blue both get some income, and the blue will remain in place with a vested interest in defending the area from encroachment by other dragons.

Of course, that may be wildly optimistic. But if it fails, we can just burn everyone and call it good.

>>15120600
Yes, we need to know if this Blue is in any way related to the Blues from Tashz, as unlikely as it may be. The chance is very small, but the cost of ascertaining is small enough that I think it an important investment.

>>15121077
Making it easier to add her to the harem, right?

>>15121013
Second. I like the ambush idea and the blue will probably just leave if he finds out there is a dragon of our power around that he would need to fight here.

Between this
>>15120913
and this
>>15121089
I think we hav a decent plan here. We might want to have Azyra watch this (Long distance watching or scrying of some kind, depending on what she can do and what we have the items for), to back up that lesson we were teaching her earlier about negotiation being a far superior method than fighting. Of course, if it all goes South she can see how fighting is sometimes important too.

Oh, and if Firelady doesn't come up with this plan (which I wouldn't expect her to, really), we might want to gently steer her towards it, giving her some time to come up with possible options and suggesting things she misses. Again, good to see where she lies on the kill shit ----- talk stuff through scale.

>>15121089
Unmated ragons almost never share territory. Either the blue stays or Firelady stays. I vote Firelady, since we said we'd help her out.

>>15121248
That's not how it works bro. Did you not hear Firelady? The blue is already in her territory. We would be giving away her territory to do that.

We really need to tell her to get a better name.

>>15121257
>“A blue has moved south of me. He... does not intend to leave, and is likely to start expanding his territory in my direction.

Not yet he isn't.

>>15121077 It's like you haven't got a clue what we're trying to do here...

No I don't. There's been nothing to indicate from the archives that you have ANY plan at all, except to create a powerful enemy in the long run. Look at your own history, nothing is beyond reach for her.

>>15121013
LoL... it's funny. If it weren't for my original suggestion, you'd have stayed in Freeport and had NONE OF THIS. AN EMPIRE OF YOUR OWN CREATION.

So FUCK YOU buddy.

As for my current suggestion, in addition to what I said earlier, marry Seffeswhatever and make her agree to an infernal contract to be, for all intents and purposes, loyal and willing to aid you. The states can remain seperate for all I care, if the only thing left at the end of this is two giant empires that are united by a marriage then so be it.. nothing stopping Scinnarri assassinating her behind your back..

>>15121559
I second the marrying of Seffy. We'll need to start making little dragonlings eventually anyway, find some way to make a dragon army. Plus adding her territory to our empire wouldn't be too bad either.

Scinarri doesn't like it? Too bad, we're the ones in charge here.


We, of course, should still not our guard down to Seffy. Better to have her as a most definite ally than a potential enemy though.

>>15121559
>>15121621
You are completely fucking retarded and need to be beaten around the head with the clue stick until you're put in intensive care where you can't make such shitty suggestions.

The adventurers prove intractable.

“Bloody 'ell, it's closed. 'nless you want to come out here and stop us yerself, we ain't changing anythin'.”

“As my companion has stated, we must continue. We mean no harm, and intend no interference, but our path takes us through here, and we cannot turn back now.” the leader replies. You frown, but do not otherwise react.

“Very well. Good luck.” you reply, figuring on a last bit of psychological combat. You cut the connection, and turn your attention instead to the Blue.

He is not terribly willing to move either.

“I hear your request, but I'm afraid that unless you are willing to offer me something more palpable than threats, I am unwilling to vacate my new dwelling.” he replies. “I confess I am not terribly interested in combat, but this is my lair, at the moment. I am unwilling to give it up as a... favor.” he says. If he had a lip, he'd be curling it in distaste. “If you do manage to come up with something, I am willing to talk, but until then...”


“How very courageous of you.” you remark caustically. “Perhaps you can at least limit yourself from bullying those smaller than you? I do not want to, but I am more than capable of showing you just why Blues should not abandon their suzerainties, but Reds simply don't need them.”

“Your complaint has been noted and added to my topics of consideration. Perhaps I will leave your daughter alone.” the Blue replies. “If that is all..?” his bad mood is evident, and does nothing to improve yours. You cut connection without further ado, and return to Firelady again, first via your mirrors, and then in person.

“You can deal with them?” she asks, without preamble. Desperate. You suppose it makes your job moderately easier.

>>15121559
Nope.jpg

>>15121621
>>15121559
Seffy is going to try to be the one with the pants in any relationship. It wouldn't work out, we'd just end up trying to kill each other anyway. Might as well just do that on our own.

“No. I may, however, have what you need to be able to deal with it yourself.” you answer. “The adventurers seek a passage from the shore to the desert. Likely this will end up as a trade-route. So far they are merely scouting it. The Blue is likely an exile from his suzerainty, and on his own. “ You pause, allowing Firelady to piece it together. She fails to oblige.

“So? How does this /help?!” she asks, expelling another brief plume of flame in her agitation.

“Calm down.” your order sharply. More politely, you encourage, “Think about it.”

“It doesn't-!” she begins, but cuts herself off, forcing herself to contemplate your words. A dozen seconds later she resumes her train of thought, this time holding steely control of herself. “It does not help. They will not stop, and they will not turn aside- they are going to encounter me, and I will be forced to fight- Either myself, which will get me killed, or my village, which will likely get my minions and myself killed, even if I have such control over them,- Or I must flee, and leave behind everything I have acquired. My relationship with my 'high priest' is tenuous at best. I cannot afford my 'divine presence' hiding from adventurers.” her words turn toward self-pity and self-derision. You frown.

“You are forgetting what I told you.” you say, a hint of disappointment entering your voice.

“/What/, then!?” she shouts. You choose to ignore her outburst.

“They are interested in opening a trade passage between the coast and the mountains, perhaps even the desert.” you repeat. You feel as if this shouldn't have- she is hardly an adult, after all- but her failure has disappointed you. She glares at you, which you take stoically, then pauses to try and puzzle out your hint. “They intend to blaze a trail. Pioneer a literal path through the jungle.” you add.

>>15121632
u mad?

Trying giving valid criticism instead of throwing around insults everywhere, you little troll

>>15121621
>>15121559
Samefag gonna samefag

Go AWAY +12, nobody likes you

“So?” she asks in a huff, then considers it further. “They... They will be opening a path. They... are not actively seeking something tangible they can take from me... I may be able to negotiate with them.” she says at last.

“It's possible.” you encourage. “What about?” you add, trying to point her in the right direction, but it seems unnecessary. She seems to be capable of reasoning it out, once on the right track.

“So I can offer them... guidance, a path, protection... I could set myself up as a toll collector, even on this road they intend to make... Yes...” She switches from panic to hopeful plotting with remarkable alacrity.

“You could even...?” you prompt, and she focuses on your words again.

“I could even... I could point them towards that Tiamat's bastard Blue...” she concludes, absently cursing. You are actually kind of pleased. “But... this all hinges on being able to communicate with them. Peacefully.”

“Indeed. How do you intend to go about that?” you ask with mild interest. “Convince them they want to deal with you peacefully, rather than fight you?” She seems at loss, and so you hint. “Set yourself up as a benevolent figure in their eyes, rather than a malicious one. A possible friend, rather than a titan of legend.” She seems to swell slightly at the description, as it fuels her pride. She still seems stumped. You add a final hint. “Perhaps what your tribe can do...”

“I... welcome them. Of course. A... a feast, even. Set them up as travelers... a sign of good fortune, even, fortune to come, with the road...” she trails off, delighted, almost forgetting your presence, you think. She returns to herself after a few moments.

“If... If I am to... to host a banquet for the adventurers, a feast when they arrive, do you think etiquette... social mores would prevent them from attacking me, barring outright hostilities?” she asks, a plan evidently forming in her mind.

>>15121663
I'm not Alpharius, you dumbass

Quit getting your panties in a wad just because there are several people in favor of something you are against

>>15121559
>>15121632
>>15121662
>>15121663
>>15121696
Calm down, you lot. Anyway, working on more, but you do have an opportunity to affect it here, if you'd like to interject.

What?

We're not marrying anyone.

What the hell?

>>15121694
They're adventurers. Who the fuck knows. However, they seem fairly intent on scouting this route, and they did recruit a Lizardman guide, so they don't seem too... Stereotypical.

>>15121663
>>15121632
They think I'm same-fagging? I don't need to hide from you. I'll be open about who I am whenever I post.

My challenge to you is; can you, in bullet-point format, state *why* we should *not* marry seffestranias?

Arguments that you'll eventually have to kill her are ridiculous, as the pact I proposed wouldn't be worth the risks of breaking it and she has noone she could rely on to assassinate you and couldn't knowingly order it or allow it anyway. Not to mention your relationship with the younger female red being apparently platonic or whatever. Instead of saying to her "I'll set you up in return for you bearing my clutch as soon as you are able" you're opting for some objective mired in obscure logic that isn't being made clear to observers in the archives.

>>15121694

Welp, it took more coaxing than I thought it would, but then I suppose that's unsurprising given her youth and general sense of fear- that is an AWFULLY big blue to her, afterall.

As for if the adventurers will or will-not attack her for the feast...lol dunno. Probably shouldn't, if things are organized well enough. Perhaps we should survey how it goes ourselves, invisibly?

>>15121760
The pact you proposed is one that Seffy will never agree to. She's not interested in being a servant.

>>15121694
"They are sort of adventurers so it would be best not to just pop out of nowhere and surprise them. That said, if you let them see you coming from a distance and have several of your tribesmen around you the entire way as you do they will probably know you don't intend to harm them."

>>15121739
It's a political marriage. I'm confident Azaladon could ward off any potential backstabbing Seffy has in store, and either way we come out on top.

She tries to turn on us? We kill/enslave her and take her stuff. She doesn't? We still have her stuff.


Marrying Seffy is a win-win

>>15121778
Nope.

>>15121778
That ship has sailed, give it a rest troll-lord.

>>15121760
Because we have nothing to gain and quite a bit to lose? Because Seffy wouldn't agree to those terms? Because it would shit up our reputation to go from "reclusive, happily married, has daughter as heir" to "DUMPED HIS WIFE AND MARRIED A RED DRAGON TYRANT, ADVENTURERS LOOK HERE!!!" Because you're so fucking retarded you can't offer a single good reason to do it?

>>15121694
"There is a strong possibility. One can never be sure, with adventurers- they are psychotic as often as they are honorable. I would advise planning for contingencies, and being exceedingly careful about their impression of you and how you treat your tribe."

>>15121778
Absolutely not, it goes against everything the character of Azaladon has done up to this point and is stupid to boot.

>>15121784
>>15121794

You can't give any reason why you disagree, and you accuse me of being a troll even though I m doing nothing but participating in the quest?

I say it is you who is the troll.

>>15121722
I'd vote to let the Firelady handle the adventurers on her own, perhaps while keeping a careful eye on the goings.

The blue though, that is likely going to be an issue. Get a bunch of scrying going on his whereabouts, get his frequent locations known, and find a good locale to ambush him at? If our armor is done we could go ahead and test it out also in the ensuing battle.

On the other hand, the blue doesn't seem as annoyed as one might expect. Might be possible he isn't overtly hostile.

>>15121799
Who said anything about dumping Scinarri?

Polygamy isn't illegal here. We a dragon, make our own laws!

>>15121778
How does it qualify as a win/win when it doesn't actually get us anything more than we would already get? Just by marrying her she's not going to be any more inclined to do what we want, in fact she'll probably be even less so because she'll think we're in a relationship that she can take control of.

Plus she isn't actually interested in us, she just wants better access to the resources of our kingdom, which is larger and more powerful than hers. It's a political marriage in which we don't stand to gain anything more than an incredibly greedy and blunt wife. The one we have already is much better.

>>15121807
How does it go against his character? His character is determined by us anyway.

I say marry Seffestranias.

>>15121810
The fact that it is out of character IS a reason. We've never been one to enjoy dealing with Seffy, and getting married to her would be condemning ourselves to dealing with her all the damn time for little gain.

>>15121825
There is a certain charm in marrying seffy as our second wife, but it doesn't look like otherws are interested in mormon'ing it up.

>>15121811

He honestly seems like he's sulking to me. Like a discontented homeless guy, or a sad drunk wondering where his life went wrong.

>>15121842

Seffy wouldn't make a very good wife anyway. Too blunt. We prefer smooth.

>>15121694
Should we be there in person? Polymorphed as a tribal for the feast to keep an eye on things. It will give confidence to the little lady and cover her ass if things go downhill. And hey, free food.

>>15121842
The charm is part of it, I'd bet it'd be pretty funny. Plenty of people seem to be pro-seffy marriage as well!

>>15121811
He is pretty dangerous and I don't particularly want to fight him ourselves if we can avoid it. I would prefer killing him via assassination perhaps.

If we do I think we should soften him up by launching an alpha-strike magical attack and have (expendable non-chosen) lizardmen with ballistae outside his lair entrance for when he comes out to wreak retribution. A few bolts hit him and then as he is turning toward them we smash into him and do a brief RIP AND TEAR with our armored self before springing away before he can retaliate.

Might be a good time to see if Cygnis can offer some fire support too.

>>15121864
> Plenty of people seem to be pro-seffy marriage as well!

Numbers of posts in the thread are meaningless, there's been plenty of samefagging throughout DQ history. Until votes are cast in the IRC channel, it might as well be one guy.

>>15121872
No. Wait until we've tested her out with small duties. We should start with being a horse, then work her way up to our lair servant. When se can send her into town to pick things up for us without worry, she might be trustworthy in battle.Might.

>>15121864
No, they really aren't. The samefaggotry is heavy, there are "suddenly" all these people who simultaneously felt their need to declare a course of action that was resolved already? No.

Incidentally, we might want to do some research into why exactly this blue is out this far. Who he offended, or something of that variety. Might be money in killing him if that's the case.

>>15121874
Can someone provide the irc channel and server?

If otherwise our votes are to be dismissed as samefagging, then I guess I'll join up. Kind of paranoid, I seriously doubt there is really as much samefaggery as people like to accuse each other of.

>>15121874
Or emailed in.


>>15121844
I'm actually somewhat curious now as to what drove the blue from whatever society he had been in. There's also a slight chance that we may be able to acquire his services, if we lend a hand. More dragons on team Azaladon can't be bad.

The IRC channel is #dragonquest

>>15121900
>More dragons on team Azaladon can't be bad.
Oh ye of little imagination. It could be very bad, especially if there is an entire blue collective who dislikes him.

>>15121904
And the server? Or am I supposed to guess?

>>15121914
That's very well possible but we also don't know any specifics yet. It's at least worth looking into further, before going straight to a brawl or assassination.

>>15121897
> I seriously doubt there is really as much samefaggery as people like to accuse each other of.

There was enough samefagging in the past to create a shitstorm in the thread when we were trying to decide whether or not to kill Asha, even though the actual voting was pretty seriously one sided in favor keeping her alive.

There's a good reason why we have the channel in the first place, we really did need it.

>>15121904
>>15121897
>>15121915


IRCHighway, #dragonquest. I kind of agree, but it's probably known that I despise cries of samefag.

>>15121826
>>15121799
That's why you make the pact as a condition of the marriage. You both agree to the same terms. If she can't willing betray you then she gets that mutual assurance, you get an ally who is obligated to help what is now her empire as well (and she has admitted to being less skilled than you in diplomatic matters and government. She prefers fights she can win and so far you have a flawless track record. It's to her benefit to let you do the decision making) and she by association will have a powerful army to command and a huge income over what she already possesses. Which will be loyal to you. Fundamentally she gains only some extra income. You get the added bonuses to reputation as saving her current empire from her excesses.

You can devote the spies you have in her territory to more useful pursuits (because honestly if you can tame seffestranias, and claim the Firelady as a future source of offspring, nothing is beyond your grasp. Red Suzeranity? Yes please. Dynastic intentions aside, it makes sense from a biological perspective) and finally make use of the humanoids of her region as a staging ground for future military action.

I think big. It's why I said to leave Freeport in the first place.

>>15121883

This guy's got the right of it in regards to Cyg; get her to relax into simple orders and following, then move up into more complex etiquette and more gradual layers of responsibility.

Regarding actually USING her as a proper Dragon, that will require many MORE years of training, as for each level of enchantment that gets stripped away without proper handling, the more her massive wisdom stats will be telling her to rebel, unless they're coaxed up along with her. And this is if we want to do it at all, of which I for one...well, it'd remove a liability to do the mind-stat portion of this training, but having her as an actual dragon is still too risky for my tastes.

>>15121948
No, you think retarded. And claiming you "had us leave Freeport" is just icing on the cake. Bitch please.

>>15121948

Shh.

No.

Don't care how much you whine or try to justify it...

...No.

Voting in the IRC channel has been pretty one sided. To the question of marrying Seffy, 1 was in favor of marrying her, 6 were opposed.

Now it's 2 for, 7 opposed.

So says Omegon.

Guys! Focus your shit! We are not in a Seffy plotline right now, we're mucking about with Firelady's crisis.

>>15122037
I agree with this eloquent gentleman, most of the time people trolling back and forth it's adun and a few others, therefore the posts begin to blend together and accusations of samefagging go out

Speaking of Firelady's crisis: If her cunning plan goes horribly wrong and the adventurers start attacking her in a way she can't handle, have a kill team on standby to teleport in. It would be a damned shame to let her die because of a failed diplomacy roll.

To do:
Further scrying of the blue's lair. Figure out defenses, layout, all that jazz.
Investigate the blue's recent past. What the hell got him to go out this far, potential enemies, that sort of thing.
Keep tabs on the adventurers and Firelady. Observe progress, but don't intervene unless things really go south.

I say it's time to use our new most powerful servant in a test run. Go with Cygnis and kill the blue to test her out. While the firelady parleys with the adventurers.

>>15122112

...Why?

Just...why?

>>15122112
Nah, let's see how firelady's plan to point the adventurers at the blue plays out before going after him ourselves. They probably won't kill him, but they might weaken him. Make the job easier, quicker, and cleaner.

"There is a strong possibility.” you concede, secretly in triumph. “One can never be sure, with adventurers- they are psychotic as often as they are honorable. I would advise planning for contingencies, and being exceedingly careful about their impression of you and how you treat your tribe. If you do not appear to be evil, and appear a relatively benevolent figure, they are likely to at least give you a chance to prove your 'good intentions'. “ you advise. “That will likely get you your best odds. Naturally, be prepared for things to go poorly, though.”

“Of course. Thank you...” Firelady answers, then apparently getting another idea. “Do you think... would you be- interested” You have a distinct feeling that she was going to say 'willing', “in attending said banquet? You have been of invaluable assistance, it's the least I can do...” Ah, of course. Securing herself a contingency. You consider it. Perhaps... Oh, you can probably afford it. A few things should be made very clear, though...

“It is certainly the least you can do, and certainly possible. However, if we can dispense with attempts at manipulation, I will not function as your failsafe. I will not be your muscle. I may be willing to attend. I may even save you, if you are in danger- But I will not make sure you succeed. After all, this is your domain, and I would not want to intrude- I am, after all, here only at your invitation.”

“And I invite you to attend this banquet, if you so desire.” Firelady replies, staring at you, appraising you. “I would not presume to expect my guests to battle in my name-”

“Of course not.” you purr. “I may attend. Whether or not I do, do not count on my presence to help you resolve things. Plan and prepare as best you can, but do not plan upon my being there. Though I may...”

“Ah... Alright. I shall... do so.” she replies, evidently detecting that your meeting is at an end. “Will you alert me when you arrive?”

>>15122120
Why not?

“Probably not.” you reply. “I will certainly contact you afterward, but I doubt I will beforehand. As I told my... Someone recently, your mind is your greatest weapon. You only risk your life when it has already failed you.”

“Of course.” she replies, watching as you depart.

###################

You watch the events unfold and arrive on the eve of the banquet, invisible. The adventurers were contact by the tribesmen, ordered to be friendly, and brought back to the camp. You observe the proceedings silently and invisibly, watching Firelady's entrance and the adventurer's obvious discomfort as the recognize Firelady for what she is. They refrain from interrupting the proceedings, and address her in Draconic, then common, a language none of the the tribesmen know. Though a rocky start, Firelady does manage to convince them to accept her as the spokesperson for the village, partially due to their inability to communicate with the village.

Negotiations almost break down a second time at the behest of their particularly bloodthirsty rogue, but Firelady manages to convince them that she is their sole method of communicating with the tribe, (incorrect, as both the wizard and Firelady's 'high priest' speak draconic,) causing them to back down some, and consider her a more vital individual.

The end result is mixed- They are highly wary, and suspicious as ever, but are willing to to leave Firelady unharmed, at least until their return journey. Their intentions should they make it back are uncertain, but that would be much later, and Firelady has her eyes set on using them to evict the Blue. You suspect her enamored of such a 'complex' and 'elegant' plan, at least, for one of her age.

They stay the night, and while they do so at Firelady's invitation, both parties are quite suspicious- Firelady declines to spend the night upon her platform, and the adveturers sleep in shifts, maintaining a watch throughout the night.

>>15122139
Because possible death. Now what's your reason?

>>15122139
Want to see how Firelady handles it.
After that, we can proceed from there.

>>15122135
Lets not. To make sure she has a contingency.

>>15122147
How many dragons have we defeated? It was never an issue before and Cygnis our new and greatest weapon let's see if our patience has paid off with her.

Last details, regarding Firelady or myself? Want some parting words, or have to see something before the thread ends? It's getting late for me, and I'm going to need to call it a night soon. Next thread is next week- Guessing Sunday, Tuesday, or something similar. I can promise a quest or two sometime at next week, at any rate.

SK.Mockery@Yahoo.com, if any feel the pressing need to contact me. It looks like some of you might.

>>15122169
We should contact her and tell her we approve, praise is good for both daughters and young dragon proteges. Finally, tell her that should they survive their meeting with the blue and attempt to come back for her we will make ourselves known in more force.

>>15122166
We have defeated dragons by never, ever fighting on anything close to even footing. Azdouche we never even lifted a claw to kill. Cygnis we seduced. That black we captured was both a weaker breed and younger than us. Nehmy was severely wounded.

This is a 300 year old blue dragon in prime condition. Even with Cygnis supporting us, we could get badly hurt. If the adventurers can soften up the dragon first, that would help immensely. No need to rush things.

>>15122166

We aren't NEARLY done with Cygnis, and for the- for MORE TIMES THAN I CAN COUNT, using her as a DRAGON is STUPID.

HIGHER mental stats might make her think-guilt her way out.

People might recognize her, or it otherwise gets around that a Gold is paired up with a Red, which is HIGHLY unusual, or worse: paired up with Mza- neither being good because there arne't many Golds and presumably they all know each other.

She might be willing to serve in some capacity, but we're asking for hostile battle action her that might go against her Good nature more than it goes with her slavish streak. Such a confliction should be best dealt with when she barely thinks about the orders she carries out anymore- a talent I doubt she'll have much practice in until after steed training.

So NO. NO NO NO NOOOOOOOOOO.

Please say it with me. Please. I never want to hear this kind of use for Cygnis again.

No.

>>15122186
We did take that female young adult black like a boss. But even there we had the element of complete surprise, invisibility, and no mercy.

>>15122186
Blue is a weaker race and it's 2 v 1 not to mention 2 of the strongest species gold and red. Add that with our legendary planning. We are the dragon batman.

>>15122201
Also blacks are one of the weakest dragons, only slightly better than white dragons, which are the weakest.

>>15122185
I like this because it praises her for her good work using her head rather than her claws and it gives her a reward in the form of a safety net against the adventurers. Rewards are needed for good behavior too.

>>15122200
She is subdued completely and we can even put a contingency in place if needed. Also we can keep her invisible and even if we didn't the only one who would see her is the one we are killing.

>>15122207
Blue is only slightly weaker than red (as opposed to a black which is significantly weaker), and in the air they're actually better than a red. Plus this blue is twice our age, whereas the black was younger than us. A mature adult blue (like this one) actually is better than an adult red (like us) in a straight up fight. While the numbers advantage probably means that we'll win, we will probably be very, very badly hurt in the process. It's a risk we simply do not need to take right now.

>>15122227
Look dude, nobody else wants to do this. For one, it's not needed right now. See what the adventurers do first. For two, it's dangerous for myriad reasons already stated. For three, we simply might not need it and we should always keep some cards back for the doomsday scenarios.

>>15122207

Actually, even though a blue is a weaker race, the age advantage makes up for it. A mature adult blue is much better in a dogfight than an adult red. More HP and a better breath weapon for air combat. We're slightly stronger, but that doesn't mean quite as much in an air battle.

>>15122166
Our patience has not yet paid off fully. She's only loyal and fully brainwashed in stable conditions- we've done no field or stress testing at all. We can't trust her in gold dragon form until after she's spent decades serving us faithfully and independently in other forms.

She's no sort of weapon at all right now. She needs a lot more training. Amongst other things, we need to train her to kill for us on command without hesitation or moral qualm. Rewriting ethics to conform to a "master defines what is good" paradigm is generally a fair bit of a project.


>>15122169
Keep a close eye on the adventurers and on Firelady throughout the night. Particularly that thief, who might try to murder her in the middle of the night. Fucking thieves are always trying that kind of shit.

If they leave the tribe peacefully, we can congratulate her on successfully managing to evade at least one of her problems... at least for the moment. Then keep some scrying going on tracking the adventurers and the blue and let her know how that conflict eventually turns out. It may require more action on her part or ours.

When the whole thing is finished, drop by and have a long conversation with her about what just happened- an after-action review, as it were. Examine what worked and what did not- listen to what she thinks of the whole thing, but my take on it was that the usefulness of knowing what is going on and assessing situations with a clear head and an eye towards manipulating rather than confronting others was what won the day here. And when you've exhausted that topic, move on to recent events in her tribe and what steps she is taking to expand her influence and power; surely she's ambitious and competent enough to have several plans in the works.

>>15122145
Well, not really the best outcome but one of the better ones. Give the lady a pat on the back and remind her that her best weapons are not her minions or fire breath. Its her mind. With that she could go further than most reds, who seem to be more physical in their actions and behavior.

Was talk when we first encountered her of a subtly enchanted crystal ball, or something to make her more easily influence, or readily dependant on us. Any feelings on resurrecting that?

>>15122200
> steed training

Oh god this is a joke right? No one was actually considering this right? Right?

>>15122277
Eh, I think that if we drop in and serve as a protector/older mentor figure throughout her youth, she'll probably grow up to be pretty easily influenced by us anyway. We don't really need to resort to mind control as long as we're literally the only one she can talk to that isn't an enemy or minion and are an eternal font of sage advice and assistance.

>>15122281
Most people were, actually. Get her to polymorph into a horse or a pony, then lock her down and use her to teach Azyra horseback riding, or something. Gradually upgrade her, eventually moving to 'servant', and perhaps after a few decades, even up to Azyra's personal minion, or an actual dragon-servant. But that's far off and not worth considering.

>>15122281

Oh no, it's quite real. Serves a purpose beyond horsing around (HA!) too.

>>15122277

I was about to second this, but now I wonder if we should bother. I kind of like this as a side-project...but then again, I *do* hate being rebelled against after protege's get cocky...

>>15122299
>lock her down
lock down her polymorphing. She has to be able to walk/run about for Azyra to learn to ride. It'd be a good test, too. I don't think we've let her outside in decades.

So what's our plan with the firelady anyways? What is the end goal?

Also can we get clarification on how "broken" Cygnis is? A mind reading perhaps?

> So what's our plan with the firelady anyways? What is the end goal?

Personally, I think it would be good to essentially have her as a vassal in the area. If she runs the show, and does what we tell her to, then we essentially control the area.

>>15122299
That is the stupidest thing I have ever read. If this actually happens I won't read another thread.

>>15122319

I'm not sure we've actually thought through an end-game with Firelady. We just liked her pizazz.

>>15122341

Seeya!

>>15122331
I guess it could work. Seems like we could turn her into a loyal vassal. We will need to rethink that in a century or so when she is more powerful (and ambitious)

>>15122341
And nothing of value would be lost.

>>15122359
At which point she might very well be more interested in mating with us to try to manipulate us than fighting. Especially if we hammer home the "fight as a last resort" lesson.

>>15122351
>spend decades manipulating and bending the most powerful species of dragon to our will

>turn her into a horse

>>15122376
Why do I get the feeling we are creating our own worse enemy now?

>>15122376
She'd get all oedipal (elektral?) except it wouldn't be incest. I suppose there could be benefits to that. Of course, Scinnari Disapproves. (-10)...


>>15122379
Polymorph-wise. Get her to turn into a horse, and stay one while we teach her good and simple reflexive obedience.

I will confess it seems a bit too fetishy for me, as well, and would prefer it was not covered in detail, but that seems to be the gist of it.

>>15122379

You forgot the 'As part of bending her to our will' part.

But that's okay, I can see you're just repeat-posting.

>>15122386
Well then Morrigan and Scinnari can both go suck dicks in hell for all their scorn will get them.

>>15122379
Yeah, personally I'd rather train her as a servant. I can see how the horse bit is a pride thing... but having her as our servant is a pride thing too, and it's less ridiculous. Having Cygnis be a mount is fine if she's a dragon mount, but anything less seems... sub-par. Excusable only as an intermediate stage.

>>15122376
Sortofwant.jpg

>>15122392
>a devil
>suck dicks in hell

>>15122393

Pretty sure that was always the plan; the intent was never to keep her as a horse.

Presumably if she became Azy's retainer she'd have cause to be one again for her whenever Azy chose, but still.

And already, reasons have been given for why a dragon-steed, though badass, is a bad idea.

>>15122386

I'm expecting us to glaze over it neatly; not pretend it isn't happening, but not dwell or press on it. There's a danger that we'd lost touch with Cygnis' character and how it's changing her, but I reckon that could be updated in a vague way.

Couldn't we order the gold to appear as a red dragon using her polymorph self abilities? Then go with her and devour that blue dragon, get her used to evil acts and ambushing.

>>15122393
>excusable only as an intermediate stage.
That seemed to be the plan.

>>15122383
I'm sure I couldn't say. Depends on how you intend to handle it. As >>15122386 pointed out, Scinnari almost certainly wouldn't approve, though she may be, ah, 'trained' or 'devoted' enough to the point where she wouldn't object aloud anyway.

>>15122341
You know, I hate to see people go, but generally, I go with the votes. I recall that being the consensus in the thread it was introduced, and it seems to have majority vote here, too. If it drives you to leave, I'm sorry.

>>15122297
Possibly.

>>15122277
Confirm?

>>15122263
>>15122261
>>15122185
Noted.


More lovely fanart, gents.

I see no reason to turn Cygnis into a horse. It accomplishes nothing at all. And using her a dragon mount also makes no logical sense. Anyone disagree with supporting arguments?

Whoever archived did a terrible job.

>>15122492

Saying it makes no logical sense while not explaining why it makes none is not an argument.

As for the arguments FOR making her a horse, well, let me educate you:

1) It is humiliating. It further lowers Cygnis' opinion of herself, and aids in creating a mindset of inferiority wherapon she is not even on the same level as a sapient creature and is instead valued on a level equal to that of a common animal.

2) It helps in her training. Now I don't mean this in a 'horse' way (though we'll get to that), I mean in how to follow orders and such. Currently she's only recently accepted her 'place', which will of course come with a lot of nervousness and uncertainty. Having only to follow simple, repetitive commands from a limited list whilst being given some small amount of maneuverable freedom shall do much to improve her temperament and get her to start obeying on reflex.

3) Practical use. A lesser reason, but nonetheless a reason; she becomes usable and useful in a fashion, and is a good low-level way to introduce her back to the concept of personal responsibility- remembering that she hasn't had either a practical use OR any responsibility for over a decade now.

3) It gets her used to interacting with others again in a lower station than before. Our daughter needs to learn how to ride, and so this is an ample opportunity to kill several birds with one stone. She can mingle in with other peoples whilst still feeling 'apart' and 'below' them, which is a feeling we wish to cement in her new mindset.


See? And it's hardly permanent. Once she's gone up and settled into and through all variations of such handling we can move onto more complicated servant training, regarding posture, how to mentally handle more cognitive responsibilities, how and when to talk, etc...

So in summation, there's plenty of reason for it, and plenty of reason why it was largely approved.

Alright, stayed way longer than I meant to. Calling it a night, and I'll see you next weekend/week. Can reach me at email (earlier in thread) or simply by posting here. I'll check it, hell, I might even respond if this thread is still here in the morning. Either way, I always make sure to check last posts and things in the archives, so either email or posting works.

See you next week.

>>15122281
The two or three people who think they run this joint really are that stupid. That's not a joke. I haven't participated in a thread for like 20something threads but I stand by what I have said above.

And yes they really are that stupid.

>>15122671

I think you're just butthurt because you were outvoted 7 to 2 when it actually came to tally up your frankly ridiculous plan to marry Seffy.

You can see the reasons for going for this course of action in the post two posts above your own...but no, you'd rather sit in a huff and cry because an idea was approved of that wasn't yours.

You're just a baby without a bottle.

>>15122561
How about in stead we just make her a servant.

>It is humiliating
so was being nothing more than decoration for the last decade. Making her a servant will also be humiliating. But if she truly is submissive to us she wont be humiliated by anything we tell her to do.

> It helps in her training.
Better ways of doing it. Also we shouldn't even have to train anything. Shes a dragon and capable just like any of our servant of following instructions.

> Practical use
A dragon polymorphed into horse serves no practical use a normal horse couldn't provide.
Also a servant, hell even a maid would be more useful AND practical.

> It gets her used to interacting with others again in a lower station than before.
so would being our servant

>Our daughter needs to learn how to ride.
Putting aside the fact she can fly and likely learn to teleport by herself soon. If she wants to learn to ride buy an actually horse that will actually ACT like a horse and not act like a polymorphed dragon.

>responsibility
We can start her off slow. She can be a maid. Then we can have guard the lair when we are away maybe staging some break ins. Have her be Azyra's end all be all bodyguard. Send her to do tasks like our silver. And so on.

So turning her into a horse actually does nothing making her a normal servant wouldn't.
Other than the whole
>"lol xD so randum" factor

>>15122757

7/10 because you made me write out at least two lines of a reply before I realized how worthless it is trying to reason with you when 'reason' is the furthest thing from your mind.

Heck, you might've even got me if you didn't completely abandon sensible pretense in that last line there and just ignorantly discard the entire idea- which on reflection you just did anyway.

>>15122814
In fact we came to an impasse where you were either a troll or had a misguided and ultimately bad idea.

Two methods of response were clear.
1) you were not trolling and this I should refute your claims with logical arguments
2)you were trolling and I should not wast my time responding with actual rebuttals and instead make liberal use of green text

I decided neither option would do and instead decided to test you by doing both.
-Were you actually trying to make an argument you would have made rebuttals of your own.
-At most you would have responded to my >"green text" with your own

Now if you were a troll or incapable of making logical rebuttals you would respond exactly as you did.
-claim i was in some way trolling by including a single line in a long and moderately constructed argument
-provide no rebuttals at all
-resort to ad hominem attacks

>WD saw the whole Cygnis thing, he knew how /tg/ works after that if he didn't before
>We have a silver caged up and ready for experiments when he suddenly introduces the idea that we can work with her
>We don't particularly like Seffy but have a good working relationship with her when he suddenly introduces the idea of marrying her
>Each time sparks a massive shitstorm with each side thinking that theirs is the only reasonable one and the other side is just samefagging trolls
Writer-Dude is the greatest troll on /tg/ right now.

We've already been breaking Cygnis for over a decade off-screen, can't we just assume that her training has continued in one way or the other because it really doesn't matter whether we make her turn into a fucking horse or not.

>>15122671
> I haven't participated in a thread for like 20something threads but I stand by what I have said above.

It really fucking shows. If you'd been keeping up with what was going on, you would hopefully not be supporting such fucking retarded ideas as handing partial control of our empire to a physically stronger, unstable bitch who's already tried to fuck us over many times; hell even just in the last couple of threads she tried to extort an obscene amount of money and adamantine off us.

>>15123106

I wouldnt call it trolling, but then I like it when things get shaken up a bit.

At the moment it seems to be mostly arguments between people who take the fluff as word of law and those who don't. Or people who think we're a 4e dragon vs 3e ones. I see people complaining that metallics and chromatics don't work together or kill on sight etc, but really that is kinda dull and ruins any chance we have to flex our evil (when we feel like it) muscles. I like manipulating others into doing my bidding, willingly or otherwise. If that involves sex, cracking skulls or selling souls to devils, then so be it. People who stick vehemently to their guns no matter what side are just stupid and failing to enjoy the game.

What is the e-mail used to send suggestions in to WD?

rolled 69 = 69

My opinion on:
Firelady: What we're doing now is fine.
Cygnis: Unsure if giving her simple commands is appropriate at this time. Perhaps first see if her mental conditioning allows her to even have her chain lifted off - only when we're DAMN sure she's not going to spaz out and start trying to fuck off, will we bring her out of the lair. And only when we're DAMN sure that, even out of the lair, she won't spaz and fuck off, and in addition, she isn't upset AT ALL about the notion of doing things, will we get her to do things.
Seffy: Needs a good stabbin'. Unsure how to obtain said stabbin'. Seduce + backstab as has happened to Azdukashen and Cygnis may work. Possibly not. Need to ask /tg/ and talk it out more.
Definitely don't marry her, except as part of a plan to deliver stabbin'.

Other dragons:
We have enough issues to resolve for now, to start chasing things like that. We've got the Drow to fight, the Jungle to colonise, the Firelady to train, the Nemmy to watch, the Rhasver to prepare for, the Mammon ('s minions) to BBQ, and we've gotta do something about the Bitch queen of Beren shaking us down for over 9000 monies.

>>15123748

Our daughter won't be too happy if we decide to off 'aunty Seffy'.

I say we keep her around a bit longer. Making an overt move against her would be a bad idea, as we are still recovering from a war and she now has some pretty tight support from her population. We underestimated her once already, we DO NOT want to do it again.

Press that we're happy to be an ally and even offer preferential rates in trade or assistance in war, but uniting our empires is not going to happen. Not unless it was hugely advantageous to both parties and she can provide some tangible assurance she isnt going to try and bogart our digs.

>>15123843
>Our daughter won't be too happy if we decide to off 'aunty Seffy'.
Our daughter will damn well get over it. We don't define our major policy actions based upon what will make Azyra smile, we define them based upon what will be profitable for us. She's not that close to Seffestranias anyway; it's not as though they've spent any lengthy amount of time in each others' company.

I agree that we should keep her around a bit longer, but more because dealing with her is going to be a bitch than because I think it's actually to our benefit.

>offer preferential rates in trade or assistance in war
This is basically giving her money so that we can make her happy. It would mean that her current bullying, extortionist attitude would be paying off to our detriment. We should not do it.

>>15123748
>Seduce + backstab as has happened to Azdukashen and Cygnis may work. Possibly not.
Won't work. Seffy knows we're a duplicitous schemer and would expect us to try something of the sort. Also, she's far more interested in our money than our body by all available evidence.

I suspect that the most successful strategy is going to be to economically outpace and begin to absorb her holdings- it's been said that Mza's guilds own most of Azar; one day we can own most of Beren, too. Once we're controlling the ones paying the army, infiltration of all levels of the nation will be trivial... at which point we'll be able to eliminate her support, focus our assets, and dispose of her. I would not recommend spending tons of money on standard infiltration as that is expensive and she has proven reasonably successful at fending it off in the past.

>>15124236
>the Mammon ('s minions) to BBQ
I'm sure that we can somehow turn this problem into a route for getting Scinnari given more hell-power and promotions. Her superior is basically taking credit for all her souls at the moment, and while Scinnari can't and doesn't want to contact her we are not in that same position. Given that we are getting nothing substantial out of ensuring that Glasya's court is the one getting all those souls, we can present the use of our resources against Mammon's minions as something that we will continue to encourage only in exchange for Scinnari being given enough infernal energy to maintain a promoted state. After all, our contract remains in effect only if Scinnari meets just her actual minimum; it's in her superior's interest to keep both us and Scinnari pleased with the current arrangement in spite of the embezzlement. It would be a relatively small thing to devote a small portion of the income Scinnari is providing to maintaining her at a higher power level.

>>15122757
It's pretty ridiculous, but as we're largely glossing over Cygnis' training anyway I hardly think it's worth arguing over. As long as the end product is what we want, specifically a gold dragon who is worshipfully loyal and fully obedient, the details can be largely ignored and handwaved as some variety of horrible abuse or another- it doesn't really matter if it was verbal, physical, sexual, or some kind of crazy shit like this.

>>15123606
See >>15122169.

>>15123843
Maybe, but not nearly as broken up as having her empire or father destroyed.

>>15122441
I don't think we're even remotely attempting or even planning to have Firelady jump on our dragon p0n0s. I always thought of it as raising up an ally and friend rather than any sort of mate, Scinnari has that station locked down as far as I'm concerned. I think a lot of people feel the same way, though I can't be sure of course.

>mind control crystal ball
How about we just make it so we can read her thoughts while making sure the enchantment is subtle enough to not be found except by an expert. I don't like the idea of mind control on her when we are already mentoring her to have an ally rather than slave, plus she's a dragon. Also, lol, we're giving her a palantir....

>>15123843
Aunty seffy is still aunty seffy no matter how much of a total bitch she is.

I totally agree with the whole CYGNIS thing. That is retarded and will get us more enemies than it will get us status. So absoultely Not never ever ever ever ever go shove your head in an elephant's ass we're NEVER doing that

As for the young red we're mentoring. If our familly happens to find out (particularly Azyra) tell them that she is a cousin and that spending time with Azyra and sciarnii seems to have given us a squishy side for familly matters.

>>15124257
Why would we lie? Just straight up tell Scinnari or Azyra that we're mentoring a young red to try and raise a faithful ally from the ground up.

I disagree with your assessment on Seffy. It's hardly like they have seen each other more than a dozen times at most.

>>15124252
seffy is clearly an extorsionist and I do believe we're taking her to be alot dumber than we think she is.

Considering she's older, has boatloads moar experience and is generally larger than us it may be better just to take a highly defensive approach to this thing. After all a good defense is a good offense

Have we started on military research? What kind of equiptment do we have on hand? Creating technology so our army can actually fight dragons or defend themselves against them would be extremely useful.

Just lookat how Rhasaver ended up. Seiged by a trio of dragons all they had as an energy shield and a bunch of ballistae to defend themselves with.

Put in reasearch for flak cannons, lime shot, grape shot, Muskets, hand cannons ect. If we're going to fight seffy I suggest evening out our odds with a good anti air battalion.

>>15124286
She's the same age. She's just more muscular and a much better fighter because that's the area she focuses in. We're almost assuredly much better at magic, planning, and subterfuge.

>>15124286
speaking of airforces

How are our Roc riders coming?

>>15124293
then lets use dat planning and make us some battle gear.

Where we lack numbers we will have tech 200years ahead of it's age. Be the Germany of this continent

have armored and enchanted zepplins, steam tanks rocs armed with gattling guns!

>>15124298
See >>15116311.

>>15124252
We really don't need to apply mind control at all here. Psychology should be more than enough if we handle it correctly.

As far as her wanting to sleep with us... that's often a side effect of a strong bond between a young female and an older male. My view would be that there's nothing wrong with it, as long as we wait ~fifty years so for her to grow up first and handle things carefully so that sex serves to strengthen our relationship with her rather than make it weaker or more volatile.

Scinnari having exclusive rights to our sex life is a definite "haha no" in my book, because we own Scinnari, not the other way around. But that line of discussion isn't really relevant unless we find someone else worth sleeping with or are struck by the sudden urge to breed up an army of half-red minions.

>>15124286
Seffy is our age but specced to be a combat monster instead of an archmage.

>>15124337

One small problem: Germany lost.

Whilst tech goes a long way towards levelling the playing field, there are some things we just can't match. One of those is that Seffy isn't putting on airs. She could probably get away with brutalising her population into line, conscriptions, taking eminent domain from trade guilds and such. We probably could not, as we've set outselves up to be fair, if not exactly benevolent. Our population would not react well to that.

I'm dead against plotting Seffy's demise, at least not yet. We're out of our depth with her at the moment, and she made it clear she has agents close to us which makes any plotting hazardous in the extreme.

As much as it hurts we might just have to bite our tongue over the extortion... for now. Paying the gold is worth not having to worry about a powerful enemy for the tim being, especially not as we've just come out of a fairly major war.

Seffy is the bad cop to our good cop in geopolitics, both kingdoms roughly the same age, one ruled by a GODDAMN DRAGON. Our personal relationship is a bit rocky, but we could fix that, I see no reason to plot against her. As for the entire "SHE EXTORTED US!" thing, we did kinda short her by only conquering one city and looting no others, also gift giving is "a thing" in relationships.

As for Cygnis, ideally I'd want her roughly equivalent to Nemmy. We could sic her on finding stuff out about the Binder since she already knows about her, and being a Gold could follow up on leads much more easily. She also REALLY doesn't like the Binder, so having her help our should make her yet more malleable. Wasting time turning her into a horse/mount for petty giggles is retarded.

>>15124628
>>15124511
Sentiment is pretty strongly in favor of ending Seffy, I don't think that's even an issue anymore. The problem now is how.

>>15124730

I don't know which thread you're reading. The sentiment seems to be let it slide for now.

If we're taking on Seffy we're opening up a huge can of worms. We're not secure in our current position; there is grumbling both at home and from the territories we've annexed, our army is depleted, our navy probably needs a refit, our funds probably need attention, our aerial project isnt even off the ground yet, our stockpiles are depleted and our troops are spread all over the place trying to contain unrest and fight Drow.

Now lets compare this with Seffy. Her kingdom is unscathed by war and feverently supports her, its at least as big as ours but not as isolated or reliant on sea travel, we just equipped her with adamantine armour and weapons, we can't take her on directly in combat without getting raped and we don't know how good she is mentally since we're also pretty certain shes playing the dumb lolevil Red. She has agents in our court so any plotting would probably be picked up on pretty fast, whilst our intelligence network in her kingdom has been blunted and thats not forgetting the clincher: we just satisfied her demands and she isnt trying to extort anything from us at the moment. We don't even have a plausable casus bellei.

Now is not the time to go to war with her. Now is the time for consolidation and building.

>>15125046
Agreed. We dont want to be picking fights at the moment. Focus on domestic affairs and get our army built up before even thinking of ending her.

>>15125123
>>15125046
I'm reading the parts of this thread that isn't just you and maybe one other guy talking to each other and the last one. Both were overwhelmingly for moving against Seffy.

>>15125137
They pointing out we cant take her on directly yet and his reasons are good. They never said we shouldn't ever take her on. We have more pressing matters to attend to for now.

>>15125137

>>15125046 here. I'm not against making a move on Seffy, I'm against doing it NOW. We're not in a position to take her on currently, and we really don't have a reason to do it just yet. She got what she wanted out of us, we avoided paying the whole fee. Happy families all around.

If we're going to off Seffy we need a motive other than "she fleeced us and hurted our feelings". That is water under the bridge now. If she tried it again then I say dump lava all over Beren, but until then picking a fight with a powerful adversary when we're at anything less than our best is just fucking dumb. Especially when we can still squeeze assistance and trade out of her.

>>15122728
Now now. Be nice.

>>15122757
>capable of following instructions
While I kind of share your reluctance to cover such a topic, I believe the specific desire here was reflexive obedience, not reasoning obedience.

>>15122814
>>15122929
Calm the hell down...

>>15123106
And I couldn't do it without you. My inside-man.

>>15123146
Now, now. Also, I can't resist pointing out that you liked most of those qualities when they were making her drop everything to go off stomping devils with you.

>>15124245
Oooh.. more meddling with hell-politics? Dangerous. Something to bring up and/or confirm next thread, I'm thinking.

>>15124286
You. Main reason I'm here. While I happen to love dieselpunk/ImperialGermany as much as anyone, I have been assuming you're stuck in a generic fantasy stasis. I have very mixed feelings on technological advancement.

>>15124628
And you didn't even loot the city you conquered! So yeah, that is rather the case. Personally, it seems to be in favor of 'let things slide', as far as I can tell, or at least not enough in favor of bloody vengeance to actually make it a 'do now' item. I have been known to be stupidly wrong before, though, so if you feel the urgent need to correct me, do so.


>>15125137
So you're just reading the parts that support you. Which is entirely reasonable, once you assume that everyone who disagrees must all be samefagging. Please. I've said it before, I'll probably end up saying it again; you can't prove it, you can't know it, so why on earth do you mention it? The real proof of samefaggery would be if others come to the same conclusions on their own, not if you use it as an attack to support your claim that will only devolve into accusation flinging from both sides.


See y'all next week, there are various ways of contacting me.

>>15125431
>stuck in generic fantasy setting
so wat gattling baby cannons? should horrify people enough to make them run away from us
no I kid, but so far we've been lingering around magic shenanigans for some time now. Of course the industrial revolution has yet to start but even at this age *assuming medieval* there were various types of munitions and medicine being created.
Mostly for the sole purpose of Killing things, in this case I wouldnt be suprised if someone made dragon killing weapons

oshit I said too much

>>15125431
What? Where did I ever accuse anyone of samefagging? It's been two guys agreeing with each other the past few hours but that is obvious and not samefaggotry just two people talking and agreeing over and over. I don't know what your problem is with accusations of samefaggoty or if it has something to do with the IRC (which I don't visit) but you're being unreasonable and overcompensating in the opposite direction. It does happen and happens often maybe more than you think

I don't try to tell people to read their own past threads because I think you know what is up but maybe you should actually read last thread if you think there was no support for moving against her cuz there were people saying to do it everywhere. I don't think anyone said war right this day was smart but even at the beginning of the thread people were saying to start undermining her aggressively to prepare

tldr: read your own threads

Someone going to archive this?

>>15126352
Already has been. For some reason, June 2011 falls in the middle of March 2011.

>>15126119
It's an implied thing. You assume that all opposition is the same two people- I'm fairly certain it's a bit more than that.

And I never said there was no support for moving against her, I just said there was not enough to totally outvote the people who didn't want to. Anyway, sorry for sounding like I was getting worked up over you in particular.


I doff my name/trip...

>>15126406
I was just sayin that the same two people were the ones saying that recently not earlier and not saying all people were the same ones

But it was obviously two people recently

will drop it tho

I have to agree with alpharius, why does no one agree to seffe's offer? Even if only to backstab. You could give her a trial as wife, then if you aren't satisfied, kill her. You would also get a decent area to add to your empire, plus. Lot of wealth, that is a major trade city i think.

>>15127448
I agree, but but apparently people on irc don't want it.

>>15127448

Seffys offer is interesting if you take into account "friends close and enemies closer". There are advantages to it, huge disadavantages though. Most people don't feel it is worth it, and of course the devil waifu supporters were out in force.

>>15127448
>You could give her a trial as wife, then if you aren't satisfied, kill her.

And how, exactly, would you propose doing that?

So long as it isn't focused on, I've no problem with Cygnis being a steed for a short while. It's probably no worse that what Scin's been doing to her for 10 years anyway. 'But why?' Well reasons have been given and really 'Why not?' I'm more interested in the end result, and this seems as good a way toward it as any.

I like Seffy, but marrying her carries a lot of problems in regards to power-sharing and so forth, not to mention all the domestic problems it would cause regarding Scinnari and our daughter- and what about Nehmaska and Cygnis? And what our own population would think of such a marriage. There's much to lose and little to gain- especially if we can gain the same over a longer time with other means.

I reckon if we can quietly kill that Black without anyone pinning it back on us, that would be good.

Firelady seems to be doing well. That Blue will need to die, but I don't think we have our barding yet...and I'd still like to see if there would be a better way of dealing with it. Compliment Firelady on handling herself well so far though and keep ourselves appraised of the situation.

>>15125431
>Now, now. Also, I can't resist pointing out that you liked most of those qualities when they were making her drop everything to go off stomping devils with you.

Correction: We found it /useful/ that she had those qualities. I can't speak for everyone, but personally I find them rather boorish. Also, being a greedy bitch wasn't even useful then.